Mini 1404 - Monopoly Mafia - Game Over

[Cheery Dog]

Hi there
Baby Spice, I apparently have you as my scumread, can you tell me why? (or Mehdi who has probably a different reason for being on that same wagon?)

Though I'll probably get around to reading this thread over the weekend if it's not too boring. I can't remember what happened in the first however many pages I tried to read when this game first started, so I can't even really comment on those. Anything else I should know now before I attempt to decipher what you people have been talking about for 30 pages?

[Cheery Dog]

Lurker claimed watcher, later slipped and said he claimed tracker. He's caught scum, vote him

That is good information to know, and what I was looking for by asking my last question. I guess the other ones can wait for answers tomorrow, as caught scum is way better than voting someone for I don't know what information.
I will agree that he is indeed caught for the way he posted after it was first identified.

Cheery jal actually posted a case, but the short version is she finds something jal did bs -> she analyzes the wagon jal is on -> she then votes jal for having a bs vote and supports it with statistics she never shows and tried to shift the burden of proof on the statistics to jal.

That'll probably need me to read the thread to understand. If it's true, there's always tomorrow. (unless death of course)

Less scum and a quiet night (well except screaming from people dying during it) sounds like a good time for me to read the thread anyway.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Lurker

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery can you hold on the lurker vote? I'd rather just let 1 day go for last comments so people know the day's going to end soon in advance vs just voting him now where he'll likely self hammer when he's online next.

I guess, but I'm not going to end up with any last comments myself unless the day lasts long enough for me to have read the thread, and since that not going to be starting until the temperature has dropped from the above 40 degrees it is today and I might be able to concentrate on actually reading instead of being hot. (doesn't help that the rest of week at least is above 30 either, but it's not quite as hot)
and since Jal just unvoted anyway, I'll leave this vote here unless there's something else that happens that makes me want to change it even now or after I do get around to reading.

[Cheery Dog]

^probable lurker scumbuddy

hey morons, get your votes the fuck back on Jal plz

Who are you insulting here from not voting Jal? If I'm to believe the votecounts, there's only one person who has voted Jal that's currently not there and they left it shortly after you replaced in, so how do we get our votes "back" onto Jal?

[Cheery Dog]

I think lurker's been put back to L-3 with the chance card I received today, I got sent to jail and lost my vote for the day.

You happy I got a forced unvote Uber?

I guess I better actually get around to reading now, seeing as you guys won't aren't lynching now which means I still plan on doing it this weekend, even if it's now not in the night.

[Cheery Dog]

Have we lynched Lurker yet?

Damn vote abitlity removals, going to longer than it should (and it should have already happened)

I don't like UN's Jal case at all, it's all changing the words she said and other gejneral confirmation bias. From my reading of the game so far, Jal is one of my higher town reads.

[Cheery Dog]

The day would be over and locked if that was the case. Cheery do you want to read the rest at night or day?

I'm fine doing either, doing my own playstyle means I won't really have any information to give from reading anyway, it's only for my own benefit that I'll be reading.

[Cheery Dog]

I think it's only L-1 due to me losing my vote for the day due to chance card annoyance, but the lynch should still happen either way.

[Cheery Dog]

@Mod, are you aware that someone (Robert2424) is still in this game when he hasn't posted for over 2 weeks?

Anyway since I've finished reading the game now and we're still in twilight, I'll announce my reads and the few interesting posts now. (I assume I still have at least 4 hours until the mod comes online (off his posting history times, so I think they'll be done in time. If not they'll be here first thing day 2.

[Cheery Dog]

Oohhhh a Jal wagon.

How can I resist?

Vote: Jal

I believe this is the start of UN's Jal suspicion, and it's just continued on to be a downright tunnel. I can't see why town would want to be doing this, and continuing on after we've had scum (lurker had better actually be scum, because otherwise argh!) makes even less sense.

(I missed this) EBWoP:

I'm busy for the next couple of days.

My opinions on everyone hasn't really changed. Anything I could say has already been said.

Stop doing that. You're either coasting Scum or unhelpful Town, and it's AntiTown play either way. I don't care how busy you are, you haven't posted

one

scum read all game even though it takes all of 20 seconds to go: "The players I think are scummiest are X, Y, and Z. I'll explain later."

Saying you'll explain later is the exact same thing, and in my opinion actually a worse version of those two options. Though the lack of any scum reads does make it true what you've said, but I still hate those that say they'll explain later and not straight away.

I'm actually not against chaining lynches as long as the idea is based on one scum flip being true (if you're going to say if he flips town the other will flip scum that's just an easy way to get two mislynches, but if requires a scum flip either you're bussing or know it won't work so it's not as scummy). Anyways another problem with it is why vote me when SC is easier to lynch if she truly believes that.

How does that bit in brackets work, it's not as scummy because you know it won't work? The only people that know if it would work or not are the scum, that's why chaining lynches is something scum do.
My one scum game I've had, I did this style of chain lynching (if he flips scum I'm going after you next (at my partner). I don't think I've done that as town yet, though I have called "one of these is likely scum" as town, so based on my own experience, it's the other way.

Anyway current reads this game which will be improved on as we play tomorrow.
Town (s-w) Jal, Mhork, Xis, Baby Spice, Jake.
Scum (s-w) Lurker, UN, Medhi, TBG

Need more recent content, but otherwise probable town: numberQ, Robert, Agent_ireland.

[Cheery Dog]

Well if I say lynch cheery and if he flips scum lynch jal if I'm scum then either I know flip you town and what I said was pointless or your my scum buddy and bussing is nice for the town + by itself it isn't going to be enough to propel a lynch.

Anyways it's more theory and in practice it mostly depends what I think of the player already.

and if you're town, you don't know how it would happen.

Jal is strongest town because of this post (there's no point in saying something about differencing amount of cards you have if it was towards a scum buddy, scum has probably already discovered what each other have anyway), and the way in which Uber (my biggest scumread besides the claimed scum) is tunnelling her.

*How* Lurker claimed was pretty townie. It also looks like he looked at his pm and to read his role before posting. The only thing that caught my eye about it was that he has 2 cards. I have a different amount. Do we all not start off with the same amount of properties?

Robert is town because I can't see him being scum with Lurker and I'm pretty sure Lurker is scum claiming scum.
NumberQ and Agent_Ireland are their usual lurking selves, so I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, I do need more recent content on all three to be able to cement any reads though.

[Cheery Dog]

I don't think we can get anything from the lurker wagon, the only person I believe was not mentally on it was robert because he had vanished.

I don't think I've read enough detail to understand why the nightkills happened as they did, but based on mafias having guns, I think it would be more likely that baby spice was the scum kill.
The flavour for UN's kill points towards there being an SK.

[Cheery Dog]

By itself it is (and her scum reads in that post vs her scum reads at the end of the day weren't identical).

Well then we also need to have a look at you since there is where her vote was before she hammered lurker, but then since you've brought this up, I've already confused my reads from the end of yesterday.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery, any reaction to the wagon on you except to be huffy puffy at Medhi?

There's currently one vote on me, even though it's so far the only vote cast today, it's still not much of a wagon. If people want to suspect my predecessor that's their own choice, I know SC's vote wasn't a bus one (since that's kind of impossible), but I can't change minds if they think that.
My town read of Xis is still valid.

[Cheery Dog]

@jal stances on active lurking feel off, as he doesn't really go anywhere with them and are therefore active lurking posts themselves.
Along with that are the artificial post count increases of correcting minor grammatical errors.
it's to much "looks good for the town" and not enough "is good for town"

Also lurker's original claim, where TBG called it a town slip.

@xis as long as you're not making cases that try to fit the read into evidence or faking evidence for a known fact again, I think that limited meta experience is capable of helping me understand your play slightly better.
The town read here is based slightly on similarities to your day 1 play that game, slightly on gut and rest on town postings. (I'll be able to relocate a post that gave me the town impression tomorrow when I'm next on a computer if that's needed)

[Cheery Dog]

Cheer - what are your thoughts in Jal?

Slightly lower than what I posted during twilight because of both kills suspecting her, but I still think she is town.

I thought I would throw this out here for discussion: I got a new card today. An actual card, not some community chest dealio. Cards can't be exchanged between players so I'm wondering what happened here.

Odd, I received one as well.

Continuing I've never not vig'd and I know enough people who'd shoot every night as vig.

That sounds odd coming out of Mafiastuck where you fakeclaimed not shooting as vig when you were a SK. (though you did shoot there)

[Cheery Dog]

The double vote came from a chance/community chest card, I don't think him having was alignment inclusive, and since he is new here, we can't actually see how he deals with having double vote powers, I don't think him placing them on someone mostly unexpected is really a tell in either direction.

Why would Lurker serious vote (and I do think even he thought it was serious according to his wall) his scum buddy like that?

He did also call in RVS still on page 2, so I don't know if it is actually that serious or not

Assuming you're talking about the wall the Lurker slipped in

Robert2424 bandwagon takes off becuase "he takes jokes too seriously." (or some reasoning like that) Post #32

for most players, ti is said we are OUT OF RVS. (no post number)

I say we are still in RVS, as I think that the discussion is still weak. #44

I still don't see that vote as that serious.

[Cheery Dog]

Do all scum players give out non-geneuine opinions? If that was the case why haven't we won already?

[Cheery Dog]

Possible yes. Done in about 1 percent of games on site this size also yes.

Ah ok. Well your electricity bill says otherwise. You stayed at home last night. No reason for VT to lie.

VOTE: Mehdi2277

[/quote]
Is this a claim to have picked up the Electricity company?
This confirms that dead player's card are randomly redistributed amongst surviving players then.

[Cheery Dog]

eep fail quote tags.

Do all scum players give out non-geneuine opinions? If that was the case why haven't we won already?

My use of genuine generally means I don't think he was doing it with an ulterior motive.

That would be the correct answer, and I have no idea why I even asked that rereading my own post, I think I better go eat if my minds going to think asking something stupid like that with other inactive players being inactive of course we can't PoE win on geneuinability.

pedit, I'm not Jal, but since I have also received a card, I got it at the start of day and it's not one lurker claimed, I guess upon someone's death then.

[Cheery Dog]

Not quite sure what you mean on the PoE thing, but currently it's something I'm fine using to look at suspects.

The second question in that I left quoted in the other post, I asked why we hadn't won yet, which was saying we should PoE this joint.

[Cheery Dog]

Who do you currently think is town?

(note: I haven't ordered these this time)
Jal, Xis, Mhork, you (now that I'm in the game better, and interacting with you, I think I might have got the day 1 read wrong), and still slightly robert slot.
AI and numQ still haven't produced enough content for me to get a read of them, and I'm starting to think scum instead.
Jake's actions today have confused me slightly as well, and he has dropped into the nuller sections of my reads.

and that probably means I should be doing this as my now biggest scumread.
VOTE: TheBrawlGuy

[Cheery Dog]

When I posted my reads list, that's the only time I ever posted any reas besides agreeing with lurker being caught and announcing Jal as town after UN's attacks of her.

[Cheery Dog]

I mentioned an rb as an unlikely possibility on you and that became I knew there was an rb.

A roleblock could possibly have been on you though.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery actually can likely guess why I did that. The chances of me being rb are a lot lower then one of us being scum.

So you are scum, and my read of you was correct during day 1 and what I've picked up here is what is wrong? You said before you thought that slot was town due to Robert double voting Jal and being genuine about it, so shouldn't you being RB'd be more possible?
I don't think Safety being roleblocked is a possibility for this scenario, as the site meta says that roleblocked trackers receive no result on someone if they are roleblocked, as with all other investigative roles. (though I see that question being asked every game that has a tracker/watcher in trouble with their role)

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Mehdi

[Cheery Dog]

I really don't know but I do know that didn't see doesn't sound like the player visited no one that's more standard.

Sounds exactly the same as I got with waterworks on UberNinja, so I disagree.

[Cheery Dog]

Your version of this is?

I didn't see anything.I didn't see anything.

Got with waterworks on UberNinja?

The other utility is also a tracker, I used it on UberNinja.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery - wait, did Uber go anywhere last night?

No. Also confirmed not roleblocked because I have a second card with actions that went through.

No I mean cheery what do you think happened in relation to me and safety.

Either you're lying scum or you were roleblocked.

[Cheery Dog]

that was dumb of me to claim before waiting for the mod to post.
But it's still valid that not seeing anything isn't a "no result" type of thing.

[Cheery Dog]

I don't know why my other card has powers since it's the only one of that set I have, but I assume the other cards in the set also have a similar ability to it.

[Cheery Dog]

Really? You tracked UN?

Yes.

[Cheery Dog]

P. edit cool, you tracked UN and didn't visit anyone ekse right?

I visited someone else with a different power (although as far as I tell it's currently useless).
UN didn't visit anybody.

[Cheery Dog]

Either someone isn't willing, or it's numberQ

[Cheery Dog]

Well since I have told everyone I have it, yeah I guess it won't hurt. The other one I used on Jal.

[Cheery Dog]

Unless you're of the opinion that both CD and I were roleblocked. I can't even imagine the odds on that.

Especially considering it would have to have been a 1 card block for me to have been roleblocked, and seeing as I put the action on Jal first, I can't see that making sense.

Though another crap theory could be that scum can block a set of cards.

[Cheery Dog]

Scum can block a set of cards when cards are random and they could end up just blocking themselves?

I don't know, as I said it was another crap theory, and I seriously doubt such a power would exis, but if it does scum wouldn't block themselves when they do actually know what cards each of them hold.

[Cheery Dog]

I am also curious how you got your extra card at night,

but Xis claimed to get an extra card during the start of the day.

It doesn't add up personally.

that wasn't you? hmm, who was the one who claimed to get the card to start the day, could have sworn it was you

Jal and I have claimed to have cards at the start of the day, presumably from the people that died during the night (since neither were ones Lurker had claimed to have) I would say there are another two people that gained cards at the start of the day as well (based on the probable 2 cards to everyone except two which have 3 distribution, but then the fact that Jal who claimed to not have 2 cards yesterday gained one makes me wonder about it)

If the 2nd kill did come from a card, then it shouldn't be claimed since those are moving between players after they die, we don't want the possibility of a scum vig. (though that would already be possible given how cards were disturbed at the start, still wouldn't get anywhere though). I'm not fussed if someone with a passive killing power wants to claim it.

[Cheery Dog]

This is what I find strange: StrangeCougar's reaction to Lurker. Lurker claimed what his cards were and one was similar to the one Cheery is claiming now. Why would StrangeCougar find Lurker's claim strange when he had a similar card indicating that yes, those deeds have power? It's not like Lurker claimed TRACKER which is what Cheery says he has, so it wasn't a CC type of vote - so I'm having trouble finding the town motivation in finding Lurker's claim "off."

I don't understand it either, but my guess would be it was something to do with the 1-shot part of it.

A vig can be a negative utility role. As scum, I would rather kill a tracker than a vig. If there is a roleblocker, which is the best explanation of town-you not being seen tracked, then they would be best off blocking them, no?

It would also depend if the vig is via a deed card or is passive. If it's a deed card, my guess would be that scum would try and steal the extra kill.
The roleblocker would also be better on the trackers, since the deed card move around, killing them would just give the tracker power to someone else, and it would still likely be a threat.

[Cheery Dog]

what are you referring to about your role PM that CD backed up, I don't recall seeing this, can you link me to what you are talking about.

I backed-up what the didn't go anywhere result was (didn't see anything)

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery I want your opinion on the mock lynch. You saw what it did in homestuck (yes I realize it was just directed without a complete mock lynch but without the vig being claimed making it clear works better with a similar effect).

I only saw an attempted town voting block done, nothing about mock lynches. Considering I was killed my you with this approach, I don't trust it at all.
I would rather any vig claimed or not to be able to make up their own mind and not have to follow a mock lynch.
Or were you talking about when they had leashed you as an SK? Yeah I would have been for your death straight away and not the directing a second kill for town, double day is for games designed to use it, not just any with a possible vig.
I'm fairly sure town would still have won in Mafiastuck with or without or acting as a second kill, it just meant town was able to win quicker.

[Cheery Dog]

Kills after that on sanjay and dgb were both leashed and fine. Three vig kills leashed (with the first that's arguable) and two caused scum deaths and was somehow bad.

The sanjay death doesn't mean anything, he only lived through the day because you had decided that's where you wanted your kill.
Being "vigged" wasn't the only thing that would have made DGB die, and killing the lynchable means that we don't get any analysis for why they choose their night actions.
Not all scum are as easy to identify as the remainder of the midnight crew were.
Both methods can win or lose a game for someone, and I'd rather everyone be accountable for their own night actions.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery there's no point in making a vig "accountable". They're already going to shoot who they suspect but shooting people the town suspects as a whole means a. scum dies b. the next mislynch dies. Cheery if you read most of the late discussion people argued to keep me alive as confirmed scum just to use my kill as a second lynch.

I did read it and I didn't agree with it. I said town would still be fine doing it for a while, but otherwise nope. (and I seriously don't care what buldermar as the main face of who was arguing to keep you alive thought as I'd tuned him out while I was alive and it continued that way after I died)

Robert/safety: I've labeled as scummy for mostly 181. 980: It makes me wonder, that would mean that he received that card from Lurker. Lurker had two cards. I received one of them. He lied about the electric being a tracker. but he then admitted to being scum rather than saying that he misread. If someone else received a card at the end of the day other than Safety, then Safety had the Electric card prior Lurker being lynched.

If this was the case, why did Robert not counterclaim Lurker day 1?
I think if someone did get antoher card then, the railroad would be the more likely fake and that numberQ had it before the Lurker lynch.
But I also don't see why Lurker would have lied about what cards he had.

[Cheery Dog]

Would multiple cards of a set make powers stronger then?
I can definitely see multiple light "green"s making my other power stronger (though probably still useless when it comes down to it), but not really the other options currently given since they're already all full powered roles.

p-edit I take it your operation when well?

[Cheery Dog]

I guess since there are only two purples that works then and it does explain why some of the cards have the for now added onto the end of doing nothing.

[Cheery Dog]

Assuming I'm not confused I believe cheery claimed the tracking to support safety in that he got the same tracking result.

Yes something like that, as it means Safety wasn't roleblocked. (and I had no idea he already knew that by seeing my visit Jal either)

[Cheery Dog]

Does that mean it is possible to block a set of cards from working?
If we're going to go like this we may as well mass claim cards.

@mehdi, I think you're still likely scum.

[Cheery Dog]

Via chance/community chest? Because otherwise I don't understand how that would all work either.

[Cheery Dog]

Does that mean the there's two/three vigs going around?

Though I'm not sure this works with the utilities since both are claimed to be have powers, but the powers are mostly contained in the first one of each set?

[Cheery Dog]

Is it on the board that is pictured in the OP? (which annoys me with the house placement every time I look at it, but I doubt those have any point)

I think we've had 3 claims of picking up cards at the start of today.

[Cheery Dog]

Oh what the hell, its one of the first properties. Whitechapel and Old Kent are brown coloured, wtf.

According to my cards, Oriental Avenue is light green, I think colours are best ignored anyway except for that.

[Cheery Dog]

Have I really hidden the fact I have one that well?

Spoiler: I've mentioned it at least 3 times prior to this

I thought I would throw this out here for discussion: I got a new card today. An actual card, not some community chest dealio. Cards can't be exchanged between players so I'm wondering what happened here.

Odd, I received one as well.

pedit, I'm not Jal, but since I have also received a card, I got it at the start of day and it's not one lurker claimed, I guess upon someone's death then.

Jal and I have claimed to have cards at the start of the day, presumably from the people that died during the night (since neither were ones Lurker had claimed to have) I would say there are another two people that gained cards at the start of the day as well (based on the probable 2 cards to everyone except two which have 3 distribution, but then the fact that Jal who claimed to not have 2 cards yesterday gained one makes me wonder about it)

[Cheery Dog]

Guille as well.

his was during the night

[Cheery Dog]

One of the things that promoted me to think this way is that Waterworks is also a one shot tracker, Right cheery?

I haven't mentioned the limitations on my actions, nor do I plan to. Need to keep scum guessing at some things to do with my cards.

But given the 2 purples are watcher cards, it's possible that the 2 utility cards have the same ability.

Someone claimed Baltic?

[Cheery Dog]

so if Jal isn't the SK/Vig than you have to believe that UN killed baby or baby killed Un, neither make any sense.

Or there are two vigs cards floating around and the one Jal gained wasn't used.

And since we have two trackers & two watches, I'm willing to believe there is a chance there is a second vig card going about and UN/Jal decided to not use it, or possibly a third kill was saved.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery - why did you use your useless power card on me?

Because you had claimed not having 2 cards, and therefore by using it on you I could see if it actually did anything.
Which to then explain that I'll have to actually tell you what it was - A deed counter which tells me if someone has at least two cards. (Which I was fairly sure everyone did as it makes the most sense) The answer was that you did have at least two cards.
I also assume more light "green" cards would increase the number I can check for, otherwise it won't tell me anything.

[Cheery Dog]

She also claimed having 3 cards basically yesterday so I don't see how it would get anything to help. If she's telling the truth she has 3 cards. If she's lying she still probably has at least 2.

It would help me understand if that action was actually any use whatsoever (whether it would tell me the actual card number or not, I didn't expect it would, but since I have it I felt I might as well use it). Unless you think there is likely someone with only 1 card.

[Cheery Dog]

I also thought your power CD came from your alignment, not your cards, so does this mean there's no town pr roles before cards? At least with three different people claiming now, someone should get through the night clear.

My powers have only come from the cards I have, and so far there haven't been any passive claims.

Is this game like Marketplace and the night kills only come from the vig cards? (would suck for them if they didn't have one if that's the case)

[Cheery Dog]

Also, Cheery, did you think Jal claiming she didn't have 2 cards meant she was claiming only one and not three? If your power only lets you check that someone has 2 or more, isn't it useless? We know everyone has at least 2.

I believe it she meant three, as two players starting with 3 cards made sense. I was checking if it was indeed useless (which it is) or whether it meant it just meant people with 1 card aren't effected by having their deed counted.

Pedit: CD, Mehdi has claimed he breadcrumbed a role somewhere in his 200+ posts. I also doubt Mafia wouldn't be allowed to night kill. That seems too bastardy.[/quote]
I didn't actually see it ther, but I believe going off his posts today, it's based off his two orange deeds.
I'm just trying to think up ideas that work with the information we have, though I will admit I think my theories are too far outside the box, but since I don't know if they're possible or not, I feel my thoughts about them may as well be heard, I may one day figure sometime out by doing so.

[Cheery Dog]

At the point where he'd have more greens, other players would have more cards.

I only know about the fact I can currently check for at least two deeds, I don't know what will happen if I got more light

blues

greens or not, and thus it is an assumption. It may tell me exactly how many they have, or it may continue to be completely useless.

[Cheery Dog]

Medhi, what does this say to you:

Jal and I have claimed to have cards at the start of the day, presumably from the people that died during the night (since neither were ones Lurker had claimed to have) I would say there are another two people that gained cards at the start of the day as well (

based on the probable 2 cards to everyone except

two which have 3

distribution

, but then the fact that Jal who claimed to not have 2 cards yesterday gained one makes me wonder about it)

My wondering is why people already with the most cards gain another one. When I decided to use the deed counter on you I was thinking you had 3 cards as it did make the most sense.

[Cheery Dog]

2. He hasn't posted much, but he voted Lurker, who ended up being scum, so he's probably town.

This reasoning works how?
Both your scumreads were also on the Lurker wagon (well Jake would have been if he hadn't lost his vote)

My basic point being someone should say if they had three cards yesterday.

Making me claim more cards what is this?
I had a third card myself yesterday (and yes I now also have 4 cards (which is why today I found it interesting people already with 3 cards were getting a 4th, as it meant both people with three had gained them)).
So unless there is someone with only 1 card at the start of the game.

Intent to hammer Monkey

But since that now means only 3 cards have been claimed to have been gained at the start of today, it's possible I guess.

[Cheery Dog]

Yes but we had Moneky claiming to have got one during the night that most of us missed and assumed was one of Spice/UN's cards given at the start of the day.

[Cheery Dog]

He couldn't have, he replaced out after I got the card.

You said you got it during the night (or at least meant to have got it during the night), that is my issue with it.

[Cheery Dog]

I did. I'm not complaining about you or AI not using it.

I just got a pm from the mod saying I got a third card during the night he forgot about.

[Cheery Dog]

Doesn't change that possibility boardwalk could already be in scum hands.

[Cheery Dog]

Give me a chance to prove myself as town.

That's why it's only an intent to hammer and not a hammer.
Can you please clarify when your slot was meant to have received the card?

[Cheery Dog]

I actually want a mock vig lynch please.

My votes would go to either Mehdi or Brawl as people I think are scum.
I'm also fine with you killing one of the people you indicated earlier, Neither Mhork or Xis have been appearing as town today as they were when I read day 1, but they both do still lean town for me from that.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm also assuming everyone is telling the truth.

But Mehdi is lying about using the doctor card?

[Cheery Dog]

At the moment I'd say cross-kill each other, vig claims are always dodgy.

And then risk both vigs cards possibly fall into scum hands? or for more people to end up claiming receiving said cards only to do the same tomorrow night?

UNVOTE:

[Cheery Dog]

At the moment I'd say cross-kill each other, vig claims are always dodgy.

And then risk both vigs cards possibly fall into scum hands? or for more people to end up claiming receiving said cards only to do the same tomorrow night?

UNVOTE:

What says the cards aren't already in scum hands?

My (and almost everyone else's) town read of Jal does - though it is quite possible Monkey's is in scum hands currently, as such he is currently most likely to be lynched.

[Cheery Dog]

Jake just knows I suspected him before, is probably scum, and wants to save his own butt.

What is with you calling people who have gone into attacking you as scum and not wanting to kill/lynch them? You did the exact same thing when I claimed intent to hammer. (which btw is still valid if you're not going to show you are in fact town with your posting, which this latest lot of posting hasn't shown me)

[Cheery Dog]

There's at least three scum. I vote for the person I see as the most scummy.

and we've had one lynched already, or are you claiming that there are actually 4 scum in this game?
(I guess that would make sense with 2 watchers/trackers/vigs/whatever else)

[Cheery Dog]

(I guess that would make sense with 2 watchers/trackers/vigs/whatever else)

Except that we could have been in LYLO on day 2.

[Cheery Dog]

If he had been taken off L-1, there's only one thing to do, put him back there.

VOTE: monkey

The vig card will still exist, and hopefully go into town hand, which I don't think monkey has.

P-edit
Mehdi has said he was sick elsewhere on the site, I don't think that was to try and fool us, even though he is also quite possibly still scum.

[Cheery Dog]

Monkey hand and town hand are identical since he can't shoot whoever he wants when it comes to vig kill usage.

He is (or at least currently) in charge of the vig card. We're currently giving multiple choice as to who is allowed to be killed. If his scum buddy is in that group, do you think he will choose them to kill?
Yeah sure he doesn't have outright control since you love directed kills so much, but there is enough leeway that I don't think we're able to direct kills properly.
Personal preference would actually to only have one of the vig cards used.

[Cheery Dog]

GNR's announcement in Upcoming games said this come be ery swingy - two vigs and whatnot certainly sounds swingy to me. It also fits the may seem bastard to some line. - therefore this game isn't guaranteed to be balanced.

This is going to be a 13-player game, so grab a spot as soon as you can
All 28 deeds will be randomized amongst all the players (Yes, that does mean some will have more than others)
Alignment is determined before deed randomization
Deeds determine your role

Due to the nature of this game, this game can be very swingy and some elements may be considered bastard to some

[Cheery Dog]

It also means cards that belong to scum, stay with scum and vice versa.

Would this mean that Safety and Guille are scum since they have Lurker's (flipped scum) claimed cards

[Cheery Dog]

So you automatically consider "swingy" and "bastard" to mean unbalanced? Do you know anything about mafia game design? Cause I have ran about 10 mafia games.

I understand it to mean not guaranteed to be balanced, it may be balanced, but swingyness and bastardiness can change that from those unknowing of what will happen. Mainly the bastard part, all games will have some swing. (except I guess mountainous which are all down to the players)

[Cheery Dog]

Rereading Xis made me remember why I liked him for town. Vigging him would be stupid and a waste. Guille and safety should get vigged. Or maybe Cheery...or Jake... I don't really have solid town reads on any of them. Pretty sure there's scum in that bunch.

I don't recall you having these suspicions before, what caused them?

[Cheery Dog]

I see a problem with that plan should monkey be town, we won't know who gets the vig card until tomorrow (as it will be received after the game is locked), so the second watcher won't be able to watch the second vig.

The watchers should therefore decide to either watch the other watcher or Jal, as we don't actually want them open to being killed and not knowing who if they end up roleblocked, roleblocked the vig.

Also with the monkey flipping town, what happens if Guille picks up the second vig? No Kill or someone else?

I see no problems with the monkey = scum plan.

[Cheery Dog]

I still don't like predetermined watcher targets, but me doing my action in either scenario is fine as is.

[Cheery Dog]

If it's only 1 scum left then the trackers are good and I've just got an innocent. But with the amount of claimed power so fat this game, I don't think the game counts as one with low town power.

With 2 vigs, a sk and mafia in action, does that mean there could have been 4 kills night 1? As that kill looks to me like scum playing it safe from the watchers, and that un definitely didn't move night 1, yet he must have had the vig card, either both the sk and mafia have separate killing actions or mafia picked up the vig card and used out on brawl and don't have their own normal night kill.

With the possibility of 4 kills, it does only make sense for mafia to be 2 members, unless boardwalk isn't actually a vig card.

Anyway I tracked mhork during the night and he had a lack of targeting the kill. (leaving the actual result out, but I can confirm that I want role blocked)

[Cheery Dog]

Bloody phone

*Wasn't role blocked.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery, do you consider Monkey to be a scum lynch?

The mod said he wasn't (and Mod knows all, though that probably actually points to 3 mafia in total, so my tracking may not be clear at all), so while I consider SKs as scum, I'm aware that some people don't and I'd rather not risk wasting my tracking on another person that may have been dying.

Cheery, why did you track Mhork?

His postings at the end of yesterday were just feeling wrong and when I was reviewing where I should target, I felt there was something between him and Mehdi, and as I don't know how scum you treat SK, I decided to look into the other option who if I followed the scum action plan would be safe from being tracked, it seems a better option, with trying to work out how many scum are left and what may or may not happen with vig kills.

[Cheery Dog]

Mhork is clearly not aligned with Medhi whatsoever (see how Medhi tried to counter-bandwagon Mhork D1), so that seems like a lame ass tracking target if you think Medhi is scum.

Sorry it I forget stuff from D1 which I wasn't even here for most of.
I'd dropped the brawl scum read during yesterday, as you would have seen the absence of me talking to him.

@safety I read kill flavoring. (I know it's not meant to actually relate to the game, but it was still there)

And I'm now claiming my third starting deed, because it will help you understand it (though I probably should have asked the other two if I'm allowed to do so last night or whenever they can tell at me they they don't want this revealed)
I'm in a neighborhood (red cards) with mhork and guille, stuff mhork said in there last night increased the oddness I had been reading from him yesterday on him as he seemed to be contradicting his stance on mehdi in there compared to in thread. Enough that I felt he was the best track target. (I also asked in there which plan I should follow in there for other's opinions other than my own, and it was decided town flip was possibly better.
I also have my town read on guile based a fair bit in on stuff said inside it. (even though NumQ never posted during night 1, by early read of him was pregame from there more than the lurkaderp in the main thread)

[Cheery Dog]

You search the monkey for clues and find out that MonkeyMan576 was telling the truth, he wasn't scum...

[Cheery Dog]

Also, did they know who you were going to target?

No, I don't know what any of their cards are besides the ones that get them into the neighbourhood either.
(well I do have a idea of Mhork's second one now I've tracked him)

P-edit. Yeah, me too Jal. From the sounds of it they had a big conversation yet where are they now? Game's been open for over 24hrs...

We were only active in there at the start of the night.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery, just to clarify -what I mean in that question: did you say anything about your action last night? Did they help suggest some course of action for you?

I only asked what plan I should follow as we hadn't programmed for an SK flip.

I assumed he didn't say since it wouldn't be needed if the plan they told him to do involved him picking personally. I can answer him since I don't think he's scum so I don't think it hurts.

But if I was to be scum, would it hurt?

Cheery, do you still only have 3 cards? Did anyone get more cards in the night/day?

I started with 3 (the ones I've claimed) and got a 4th at the start of yesterday as I claimed when it was thought Monkey had said that he had got his third during the night.

[Cheery Dog]

No new ones today or during night 2.

[Cheery Dog]

and a red card that I completely forgot about last night.

You remembered it 2 hours after I first posted in there last night
Then managed to forget after we have twelve hours after that without a post? (though guille never posted again after that either) I feel I only got a response due to me asking why noone had talked during more that the first 24 hours of night.

[Cheery Dog]

I think putting it together in that fashion may also mean that people dying don't get to use cards, because thinking about it now, as if my memory is correct, UN was highly in support of vigs acting night 1 when that discussion was in mafia dicussion.
Definity points that direction even more so now.

[Cheery Dog]

Is it only me that thinks safety's reaction is weird re: xis's claim? Wasn't safety supposed to be watching Jal? If he did he certainly say anything about anyone visiting him (unless I missed it)

He was if monkey had flipped town. I'm the only person who decided that a SK flip meant follow flip town plan.

[Cheery Dog]

Scum killed baby spice night 1, they obviously aren't being that logical about who they kill.
@safety; my other deed's green, no powers.

@ cheer - can you explain your town read on guile please ?

Numberq's first post in the neighborhood was a town motivated question, and I think scum would be more likely to be discussing with their scum mates rather than ask who was scum in a neighborhood. Hire absent from it during night 1 was a little worrying, but guile's y telling us out his reads in case of dying due to vig was treasuring if the town read. Guile's posts in thread have also been gut reading as town, and nothing has pointed to him being scum here either. I don't understand why he has ben a suspect of almost everyone else.

Btw, do you or anyone who wants to voice it think that all the cards were randomly distributed at the start of the game?

They said they would be when GNR posted the game in the upcoming games section, that's all the evidence I have for it happening and makes it makes sense.

reading back guile, this is one of the posts that made me suspicious of him, guile is speaking like he knows for a fact Cheery's card is 1 shot but of course cheery doesn't confirm that. It is a very odd interaction

If you haven't noticed, the fact I have a result on mhork means it's not 1-shot.

[Cheery Dog]

Have you not read my posts complaining about lack of activity during the later real days of night?
it's night talk only.

[Cheery Dog]

What do you mean by actual result?

That I didn't get a no result response from the mod. I got a didn't see anything response which means that you didn't go anywhere.

What 'stuff I said' are you referring to?

Your read on Mehdi, it is still off to me.
I don't have a problem with you saying monkey was an SK, I never questioned that in there, and I'm not arguing the fact out here either.

We were only active in there at the start of the night.

Elaborate.

The night went over 3 RL days, all the posting happened in the first 24 hours it until I posted again later.

Dude, I'm not gonna play the 'but you posted right when I mentioned your name' game. I posted there when I remembered about it, then didn't get another chance afterward. I apologized about that. You got a response because I felt like talking could be helpful, but at that point it was too late. If you want, tonight we can get together and a have a severe heart to heart between the three of us. >.<

I find it odd when people forget their powers, and it was possible that you were trying to ignore it during what you thought was the remainder of the night (because rules posts says they are 48 hours), and you either came back after finding out we were still in night, or you're possibily telling the truth, which given that you didn't visit anyone, I think is quite possible.
Let's just focus on catching the remaining scum out here in the thread I don't think heart to heart tonight will be necessary.

[Cheery Dog]

Well it definitely sounds like he tracked you somewhere. So obviously someone is lying.

Cheery, who did mhork visit?

And if you say he didn't go anywhere I'm policy lynching you for trying to deceive town.

I wasn't trying to deceive town, I was just stating that I knew I wasn't roleblocked. I'm sorry if my use of 'actual' confused you into thinking that.

[Cheery Dog]

vote: cheery

Anyway I tracked mhork during the night and he had a lack of targeting the kill.

this implies you tracked him somewhere

cheery is now confirmed scum

He had a lack of targetting anything.

[Cheery Dog]

How does knowing he didn't target anyone help you in figuring out what his second card is?

It means it's a VT card most probably.

And why did you not reveal the result after the rest of the day's claims were essentially all made?

Because I didn't see it as important.

[Cheery Dog]

lack of targeting kill means you tracked him somewhere else.

If you got a result that he went nowhere you would have said that he went nowhere.

No I would have said that he didn't target the kill.

and you know what, THAT'S WHAT I FUCKING SAID!

[Cheery Dog]

In the hopes of seeing if he'd try to fakeclaim something maybe, but that obviously didn't happen.

[Cheery Dog]

That's because when I claimed the UN track and why I did it was important to the facts at hand which were Mehdi being seen not to have got anywhere when he used his doctor.

[Cheery Dog]

The Mhork track didn't have the same feel for what I needed to say.

[Cheery Dog]

yeah, he asked guile and mhork, the 2 smartest people in the game

They werethe only people I had access to talk with during the night, and I did have town reads on them both when I first entered the game, mhork hadn't stuck me as scummy until day 2 and his post in the neighbourhood. He also didn't response to asking me which plan I should have used.

[Cheery Dog]

so basically you listened to the person who was suspected as scum and was a potential vig target?

He's still one of my town reads. Just because other people may want him dead doesn't mean I don't trust my own reads.

[Cheery Dog]

How does knowing he didn't target anyone help you in figuring out what his second card is?

It means it's a VT card most probably.

It doesn't mean anything about the colour, but it indicates it's unlikely to be a match of a PR someone else had claimed to have on a colour.

Do the remaining orange/yellow cards have any powers?

[Cheery Dog]

Dude, I'm not gonna play the 'but you posted right when I mentioned your name' game. I posted there when I remembered about it, then didn't get another chance afterward. I apologized about that. You got a response because I felt like talking could be helpful, but at that point it was too late. If you want, tonight we can get together and a have a severe heart to heart between the three of us. >.<

I find it odd when people forget their powers, and it was possible that you were trying to ignore it during what you thought was the remainder of the night (because rules posts says they are 48 hours), and you either came back after finding out we were still in night, or you're possibily telling the truth, which given that you didn't visit anyone, I think is quite possible.
Let's just focus on catching the remaining scum out here in the thread I don't think heart to heart tonight will be necessary.

I'm sorry you find it odd. I forgot. Simple as that.

Also why do you say I was 'trying' to ignore it. If I had wanted to flat out ignore it, why would I have posted at all?

In the hopes of seeing if he'd try to fakeclaim something maybe, but that obviously didn't happen.

What made you think I would try and fakeclaim anything? What would I have tried to fakeclaim, from your perspective?

I can't prove if you did forget or not, I assumed you hadn't forgotten and were just ignoring, then you felt it better a idea to actually respond since I had rebrought it up. If I read what you were doing wrong, then that's fine, but that's what I felt when I decided to track you.

You may have tried to fakeclaim as with so much power around already, any claims may have should you be scum progress furthur in the game.
Yes you probably wouldn't have fakeclaimed since I had outed that I tracked you, but with kills like Baby, scum may not actually be following information around, and you could have made a mistake. There's always the 1% success chance of a 99% fail likelyhood plan.

Anyway, it does probably mean that my day 1 read was right on you, you're definitely not scum with Mehdi after safety's track of mehdi anyway.

[Cheery Dog]

Leaving lurker alive slightly longer may have got him to indicate his buddies, caught scum doesn't always need lynched straight away

I only voted him when I first came in because I felt it would be easier for me to understand the game without having more people continue posting as I was catching up, and since I had the neighbourhood discussion at night, my guesses at remaining scum could still have been heard by at the time I thought at least one other townie, which from the pregame discussion I thought was numberq, and the reading through the thread made me think mhork was actually town as well as you would have seen when I posted my early reads.

[Cheery Dog]

Guille you realize it's impossible for me to be scum with mhork because of roles? (for me to be scum with him then cheery or safety has to be scum which would make 4 mafia + 1 sk in a 13 player game and would make this mylo and I'll go with the easy 5 scum isn't going to occur in this game) You're logic basically says I've run out of people to be scum with except cheery (I see at the end you seem to consider me + jake when you earlier said we can't be scum together so not sure how those two work).

Unless you're a ninja scum doing the kill (and other actions), seeing as your doctor action night 1 wasn't tracked, and no-one appears to be roleblocked night 2, I believe it may make sense for scum to have a power of that sort, which also effects your cards.
VOTE: Mehdi

[Cheery Dog]

My reasoning is still your scummy arse from previous days. And it makes sort of sense for my reads to possibly be correct.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm assuming you're a scum ninja with why you weren't tracked night 1, though I'm not entirely sure of why that would effect chance cards, but it makes sense to me, I also don't know why wyou wouldn't have used it on someone being watched, but since you would have also done the baby kill, I guess you haven't been paying attention to what your own role is.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm not accusing you of lying, I'm currently accusing you of being a ninja, get it right.

[Cheery Dog]

And you haven't flipped yet here either, so how am I meant to know you're not lying about doing it again now?
You probably weren't even aware of it affecting chance cards, you should check on that.

[Cheery Dog]

Well either scum have to have gained the tracker/watcher cards or they're pretty much toast due to so many of them. We have had a seril killer as well flip, and I think sum would need something to help depend themselves from.

We have Vigs, Cop, watchers, 50% self watchers, trackers, neighbours and whatever the railroad power is + presumably something else if someone ends up with two of green/pink.
Though it is possible that scum should have some of that, just what would be 6 cards at the start between them (and presuming where cards may have gone last night possibly more), the game fills to much townsided as it stands. I am aware that it is a swingy game, but that doesn't really mean that much.

But if I'm correct, it also effects your other cards, or at least the chance cards.
The watchers are already ineffective at seeing each other anyway, which reminds me to ask this

@Mod, does tracking someone count as a visit?

[Cheery Dog]

Cheey, do you think there are likely non vanilla scum?

That's part of my current argument yes

[Cheery Dog]

Couple of questions for now, would people rather go into day 4 in lylo or mlyo? Because if today is a mislynch then that's the question facing the vig.

Depends how good our guesses at remaining scum are, Should Mehdi actually be town, MYLO is possibly better as there will be less chance of the vig misfiring if we fail to lynch tomorrow, but then again there would probably be a roleblocker or similar that wasn't active last night if they have another shot would ruin that second chance.
I trust Jal to make whatever is the correct decision.

[Cheery Dog]

Cheey, do you think there are likely non vanilla scum?

That's part of my current argument yes

But that seems more just justification for your PoE, no?

You can call it that, since my thoughts have led to it, It's just how I'm thinking about the situation. I have no bones about you wanting it to be a justification for PoE.

[Cheery Dog]

I think the fact we need to argue I'm a ninja so that my lack of action on n1 can fit the I must be scum for contradictory report is a problem in itself. Nice lack of response to the heart of 2041.

It's not just that. You could still have been lying, but it does make more sense for how that is actually possible.

[Cheery Dog]

I don't think there's any point in me tracking the same person again?

[Cheery Dog]

I still think that being killed probably removes your cards before you can act with them (role blocks) to explain why baby/un never shot.

[Cheery Dog]

I just got a 2nd vote. Yay me

That makes up for you losing it day 1 then.

I only gained a macho attribute.

[Cheery Dog]

Really? Playing against my win con? That's nice.

VOTE: Medhi

I really don't care at this point. Town has a won game. Just lynch someone so the power roles can do their thing.

What is this? You're not getting the medhi scum thing, yet you're happy to vote him when pressured to actually use your vote, just because that is the only wagon active at the time (though guille had two votes) doesn't mean that's where you have to have voted, also you've placed it when it's no longer a hammer :S

[Cheery Dog]

I don't think there's any point in me tracking the same person again?

Mhork is only cleared from doing last night's kill and considering 4 players can be checked it's more of a question of who I don't think should be checked. To me safety, jake, and jal are the people I think are the most likely to be town which means the other should be checked with night actions. If we were to lynch from those 4 then I'd have safety be tracked since jal > jake > safety in town read.

I still feel it's a waste to have me do the same thing again, if we're having the same person tracker, I think it may be better to use the other tracker to double check rather than the same one, for if for some reason I lied (I haven't but it's there as an option if people what differently), I'd probably do the same thing again.

[Cheery Dog]

Are we going with what medhi posted earlier? If everyone wants me to I well track mhork again, but it just doesn't feel right to me to repeat the same action.

[Cheery Dog]

Are we going with what medhi posted earlier? If everyone wants me to I well track mhork again, but it just doesn't feel right to me to repeat the same action.

Considering this: If Medhi and LM had been tracked together (correct me if I'm wrong.) Which means that if Medhi flips scum, then LM cannot be scum with him. So tracking him is pointless. So, if Medhi flips scum, cheery can track someone else.

unless mt ninja theory is true. (which we will find out with medhi's flip) but yeah if he's just a scum goon, I'll just track jake instead as there is actually nothing stopping me from double tracking - it just seems worthless to me investigating the same person again, but since we have two trackers I guess why not.

[Cheery Dog]

Then we can direct the scum kill where we want it, that's the while point in the plans - which should be scummy towns whatever their role.

I do think there should be one on Jal though.

[Cheery Dog]

Poor person who had to replace into that scum slot. We should just lynch him more before we get an official replacement.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm fine actioning the least plan posted in terms if my actions whatever medhi flips.

[Cheery Dog]

I can confirm no killing actions from Jake.
(and also to make him happy I guess - I didn't see anything from tracking him)

No kills always confuse me - there not being a vig doesn't make sense as an option unless Xis (the only person that can actually be scum with Jal) was attempting to confuse us my framing her.

My guess would actually me the other get out of jail free card being used successfully on one of the unwatched (me/Jake/Xis), since presumably a second one would exist.
Though the possibility of scum just trying to hide from the trackers is also possible.

I think we should no lynch and see if the scum want to play ball with all investigative roles.

[Cheery Dog]

After I claimed mine's existence, I said I was hoping for it to actually give me a number, but no, it's always been "at least 2", though I only used mine the once.

[Cheery Dog]

Because that's what I suspected would happen, and what did happen, and it hasn't updated anything. I also know it did nothing against someone that who I had figured had more than 2 cards when I had used it.

pedit - The read of Medhi - not thinking Medhi should be vigged which I understood to be a townread, which happened near the deadline of day 2 - and then he was feeling conflicted of Mehdi in the neighbourhood. Being conflicted about someone I would have thought would make an okay vig kill, to solve having to read the troublesomeness of him. But the statement in thread was telling me Mhork had Mehdi as a town read. (Just checked it; 86% chance a list of people including Mehdi were town)I also didn't really see any attempts to actually read him better from Mhork yesterday anyway, just rejecting my theory that Mehdi was possibly a ninja was really the only talk about Mehdi he joined in with yesterday before he voted)

[Cheery Dog]

After I claimed mine's existence, I said I was hoping for it to actually give me a number, but no, it's always been "at least 2", though I only used mine the once.

Who did you use yours on each night?

I've only used it on Jal night 1 - see my response to Mhork on the same think if you're confused.

[Cheery Dog]

The only person who is not a pr alive now is mhork, since he can't have made the night 2 kill, one if not 2 of the prs must be scum.

[Cheery Dog]

@Neighbours

: More generally, is the end of the quicktopic approximately how you currently feel about each other?

Do you think I would fake something in a neighbourhood I knew someone else would be entering last night? This question seems worthless, of course it's how I feel about Mhork, saying something I think wouldn't be possible would be worthless there or in the thread and against my win condition.

@Cheery:

What do you think of guille's final reads?

They match up with what he had been saying, and possibly good, I'm not going to done all my own tools to go follow them though.

[Cheery Dog]

How do you feel about xis?

Odd, There seems to be some thought gone into when he claimed cop, but choosing obvtownies to go after night 2/day 3 doesn't makes sense with as little reason as he said his suspicions started. But it does also fit with what he was making cases on when he was a cop in Discworld which makes him just odd.

@Xis, just to claify something else, when did me being open about the light green card become a town tell to you?

[Cheery Dog]

@Xis, just to claify something else, when did me being open about the light green card become a town tell to you?

When I got my own. It's clear you were telling the truth about a ridiculous non-ability, which is pro-town to reveal since it would invite suspicion.

So you still had me a suspect when you investigated Jal?

[Cheery Dog]

Sure, I guess. I had thought Medhi was town, but he was acting kinda scummy so I had no solid stance on him.

86% chance of town sounds pretty solid to me.

But I have no idea why anyone ever puts their town reads in percentage form. and you've gone with Xis being scum now after he investigated Jal, which sounds to me almost as bad as the reason for him investigating Jal in the first place. - One small mistake is making someone scum.

VOTE: Mhork

[Cheery Dog]

Cheery, that doesn't make any sense. The percentage thing was a joke. How is finding him scummy after copping an obv town me looking scummy?

It doesn't on it's own, but with me rereading that he was in your list of joke high percentages of people likely to be town, to which you also had Mehdi in and changed your mind on, I think you're just attempting to put points against him for need of someone to attack, even if I am still finding Xis odd myself, I'm finding you more likely to be scum.

So why wasn't Mehdi who you had no solid read on be a good vig choice for night 2?

[Cheery Dog]

wait what?
I'm talking about this comment from you

I just know that Mehdi prolly shouldn't be shot, or Jal unless Monkey flips town, or Xis, or Brawly. I'm, like, 86% these guys are town.

[Cheery Dog]

Hehehe... You're silly, Cheery.

But let's put this 'me-scum' thing aside for a moment. Do you think that xis is town? 'cause jake made done pretty good points.

I'm not going to ignore a scumread in MYLO, why would I do that?

[Cheery Dog]

I only have your word for that.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm not convinced that Xis is scum because he got a result on Safety, he would have done Safety was being watched, so faking a result when not actually visiting would just be stupid.

I think it's somehow one of the mods non-interaction things.

[Cheery Dog]

But what about the purple card? And the whole copping Jal was just ridiculous.

They're possible, why are you so upset that I'm voting you anyway?

[Cheery Dog]

Also if cheery wasn't watched, why on earth would scum leave him alive?
IMO it's xis/cheery as scum. Cheery's vote on mhork makes no sense. Today's only options are xis, me, or NL. Cheery wanted to NL and instead votes mhork? Makes no sense.

The time for no lynching has been and gone, I think it would only hasn't been worthwhile had we had a claim of someone using the other get out of jail free card, but with no claims of use I believe that means scum must have no killed last night. Which potentially they'd do again tonight if we did go with the no lynch.

We could therefore try having jal eliminate someone else at night believing scum won't submit a kill, but if that was on town scum would win if they did kill. while it would work by a town xis catching the scum, I'm not entirely sure if he is telling the truth anyway.
I rather lynch people based on day play rather than absence of claimed night actions, especially when the watchers/trackers in this game are having trouble actually seeing any actions. (each other and medhi's doc at the least)

[Cheery Dog]

Deed Counter Owners please announce who you investigated all nights. Thanks.

Already mentioned, but I can do it again.
Jal
Didn't use
Didn't use

[Cheery Dog]

Given that I think that scum, yes, are being competent which would mean reading this thread, they would know that Xis was at L-2 for a long time and would definitely quick-hammer it.

I think if they quickhammered they'd actually be pretty stupid. (and their might kill choices are competent?, they don't look like it to me, I'm still alive after a night they knew I wasn't being watched)

though it could be scum was already on the wagon and therefore a quickhammer wouldn't work (or the wagon was on scum?)
But we'll see what happens now jake has put himself onto l-2

I'll probably do a bit more reading anyway.

I'm confused on the people card aspect about why xis claimed the light green/blue at the start of yesterday but not the purple. I would think scum would be more likely to hide the one with powers and an thinking medhi just forgot receiving it at the start of the night

[Cheery Dog]

We'll see if I can be convinced, that lurker thing does sound about right. Let me just check something.

@Xis, where would your vote be if you still had it?
Also presuming for a moment you're telling the truth; you have a town read on jake, clears on jal and safety, and a town v scum read on me/mhork, so are you thinking one scum left it godfather?

yeah that really doesn't make any sense about reads. I will vote now
UNVOTE: VOTE: xis

[Cheery Dog]

@Cheery Dog

:

@Xis, where would your vote be if you still had it?
Also presuming for a moment you're telling the truth; you have a town read on jake, clears on jal and safety, and a town v scum read on me/mhork, so are you thinking one scum left it godfather?

No Lynch. Aside from the possibility of investigation-immune roles, I've also been wondering if I have a non-normal sanity with only 2/3 Yellows. If I continue to investigate without guilties, I'd suspect that to be the case, have to discard all results, and going purely off play and motive my scumteam would be Mhork+{Safety,You,Jal}.

Who is the most likely team should all your results be sane?

Shouldn't someone be watching xis on the off chance he's actually a cop?

There's only 2 watchers, I think I agree with the confirmed towns being better in this case + if Xis is actually a cop, and results are sane, the scumteam is found in you/Jake anyway.

[Cheery Dog]

Also Mhork, now that you're not attempting to force me into a Xis vote by stating stuff, can you answer this conversation properly?

Cheery, that doesn't make any sense. The percentage thing was a joke. How is finding him scummy after copping an obv town me looking scummy?

It doesn't on it's own, but with me rereading that he was in your list of joke high percentages of people likely to be town, to which you also had Mehdi in and changed your mind on, I think you're just attempting to put points against him for need of someone to attack, even if I am still finding Xis odd myself, I'm finding you more likely to be scum.

So why wasn't Mehdi who you had no solid read on be a good vig choice for night 2?

I just realized that both possible scum teams have xis as a part of them.

VOTE: Xisquelomir

He was a good Vig choice 'cause he looked like he was purposely trying to make other people doubt their reads on him.

wait what?
I'm talking about this comment from you

I just know that Mehdi prolly shouldn't be shot, or Jal unless Monkey flips town, or Xis, or Brawly. I'm, like, 86% these guys are town.

Hehehe... You're silly, Cheery.

But let's put this 'me-scum' thing aside for a moment. Do you think that xis is town? 'cause jake made done pretty good points.

[Cheery Dog]

@ cheery actually the scum team would be you/mhork cause I'm town yo

That'll we'll have to argue about, because I'm fairly sure I haven't misread my own faction.

[Cheery Dog]

If you're asking who I think is most likely to be mafia out of the 3 remaining uninvestigated, it's Mhork, then you, then Jake in descending order of suspicion. I'd give the pip to my StrangerCoug heebie-jeebies and assume you and Mhork were trying to fake-out guille in the neighbourhood QT before abandoning my Jake townread. However, I'd still prefer to investigate before lynching if it came down to you and Jake.

Yes I was asking about what was strongly since you only had 1 scum in 3 unconfirmeds and it didn't make sense. Now you are making some sense about where the second scum would come from.
UNVOTE:

I guess I better wait for safety's response to whatever before I hammer this no lynch.

[Cheery Dog]

btw safety, I answered it in the thread

gee safety, how dare you cherry pick what you are reading, how dare you do that in mylo. if you are town you should be ashamed of yourself.

I'm fairly sure all 3 of us with deed counters had actually answered it before safety asked the question.

Let me rephrase: Who received a card at the beginning of D2? Not during the night. At the beginning?

Good to see for all your claim of ignoring me, you've been cheery picking the posts you want to read, instead of the important ones. But you're right, why would town bother to read?

ahaha I'll teach that google I don't mean cherry when I search my username there yet!
(second time I've seen someone right cheery instead of cherry in the last week on this site, which makes a change from me being called cherry dog)

[Cheery Dog]

back to where we were all voting before then I guess.

VOTE: Mhork

You still haven't answered my posts.

[Cheery Dog]

unvote

had a brain fart and I am not on my PC right now, cheery, what were your tracking results each night again?

A listed by safety in the first spoiler of 2496
uber night 1, didn't see anything
Mhork night 2, didn't see anything
You night 3, didn't see anything

[Cheery Dog]

Before we go have this discussion about what my results pms say (which we've already had on day 2, which was why I claimed I'm the first place) can you please reread the one you got on night 2 and get back to whatever the heck it it's you're now.

[Cheery Dog]

Nah you can explain why you're getting different results than safety for the same action.

I got the same message that I got with Mehdi night one for both my results night two and I can't have been blocked day one. So I think its safe to say the "didn't see anything" message is not the same as a no result message. Would be nice to know the difference though.

[Cheery Dog]

I have no idea what the mod is on then. He definitely gave me a result at the end of the night.

So either Mod wasn't actually paying attention to what he was answering, or

you

didn't actually action last night.

scum found indeed.
VOTE: Jake

[Cheery Dog]

Which therefore means you didn't actually target anyone, therefore giving me the correct result of me not seeing anything.
It also means you're faking having not seen Xis get his result on safety, since you therefore didn't target and you're scum looking for that 1v1 to get a lynch.

[Cheery Dog]

and what is your roles name?

My is vanilla townie with some property deed cards.

To become not vanilla you require a monopoly if I'm to believe Jal's role is now "vig" - therefore you not actioning with your cards means you are just a vanilla mafia goon.

[Cheery Dog]

Unless the mod is lying to me (or the thread), you're the one lying here.

[Cheery Dog]

Why dop I need to ask the mod questions, it's obvious you're scum and you're just looking for other targets now that your "didn't see Xis because I didn't action plan" has fallen through.

[Cheery Dog]

There's no confirmation about me lying anywhere, because the fact of the matter is I'm not lying.

[Cheery Dog]

Your role's actual name please.

[Cheery Dog]

Therefore my point is in 2515 is valid and you not actioning means you weren't doing anything therefore I shouldn't have got a "no result" on your no action.

[Cheery Dog]

but I was actioning, one of my cards gives me the watcher ability. want proof that I watched Jal and saw you?

ALL of this was before Safety claimed to watch Jal also. I was freaking out cause I thought I caught you in a lie.

You having seen me visit Jal night 1 doesn't mean anything about your lack of an action last night.

[Cheery Dog]

nowhere.
I said you needed a monopoly to get powers actually listed as your role, therefore my result I received and the mod's post means you hadn't actioned. And therefore it doesn't count as you actually being a watcher, you're a vanilla of whatever your alignment is, which I believe to be scum.

[Cheery Dog]

It's the only thing that fits with the information the mod had given me.

[Cheery Dog]

@Jake considering I didn't pay attention to the mod contradicting what he sent me at the start of the day until how ever many posts that was after you brought it up, it's only become apparent that you're lying now. I don't think you were expecting that answer from the mod to your question, but that's how the facts fall. Unless you'd already asked him during the night, but you'd have brought this up earlier if that wa the case.

As for reasons you didn't watch, I came up with one possibility by sleeping on it, but seeing as I should therefore have seen you move I may have to discount it. (plus there wasn't any other claims making it less probable)
But as I'll still wonder about it anyway

@mod, are mafia able to kill and use deed actions in the same night?

You're moved off xis again because you need 4 people to lynch and you thought you'd have better luck with me getting jal and safety to move.

Cheery - Do you think there is a manipulation role in the game?

If there are any I believe them to be limited shot - chance/community chest.
But I think the mod's weird role interactions by lack of watchers seeing each other, trackers not seeing doctors means that actual manipulate roles don't exist.

[Cheery Dog]

This is a purposeful prod dodge until tonight and then I make my vote. Yes yes I realize the deadline is short.

I thought you still wanted nolynch?
(which for whatever reason those votes still aren't being shown in the votecount)

[Cheery Dog]

I personally don't think the 2 are the same.

So from Cheery's pov I stayed home and didnt submit an action despite me claiming I did.

Xis claimed that he got a result on safety even though I claim nobody visited safety.

So our options

1. I lied to frame both of then (but me pushing on safety and saying I don't think xis/cheery are scum together don't really fit this scenario )
2. They are both lying to set me up which is fine by me cause if I get lynched Ill flip town and Jal shoots 1 and you lynch the other (assuming no manipulative role)

3. We actually do have a manipulative role of some sort.

A. Roleblocker? Doesn't work
B. re-director? If xis got redirected Cheery's result is still wrong. If cheery got redirected, xis's result is still wrong. If I got redirected, Cheery's result is still wrong
C. Bus driver? If I was bussed, cheer's result is still wrong. If safety was bussed, both xis's and cheer's results are wrong.
D. ???

Maybe there are other scenarios I'm missing but we got 3 days, and it's guaranteed one of me/cheery/xis are lying and it means one of these 3 are scum.

Want more time? NL but I really think we can figure it out in 3 days

option 2 doesn't neccarsary work with you being town and only 1 of us 3 being scum - a mislynch and a misvig means town loses and we won't be able to lynch the other.

Unless you're saying there's now only one scum left.

I think it's most likely jake/mhork.

[Cheery Dog]

So what's the other card that was redistributed at the start of day 2 then?

the SK would have had a seperate kill, unless you think Jal has become an SK now :/

[Cheery Dog]

So what's the other card that was redistributed at the start of day 2 then?

the SK would have had a seperate kill, unless you think Jal has become an SK now :/

[Cheery Dog]

So what's the other card that was redistributed at the start of day 2 then?

the SK would have had a seperate kill, unless you think Jal has become an SK now :/

Idk what to think. I'm trying to have a discussion but everyone keeps telling me to basicàlly shut up.

You guys don't want to discuss anything? Well that's you guys throwing the game away, not me.

Do I think it's possible Jal could be scum? Yes I do

Yes it's possible Jal could be scum, I doubt it to be the case since I believe it's you/mhork.

But what you're currently saying is that MonkeyMan lied about which card he picked up at the start of day 2, got a serial killer alignment from that card he apparently had at the start and claimed it fruitlessly in an attempt to avoid the lynch, and it when to Jal-scum who proceeded to claim a lie about his role now being a full vig for no reason.
Boardwalk also passed through TheBrawlGuy's hands, what do you think it was then?

[Cheery Dog]

Do you think that the SK's killing ability comes from the card but mafia can kill without one? I don't think so but nobody wants to discuss it.

I believe both parties can (or could in the case of the SK) kill without the card, and that there was a possibility of 4 kills night 1, however if killed your cards don't activate explaining why the vig shots didn't go though.

There was two kills night 1, and two vig cards were apparently redisturbed at the start of day 2, both night 1 deaths were town, and I don't think they would have offed each other.

[Cheery Dog]

No I believe

I believe both parties can (or could in the case of the SK) kill without the card, and that there was a possibility of 4 kills night 1, however if killed your cards don't activate explaining why the vig shots didn't go though.

I know that UN didn't go anywhere night 1 because of my actions, and unless their is manipulative roles, that's the only way I can see it making sense.

Why do I have to believe the word of groupscum because I believe words of an independent alignment?
Lurker obviously lied about his deed, monkey's claim makes sense with the other information available, that's a big difference.

Please continue attempting to force your own theory onto me when I'm questioning it, you can't get much more obvscum, but maybe the others will actually notice.
Do you believe that the BrawlGuy had boardwalk during night 2?

[Cheery Dog]

Monkey died day 2, it then went apparently to brawl during the night and onto jal day 3.
Monkey having it during night 2 is not an option.

[Cheery Dog]

The no lynch is going to happen at deadline in 20 hours anyway, so there's kind of no point voting it now.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm assuming that you're meant to have had jal on the no lynch as well, because ig it only requires 3 votes this day should have ended over a week ago.

I guess we're not going to get anything out of the next 4 and a hour hours anyway.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: no lynch

I will be deed counting someone tonight

[Cheery Dog]

Determined both the investigation and card-counting targets by randomizing (out of 3 for investigation and out of 5 for card-counting).

Copping Lord Mhork: G

Card-counted Jal: Jal had at least 2 cards

Will vote Mhork if watching/tracking results reveal no interference.

As someone who tracked you last night, why don't I see either of those actions? (or any action whatsoever)

Deed counter has been confirmed to count as a visit (at least to watches) who saw mine in action night 1, I don't see trackers not being the same.

Speaking of the deed counter I used mine last night as I said I would, @Jake, did you self watch pick it up?
Also with that, I'm confused why my night 1 use described the answer as well as the "confirmed" I got today to tell me more than two cards were processed.

@Xis, how much detail have your results gone into when you have got your results I didn't see you getting.

[Cheery Dog]

I didn't think it meant anything, it was jst something I noticed. The language from tracking has remained the same.

Even if all investigation results have to be discarded, however, I'd prefer Mhork as today's lynch just based on his Neighbourhood activity level last night in contrast with his on-site posting rate.

I agree to that, he's still ignoring my questions from yesterday.

[Cheery Dog]

St. Charles Place.

[Cheery Dog]

I'm going to try this as he deserves death for siding everything yesterday, and I'm fairly sure he it's still scum

VOTE: mhork

If it's xis and one of the watchers, well done on winning against the odds.

[Cheery Dog]

so how do you wrap your head around xis getting a result on Safety yesterday when he didn't visit him? did he pull that result out of his ass?

the same way I explain how I didn't see him last night, by tossing those results in the bin sure to odd mod tactics and going off my own reads which as I said yesterday are jake/mhork.

And though it does mean I'm lost with why I got a didn't see anything on jake last night instead of the no result I was supposedly meant to get.
new theory is that the trackers don't actually do anything.

Actually I'm now wondering if the cards actually only activate if they're both used on the same person.

[Cheery Dog]

Wow, Cheery. Way to confirm yourself. The team is totally Cheery/xis now. Lemme ask you, cheery, first of all what do you make of the fact that I got the Vig shot? Second, how can you possibly believe that I'm scum over xis, who is BSing and bending over backwards trying to look obv town. He had a guilty on me, supposedly. A guilty. Yet instead he chose to wait of the town to say something about it. Explain that. How does that look town?

Getting the vig shot means nothing, we know the sk had one before you, so why wouldn't the mafia?

Which is the complete opposite to you dodging questions about your old reads and even trying to reverse them.

[Cheery Dog]

If they can't pick out up, PoE tells us who is scum
I believe xis had the other one, so what do you day with that?

Anyway the last line of my response to jake, the vig shots need to both me at the same person to work.

though only the case for those with only 2 cards.

[Cheery Dog]

@Cheery: I realize you have Jake as last-scum, but can you explain why he'd relinquish his stance yesterday to NL?

The same reason he gave up on you and went after me, in that it was the only thing that would actually go through.

I believe you and Jal were the only ones to not give up voting stances, and that's because you were both always on the no lynch. (up until you lost your vote), even though mhork never joined the no lynch the second time

[Cheery Dog]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: xis

[Cheery Dog]

So I'm kinda disappointed in SC, I didn't expect him to quit under suspicion. I really wish more people was suspicious cheery. I knew he was scum but just couldn't convince anyone to lynch him. Nice trick by bussing him in lylo. Scum seems to be taking more risks now

I figured I needed to be on the wagon and joining then was the best way to get your vote onto xis

I see I managed to actually figure out why we weren't getting taking results beforehand.
But that was nice that noone knew what was happening with the power roles.
And I'm surprised I managed to live anyway, my counterattacking you near the end of yesterday was piety bad of me not reading the thread. Though I was meant to get that failed result and not be blocked.
day 2's claim about mhork bring tracked and not targeting the kill was because I decided you didn't need to know he didn't have powers (and I would have ended up lying about what I did see if he did actually have any powers)

[Cheery Dog]

Well, Xis Cheery and mhork. trusted me. The rest either wanted me killed or didn't care. At the time there wasn't a mayority on people not liking me, but there were plenty that given enough time, I think me being in Lylo would have guaranteed a town loss. It's irrelevant now though.

When 2 of those are scum, there's going to be problems.

[Cheery Dog]

One of my posts this day has me figuring out the mechanic (except I was confused by deed counters)

My not seeing Xis deed count, yet the deed counter had been seen by watchers triggered me into thinking that, and it does work a lot better than cards not working due to death as I suspected earlier.

Had you lynched mhork, I was actally going to probably no kill and claim green giving me jailkeep if I received mhork's green card.
(when i went bussing today, i'd thought about what role green was actually likely to have behind it, and figured roleblock/jailkeeper would be likely due to the proximity of the go to jail space (though i had forgotten we hadn't found out what purples next to the actual jail did, I switched that and train stations.)
If i gained the vig (at least at that stage when i hadn't confirmed what the mechanic was, i probably would have attempted to use it on xis.