Mini 1438: Gonzo Mafia (Scum Win)

[Wisdom]

(Except one game that he replaced in while I was already dead, so I guess I won't count it)

SE-Asians (L-4): I Am Innocent, Human Destroyer, kuror0
Nachomamma8 (L-6): pirate mollie
Wisdom (L-5): borkjerfkin, Fate
Fate (L-4): mantisdreamz, Remembrance, SE-Asians

Not Voting: AngelusW, Wisdom, Nachomamma8, buldermar

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline is April 13th at 9:30 PM EST

[buldermar]

I'll be frank. I think Se-Asian's is mislynch bait. Everyone is okay with voting him and I am tempted to as well. But that means scum are okay with his lynch too. EVERYONE is okay with Se. Ergo, scum are okay with his lynch. Scum do not play that way because it's intentionally suspicious, the arguing about and wanting to have the Doc's claim was not something scum would do because it's idiotic and suspicious to do so. Yes, I am going for the "too incompetent to be scum" argument. Why vote Buldermar? Why discuss it amongst the hydras if he wasn't town. Ultimately, he will probably be lynched anyway, I will follow tomorrow if he flips scum. But them's the breaks of having an opinion.

This is a good point. Makes me think even more that Wisdom could be scum.

Because you're fence-sitting like crazy, voting people that are voting him for his retarded stunt while insisting that you do not read him as town. It's as if you're waiting to see what will happen and then you can pull a scum read on him out of your white hat at a convenient time instead of just explaining it now. On the other hand, should he not get lynched you can night kill him and gain town cred.

If you think he's scum you shouldn't give a damn if he's lynched for reason X or reason Y.

[buldermar]

I've never played with scum-Nacho. Why?

I don't even know why I'm discussing this. Your hypothesis that he deliberately proposed an exploitable plan only to trick me into proposing an alternative but also exploitable plan that he, knowing that it's exploitable, can support, is silly because

even if

he's scum, it's much more likely that he'd just propose a plan to gain town cred than to trick town into doing something exploitable.

[Wisdom]

That's not what I am saying. Of course he proposed the plan to gain cred. But that doesn't mean that he does not have some ways that it can work to his benefit in mind. Then you propose your own plan, which might be better in that aspect for him. So he supports it. Do you find this so unlikely?

[buldermar]

Yes I find that highly unlikely. I looked at his plan and thought of a way to overcome some of the issues with it, so it's extremely unlikely that he found some sort of "more exploitable hidden flaw" compared to his own plan. I think even if he's scum and even if he realize that my plan is better early on in the game in many aspects, he'd go along with it because it would look bad if he didn't.

[buldermar]

Note that I'm not saying he's 100% town - I'm just saying that the whole idea of him specifically accepting my plan because it's more exploitable is silly.

[Wisdom]

mkay.
So who is scum?

[buldermar]

I don't know. I still don't like how you've been dealing with the whole Asians-stunt, but you've looked town based on your most recent posts.

[buldermar]

I'm still uncertain about the bac/Fate slot.

[SE-Asians]

What if Nacho and I happen to have day talk and be a scum faction of our own and this is all just staged to deceive and manipulate town?

It is unlikely happen. When Nacho told about the plan, you prefer had a discussion about read rather than the plan. Other side, you told your plan when Nacho wasn't around. Slash this scenario please.

What if Majiffy gave us all the same role just to troll us?

I already claimed my night.

Why? If he had already found flaws in his own plan (we're assuming Nacho is scum, I remind you), he could easily find flaws in your plan too. It's not like the two plans aren't similar.

The flaw of Nacho's plan is when the scums claim as cop. When you know this, this is safe play. The flaw of Buldermar's plan is when the there is only 1 town PR or no town PR. This is totally random.

Now you know it.

Of course he proposed the plan to gain cred.

According to the fact, when someone try to gain towncreed with something (Like take out from RVS) there is no guarantee it is going to gain a towncreed. Town aren't that stupid to not realize this. And it was D1.

@Rem : Why need both of us online?

About other reads, please wait, even though I already have my personal read.

[Remembrance]

^ Wanted to question you. Need you to be on at the same time to do so since the questions are time sensitive.

[buldermar]

Can't you question me instead? I'm on and love questions :O

[Remembrance]

Well, okay.

What do you think of Mantisdreams? At this point, I see most people as town. She is lurking a bit, like Mollie warned, but Mollie won't lynch Mantis. Because she refuses to invest in earmuffs and mittens for the cold outside world.

[buldermar]

Okay here now and gogogo

[buldermar]

I think he's posting less content than he usually does as town. That's my quantitative analysis.

[buldermar]

Now for the qualitative one...

[buldermar]

i dunno, maybe SE-Asian is an ok bet, since everyone will be wondering about the VT claim.
he's always the day 1 lynch though.

This looks like fence-sitting.

[buldermar]

What's townish about I am Innocent?

well he's actually one of the ones that is not too townish to me.
but ... he hasn't really done anything overly scummy. just that others seem more town. ie - you, mollie, bork, bulder, HD

rememberance seems ok. and i was thinking as well, that lncolm looked more frustrated.

This looks okay - the reads suggests that he has actually been following the game. At least it's well in accordance with general consensus.

[Remembrance]

Additional question, when you're done answering that one. I asked a fairly difficult question to Bork, about his reads on Kuror, Bacde, and Nacho. He responded in two minutes, it takes me about 4 to make up stuff as scum. Does this affect your position on Bork in anyway?

[buldermar]

Let me find it.

[buldermar]

Bacde was town so fate is town. Fate's null by himself.

Doesn't matter what Nacho's alignment is, I have a feeling he'd make that post about Kuror as either one.

If you mean this response to 1156 I think it's fairly town, but I already liked bork for town so I didn't particularly look into this previously.

[buldermar]

Also I think you're wrong about the 4 minute thing - I think it very much depends on play style and player.

[buldermar]

I g2g again unfortunately but lets do this some other time - I also want to pose some time-sensitive questions.

[Remembrance]

Fair. I've never really run into scum that don't delay or have difficulty responding when tied into knots. But we'll see. Plenty of cop investigations and the like, will slowly confirm people.

@Pedit: k.

[Mantisdreamz]

I think he's posting less content than he usually does as town. That's my quantitative analysis.

she.

i've been out of town since yesterday and until wednesday or so. (with mollie!)

i'm tempted to vote for nacho. but someone made a point that we probably shouldn't lynch, or think about lynching a claimed night 1 PR.