Mini 1438: Gonzo Mafia (Scum Win)

[SE-Asians]

He's scum guys. Lynch him.

Okay.

Vote : Remembrance

[SE-Asians]

VOTE: SE Asians
Gotta read them

You can't.

Asians, is the vote on Remembrance serious?

No. Why ask?

[SE-Asians]

Wanna bet I can? For starters, you are Lincolm.

Because it looked like it was serious, with the quote and everything.

Only Sora ever quote like this, huh?

Okay, you can. I never have sense of humor.

That wasn't hard to figure out.

For those of you who need a hydra guide:

Sora: Does not give a shit.
Lincolm: Concise and does not give a shit.
TNE: Is not Concise and gives enough shit for the both of them combined.

I do give a shit. Like this. Or this isn't?

Vote Count:

SE-Asians (L-5): Human Destroyer, Wisdom
Bacde (L-6): Remembrance
Remembrance (L-6): SE-Asians

Not Voting: Nachomamma8, mantisdreamz, buldermar, borkjerfkin, pirate mollie, I Am Innocent, AngelusW, Bacde, kuror0

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline is April 13th at 9:30 PM EST

[SE-Asians]

My vote is random.

He said he's nervous and I believe him.

By the way, I like stay my vote because of this.

[SE-Asians]

Wis, you don't ask my reason why I like to stay my vote?

Rem, we just met once... By the way, I don't know who is AngelusW.

[SE-Asians]

Sure, tell me more about why you want to keep your vote on Remembrance.

Sorry, too late.

Why you ask when I asked for it?

wisdom I am thinking you are town!!!

Tell us more about this.

Among those, I find bork's post is providing more info.

He doesn't like his role, like me.

I've read one of Lincolm's games which I remember him winning as scum, with heavy lurking.

I did?

It's spelled "buldermar". I consider RVS inherently anti-town.

Then stop observe.

Meta stuffs are boring and stupid. Can we please change the conversation?

[SE-Asians]

pretty sure he was being sarcastic.

How can you so sure?

[SE-Asians]

It's never too late.
Do you think Remembrance is scum now?

I like to keep it hidden because you asked it when I asked that to you. So, it is too late.

Now, please answer my question.

I don't like meta stuff. So, I have no reason why he is scum, but I like my vote for now.

Why would he/she lie about it?

A joke. For me, RVS full with jokes.

[SE-Asians]

You have no reason; therefore you don't find that quote regarding Bacde being nervous scummy.

.......................................

Okay, this is an answer for what?

[SE-Asians]

You had said that you are keeping your vote on Remembrance because of that post.
Now you say you have no reason for him being scum.
Therefore that post is not your reason.
Therefore you don't find that post scummy.

Yes, I have a reason. Do I need to say again that I like to hide it?

Do I need to say again that my vote is random? Why I found it scummy if it is random?

[SE-Asians]

If you have a reason, it's not random.

I really don't know why you don't like to answer my question.

You're too concentrate with Remembrance when I'm online also. I know you will get us out from RVS, so I like to get your attention. This is my REASON. Okay?

You keep distance from me.

Vote : Wisdom

[SE-Asians]

What is your question? Why didn't I ask you about why you're keeping your vote at that time? Because I was too busy questioning Remembrance's selective questioning of HD, which was more important than your vote.

You waited just 5 minutes before you asked me why I am not asking. I don't think you can argue that I dodged your question.

I already said meta stuffs are boring and stupid. Tell me why it is important.

My question is why you asked when I asked for it? You didn't answer it.

P-Edit : ....I asked him first...

[SE-Asians]

Meta stuff are not boring, nor stupid. It was important because Remembrance knows little about almost everyone yet he selected a specific person to question regarding playstyle. Pretty sure I explained it already.

You asked me "you don't ask why my vote stays?" - I took that as if you're offering to explain why your vote stays so I asked you.

If I'm not wrong he said HD is the most hard to read for him? I think it already answered.

Yes you did answer it. But you didn't answer my second question.

Why you ask when I asked for it?

Okay, Mollie also did not read my post, but please don't give same answer.

[SE-Asians]

I don't know why this question now become paradox...

[SE-Asians]

Unvote

Vote : Remembrance

Back to the old one.

[SE-Asians]

Mollie, you're always like this, aren't you?

[SE-Asians]

Remembrance, how do you read SE-Asians so far?

What about your read to me?

Why ask Remembrance?

[SE-Asians]

I don't know that you deliberately answer my question with the same question or what...

What your read about me?

[SE-Asians]

Because I get my attention in you. Somehow you like to troll me around... Even though it is funny...

[SE-Asians]

where did wisdom troll you?

Like you didn't know my question and Wisdom's answer...

[SE-Asians]

Seeing as how SE-Asians think that I am trolling them and you think that I am being serious

Your answer are not telling me that you're serious... I was serious before...

[SE-Asians]

TNE: Is not Concise and gives enough shit for the both of them combined.

Ouch... Was that a compliment or something? 'Cause ouch

But honestly I think Remembrance is town. I can see how he'll AtE all over the place again when pressured.

Wisdom is question dodging again like always...

Well I guess this head would be fence sitting...

UNVOTE:

But I have my eye on wisdom for now.
-Philippines

[SE-Asians]

that isn't an answer

in what post did wisdom troll you?

give a good answer and I will back off

Nah your vote is good. Keep in me.

First I asked why Wisdom asked me when I told him, but he said because I offered it. The next I would asked the same question, and he answered the same answer, and keep going~
Second I asked why Wisdom asked Rem's read, but he said because he like to know it. The next I would asked the same question, and he answered the same answer, and keep going~

Is this clear enough?

I think you know who post this.

[SE-Asians]

If you ask the same questions, you'll get the same answers. How is that trolling?

Do I should ask the same question to proof it?

[SE-Asians]

.................
.................
.................

This is the simple example of what happen. A ask B why C is bad, B answered because C is bad guy, so A asked B again, but B answered the same answer again...

This is typical what happen in my eyes with you... Should I proof it this is going to happen?

[SE-Asians]

Wis, did you read my post above?

A ask B why C is bad, B answered because C is bad guy,

I don't know are you really deliberately trolling or not.

[SE-Asians]

In the first case, you asked why I didn't ask you about your vote instantly. I gave you an answer - because I was busy doing something else. You asked why I asked when you asked - I answered because you were offering to tell me.
What is not satisfying about this?
In the second case, you ask me why I am asking Remembrance for his read. The answer is because I wanna know his read. What other answer could be here? My own read has nothing to do with Remembrance's read. So, what answer were you looking for here?

First case, I already said that you're too concentrate with Rem. I don't know why, but why you can't ask mine also? Because too busy? Why just concentrate to a person, really? When I offered, you just did it, like "oh i forgot", so I asked you again the other question, and the rest you know what happen.
Really, is this satisfying? Maybe in your side you're, in my side, you think?

Second case, when I backed off, you like to knew Rem's read. You said you were too busy with Rem, perhaps that same meaning with "I get my attention to Rem". But you like to knew Rem's read about me? So I like to knew why you interested with Rem's read, but you just said "because I like to know Rem's read". What I want from your answer? I don't know, something that can prove you're town or scum. Do I look like a person who have a clairvoyance?

[SE-Asians]

Really? So because I spent 5 whole minutes questioning Remembrance you assumed that I forgot your post?

Now now Wis... Should I ask "then why you asked when I offered"? Because I really want to write it down.

Why am I interested in Remembrance's read? Because I am trying to read Remembrance. Is it that hard?

You said because you wanted to know Remembrance's read... Should I quote it?

What is your read about Remembrance now? He already have a read about me.

[SE-Asians]

This sounds like something scum would say, trying to sound townie. In actuality, town would realize that a vote on themselves is one less vote to pressure mafia, and would be best off trying to prove their towniness.

You never play with Mollie, huh? I already saw twice Mollie give reason "You're not the person I seek for" when she voted. Why you don't ask Mollie's reason? I don't care with HD and Wisdom's vote if you see my post.

I don't know why you only quote that, try to accuse us, perhaps? That full post is quite contradict with your reasoning. I'm trying to clear what Mollie want to know. Is this sound scummy enough for you?

And what is that "one less vote to pressure mafia"? Is pressure have an amount of votes?

@SE-Asians: Why are you asking for meta discussion to stop?

Every person can change their meta, as town and as scum. If they rarely do this, maybe you can read them, but if not, you're going to have a facepalm in your face. Like this ->

Personally I like to change my scum meta to my town meta. I think some people do this also so they get town read when play with same person. Well, you know how many persons that you have played with them before. I have 6 persons. The other 5 persons I only know them. I really don't know who is this one (I will let you guess who is this, Majiffy already told us).

Do you found that metaing someone is important? Tell us why it is important.

@SE-Asians: Why does Post 83 contradict itself? Do you have a serious reason, or is it random? It can only be one or the other. Also, why are you voting Wisdom, and why do you back off of him so quickly?

I don't know where is the part is contradict. My reason was to get Wisdom's attention because he tried to get us out from RVS, but he was too concentrate with Remembrance. I realized that he said he had his attention to Remembrance, so he didn't like to deal with other person in that time. Also, I realized my question and Wisdom's answer like a child fight (Ya, this is the funny part). I think it is pointless, so I prefer to stop it.

Are you really read my post? Because I already explained it before.

Do IAI like bussing with me? Because it isn't.

By the way, give a reason why Remembrance and IAI are scum and why Mollie and Wisdom are town because I already have met my quota with posts without reason.

@Wisdom : Answer my question please.

What is your read about Remembrance now? He already have a read about me.

@Bacde : Give reason why Remembrance and Mollie are town.

[SE-Asians]

I can see why people are discussing it and your quashing of said discussion looks like you're afraid of someone meta-reading you as scum.

I do Hydra. Is this an accuse or what? You can see why people are discussing but can't see the fact I'm hydra? Why i should afraid with someone meta-reading when he read other person?

Why do you want to move Wisdom's attention away from Remembrance?

I said I want to have Wisdom's attention. When I said I want to remove Wisdom's attention? Really, why you should have attention to 1 person when you have 3 persons to deal with?

Your backoff from Wisdom is so, so, SO weak, and clearly people were getting reads out of the discussion, so it wasn't pointless and you backing off is really bad.

Dudeeeeeeee... Did you read my posts, really? Do I need to quote all of my post? Here, have some read.

A ask B why C is bad, B answered because C is bad guy, so A asked B again, but B answered the same answer again...

Go ahead. Tell me where it wasn't pointless.

IAI could certainly bus you; his reasoning is weak and could work perfectly well as a quick towncred grab for your scumflip.

Oh yeah, towncreed. When there is scumflip everyone will vote, there is no way someone gain towncreed. Your logic flawed, try again.

If you don't know my reasons for reading each person, you're being a very selective reader.

Maybe I am, because I don't see any reason why Wisdom and Mollie are town. Your read is from your side. I do see why Remembrance is town, but you said Remembrance is scum. So you accuse someone who have different read with you? Another flawed logic. Try again.

Also:

SE-Asians, why are you pushing the whole idea of "Wisdom is question-dodging" while at the same time removing your vote, relieving pressure?

Sorry for forget about this. I don't have any reason to vote him. He already proved me wrong, so? should I stay my vote in him?

[SE-Asians]

If you need specific post numbers, I'm talking about Post 109 and, more importantly, Post 115.

Okay, I'm lurking for now. Enough with this shit.

[SE-Asians]

Yes I understand you are a hydra. However, the individual members of a hydra CAN be read using meta (to an extent). And yes, that is an accusation.

Do you know the fact that Wisdom metaing Remembrance? Good. Now, you should have better accusation. You're contradicting with your own post.

I thought you said "He was paying too much attention to Remembrance, so I'm trying to move his attention to more places." Why does he need to focus on more than one person on a time? We only have 1 lynch anyways.

"I like to have mislynch every time". Yeah, you like it.

See, but you're asking questions that there's no good answer to. You're asking "Hey, why are you asking for Remembrance's read on me?" which the correct answer is "Because I want to know his read." It's not a useful question in the first place, so it's unsurprising you'd get a slightly snarky answer.

The fact, he can answered my second question well.

Why am I interested in Remembrance's read? Because I am trying to read Remembrance.

Sorry, you aren't read all of those posts but accuse me.

There's nothing flawed about my logic. Not everyone is going to vote for scum.

Oh yes, when there is scumslip, I will not vote. Good logic. Try again.

Well if you're going to strawman my accusation of Remembrance, that's cool too. I specifically said I found his reasons to be weak and bad. If he had good reason to townread you, I'd be okay with it.

Try reading again, this time looking for the parts where I called each of my two townreads town.

So, "Your read is bad read because I tell my reason to you. My read is good read because I'm not telling my reason to you". Good accusation. Try again.

If you think he's question-dodging scummily...yes.

Pathetic... Did I already said he was too concentrate with Remembrance? I never said he question-dodging. I never said he is scummy or scum. I said he kept distance from me. Good accusation. Try again.

Do you have other scumreads? If so, why aren't you voting them?

Looking an accusation for me? Like I give a shit to your logic, scum. You want a vote? Here, have mine.

Vote : HD

Looked like an OMGUS? Should I care? Here, you will like my claim. VT. You can easily mislynch me.

I think it's townish, particularly if SE-Asians is scum, because scum-

mollie

would have left it hang with the bad answer and not have bothered to follow through from lack of motivation to scumhunt.

I don't think scum-

mollie

would have left it hang with the bad answer, as you put it...

You are proofing my word about meta.

[SE-Asians]

Nah, sorry, wrong account.

I don't know which part that I'm not explain clearly to you. I already explain all. And you're questioning that I already post.

Nah, okay, game over baby, mislynch coming. Sorry Sora and TNE. Sorry Town. No one believe me.

[SE-Asians]

I did answer.

Well, now you reading my post. The fuck why you aren't reading my others post?

I want to know that you're read my post or not. All of your questions already answered in my previous posts. God damnit, I don't know the part I don't explain it clearly. Nah, just vote me. End the fucking day...

[SE-Asians]

My answer already answered in my previous previous previous post. Why do you ask?

Here. D6 Innocent Child. Do wish what you like.

[SE-Asians]

I already got a lunacy with all of your questions.

Everyone have diffusion role. Meaning someone have same day to use.

Do it.

P-Edit : You will like my flip. IC's gone in 3P LyLo.... Good thing to hear...

[SE-Asians]

Rem, can you just vote me to proof they are wrong? Thanks.

[SE-Asians]

Remembrence should explain his slightly town read on SE-Asians

You didn't read...

did you miss the VT to IC claim?

Like I never fake claim.

there's no way you missed Lincolm's claims

He did missed it. Try to accuse other huh?

[SE-Asians]

Nah sorry. I like to fake claim. My role in N5 so I like to survive. It doesn't matter.

[SE-Asians]

Well, well, well, HD is scum. He know I ever fake claimed once. Lynch him tomorrow.

[SE-Asians]

Fake out scum? Really?

Do you think I'm not trying to safe N5 role?

[SE-Asians]

Because claiming IC

period

is going to save you

You're answering it. What's wrong with your statement really?

P-Edit : Yah, sorry. I'm pissed off.

[SE-Asians]

Because claiming IC

period

is going to save you

You're answering it. What's wrong with your statement really?

P-Edit : Yah, sorry. I'm pissed off.

[SE-Asians]

Claiming IC is definitely not going to save you from nightkills, which seems to be your entire motive for claiming such here

I really forgot scum like to seek other people who have better role. Man...

It damage control to town.

[SE-Asians]

Well, ya Rem. I'm quiet pissed of why my explanation not clear enough... Just make me sad every time I need to explain it more and more...

By the way, when I flip, I'm N5. Thanks.

[SE-Asians]

Even I'm posting, no one will believe it. WHY I'M NOT GET LYNCHED, PLEASE! THIS IS PAINFUL!

[SE-Asians]

DID I MENTION THAT LINCOLM BLOCKED ME ALLOWING SCUM TO NK ME IT WAS PRETTY FREAKING OBVIOUS THAT IS WHAT THEY WERE GOING TO DO!!!

Like you aren't blocking me.

[SE-Asians]

Really, your discussion aren't going nothing. You give assumption that I'm scum but not see my flip. The fuck is this town?

[SE-Asians]

Lincolm's usually a pretty rational poster barring the language barrier.

I already change that when Seanald made a joke for it. Don't care any more.

[SE-Asians]

Good. Because I already waiting for it.

[SE-Asians]

Lincolm, will you stop with this?

Wis, the only keep this game come straight is to see my lynch. When they keep assumption that I'm scum, there is no way the discussion going well. So now, lynch me.

[SE-Asians]

So you're gonna be like this for the rest of the game?

Perhaps. The only one who want to see my post only you. Well, what do you feel if you never being listened? They have assumption I'm scum, which they try to see my interact with the other. This isn't going to help town, they keep that mind in their head, and the result the discussion with that assumption are useless. If you want to see the example, ISO Mollie. Thanks.

Well, logically scum try to lynch me fast because they get free one mislynch.

I don't know if you try to gain towncreed for this or not, but thanks. Relax me a bit.

P-Edit : Nah, what

a lot of negative feedback

really? YOU NEVER TOLD ANY.

[SE-Asians]

Lynching you won't help town either. You know what will help town? Stop acting on your ego and your desire to prove you're right and try to find who is scum.

Mollie actually thinks you might be bad town. How is she an example of people not listening to you?

Oh god... Why I know you Wis... Why I know you also Mollie... I wish both of you're scum together so I get lynched in that time.

Town don't know who is town and who is scum. Even I help, that isn't going to be a "help" because of their mindset.

Rem, Mollie, and Wisdom are town like a fuck. If they are scum, they wouldn't attempt to starting other discussion.

Well, in this condition scum have 1 free mislynch, but I think Bork's reaction is neutral reaction that can be alignment as town or scum.

Nacho in V/LA for 2 days. I still remember he posted it in Amurika.
Kuroro have activity like this because I'm in one game with him.

Reporting in, over.

[SE-Asians]

You should convince them to vote me, really.

Vote Count:

SE-Asians (L-4): I Am Innocent, Bacde, Human Destroyer, buldermar
buldermar (L-6): Wisdom

Not Voting: Nachomamma8, mantisdreamz, AngelusW, kuror0, SE-Asians, pirate mollie, Remembrance, borkjerfkin,

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline is April 13th at 9:30 PM EST

[SE-Asians]

Hydra.

[SE-Asians]

Allright, just woke up and WOAH 13 PAGES ALREADY?

Gonna check the hydra QT but for now noticing that our Indon friend has claimed VT and then IC. Disregard that: he says it was just for the lulz.

Oh, and if someone could give me a quick rundown of everyone else that would be glorious.

Pedit:

Really, your discussion aren't going nothing. You give assumption that I'm scum but not see my flip. The fuck is this town?

Do you have some sort of post restriction that forces you to translate everything you say from some asian language to english using google translate? Your posts are fairly difficult to decipher.

As a matter of fact, all of us(well, at least two of us) do not have English as a first language, and as such directly translate everything from our native languages to English.
#RANTABOUTLANGUAGES
And if you guys need me to decipher it I can.

[SE-Asians]

Hey Sora. Are you scum?

Nope.

[SE-Asians]

Ok what dafuq happened...

Uhm... Erm... Sorry for that outburst guys, I didn't even...

Anyways...

Is it just me or is bul sheeping HD to lynch us?
Not liking that at all.

Remembrance... I'm just not feeling this guy's town play yet.
Call it gut or meta or whatever you want but anyways...

Wisdom I'm not too keen on reading... But I'd say null-town for now

HD is totally town because gut feeling and town vibes (Totally not relieving pressure off by calling you town )
Or I could be wrong... Maybe scum trying to take advantage of our frustrations.

Everyone else needs to post more.

Again... Sorry for that outburst.

-Philippines

[SE-Asians]

Nope... I can pretty much see you saying
"Calling me town so I get off their back"

[SE-Asians]

Wait there's a vote on HD?

No no no.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: buldermar

Call it wrong or something but there's something that strikes me as odd about joining the wagon
-Phil

[SE-Asians]

Your last dot is also something that is null for tne.

worried and thinking too much about image?

that one's a definite scumtell, not a null tell

It can also come from paranotic town sometimes. So it's a null tell

[SE-Asians]

Wait there's a vote on HD?

No no no.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: buldermar

Call it wrong or something but there's something that strikes me as odd about joining the wagon
-Phil

Do something useful... like providing me a link to a game in which one of the participants of your hydra does something as retarded as fake-claiming a role that isn't in the game intentionally.

Thanks.

I'll let the other 2 do it for me.
I would never use carnival of lunacy on a setup like this

[SE-Asians]

I don't see wishy-washiness in that game. Null read =/= wishy-washy. TNE appears to take strong stances on people's alignments in that game, at least in the bit I skimmed.

Here's one

[SE-Asians]

Stop stopping at page 10 and read everything else

[SE-Asians]

Like, I understand you guys think TNE is scummy normally

But the tells I'm pointing out aren't the ones town-TNE committed.

So...what gives?

Actually... I dunno myself.

People keep saying that my reads were wishy-washy so yeah...

[SE-Asians]

Also, he was very active in that game as opposed to this. Not that it is necessarily alignment-indicative.

'Cause this is hydra account. I'd let the others deal with their stuff.

[SE-Asians]

I just realized that it being a hydra account may skew things towards it actually being a joke. If it was indeed a fake-claim, I'd imagine that some percentage of the time the person intending to make the fake-claim would confront the other participants of the hydra with the idea before actually making it. I'm not saying that I rule it out altogether, but this does make me second guess myself.

Yeah... he didn't confront us with that fake-claim

I, personally, am not a fan of that fake-claim

But I think "we" did that because of frustrations and stuff like that.

-Phil

[SE-Asians]

Well for this game you'll have to ask mollie to provide specifics as I was not in it.

So you know that he usually does shit like this because mollie says so?

Hey, I was in that game too.

Lincolm claimed 1-Shot BP. Told us he fakeclaimed, then claimed Mass Roleblocker with no restrictions. He was actually a normal roleblocker.

Basically he can be like this. Don't judge him or us.

For now, knowing Wisdom's town and scum meta, this reminds me of Micro 86, his scum meta. He posted short answers very quickly and quickly built up a townread on himself. It's not nearly enough to incriminate him though, and I still want to believe that he is helping the town.
HD is probably misguided town. As we know we're town, HD has been tunneling on us and stating all the reasons why we're scum without even contemplating the possibility that we're actually town. He has been trying though: reminds me of what he did in Timeshift.

[SE-Asians]

Well just have doctors claim before cops

If no doctors claim don't have the cops claim

I actually like this Idea.

Worst case scenario is...

Doc claim --> Cop claim --> Scum choose to kill someone else --> Cop investigates town --> Scum kill N2 cop.

Or

We lynch N2 cop

[SE-Asians]

Oh... And scum successfully counterclaims the real cops/doctors

[SE-Asians]

You guys write so quickly.

Re: Wisdom in regards to his meta

As scum, you are more passive, though you retain an attacking edge. You like to convince people that you are right, and you often get along with strong town figures.
As town, you are hellbent on lynching the person you deem scummiest.

I'll reread the plan and get back with my thoughts: at this point I think it's too random, but I have a feeling I might be wrong.

Ninja'd.

[SE-Asians]

Not really a mass claim

A day-by-day claim, so to speak

[SE-Asians]

With the VT claim, and now this, why are we up to 25 pages??? This should be lynched with fire by now?!?!?

Good place to stop.

And again... Sorry for "our" little frustration fest.

[SE-Asians]

So the plan summary is...

1)Doc claims
2)Cop claims after
3)Scum choose to kill cop... Doctor protects... We get result
4)Scum choose to kill doc... We get result from cop

Is that it? Or am I missing something?

[SE-Asians]

Nah I think the doc should claim first.

There's no guarantee that the cop will not die if only the cop claims.
So Doc should claim first

At least scum gets WIFOM panic.

[SE-Asians]

Btw if we're going through with this... Do we still random lynch or just no lynch everytime?

[SE-Asians]

If someone doesn't claim doc... then Scum might claim doc.
That's what I fear

[SE-Asians]

They can pretty much choose to No Action.

They can't die.

Plus... If a doc dies... The pool would decrease. Then It'd be easier to know who scum are.

[SE-Asians]

But what's the probability of a doc protecting the cop?

They may NOT be a doc to protect the cop

[SE-Asians]

Ok so cop claims... Doc doesn't claim... We lynch "used doc" next day

Ok I can see that now. Phil is biting.

[SE-Asians]

With Nacho's plan they can't do that, if they fakeclaim N1 cop they'll have to provide results and eventually get caught.

They know who the docs and the cops iirc.
The only thing they don't know is what night they are
Unless they're lucky

So yeah... I'm supporting nacho tactic

[SE-Asians]

No, they know how many doctors and how many cops (4-6, 5-5 or 6-4).

Oh... I may have read the setup wrong...

[SE-Asians]

In Nacho's plan they don't have to claim anything at all; they can always just claim to have been a doc at any later point in time on a night where there was no claimed cop - or even on a night where there was a cop who just didn't get killed.

I thought we would lynch the previous doc?

[SE-Asians]

Btw Asians, why do you think I'm scum again?

One of us (me) got bothered on how you entered my wagon.
Well that aside...

if there are 2 or more N1 cops, only one of them should claim. The whole scum WIFOM will be around him, and the other cop(s) will get investigations in.
Thoughts?

[SE-Asians]

I'm up for letting only one claim

But I'm just curious why not let both claim?

[SE-Asians]

Not a N1 PR.

[SE-Asians]

@EVERYONE/MOD/HYDRA PARTNERS: I will be V/LA for the next two days or so, not being able to post, but being able to read, so I *think* I may not be too far behind when I get access again.

[SE-Asians]

Sorry... Apparently 1 of our heads didn't want to post when the 2 of use were in V/LA

[SE-Asians]

Fate really has wishy washy reads.

From I am innocent to us then to wisdom.

Without really proper reasoning
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Fate

[SE-Asians]

UNVOTE:

And now this unvote scares me

[SE-Asians]

why the hell does Iaminnocent have to be town
I just want

to lynch it

I meant this.

[SE-Asians]

Sorry... Apparently 1 of our heads didn't want to post when the 2 of use were in V/LA

Which one?

You can guess who was quite shaken by this game

[SE-Asians]

Will he ever come back?

Because you ask, I post.

Yes, I did my ego in there, I didn't discuss any read with them, so I prefer stop posting and discuss everything with them. Any way, if I post I always think the condition is going to be bad again, so I prefer not.

Anything you want to hear from us?

[SE-Asians]

Well, we never discuss about Bacde/Fate. Go to Mantis, AngelusW, and Kuroro also. So, I must say it is null for now. I can't say anything, he rarely post about his thought with reasoning.

The only one bugging me is when he asked being replaced, he posted this :

which is probably why there seems to be an air of confusion about my slot

I really don't know why he said this.

But, I agree that Fate should give her (or his?) reason.

[SE-Asians]

Yes. But I will support whatever my partner have been done.

SE-Asians (L-4): I Am Innocent, Human Destroyer, kuror0
borkjerfkin (L-6): pirate mollie
Wisdom (L-4): buldermar, borkjerfkin, Fate
Fate (L-4): mantisdreamz, Remembrance, SE-Asians

Not Voting: AngelusW, Wisdom, Nachomamma8

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline is April 13th at 9:30 PM EST

[SE-Asians]

Nacho is obviously town. Well, many reasons from mine. The biggest one, he was planning about the plan, but he didn't use his own plan. There is no reason for scums doing this except Nacho and Buldermar scums together, but there is no reason for Buldermar changed the plan if they are scums together. So, Nacho is town.

Mollie is town. Too many reasons again from mine also... The biggest one, actually, there is a flaw in this plan, but I don't like to tell it because you all already claimed. She told her role first. Looking at the history, there is a lot chance that a day there is no town or only 1 PR. The scums will try to claim with town, not alone, so basically his first claim is naturally from town.

Rem is town also. About this plan, scums must immediately change tempo because of town's plan, so almost likely the N1 claims come from town because if I am scum, I like to discuss our fake claim first in our QT in the night. There is many things to discuss, like what night and how many docs and cops.

I believe that Buldermar is town, but still they keep their eyes on him. One of the reasons, he very fast to post to help the plan, but when he realize there is something wrong with it, he withdraw what he said. If I'm scum, I like to leave it behind. Well, they didn't like how Buldermar jumped on the wagon before. Because Buldermar didn't read the whole thread but vote. Well, if Mollie wasn't unvote, was he going to hammer?

Well, I support whatever my partner said. I don't see why HD is town, but fine, HD is town because I don't see why HD is scum.

I do see why Wisdom is town. If he is scum, he have 1 free mislynch to get (L-1, this is great chance to scums), but one of us see you're too passive like your meta as scum... Well, I don't like meta things, but... Null for now. If you wonder why, I can't answer. Please wait for this.

Well, Bork. We don't have too much about him. There is only personal read. Still need discussion. Null for now.

I am Innocent yah... Personally I don't like his posts, so I prefer skip it. One of us said he is scum, but still no reason. So, I can't tell too much about this. Please wait for this also.

Basically in my eyes, because of my play, this is split to 2 divisions, who push us and who help us which make me have hard time to observe to have a read and to survive (I'm thinking become survival since that time). And I skipped many part of pages which I don't like...

[SE-Asians]

The biggest one, he was planning about the plan, but he didn't use his own plan. There is no reason for scums doing this

What if Nacho realized that Bulder's plan is more exploitable(worse for the town) than his own?

Well, I did see why it is more exploitable than Nacho's plan, but it was too late (and I don't like to post in that time). (You know, I'm pessimistic)

Well, that is Nacho is scum and Buldermar is town scenario.

Basically Nacho said about the plan first, so if he is scum, he already planned all of the plans first and ready for all any circumstances, almost likely being planned in QT. In other side, he changed his plan, which make him make another blueprint plans in his head. Basically it is hard to be done, but not impossible, but he needed to calculate everything again over. If I'm scum, I like to push my plan rather than other plan who did not give guarantee to win. Well, in that time, he calculated for 20 minutes, pretty fast for scum.

[SE-Asians]

Allright, back from /LA.
Will discuss with partners over reads and such. yes, I do have a slight scumread on IaI and mentioned that Wisdom's passivity is something to be noted.

Before trying to catch up on the ten-odd pages I've missed, I'll just say that scum is often far more passive than town.

[SE-Asians]

What exactly do you mean by passivity btw? Can you quote a few examples?

It's more gut than anything else: you haven't been pushing any major lynches yet/trying to start bandwagons yet, but that could be just because you haven't found a strong target yet, just like in 137.

[SE-Asians]

What if Nacho and I happen to have day talk and be a scum faction of our own and this is all just staged to deceive and manipulate town?

It is unlikely happen. When Nacho told about the plan, you prefer had a discussion about read rather than the plan. Other side, you told your plan when Nacho wasn't around. Slash this scenario please.

What if Majiffy gave us all the same role just to troll us?

I already claimed my night.

Why? If he had already found flaws in his own plan (we're assuming Nacho is scum, I remind you), he could easily find flaws in your plan too. It's not like the two plans aren't similar.

The flaw of Nacho's plan is when the scums claim as cop. When you know this, this is safe play. The flaw of Buldermar's plan is when the there is only 1 town PR or no town PR. This is totally random.

Now you know it.

Of course he proposed the plan to gain cred.

According to the fact, when someone try to gain towncreed with something (Like take out from RVS) there is no guarantee it is going to gain a towncreed. Town aren't that stupid to not realize this. And it was D1.

@Rem : Why need both of us online?

About other reads, please wait, even though I already have my personal read.

[SE-Asians]

@Rem : Well, seems that hard to be achieved. I don't know where are my partners gone. I should blame myself for this. And I'm on V/LA also for this week.

By the way Rem,

The logic is poor(on my part), but in general, it's a responsible use of a scum tell to get someone lynched, so it makes me lean very slight town.

Scums also do this. Because they should mislynch someone, so they will seek a reason to lynch someone (vote also), attempt to follow the situation (maybe vote maybe not), or they can watch mislynch (not voting). Well, my newbie games taught me this.

I figured ya all needed something from me ASAP this slot has been a black hole for too long in this game.

Not really, my crystal ball still work for who will be lynched for this day. You still have plenty time.

Post from wrong account again...

[SE-Asians]

Not saying I agree with you, but why in the world would town-Asians tell scum what the safe play is? Who are you trying to help?

Everyone already know the scenario. It isn't a secret. I'm not the first who told it. In other side, I should told the flaws if I know it. Why I should keep the flaw as secret? I think you will answer, "You seek for towncreed".

The problem is if scum fakeclaims cop.

@Asians, what are your reads on Remembrance and Bork (want this from all 3 heads)?

Personally, I already told about Rem, and Bork is town. Bork's post #709 seems honesty. If I am scum, I like to see the pattern first. Post #789 seems come from town. Kept it, he won't hurt.

And now he acts like he's tunneled town on me when

he knows full well that I am not scum.

Every scums know fell well who is town and who is scum, right? Why is this scumtell?

*though i'd like to hear from SE-Asians again

Just clarify, about HD?

his back and forth with SE Asians.

Elaborate please?

@Rem : Hey, Rem, still here?

[SE-Asians]

Ya go get it!

[SE-Asians]

Hmm...

I always told my read first. Then if we already post our read, we have agreement. Most likely they don't have read about other players, so they just agree. Maybe because my previous play. (But I'm glad they still have a read)

P-Edit : Hmmm... You know that the older the read they weren't active. (They didn't have read)

[SE-Asians]

TNE rarely post in QT. So, actually his read in all of this thread. So, I always take a look at this ISO to know TNE's read.

Sora talked overall. Not post per post. He have Nacho as town because attempting the plan, Wisdom as town (don't know why, maybe because their previous talk?), IaI as scum because have single-minded.

Most likely I agree with them because they have good reason about them. I always told my read, then asked are they agree or not.

[SE-Asians]

I forgot about the older. I should checked QT.

Previous read, Sora had Rem as null-with-a-tinge-of-scum because overall your post in the beginning wasn't worth to post, but TNE had Rem as town because AtE. But TNE wary with Wisdom in beginning.

[SE-Asians]

Usually we asked about all of us. Well, TNE sometimes came up.

The last I asked them, I asked all of read about the player. And that was Sora answer. TNE never came up.

Sora ever asked about Buldermar jumped in and though of the plan. I responded the most about the plan. TNE have a new plan with doctor claim. Well you know it.

[SE-Asians]

Last question: Go into detail about one conversation you had about one read that you talked the most about.

The last read I asked to them? I asked all of their read, because I find something interesting, I like to discuss it to them (well, I can't tell it in thread).Even though that they weren't respond it.

Because I already have read in other player, I told my read about Mantis, IaI, and Kuroro. Well, that was Sora's respond. And no other respond. I think Sora still's busy. He promised had other read 3 days ago, but never came up. TNE never came after his V/LA.

[SE-Asians]

You can't tell us the interesting thing you thought of in your QT?

Well, it is about read also thought. It is about meta, even though I always use it as reference, I never use it as read. So, I don't like to tell it.

Well, Rem, thanks, provide me you're obviously town also.

[SE-Asians]

By the way Rem, what kind of result do you expect?

[SE-Asians]

Someone remind me of this post

Day 2

if

Asians

, by some strange fluke,

flips town

.

abandoned the doomed

scum slot

.

What?

I see it as

scum hydra

.

so

null

there for me

What?

Why are you voting Fate.

Fate had jumpy read in #937, #938, and #993. Personal, I consider this because he replaced for 40++ pages, I know that feel. He said it in #1364.

it will most likely be Fate or SE-Asians

You should had trust to my crystal ball. (This crystal ball remind me that perseverance thingy, I like it )

[SE-Asians]

Why being a hydra if you are not even discussing your reads with the people you know have the same alignment as you? I guess the whole point of being a hydra is that one. If they are not doing it, it means there is no real interest on scumhunting (not showing in the thread and not on their QT according to Lincolm) which means scum to me.

Isn't this from the interviews? Where I misinterpret it?

[SE-Asians]

Because yesterday I was busy with my exams, doesn't mean I'm lurking. I try to keep posting in this game even in V/LA. I'm trying dude.

I'm a fast reader, especially if I'm just looking at one player

No, you don't. In our games, you pushed 2 or 3 persons. This game as town http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=25435 and this game as scum http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24645. You're trying to play with different meta and your meta defense is bullshit.

VOTE: Wisdom

I want SE-Asians head on a platter tomorrow.

What the fuck is this? YOU'RE THINK I'M SCUM AND WHAT IS THIS SHIT?

Would scum-HD really tunnel so heavily on one person (Asians)?

Why not?

I don't see scum-HD pushing that Asians-lynch so thoroughly for so long with so much resistance when there are so many easy alternatives and it's so high risk even if he succesfully gets town-Asians mislynched. I think he's just misguided with respect to Asians (because I think at this point that Asians is town).

With townread, I don't think he isn't going to be looked around because his massive push.

i'm looking at one of his ISO's in a scum game i played with him in. he's capable.
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=23964&user_select=20122

Even though I'm winning with Nacho, I'm not satisfied with that game. I played to passively. I really don't know why I got townread in there. Because I played cautious and safely, it should be scummy.

umm hello might get NKed?

Did you read the plan or not? Well, according to the plan maybe our PRs the one who get killed, luckily if we have doc and protect the right person.

K, I'm not support any Wisdom and Fate lynch. I don't see any big cases maybe Wisdom is scum or Fate is scum except by his jumpy read, I consider it as laziness. So,

Unvote

Wisdom probably town and Fate should have done better in D2, whatever is his alignment. I don't like his play but it isn't tell that he is scum.

Because we need lynch, I support my own lynch. Just go ahead. If deadline's near and no one hammered me, I will vote myself.

Please don't let HD around with townread. He said he is sure I'm scum, but he still can said with strange fluke I'm going to flip as town and vote Wisdom? What kind of fluke is that, I have role and it's never change! He is trying to make a case on Bork in D2 when I flip as town. And he didn't provide any reason to vote Wisdom except at latter. He only want to lynch.

Good luck town.

SE-Asians (L-2): I Am Innocent, kuror0, mantisdreamz, RachMarie, HumanDestroyer
Wisdom (L-4): Fate, Nachomamma8, pirate mollie
Fate (L-4): Wisdom, borkjerfkin, buldermar
I Am Innocent (L-6): Remembrance

Not Voting: SE-Asians

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline is April 13th at 9:30 PM EST

[SE-Asians]

If I "only want to lynch" as you put it, do tell why I've flat out refused to vote for at least half the playerlist, including Fate, the leading wagon at the time?

Because Fate is your townread. You just don't get your own read, do you?

If you don't...I think you're scum, but a fluke would be the 0.01% chance you're scum

Yeah, you try to make a case in Bork after I flip as town. No way you're town.

Lynch this guy tomorrow.

[SE-Asians]

Remembrance is town.

SE-Asians I still lean scum on for pretty much universally anti-town play. Other than that I can't tell wtf he's (they're?) even saying and tend not to read his posts.

Someone remind me of this post Day 2 if Asians, by some strange fluke, flips town.

[SE-Asians]

I have nothing to say with you guys have done. Too cool.

Mollie and Nacho, your last read for today please, before Majiffy close this thread.

[SE-Asians]

^ Please tell TNE and Sora, to help you out and figure out your reads if you're town okay? TNE was around, so, should have helped you out more.

Ya. Going to do better in D2.

[SE-Asians]

I have nothing to say with you guys have done. Too cool.

Mollie and Nacho, your last read for today please, before Majiffy close this thread.

why aren't you asking rememory too?

He wrote it in post #2232.

[SE-Asians]

I feel my first newbie game repeated again. *sigh* (The case, not the alignment )

i was a bit surprised that wisdom was the nightkill, but yea - my first thought as well, was that maybe scum did not like his reads or where he was headed

Wisdom ever killed because of his activity. Probably same. Will take a look at his ISO, but too many post...

But I already fucked up once.

I fucked up three times in here.

also, lincolm would have really had to have extremely good acting skills, if he actually is scum

I never know that I have acting skills. Seriously.

Those who immediately pointed to Nacho are scummy to me.

Because Wisdom attacked Nacho so scum want to make a case on Nacho? Probably right. Scum-Nacho will not kill Wisdom also.

Also, Rubicon didn't react at all to Mollie's announcement. Which is just out right strange. Usually scum aren't that incompetent. What I mean, is that usually they try to involve themselves when such an announcement is made, but he/she didn't. Just left.

I think that is town reaction. Will explain after everyone posted.

@Mollie & Rem : You should stop that. Both of you misinterpret both view.

By the way, I like to being replaced to see UberNinja get lynched. (No, I don't do that) (By the way, Sora is nowhere, about TNE... yah... I know him personally so...)

By the way also, in seriousness, can someone unvote please? I'm afraid there is scum buddy or stupid town put L-1 and Fate self-vote to end the day. Thanks.

[SE-Asians]

I don't recall exactly why I thought Wisdom looked scummy at this time, but I do recall that I at one point in time thought he looked scummy for claiming that he actually had a slight scum read on Asians while voting people who voted Asians for their day 1 stunt.

Maybe it is because his play style. Sorry, personally I don't like meta things even though I still use it as references, so I like to keep it myself.

On average, you will have 2 power roles a night. With rach dying, that reduces the average to one for N2. If we have everybody claim, and one person claims a N2 power role, what do you think happens to them???

Based on the flips and Nacho/Mollies roles, my suggestion would have been for no one to claim. And if we did claim, to go with Nacho's original plan where just N2 cops claim. With 2 people already claiming no power role N2, and another person soft claiming towards having one, maybe we should finish, I don't know.

This is town post... Now I hate you because you're town.

I'm still sure HD is scum. Will check the last partner. Will read Mantis, Kuroro, IAI and Bork/Rubicon's ISO again.

By the way, scum would like to jump on their partner who outed guilty because they want to end the day faster. That's why I think Rubicon is town, but that "Somebody should investigated Nacho" was uhh.... Glad no one vote to join on the wagon again.

P-Edit : No answer here. I have seen night phase extension before because replacement request. I forget which alignment.

[SE-Asians]

It would have to be his play style seing that he was town, right? That's self-evident at this point.

Yes, indeed, because I never play with scum-Wisdom, even though I already read all of his game (Because Wisdom one of the interesting player I have played with). No way everyone agree with that also. I ever protected Wisdom because of his meta, but no one believe. By the way Bulder, who do you think the other mafias?

[SE-Asians]

Seems now everyone paranoid with Nacho. Sorry, Nacho is one of my obvious town. Won't take it back.

Do you really think scum-Nacho will post this? Nacho is slick when he is scum, he won't post something like this as scum.

I let Fate go for D1 because I love being the same alignment with him and wasn't so sure about my Bacde reading powers because I've usually been scum in games with him. So, I ignored the shit out of him and waited for him to do something beautiful.

Fate most likely isn't the only scum on this wagon.

I think someone who not in the wagon is more likely scum (include me), not in the wagon.

jumping on the lynch of an outed guilty is not alignment indicative

^"Jump on the wagon, let's end the day". Still don't get my logic?

nacho is so god damn town

I trust this.

[SE-Asians]

Nah sorry. I like to fake claim. My role in N5 so I like to survive. It doesn't matter.

[SE-Asians]

Sorry, I have big real life issues. Read 100++ pages with problem wasn't easy.

@Rubicon :
RachMarie's wagon succeed because many people online in that time, in 24 hours. 10 people I guess. Nacho, IaI, and I wasn't online in that time. Of course RachMarie could not self-vote.

Fate's wagon succeed because Mollie's result. Everyone didn't want to vote also when L-2 happen.

@Kuroro : I ever observed one of your game before (with JasonWazza, Revenus, Bitmap, and the others I forget), when you as town cop and you faked your result (your target killed at the same night, twice in row ). So, why you did not fake your result? Why change of heart in my slot?

@IaI : Sorry, I really don't want to believe with your result. How about this plan? Lynch me today and after I flip as town, lynch you tomorrow? I still remember Mollie said you were very good at fake claiming as cop and I'm wary with it. There is scenario that you protect HD, of course. I don't think that is moronic when the scum with townread fakeclaim as cop. Town tend to believe with the scum and the result.

TNE said Fate is scum. Sora said IaI is scum. And I said HD is scum. So yes, I stuck with this.

[SE-Asians]

Sorry, probably I forget many cases. Still, I try to check before post.

=

@Kuroro : Please elaborate what do you mean by empty slot. If you think I don't do anything, am I fence sitting in your point of view? If I'm fence sitting, why I'm not scummy enough to you?

=

@IaI : I don't too like night analysis because I ever post RAWR but... I still do it because it is right answer...

The N1's kill already weird like fuck. Mafias prefer to kill Wisdom, probably because his activity. Why prefer other night player than N1 PR's?
The N2's kill also weird. Mafia prefer kill used power player rather than PRs. Why again?

This is only analysis so I can't say this is 100% right. Probably this is the answer :
N1 : Mafias killed Wisdom because mafias knew there is a lot of doctors (4-6 or 5-5). So they prefer have 100% kill rather than gambit kill.
N2 : Same with N1. Because no claim than cops, mafias prefer kill other player. Why Nacho? I like to say Nacho is strong player, always re-read, and unlynchable. If Kuroro is town, I don't think Kuroro investigated Nacho was weird. Even Rubicon was wary with Nacho. Perhaps because Rubicon said that, Kuroro began to wary with Nacho. The other people also, right? I call it perception. So no, Kuroro investigation is null-tell. But personally I consider it more likely come from town rather than scum.

About why Nacho killed :
1> They knew how many cops and how many docs. If I'm right about you and HD as scum, in D2 of course no one would investigated both of you, no worry about it. Kuroro insisted to investigated his list. Even there is future cops, just kill the cops if town don't have doc or his possibility target. If town have doc, just kill other player, like D1.
2> Why scum do not fake-investigate other townie or his buddy? This create WIFOM to town, so it is null-tell. Why the candidates can't be all towns? There is possibility of this. So it is null-tell also.

=

@Rem : Let Mantis and Rubicon alive, what WIFOM will be created? Take a look at the remaining PR. See below.

=

@Mantis : Why you don't take a look at me but Rem?

=

@Rubicon : Respond to my analyse about your wagon analyse please.

=

Rubicon sheep Nacho's analysis. I wonder why.

So, Mantis and us still not claim if I'm right?

6 Claimed cops,

N2 Rach

, N1 Mollie, N2 Kuroro, N2 IaI, N3 HD, N4 Rubicon.
4 Claimed docs,

N1 Nacho

,

N3 Wisdom

, N1 Rem, N2 Buldermar.

I already claimed N5. By the way, Mantis probably town. Mantis should not claim at all. So, keep away from her, will ya? Ask me why. Tell me why also why Mantis is scum if you think Mantis is scum.

This is only WIFOM, but it say scum prefer to claim as cop than doc. I don't like to check Buldermar's ISO again, he is town.

[SE-Asians]

Scum want a guaranteed kill every night. So Wisdom dying N1 (future power role) makes sense to me.

There was 3 outed roles. If I am mafia, I would try to look who is the cop and who is the doc and his target. What happen if it is 2 cops or 3 cops? Yours is logically right if only the mafias know that there were many docs and the docs targeted the cop.

Why kill a player that has already used his power over a list of the unconfirmed players, at least one of which had to be a cop?

Same analyse with above. Why not other player like Buldermar, Rubicon, Mantis, or me? Perhaps because we are lynchable. Why Nacho? I already said it.

se-asians' soft push on IaI and me is laughable to the max, considering they're doing absolutely friggin' nothing with their vote

Your post (this one) is laughable also.

@Se-Asians, can you remake your suspicions based off the fact HD is town? Before the day ends? Thank you.

No. Your reason "too scummy to be scum" isn't proven. The others didn't think that post is scummy, also myself.

About mantis. I am officially asking why she is town to you. She probably just got HD killed if he is town.

If IaI and HD are gambiting, this is the most town perfect move in this game.

Start of day 1 Mantis was lurking, but rather than give better read, she gave mostly gut reads. When I mostly wanted to lynch myself, Mantis the first who unvote my wagon when in L-2. Day 3 she voted Rem without purpose. Overall, she have no scum motivation at all and honesty.

About your case on Mantis, I prefer Mantis answer by herself, so I will let Mantis to answer first.

I love her claim by the way.

I'm not comfortable lynching a claimed cop potentially shutting down another investigation.

This is only WIFOM, but it say scum prefer to claim as cop than doc.

Wasn't going to, but since it looks like you guys are probably not lynching me right away, this slot deserves someone who can actually spare the time to play well. I'm getting a bit burnt out on all this mafia stuff and just don't have the energy.

Why you post this?

Also please, respond to Buldermar's and HD's (that you promised)?

Please answer before you replaced with UberNinja.

Rubicon (L-3): Remembrance, Human Destroyer
Buldermar (L-4): Rubicon
kuror0 (L-3): I Am Innocent, mantisdreamz
mantisdreamz (L-3): pirate mollie, kuror0

SE-Asians, buldermar

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline is Sunday, May 12th 2013, at 12:00 AM EST.

[SE-Asians]

I wonder in where Majiffy will post the vote count in my above post.

[SE-Asians]

hi SE/lincolm - not sure if it's the why did i claim that i should answer?

I mean Kuroro's case on you. This post

I would expect at least 1 scum to include him as he'd be an easy target

This is not my cases on HD. Defending can be done by town-town, scum-town, town-scum, or scum-scum. So no. By the way, who use this as their reason to suspect HD ?

Her claim is not the most trustworthy but we haven't lynched any claimed cop it is better to have the option to let more info come to us.

We already lynched RachMarie who is N2 Cop. Also, I already said before, this is only WIFOM, but it say mafias like to claim as cop rather than doc.

in order to clear out the wifom.

What WIFOM?

I hate to say this, but I prefer myself as lynch today and next is IaI. I can't say why because this is based on WIFOM in my point of view. I think you all smart enough to realize the scenario (by the way, I think of it until day 5, so town can win with this tactic).

[SE-Asians]

Darn it, include Kuror in that list of cops too. So if you are a cop, Rubicon or Kuror is surely scum.

I don't believe with kind of this post. Seriously, scum like to post something like this because they know how many roles.

if scum can see the math I did it actually ruins the plan I have

I like you to post about this in your next post. Full analyse.

There was little critical thinking, and a lot of trying to look town in the above, it almost looked like a play-by-play: of things town say^tm.

No. I agree with Buldermar.

@Rem :

mollie you can control my vote since you're essentially confirmed town. I'll take control of it again once I'm motivated, though.

Now, take off your vote at Buldermar.

He HAS put himself at a disadvantage as scum, but he has also tried to reap the benefits of doing so.

By the way, 'he' in here IaI? I don't see it. Can you put with simple words or pointed which post?

Because Mantis already claim her role, I prefer claim my role. Scums know what is the role I have, so we're N5 Doc. I'm Timothy Crouse. Wiki said he is a journalist and a writer. Never heard him before.

@Mantis : Can you respond my post here?

[SE-Asians]

Also, because Rubicon request of replacement

@Mod : Majiffy, can we get extension for Rubicon's slot?

[SE-Asians]

Bah, seems I can't protect both Bulder and Mantis today, damnit. Kuroro also town by the way. I have nothing to say about Bork-Rubicon's slot.

Really, I don't get it why you people never thought about gambit at all, like scums never do gambits.

Let's take this seriously.

Who thinks my claim seriously?

Especially you, Mollie, I know you like to use meta and you know I like to fake claim. Mantis, I prefer you do not respond this. I prefer the rest of players.

it is very weird that buldey hasn't put a vote down yet

I never put my vote down today. You should voted me rather than Mantis.

I am seriously wondering about SE. I have completed games with all 3 right now and I still don't know. they look scummy to me. dunno about kuror like even when he posts he somehow manages to slip off of my radar and tbh that is usually a scumtell.

See my respond above. Damnit. Next game we're on same alignment again, follow my flowchart.

lincolm felt forced to give out scum reads... actually he never really gave out many at all, and was really un-confrontational

he's town.

Please don't use it to defense, especially me, I don't like it at all. I don't like meta defense.

P-Edit : I'm still thinking I'm best lynch for WIFOM I will create tomorrow, if I survived.

[SE-Asians]

By the way, in the case I'm not survive, you guys should think again about the gambit. If you're not, I'm going to hate all of you.

Why I think they are gambiting?

First, I'm pretty sure about my scumread in HD. He tried to make a case in Bork after I flip as town. HD voted in Wisdom and made a cases in Wisdom after my wagon stalled.
Second, Fate interaction with Nacho seems genuine. Perhaps you should see Nacho post this and Fate post this.
Third, HD didn't give comment about I suspected him and IaI, but IaI the one who take care about that they weren't gambiting at all.

Lynch IaI or HD tomorrow.

I don't care if you think this is scummy or what are you thinking, you all forget about the fact and the possibility.

Also, you all need to answer my question, why I'm telling the truth about my role.

[SE-Asians]

Sorry, I got competition last weekend.

Well fuck, fine then, I was wrong yesterday (D3). I need time to read the whole 125 pages again.

By the way, if I remember correctly, IaI and Rem is town based on play in D3. And Buldermar is pretty slick, I forget which post, but we have bad condition right now.

[SE-Asians]

Sorry, not good time in real life. Have hard time until now. But I really want to play in here...

Like I said before, we're in bad situation. If we lynch town today, Jon is alive, this is going to be asdfasdf WIFOM.
I'm thinking what Nacho said before...

IaI in day 2 and day 3 is really town. Mollie still town. I think Rem is town, added his play in day 3 also... I hope I'm not wrong about is one, gut say the other fvkc...

Leaving Jon, Kuroro, and Buldermar.

Vote : Kuroro

SE Asians if scum, is bussing his partner. He has one confirmed town on his wagon, and me and Kuror. If Asians is town, you can be sure one of me and Kuror are scum.

=

@Jon : Why Mollie is more townier rather than Buldermar?
Hint :

If SE is claiming a N-5 PR, one of our cops is lying about being a cop.

I already claim, eh?

[SE-Asians]

@Jon : You better not scum Jon. I hate in LyLo.

Eh, just realize, wrong question. Why Buldermar more townier rather than Mollie?

[SE-Asians]

I'm trying to figure out how Kuror0 and IaI keep picking at each other and how that works if they're a scum team. They've been narrowed down and are pretty much forced to push at each other, but I'm wondering if the scum team is worried or what their game plan is and how they're reacting to all of this. I want to make sure this makes sense.

Can you elaborate what make you think about this?

Who should I investigate? Buldemar gets two votes, since he's my biggest Town read. Buldemar, you better not be scum!

Dunno, but this is sounded like "I will survive tomorrow"... I hope you're joking in here...

[SE-Asians]

I seriously considered p_m doing a gambit here, but buldemar said there was no way she'd do it in this situation.

Convince me why Buldermar is town please. Your own reason of course.

Does it worry you if buldemar gets more of a say in an investigation that probably won't see the light of day?

Don't make me paranoid again Jon. You're saying again in here that you will be not get killed this night.

Even if you're survive tomorrow, you get town or scum result, there is no way you're town, only in your point of view this help you, if you're town. The mafias will decide what action they like to do. In order to create that WIFOM, both mafias should survive. I don't think IaI and Kuroro are scum together based on this. That's why I asked Rem.

[SE-Asians]

Don't make me paranoid again Jon. You're saying again in here that you will be not get killed this night.

Bah, I misinterpret your post. That's why I feel weird. Strike this sentence. I shouldn't have read after wake up.

[SE-Asians]

Does it worry you if buldemar gets more of a say in an investigation that probably won't see the light of day?

What do you think Buldermar will said about the next investigation?

[SE-Asians]

I still think IaI is town. Really, I don't get the hell your cases in IaI. And I don't know where I should start, I completely disagree with all of this... I thought the gambit IaI did was with HD, no more. HD is killed and this proving me I was wrong. So, IaI is town.

Where I saw it... Found it!

Like SE-Asians and IaI are just bleedingly town.

Somehow I trust this one. This post is genuine and honest, not contrived at all. Call me stupid, retarded, idiot or whatever, I still trust this, except the truth IaI is mafia. If IaI is mafia, I have a lot of regret because follow this.

Why all this hostility? Why are you threatening this? I almost feel it's a scum ploy to get votes turned away from you.

This is how someone play. This isn't tell someone alignment. Probably you never see the worse.

IaI if mantis was off limits then why did hammer her instead of defending her?

Because almost deadline? I would not hammer Mantis. You know that.

Do you agree with Nacho and Fate that
1. You are town as shit.
2. An easy mislynch.

This kind question isn't going to help. This is only produce self-meta. What kind of answer do you want to get from this question?

Investigate the one of IAI/Kuro that we are not lynching in my opinion.

You know that this is only work if we lynch town today

and

Jon is town

and

Jon is survive until the day come. It still not helping because I have no idea with Jon slot.

God...

[SE-Asians]

@ SE Who do you think is most likely to be scum now. Your one top pick.

Like I said before, Mollie, Rem, and IaI are town. I have no idea in your slot, but my gut said you're honest about "Don't know my alignment". Leaving Buldermar and Kuroro. Unfortunately, I agree Buldermar looks like a town, so the only left only Kuroro. So I pick Kuroro as my main suspect.

tl;dr Kuroro by PoE.

I recheck all of my notes I wrote and I did not find anything. The mafias really did good job to looks like a townie in my view.

[SE-Asians]

@Rem : K, that question deserve an answer, that is how you play. Perhaps it will help you generate your read in IaI. I hope it can...

I really don't see the pattern how Nacho play, even though I like to spectating his game. But, I think it was serious. Even though it tried to see other people's reaction, it still a read. Stubborn is how I play in mafia also.

I'm really not sure about Jon's slot. Bork dislike this game, so I consider his play. Rubicon also busy, so I consider it again. Meh... Probably Jon like to vote IaI I think. His flip-flop perhaps because he replaced with 125++ pages. Indeed we need someone to trust to read more easily in that condition.

I think your question is meta things, not a WIFOM. Self-meta isn't going to help IMO, you need to know his meta. I always allow WIFOM around because I like them. You can see that in day 3, I and IaI discuss about the night kill, all of them are WIFOMs.

=

So, about Jon. Let me seek for a while.

So, in post #3178 and #3187, Jon speculating about our role. Actually, all the roles already outed, especially to mafias. If Jon is scum, then he know what the fuck is my role without reading, but he still speculating it (and his speculation was wrong). Maybe he know this so he forced to post this, but post #3178 seems not contrived because it is big post. Dunno then...

Any way, if I'm right about the time, there is 18 hours? I probably sleep first right now. Will check again after wake up.

[SE-Asians]

Why would he know that?

He knows the number of roles, but not who has them unless he read your claim. For example, he assumed you were a cop. Instead of a doc and that someone must have fake claimed. But where does that assumption come from?

I don't know why he assumed me as cop also. The mafias know how many cops and docs. The last who claiming role (not claim night) sequentially is Rubicon, Mantis, and the last is me.

Let's say Rubicon's slot is scum, so he was fake claiming. So Mantis and I are the last who claim, but Mantis lynched in D3 and flipped as doc, so Jon knows what is my role even though I didn't claim. Other side, town still need my confirmation, and Jon did this.

I couldn't say that this is legit read, because if mafias realize this, then he gain a lot of towncreed in my view. Yeah, WIFOM...

I don't think mafias would fake claimed doc... But for stabilize the role, example if setup is 5 docs - 5 cops, someone of the mafias need to do this.

I really wanted someone said, "are you fake-claiming?" or anything like this in day 3 ... You know, I like fake-claiming. *sigh*

=

What is Jon's role? Oh, Hunter S. Thompson

Don't bother about investigate, not going to help. And what you did just make me paranoid.

=

Sorry IaI, I'm stick with my choice. Kuroro is the best choice.

I don't think Buldermar + Jon are make sense. I strike this possibility. After Jon replaced in, he did buddying with Buldermar, I think this doesn't make sense as mafia + mafia.

By the way IaI, where is Buldermar + Kuroro, Buldermar + Remembrance, and Jon + Remembrance possibility?

=

IaI didn't do anything slip. When IaI asked Rubicon to claim, Rubicon in L-1. Time to claim, right?

=

I was frustrated... Any way, I think IaI's post make sense. His logic about the night kill are pretty good. Too good as scum.

Yes, I withdraw my accusation because I was wrong.

=

P-Edit : Bold text.

[SE-Asians]

By the way IaI, where is Buldermar + Kuroro, Buldermar + Remembrance, and Jon + Remembrance possibility?

Uh IaI, I know you're in phone, but somehow I like this to be answered... Because, you know, my possibility scums team in here...

[SE-Asians]

7 hours left. Just reminder.

I'm quiet disagree with IaI reads. Actually that... Dunno but in D2 I had a feeling that Buldermar was soft-claiming, dunno which post, also if I remember correctly though. Uh... yes, I do know if he is scum he had a chance to kill you, but somehow if I'm cop in that condition, I would not investigate Buldermar...

But, somehow I like to trust this... asdfasdfasdf

rememory plz don't vote IaI. look at his post. just look at it.

Told you.

[SE-Asians]

I'm still watching tournament (in 3 AM), so I still around. I still like to hear anything.

@Kuroro : Yes, indeed I vote you because of PoE, I think Mollie, Rem, and IaI are town. IaI completely defending HD in day 3, even though I accused him did a gambit, but he blatantly asked me to look over and asked why with the night analysis. I'm not accepting or rejecting by gut, it is completely because the logic I have. If I agree, then I agree, if not, then I disagree, but this is certainly not giving clue about someone alignment. Because someone have same logic, doesn't mean their alignment also same. If you take a look at the discussion about night action, it is completely both of us disagree with our thought. I countered his analyse, he countered mine.

If IaI is scum, I have no regret. Good game by him.

@Rem : You complete make me paranoid again.

Please don't say "please investigate A, Jon". This is completely assuming that Jon will survive tomorrow and dafuq how do you know...

[SE-Asians]

Somehow that's blowing my mind... That's completely right according to the fact... But with bad logic inside...

[SE-Asians]

Somehow, I don't like to tell it. But this is essentially telling it.

[SE-Asians]

Posting. Telling you I'm still around.

By the way IaI, where is Buldermar + Kuroro, Buldermar + Remembrance, and Jon + Remembrance possibility?

IaI, I want this to be answered.

If Kuror0 and Jon die I might have a stroke.

If this is right, then town already lose. I have no idea who is mafias and towns. Probably I will just play my vote around so there is some of confirmed not mafias pair...

=

Buldermar's frustration seems come from town asdfasdfadfadf...

Should from this account.

[SE-Asians]

I posted and everyone gone. Forever alone

[SE-Asians]

Okay, what question I want to ask to Buldermar actually...

Forget it...

I wonder if everyone are sure that Jon's role is Hunter S. Thompson...

@IaI : I understand about your read in Buldermar, but you made this post before re-read I think?

possible scum teams: Bulder/Jon, Jon/Kuror, Kuror/Remembrance

Post #3431 is the time you re-read again?

[SE-Asians]

In Kuror0's last wifom post we see him moving Se-Asians down. He choose him in particular, but kept everyone else where they were in his other scum read progression. I don't know what that means at all. Or if it even has a meaning.

It has a meaning. It is what you did. Questioning why he putted me in there.

I don't think he chose me in particular. I was defending IaI first, so the only make sense in as IaI's partner is me.

Someone talk to me. I already pmed Majiffy to ask if he was trolling. He said he wasn't.

I think Jon get killed is not weird. If Jon is survive and Jon didn't investigate me, probably we lynched him, but we have confirmed town and I can protect him last night, and Mollie still town as fuck, not going to lynched at all.

But, because I don't get killed last night, it's mean the scum afraid with the investigate.

Vote : Buldermar

Let's have 1 v 1.

[SE-Asians]

Majiffy's avatar is disturbing... a lot. I just follow IaI's flowchart now. Get up, survive, and sleep.

=

Buldermar, if Jon was alive today, then it should be me who was going to be killed at night because I still have my power. I don't think Jon would be not lynched today. Though, after that Jon's result is confirmed whatever his result.

It just night speculation.

I withdraw that 1v1. I should realize I need to protect someone today. I hate LyLo...

=

You are asking player x to tell you why player y is town, I don't like that.

I like to do this also. Not because to convince me that Y is town, but I want to read X is town or mafia, or mental note about X. I like to have townread rather than scumread, in other case townread need to be asked also.

why do we have SE as town again?

You tell me.

One of the primary ones being that both Kuror0 and Bacde tried to push for his lynch. Fate changed this and stated Se-asians was a mislynch. There's also the Mantis meta read to consider. There is a lot to go through.

Bussing can happen. Fate is mafia, so I don't know from view of point you believe that is mislynch, but indeed it is mislynch. Meta still meta, not 100% read.

=

[SE-Asians]

I'm not sure I understand this. Could you try to phrase it differently? Sorry.

My bad. My writing sucks.

If Jon alive, night kill (almost likely me), almost likely Jon is going to mislynched (especially town result), confirm 1 person.

Se-Asians, why do you think Buldermar is scum? Is it just PoE again or something else?

Some of his posts in day 2 or day 3, I forget, tingling my gut that he is slick. It just make me paranoid about him over and over and can't read him.

this is why SE should never have made it this close to endgame

I agree.

Just simple, if you think I'm scum, go ahead. Maybe I'm ego, but this is for town's sake also. At least in this 3, Rem, IaI, and Buldey, choose who is town. For your substitute in LyLo though.

sora has been active on the site and the weird way in which they read nacho was well weird. it was hedging pure and simple and sora has been active elsewhere on the site but I don't think he has posted in this game since d1. lurking is a scumtell for sora I think but gah, has claimed n5 doc

He is too busy.

Let me tell again. Overall that is my read about Nacho.

After 12 persons posting, Nacho came and suggested the plan. Even though, he had townread in my slot, he still considered it after Rem interviewed me. His interaction with Fate is different like scum-Nacho I ever seen. So yes, Nacho is town.

(By the way, usually I'm lurking as town, this is self-meta)

=

Why the hell I get feeling IaI bussing his partner whole day 4 now god dammit.

[SE-Asians]

Fine then

Unvote

Vote : IaI

[SE-Asians]

Alright, I think I understand, and I agree. However, I'm not entirely sure how it relates to your withdrawal from 1v1'ing me?

Not related at all.

I just realized that I need to

PROTECT MOLLIE

tonight. Every 1v1 I'm always lose by the way.

[SE-Asians]

Am I gonna have to prod some bitches?

No thanks. Prod dodge here.

[SE-Asians]

@Rem : Just ask. What do you think about the night kill?

[SE-Asians]

Yah, I should thanks for that. Somehow, I'm glad. Read 100+ pages to clear out paranoid is a misery for me. (And, I'm still not finish it, I'm clearly not suitable with 13=+ person games)

Any way, good luck.

(I just woke up to continue my read by the way)