Mafia Behind the Maiden (Game over!)
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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FWIW, I'm on FIRE AND HATRED mode. I am not going to spend early days in a 28-slots/32-players game trying to defend people who will be constant lynch ponies and can't be trusted to hold up their end of town play in later days. Scumhunting > trying to save derpy players from a lynch.
This means: either shape up and look townie, or don't trust me to defend poor play even if I don't find it scummy. I don't have the patience nor the willingness to defend that crap in a game this size.
Most of this playerlist is capable enough to not need hand-holding, anyway. But I thought I should warn about this because there might be a meta-shift from me.
SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE.
/ur-quan
PEdit: O hai. Complete bullshit list.
UNVOTE: Wyrd
VOTE: Quilford-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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In post 25, Quilford wrote:What's bullshit about it, Tierce?
Making a list like this at the stage in the game when you made it (Post 22) as town is absurd, especially when you bother listing players asnullout of RVS votes. Town doesn't really find a need to classify players they don't yet have a read on, while scum would be more likely to present null-reads to show 'effort'.
In post 26, Magister Ludi wrote:@ Tierce, what triggered this self proclaimed meta-shift, and who exactly do you expect "poor play from" and consider a "lynch pony"?
If I wanted to talk about it, I would've.
Why do you want me to point out who I think is a potential poor player/lynch pony? There is no town motivation for doing so at this point in the game.
In post 32, Tammy wrote:And what's up with the meta warnings? Just a heads up I won't be playing like I normally do, but it's definitely not because I'm evil, it's because... Seriously, not because I'm evil though, definitely not that!
I was warning about a change because I don't want to eat a lynch/vig bullet from something that is deliberate becauseI'm pissed offand done with trying to figure out what might be herp-a-derpy and what's straight-out scummy. People assume my town behavior is something very specific, while I am careful to ensure I subvert my town meta and use it as scum for my benefit (see Paranoia Mafia for several examples). I usually don't give a crap about how my meta is perceived as town, but I don't want to waste time explaining myself later when my attitude gets inevitably questioned. This is deliberate and purposeful. As scum, I get stuff done. As town, I spend far too much time hand-holding and protecting perceived town VIs from lynches--and they screw up later, while I end up night-killed before doing anything really useful.
I'm done with it. Vi is one of my favorite mods, this game has some of my favorite players and I want to make a difference in it.
Are we done with the pointless questioning? Great.
In post 38, Debonair Danny DiPietro wrote:VOTE: Tierce
Don't want to be stuck in a situation again where she's scum and I know she's scum but can't get her lynched because she's Tierce so she needs to die now.
I'm easy to lynch in larger games, worry not. (You had issues in N#1209 because it was you v. me and we were the strongest figures in the game, etc.; hardly the case here.)
Problem with your logic is: I'm not scum.
In post 40, SpyreX wrote:
I'm not gonna lie and you managed to get me a little paranoid but this is so beautiful I have e-tears.
Will you be my secret bff?
Of course. <3
I thought things over, and there was rage and red and razorwire and I'm done. Derpy players alive too late can be dangerous for town.-
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In post 67, SpyreX wrote:Also we can skip the middle man and a high five for whomever turns UN into dust "HOW COULD O AND P GET CONFUSED ITS NOT LIEK.... THEY ARE RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER ON A KEYBAORD VOAT"
Will turbo-powerlynch that slot for hire. No fucks given.
Should probably go to bed. >.> Will reread Quilford in the morning.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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Hey Ludi:
In post 54, Tierce wrote:In post 26, Magister Ludi wrote:@ Tierce, what triggered this self proclaimed meta-shift, and who exactly do you expect "poor play from" and consider a "lynch pony"?
If I wanted to talk about it, I would've.
Why do you want me to point out who I think is a potential poor player/lynch pony? There is no town motivation for doing so at this point in the game.
This wasn't just for BLOOD AND RAGE benefit. I want an answer to my question. Why do you think me saying who I think is a weak spot in this playerlist would benefit town?
Duplicity wrote:God every time I'm about to hit submit there's more posts.-
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@UberNinja:
Okay, let's make that glaringly obvious:
See above: no fucks given. I don't care about you. I dislike the way you play. I don't want you around come LyLo, and I definitely don't want to have to slog through your posts. Yeah, I chose to join this game after seeing your name in the playerlist. Doesn't mean I have to like everyone's skills as a player, and I definitely do not like yours. Wouldn't mourn you eating a vig bullet none, and would give any SK a golden pass for it.
Inflated ego? That's not the issue. I want you dead because you're always a fucking distraction who makes no visible effort to stop being one, and a playerlist this size needs much pruning and purging before it starts being acceptable to play with. I don't want the inevitable slog through your posts, I don't want to have you around at LyLo, I don't want you around, period, and I highly doubt we will need your slot alive that much in a game this size. So yeah, you can eat a bullet and I wouldn't be bothered by it.
PEdit @Ludi: Yeah, I didn't clarify who I meant, and it's not just the :RAGE: above. I'm not saying I'm going deliberately after weak players. That's stupid. I'm saying that I don't have the energy, the willpower or the state of mind to defend weak play anymore by trying to defuse wagons on weak players. They will learn eventually that 1) weak play gets them no victories and 2) being hard to lynch benefits them regardless of alignment. That's something that they can't be protected from, and I don't want to spend my early game focused on defending this kind of people. Ergo,not focusingon them, going after who I think is scum, and explaining my change in attitude. If they get wagoned, it's not my holy quest to defend them; eventually I either bite a nightkill and they are still lynched later, or they turn around and lynch decent townreads of mine. So, yeah. I've decided that a certain kind of player is not my problem on D1/2/etc. and won't waste my energy or words on them as the days progress.
And now, good night.-
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:HAPPY:
In post 122, singersigner wrote:"When Tierce looks into your eyes it's like slitting little kitties necks."
-Prozac
You don't want this, Glork. Think of the kitties.-
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Tierce Cache Me If You Can
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Sleep what sleep. BLACKWATER!
In post 103, Tammy wrote:In post 54, Tierce wrote:
In post 32, Tammy wrote:And what's up with the meta warnings? Just a heads up I won't be playing like I normally do, but it's definitely not because I'm evil, it's because... Seriously, not because I'm evil though, definitely not that!
I was warning about a change because I don't want to eat a lynch/vig bullet from something that is deliberate becauseI'm pissed offand done with trying to figure out what might be herp-a-derpy and what's straight-out scummy. People assume my town behavior is something very specific, while I am careful to ensure I subvert my town meta and use it as scum for my benefit (see Paranoia Mafia for several examples). I usually don't give a crap about how my meta is perceived as town, but I don't want to waste time explaining myself later when my attitude gets inevitably questioned. This is deliberate and purposeful. As scum, I get stuff done. As town, I spend far too much time hand-holding and protecting perceived town VIs from lynches--and they screw up later, while I end up night-killed before doing anything really useful.
I'm done with it. Vi is one of my favorite mods, this game has some of my favorite players and I want to make a difference in it.
Are we done with the pointless questioning? Great.
And you had to go into so much detail about your meta because? I'm wondering why you had to go into a meta-defense before the game started, before anyone asked you any questions. It's even odder that you're now saying that you're not going to stand up for innocents from a mislynch, no matter who they are. I um not following your reasoning here.
Because I'm incredibly frustrated with recent events. And I've explained why I've expounded on it early on--because I don't want to waste time on it later and there would undoubtedly be questions about it later on. Several players here have seen me as town and know I tend to have a shining white shield and lance. I can talk about my meta because I know it and I'm able to manipulate certain levels of it, and I'm warning in advance that certain parts are changing because ~*~REASONS~*~
You're misrepresenting what I've said when claiming I won't defend innocents. That is definitely not what's behind my words--what I'm saying amounts to pursuing my scumreads instead of trying to defuse a wagon on weak players; packs a much more effective punch against scum/when it comes to protownness.
Let's see the votes:
Glork:
In post 86, Glork wrote:By the way, my vote was in no way random.In post 91, Glork wrote:I think she'd call out UN's playstyle regardless of her alignment. Widespread frustration with a player is not limited to alignment.
So... what have I done that strikes you as scummy, Glork?
Oman:
In post 90, Oman wrote:Also, uhhhVote: TierceI guess. Page 4 vote, no real reasoning, more of "why not".
Probably RVS. Please clarify this, Oman.
Quilford:
In post 92, Quilford wrote:In post 54, Tierce wrote:In post 25, Quilford wrote:What's bullshit about it, Tierce?
Making a list like this at the stage in the game when you made it (Post 22) as town is absurd, especially when you bother listing players asnullout of RVS votes. Town doesn't really find a need to classify players they don't yet have a read on, while scum would be more likely to present null-reads to show 'effort'.
I am an absurd person, then. I've done it in almost every single game I've played for ages as town, if I remember correctly. It produces useful reactions and usually gets the game out of RVS. And I was just listing everyone who posted for completeness.
I have a massive scum read on you now though, thanks. You remind me of VPB when he encountered me doing it. VOTE: Tierce
You claim you do this kind of thing for reactions, and then get surprised when people have... reactions? I thought the list was out of place and called you on it. What is scummy about my reaction? I am not VP Baltar; don't attribute hisrather awesomescumplay to me.
Tammy:
In post 98, Tammy wrote:I'll sheep Glork...vote: Tierce
*Trying really hard to look even slimier by the minute...so excited*
Why do you think Glork is town?
In post 110, Glork wrote:I'm not really at liberty to discuss my Tiercevote in detail.
You're in no other game with me and definitely don't have a guilty of any kind on me; why the cageyness?-
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In post 28, Haze wrote:VOTE: Hinduragi
Hi.
I'm not quite sure if Quilford's list is designed to catch reactions or if he geniuinely believes them...
FOS: Haze
Thought it was weird the first time around, still think it is weird now. Probably not scum with Quilford, and I know Haze tends to be pretty cautious, but why remark on the reads list this way and potentially destroy any genuine reactions Quilford might want to get? Why the fence? If you'renot sureand you actually want toknow, ask.
PEdit: Holy wall of posts.
@Glork, I omitted it because I'm not particularly interested in your perception of my scumhunting, which is rather wrong to begin with--if you're actually reading my posts, you'll see I'm scumhunting--and so I dismissed it as invalid. What I wanted to focus on was why you won't discuss the nature of your vote in detail, because that confuses me due to the current number of games we are NOT in together.
PEdit: FWIW, I *think* I need to find a certain(s) role(s) too. Not too familiar with Fire Emblem, but questing the wiki makes me think this would make sense.
This PEdit is turtles all the way down. I just want to post and read up on things I missed.-
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In post 129, Quilford wrote:In post 119, Tierce wrote:In post 92, Quilford wrote:In post 54, Tierce wrote:In post 25, Quilford wrote:What's bullshit about it, Tierce?
Making a list like this at the stage in the game when you made it (Post 22) as town is absurd, especially when you bother listing players asnullout of RVS votes. Town doesn't really find a need to classify players they don't yet have a read on, while scum would be more likely to present null-reads to show 'effort'.
I am an absurd person, then. I've done it in almost every single game I've played for ages as town, if I remember correctly. It produces useful reactions and usually gets the game out of RVS. And I was just listing everyone who posted for completeness.
I have a massive scum read on you now though, thanks. You remind me of VPB when he encountered me doing it. VOTE: Tierce
You claim you do this kind of thing for reactions, and then get surprised when people have... reactions? I thought the list was out of place and called you on it. What is scummy about my reaction? I am not VP Baltar; don't attribute hisrather awesomescumplay to me.
I do this kind of thing for reactions, and then lynch people who exhibit scummy reactions (i.e. yours).
Your reaction is scummy because you reacted.
I called you out on a bad reads list, explained why I thought it was scummy, and you... think I'm scum as a result? I really don't get this one. Why are reactions to that kind of (unexplained, too-early) list scummy by default? Have you never had a reads list questioned? I tried to look for the town motivation for doing it, found none. (You claimed 'completeness', I claim 'bollocks to that'.) I looked for scum motivation, found one--appearing to be scumhunting early and presenting 'effort'.
'You reacted to my early reads list, that's scummy' makes very little sense. I can understand that you might once or twice have gotten reactions to this kind of list and got lucky that the person later flipped scum, butreacting by defaultis not scummy.
PEdit: Character(s), in my case. Equivalent to roles/players considering it's one each.-
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In post 147, SpyreX wrote:PEdit: Character(s), in my case. Equivalent to roles/players considering it's one each.
I'm tired so I just want to make sure I've got this right:
You & Glork are looking for:
Baazelbub, Terror of the Sands
NOT:
A Roleblocker and a Vig
No idea about Glork, but from me, yes, you are correct.
PEdit: Huh, but subduing the Daein Resistance implies workingagainstthe Resistance/Micaiah.-
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In post 152, Glork wrote:
Actually, this sounds about right.Tierce wrote:I called you out on a bad reads list, explained why I thought it was scummy, and you... think I'm scum as a result?
I would love for you to explain why you took an RVS list commenting on a bunch of RVS votes and decided it came from scum trying to overjustify themselves.
I've done so:
In post 54, Tierce wrote:In post 25, Quilford wrote:What's bullshit about it, Tierce?
Making a list like this at the stage in the game when you made it (Post 22) as town is absurd, especially when you bother listing players asnullout of RVS votes. Town doesn't really find a need to classify players they don't yet have a read on, while scum would be more likely to present null-reads to show 'effort'.-
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@Glork--I understand if you don't want to answer this due to your read on me, but is itexpliciton your PM that you are looking for someone? Because IthinkI need to find other people (and doing so could benefit the town), but it's in no way explicit. Having just the barest flavor knowledge doesn't help this.-
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In post 161, Glork wrote:In post 155, Tierce wrote:In post 152, Glork wrote:
Actually, this sounds about right.Tierce wrote:I called you out on a bad reads list, explained why I thought it was scummy, and you... think I'm scum as a result?
I would love for you to explain why you took an RVS list commenting on a bunch of RVS votes and decided it came from scum trying to overjustify themselves.
I've done so:
In post 54, Tierce wrote:In post 25, Quilford wrote:What's bullshit about it, Tierce?
Making a list like this at the stage in the game when you made it (Post 22) as town is absurd, especially when you bother listing players asnullout of RVS votes. Town doesn't really find a need to classify players they don't yet have a read on, while scum would be more likely to present null-reads to show 'effort'.
I'm willing to be that I can find an example where a player in RVS called someone else null and you didn't bat an eyelash. Why is it a big deal here, and what made you think that Quil's list was in any way different from any other RVS post made, aside from the fact it commented on everyone who had posted?
As of Post 23, what actually made Quilscum, and not someone who was just being a goof on Page 1?
It's possible. But on a reads list on page 1? It seemed forced, premature, and I'm not going back through my games to see how I reacted to similar things before. This is how it struck me here, in this game--as a scummy gesture, because it seemed an exaggeration of the stuff he actually had available to analyze.
To note: I didn't think his post was RVS. Now that I look back at page 1, I think I've overreacted re: Quilford's list's importance and its non-RVS-ishness.
UNVOTE: Quilford-
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In post 158, Tierce wrote:@Glork--I understand if you don't want to answer this due to your read on me, but is itexpliciton your PM that you are looking for someone? Because IthinkI need to find other people (and doing so could benefit the town), but it's in no way explicit. Having just the barest flavor knowledge doesn't help this.
At least give me a "no, I won't answer this". Don't ignore me, please.-
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Must... resist... urge...
What's your problem re: actually contributing content on the first phases of a game, Oversoul? Why wait for others to provide "things to comment on"? I think this is a playstyle thing from you, but boy oh boy does it make me twitch.
PEdit: Ooooh trinkets.
Tammy: Why SpyreX over me? Why the pseudo self-vote after you had said you didn't believe those?-
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See: my initial remark about meta-shift.
I accomplished things in Paranoia that, had I been town, could have led town to a win, had I bussed you or Akonas. I actually think the basis of my scumplay would make for solid townplay, and that's part of what I'm trying here. Assertive aggressiveness can be good, and you're fooling yourself if you think I would be mellow and gentle as town in a game with this playerlist in these circumstances.-
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In post 187, Hinduragi wrote:I don't think he's saying it has anything to do with your alignment. If you guys have problems with play styles, I'd prefer if you saved that for postgame pm's, md, etc.In post 188, Hinduragi wrote:Skimmed the paranoia part. My bad.
Yes, it's alignment-relevant. He's seeing parallels between my play here and the early stages of Paranoia, in which we were both scum. I'm saying that there are some deliberate parallels because I'm drawing from my play there. While I understand that it would make him uncomfortable, this is actually being done on purpose. (...Sorry, I guess? But this works for me, Oversoul. Deal.)
Holy overblown AtE Batman.
Riddle me this, Tammy: if you were to draw town in a game and recent events and circumstances had changed your perception of how best to act as town, but you knew you would probably be attacked for a visible change in playstyle compared to games the playerlist has seen you in, what would you do?
- Don't say anything about it at all, even if you are run-up on "meta!"
- Explain when you are run-up because you are not playing to your usual meta.
- Wait for someone to ask about it.
- Explain the meta change when the game has just started and we are at a low-information stage, where reactions to this announcement will push the game away from RVS and/or be indicative of alignment and/or not distract much from scumhunting.
A) and B) seem risky and a waste of everyone's attention when they should be focused on finding and lynching scum. C) is acceptable. D) is totally my style.
How is this behavior scummy? I'm not trying to excuse a meta change halfway through the game, I've explained my reasons, and those I have NOT explained cannot be delved on right now.
You haven't actually answered my questions, and your post can be reduced to "woe is me, for I am being wagoned". I am not voting you, neither are a lot of other people. Again: why the self-vote after you had said you don't believe in self-votes, and after that stint, why SpyreX instead of me? The timing is suspiciously close to the crumbling of the wagon on me. What changed your mind and caused you to change votes each time? Why the townread on Glork? You are avoiding the crux of these questions to simply say that your actions aren't scummy (rolled in a huge ball of AtE cheese) without explaining your reasoning. I've seen you play, I know you can do better than this.-
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Still not an answer to my questions.
And to prove you wrong, Benmage presented a similar circumstance on D1 of Weather Mafia II--he claimed he would be less active than usual on later days, and people were in an uproar as to why he would claim that so early on. He was town.
Town can be aware of their general meta traits and be upfront about them, especially if the changes are deliberate. Why is this scummy?-
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In post 194, Tammy wrote:Answering your questions Tierce:
I don't have a static playstyle, by game or day, so I don't know how to answer this question. Seriously, I'm rather temperamental, and even though I play analytically mostly, my play style can vary widely by day, hour, or mood. I have general attitudes that you can read me by, but that's probably as far as you can get unless you watch me closely and know me well.
But, the fact that you came into a game and announced that you'd be different...and that you had a lapdog rounding up votes against the one person who called attention to it? Fucking droll. I don't care what the hell meta you round up to prove your intent people can manipulate it. I don't care what type of dispersions you cast against me because I say it's BS. I'm not gonna tell you why I have a town read on Glork anymore than I'm gonna tell you why I have a town read on Zdenek right now. I just fucking do.
How does this answer my questions?
What I really want to know from you is:
1) Why you had/have a townread on Glork since RVS, which you're refusing to do;
2) Why you self-voted when you said you don't go for self-votes;
3) Why you chose SypreX as scum over me after that self-vote.
I don't give a damn that you think it's over-explanatory. I could rant about the subject of whiteknighting in my meta for hours, and people here know I would/have done so. Christ, go ahead and look through my games. You can see this shift coming from miles away.
You were supposedly sheeping Glork over my meta explanation--but Glork wasn't voting me on meta to begin with. You haven't even touched the points on me that were making Glork-your-townread uncomfortable.
You're complaining that you were a 'lapdog' being wagoned while I made a declaration of meta change (I... don't control how the votes fall on you? I'm not an ironfist and I wasn't voting you, so what exactly did you want me to do about the wagon on you?) but the only thing you're raising against me is "overexplanation", which is not a scumtell with neither you nor me because we are both known to soliloquy from here to tomorrowas town. The fact that you started raking up votes while I went on my own personal sidequest of Hatred And Loathing For The World--in your mind, how are they correlated? You clearly think they are, so who is the scum that was making sure you grew on votes while you raved against dram?
This just doesn't add up. Last night I was left wondering if you were drunk or something; your posts don't really make sense, and as I said before, I know you can do better. You're not explaining your reads outside from me, the only reasoning you're presenting for Tiercescum is that you think I'm overexplaining things myself, and--it doesn't work like that.
UberNinja wrote:Tierce, are you scum? Don't lie to me, please.
If you do, I will make it my personal life's work to join every game you're in, and lynch the shit out of you every single time.
I'm terrified.
I'm not scum.
singersigner wrote:In post 48, Tierce wrote:Quick warning--I'm currently in the same room as singersigner, so we're avoiding this game until she goes back to the hotel to avoid out-of-game interference. Post later.
lol. The awkwardness that ensued when we both realized that the game was up, but didn't want to risk anything by posting yet...I may have been a bit harsh about trying to avoid anything out-of-game related. I hope you can forgive me! <3
(though that clearly didn't stop her from posting up a storm-ish as soon as I left )
You're a terrible person and I hope you feel bad for that one. (But not really. That was a good idea due to game integrity--thank you. <3)-
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In post 224, SpyreX wrote:Because in my gut this is bad BUT its happening AND I just love fighting tooth and nail to watch it get waaaashed away because ~mysteriously~ it never seems like they DIE AT NIGHT LIKE THEY SHOULD
See, this is my problem.
FWIW, I think that slot is incrediderpy town. Wouldn't mourn it for a minute because that play is utter crap; he'd probably pull something stupid later in the game and eat a lynch/vig bullet. It's a slot that will never eat a scum kill. -_- But I'm not really ready to see one of our town players die tonight with no more info than a probable-townlynchwagon.
Old habits. ._______.
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It is, but my experience with him says this isn't exactly surprising. He just doesn't remember the crap he's done--remember in Weather Mafia II, where in D2 he had no idea he had massively defended BBmolla on D1?
I need to read this thoroughly tonight, if I have decent internet on that other island.-
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In post 232, Alchemist wrote:Glork. Your UN vote is bullshit.
Yeah, I was thinking about it, and it's not the fact that it's uN that's being wagoned--it's the fact that Glork has had enough experience with UN to know better. I've seen Glorktown act like this, but... he should know already. His softclaim looked townish, but this is rather odd.FOS: Glork
In post 232, Alchemist wrote:Tierce do you think SpyreX is scum?
I have no idea. SpyreX is one of my favorite players and I'm extremely paranoid about him because I've seen him pull off amazing scum plays. He is one of those players with whom I just want to roll over and be happy at the sheer marvel of their posts. >_< Too early to tell, I think.-
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Ya rly. Let me have my paranoia.
Why would you prefer to be voted yourself than having me being voted, Glork? Doesn't make much sense, no matter how certain you are that I'm town. It might just be a turn of phrase--I'm too tired to delve on it, so please explain.
@Toast:
There's history behind my opinion of UN's play that involves other games. I have a slight townread on him, won't push that wagon myself because I'm more interested on Other Things (at least once I'm awake enough to analyze the rest of the game), but it's not a slot I care enough about to defend.
@SpyreX:
We can do BETTER than UN. I'd much rather not read through his posts, true, but come on. I'm trying, but you have to give me something. That Tammy wagon had a lot more spunk.
VOTE: Tammy
Oof. Exhausted. Poor night's sleep + hayfever + plane + rain = have mercy on me. Moar post tomorrow.-
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In post 229, Oversoul wrote:Tierce, you said you are transplanting some posting habits from Paranoia Mafia and saying you are using them here as townand that I should "deal". My response to you is that you should "deal" that I find you suspicious for using scumbehavior from a scumgame we shared.
Huh, yeah? I said I understood where your suspicions came from and I'm not criticizing you for them, but I'm not going to change deliberate play because you find it meta-suspicious when the meta-appropriation was deliberate to begin with.
tl;dr: Iam"dealing" with it.-
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For reference:
Unofficial votecount:
Tammy (L-9) ~ Magister Ludi, Debonair Danny DiPietro, dramonic, Oman, Tierce, SpyreX
UberNinja (L-9) ~ Lady Lambdadelta, SpyreX, Glork, Nikanor, Teleporting Speed Hippos, ToastyToast
Tierce (L-11) ~ Quilford, Tammy, MaguaofIllusion, UberNinja
Hinduragi (L-13) ~ Haze, Zdenek
Quilford (L-14) ~ Duplicity
Wyrd (Nuwen) (L-14) ~ Wyrd
Alchemist (L-14) ~ MathGirl277
Nikanor (L-14) ~ Hinduragi
Haze (L-14) ~ Gammagooey
Magister Ludi (L-14) ~ Alchemist
Not Voting:implosion, Katsuki, Nexus, Shinori, singersigner
--With 29 alive, it takes 15 to lynch.-
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In post 7, Vi wrote:Vote Count 0:Shinon
Not Voting:Alchemist, Teleporting Speed Hippos, Debonair Danny DiPietro, dramonic, Duplicity, Gammagooey, Glork, Haze, Hinduragi, implosion, Katsuki, Lady Lambdadelta, Magister Ludi, MaguaofIllusion, MathGirl277, Nexus, Nikanor, Oman, Oversoul, Quilford, Shinori, singersigner, SpyreX, Tammy, Tierce, ToastyToast, UberNinja, Wyrd, Zdenek
0In post 203, Vi wrote:Mini Vote Count:Matthew (FE7) (also, 152 posts overnight, seriously)
Tammy (L-8) ~ SpyreX, Magister Ludi, UberNinja, Debonair Danny DiPietro, dramonic, Oman, Glork
Quilford (L-13) ~Alchemist, DuplicityTierce,
Tierce (L-13) ~Quilford,Debonair Danny DiPietro, Glork, Oman,TammyTammy,
dramonic (L-14) ~ Zdenek,Tammy
Wyrd (Nuwen) (L-14) ~Wyrd,Tierce,Quilford
Alchemist (L-14) ~ MathGirl277
Hinduragi (L-14) ~ Haze
Zdenek (L-14) ~HinduragiTammy,
Haze (L-14) ~ Gammagooey
SpyreX (L-15) ~Tammy
Teleporting Speed Hippos (L-15) ~Alchemist
Oversoul (L-15) ~Magister Ludi, UberNinja
Not Voting:Teleporting Speed Hippos,Alchemist,implosion, Katsuki, Lady Lambdadelta,Debonair Danny DiPietro, dramonic, Duplicity, Gammagooey, Glork, Haze, Hinduragi,MaguaofIllusion,Magister Ludi,Nexus, Nikanor,MathGirl277,Shinori, singersigner,Oman, Oversoul, Quilford,ToastyToast, UberNinja,SpyreX, Tammy, Tierce,Tierce,Wyrd, Zdenek,Glork
0
Vi wrote:0
Am I the only one who noticed this? I'm wondering if it has to do with votecount numbers or if it's something else. It's certainly not size-zero-Vi-prod-list.
@Vi: Is the meaning of this zero available for public knowledge? If so, could you explain it, please?[/b]-
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In post 301, SpyreX wrote:I also am a doublevoter in your vote count.
We might as well dream big.
It might mean votecount #0, especially since the second votecount was amini-votecount. I'm wondering if that kind of "visible" numbering is a way of tracking the RL length of deadline-less days, but it seems redundant because it's already in the VC title/can be seen by counting the days.
Confuzzled and sleepy and ooooh bed nao.-
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In post 305, dramonic wrote:In post 300, Tierce wrote:EBWOP, failtag:
@Vi: Is the meaning of this zero available for public knowledge? If so, could you explain it, please?
I have no clue what we're talking about here, enlighten me?
Look at the votecount posts. Lower right. There is a blueish, oversized, bolded 0 (zero) on them.
Inquiring minds want to know.-
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In post 317, Tammy wrote:And Tierce enters in Post 290 and confirms herself as scum. Hey Tierce dear, I want you in 50 words or less, to explain to me how anything I've done has expressed scum intent or mindset. I'm sure you can come up withsomethingthat sounds good. Noted the subtle way that you directed Spyrex to get on my wagon as well. Sneaky sneaky. Come on! Round up those votes...you've got a mislynch to push.
There was nothing "subtle" or "sneaky" about it. My intent was to get SpyreX to vote you. It's something that happens when you want to push your scumreads--you try and convince others to vote the wagon you prefer. But nah, this is completely a scum move by me, you're totes right.
I've already explained how your behavior is against what I'd expect from you as town and how I can't follow your train of thought; your behavior does not match what I have seen from townTammy.-
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'Morning.
The three starting/main wagons? No visible intent to actually get reads elsewhere or push your scumreads?
Rope pl0x.
UNVOTE: Tammy
VOTE: ToastyToast-
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Late to the party, it seems. Buuut it's a good wagon.
In post 440, ToastyToast wrote:In post 437, Glork wrote:In post 434, ToastyToast wrote:Did you not get from my first post that there were three people I found suspicious. Good God the stupidity.
Your top three suspicion list is literally a steaming bowl of shit.
How do expect me to respond to this? Would you prefer I just make up some scumreads on people who aren't being voted? I don't think my scumreads are shitty, and so I'm keeping them. The three of them are in a circle of "I know you before this game" and "I am like this in other games" and I don't like it. To me this is the singlemost suspicious thing in the game thus far. I'm sorry you don't like them, but quite frankly I think its a pretty damn good lead to start with this early into the game.
I mean, seriously, wtf is this? So we've played/read each other before, and that's suspicious? (You're in for a loop with me, I've read alotof games for my join date.) You're not even trying to figure out who is scummier of the set? You have no comments on anything else? 'This early in the game' being page 20? We may be close to the start chronology-wise, but you find nothing else to comment on?-
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In post 453, Magister Ludi wrote:Gamma's 447 is also a pretty good find. I don't think singersinger really knows what she is saying here. She puts down a vote on Tammy, and then a few hours (~15) later seemingly forgets where it is, calls tammy super town, and decides to call SpyreX, who was also on the Tammy wagon, scum, and Magua, scum, (who knows why) but doesn't shift her vote to either of them.
And she also said she didn't feel like mafia-ing, so that post is more of a "general feelings, will be back later" than "here is all my commentary and current reads". She's trying to participate with what she has.
Having met singer and knowing how she's been feeling recently, I think this is neither surprising nor scummy; instead it's a bit of a towntell.-
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Snipped several bits.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:As I have said, I think Tierce's reaction to Quil's list was an overreaction and highly similar to when she bussed me in Paranoia. Yes I know her defense, but I'm not going to let this go for now.
Given the first two pages, I have a townread on Ludi and Alchemist. Minor townreads on Quilford and Zednek, but we'll see how this changes.
You know my defense (I didn't realize he was actually RVSing and jumped on it for being a bad list, period), so I don't really have anything to say about this. I'm interested in how you think this is similar to when I was bussing you in Paranoia and yet you have a minor townread on Quilford; in the same breath, you are claiming that Tierce-Quilford is equal to Paranoia Tierce-Oversoul but they are at the same time different. Makes little sense.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 49, Alchemist wrote:Quil is going way over the top. Wow.
Also;
In post 47, Quilford wrote:Ugh, I didn't want to get agro this early. Fuck.
Pretty sure we got scum here.
Why? His aggression if anything shows he doesn't care what people think and believes in the truthfulness of his list.
Then...myaggression is scummy, how? When I've stated directly in this game that I intend to be more aggressive as town, the reasons for it, and then do it--calling me (over)aggressive = scummy seems to defeat the point.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 54, Tierce wrote:Making a list like this at the stage in the game when you made it (Post 22) as town is absurd, especially when you bother listing players as null out of RVS votes. Town doesn't really find a need to classify players they don't yet have a read on, while scum would be more likely to present null-reads to show 'effort'.
Maybe I've played a few too many games with Mastin, but this behavior doesn't particularly bother me.
Why would Quilford do that if he could just blend in with the shadows by making a random vote and no reads list? The initiative is town, Tierce.
Hai, the list was RVS meant to garner reactions. I didn't think it was, I thought it was a supposedly-legitimate-reads-on-post-22 and called bullshit on it. Then I saw The Error In My Ways. I don't think it's particularly town (here's a Tierce-Quil/Tierce-Oversoul difference, I called you town in Paranoia, while I don't have a townread on Quil), but my scumread was wrong.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 54, Tierce wrote:Are we done with the pointless questioning? Great.
At this point I think we need to take a breather. There really isn't any reason you should be *this* angry Tierce, but then I again I don't know the whole story.
Why can't we be suspicious of your meta? You're asking town to do untowny things simply because you feel yourself to be clearly town.
Again, I never said you shouldn't be suspicious. The thing with Tammy was that she asked me to rehash what I had already said--and unlike you, she has no completed games with me nor is she familiar with my meta, so the whole thing seemed pointless.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:What do you think of Quilford's aggro comment?
No opinion. I don't think it's relevant.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:I am withholding a townread on Spyrex for a certain reason that I'll explain later, if I am allowed.
SHUT THE FUCK UP. If this reason is anywhere close to what I'm thinking, you need to STOP CLIAMING THIS CRAP, Oversoul. NOW. And yes, this makes me incredibly angry.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 77, Tierce wrote:Why do you think me saying who I think is a weak spot in this playerlist would benefit town?
Why no pressure on UN for asking Gamma what his "super secret scumtell" is?
I'm not really reading UN's posts.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 119, Tierce wrote:
Why are pursuing scumreads and defusing wagons on people you think are town exclusive? If you get a lynch on a scumread you shouldn't have to worry about a lynch on one of your townreads, no?
I'm not really seeing the whole reason for "defending" bad players.
Then again, I am pretty sure we've never had a towngame together other than Mafia with the Kitties.
Why do you not have a problem with Oman's vote when it is fairly clear we were out of RVS at the time of that vote? Is it because he has blue eyes?
Tierce, do you think your scumplay is unique to yourself?
I really don't see how you can be angry at Ludi for asking you "who are easy lynch ponies?" and then ask Glork to explain his "not at liberty statement"
Like seriously I don't understand the logic behind those two actions.
Will approach this and the rest later, I need food and breakfast closes in 10.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 186, Tierce wrote:Assertive aggressiveness can be good, and you're fooling yourself if you think I would be mellow and gentle as town in a game with this playerlist in these circumstances.
Need I point you to a thread in MD about town leaders? Sometimes being a person who isn't in the limelight is a good idea. Would you not agree?
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 251, Glork wrote:Tierce's complete and utter confusion over flavor / win conditions is very likely genuine, as I'd expect her to tighten up the flavor screws before the game started if she were scum. Please move your vote somewhere more useful. Hell, I'd rather it be on me than Tierce at this point.
No.
If given the chance (beyond my control at this point) I will explain more, but no. That is not good logic to use when justifying *anyone* as town.
SHUT THE FUCK UP. Again.-
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Failquotes. Let's try again.
@Vi: Please delete the previous post.
Snipped several bits.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:As I have said, I think Tierce's reaction to Quil's list was an overreaction and highly similar to when she bussed me in Paranoia. Yes I know her defense, but I'm not going to let this go for now.
Given the first two pages, I have a townread on Ludi and Alchemist. Minor townreads on Quilford and Zednek, but we'll see how this changes.
You know my defense (I didn't realize he was actually RVSing and jumped on it for being a bad list, period), so I don't really have anything to say about this. I'm interested in how you think this is similar to when I was bussing you in Paranoia and yet you have a minor townread on Quilford; in the same breath, you are claiming that Tierce-Quilford is equal to Paranoia Tierce-Oversoul but they are at the same time different. Makes little sense.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 49, Alchemist wrote:Quil is going way over the top. Wow.
Also;
In post 47, Quilford wrote:Ugh, I didn't want to get agro this early. Fuck.
Pretty sure we got scum here.
Why? His aggression if anything shows he doesn't care what people think and believes in the truthfulness of his list.
Then...myaggression is scummy, how? When I've stated directly in this game that I intend to be more aggressive as town, the reasons for it, and then do it--calling me (over)aggressive = scummy seems to defeat the point.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 54, Tierce wrote:Making a list like this at the stage in the game when you made it (Post 22) as town is absurd, especially when you bother listing players as null out of RVS votes. Town doesn't really find a need to classify players they don't yet have a read on, while scum would be more likely to present null-reads to show 'effort'.
Maybe I've played a few too many games with Mastin, but this behavior doesn't particularly bother me.
Why would Quilford do that if he could just blend in with the shadows by making a random vote and no reads list? The initiative is town, Tierce.
Hai, the list was RVS meant to garner reactions. I didn't think it was, I thought it was a supposedly-legitimate-reads-on-post-22 and called bullshit on it. Then I saw The Error In My Ways. I don't think it's particularly town (here's a Tierce-Quil/Tierce-Oversoul difference, I called you town in Paranoia, while I don't have a townread on Quil), but my scumread was wrong.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 54, Tierce wrote:Are we done with the pointless questioning? Great.
At this point I think we need to take a breather. There really isn't any reason you should be *this* angry Tierce, but then I again I don't know the whole story.
Why can't we be suspicious of your meta? You're asking town to do untowny things simply because you feel yourself to be clearly town.
Again, I never said you shouldn't be suspicious. The thing with Tammy was that she asked me to rehash what I had already said--and unlike you, she has no completed games with me nor is she familiar with my meta, so the whole thing seemed pointless.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:What do you think of Quilford's aggro comment?
No opinion. I don't think it's relevant.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:I am withholding a townread on Spyrex for a certain reason that I'll explain later, if I am allowed.
SHUT THE FUCK UP. If this reason is anywhere close to what I'm thinking, you need to STOP CLIAMING THIS CRAP, Oversoul. NOW. And yes, this makes me incredibly angry.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 77, Tierce wrote:Why do you think me saying who I think is a weak spot in this playerlist would benefit town?
Why no pressure on UN for asking Gamma what his "super secret scumtell" is?
I'm not really reading UN's posts.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 119, Tierce wrote:
Why are pursuing scumreads and defusing wagons on people you think are town exclusive? If you get a lynch on a scumread you shouldn't have to worry about a lynch on one of your townreads, no?
I'm not really seeing the whole reason for "defending" bad players.
Then again, I am pretty sure we've never had a towngame together other than Mafia with the Kitties.
Why do you not have a problem with Oman's vote when it is fairly clear we were out of RVS at the time of that vote? Is it because he has blue eyes?
Tierce, do you think your scumplay is unique to yourself?
I really don't see how you can be angry at Ludi for asking you "who are easy lynch ponies?" and then ask Glork to explain his "not at liberty statement"
Like seriously I don't understand the logic behind those two actions.
Will approach this and the rest later, I need food and breakfast closes in 10.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 186, Tierce wrote:Assertive aggressiveness can be good, and you're fooling yourself if you think I would be mellow and gentle as town in a game with this playerlist in these circumstances.
Need I point you to a thread in MD about town leaders? Sometimes being a person who isn't in the limelight is a good idea. Would you not agree?
Sure. But that's not whoIam. I'm the kind of person who goes all limelight even if I'm a doc/weak doc.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:In post 251, Glork wrote:Tierce's complete and utter confusion over flavor / win conditions is very likely genuine, as I'd expect her to tighten up the flavor screws before the game started if she were scum. Please move your vote somewhere more useful. Hell, I'd rather it be on me than Tierce at this point.
No.
If given the chance (beyond my control at this point) I will explain more, but no. That is not good logic to use when justifying *anyone* as town.
SHUT THE FUCK UP. Again.
THIS is purely genuine anger, Oversoul, and you know it. I don't give a fuck about your alignment at this stage, if you continue this crap, I WILL fuck you up.-
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In post 455, Oversoul wrote:
Why are pursuing scumreads and defusing wagons on people you think are town exclusive? If you get a lynch on a scumread you shouldn't have to worry about a lynch on one of your townreads, no?
Not exclusive. It's just the way I usually approach it--I tend to get lost pushing a defense on someone instead of actually scumhunting his accusers. See: I'm a white-knight, not a town chainsawer. kuribo gets lost in arguing with people, I get lost trying to defend people who will inevitably be wagoned/lynched later on anyway.
It doesn't happen on purpose, but I tend to be single-minded--either attack-tunneling, or defense-tunneling. When I get convinced of someone's alignment--heck, you saw me on Mafia with the Kitties, D1, re: DeasVail scumread.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:I'm not really seeing the whole reason for "defending" bad players.
See above. If I think they are town, I tend to defend them ferociously to the detriment of the rest of the game. I've reached the conclusion that this is not a healthy approach to the game for the way I'd like to work.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:Then again, I am pretty sure we've never had a towngame together other than Mafia with the Kitties.
Correct, we have no other finished games together other than MwtK and Paranoia--and you apparently aren't too familiar with my townplay. There's no problem with that, but this whole situation started because I did some angry soul searching and decided to change my playstyle.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:Why do you not have a problem with Oman's vote when it is fairly clear we were out of RVS at the time of that vote? Is it because he has blue eyes?
Yes~ And I did question him about his vote; he called it RVS, and after I posted I noticed he had actually changed his vote already. I don't have a problem with that anymore than I have with CES's typical vote-the-largest-wagon-in-RVS meta.
In fact, now that I think about it, I have a townread on Oman--his claim that he is not a barometer and shouldn't be sheeped out of the blue was pretty townish.
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:Tierce, do you think your scumplay is unique to yourself?
What kind of question is that? Is this some kind of snipe at me saying "don't compare me with VP Baltar"? The intent behind that was because I think VPB is a great scum player. I'm not, and it's public knowledge I dislike playing scum. (That's actually changing--I like achallenging gamemore than I like analignment, and that was one of the reasons I liked being scum in Paranoia, because that game required work; OTOH, I didn't like being scum in PYP Redux, and in MLP I was just nervous as hell with Vi in the game and Glork as my town neighbor. /tangent)
I don't think my play as any alignment is particularly unique, as I draw bits and pieces from the games I read to build my own playstyle upon. You don't have to look too deeply at this playerlist to see at least one person I'm trying to draw upon for my townplay.
(Hai--another person I use for my townplay-model is our exalted mod.)
In post 455, Oversoul wrote:I really don't see how you can be angry at Ludi for asking you "who are easy lynch ponies?" and then ask Glork to explain his "not at liberty statement"
It's different. Ludi is asking me who are potential mislynches--either for him or so I'll share that knowledge with the rest of the game. With the amount of games I read, this is dangerous information to provide scum with off-hand, and it has no bearing in whom I actually think is scum, so there's no point in dwelling on it.
Glork's statement seemed like he had some sort of ongoing meta on me, which looking back at our (nonexistent) ongoing games together, seemed out of place. There was no reason for him not to comment on his scumread reasons on me because we are not playing together elsewhere.
This ran long.-
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Also, Oversoul, you really, really, REALLY need to stop referring ongoing games. This crap you do is just as bad as the "[REDACTED]-game"--games are not entities in vacuum, and you're going to have reads on people in one game based with your interactions with them in OTHER ongoing games, sure.
But you can't bring those up while the game is ongoing. On the game thread, on PMs, on AIM, on QTs, anywhere. Hinting at the fact that you have a town/scumread on someone but are 'not at liberty to say whyyet' is TERRIBLE. You are releasing information about your alignment/how you feel about someone in a different game. You do this constantly, and by now you really should know better. I read a lot of games (completed and ongoing), and every time you do this it's another game I can't replace into because I feel I have compromised information about it. Hell, I feel bad about Wyrd's townread on me:
In post 359, Wyrd wrote:Tierce is not scum here because of pre-game talks of how she was going to approach this game and Glork paranoia.
This has very little to do with this game in particular, because the conversation was before role PMs were distributed and I don't think I actually said how I'd approachthisgame in particular, just talked with Fate about how my playstyle would be changing in the future, but it still makes me feel queasy and uncomfortable because it makes me ridiculously obvtown to him.
You know how I feel about game integrity. You know that my anger when you started hinting at other games in Paranoia was completely genuine. Please, please, stop doing this. I like playing with you. Stop making every game a chore in which I'm afraid of even reading your posts because of this.-
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In post 474, Oversoul wrote:In post 473, Magister Ludi wrote:Not many games have the potential scum win condition out in the open like that.
Because most of them are considered the general wincondition?
Glork, I'll let that sentiment bite you in the ass later.
Tierce's crap with Quilford is almost fucking identical to the bussing she did to me in Paranoia Mafia.
Overzealous accusation against another player (maybe her buddy although I doubt it from Quil's play) and then biting her tongue and accepting the person she was vehemently pushing is town once others start chiming in about her actions and the actions of the person she is accusing.
Huh. This is not nearly close to what happened.
Look at the amount of times Glork called Quil's list RVS, and how oblivious I was. Then look at my posts. It's very clear where the shoe drops and I realize the listisRVS, and thus not worthy of consideration for scumhunting.
I don't particularly think QUilford is town, but that list does not make him scum, so that vote was out of place.-
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In post 482, Oversoul wrote:In post 481, Duplicity wrote:her fairly obvtown including her reaction/genuiness to being voted alongside her unpromopted soft-claim.
Oh, that's another thing you reminded me.
I don't find that softclaim town at all.
I want to hear Tierce's response to everything before I reveal why though.
Go right ahead, then.
I'm going to come clear on this: mycharacter's flavormakes me think I am looking for two other people, but there is nothing in myrolethat specifically indicates this. As such, if anything, I think I am a searchTARGET, and would like searching/seeking roles to come after me because if wedoget any results out of this, it should add power to town.-
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Oh, what the hell. That was obvious enough to anyone familiar with Fire Emblem and any scum worth their mettle will realize who the trio is.
I'm Rolf. If Oscar and Boyd (or other Greil Mercenaries) are out there and can neighborize/masonize/whatever, HAI I'M HERE.
If not, well--carry on.-
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...Holy shit. Sorry for the 11 (now 12) posts in a row. I didn't even realize it had been that many, I was just dropping them in as I read and they seemed to have different enough subjects/were stream of consciousness enough to warrant new posts.
Oversoul, of course my stuff in Paranoia was engineered to look town. I wasscumand the only place I was being transparent on was the scum QT, where I laid all my cards down and wasn't on strategilurk mode. If you actually want to use Paranoia as a meta match, a better comparison for my play would be 'Paranoia scum QT'-'my play here', not 'Paranoia game thread'-'my play here'. However, I really think you should have a look at my completedtowngames and add three levels of FIRE AND HATE to them--you'll find my behavior is pretty similar to what's happening here.
Of course I was trying to look town in Paranoia--I was scum! Looking town is a good thing to do as scum. But here I don't have totryor engineer fake townslips--if I townslip, it's genuine, because HAI I'M TOWN.
Peace out.-
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Y'all probably want an explanation for why I think there might be a town power in getting all three brothers together:
Triangle Attack in the Fire Emblem wiki
PEdit: Huh, exactly. I asked you about your vote on me when I questioned my whole wagon, and I said it was probably RVS before you actually confirmed it was RVS. I had no issues with your RVS vote on me, I was answering Oversoul when he questioned mewhyI had no issues with it.-
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In post 513, Haze wrote:In post 507, Tierce wrote:Oh, what the hell. That was obvious enough to anyone familiar with Fire Emblem and any scum worth their mettle will realize who the trio is.
I'm Rolf. If Oscar and Boyd (or other Greil Mercenaries) are out there and can neighborize/masonize/whatever, HAI I'M HERE.
If not, well--carry on.
What's the intent behind this, Tierce?
If you're town, you've essentially claimed town PR. Won't you be shot?
Also, how do you know you're not on the list of "roles to be eliminated"?
Won't you be shot and won't you be making it easier for scum to win?
I'm town--scum's goal is already to get me killed anyway, and the softclaim had already gone too far. I'd rather make it clear and ensure that, if Rolf's brothers/the mercenaries are out there, they'll come for me. If I'm shot, I'm shot--that's bound to happen sooner or later.
I expect that "Micaiah's plan" list isn't going to include just 'famous' names, but honestly I stepped too far on that softclaim and thought it best to be open about it and call for my potential 2/3rds. With luck, there is actually a power role if we get together, oooor there is actually no co-PR whatsoever and paranoid scum shoot me, which wouldn't be too shabby.-
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In post 518, Quilford wrote:I really don't know who to vote for atm. D:
Hint: Name starts with Toasty, ends with Toast, he of the very comfortable scumspicions on the original three wagons and no apparent work on trying to unravel scum-town/town-town/scum-scum connections between his scumspect trio or getting reads on anyone else.
Now that'd be a good vote.-
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Hmm. Rereading Toast, I've realized I'm misrepping him somewhat--he did try to get something more out of his trio.
Vote stands, though. Do you know what I like about Nikanor, Hinduragi, Zdenek? I have no idea what they are going on about, but they sure are dealing in things not strictly related to the top wagons, and that shows a lack of scummy opportunism. This is not present on Toast's posts, because they are far too centered on this situation without really trying to getotherreads.-
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In post 525, UberNinja wrote:In post 502, Tierce wrote:That said, Oversoul is probtown. (Oh god need to go get food.)
But HATE. SO MUCH HATE. SHUT. THE. FUCK. UP.
what an obvscum post
Considering you apparently have no fucking idea why I'm raging against Oversoul, go ahead and call me obvscum. I couldn't be obvtowning more if I tried.
Glork, I derped hard when I called out the number of roles I am looking for. There wasn't much point in hiding it from then on. :/ If they actually exist, I don't want the other two players to claim, but if they can neighborize/masonize, here I am, this is me, etc.
PEdit: Okay back to /ignore mode because I REALLY CAN'T DEAL WITH IT.-
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Maybe realize that I don't have to 'try' because this behavior comes naturallybecause I'm town? I mean, seriously, if you want to call me "too townie" just after you called me obvscum, by all means. (Hint: look at most of my finished town games, Idoobvtown like crazy. And yes, I call myself obvtown as town, because the level of clarity in my alignment tends to be pretty ridiculous.)
Oversoul toes the line of game integrity in pretty much every game he's in and that drives me bananas. I get angry at that. (Oh no she's an angry person she's totes obvscum--hey dude meet Fate and SpyreX and you'll see what true anger is.) I've lynched town as town for this bullshit and NO REGRETS.
Just keep voting Toast. The rest is pretty much irrelevant tbqh.-
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Other than the fact that pretty much all dead town suspected me in Paranoia? I can't really do much for you here, Glork. I really can't compare a town game to a scum game of my own and expect the results to be unbiased, because I already know my alignment is different.
I was successful as scum in Paranoia. Yes, I was copying my town meta and subverting my scum meta in that game--there were several instances of "why would scum Tierce ever do this" that were there on purpose. That's what I've learned to do as scum because it wins me scum games, and heck, it was fun to do.
As town, if there are such instances, they come naturally. See what I mean? As scum, I have to think about them. (TBQH, I'd like to think that at this stage my scumplay is good enough that I don't derp as I already did here, but I missed a mid-of-line vote in Paranoia and that might count as derping? Dunno.) As town, my behavior is transparent because I don't have to hide anything.
Seeing you paranoid here makes me feel better about you, at least.-
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In post 533, Glork wrote:Fucking fuck.
In post 508, Tierce wrote:Oversoul, of course my stuff in Paranoia was engineered to look town. I wasscumand the only place I was being transparent on was the scum QT, where I laid all my cards down and wasn't on strategilurk mode.In post 530, Tierce wrote:Maybe realize that I don't have to 'try' because this behavior comes naturallybecause I'm town?
Can you please reconcile these two quotes? Obivously you had success engineering townplay in Paranoia, as you survived and won.
How exactly do you expect us to discern "EngineeredTierceTown" from "GenuineTierceTown"?
Oh, I see what you mean.
That wasn't my point. My point is that UberNinja is accusing me of looking (too?) town. Damned if I do, damned if I don't. I look town because I'm town--if his case on me is a Tammy vote + looking town, there's nothing I can do for him when those are clearly coming from a town mindset. I understand Oversoul's suspicion if there are similarities in my play with Paranoia, though those similarities are deliberate (because I got crap done in Paranoia and I want to get crap done in my town games); but UberNinja's suspicion on me is crap, because he doesn't really keep up with games he has died in (so he doesn't even have Paranoia-similarities to draw on as "omg Tierce is scum paranoia ohshi--"), and in his other game with me (Weather Mafia II) we were both town--aaaand he didn't keep up with that one either.
tl;dr:
1) UberNinja doesn't know my meta and accuses me of looking town;
2) Well then.
3) I throw my hands up in the air sometimes, saying hey-o, gotta let go...
4) (Hi Vi.)-
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Faraday isn't in this game...? That's MoI and Magua. But I'll have Faraday with me in 90 min wheeee~
I tend tohavepaint big fucking targets on my back anyway. In Warlocks and Werewolves, I claimed weak doc on D1. In Newbie #1197, I claimed doc about 5 posts after replacing in (that was incredibly stupid and I'm not too fond of remembering that game ._.). I'm not afraid of fullclaiming, Oversoul. Look at this playerlist. I'm fairly confident that, if I die early, town has playersfar more capablethan me to keep things going--I'm not THAT arrogant. Tiercetown doesn't die that early in Larges.
You're actually rather wrong in your perception of how I feel about being killed early. It's usually a compliment--it means scum saw me as a threat. I hate that townignoresme afterwards, I don't hatebeing killedper se. It's two different things. It's more a "arrrrgh why aren't they sheeping my reads HELLO IS SOMEONE THERE" reaction than hating being killed--if I'm killed, a future town loss isn't really my fault. >.>
Aaaand Nuwen? Seriously? The jumps in logic you are making mean you're probably town trying to piece this whole thing together (much more rationally than you do as scum, btw), but IadoreNuwen. You can see me going after SpyreX and Nuwen like a lost puppy (sorry Typo Incarnate, but that's a truth and yes I should be paranoid but I don't see Spyscum atm). She may have a tendency to kill me early on as scum because we somewhat similar scumhunting styles; OTOH, I wouldn't be afraid to get her dead if I thought she was scum. I don't fear her when I'm town--I fear people when I'm scum. Your logic is backwards.
I didn't even consider Nuwen-scum when I fullclaimed, but if you want to disprove that theory--look at when Wyrd called me town, then see when I fullclaimed. Their townread on me makes me believe that Wyrd are town, so, logically, Tiercetown would have no reason to fear Nuwenscum.
(FWIW, Nuwen has killed me twice as scum. Admittedly, that's the sum of the games we've played together in which I was town and she was scum. Stop that, lady.)-
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In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:Then... my aggression is scummy, how? When I've stated directly in this game that I intend to be more aggressive as town, the reasons for it, and then do it--calling me (over)aggressive = scummy seems to defeat the point.
saying "oh hey guys, Imma play differently this time " is scummy too. Why do you need to tell people you're playing differently? Why not just do it? Unless your "new town" matches your scum identity, there is no reason for it. And if it does match your scum identity, then its still scummy.
No, it's not scummy at all. I don't want to be strung up for something that is deliberate. I've taken a lot of flak as town for defending weak players, I've decided to try and do away with some of it due to recent events, and I wanted to get it out of the way and moving on. Your complaints about the constant reference to meta are at least partially due to the fact that people won't accept this and move on--I understand being suspicious, I was suspicious of a town player who did this in Weather Mafia II, but either vote me or shut up altogether.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:I'm not really reading UN's posts.
protown attitude right there.
It is. They make my eyes bleed.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:It's different. Ludi is asking me who are potential mislynches--either for him or so I'll share that knowledge with the rest of the game. With the amount of games I read, this is dangerous information to provide scum with off-hand, and it has no bearing in whom I actually think is scum, so there's no point in dwelling on it.
Not necessarily. By giving that information, scum would have to risk being called out on it. Say, if you and Ludi agree that Tammy is a potential mislynch, scum might actually ignore such a wagon.
And yet I'd rather shut up and call them out on it if I see such wagons being pushed. Catching scum red-handed is much better than giving them the info to use early on.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:In post 507, Tierce wrote:Oh, what the hell. That was obvious enough to anyone familiar with Fire Emblem and any scum worth their mettle will realize who the trio is.
I'm Rolf. If Oscar and Boyd (or other Greil Mercenaries) are out there and can neighborize/masonize/whatever, HAI I'M HERE.
If not, well--carry on.
WHY. WHY WHY WHY. Oh, that's a good idea! Lets tell scum that there's a dangerous and possibly-conf-town trio!
Unvote:Vote:Tierce
I admit it might have been a bad idea, but why is it scummy? Why does it merit a vote? The way you treat the claim makes it look like you believe it comes from town--in which case, voting me is dumb if you are town.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:I expect that "Micaiah's plan" list isn't going to include just 'famous' names, but honestly I stepped too far on that softclaim and thought it best to be open about it and call for my potential 2/3rds. With luck, there is actually a power role if we get together, oooor there is actually no co-PR whatsoever and paranoid scum shoot me, which wouldn't be too shabby.
So, instead of just shutting the f up about your softclaim, you decide to name claim AND mention a possible connection of the three brothers? You do realize that this is more dangerous than just soft-claiming? Its not even an issue of a single death
See above. You seem to think this is a town claim; why the vote on me? (Hint: town does stupid stuff sometimes. Sorry.) And I don't want the brothers to claim; admittedly, I didn't think about scum watchers, which was a bad oversight.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:Hint: Name starts with Toasty, ends with Toast, he of the very comfortable scumspicions on the original three wagons and no apparent work on trying to unravel scum-town/town-town/scum-scum connections between his scumspect trio or getting reads on anyone else.
this sort of "let's convince people!" shit is awful.
Why? You didn't have a similar reaction to me trying to move SpyreX onto Tammy. What makes the two situations different? Is me trying to get my scumreads lynched scummy? Why?
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:Hmm. Rereading Toast, I've realized I'm misrepping him somewhat--he did try to get something more out of his trio.
But you still keep the vote on me. Then why say this? Only reason I can see is to distance yourself from the wagon if I flip town.
You've clipped my quote. I'll amend my cases if I think they are not exact/I'm misrepping someone--it's natural behavior.
For reference, my full quote:
In post 520, Tierce wrote:Hmm. Rereading Toast, I've realized I'm misrepping him somewhat--he did try to get something more out of his trio.
Vote stands, though. Do you know what I like about Nikanor, Hinduragi, Zdenek? I have no idea what they are going on about, but they sure are dealing in things not strictly related to the top wagons, and that shows a lack of scummy opportunism. This is not present on Toast's posts, because they are far too centered on this situation without really trying to getotherreads.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:Maybe realize that I don't have to 'try' because this behavior comes naturally because I'm town? I mean, seriously, if you want to call me "too townie" just after you called me obvscum, by all means. (Hint: look at most of my finished town games, I do obvtown like crazy. And yes, I call myself obvtown as town, because the level of clarity in my alignment tends to be pretty ridiculous.)
huh? unwarranted cocky "I'm awesome" attitude in a game where people don't think you are obvtown? confuzzling.
Actually quite a few people think I'm obvtown but whatevs~
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:In post 532, Glork wrote:Also, with "players looking for players" as a mechanic, there's a very good chance that the scums have one (or more) watcher/tracker abilities. If they use said abilities on you, you're outing even MORE townroles to the scums.
You know I heart you, but seriously, get your shit together.
This
Again. You seem to think I'm town. STOP VOTING ME IF YOU ARE TOWN.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:I was successful as scum in Paranoia. Yes, I was copying my town meta and subverting my scum meta in that game--there were several instances of "why would scum Tierce ever do this" that were there on purpose. That's what I've learned to do as scum because it wins me scum games, and heck, it was fun to do.
And what to stop you from using your meta to get through this game?
Nothing! Except I'm not scum.
In post 555, ToastyToast wrote:Tierce wrote:if I die early, town has players far more capable than me to keep things going--I'm not THAT arrogant. Tiercetown doesn't die that early in Larges
wow. Let's play "compliment the playerlist," eh?
Ooooh I could go on. Dude, it's no secret there are players in this game that I completely :HEART: and would have lovechildren with if I ever wanted kids. That doesn't mean I won't push for their lynches if I think they're scum.
Why did you comment on this?-
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@Alchemist:
Don't really have the brain to read it now. I'm quite tired and trying to catch up elsewhere.
So far, I think Glork is town. My general problem is that Glork hasn't had a scum game since his return, and I can't really compare his current play to the one before his hiatus and draw comparisons.
@dram:
Actuallyit's apparently shared by several groups of characters including my little trio.-
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In post 566, Alchemist wrote:Can you not just blanket-town Glork because he's Glork? When you can get around to it, please critically read my post and give me your thoughts.
See above? I implied I'd do it. Let me sleep first.-
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