The real folk blues [Canceled]

[MathBlade]

Going to be reading as I can on Sunday. Hi all <3 Going to try to post as I can.

@rb -- Oh stop it. You didn't say the same thing in Gistou and that had more walls than a 20 story house. And you sure as hell didn't tell anyone to stop there. Especially me when you were town before you became a Wulden.

[MathBlade]

I don't need the TLDR I am going to read Sunday morning. Go to D&D then Read Sunday.

The question is why do you think I'd ever do a naked vote on someone without reading?

[MathBlade]

Oh and yes I'm a little bitchy today. Deal.

[MathBlade]

Unvote

In case prior slot's vote was somewhere.

[MathBlade]

I don't need the TLDR I am going to read Sunday morning. Go to D&D then Read Sunday.

The question is why do you think I'd ever do a naked vote on someone without reading?

Tell me all about your D&D Math! Edition? What race/class are you playing? What campaign are you in?

-Cerb

Ranger/Rogue/Fighter hybrid level 7

She's a former noble dualwielding crossbow maiden and dual swords...AKA lots of damage glass cannon.

Edition Pi (custom by our DM) in a custom setting.

[MathBlade]

Oh and Half Elf

[MathBlade]

Forgot to mention
Don't and the day before I use my dayvig

@Kraska (I'm probably sure I'll see this in the thread)

Why did you claim Dayvig?

[MathBlade]

I don't need the TLDR I am going to read Sunday morning. Go to D&D then Read Sunday.

The question is why do you think I'd ever do a naked vote on someone without reading?

That was @RB

I'll see if that jives when I read Sunday.

[MathBlade]

Lol, got it. Sounds fun. Martials>casters, just more fun to figure out how ro make your character interesting since innately you sorta aren't. .::p

No...All are equal. If you are limited in your ability to make a character interesting then you need to come to California and I show you how to roleplay.

I am definitely interesting and so is Kyrsti.

Are you trying to tick me off?

[MathBlade]

Forgot to mention
Don't and the day before I use my dayvig

@Kraska (I'm probably sure I'll see this in the thread)

Why did you claim Dayvig?

we have 5 dayvig's :^)

and yes i am kraska's official representative

WTF no....I do not believe Frozen Angel would put that in the setup.

So RB claims troll. Unsure if it's troll scum or just troll.

[MathBlade]

Going to be reading as I can on Sunday. Hi all <3 Going to try to post as I can.

@rb -- Oh stop it. You didn't say the same thing in Gistou and that had more walls than a 20 story house. And you sure as hell didn't tell anyone to stop there. Especially me when you were town before you became a Wulden.

Yes I've learned the error of my ways.

NEVER EVER limit communication from anyone.

If it is a scumread they will inevitably give more clues. If it's a townread you are stopping them from gamesolving. Just no.

[MathBlade]

Well...That makes crumbing a hell of a lot easier <3

Yes I'm a bitch <3

[MathBlade]

Okay I'm going to go to bed now before this thread turns into more unreadable spam.

Good night all.

[MathBlade]

VOTE: Vifam

Still reading the thread but something struck me as fishy will post more late tonight.

[MathBlade]

Why are you asking me to do a naked vote while I am still reading?

[MathBlade]

Not naked just where there is scumz

Horribad. It would be naked for me as I haven't finished reading the thread yet.

[MathBlade]

rb you gotta stop shitposting man

Not if you and rb are scums together. RB is acting weird and that feels off. And my gut.

[MathBlade]

AFK for D&D the rest of today.

[MathBlade]

Just got home will catch up after dinner.

[MathBlade]

VOTE: Vifam

Still reading the thread but something struck me as fishy will post more late tonight.

Why are you asking me to do a naked vote while I am still reading?

Lol@this

rb: where on the scumz on that wagon

It is simple. Still reading the main thread but Vifam had a simple request for reads from the PT we share with (x number of others) were not followed up on and instead he buddied me saying that a suggested scumread could be scum. I glared at him in the PT and still no reads. I am still catching up but to have no reads at this point IMHO is ludicrous.

[MathBlade]

ari, how you feeling wrt reads.

drixx, math, im still pointing you guys out.

kraska, ds, maker, rb do you have relevant things to say?

cerbrus, abr, davesaz fuggin do something sometim, kthnx


kts, vifam, appreciate the entertainment i do but lets get together

I said I was VLA on sunday and I am on my lunch break right now. I have a life. Will do my best to post but generally late weeknight evenings are the best time to catch me.

[MathBlade]

I wanted you to say something bro

:<

It was a gentle pressure. You can stay. Youve claimed and made your slot a target. Its unfair to place out.

Unfair no. Incredibly antitown and something Drixx would do yes.

[MathBlade]

I am sorry. That was inappropriate and uncalled for.

[MathBlade]

I made a judgment call that was rude incorrect and just blah. No excuse for it.

[MathBlade]

Drixx I am sorry that I did that.

[MathBlade]

Maybe it is a phone thing mine doesn't get them sometimes either.

A PT would be communication other players cannot see.

I did not mean to imply what I did. I have no problems with you as a person and I should think before I speak. If you wish to think I am horrible for now then please do as I wish to not clutter the game with toxic things. I am also open to addressing it with you post game. I just should have thought before I typed.

[MathBlade]

I am sorry. That was inappropriate and uncalled for.

You clearly got some problem with me. How about you get the mod to make a PT and we can hash it out so it doesn't play out in the game thread, yeah?

And for your information, because I know you weren't in the only game I've ever actually replaced out of, I only replaced out of that game because I had back to back deaths in the close family and if you manage to find it you'll see I went super dark on site for awhile while I dealt with it.

So calling me antitown and implying that I'm an asshole who replaces out when the only time I've done so was because of deaths in the family ... goes beyond "uncalled for" and into "I'm a terrible fucking person" territory, imo. Whatever problem you have with me, you can either forget it or do as I suggested. You come after me personally again and shit is gonna get ugly. That's a promise.

That implied my post not yours.

[MathBlade]

VOTE: Kraska77

At work will post more later there be reasons.

@Expedience you had a question why I did what I did. Because I let out as little as I could while explaining my read.

[MathBlade]

Yo math of the bebop neighbor crew how about you explain wtf about yesterday and if vi claimed pr which then got him killed

I have a theory as to why Vifam was killed. Will post more later when I have time.

[MathBlade]

I think it is Kraska Rach SpyreX and Kraska are all some kind of nefarious entity.

[MathBlade]

Mirhawk*

[MathBlade]

Their strongarming a mislynch so quickly
Plus I never really got townvibes from them

Then why would you vote them over me?

Cause that lynch was me man

VOTE: Kraska77

At work will post more later there be reasons.

@Expedience you had a question why I did what I did. Because I let out as little as I could while explaining my read.

Yo math of the bebop neighbor crew how about you explain wtf about yesterday and if vi claimed pr which then got him killed

I have a theory as to why Vifam was killed. Will post more later when I have time.

I'm kind of interested in hearing more about this

Just got home. The short version is Vifam said something in the PT. Something I could verify. Vifam ends up dead means scum didn't want that something to come out. Vifam's scumread in the PT was Kraska. Therefore Kraska is very likely scum.

[MathBlade]

VOTE: Mirhawk

I think it is Kraska Rach SpyreX and Kraska are all some kind of nefarious entity.

Mirhawk*

Is this related to that theory you were talking about before?

Dripping goofball no idea but the rest yes.

[MathBlade]

Their strongarming a mislynch so quickly
Plus I never really got townvibes from them

Then why would you vote them over me?

Cause that lynch was me man

VOTE: Kraska77

At work will post more later there be reasons.

@Expedience you had a question why I did what I did. Because I let out as little as I could while explaining my read.

Yo math of the bebop neighbor crew how about you explain wtf about yesterday and if vi claimed pr which then got him killed

I have a theory as to why Vifam was killed. Will post more later when I have time.

I'm kind of interested in hearing more about this

Just got home. The short version is Vifam said something in the PT. Something I could verify. Vifam ends up dead means scum didn't want that something to come out. Vifam's scumread in the PT was Kraska. Therefore Kraska is very likely scum.

So you have a scum informant in your PT then?

That is my theory yes.

[MathBlade]

Speculating the reasons for a nightkill is rarely valid unless they have some decent reads, or are leading the town. Night actions are rarely reasons to kill. So, I'll let you have your charade, while I do actual scumhunting.

Reasons for the night kill is one of the biggest things towards scum hunting there is. Reads are another. Both put together is scumhunting. If you were in the PT you'd know why my suspicion is very much valid. You can accuse me of not scum hunting but I assure you it makes a fuck ton of sense. I always do NK analysis. It's a great way to catch scum especially when they plan a mislynch on someone but that someone on the scum team is stupid because of NK reasons. NK analysis narrows a pool significantly.

[MathBlade]

math your case is ass.

if theres scun in yiur hood you need to catch them.
if kraska i scum you need to make a case that isnt logical leaps.

you arent conftown. your case needs to be better than ass

....I cannot say more without outing more that is in my PT than I should. This is my case I can share without being antitown. Calling me names does nothing to show you hunting me. I strongly believe Kraska is scum. My case is not ass and I'm thoroughly aware I'm not conf town. I'm not trying to be conf town I'm explaining my case and seeing what people thing about it. It is not a logical leap to see what is in the PT to Kraska is very likely scum.

[MathBlade]

If they were drunk enough to I'm gonna gunsmith kraska thats not a huge leap. I mean wifom wifom blah blah but why f around.

I said Vifam said SOMETHING. and that Kraska was their top scumread. I did not publically say Vifam said that they were gonna gunsmith Kraska. Thanks for scumclaiming.

VOTE: Spyrex

I needs more votes please. And SpyreX is not in my PT.

[MathBlade]

Fyi you're gonna have to out that at some point sooner than later but not for a day or two

Pedit are you drunk or what

Not drunk. Completely serious. Explain how you knew Vifam said they'd gunsmith Kraska when I didn't say it in the thread.

[MathBlade]

Verifying that Vifam did state his intention to check Kraska for a gun in the PT.

Pedit:

VOTE: Mirhawk

Why the fuck did you out that when I was clearly reaction testing?

I still think both are scums.

[MathBlade]

Vifam says they'd gunsmith Kraska. Kraska dies. Ergo Kraska likely scum. That is very rational.

Reaction testing to try to find out who knew that information when they shouldn't is rational.

Mirhawk trying to stop that reaction test is infuriatingly scummy.

[MathBlade]

VOTE: kraska77

I'm down for that too.

[MathBlade]

I started it and then pressured people. Make no mistake about it. ABR may be first in vote order but I started this wagon. Look at the first post of the day.

[MathBlade]

my first post*

Pedit

[MathBlade]

Because SpyreX is misrepping the situation I care.

[MathBlade]

Town:

MathBlade/Space Dandy/SirCakez/

SpyreX

/Drixx/Aristophanes/Vifam/rb/Expedience/pisskop/Road Kamelot/Killthestory/Cerberus v666/The Ascended Masters/Albert B. Rampage/Nero Cain

Bullets:

grapes/randomidget/DrippingGoofball/DiamondSentinel/Panzerjager/Klingoncelt/

kraska77

Rope:

Maker_of_Zanos/

Mirhawk

/davesaz/Vedith

Rope2:

Skrub/mhsmith0/Nosferatu/

RachMarie

/PeregrineV

FYI grapes got killed as a Miller with 4 posts all game. Might want to look at their reads. Generally a miller sticks around because they could be mislynched or made to look suspicious. Grapes being killed is hella weird.

Three out of four likely scum ain't bad.

[MathBlade]

Emphasis mine

[MathBlade]

He was shot by vig

Math, how many people are in your neighborhood?

Between 1 and 100.

[MathBlade]

Mirhawk how many in the neighborhood bonus points you get to spite math

The question was answered. Just not precisely. You should be scumhunting but you can't.

[MathBlade]

Whenever you want to 1v1 I'm down. If not for this logically making sense even having a similar read would make me need a shower.

Down for it too but Kraska first because they are the more obvious scum. The rest is dominoes.

[MathBlade]

Because I'm also accounting for MathBlade is an idiot case.

If I die someone else can take up the mantle.

You may not have seen the games I have played but on other sites it catches scum very quickly. So you hate it doesn't mean

I

am not going to do it.

[MathBlade]

Speculating the reasons for a nightkill is rarely valid unless they have some decent reads, or are leading the town. Night actions are rarely reasons to kill. So, I'll let you have your charade, while I do actual scumhunting.

Reasons for the night kill is one of the biggest things towards scum hunting there is. Reads are another. Both put together is scumhunting. If you were in the PT you'd know why my suspicion is very much valid. You can accuse me of not scum hunting but I assure you it makes a fuck ton of sense. I always do NK analysis. It's a great way to catch scum especially when they plan a mislynch on someone but that someone on the scum team is stupid because of NK reasons. NK analysis narrows a pool significantly.

Verifying that Vifam did state his intention to check Kraska for a gun in the PT.

Pedit:

VOTE: Mirhawk

Why the fuck did you out that when I was clearly reaction testing?

I still think both are scums.

Wait. Why on Earth are you voting Mirhawk when you supposedly have this 99% guilty NK analysis on kraska...

Pressure investigation and scumhunting thse are things.

[MathBlade]

And vig you can shoot me tonight.
In fact you dont need to even lynch math when im town. Just quote this and ignore him for the rest of the game.

If you are going to insult my play at least don't be so lazy as to use the wrong pronoun. Them. My pronoun is they.

[MathBlade]

Speculating the reasons for a nightkill is rarely valid unless they have some decent reads, or are leading the town. Night actions are rarely reasons to kill. So, I'll let you have your charade, while I do actual scumhunting.

Reasons for the night kill is one of the biggest things towards scum hunting there is. Reads are another. Both put together is scumhunting. If you were in the PT you'd know why my suspicion is very much valid. You can accuse me of not scum hunting but I assure you it makes a fuck ton of sense. I always do NK analysis. It's a great way to catch scum especially when they plan a mislynch on someone but that someone on the scum team is stupid because of NK reasons. NK analysis narrows a pool significantly.

Verifying that Vifam did state his intention to check Kraska for a gun in the PT.

Pedit:

VOTE: Mirhawk

Why the fuck did you out that when I was clearly reaction testing?

I still think both are scums.

Wait. Why on Earth are you voting Mirhawk when you supposedly have this 99% guilty NK analysis on kraska...

Pressure investigation and scumhunting thse are things.

And now you make even less sense.

"Anyone who seeks to lynch someone else when having supposedly found a scum is likely scum themselves, and the first target is likely scum as a result."
-Paraphrased from the wiki

And I hate site meta and eat it for breakfast as both alignments. Site meta isn't something I follow. Why someone does something is. If it aligns with the wiki, fine. If it doesn't I don't give two shits about it. (Unless it's rules on how roles work then site meta is horribly important.)

[MathBlade]

Hell you fucking know this DiamondSentinel you were scum with me in Shadowrun Mafia where site meta said to do things that made it to where we won. (Granted that game had other flaws but still.) You know I hate site meta. To bring up site meta as a reason to discredit me is ridiculous.

[MathBlade]

MathBlade, do you want to know the beauty of that episode?



Nobody except you cares.

Now either get back to the game or go bitch about it on Tumblr. Don't bitch about it on here.

Pardon my french and boyish attitude.

PEdit: OH BOY! OH BOY! THIS IS GONNA BE A FUN DAY, I CAN ALREADY TELL! CONSIDER THIS WAR DECLARED ON YOU!

I don't use tumblr. I am playing game and scumhunting. You don't like my methods deal with it. My vote wasn't to see the reaction from Mirhawk. I will continue to use my methods and if you don't like it I don't care. I'll display my reads til the cows come home.

I'm not being a bully. I'm displaying a case. If someone has a better case they can bring their case and duke it out. Otherwise we should lynch Kraska.

[MathBlade]

Yep I'm with you ds. That's why even 1:1 i just want him silenced

You want me silenced even though you agree with my Kraska logic?

Even when you can't be bothered with little details such as my pronoun correct after telling you.

Who gives a goddamn flip if I use a playstyle you can't understand if I"m right? The jist of the matter is I'm very likely right on Kraska.

[MathBlade]

Now I'm going to bed.

I DO. Imagine if every day of your life everyone called you the wrong pronoun and treated you in the wrong way? If you have that happen to you then you can tell me about not giving two shits. I CARE. The pronoun field is there for a reason.

My methods are fine and need tweaking occasionally. Using my methods I caught HOUSE and CHUCK in another game til Titus came in and ripped it apart. It isn't the methods you should attack it is the result. Does a to b make sense? If you disagree then don't agree wtih my read. All you're doing is shitposting.

[MathBlade]

All PGO claims should be done at the start of the game. He just said he couldn't be vigged. If he is a paranoid gun owner it is certainly not protown.

Two -- Vifam was not an established PR in game only in our thread not public one.

Three -- Why would you turn on your PGO after claiming you couldn't be vigged? If truth telling scum wouldn't be dumb enough to visit you and you would only be hit by investigatives.

[MathBlade]

Sorry Kraska I should have used she.

@mod can you please correct this in post 2048

[MathBlade]

Going to work now.

[MathBlade]

Lots of posts will catch up late tonight.

[MathBlade]

Too many posts to catch up on tonight. Work ran super late. Will try to post as I can tomorrow.

[MathBlade]

Still AFK today til late sorry. Work stuff.

[MathBlade]

Consider me VLA a day early. The internet issues while I am in California could cause work issues at any point. Today is rough.

Google Dyn hack if you need more info.

[MathBlade]

I cannot say if I am affected or not but I work in IT as a computer programmer. So do the math.

Math sorry :/ Please consider me VLA

@Mod

[MathBlade]

Internet stuff is all good for my job. Don't have time to read all this.

Mhsmith0's last post looks townie.

V/LA til Monday and am always a lesser poster on the Weekends but I always try.

[MathBlade]

I do not buy Kraska's claim. In a hurry best I can do time wise.

[MathBlade]

Nero Cain likely scum with Kraska.

People shit claim at start of game all the time.

There is no way a mason PGO exists so Nero or Kraska is a liar people. Or both which is what I think.

[MathBlade]

I think Nero is the most town player right now

And I'm willing to keep kraska around because it's testable and it also allows us to test people into it.

....Except she is two shot which implies control over it. Which means limited paranoia which is ridiculous and if it is true then if she is scum then she doesn't have to turn it on. Which just wastes a ton of PRs that direction at night. Because we sure as hell aren't announcing in this thread who would visit Kraska.

The entire idea of throwing people at Kraska is terribad.

[MathBlade]

Nero Cain likely scum with Kraska.

People shit claim at start of game all the time.

There is no way a mason PGO exists so Nero or Kraska is a liar people. Or both which is what I think.

Math, how many games have you played with Nero?

I remember one and it was a replace in to a scum slot (Gunslingers). Did the same sort of shit.

[MathBlade]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=67961

There is the link if anyone cares to read it. Won't make people hunt.

[MathBlade]

He is saying I am a brilliant scum mastermind who pretty much when I look obv town I am scum. I am obvtown so ABR is trying to say the meta is similar.

However ABR can't read me for shit and figured it out much too late in Shadowrun Mafia and is salty.

It is the biggest backhanded compliment and an excuse to policy lynch.

At some points the scum PT reached half the main thread because I had to keep all the stories straight. It was hell. I do not want to play Shadowrun Mafia ever again. I hated that game.

[MathBlade]

I have only two true "losses" as scum where I fucked up. The other I got killed at night by strongman scum as infinitely bulletproof.

The other was a boned slot on replace in.

I have a greater than 50% winrate as scum.

[MathBlade]

I know what ABR was hinting at and I would rather have it all open so that way if ABR wants to insinuate something he has to put on his big boy pants and write sentences. Til then he is looking for a policy lynch.

[MathBlade]

I have only two true "losses" as scum where I fucked up. The other I got killed at night by strongman scum as infinitely bulletproof.

The other was a boned slot on replace in.

I have a greater than 50% winrate as scum.

Most people do on-site.

Good comedy. Most people can't. Not possible.

[MathBlade]

That makes you good scum.

[MathBlade]

I hate site meta. I suck as town. Completely suck.

The site meta of scum having an advantage is an excuse for bad play. Scum have to hide that they have knowledge. That is the biggest thing to fake as scum. And the more moving parts the easier it is to slip.

[MathBlade]

I have to go but please look at the people I scumread.

[MathBlade]

Still don't trust Kraska.

[MathBlade]

Still don't trust Kraska.

That's fine. We'll have to lynch her eventually as nobody will target a claimed PGO amirite. That doesn't mean now is the time for it either.

This just lets likely scum off the lynch wagon. Didn't claim PGO day one like they are supposed to.
And now they could just kill someone and no one would be the wiser because no PR would visit them with the PR claim.

So tell me? Just how long are we supposed to let nigh on close to confirmed scum not be voted?

[MathBlade]

she is supposed to*
And now she could*

[MathBlade]

Still don't trust Kraska.

That's fine. We'll have to lynch her eventually as nobody will target a claimed PGO amirite. That doesn't mean now is the time for it either.

This just lets likely scum off the lynch wagon. Didn't claim PGO day one like she is supposed to.
And now she could just kill someone and no one would be the wiser because no PR would visit them with the PGO claim.

So tell me? Just how long are we supposed to let nigh on close to confirmed scum not be voted?

Still haven't heard a good answer to this.

[MathBlade]

Not joining a lynch Mirhawk and Kraska are on.

We should be lynching Kraska.

[MathBlade]

If scum would bus they would have bussed Kraska. This is likely not a bus. Just a hunch.

We should do it because Kraska is nigh on conf scum claiming PGO to get out of a lynch.
I had Karnos claim Neoplitan in 1800 and people didn't lynch the cop.

PGO is something you claim day one. She didn't.

[MathBlade]

Let's say it is from a place where all good hunches start.

[MathBlade]

....Driving home.

Any lynch besides Kraska is ridiculous.

[MathBlade]

I think it is Kraska Rach SpyreX and Kraska are all some kind of nefarious entity.

1)Kraska because of what I said earlier and common sense.
2) Rach called SpyreX a top read then doesn't interact with SpyreX the way a top read should.
3) There is scum in our hood and Mirhawk keeps insisting it is not the case and posting terribad bullshit in there.
4) SypreX hard defended Kraska and Mirhawk ruined my reaction test because Mirhawk likely knew something was up.

5) Add ABR too because ABR actually provided a reason for a scumread which he never did as town in almost all of Shadowrun Mafia.

@Nero

Slight possibility of Nero fake claim being scum with Kraska.

[MathBlade]

There is no way that Skrub is a bus with all this people scum.

[MathBlade]

....Driving home.

Any lynch besides Kraska is ridiculous.

You are ridiculous.

Anyone proposing a kraska lynch based on the BS from earlier today is ridiculous.

Not BS. People calling something BS doesn't make it BS.

Kraska claiming PGO d2 to get out of a lynch is horrible. Kraska is just scum.

[MathBlade]

not lynching kraska here makes sense to me

I will be crying at the town stupidity at my funeral.

[MathBlade]

Vca with just d1 isn't cool just close your eyes and dive in

It catches more scum than you realize.

[MathBlade]

Now I am playing Civ 6. Y'all can keep doing town stupidity dance and I will hold a neon sign towards "Scum here lynch it"

Y'all wanna claim you can't read be my guest. I will keep hunting and tracking the scums while y'all decide to not do the right thing.

[MathBlade]

Panzer and davesaz: you guys agree with

3) There is scum in our hood and Mirhawk keeps insisting it is not the case and posting terribad bullshit in there.

?

Neither of you have seemed interested in pushing Mirhawk in thread so I'm curious if you agree with math's take here, or if you think they're just wrong, or if you think they're bullshitting.

I've already talked about this, but I believe the Kraska claim(or at least I'm willing to test it), so as a result of that, I do not currently believe that there is a scum in the neighborhood. I think this varsoon counterwagon is scummy as hell because I believe it's beating a dead horse.

Math's argument against Kraska is basically that she was scummy d1 and played her claimed role wrong therefore she is scum -> which makes Mirhawk her buddy who gave her the inside info. My counterargument is sometimes people play bad, man. I play bad all the time because I am bad. So if Kraska is bad town then Mirhawk probably isn't scum cause the most damning thing is gone.

I'm in on Skrub, Varsoon,or Exp for now. If something convincing comes up, I can be coerced into going a different direction. I 100% will not be on (another) Mirhawk wagon today.

1) They
2) One key element is missing from the above that is damning but if I share it Y happens and Y is bad.
3) Just stawp. Mirhawk's post in the hood said Mirhawk was faking caring about the game.
4) Of the reads Mirhawk did give after being poked do not make sense.
5) People play bad yes. However as soon as Vifam died the first post out of Kraska's mouth should have been "I am PGO. I killed Vifam." Then I would believe bad d1 play but to only claim it under hella pressure is fake as shit.

[MathBlade]

noone asked me shit. all i got was math saying im scum like a broken record
u can stop inventing shit now

pedit: @pisskop

Probably just a little salty that

1. You killed a town PR.
2. Having done so, you will not kill any scum.
3. Being almost certainly town due to your role, you're not providing more for us to sound board off of.

This assumes Kraska is telling the truth. Scum have this great PR called lying. They use it every game.

I ReALLY DOUBT KRASKA is a PGO

[MathBlade]

@PeregrineV Reasons

[MathBlade]

Lynch Kraska

[MathBlade]

I am not discarding the fact that Kraska could be scum. But there is practically no chance whatsoever that kraska, or ANYONE, for that matter, is a serial killer.

Wake's Role Madness had an SK @ 42 players and the SK won.

[MathBlade]

Lynch Kraska

Happy scumday FA
Skrub wagon is a counter wagon

[MathBlade]

...Everyone is lynching Skrub out of boredom when Kraska should be lynched.

[MathBlade]

...the only good person in those lists is RachMarie

The wagon has almost all my scumreads. So yes I townread Skrub

[MathBlade]

Going to work.

When I don't see anyone tomorrow was nice knowing you guys and remember to lynch Kraska and then SpyreX.

[MathBlade]

DS is misguided town. Look over my ISO. I am nothing but transparent.

[MathBlade]

@Skrub:

I recognize the irony in me saying that, but I don't intend to be a liability. You're self-voting and claim to have given up entirely. If you're town, that's not who I want on my team in LYLO. You're scumreading me, which reflects that you have poor judgment, if town, as well. You need to claim--stop spouting these appeals and claim already.

@WhoeverWasAskingAboutFlavor:

I love this show and have seen it as recently as two years ago. The drug-running guy is in the first episode and is almost certainly an antagonist. He uses a drug that he sells called 'Red Eye' to enhance his perception and allow him to get high and to fight better. The protagonists are hunting him for his bounty, and his seemingly pregnant wife comes off as sympathetic until the end of the episode, where she tries to make a break for it and is shot down, revealing that she was very likely not pregnant and instead simply smuggling the drugs in a fake belly.

As far as a poisoner flavor goes, there are SEVERAL applicable characters, especially if the movie's flavor is a part of this game.

@SirCakez:

From the 4 town deaths so far, I can only assume we're in some shit show of a multiball, and, yeah, if we just lynch the weakest links and only scum survives, we get fucked because multiball is the shittiest thing you can do to a town playerbase what the fuck no one should ever run multiball games again they're garbage--BUT, if all of the chaff is town anyway, then we would lose because we are a weak town in a setup that favors scum.

Scrub claimed VT.

We should be lynching Kraska.

[MathBlade]

If they are not in my list of scumreads I am not interested in the wagon.

[MathBlade]

....Kraska

[MathBlade]

But certain kinds of anime porn are good.

Vote Kraska

[MathBlade]

I'm never playing in a game this big again. Everybody completely gave up after day 1 and doesn't care who gets lynched at all

I didn't give up.

Everyone else did.

Vote Kraska.

[MathBlade]

Read my ISO.

Kraska killed Vifam because Kraska is Mafia. Mafia report as having guns regardless of how the mafia kills. Claimed PGO to cover it up and people buy it for some silly reason.

[MathBlade]

Giving props to Frozen Angel for their awesome modding skillz. I wonder how they track it all. <3

[MathBlade]

But certain kinds of anime porn are good.

ITT we learn Math watches cartoon porn

It is more productive than this thread.

[MathBlade]

Get well soon RachMarie.

VOTE KRASKA

[MathBlade]

I get the feeling TAM is a policy lynch because I have heard talks of how good this nacho is in some of my prior games.

And Kraska should be the lynch.

[MathBlade]

And also has a lovely habit of posting elsewhere constantly.

I find that a bad way to scum hunt. Gistou was faster so I let slower games sit.
Activity is not alignment indicative unless they were already caught scum which in that case it is irrelevant. It only serves as conf bias.

[MathBlade]

Lol I disagree TAM.

DGB did the opposite in Wake and tried to VT lurk it out. Fuck appearances is both alignments but trying to explain without prompting is DGB's scum claim iMHO.

[MathBlade]

DGB played lost pretty well in Wake Mafia. As scum DGB writes paragraphs and as town DGB writes short sentences. She's been trying to adapt but not quite there in similar metas.

Vote Kraska.

[MathBlade]

Both the top two wagons suck staying on Kraska.

[MathBlade]

VLA until Monday evening

We should be voting Kraska. I disagree Panzer.

[MathBlade]

And being confident is fine; bloodlust in mafia is fun. But when you're wrong, you need to acknowledge that you were wrong, you need to find out why you were wrong, and you need to fix it in the future. You should never find yourself in a position where you don't believe the person you're pushing could ever be town in any circumstance ever because that means that for an entire day you're wasting time and effort forming a narrative that will be completely useless when your tunnel target flips town; you'll miss on scummy shit happening around you because you're tunnel-visioned, and if you never learn how to do that then you'll find people listening to you less and less and less, even if you are right occasionally.

Agreed.

There is one minor exception to that rule I keep track of.

Not sure it is smart to say it here.

[MathBlade]

I townread TAM.

[MathBlade]

In other news Rach Marie is scum like I said before. Rach Marie doesn't want to be known for being a tag on to a likely mislynch so she starts her own wagon. Rach Marie as conf town in Wake's posted cases on players in the game and how she reached her conclusions and in general reads.

Nos wagon sucks we should be lynching Kraska.

[MathBlade]

In fact Rach Marie was widely scumread why the hell would she be sheeped?

[MathBlade]

I think it is Kraska Rach SpyreX and Mirhawk are all some kind of nefarious entity.

1)Kraska because of what I said earlier and common sense.
2) Rach called SpyreX a top read then doesn't interact with SpyreX the way a top read should.
3) There is scum in our hood and Mirhawk keeps insisting it is not the case and posting terribad bullshit in there.
4) SypreX hard defended Kraska and Mirhawk ruined my reaction test because Mirhawk likely knew something was up.

5) Add ABR too because ABR actually provided a reason for a scumread which he never did as town in almost all of Shadowrun Mafia.

@Nero

Slight possibility of Nero fake claim being scum with Kraska.

Kraska SpyreX Rach (one of Mirhawk/X/Y) and ABR bada boom.

[MathBlade]

I am not insterested if it is not in those 5 and we should be lynching Kraska.

[MathBlade]

I think it is one big team. That is a fill in the blank for someone in the hood and my standard filler regardless of hood size is X and Y so it is someone from the hood likely Mirhawk

[MathBlade]

Kraska SpyreX Rach ABR and someone from the hood likely Mirhawk.

[MathBlade]

Blah the Nos wagon was so old I thought she restarted it.

I am saying because Rach Marie is pushing it and Rach Marie is a scumread Nos is likely town because of it. I replaced into a game with Nos scum so I would have a feeling I would know it when I see it. Nos is literally someone that if I am wrong on my read it will be crystal clear later and I have five scum reads. Compromising on anyone else means likely lynching town.

[MathBlade]

There was a big push to join the top two wagons but then Rach Marie who has been lurking (due to RL completely not attacking RL here) likely didn't want to be on the big wagons because hopping on a big wagon is what site meta (which I fucking hate) looks for. So pushing Nos is a safe option that looks like content rather than explaining who her town and scumreads are.

[MathBlade]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p8203064

Take a look at this from Rach Marie in Wake's 42 player Madness. She straight up said she wasn't reading things and then gave a quick clear explanation of why she voted Egg.

She also drops reads like candy.

Not here.

Rach Marie is scum.

[MathBlade]

I am asking Nacho.

I need more reads from you. I know the level of activity from you is NAI, because I have been in many games with you.

GL on that Spy Like I said in Wakes game, Math tunneled on me something fierce for a long time, even after Titus and a few others said she is a Mason.

1) Yes I was an idiot that game. But that game had more posts to catch up on than anything. A prior game's idiot does not make this game an idiot.

2) You did not address my points about how you were different and instead pointed out a game where I sucked. That is scum deflection.

3) I have provided my scum reads. There are plenty. Do I know how many scum? No. But Nacho I have said I think is town and my scumreads are all over that. Skrub was a counter to Kraska and Nos was revived by Rach Marie.

4) I have my reasons for wanting Kraska more than anyone else mainly her PGO claim.

So I will not be joining any wagon that isn't in my 5. Deal.

[MathBlade]

Course there is a problem scum won't bus and not enough people will take their mislynch options.

Vote Kraska.

[MathBlade]

The shift onto Nosferatu isn't town-driven. TAM's vote there is hypocritical and self-serving, just look at it compared to his previous reluctance to vote his rival wagon. We're starting to connect the dots, boys and girls.

First sentence is right by Rach Marie.

Rest of it is ABR trying to mislynch TAM.

[MathBlade]

Course there is a problem scum won't bus and not enough people will take their mislynch options.

Vote Kraska.

Why is Nos a mislynch?

Because RachMarie is pushing him.

[MathBlade]

@Rach marie Even when you had no time you dropped reads. You aren't dropping reads now and instead are spending more time pushing me because I scum read you.

I don't need to try again you are just flailing scum.

Back to work I go.

[MathBlade]

Course there is a problem scum won't bus and not enough people will take their mislynch options.

Vote Kraska.

why the fuck do you keep pushing that shitty wagon that you continue to perform logical gymnastics to justify?

Nosferatu's ISO is pretty scummy. Stop making wagon speed arguments guys, they'll never be valid.

how is my iso scummy?

Why do you push something so straight forward as logical gymnastics?

[MathBlade]

Both you and Rach Marie asked me why when it is painfully obvious why and that Kraska made up shit not to be lynched.

[MathBlade]

yeah you claimed a bullshit role with absolutely no flavor and just 'VT'

It wasn't a serious claim btw, it was an inside joke with nc from that time

Expedience hasn't claimed jack

[MathBlade]

Math, even if Kraska is scum there are still 9 other scum in this game. I think your single minded tunnel on her is pretty bad regardless of alignment.

You'd think right? But it is actually pretty townie.

[MathBlade]

How do you come up with that number Nero?

Still waiting on a response from Nacho on my other questions. He is a lot better at math than I am and I am trying to figure out how many scum we are likely to have in this game, it helps me sort out reads. Also if this game is multiball or not, helps me sort things out. And by that I mean two mafia teams instead of one, Nero I know you think an SK is enough to make it multiball instead of a single maf team and a 3rd party.

Spy feel free to add in here as well, you are my top town read, and I know you have played in a ton more games than I have. And most likely are also better at math than I am. I suck at statistics ended up dropping out of the class 3 times.

Welcome to scum claim this is.

You are still trying to sort me yet you didn't even bother to ask me a mathematically based setup question.

Look at my name.

MathBlade.

Math.

One might think I'd be good at it. But you aren't interested in hunting me only silencing me.

[MathBlade]

its like you just keep posting things but don't know what they mean.

Its a 32 player and I believe in all my heart that KTS slipped that it was MB. 10 scum would make this a 10/22 (or 10/1/21 if we have SK) setup which seems more than reasonable. Assuming that yes this is MB then 5/5 makes sense as scum numbers. Also Math seems fixated on there being 5 scum and it looks like hunting the other team. And Nacho's kill list is exactly 10 players long.

My list is based upon my top 5. I don't ever vote a scumread under my top 5 regardless of size of the game.

[MathBlade]

Methblade do something before we mislynch Nos instead of trolling lol

Trolling implies I am doing something for the lols.

Notice how my scumreads poke me as to why instead of using the common senses.

@DiamondSentinel

Reads wise I struggle sometimes.
However I am pretty good at setup spec. I called a town vig in Wake's and everyone called me nuts. Had wrong player read for it but still.

And that was a specific critique of Rach Marie who knows I am damn good at setup spec.
Call me an idiot on reads fine.
But with setup spec I am damn fine thank you very much.

@ABR nah Serves me so far. Don't see a reason why I would join a wagon pushed by a scumread when I am asked by a scumread.

[MathBlade]

baiting rach for math puzzles counts as trolling

I am not baiting her for them.
I am saying because of who she asked she is scumclaiming.
She says she is trying to figure out why I am on Kraska yet she doesn't try to ask me a setup spec question involving math.
I am not asking her to ask me now. I am saying she is not interested in sorting me.

[MathBlade]

Nope. By making that list I give out who is not in the hood which narrows scums kills. Not doing it. Be annoyed all you like but none of the arguments are better than lynching Kraska. Of which I presented straightforward logic for and people just called it "bullshit" and went on looking for someone else to lynch.

[MathBlade]

The Nope is for the list of 10.

I do not lynch anyone that is not in my top 5 scumreads. If y'all don't want to lynch in my top 5 or make an argument that causes my top 5 to change I don't see a reason to move my vote.

[MathBlade]

Man i am soo tired of mathblade.

10 nontown total would be decent. A 10 person scumteam even if town is stacked definitely wouldn't fly back in ye old reviewer days.

It really depends on how some of the mechanics shake out. I could see 5 5 1 or 7-8 1

Of course you are tired of me repeating the scum team over and over and having to keep pushing other people.

[MathBlade]

Parts of the*

[MathBlade]

@Nosferatu Can you please change your avatar? It hurts my eyes to have a Gif that fast when I am reading.

[MathBlade]

The Nope is for the list of 10.

I do not lynch anyone that is not in my top 5 scumreads.

If y'all don't want to lynch in my top 5 or make an argument that causes my top 5 to change I don't see a reason to move my vote.

You realize this is anti-town, right?

I think it is anti town to not lynch in your top scumreads when there is a shit ton of time left.
You want me to vote your wagon you have to convince me.
That is how Mafia works.

[MathBlade]

I like his Deku gif

Liking is immaterial when it gives me a headache whenever I read the thread. I have eye issues and I can barely stand Nero's. It is also why I hate neon colors being used.

[MathBlade]

Vifam ; Jet Black ; Gunsmith With Bebop Access aligned with bounty hunters got killed by biological warfare and explosives during Night 1.

That says biological warfare and explosives.

Even if you consider that poison

Spoiler: Poisoner from MS Wiki

Poisoner
Alias: none
Alignment:
Anti-town
Role type:
Killing
Misleading
Choice:
Night
A Poisoner can target a player to kill them. However, this kill will take place at the end of the next Night. Thus, the poisoned player can get one more Day and Night of actions out. The advantage to this is that a kill via poison cannot be stopped, except by the fairly rare Poison Doctor.
Poisoner has been seen as a substitute for Vigilante; however, Poisoner is much more commonly an anti-Town role who uses the poison as their implementation of the factional kill.
Variations

Exactly when the poison kills a player is not standardized. Some moderators will cause the poison to take effect at the end of the next Day, and some moderators will cause the poison to take effect a few posts into the next Day. The power of the Poisoner will vary nontrivially based on which time of death is chosen - the longer the wait, the more actions the poisoned players can perform.
Some moderators allow ordinary Doctors to stop poison kills; however, this usually makes the poison-based kill almost strictly inferior to simply killing the victim outright.
Use and Power

Poisoner provides an interesting trade-off between bypassing the potential for a player to be protected at Night and allowing the victim to perform more actions before dying. It's used in setups when this may become a factor, or simply for spice. It is strictly inferior to Strongman.

It can either be delayed or it can be simply flavor or for spice.

Considering Kraska claimed PGO and Vifam visited Kraska last night if poison was delayed it would not be delayed. Kraska is just scum.

And I am listening. And I assure you I am tunneling with merit. I just see no good arguments for the current wagons and they are pushed by my scumreads. Furthermore Kraska is nigh on close to conf scum. You wanna provide a good argument instead of just attacking me for not sheeping?

[MathBlade]

If poison was delayed Vifam would be alive.

Therefore Vifam was not killed by poison or poison is not delayed*

[MathBlade]

@Nosferatu Once more without the neon please.

[MathBlade]

@nos can you make it flaming skulls being juggled by a robot

Can you not be mean about eye issues? I don't care about the substance I just want to be able to read the thread. I am pretty sure you are scum but you don't have to be a dick.

[MathBlade]

If poison was delayed Vifam would be alive.

Therefore Vifam was not killed by poison or poison is not delayed*

I go for the former. As far as I can tell, Drixx said that it was a poison, not an explosive. Now, this is dangerously close to the same setup spec I got into trouble with in Cyberpunk, but still, I'm willing to bet that the poison is delayed, and Vifam wasn't killed by it.

Then the proper play is Vifam was killed for saying they'd investigate Kraska.
It is simple.
If Vifam's kill wasn't delayed and they know they'd show up as guilty they claimed PGO in response to the first hint of a tunnel. Town PGOs claim immediately. Read the Wiki.

[MathBlade]

@nos can you make it flaming skulls being juggled by a robot

Can you not be mean about eye issues? I don't care about the substance I just want to be able to read the thread. I am pretty sure you are scum but you don't have to be a dick.

That was a joke.

Oh. I hate that joke then.

[MathBlade]

Go back and look at the posts where people dropped their votes on him and it becomes clear as day.

I saw people vote Nosferatu. Show me why they are obvious scum.

Its not rocket science. One second he had no votes and nobody cared about him. The next second someone said "nos hasn't done anything so lets lynch him!" and then a shit ton of people popped out of the wood work to drop a vote and disappear. Its mislynch 101

*nods*

Remember it was revived but Rach Marie.

[MathBlade]

Orrrr once again I've been looking for something that wasn't the awful two wagons to get people behind and yea that's gonna be a lurker in this day 2 shitstorm jesus

You could bus your buddy Kraska.

[MathBlade]

Again if you pile of dull tacks actually think this is deep scum.machinations I'm clearly the scum for fucks sake

I completely agree you are scum.

[MathBlade]

Nosferatu (9): mhsmith0 , The Ascended Masters , SpyreX , RachMarie , Vaxkiller , Cerberus v666 , Aristophanes , Expedience , PeregrineV

smith started the wagon.

Nacho joined it and I thought I should pay attention since I know Nacho has a habit of being a good scum hunter when town and he often buses when he is scum. Plus with the possibility of it being mb, that means he could be scum for one team and the other team be who he is scum hunting for, so regardless of how anyone is reading Nacho, it pays to pay attention to where Nacho is voting.

Spy joins in and he is my top scum read

I look at Nos's iso and see something that reminds me a lot of Mastin's game where Nos was the Cult Leader.

I vote Nos.

How is that a reviving of the wagon on Nos?

Because the top two wagons were TAM &a Skrub.
People were asking for consolidation.
You revived a wagon that if people actually cared about consolidation wouldn't exist.
But that is a bunch of horse manure.
You made it a thing.

[MathBlade]

Also nice to know Spy went from top townread to scumread. SpyreX+RachMarie even more confirmed like it is so obvious damn.

[MathBlade]

Mathblade, I'd really like you to explain how it makes sense that vifam, the gunsmith, was killed due to his investigation choice, by someone who doesn't use a gun? For bonus points, explain that connection without assuming a single scum faction has access to multiple kill flavors.

Mafia flag as having guns regardless of powers.

[MathBlade]

@FA: is that kill flavor on vifam indicative of one sort of kill, or two?

Also, would vifams gunsmith have worked on the individual with the katana/explosives/biological warfare?

It indicates one kill

and no. It would only detect gun's

She said it would only detect guns.
All Mafia have guns regardless of powers.

The Gunsmith is an information role that can target a player at Night to learn if they have a gun in flavor. Members of the Mafia (that are not Doctors), Cops, FBI Agents, Vigilantes, other Gunsmiths, Paranoid Gun Owners, etc. all have guns in traditional flavor. Notably, Serial Killers and Doctors do not have guns.

[MathBlade]

Paranoid Gun Owners Have GUNS. It is in the fucking name of the role.

[MathBlade]

I'm sorry MathBlade, but your theory on Kraska has too many holes in it. I can't support it at all.

No it does not.

PGOs based on their role have guns.
Kraska as a claimed PGO would have shown up as a guilty on it.
Kraska killed Vifam because he would be discovered.
Kraska is very likely not a PGO.

If a game does not follow the wiki then it is not normal.

[MathBlade]

God if this is Wake's game all over where games don't follow the wiki I am going to scream.

Flavors are different.

Frozen Angel answered that question how they had to as a mod.

Explosives if town aligned would not show up.
Explosives if Mafia aligned would because Mafia have guns.
PGOs based on wiki have guns.

It is bastard if PGOs don't have a gun.

[MathBlade]

Let's try asking this

@Mod would a PGO regardless of kill style have a gun?
Would all Mafia have a gun regardless of kill style?

In other words is Gunsmith wiki accurate and if not please explain what a gunsmith does

[MathBlade]

If Kraska is fake claiming PGO then yes it matters. It hella matters. I am trying to establish that Kraska was afraid of the check and that she is lying about being a PGO.

[MathBlade]

Second, a mechanical PGO DOES NOT FEAR BEING INVESTIGATED BY A GUNSMITH...because the gunsmith dies when they do so.

And also this.
I'm not sure why "PGO = gun" is a point of discussion.

All PGOs have guns. Kraska as a scum PGO who is two shot would have to turn it on. Else they would be outed.

Kraska would have shown up as having a gun because they are a scum pGO or she is lying about the PGO.

[MathBlade]

...

You're working at cross purposes here.

The mod already said the kill flavor that killed vifam would not have been detected by him.

Thus, there is no connection between his choice to investigate kraska and his death, without scum having multiple kill flavors, OR scum being really really really stupid and not asking if a gunsmith would catch them, once rhey learned one existed.

No they answered a different question.

They said explosives are not guns.

A PGO has a gun regardless of kill style.
If Kraska is a two shot scum PGO she turned it on to avoid detection.

I do not believe Kraska's claim.

[MathBlade]

I am almost nigh on certain Vifam targeted Kraska. Very very certain.

[MathBlade]

@Mod Would a PGO show up as having a gun regardless of kill flavor?

[MathBlade]

right but how about the point that she did NOT claim PGO she claimed 2 shot PGO, why would she add that it was an x shot one if she was fake claiming it?

Meaning of course after one more of the double whammy thingy she would no longer be PGO.

And if that is not a special flavor kill instead of of maf kill then that seems a bizarre twist. The reason a GS sees all maf players no matter what their role is as with a gun, is because they usually shoot to kill.

Also keep in mind there were multiple deaths. This is why I want to find out if it is mb or not, because it helps in sorting out the deaths if you know if it is one large team or two smaller teams.

Logic is the key to solving mafia games.

The two shot thing is even more ridiculous. PGOs are paranoid.

"Yes excuse me let me stop being paranoid"

And two shot really?

No. The role is all or nothing. No way a two shot PGO exists.

[MathBlade]

There is no way an experienced player like Kraska would forget to claim PGO.

She said that she can't be killed.
That would be a message to scum to not shoot her but to town PRs to come on in.

A claim I would have believed is bulletproof.

And that one shot town PGO doesn't claim.

[MathBlade]

Hell show me one even where they do. That game would probably border on ridiculous.

[MathBlade]

Even if the PGO is real I do not believe Kraska is town:

[MathBlade]

Now I have to go home and get my prescriptions. I will be on later but I swear this is probably my last game on MS for a while since they don't follow the damn wikis.

[MathBlade]

Apparently everyone agrees not to follow the damn wikis and doesn't tell me.

[MathBlade]

@Mod-
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with a Katana" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with biological warfare" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with explosives" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed by biological warfare and explosives" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "shot" if he investigated them?

The answer to first 4 questions are : no, not by defualt
the answer to fifth question is yes.

Jet Black could detect whoever has a gun.

FUCK YOU MATH HERE IS THE MOD'S SPECIFIC POST.

Just left my building kept getting interrupted.

Not the "not by default" meaning if Mafia they would have a gun.
So Kraska likely turned on the PGO because of Vifam and there is scum in the hood.

For my sanity what does "not by default mean"?@mod

[MathBlade]

Oh yeah, who's in the PT again?

People with role PMs.

[MathBlade]

General scuminess, a lack of towniness, terrible play, the general stuff.

The real question is why wouldn't I scumread them?

Because KTS is scummy as fuck when town and when they are townie as fuck they are scum.

[MathBlade]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=68153

KTS's town game

KTS why are you counting down?

[MathBlade]

Also, I'm 100% done giving anyone a pass for shit play. I did that twice for Dwlee and he was scum both times. No more.

Anyone who wants to give them a pass should read Cyberpunk mafia and GTA2 mafia.

PEdit: MathBlade, I think I missed the part where I was supposed to give a shit.

You give me games to read, I give you games to read. Until you read the 2 games I just gave you, I will not read any games that you put out here.

I skimmed. *glares*

[MathBlade]

I don't know whether to cry happy tears that someone sees the game similar to me or if that is some of the hardest core buddying I have seen in my life.

[MathBlade]

@Mod Would a PGO show up as having a gun regardless of kill flavor?

@Mod-
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with a Katana" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with biological warfare" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with explosives" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed by biological warfare and explosives" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "shot" if he investigated them?

The answer to first 4 questions are : no, not by defualt
the answer to fifth question is yes.

Jet Black could detect whoever has a gun.

FUCK YOU MATH HERE IS THE MOD'S SPECIFIC POST.

Just left my building kept getting interrupted.

Not the "not by default" meaning if Mafia they would have a gun.
So Kraska likely turned on the PGO because of Vifam and there is scum in the hood.

For my sanity what does "not by default mean"?@mod

Trying to make Frozen's life easier

[MathBlade]

Let's try asking this

@Mod would a PGO regardless of kill style have a gun?
Would all Mafia have a gun regardless of kill style?

In other words is Gunsmith wiki accurate and if not please explain what a gunsmith does

Sorry missed one

[MathBlade]

God damn it why don't roles follow the fucking wiki?!?!?!

[MathBlade]

I still don't trust Kraska but they aren't nearly as confirmed as I thought but even so are still better than any of he suggested wagons.

[MathBlade]

I said

Shutup

She* the*

[MathBlade]

I said

Shutup

Scum slip IMHO because I am PDS that Kraska wouldn't tell anyone in a public thread to shut up. Probably meant to her buddies.

[MathBlade]

God damn it why don't roles follow the fucking wiki?!?!?!

Is this a question from me or not? Please bold if you want to ask a question from me. thanks.

@Frozen angel That was more frustration than an actual question. You may answer it if you wish but that honestly would be hunting the mod about why you designed something the way you did. I think I would want to talk about this post game though as the bastard elements question should be yes if roles don't follow the wiki. Anything not normal is bastard. However that doesn't seem to be an opinion shared so I will stew and talk privately post game.

[MathBlade]

God damn it why don't roles follow the fucking wiki?!?!?!

Is this a question from me or not? Please bold if you want to ask a question from me. thanks.

@Frozen angel That was more frustration than an actual question. You may answer it if you wish but that honestly would be hunting the mod about why you designed something the way you did. I think I would want to talk about this post game though as the bastard elements question should be yes if roles don't follow the wiki. Anything not normal is bastard. However that doesn't seem to be an opinion shared so I will stew and talk privately post game.

Pedit

[MathBlade]

Shadowrun was declared bastard at launch. Huge difference.

[MathBlade]

Theme games are ones with new mechanics but still use the wiki for roles given. E.g. A cop isn't a hidden vig. The wiki is there so people know what roles do. They can be bastard if they involve cult or alignment changes etc or if roles don't follow the wiki.

[MathBlade]

Is it possible your game has any of the following: cults, mid-game alignment changes, moderator lies that cannot be reasonably anticipated (for example, Godfather, Tailor, Miller, Ninja, and mechanics like that are generally fine. Telling someone they are a reflexive doctor when they're actually a PGO is not), secret win conditions, un-divulged non-randomness in player role/alignment generation, direct moderator influence during the game? (Yes/No)

It is more that a Gunsmith doesn't get a result on a PGO is more of what I have a problem with. It drastically impacted my reads.
A gunsmith operates based on roles and now instead of being almost damn certain Kraska was lying now there is a slim albeit remote chance Kraska is town. Roles are supposed to follow the wiki so people can get reads based off that. When they don't it throws a serious monkey wrench in how things work.

[MathBlade]

Saying a player is a gunsmith but then having that role not work as per the wiki to me falls under moderator information that cannot be anticipated.

[MathBlade]

MathBlade, you've been on the forums for 3 years! How could you not have learned that theme games are not normal 90% of the time! Non-normal roles, again, fall under absolutely none of those categories. I'll even go down the list.

1. Cults-Nope
2. Moderator Lies-Absolutely not
3. Secret Win Conditions-Not even close
4. Non-Randomness-How does that even apply?
5. Direct mod influence-Nope

You're 0 for 5, kiddo.

1 for 5. A gunsmith that does not follow the wiki to me is a moderator lie.

[MathBlade]

I disagree but this is why I wanted to talk about it post game.

Theme games are not exempt from the wiki requirement. They can build their own mechanics and roles but any roles in the wiki should follow the wiki.

You are not going to convince me by yelling. Let's move on like I tried to do civilly before.

[MathBlade]

Otherwise you could make a cop a vig and then go "it's theme". It is not a reasonable thing to expect a role to not follow the wiki.

[MathBlade]

An unreasonable*

[MathBlade]

Saying a player is a gunsmith but then having that role not work as per the wiki to me falls under moderator information that cannot be anticipated.

Weak/restricted roles are pretty much casual based on the wiki itself.

This is totally anticipate-able in the same manner a godfather is anticipate-able - maybe even in a more accurate way. The game has a decent flavor involved.

The game has kill flavors and the roles might work accordingly. That's the game theme and its what you signed up for. Its not role madness nor bastard by any definitions.

Respectfully I disagree and I will leave MS after this game or only play games that follow the wiki. That is the mod ruling let's move on.

[MathBlade]

I have never replaced out of a game and I cannot in good faith ask anyone else to do so. I will just figure it out and if I have to ask more questions do so privately.