Mafia Behind the Maiden (Game over!)

[ToastyToast]

To be honest, I don't have a large bunch of scum reads on your wagon either. I'd say TSH, and then maaaaaaybe DDD and Haze (and uberninja is just derpy).

The point isn't the scumreads, but the fact that its a bunch of people who don't do shit

Colorized for you. DDDP is my only scumread on the wagon. I've mentioned all of the townreads except for gamma. Haven't gotten real opinions on anyone else here.

Firstly, i don't got a clue how you can get a town read from UN or Wyrd. If you could explain those, please do. May give me a better look into their slot. Secondly, it doesn't trouble you that you don't have opinions on half the wagon?

No. I just think they're a stupid thing to do.

So you are okay with this? Why not mention it? I mean, you mentioned it as a reason for voting me (connection between Tierce, Tammy, UN). It looks like selective thinking.

Its another reason I like toasty, he's willing to poke at DDD and go *here's somebody*, because he honestly believes there might be scum slipping along in that slot. TSH falls in the same category for myself.

Lol seriously? This is the kind of buddy defense that gets used these days?

UNVOTE:
VOTE: TOASTY

LINK DETECTED

KILL MODE ENGAGED/afk GW2 week-end

[Haze]

Don't prod. 1 test down.

Reading up.

[Duplicity]

I had a good discussion with Shift earlier, he's insistent on changing to Implosion and thinks that Implosions #1137 is complete garbage. He finds that the push that it would be more natural to finish the reads than to get upset that you're being wagoned for something you've already explained is ridiculous. He also thinks that implosions entire play so far has been lackluster and doesn't think he'd play like this as town. I'm very inclined to agree and think that Toast comes of far better in the whole implosion-Toast discussion with Implosions #1163 and #1666 being the worst offenders. They both look as if he's bickering with someone in a fashion that he's trying to convince them he's not scum while insisting that they are. It's something I see scum doing a lot more than town.

I really like Toastys recent content and contribution and while it's bad that this sort of effort only came up when he's wagoned I find it coming across as town.

Also peoples scum-reads on DDD are something that I don't follow at all. DDD just sheeping someone he knows to be competent isn't a scum-tell for him, espcially not this early on in the game when one vote alone is worth less whereas votes compiled actually lead somewhere.

Unvote, Vote: Implosion

Free cookies for those who join.

[Tierce]

Toast--see my remark about Glork, his role, mine. Cut that !!special!! from that list and make up your mind.

[Hinduragi]

Ok, Im back and Im just going to do this the traditional way of catching up: with spam. (Seriously, I wont be making this any worse than it actually is, and at least my posts will be relatively short compared to some of the walls.)

What changed your mind?

Nothing. I told you I was taking on that point of view from Spyrex's post when I was explaining it.

Can someone explain all of the sudden dram-hate?

Dram isn't doing shit in this game. I voted you way back when because you were playing like shit and I wanted you to actually take it seriously. This is different.

He comes in the game complaining about the 1v1 bastardry being thrown around(mainly Tammy-Spyrex back then) then votes Tammy. You can look at his posts after that. None of them explain the Tammy vote. About all the content is basically flavor, mechanics, etc. with some jokes thrown in here and there. This is about the only explanation I found for his Tammy vote.

@Tammy: I'm voting you because I think you're scum. I'm jesting about the mad skills because in real life games I have a tendency to think someone is scummy and vote them for the next 4 game days.

No, Im not exaggerating, misrepping, etc. him. You can ISO him yourself if you want. And, after all of that, he pretty much voted Oversoul, not even commenting or showing he ready about anything that happened before "Im not Ike". He's been pretty much posting nothing but managing not to get caught out about it.

[Hinduragi]

I am very curious what is this GreyICE wagon.

^

I don't see it. At all.

[Hinduragi]

Thought seeing as Magister Ludi is still a main wagon I will concede that you people have been doing gods work.

Gamma is town on quickskim, as is Tierce and ofc Glork has reached heightened levels of "confirmed town always doc protect always love." So there's that.

....You can do better.

[Hinduragi]

This post really struck me as odd though:

Dont even care about saying Tammy is town even if I disagree.

The fact you've latched onto this UN thing when AT BEST it was pretty clear it was a lynch of necessity that may hit scum versus SCUM FOUND says something.

The fact you think you're the "backbone" when it looks like Tammy has waaay more of a fanclub then that slot deserves also says something.

How about this deal SpyreX:

If Tammy flips town, you sheep me tomorrow.

If Tammy flips scum, I'll sheep you until I die (which I don't expect to be long if she's scum, but thems the bones).

Take it or leave it, because I have you read as town, and I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you any longer.

If she truly believes I'm town, this is a bet that should never be made. And if she's scum, this costs her absolutely nothing. She knows I'll flip town, so she'll get her wishes fulfilled and Spyrex would sheep her tomorrow. If it is a fact that Uberninja is town, there's two mislynches lined up in a row.

Actually, I felt something was off about that post too. It keeps her safe regardless(Spyrex, you're town, so since I said that, you wont really think Im scum, right?) and it's similar to Defcon 3 where she was helping with some retarded scum QT code when she was scum.

[Hinduragi]

Hey Tammy.

Crazy ass Vi game

24 motherfuckers to mow through

Unlikely to be one scum team

Discuss.

Dumb post. You should feel bad for even thinking this way.

[Hinduragi]

SCUM Debonair Danny DiPietro: Blegh. Lurker I have the most issue with. The “GIVE SPYREX MY VOTE” comes 1) too soon, 2) allows DDD to blame spy for being wrong, 3) is illogical.

Why would town DDD not do this if he was feeling lazy? Also, LLD/UN/DDD scumteam? No.

[Hinduragi]

No wonder those reads seem weird. Toast was one of the top wagons when he made that post.

Unvote; Vote: Toast

[Hinduragi]

And MaguaoI is harder for me to give a solid because they voted me, I'm biased in thinking anyone voting me is scum pushing for a mislynch. Of any wagons with multiple votes, this is the one I would join.

I don't think Ludi should be the lynch today for this sentence alone. Next suspect please.

[Hinduragi]

vote: ludi

oh you

Moving your vote around when you know we're trying to get a lynch is hurting a lynch happening. Especially when it's just because he's spiting you. Stop being dumb Tim if you're going to be more active than me.

[Hinduragi]

What happened to D1 26 post quickhammers in Vi's games.

When they ended on getting a VT getting quicklynched, then a PR NK'd, and the PR's invictus kill ending on me, another VT, and an easy scum win because of a snowball effect. That's when.

[Hinduragi]

Meh. Toasty raged when I put him on lynch before too and he was town then. This is pretty similar. Yes, we need a fucking lynch. But it's dumb to lynch someone because you're too lazy to switch over.

Unvote; Vote: Dramonic

I'll also hammer Hippo or Nexus.

[Shmugen]

@Toasty - I have two mostly solid scumreads and one decent scumread, yes. The difference between mine and your early ones that I'm voting you for is that mine looked at everyone after a large amount of game went by and yours looked at the 3 largest wagons early and looked at no one else. Your biggest complaints about DDDP seem to be his giving his vote to Spy and not voting Dram when he says he would vig Dram if given a chance. While not expressly stated, he gave his vote to Spy before your entrance, and if he likes where his vote is, his 'I would vig Dram' is fine. Incidentally, his vote is on you. Could this have anything to do with your scumread on him? Your four largest scumreads are all on your wagon.

And no, I try not to forget early play. One of my favorite things about forum mafia is the inability to delete old posts. Someone has to remember what came before and not let scum slip by.

[Quilford]

pretty promise to post here. birthday soo

[SpyreX]

HRmmm

Gamma I think Hindu is right point your sword somewhere else.

[Alchemist]

OH MY GOD CAN WE PLEASE LYNCH DRAMONIC PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE

[Tammy]

AAAAND Alchemist keeps proving that he's town. Really people who make me laugh are town always. It is known. (Except for when they're not, but even when they're scum if they make me laugh they're town. )

This Toasty wagon is blech. I know that in my first reads list, I said he was totes probscum or something like that for just commenting on the top three wagon getters, but the reactions he's had from people jumping on him for it don't feel like scum caught for doing something scummy, they feel like town frustration. My biggest problem with the wagon is that it seems like people are voting for him for that and haven't looked past it. My least favorite vote on the wagon is the Hippo vote. Sone of the other early voters seem to be a bit lazy now as they were early votes that don't seem to have taken into account anything after.

Gamma - As the spokesperson for the Transitive Triumvirate and as someone who has seen Toasty as town before, do you still read him as scum? You said you were going to wait on his reads to make up your mind.

Tierce - Why do you care that Toasty has you down as special? Toasty is one person out of 29. You are no way, no how getting lynched. He's not even calling out trying to convince anyone that you're scum. This should be the last thing you should be focusing on/commenting on right now. Besides, I can sympathize with Toasty here because by logic I have you down as town, but there's a nagging feeling that keeps telling me my logic is wrong.

Duplicity's cookie offer is tempting...I like cookies...but I like my vote right where it is for now. If the MoI wagon won't take off, I'll look at it again as I like the Implosion wagon better than the Toasty one. Or the Magister Ludi one. But I think the Hippos would be better as the reasoning for jumping on the Toasty wagon was just blech. And that was the only real comment on the game state. Meh.

[Tierce]

Tierce - Why do you care that Toasty has you down as special? Toasty is one person out of 29. You are no way, no how getting lynched. He's not even calling out trying to convince anyone that you're scum. This should be the last thing you should be focusing on/commenting on right now. Besides, I can sympathize with Toasty here because by logic I have you down as town, but there's a nagging feeling that keeps telling me my logic is wrong.

Because the way his reads evolve on conftown-FMPOV are one of the ways I read him? This seems kind of obvious.

[Tammy]

No, it's not obvious, it's silly. It shows too much concern with how you are perceived by everyone. You are not confirmed town. Vi did not come in here and make your name green or whatever color is being used this game to denote town. You are most likely town, but you are not confirmed. So stop, just stop.

[Tierce]

Good joke coming from you, when you seem to take offense at people calling you scum.

I'm not looking for Toasty to call me town. His read on me was dependent on Glork's claim, and it has been stated in-thread that Glork's claim is not necessarily tied to mine. I want to know Toasty's conclusions, because his read on me is important for my read on him. I don't care if you tell me to stop--I want to hear what he has to say. I know I'm not confirmed, so where did that come from?

Perhaps you have noticed I'm not voting him. There is a wagon on ToastyToast and I want to analyze him, so stop acting like I don't have the right to have my questions to him answered.

[Zdenek]

I've skimmed the thread.

I feel like I need to comment on Dramonic, MoI, but I'll need to ISO them first.

I would vote for his replacing in post alone.

GreyICE's comment after that post makes me duddenly feel better about him.

I think that the MoI wagon that sprung up is weird.

I don't really like the Toasty wagon because of who is pushing it. His suspicion of Tierce looks town too. Could someone with meta on Toadty tell me how his play in this gamecompares o his play in others.

Unvote
Vote:Implosion

Sheeping Duplicity.

[Tammy]

You said that the way his reads evolve on conftown - I thought you were referring to yourself with the conftown. Sorry if I misunderstood.

Well...sure I hate being called scum when I'm not and don't deal well with too much suspicion. I'm getting better about it though. I don't necessarily take offense at people calling me scum...always. Especially not when the majority of a town has me as town. If one or two have me as scum on their reads list, it's not something I pay attention to, if they're aren't pushing for it. In fact, after getting killed early in several games and being up for getting killed early in several others, I prefer not to be on everyone's strong town list. A little suspicion can help to keep you alive; I like staying alive.

What I mostly take offense at is when people say I'm doing something I'm not doing. I've had people call me scum before and not taken offense when their suspicions seemed legitimate and genuine.

I never said you were voting him nor did I say you didn't have a right to have your questions answered. You didn't ask him a question though. You told him to see a remark about Glork and your role and to cut that special out of his list. It looks like you focusing too much on his thoughts about you, which is weird, considering that he's provided a bit more content that you could be able to question him about if you were trying to evaluate him.