Mini 727 - Mafia in Standardville - Game Over

[PJ.]

Woohoo First!!!!

Vote:xdaamno

[PJ.]

It's cause you suck xd, like in the scumchat days =P.

[PJ.]

Wow, Charter caught me, lol.

Anyway..putting someone at 3 is not scummy. Putting someone at 5 would be a little scummy. On that note,

Unvote, Vote:BSG

[PJ.]

@Charter, Why the WIFOM? It's scummy to put someone at L-2(which is claim zone) for no reason, so why did you do knowing that it would be WIFOM. You're an experianced player, you should know better.

Unvote, FoS:Charter

@Everyone asking Artem why he didn't vote: Thats what an FoS is. A public statement expressing that you feel someone is suspicious but not sure that they are actually scum. After the random voting stage, you should only vote someone you intend to lynch.

@ Lowell, I want reasons.

@Artem I believe, why is it bad to go after easy targets? And what classifies an easy target? If I claimed scum would I be an easy target and would you vote me?

[PJ.]

/confirm

[PJ.]

From the scum's point of view, an easy target is a townie that is easy to attack because they've done scummier things than others.

So voting someone you find scummier then everyone else is scummy and attacking an easy target? Riiiiiiight. Also, if you FoS someone who is claimed scum, you clearly are a poor player. Assuming their are no Jester-esque roles, you lynch the claimed scum, period.

Panzer, why is it only scummy to put someone at L-2? You put BSG at L-3. There isn't a huge difference between the two. You're calling out charter on his vote which is very similar to your own.

There isn't much of a difference, L-2 is completely arbitrary. Charter knowing that it would start stuff, knowing that it was WIFOM, but put the 5th vote on because he knew it would bring pressure off of Artem's easy target talk. L-2 was bait, Charter snagged it. I would like for him to answer my previous question.

[PJ.]

So voting someone you find scummier then everyone else is scummy and attacking an easy target? Riiiiiiight. Also, if you FoS someone who is claimed scum, you clearly are a poor player. Assuming their are no Jester-esque roles, you lynch the claimed scum, period.

Artem, I wanted you to answer that.

@danchao: yes there are occasions where voting is okay when you don't want to see someone lynched, but a good part of the time, that's when you vote. When you wouldn't mind that person being lynched.

[PJ.]

EBWOP: Also, yes L-2 is generally claim time. Sometimes L-2 and definently L-1.

[PJ.]

Ya know what, This game needs to move

Unvote, Vote Charter

Charter right now is my top suspect and when he comes back I expect answers to my question(s) about him. Also, I have absolutely nothing on BSG, she's played beautifully. I don't even know if she is coming back though. Send her a PM maybe? Has anyone else not checked in?

[PJ.]

Alvinz: Lurker. Post or Ask for Replacement.

Artem: Playing scummish right now, Possibly could be newbie town. At some points his actions seem calculated and some seem like he doesn't know which way is up. Maybe newb scum trying to look for a rock or maybe newb town trying to find the ropes.

Artifex: Asking some questions, trying to scum hunt. A little too concerned with whether or not she looks scum with Artem. Neutral read.

BSG:Playing very well for a newbie. Newbie town for now.

Charter: I've already posted my thoughts on charter.

Danchaofan: More sitting by the sidelines but I get the feeling he isgoing the patient method of trying to catch scum. If he doesn't attempt to scum hunt in the future, I'll start to find him suspicious.

Darox: Just replaced a lurker. Post please

Lowell: Chronic Lurker, post or be lynched, because I know you'll post enough to avoid replacement.

Lynx: I don't really know, makes some good points but also trys to swing things. neutral.

Master Ruck: Was kinda giving me a townish read but has since disappeared. Nuetral

Xdaamno: disappeared afterrandom stage. scummish. Due to when he disappeared. Hasn't made many if any relevent post.

[PJ.]

EBWOP: Panzejager is town.

[PJ.]

Scummish because once the game became "serious buisness" so to speak, you were gone.

[PJ.]

Way to dodge my question charter. Why did you intentionally lead the game into WIFOM teritory? You purposely put a L-2 vote for virtually no reason after I had said it would be scummy to do so, without explaining yourself. Pressure was already there so if you are town or scum you'd already gained that. The extra advantage you get as scum would be dragging the game into WIFOM territory confusing players and taking discussion off a buddy(I believe discussion on Artem had just start) and on something that we couldn't lynch you for exclusively. I believe you voted to intentionally to pull discussion away from Artem.

And I appreciate the OMGUS suspicion you throw at me at the end of your post.

[PJ.]

Since when is delibrately trying to pull pressure off somebody scumhunting?

[PJ.]

Timing always makes a difference.

Although regardless. I agree with you that Artem is the most scummy. You have defended yourself suffciently

Unvote:Vote:Artem

[PJ.]

Because I think him not voting you but voting Lowell for much less of a reason pretty much ensures that one or both of you are scum.

[PJ.]

EBWOP: Pretty much I think between him not voting you and you taking discussion away from his easy targets things ontop of him voting Lowell for baseless reasons makes me believe you guys are scum together. Decided to re-type because I was vague.

[PJ.]

Thank you, someone agrees, but for now, let's lynch his scum budddy, Artem.

Also, Artem is the one voting Lowell.

[PJ.]

That's lynch,

Huge FoS

On Darox for that claim. I'm not sure if I believe hence the FoS because it's a Mini Normal not a Mini theme, so unless there is an ungodly ammount of power here, I really don't like it. Also it's a very easy claim to hide behind seeing as now nobody targets him. I more likely see him as a Survivor(not bad) or an SK(really bad) or he can be plan old scum(bad)

[PJ.]

Thats L-2 then

and I was saving this for Day 2 but Xdaamno, why didn't you wait for a claim. Seemed like oppurtunistic hammer vote. No reason, no nothing.

I would still like a claim from Artem.

[PJ.]

So wait, why are people unvoting the scummiest player in the game before he claims? That doesn't seem very smart.

[PJ.]

I'm in agreement with Darox on lynx, and am gonna wait for Lynx to address the issues.

@Artem, You're not the most active or vocal and most of the game you actually seemed pretty lost. Also, I have stated reason, several times. You never addressed them.

[PJ.]

Not at all, It was a 3 day crassh. He then followed it up with a post with why, so no, I don't find it scummy.

[PJ.]

EBWOP: He could be bussing you.

[PJ.]

You HAVE contributed nothing. Most of your 14 game post have been less then 3 lines and most of those have been completely either exetremely defensivve post that don't add anything to the discussion or completely contentless all together.

Unvote, Vote Xdaamno

[PJ.]

EBWOP:Artem has defended sufficiently for now, but I still think Charter and him could be buddies.

[PJ.]

Charter, did you attempt to bus Artem and distance yourself from Artem?

[PJ.]

I'm still not digging Xd's explanation for the Artem thing, and so if I don't involve you directly in the questions you're not gonna weigh in? Assume every question I ask I want your opinion on unless I state otherwise.

[PJ.]

@Artem, My biggest reason for voting was because you and charter seemed like buddies. You had previously defended yourself on a lot of my points when you addressed Danchao's post, so I looked at charter's actions and thought, I best just put these in storage and move on.

[PJ.]

Holy shit, I have a lot of catching up to do, I've been away since Friday. also, POST.

[PJ.]

First off, I need to read, which I'll have time to do but not now. I'm currently jobless so I'll have all of tomorrow to get the read done.

Right now the thing I want to address is the things I skimmed on this page, namely Artem and Charter.

Charter, define how I'm scummy.

Artem, if the only reason your voting for me is because I've been lurking you are sadly mistaken. I've been V/LA. I was visiting my girlfriend all weekend. Well, weekend plus a couple of days, Friday until Tuesday. I only posted Monday night to pickup prods I knew were coming.

Note:

Artem jumped right on when charter suggested lynching me, Also Charter didn't have the balls to vote me without approval from Artem

afatchic, I think I know why I got picked, but I'm answer your questions after my reread tomorrow

[PJ.]

Currently Reading and taking notes. @Artem I did read that post and there was nothing that stood out as an actually reason beside lurking. So maybe you should post better?

[PJ.]

Addressing Artem first.

[quote=Artem]...charter made no posts, and my only post can be summed up as "Yes, I have addressed those points." The only post about me between 174 and 185 that is of interest is 179 by Dan. Dan basically states that he is less suspicious of me now. Panzer simply echos the sentiment in 185. This is suspicious because it feel like Panzer is/was piggy-backing Dan in his attack against me. [/quote]

I wasn't Piggy backing Dan but my suspicions did mirror(except for you and charter being connected) and you did answer his suspicions and I went back and looked at the post in which you said you answered his questions and after reading those posts, I looked at Charter's actions and decided to let it go for now. So in short Between post 174 and 185 there was nothing but I looked at previous post and reviewed my own thoughts and thought, "there isn't much here right now"

Now on to charter, I'll address the taking pressure of Artem. True there was one vote on Artem but all the posts at that time were talking about Artem and how he was being scummy and people were starting to vote him. In my opinion you were trying to steer away from that by intentionally causing a WIFOM arguement. My post was clearly a pressure vote on BSG with an inlaid trap because I didn't want it to go to L-2 in fear of a qucik lynch because of the ammount of newbies and newbie-esque players in this game.

Now on to how my suspicions are seemingly me just latching on. I was the first one to be suspicious of Darox I believe and I didn't feel it was worth going into. If he is a PGO then more power too him and us as town. But we can't just ignore him. Also, I thought he made good points against lynx but I didn't FoS nor Vote Lynx. I didn't think I needed to, I just felt Darox was justified in his opinions and stated so.

I voted XD because of his promises to reread that he never followed through on, his BS "pressure vote" on Artem that I truly think was an attempt to lynch(possibly bus), and all of his excuses for not being involved with game until all the attacks focused on him. Also, the week long break between "Okay I'll post more" and the attempt to lynch Artem rubbed me the wrong way.

[PJ.]

EBWOP: I forgot the quotation marks..

[PJ.]

Seriously, charter? Dude, all this is is a pissing contest. You want to prove that you were right that saying -2 is no scummier then -3. You know what, you're right. L-2 is pretty much nothing as L-3. What I said was to see if anyone would test it, and trap themselves in WIFOM. You are scummy for doing that. Onlt reason you have me as scum, is because of that one statement, a statement that in the end game, won't even matter. Use your brain and not your ego. XD is scummier then I am, that's why ever since his wagon started, he was your number 1 suspect and me you're number 2.

I'm definently surprised at the quickness of my wagon though. Looks like I was right about you and Artem, say that it doesn't matter but I'd be willing to bet that you and Artem are scum and I wouldn't be surprised if XD was with you guys.

[PJ.]

That's just my biggest lead, so I'm using it.

@Artem: I didn't ask for a claim because I've not really been here and when I did get here I was at -3 2 days from deadline. I had other pressing matters Even though I agree with Charter, I actually would like a claim. For The Record.

[PJ.]

Actually, XD is the lynch.. He has the most votes. IF we were tied, it'd be a no lynch.

[PJ.]

@Lowell, I currently like how Artem is acting


@The crowd skeptical about me calling scumbuddies, I'm really skeptical about buddying up because to me it represents people being to comfortable and the only people who would buddy would be scum. That's why I keep mentioning a charter/Artem pair, but I can keep that in my notes if you'd like. All I'm saying it a playstyle nulltell, not a scumtell.

[PJ.]

Panzer, what is your view on all of this? From what I've seen in my isolation read on you, do you have any thoughts on anyone besides Artem and Charter?

Well If you read my post you'd know I have thoughts on people other then them. That's kinda what I'm under the microscope from charter about supposedly, because I latched on to some views(Note:This is not true)

What more of all of this do you want?

[PJ.]

Um...You must not know how to read.

I'm mentioned how I agreed with Darox on Lynx and I have expressed that I felt XD was scum. I was also skeptical of Darox claim. I have expressed both of these things lately and in the past. So to answer your question, yes I have thoughts that aren't about Artem and Charter. I have express heavy suspicion of XD, very minor suspicion of Lynx, and have been skeptical of Darox.

[PJ.]

Who'd Support a Charter wagon before deadline?

[PJ.]

Unvote Vote:Charter

For being Scummy McScumface

[PJ.]

Hahahaha, That'd be funny if you weren't actually scummy.

[PJ.]

Charter, You are so scummy. You seem to have a lot of inside information, you claimed that Xd was town before he was lynched now you're telling us that Charter is 100% confirmed town. And apparently Dan and I are scum together. You definently are making a lot of assumptions and trying to pass them off as facts.

We call those people scum. Do you know why? Because those are the ones who know everyone's alignment. You seem to "know" 4 people alignments. Not only are you wrong and possibly buddying with Artem(again), Your accusing Dan and I of being scum when we haven't buddyed at all.

[PJ.]

Charter, Seriously man. You are waaay to narrow minded.

Unvote: Vote:Lynx

For most of his stuff yesterday.

[PJ.]

XD is lynched, Charter is Town, and Artem Is town. Your the guy I find scummiest.

I'll make a case later, I'm currently doing other things but I needed to make a post because I was V/LA all weekend

[PJ.]

You claimed Hider, or did you forget. I buy the claim. This means you and Artem are town. Since when is believeing a protown claim scummy?

[PJ.]

Wow Charter, you do suck at this game. I believe you are telling the truth. Nothing is certain.

[PJ.]

[hypothetical] If I claimed Cop and said I got an innocent on Dan, wouldn't you be saying we were damn closed to confirmed town?[/hypothetical]

[PJ.]

So you'd beat a dead horse and possibly lynch a claimed cop just because you're way too narrow minded to see the whole field?

Personally I don't see why Lowell, Lynx and I are the only cases that can be made. I can see a case being made for Master Ruck or Tubby. It is scummy for limiting the town's options to just 3 lynchs and

FoS:on anyone who has done so

[PJ.]

Well Master Ruck just made my point. He's downplaying his own stuff cause he made huge scumtells in during the XD thing.

And Tubby has been lurking in plain sight ever since he replace, continually promising reads.

I'm not FoSing those not making cases Charter, I'm FoSing those who said the only cases to be made are for Me and Lowell.

[PJ.]

On Lynx, How he continually changed his stance on the Charter wagon was incredibly scummy. All of his interactions with BSG, were also incredibly scummy because he was saying don't read BSG's reaction, I ruined it, when she spoke up before he did. Also as Darox mentioned, He has a tendency of fence sitting and trying not to offend anyone by averaging being in the middle.

Unvote, Vote: Lynx

[PJ.]

EBWOP: Apparently I was voting Lynx and forgot.

[PJ.]

Lynx, When my major suspicions are ever dead or semi-cleared wouldn't my minor suspicions become my major suspicions?

[PJ.]

Eh, I reread Lowell. He's a lurker for sure but I don't see much of a case on him right now.

So you have no problems FoSing and voting panzer for lurking, but not Lowell?

ohohohohohohoh BURN charter BURN!!!!

[PJ.]

Can we get some prod's?

Everyone has posted in the last 72 hours

[PJ.]

That makes him singleminded but not wrong. He's not singleling you out, for he had a vote on me late Day 1. Darox is a bit lurkerish but he has posted more content then 2-3 people in this thread, including you I believe.

[PJ.]

How am I scum? This is TWICE that you have indeed jumped off of a wagon to try and lynch me. I'm starting to think that you are trying to use the emotions from wagons in order to get a mislynch on me.

Stop playing Anti-Town Charter.

[PJ.]

Dude, we already argued this, I have explained it. It's you having a pissing contest with me. I already gave up. You're the bigger man you 6 foot 7 octopus now let's actually lynch scum. Put your vote back on Lynx.

[PJ.]

Lol, C'mon charter. Just admit it. Your case held 0 water. Your voting me as your own personal hooray, not scumhunting.

Put you vote back on the scummiest player(lynx).

[PJ.]

I'm with tubby 100% on this, and actually I'm gonna go out and

Unvote, Vote:Charter

You're right, I shouldn't buy your claim 100%, Artem could possibly be town since as scum, you know everyone's alignment. Also, Hider is an obscure way to use that knowledge and say I just kept clearing townies.

Your vote on me has little do with your supposed case and more to do with distancing yourself from the wagon, as you did with the Daamno wagon.

More votes on charter please.

[PJ.]

I see this turn of events as, Charter sees the wagon stalling and jumps on me to distance himself from another possible townie lynch. I could also see Lynx being partners with charter as he just rode the bottom of the Daamno wagon all the way out and now he is on me since as soon as charter said ok. Seeing as he jumped to me in a terrible fashion with hardly any reasoning.

On a re-read, I'm definately pointing my finger at charter; he's

far

scummier than anyone else right now.

Over, and over, and over again he makes brash, vote-related accusations that he seems to be 'certain' of. Town players are very rarely certain in practice, while scum players are quick to call town players both "certain town" and "certain scum", since nothing is a mystery to them. Examples:

Still want the Xdaamo lynch.

I think you're scum, I want to lynch you.

Happy with a Panzer lynch. An Xdaamo lynch is an acceptable last resort.

I think it's Panzer and dan. I don't think Xdaamo is scum anymore. I got all excited about his mishammer and got carried away.

I add dan to my list because of his earlier ties to Panzer and his most recent post, saying he finds Xdaamo more town and Panzer more scum but doesn't change his vote.

@Charter- You're pretty excited about Panzer, too. An honest question- why is this time different from when you were excited about Xda (how can I know you arent being 'carried away' again?

I would bet my life that Artem is town.

Panzer is definately the way to go today.
Assuming Xdaamo isn't scum, like I said, I'd bet money Artem is town.

Unvote, Vote: charter

His change of direction from me to Panzer also strikes a bad vibe, and makes me think Panzer is town. For a while, I became indifferent to him because of the fact he was on my side (and by 'my side', I mean against everyone but me).

I'm not sure that I will be lynched today, so I won't self-hammer.

I think Xd nailed it here and that charter figured he'd be under suspicion and came up with this tremendous fake claim. He claimed at a very odd time and now is up to his same old derailment tricks.

[PJ.]

Ruck, why are you so dense, two different things. I'm agreeing with Daano and then also bringing up the fact that he came up with this fake claim to avoid suspicion. Charter was in no danger of a lynch when He claimed. Meaning he had this claim preemptively chosen.

[PJ.]

There is 0 good reasons why we should lynch charter today.

If you feel otherwise, please try your best to correct me, because I assure you that you are wrong.

Lynx has already digressed into Him or me mode, as will I

Unvote:Vote:Lynx

[PJ.]

Charter, You're full of it, You haven't , made a reasonable case because it doesn't exist.

[PJ.]

EBWOP: What do you want from me charter? What do you need me to do, for you to stop accusing me for silly resons and tunneling in on me?

[PJ.]

I mean, it's too late, you've already incriminated yourself. Maybe if you were to scumhunt and find someone that is even scummier than you, but you just keep throwing your vote around whenever another possible lynch target surfaces.

The only other possible lynch right now beside Lynx is you, how am I throwing my vote around? Between you and Lynx?

How about you throwing your vote around on Me and whoever happens to be the lead suspect, as you did from Xd to Me and From Lynx to Me.

[PJ.]

Ya, ok. More Bullshit please charter.

[PJ.]

3 players aren't here. Artem is stuck on Lowell. I'm at 3 votes that's 7 out of the 10. The rest are on Lynx. I disagree that Lowell is scummy, I believe charter is scum and Lynx is scummy as well. How this game has progressed, it's narrowed the suspects to 3 people and 2 that I'd lynch(third being myself). I would love to lynch charter, but that's simply not gonna happen. No one else thinks he is scummy and I don't feel like kicking a dead horse. That leaves Lynx or Lowell. I've played with Lowell before and he is a chronic lurker. Other then a couple of mildly scummy post, he's not so bad. He's nowhere near as scummy as lynx. Lynx gets my vote, because voting myself would be stupid. Only other person that is mildly scummy is Ruck, who I'm contemplating making a case for. Have to re-read him and decide if he is worse then ruck.

Also, that quote that is being pasted around is a typo I didn'tcatch until now, it says it should say "me and lynx" not "you and lynx". "You and lynx" doesn't make sense because chater isn't a possible lynch at this moment or when i said that. Thanks for burning me on a typo though Ruck. I need to PREVIEW button more.

[PJ.]

Ruck, I have better things to do with my time then simply explain away a lynch that is not gonna happen.

I have a job to look for among other things.

[PJ.]

After Panzer flips scum, MR has stocked up on town points, it's not too late to get yours too!

Dude, he is in the third spot. He's jumping on me while the wagon is hot and picking an easy target. His jump was incredibly scummy and if I'm scum I would hope you would look at that as him bussing me.

[PJ.]

Tracker. I tracked charter that's intially why I thought he was cleared because I got a no result. I then started thinking I may have been role blocked.

[PJ.]

EBWOP: I intially thought I was roleblocked, then I saw the game and understood and I didn't want to come out and say I thought he was 100%. This is why i dropped the Artem thing. I'm back to thinking I was roleblocked.

@Charter, How come I couldn't have been cop? How would you know unless you are some kind of Mafia role cop. I'm really thinking about lynching you just on the basis you had a narrow mindset on my claim to begin with.

[PJ.]

Also, I'm gonna be V/LA until Sunday evening.

[PJ.]

Tracker and Hider, yes thats a lot of power, but normally Tracker and Watcher are paired together and that's just as much power. First off, Tracker and Hider are weak investigative roles. Hider can lead to 2 deaths and Tracker can inadvertantly out power roles. Also PGO risks uskilling ourselves had he not outted himself.

@Artem, I'm not saying give all lurkers a pass. Lurking is scummy. Active Lurking is scummier(I'm looking at you Darox) but when it's a null tell it is a null tell. I don't think in Lowell's case it is that scummy(still scummy) because he lurks no matter what. Also, I think you have a fantastic point with people oppurtunistically jumping on me and I think there is at least one scum on me probably 2.

Unvote:Vote:Lowell

In light of his oppurtunistic hope onto my wagon.

@ Lynx, I was implying Mafia roleblocker. I figured I had been role blocked because I got no investigation. I believed the hider claim because it made a lot of sense with my investigation so when he claimed I was like ok. When he did this whole, random turn around on me, he simply reaffirmed my beliefs that I could possibly be blocked by his buddy. The reason I believe Artem is town is because I don't think charter would claim to have investigated a buddy.

[PJ.]

Lynx, I actually agree with you and am going to take a look at where Tubby has jumped at in both spots. He jumped on in the 4 spot, a very traditional oppurtunistic scum spot. His post was:

ok i heard enough

untvote: vote: panzer

He gave no reasoning at all.

Tubby averages about 2 days in between each of his post, pretty much just enough to get him by. Active lurking. As I said exetremely scummy.

He also jumped on XD for abosulutely no reason. In the 5 spot. Pretty the I'm late to the wagon spot.

Anyway,

Vote:Tubby216

If I'm going to be lynched, I want my vote on him and I want you guys also to look at charter with so extra attention.

[PJ.]

I'm Scum, My partners are Lowell and Artifex.

Unvote,Vote:Panzerjager

I hate you Charter for having gut feelings.