Open 801: Trust Fall (Game Over)

[Necessary Sneasel]

i am in the game because it was decreed by the universe that i must be in this game.

[Necessary Sneasel]

i also didn't realise it had started. i was busy with things that were very important, of course.

Mine?

this time.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Maybe if we vote hard enough, it'll become a mechanic.

VOTE: Rainbow Reads

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i wonder if his predisposition toward the color red indicates the coloration of his role pm.

[Necessary Sneasel]

sneasel is lying he was busy with very unimportant things like building houses out of wax and watching videos of people falling over

frighteningly accurate. are you my housemate?

[Necessary Sneasel]

Following my own plan
HEAL: Jake
HEAL: Fidget

why are you healing these two here akarin?

Trust Count 1.02

Not Trusting (10) - Akarin, Fidget, Hectic, Jake The Wolfie, Necessary Sneasel, PookyTheMagicalBear, Rainbow Reads, Rockhopper, shellyc, Uncrowned

The deadline is Sunday, December 6, 2020, at 7:30 PM EST (UTC-5), which is in (expired on 2020-12-06 19:30:00).

Moderator Note

As a reminder, the notation for trusting is

I trust X

.

i'm feeling tipsy already

Hey. I said tie me within a townie player.

You scumread Jake?

I'd put them null for now.

as in a "i have literally no opinion on anything they've posted" null or a "i am very intentionally null on them" kind of null?
update this read if you can.

I like Shelly!

shelly is always scum, be wary

hectic is sneaky

HURT: hectic

this is a bit serious i don't get the Hectic Townvibes yet and the iso has a fluff to seriousposting ratio that i dislike

this is low key how i feel about every person in the game atp

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{Rainbow Reads}

{Akarin}

{Jake The Wolfie, shellyc}

{Fidget}

{Equinox, Necessary Sneasel}

{Hectic, Rockhopper}

{Uncrowned, PookyTheMagicalBear}

{}

{}

i assume equi/me is some kind of vip tier.

why are jake and shelly equal to you? otherwise i'm kind of fine with your reads.

[Necessary Sneasel]

meh
it'll end in tears

[Necessary Sneasel]

i wouldn't call hectic so proactive that i'm surprised he's flustered two days into the game, tbh

who are you townreading?

[Necessary Sneasel]

why are you healing these two here akarin?

Because I had liked both of their opening posts.

Later I decided I did like Jake because of his discomfort with being townread, but since then I've flipped on him because I feel like he's playing it up a lot.

what made you like the other person's opener? not jake. i forgot the username of the one i'm asking about.

[Necessary Sneasel]

shelly is always scum, be wary

scum is superior

I'm townreading akarin, unc

cool, why uncrowned?

Welcome to your first game on site, Necessary Sneasel!

This is sure to be a good introduction for a new player like you.

i scumread this post in an out of game way >___>
thanks though

[Necessary Sneasel]

meh
it'll end in tears

you're just upset you've never experienced true love such as this

correct, i'm still right though

what happens at the deadline?

equinox folds his arms, narrows his eyebrows, and shakes his head at us

[Necessary Sneasel]

why are you healing these two here akarin?

Because I had liked both of their opening posts.

Later I decided I did like Jake because of his discomfort with being townread, but since then I've flipped on him because I feel like he's playing it up a lot.

what made you like the other person's opener? not jake. i forgot the username of the one i'm asking about.

fidget

[Necessary Sneasel]

Sneasel Sneasel Sneasel SNEASEL Sneasel

mood

This is a good point lol

im pretty sure buzzwording is one of my alignment tells which nobody has found out yet

won't tell you the correlation though

i hate that you've become aware of this tell

[Necessary Sneasel]

why are jake and shelly equal to you? otherwise i'm kind of fine with your reads.

Necessary Sneasel!

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you seem like the kind of rainbow with an accurate gut but it's not helping me work out whether you're scum

[Necessary Sneasel]

what made you like the other person's opener? not jake. i forgot the username of the one i'm asking about.

She obviously understood about Equinox's disgusting anti-suffrage stance, but chose to RVS vote for Pooky right after me, building momentum. It's a dumb page 1 read but I feel like scum would have been more likely to either not vote or vote elsewhere.

But post 98, post 171 progression, and post 171 also strike me as pretty towny, so I have grown more confident in my town read there.

aha
i think nonchalance, or even silliness, is what i was looking for in fidget's opening

thanks

[Necessary Sneasel]

i'm going to trust akarin in like 24 hours

[Necessary Sneasel]

I can't believe I put on my favorite Lynx Africa body spray just to get snubbed from being the first selection.

i hope that this is ironic so you can be my fav user

[Necessary Sneasel]

Necessary Sneasel - I feel like this player has been poking and prodding, sure, but I'm not convinced they are solving as of yet. He really has just been asking Akarin why she has townreads.

the people i want to do things (pooky, hectic, rock first and then jake & rr) aren't really doing anything so this is a pretty correct take on my play yeah

akarin is actually townposting so i want to check my own reads on her more than get a read on her

[Necessary Sneasel]

HEAL: Uncrowned - Town reaction to trust.

is this the only reason you townread uncrowned?

Why's that?

your openign post made my third eye raise its brow and i coudln't really put my finger on why - i think akarin is probably right, it's what the kids call "pure tone"

[Necessary Sneasel]

pagetop?

[Necessary Sneasel]

also we kinda win if we get enough pairs paired up right?

i was going to make a snarky response about your wincon, until i realised this is true for both wincons

[Necessary Sneasel]

bear dude fam let's get real for a moment. you are top posting this game. but all you're doing is being cute as fuck. what are you waiting for? what's your angle here?

[Necessary Sneasel]

seems okay

this will be written on my gravestone

[Necessary Sneasel]

A question to whoever wants to answer: If you could win the game by identifying one town right now, who would it be?

unc

how, except if you say the word "slip" you're confirmed scum

[Necessary Sneasel]

Fidget I'm actually kinda undecided on, but I agree with her reads which is probably good

why are you undecided on someone whose reads you agree with?

she has a good range, and all of her posts could in-theory be faked so far. mindmelding on reads is +town though

are you ready to change your life forever?

look within - which of those reads do you think you could fake or would be motivated to fake?
now, flip it back. do you see a reason for scum fidget to fake any of these fakeable reads?

this will be covered in greater detail in my next book

[Necessary Sneasel]

ok that game is indicative of hectic!town here...

HM.

would counter that hectic providing selfmeta to support town!hectic is not an alignment tell, shellyc.

[Necessary Sneasel]

hmm i had suspected but oh my, how forward.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I'm gonna trust Akarin

[Necessary Sneasel]

I'M GONNA DO IT

[Necessary Sneasel]

SOMEONE STOP THAT SNEASEL HE'S OUT OF CONTROL

[Necessary Sneasel]

maybe i should trust unfrowned instead. he seems like a happy lad.

[Necessary Sneasel]

what is love if not a leap of faith?

I trust Uncrowned

nice work i was actually tempted to follow thru on this one

it's ok, what's not meant to be,

is not meant to be.

Untrust : Uncrowned

I think you should dance with Akarin, her eyes glow like a thousand stars when she looks at you.

why in 1000000 years would you bother untrusting someone who you've confurmed town pooky

[Necessary Sneasel]

whatever jack

alright this is cute

[Necessary Sneasel]

shelly rainy or rocky are you thinking what I'm thinking?

[Necessary Sneasel]

Good to know that we're basically still in RVS 13 pages in.

we have one clear and I have a scumread

if you feel like we're still in rvs try making some more noise and blast us out of it.

[Necessary Sneasel]

akarin, how are your reads progressing?

[Necessary Sneasel]

i trust uncrowned

this is pretty novel but meh

[Necessary Sneasel]

what is love if not a leap of faith?

I trust Uncrowned

Trust Count 1.10

Not Trusting (10) - Akarin, Fidget, Hectic, Jake The Wolfie, Necessary Sneasel, PookyTheMagicalBear, Rainbow Reads, Rockhopper, shellyc, Uncrowned

The deadline is Sunday, December 6, 2020, at 7:30 PM EST (UTC-5), which is in (expired on 2020-12-06 19:30:00).

wait wait hold up

was this intentionally not included
if so mb

[Necessary Sneasel]

it's ok, what's not meant to be,

is not meant to be.

Untrust : Uncrowned

I think you should dance with Akarin, her eyes glow like a thousand stars when she looks at you.

never mind i forgot about this

pooky i am outright

flustered

that you bothered untrusting someone who is now confirmed town to you but you are townsiding by play but the correct strat for scum in this setup is to just make explosively towny noises early and hope that someone has a whimsical lapse in judgement so strictly speaking you should have something like top-3 scum equity but you're not really trying to look towny you're just posting a shitload

[Necessary Sneasel]

i have some really bad news but this spoiler ain't for the faint of heart

Spoiler: not for the faint of heart

akarin is scum

[Necessary Sneasel]

it's just occurred to me that scum can actually fake trust their partner and have their partner respond and gamble on the mod not posting a vc

@pooky gonna have to insist on you & uncrowned reigniting your romance til the next vc please

[Necessary Sneasel]

i'll give you guys a lovely wedding present ♥

[Necessary Sneasel]

untrust: uncrowned

w/e

[Necessary Sneasel]

reminder we need pooky to re-trust uncrowned for an actual mod clear

I'm basically V/LA until the marathon is over btw

good idea do marathons

[Necessary Sneasel]

uncrowned leans town but I'm not reading the slot until pooky re-trusts him

pooky is confirmed scum until he re-trusts uncrowned and is throwing if town so do what you will with that

akarin reads wildcard/wolf

lean town shelly, fidget
null town rainbow, jake, maybe hectic

[Necessary Sneasel]

re-trust uncrowned until the next vc or he's not mod confirmed and you may as well be the scumteam gambiting lol

[Necessary Sneasel]

Have you played with Shelley before, because she sounds more like she did in Death Curse here than in Hideyoshi. Scum!Shelley is more aggressive where as town!Shelley tends to be somewhat indecisive. Why is he scum for not re-trusting Uncrowned?

no this is my first game, I haven't read either of those

shelly does not seem aggressive here. actually she feels a bit lost and maybe perplexed more than aggressive which I associate with town in this setup. her strongest read is that I'm an alt lol.

If you lean town on him then why would that make Poooky scum? Wouldn’t it be in scum!Pooky’s interest to want to re-trust “lean town” Uncrowned or am I missing something?

he reads town in isolation but he's mechanically solvable by Pooky re-trusting him

pooky not doing so is either coming from pooky who is scum with him therefore can't re-trust him, or Pooky who is scum with someone else and wants to cast a shadow on uncrowned's alignment - not re-trusting is a scum move

[Necessary Sneasel]

we need to play with a super tight poe here we don't really have miselims let's get what mech info we can

[Necessary Sneasel]

told y'all i'm necessary

[Necessary Sneasel]

The first part I get but isn’t it in “scum”!Pooky’s interest to re-trust “town”!Uncrowned”?

to make it look like they're aligned so uncrowned isn't removed from the game

[Necessary Sneasel]

re-trust uncrowned until the next vc or he's not mod confirmed and you may as well be the scumteam gambiting lol

???

why wouldnt scum be able to trust each other?

If the mafia attempt to trust fall together, then nothing will happen.

now you've faked the townslip
if your next post doesn't trust uncrowned, then your next post is a scumclaim

glgl

[Necessary Sneasel]

I am confusion right now

what is mod-confirm?

isn't it only when both mafia trust each other that nothing happens or something along those lines? are you suggesting i trust pooky?

actually good question idk
i wouldn't have expected scum to be able to be listed as trusting each other lol

[Necessary Sneasel]

Fidget, Rainbow Reads, and shellyc have been prodded.

Maybe NS is right because Shelley also needed prodding in Hideyoshi. I hate activity alignment reading people though.

activity reads are for nerds, shelly probably had a busy weekend or something
check her iso, a personality like hers always reads assertive but i think she clearly has no idea what's going on in this game

[Necessary Sneasel]

Need to catch up, but this is a weird weekend to be making activity reads.

every weekend is a sucky weekend for activity reads

[Necessary Sneasel]

So why isn't Uncrowned just conf!town or gamethrowing scum? I don't see what mod confirmation has to do with it, if Uncrowned accepts a trust, he's out of the game and scum is that much closer to winning, right?

Haven't 2 players trusted Uncrowned at this point?

I did very briefly before he posted and before it occurred to me that a Pooky + uncrowned scumteam are incentivised to trust each other then untrust before any kind of mod activity confirms that the trust request was fake

Pooky is absolute lock scum unless he re-trusts uncrowned, removing the potential for them to be the scumteam gambiting

pooky reads scummy anyway and I don't think his cute act is going to win him enough favours so this doesn't really bother me

Necessary Sneasel, why'd you do a 180 on me?

see it you can find it

[Necessary Sneasel]

When we do start pairing up, instead of pairing top townreads first, I kind of think we should pair from the middle pairs until we hit scum, then reevaluate for the last few.

akarin is scum because the four pages between this & her last post are filled with actual content and this is a really peculiar moment to pop in with a mech comment - go back and reread from her last post to this one and tell me you think an akarin who is reading and trying to solve the game makes this post without commenting on anything else

unconscious guilt over me saying I was going to trust her is showing

bet on it.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Because it would flip them now and the endgame would be actually readable players, and they don't seem like they're scumreading each other particularly.

We shouldn’t ship anyone unless we think they’re both town. If the majority think this then great but that’s the only way that makes sense.

Nothing about either has really pinged me either way but I want to hear from players who actually have reads on them. Like Sneasel and Fidget for example. I would be extremely shocked if either one of them flipped scum here, so I think I trust their reads the most.

don't slander me I have no reads

rainbow reads weakly town because I don't feel like they're trying to look town (this is a setup which necessitates scum being very likeable), so much as doing things which they need to do as town. their iso is very undersold.

jake has done nothing in this game

[Necessary Sneasel]

I actually almost proposed to Sneasel earlier today, not that I think he'd accept, but I'm having some paranoia there. I think he's probably more likely town than not but I don't know, something about the "I'm gonna pair with Akarin, somebody stop me" thing. Plus, if he is town, I wouldn't want him to actually accept anyway.

There's 4 hours after Sneasel proposed to Uncrowned where Uncrowned was admittedly not that active but

did

have a couple posts on site elsewhere and there's not enough scum for it to be Sneasel + Uncrowned + Pooky. So scum!Uncrowned should have paired with whichever was town, or either if they both were.

I don't see what the gambit does for Uncrowned here if scum, and it's possible that it's Pooky + Uncrowned and Uncrowned missed the Sneasel thing but I think that's

much

less likely than Sneasel seems to think it is.

granted let's put this to bed

I trust uncrowned

[Necessary Sneasel]

ok talk me through what's towny in her iso and not just mech talk kgo

You know how when you get like halfway through a normal game and you just want to eliminate those players who have done absolutely nothing towny all game and you can't stand them making it to endgame, but then they flip VT?

I feel like that's Jake and Rainbow.

you think Jake and rainbow are that similar? can you try rainbow again?

[Necessary Sneasel]

don't really care for an actual date with uncrowned, just keen to settle his alignment

shelly if you want to trust him I can switch off

[Necessary Sneasel]

eh probably

[Necessary Sneasel]

i feel like your response to giving reasons to townread akarin which aren't mechanics is just "her fidget townread", 1 is exactly mech talk & 2 is just furthering the mech point she was already making (pair null players) by putting names in it

[Necessary Sneasel]

eh probably

why the "probably"? what qualms do you have?

I'm going to go file my nails instead of answer this

[Necessary Sneasel]

Yeah that was a prod dodge.

meh ok post towny things then lol

[Necessary Sneasel]

you think Jake and rainbow are that similar? can you try rainbow again?

They obviously have different playstyles, but yeah I think they're basically going to amount to the same in terms of difficulty reading. Neither strikes me as the scummiest player, for reasons I mentioned before, and your previous point on Rainbow, but at the same time I'd be super-hesitant to bet the game on both of them being town near endgame.

You disagree?

I think only one of them is making any effort to post game related content & feel like rr is a fair bit townier than Jake yeah I see what you get at tho

yeah my read on rr isn't crazy high confidence but taking Jake out here would be literal policy and I think he has non negligible scum equity so I'd rather not policy to help someone I just don't townread at all and go into sudden death

[Necessary Sneasel]

Necessary Sneasel has rabies

that obvious huh

shellyc is someone I have no faith in my ability to read and hasn't done anything really notable but has been questioning Sneasel a bit

ideally town just wins without sorting shelly but I have a slight townread on her

[Necessary Sneasel]

Oh yeah, we should do a thing where we propose to the towniest people, and have them not accept. We can "clear" people if we slowly propose to the UTRs until we have a smaller pool. So we can IC people while keeping them in the game while they can continue to weigh in

interesting theory, ideally I'll be around after trust 1 to talk more about this

[Necessary Sneasel]

Because it would flip them now and the endgame would be actually readable players, and they don't seem like they're scumreading each other particularly.

We shouldn’t ship anyone unless we think they’re both town. If the majority think this then great but that’s the only way that makes sense.

Nothing about either has really pinged me either way but I want to hear from players who

actually have reads

on them.

Like Sneasel

and Fidget for example. I would be extremely shocked if either one of them flipped scum here, so I think I trust their reads the most.

don't slander me I have no reads

rainbow reads weakly town because I don't feel like they're trying to look town (this is a setup which necessitates scum being very likeable), so much as doing things which they need to do as town. their iso is very undersold.

jake has done nothing in this game

Um what? I called you one of my strongest trs. How am I slandering you?

bolded for illustration

calling me scum would be a compliment, not slander

[Necessary Sneasel]

Maybe. Playing the odds, sure, random nulls have a 4/5 chance of being town. There's only a 65% chance that both true nulls will both flip town, though, if I understand math.

odds shift down if we assume uncrowned is cleared
odds shift down again if we have consensus townreads

it's a good strategy in a weak plist where nobody towntells (so communal reads are closer to rand) but I'm not really sold on it unless people actually think Jake & rainbow both have a somewhere above rand chance of being town. vague "they feel like those lategame VT flips" isn't really doing it for me, we need to get grittier.

[Necessary Sneasel]

With Pooky, it's tricky. Usually I would expect him to seize hold of a gamestate as scum, whereas as town he might just do whatever. In this game though, I am not sure. You aren't really obligated to do anything except for get trusted, as both alignments, really. Figuring out who we shouldn't trust is helpful, but technically the bare minimum a townie must do is be trusted.

one good pocket can get you out of the game successfully
it takes one towny who wants you to be town to stuff up and give you the escape

people who try to towntell or get on people's good sides early are bad news

pedit: .... you like me don't you

[Necessary Sneasel]

If

HURT: RR No way town has either us so low.

?
who are you again

towncase yourself for me?

[Necessary Sneasel]

don't slander me I have no reads

rainbow reads weakly town because I don't feel like they're trying to look town (this is a setup which necessitates scum being very likeable), so much as doing things which they need to do as town. their iso is very undersold.

jake has done nothing in this game

I feel the opposite way about Rainbow. They've been bringing out flashy readslists, but in reality they haven't really done anything to further town wincon with them at all. After all, they haven't really shown us their work, no? So it really only gives us the vague impression that Rainbow is solving, without them actually having to show us any of their solving.

If you want someone who isn't trying to look town, I'd point to Jake for that from what I can remember.

good take! if you think Jake and RR can be flipped in my reads I'm fine with that, I'm not married to my read on either of them

pairing them off is still a bad idea because there is scum equity in that pair regardless of which one it is

[Necessary Sneasel]

Sneasel, you're going to need to do more than discredit reasons for Akarin being townread in order to prove she is scum. Townreads, I feel, are going to be inherently weak since there is A.) no elimination mechanic, B.) many many absences, and C.) no flips yet.

So far, I have only noticed your insane Freudian unconscious guilt theory on why Akarin is scum here. Do you have more?

not really
she posted elsewhere onsite between the post before the one that struck me as guilty & her post before it so I kinda assumed she wasn't literally inactive the whole time

I'm still surprised she didn't feel compelled to engage with anything else, I'm still struck by the fact she's more focused on mechplay than reads, but she has some kind of tonally natural posting style that could also be town

I'll work her out later if I need to, someone we don't really care for can trust her if they want. if we do the Jake/RR thing and there's scum in there I do think akarin should be endgamed but if it's like rr/akarin or something then someone like Pooky probably loses the game for town anyway so let's hope it's not

[Necessary Sneasel]

No, I only mean the part about scum being guiltied if they trust each other. Not his theory concerning Pooky/Uncrowned. Uncrowned is very likely town though.

Oh. I see.

This is how I'm feeling currently. No heavy review, just from catching up. I want to believe I've got both scum below the dash, but beyond that, not so confident.

{Uncrowned}
{Akarin, Sneasel}
{Gloria}
-
{Hectic}
{shelly}
{Rainbow, Jake, Pooky}

could you dissect those hectic & shelly reads for me?

[Necessary Sneasel]

hectic actually proposed this time

and this ring... oh my! it's massive. how much did this cost?!?!

I... I'll have to think about it

hello..... I'm right here.....

[Necessary Sneasel]

RR has seriously questionable reads

why aren't you asking questions then?

[Necessary Sneasel]

town!Pooky sometimes has some pretty good reads

love that you call rr's readlist fishy but use this as a reason to posture reconsidering a hard townread

[Necessary Sneasel]

I don't need to give reads because if I pair my daughters off correctly we win the game.

Who would you like Akarin and Fidget to be paired with?

Posts like these make me think it isn’t Pooky.

One or both scum in RR/Jake.

Uncrowned/Fidget/Shelley top town reads,

hmm not as hard as I was thinking maybe
not really important, keep posting Gloria

[Necessary Sneasel]

ideally I'll be around after trust 1 to talk more about this

ooo yet you have me trusted atm?

choosing me would be the COWARD's path but you are welcome to choose me if you really must, I won't be rescinding the trust

[Necessary Sneasel]

Could Uncrowned be deepwolfing to get their partner on the bench of trust fallees?

After reconsideration, this question implies that the town is doing an awful job.

in theory sure

in practice this is really damn hard because as soon as one of you leaves, there are associatives and the deepwolf is probably going to look bad even if they were soft confirmed by not leaving

uncrowned doesn't smell like the kind of player with a wide enough scumrange to intentionally choose hardmode and try to actually sell overpowering the town as a towny error coming from a member of the town. few do and it's an intentionally exhausting strategy

[Necessary Sneasel]

it's a huge deal, I'm the deepwolf *dramatic hand gestures*

[Necessary Sneasel]

tbh i didn't think twice about it and I think didn't think twice about it because you are universally townread but I don't think anyone is really talking about us leaving together? i trusted you to get the alignment result, not because i want us to leave together necessarily

[Necessary Sneasel]

So I'm thinking that if Gloria isn't scum with Pooky (which I don't entirely want to rule out) then she's very likely town.

co-sign, i think gloria is quite pocketable for pooky as well

she posted elsewhere onsite between the post before the one that struck me as guilty & her post before it so I kinda assumed she wasn't literally inactive the whole time

I'm still surprised she didn't feel compelled to engage with anything else

I literally had not read the intervening posts.

I had a limited amount of time and prioritized a game with an impending deadline. Not sure if it's the one I can talk about yet or not.

no stress, it was a good read to shake things up but probably not a realisic alignment indicator

[Necessary Sneasel]

I also just like that latest string of Fidget posting.

what do you like about it?

[Necessary Sneasel]

If there isn't scum at the bottom, then all scum has to do is nod their heads to us not pairing Rainbow/Jake, and they win. Which is what is occuring if they're T-T, I don't think a single player is really against it. Akarin did try to pair them, I suppose.

i suppose i'll concede that akarin isn't actually super likely to be scum but i'm having a hard time committing to a townread on her

you're like my only strong townread other than uncrowned

[Necessary Sneasel]

Ok Gloria I see.

So I'm thinking Uncrowned, Sneasel, Gloria, and Akarin should get out of here first. The only paranoia I harbour there is maybe a slight one on Akarin. Could do well to get that out of my mind, I suppose, but we are also gonna be really pressed for time and if one of these is wrong, extra time would be good.

slightly prefer subbing you for akarin here but i do think the game goes in two different directions depending how gloria/akarin flip so meh

How would people feel about me trusting Shelly?

Dad?

i don't feel like i townread shelly enough to want to trust her, and i'm worried a scumflip from her would accomplish nothing
is it bad i'd rather roll the dice on hectic than shelly atm?

[Necessary Sneasel]

Ok Gloria I see.

So I'm thinking Uncrowned, Sneasel, Gloria, and Akarin should get out of here first. The only paranoia I harbour there is maybe a slight one on Akarin. Could do well to get that out of my mind, I suppose, but we are also gonna be really pressed for time and if one of these is wrong, extra time would be good.

I think Hectic is pretty high on my town list now as well. If Uncrowned rejects his offer, I would accept Hectic’s. I’ve long harboured a secret crush on his avatar but please don’t tell Pooky. The last time I brought a date home, it didn’t end well. :/

spicy

[Necessary Sneasel]

It's probably not exactly Jake-Rainbow, so I have to be concerned with who's the scum with them, but I can't come up with a decent answer as of yet.

pooky is scum lol

[Necessary Sneasel]

So I just asked Eqi what would happen if one scum trusted the other and they said that it would show up on the trust count.

eh I made a mistake, we've been over this and acknowledged uncrowned's reaction was more likely to come from town anyway

keep up, what are you thinking about the game of mafia were playing?

[Necessary Sneasel]

I could do that, but I wanna stay in the game longer if possible.

why & why should we remove us 4 before you?

[Necessary Sneasel]

If he's scum with Rainbow or Jake, he's more or less committing to losing because both he and they are going to be around too long. Pooky's only interested in pairing off his daughters. Oh, maybe his dislike of you as a potential suitor is tactical, though.

if he is he needs 1-2 incorrect peoole in the PoE to win and after he became PoE'd he started shading

yeah it's tactical

[Necessary Sneasel]

sigh Fidgey.

You don't even know who this guy is.

He could be an axe murderer.

I am an axe murderer, y'all need only concern yourselves with who I plan to murder

Pooky, why is Shelly scum?

Gloria, why is Hectic town?

His thought process seems really genuine. He’s asking lots of good questions. I’m mindmelding with him on quite a bit and his avatar is making my heart go pitter patter.

quote 3 of his posts and tell me why you agree with them and why you think you two having the same conclusions is town indicative

[Necessary Sneasel]

if he is he needs 1-2 incorrect peoole in the PoE to win and after he became PoE'd he started shading

He needs at least 3 townies in the scummiest bunch of players to win.

I think this is an important distinction.

I'm saying he needs to introduce about 2 people in that scenario assuming our PoE is pooky/RR/Jake

[Necessary Sneasel]

I can't believe my daughters are falling for a brit just because he has a cute accent, a top hat and a white rabbit.

i have a cute accent too

are we your bane?

[Necessary Sneasel]

I am confusing as a matter of habit, I make no apologies for it

Yes absolutely, I think Pooky sticks to a tact and his cute pocketing tact isn't working so he's pivoting to polarising the playerlist (part cute pocketing, part discreet shading). If I had to make a guess about Pooky's meta I'd say he's probably pretty good at scum, but when cornered or scared quickly runs out of angles to play. I think Pooky as either alignment should be realising that he's a liability at this point and think his inability to adapt is a guilt indicator.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I trust Gloria

No need to accept this, Sis. But if you want, we can decide we don't need no man (or woman/wolf/demon thing, whatever) and drive off together into the sunset with the radio turned up too loud and the wind in our hair.

I was thinking of doing this too ngl

[Necessary Sneasel]

just without the cool outro. If Gloria and I end up together we'll probably just go have a cup of coffee as friends or something. I dunno.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I mean, I feel like Pooky already has me pocketed for life independent of alignment. In this and all future games.

he seems to have that effect.

[Necessary Sneasel]

that's not all that far off my reads I think

[Necessary Sneasel]

akarin and Gloria concocted this ice cream flavor in the scum pt. wrap it up folks, that's the game.

[Necessary Sneasel]

just without the cool outro. If Gloria and I end up together we'll probably just go have a cup of coffee as friends or something. I dunno.

mocha latte

I’m a girl with expensive tastes.

it's my shout, as long as you promise we don't have to be cute and couple-ey. u////u

[Necessary Sneasel]

I guess for the memes

I trust Gloria

[Necessary Sneasel]

i'm gonna start getting overconfident soon

[Necessary Sneasel]

i trust hectic

uncrowned you should probably be un-trusting and letting someone other than you/gloria do this

[Necessary Sneasel]

oh unless you actually want to leave with hectic

that checks out

[Necessary Sneasel]

uncrowned didn't you feel it when our eyes met so many years ago? it was meant to be us, all along.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I'm just gonna settle this

I trust Gloria

if she is scum playing this well and correctly intuited that she needed to softclear herself long enough for uncrowned to fall for hectic then MY GOD I'm going to get this wrong later

[Necessary Sneasel]

So the problem is, now we can only leave 1 town unpaired.

Pooky >>> Jake > RR > shelly

we're in a pickle

[Necessary Sneasel]

I trust Fidget

Cheers, I wanted this to happen yesterday at some point if we had time

[Necessary Sneasel]

I am BACK

I've fallen behind in like all of my games, so I'm just going to play from page 19 and look to new horizons. Give me some important pointers if I missed them.

Fidget is still cute. Has been generally towny.

Gloria Cleary replaced Rockhopper and will surely post enough that you'll be able to read her soon.

Jake The Wolfie has been prodded. Flirted with Pooky a bit but didn't propose. Has had no real content.

Necessary Sneasel has rabies but is pretty likely town. Thinks I'm scum because of the post I quoted just above this one. Also was doubting that Uncrowned was town for a while even after previously trusting Uncrowned, but has since decided that was paranoia and is trusting Uncrowned again.

PookyTheMagicalBear is my father.

Rainbow Reads

?

?

?

?

?

?

shellyc is someone I have no faith in my ability to read and hasn't done anything really notable but has been questioning Sneasel a bit

Uncrowned is probably* conftown.

I suddenly have little faith in reading shelly too honestly, she's shifted her meta a lot and I'm scared

Uncrowned looks conftown to me unless he's scum who wants to stick around to shitpost, but nah, probably just town

Read back on that Sneasel paranoia and I actually kinda like it, it's like really unnecessary as scum and rules lawyering in a good way on something I didn't even notice. It's unnecessary at the end of the day if he's scum, since Pooky would just repropose at some point and it'd put the matter to bed

Jake Jake Jake....

Pooky, do you want to fall into my arms?

Pooky if you don't fall into my arms I'm going to drop kick you to the floor

Why'd you say this? Do you read Pooky as town?

Someone needs to go over this with a fine toothed comb.

not sure scum goes this defiantly at not having a decent read on their partner - this doesn't feel hectic/shelly

[Necessary Sneasel]

im actually mad that people that are likely!town twisted my word choices into a "tmi slip" though

elaborate on why this annoys you, you're capable scum right so surely you get called out on shit all the time?

[Necessary Sneasel]

That’s not an answer though. If you’re right and both of you remain unpaired we still win.

I'm willing to be unpaired

most concerning post from u in a while

[Necessary Sneasel]

Pooky refused to trust fall with me while making it clear he hard tr me. That makes absolutely no sense for him to do that as scum.

this is a pretty counter intuitive approach to partners in this setup ya

[Necessary Sneasel]

I trust Shelly

*puts on too much lipstick and smokes a cigarette*

LIVING FOR THIS YES THANK YOU

[Necessary Sneasel]

So there's 1 scum in:

Jake The Wolfie
Necessary Sneasel
PookyTheMagicalBear
Rainbow Reads

And we need to pair 2 town.

How sure are we that we can just get away with pairing Pooky and Sneasel?

I want to give that some serious thought with our Council of Eligible Young Women.

I feel uncomfortable leaving with Pooky.

[Necessary Sneasel]

i should actually filter my townposting

HURT WITH A BLADE: pooky
HURT WITH A BLADE: Jake

these two endgame

This is my ideal ending as well.

[Necessary Sneasel]

at least this isnt like that time you launched me out of the house on a catapult for your science fair project.

this is your last chance pooky in short why are you town

whatever shelly you can take responsibility for the loss/win its kind of exhausting to talk to you.

this is the least exhausting thing shelly has posted
what even is this reaction?

[Necessary Sneasel]

scum pooky is very pessimistic based off firsthanded experience sharing a scum pt with him. i can totally see this as scum!pooky trying to shift away from defending against my pressure

jake was totally scumposting after returning trying to shade akarin

My biggest issue with gamestate is that I'm amazed this isn't multiball with Jake and Pooky on opposite scumteams

gun to head I think Pooky is less likely to just totally fold as scum which means Jake is probably more likely but scum Pooky would have basically had town sitting on his neck all game so I'm also not very confident in his ability NOT to fold in this game in particular

I guess if one person in Pooky/Jake is just going to lose the game for town for no reason I would say it's Jake before Pooky (Jake has powerful chaotic neutral vibes) so like again I think it's Pooky before Jake

If I have a blind spot it's rainbow reads, I just /feel/ like their reads have a form of trajectory and that automatically makes them more towny than either of Pooky or Jake. Their read on Gloria was interesting. I didn't agree with the result but I could see how they started scumreading her at that point and she just shifted down their list. I wonder if RR's taciturn approach to this game is intentional to draw a reaction from e.g. Gloria but that's above my pay grade.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Since I'm apparently conf!scum, I'm going to slank a little while everyone else pairs off and finds the real scum.

This shouldn't be an issue if you really think I'm scum, yes?

if you're town your wincon is to be townread
if you're scum your wincon is to be townread
don't fps in the face of your wincon, just play with us.

[Necessary Sneasel]

i dont really see that level of wifom in jakes play - hes usually pretty straight to the point.

this reads tmi

[Necessary Sneasel]

I'm just gonna settle this

I trust Gloria

if she is scum playing this well and correctly intuited that she needed to softclear herself long enough for uncrowned to fall for hectic then MY GOD I'm going to get this wrong later

?

Gloria is already conf town

read 864

Pooky >>> Jake > RR > shelly

we're in a pickle

Shelly is also conf-town

the POE right now is

Pooky - Jake - RR - Sneasel.

Wasn't caught up, I'm a busy Sneasel, you're getting my realtimes.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I agree with Gloria's thoughts on Rainbow, those same posts have me worried too.

I'm just also worried that it's not

that

much and I don't agree with her logic on Jake being town. Actually I don't agree with her logic on

me

being town in one of those posts, a lot of people were putting Hectic in definitely-not-scum territory, I don't think people trying to interfere with that in subtle ways means anything.

I vehemently disagree with Gloria on Pooky being town
I'm kind of indifferent about the Jake anti hectic thing (I don't think I'd classify Jake's play d1 as engaged enough to be anti anything)

I do think Jake's mini meltdown over being universal scumread was kind of towny?

[Necessary Sneasel]

don’t really see this as scum theatre

nothing there makes me think it's not scum theatre, sorry if this sounds like blanket invalidating, I think you're a bit confbiased towards Pooky being town and I think that makes sense because I feel like he's been pocketing yoi

[Necessary Sneasel]

hm I am happy to explain either of these, sorry if I lose us the game

I trust Akarin
I trust Fidget

still trust Gloria obv

[Necessary Sneasel]

difference in Hectic’s responses to both Pooky and RR.

the more I read the more I start to think you're right :/

[Necessary Sneasel]

Oh yeah, we should do a thing where we propose to the towniest people, and have them not accept. We can "clear" people if we slowly propose to the UTRs until we have a smaller pool. So we can IC people while keeping them in the game while they can continue to weigh in

This is why I'm still worried about Sneasel actually.

honestly my eyes glazed over on 460 because it's a pretty obvious thing to point out (scum mech fluffing in hindsight) but if people are actually anxious about me let's solve around this

[Necessary Sneasel]

and just letting Equinox sort Jake-RR out.

Would you like to clarify how the moderator will sort out me and Rainbow road?

No.

I feel like reading comprehension is an important skill that we should all get a bit of practice in.

i like you

[Necessary Sneasel]

And I'm worried it was to encourage us to trust some of the at-the-moment consensus townreads first. i.e. Sneasel. Then Hectic would have been the 2nd scum in the game in that case.

If we went down the list the other way, Hectic is out first and Rainbow and Jake are endgamed. Which is bad for Hectic-Rainbow.

respectfully I am a stronger scum player than hectic and setting up weird post flip associatives then putting the scum who left with uncrowned down to a coin flip would be a tragically shitty plan

[Necessary Sneasel]

Controversial take: I'm townreading Gloria right now.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I suppose it’s possible for both Hectic and Sneasel to have tf’d Uncrowned at the same time, hoping he’d choose among them and it being some kind of gambit?

thing is I really don't feel like any of this is a *good* gambit

[Necessary Sneasel]

WiFoM

just drink the damn wine and vote whatever your drunk self feels like

[Necessary Sneasel]

i have read everything and am starting to agree with y'all that rr has a non negligible chance of being the partner

I'd like Pooky left to endgame as a wildcard before Jake at this point though

[Necessary Sneasel]

think Jake's little tantrum about being universally scumread looks sincere. it's a pretty ridiculous strat for solo scum to take rather than just, you know, doing the things we're asking Jake to do in an effort to look like town.

I don't really think Pooky has done anything towny other than clearing uncrowend, he's posting a lot but most of it is cute and pockety without effort to actually solve the game - I think he wants to look good & be seen to look good but I'm not convinced he had a stake in working out who the scum are.

I just don't trust his play here and if it's coming from a towny mindset idk how to make myself see that

[Necessary Sneasel]

hm I am happy to explain either of these, sorry if I lose us the game

You're really still worried about that losing the game?

if I was I wouldn't have done it

[Necessary Sneasel]

I have reasons to tr everyone but RR, that has to mean something right?

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have you read the substantial posts either Gloria or fidget have made about you? i think there's a lot more value in trying to find a hectic partner than calling Gloria frustrating

[Necessary Sneasel]

think Jake's little tantrum about being universally scumread looks sincere. it's a pretty ridiculous strat for solo scum to take rather than just, you know, doing the things we're asking Jake to do in an effort to look like town.

I think it's sincere too, btw. I'm just not convinced that sincerity couldn't come from

scum

being universally scumread in this situation.

this is interesting, I'm not really sure.

tonally it had some tells which were more pure than rr's reaction just now. jake "I guess I'm stuck until endgame, welp, good luck town I guess I'll try and find the scum later if it's needed" is pretty poorly considered but it's more nuanced & feels closer to a real thought than a "Gloria is confirmed town but is infuriating for scumreading me with a fair bit of reasoning and I don't have the energy to fight her right now" when to town Gloria should be very far from the problem

I appreciate this comparison didn't exist when I originally called Jake towny, I'll grant that it's probably not a clearing toneread on its own

[Necessary Sneasel]

have you read the substantial posts either Gloria or fidget have made about you? i think there's a lot more value in trying to find a hectic partner than calling Gloria frustrating

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I also scumread Pooky so you've got an easy ally in me here - sell me on it? when did you first come up with the idea that Pooky might be scum - from Pooky's posts, not the first read list where you listed him as scum. what about hectic flipping scum reinforces to you that Pooky is the partner?

[Necessary Sneasel]

maybe I'll trust Jake next

[Necessary Sneasel]

i admire your restraint gloria, you

do

have the ability to trust Pooky and force the game onto that gamble and i think it's cool that you're not exercising that

we're dealing with a PoE of
- Pooky
- RR
- Jake
- sneasel

akarin, fidget, shelly, gloria all clear (game would be over if they were scum)

I'm only clearable by shelly or someone in the PoE atm because I'm a smart ass

HEAL: jake (on the proviso Jake actually does something in the next few days), sneasel
HURT: Pooky, RR

we can check if this has maj if we want but that's pretty much pointless

[Necessary Sneasel]

there's something about gloria coming into D2 like "I was wrong on hectic but fuck all of y'all I am NOT wrong on Pooky" which is so peculiar it makes me half want to sheep her

[Necessary Sneasel]

let's say this - i will contemplate the RR/Jake endgame

[Necessary Sneasel]

hi

[Necessary Sneasel]

Noooo

If it was totally up to me, I’d trust Pooky over Jake but I’ve given up on convincing anyone of that. It really doesn’t matter anyway because I think RR is extremely obvious scum because it makes absolutely no sense for a slot who has hardly done a damn thing all game to be that upset about not escaping, because it’s beyond clear that their insistence on BOTH Pooky/Jake being unpaired only makes sense if they’re scum.

Plus Hectic’s damning associatives, plus Fidget RR metacase, plus their ridiculous shade on me and discredit on Fidget with absolutely no logical reasoning behind it. I really don’t see how it’s not them.

Hell, I’d be willing to ship everyone else if that was the only way to guarantee they never get trusted.

Oh, I just wanted Sneasel to stop trusting people other than me.

i live to stress you out

p-edit: s- stop that, my nose is very important

[Necessary Sneasel]

sneasel should i conftown you

meh
rather you just sorted the part of the poe i'm actually stressed about tbh

[Necessary Sneasel]

let's say this - i will contemplate the RR/Jake endgame

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i realised what you're saying was kind of stuff that we'd already spoken about or fairly surface level suggestions - i don't really disagree with any of what you're saying but it didn't really add anything to what i was thinking

i guess i could have just said this at the time but i didn't feel like it

[Necessary Sneasel]

i skipped the last page because gloria/rr is not something i'll be reading + jake just made a useless post

Hi Akarin, hello Sneasel.

I'm up for hugs and ice cream. I have a question for Sneasel, too: What is your current opinion of Pooky, minus sheeping Gloria's read of him?

if i could vig someone in this game it'd probably be jake but pooky would be a close second.
my god.
i am so annoyed.

pooky has reasonable scum equity and if town SHOULD have realised at some point quite a lot earlier that he's sandbagging the hell out of his wincon by being an adorable lurksack. as scum it's in his interest to be an adorable lurksack, theater a little with hectic, then stay cute into endgame while =player name here= (gloria in this case) defends him

having said that i do actually buy that RR has reasonable scum equity

i am firmly null on jake because they are doing exactly nothing this game

i hate people who say this shit but i'm at the point where i think rr is scum, who the hell knows what jake's deal is, pooky sure could be scum but i'd rather lose to him pretending to play the game than lose to jake lolcatting the entire thing except for the bit where he had a low-grade temper tantrum

[Necessary Sneasel]

i think there's a really interesting strategy in removing gloria from the game so that RR feels that they can engage the game in good faith

intentionally not making comment on whether i think their interaction is good or bad faith tbqh

[Necessary Sneasel]

i think we can win with sneasel-jake

i have a good feeling girls

this is obviously pandering regardless of alignment and if pooky is scum he's POE'd so hard he has no option BUT to pander

[Necessary Sneasel]

my dream for today would be having a gloria-shelly pairing leave and letting the POE play a bit

i'd rather not explain why shelly over fidget or akarin

[Necessary Sneasel]

Feels kind of like a tossup, I agree with Sneasel about Dad, but on the other hand, have you seen Pooky's music taste?

i really have, i'm worried a might have a bit of a crush on him

[Necessary Sneasel]

i think we can win with sneasel-jake

i have a good feeling girls

this is obviously pandering regardless of alignment and if pooky is scum he's POE'd so hard he has no option BUT to pander

That's consistent with his entire game the whole way through anyway.

So does scum accept their fate and select two other players to save, or do they fight to not be in the bottom two?

..interestingly enough, I definitely see scum!Pooky choosing "pandering" and scum!Rainbow choosing "fighting". So that sucks.

Honestly could see Pooky having a higher chance of flipping scum than Jake by virtue of Pooky being good at this kind of manipulation, but because of that very reason you mentioned earlier where I'd be way angrier losing to Jake!scum than Pooky!scum, it's hard to justify saving Jake over Pooky.

yeah i feel very similarly. if i'm literally playing to ruin the days of players who i think are scum, last pair must be pooky/rr.

but the spiteful bitch inside me doesn't want jake leaving

[Necessary Sneasel]

untrust: akarin
untrust: fidget

this is kind of superficial because i doubt either of you are silly enough to accidentally hammer leaving with me or w/e

i do think akarin/fidget is a good pairing though i'm not sure if i'm really ideal to have in f4

i can't really set up a good f4 in this game

[Necessary Sneasel]

i admire your restraint gloria, you

do

have the ability to trust Pooky and force the game onto that gamble and i think it's cool that you're not exercising that

we're dealing with a PoE of
- Pooky
- RR
- Jake
- sneasel

akarin, fidget, shelly, gloria all clear (game would be over if they were scum)

I'm only clearable by shelly or someone in the PoE atm because I'm a smart ass

HEAL: jake (on the proviso Jake actually does something in the next few days), sneasel
HURT: Pooky, RR

we can check if this has maj if we want but that's pretty much pointless

I really like this post from sneasel


feeling better now about staying behind with RR.

meh
rather you just sorted the part of the poe i'm actually stressed about tbh

i like this guy now

fidgey u r so smart

issue #147 with pooky, I didn't really think either of these posts were towny...lol

I nearly deleted the first one because I have no idea what the point of it was, I was just kind of waffling and restating my POE in a different way in case anyone substantially disagreed

the second one is exactly what scum Sneasel needs to say to shelly in that situation unless I'm feeling like a BADASS and I'm like "yeah duh lemme cash in that sick towncred fam"

idk like in all of my posts I feel like I'm consistently towny but neither of those posts felt like things I'd expect people to consider as turning points into townreading me? I feel generally fairly obvtown though so whatever

[Necessary Sneasel]

sorry i'm aware #1116 is probably fairly anxiety inducing to townies but it was irking me

[Necessary Sneasel]

:X

i was looking for a bit of a reply to this

do you feel like pooky actually has a read on me?

[Necessary Sneasel]

Who is not ok with a Jake/Snevil pairing?

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Gloria is not a puppet master, or a master of the dark arts, or in control of your body in any way. This means that she is not forcing you to respond to her answers. The only one who is making you respond to her answers is yourself. Unless you have evidence that she is capable of controlling your body against your will, stop insisting that she is the reason why you cannot stop interacting with her.

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It is not an opinion. You indirectly made the claim that she was somehow forcing you to interact with her. I am asking for evidence of this claim. Instead of dodging or deflecting, could you try supporting your claim with evidence?

part of me wonders if this string of posts is jake seeing something like what gloria is seeing in RR or whether i'm looking for reasons to townread jake

[Necessary Sneasel]

what is love if not a leap of faith?

I trust Uncrowned

The geek in me often gets triggered when I see the term "Leap of Faith" used, if only because of the way the Assassin's Creed Franchise gave it so much meaning in the earlier games only to rip it away in Assassin's Creed Odyssey, fundamentally tossing away what was one of the original and most recognizable traits of the legendary group.

Anyways.

It feels good being valued for once.

This is tragic. I am sure you will find someone better to dance with <3

I will sleep alone and sad tonight.

I am glad my townread on you was at least correct :3

i feel so guilty right now

this is not a rejection i promise

i am just torn

it's ok, what's not meant to be,

is not meant to be.

Untrust : Uncrowned

I think you should dance with Akarin, her eyes glow like a thousand stars when she looks at you.

i need to go for a bit, i'll talk about this later.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Briefly -

I know I've spent a lot of time looking for reasons to townread Jake and then telling myself I need to walk away and approach it fresh later.

Same and I don't think there's enough content in Jake's iso that I'll ever feel fresh enough.

@Sneasel, I don’t want to exit the game unless I’m beyond certain RR never gets trusted.

I can't promise this. I can promise that there's an extremely low chance of me ever trusting RR, and that they will very likely be one of the people alive at the end of the game.

If we're wrong on RR and we decide that they will absolutely never be trusted, then the remaining scum in Pooky/Jake doesn't need to do much to accidentally win. Even without me trusting RR, the moment I say "never", the game gets easier for scum Jake or scum Pooky - and I'm not going to do that.

RR is relying on the narrative that they are unable to play the game with you in it. That narrative might be true, and might be false (as you, Jake, and others suspect). But if we force RR into a situation where that narrative no longer exists, they necessarily need to play harder, making them easier to read.

I think RR is scum, too. Pardon the chess analogy but removing you is like a "check" against them.

[Necessary Sneasel]

how pretentious and non-brief.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I forgot I trusted Gloria - I won't untrust that but I think she should leave with shelly, or one of akarin/fidget as a compromise, rather than me.

[Necessary Sneasel]

You're probably right but you're also confbiased, which means RR's narrative is that they feel oppressed by how confident you are about them being scum. If they don't feel confident that they can play the game with you here, that narrative isn't going to change.

I understand that it's hard to empathize with RR on this. RR needs to engage more with the game, and you're town so we need to remove you at some point. Why not do both of them together?

[Necessary Sneasel]

It’s not about empathy it’s about scum getting a foothold. I don’t believe I’m “confibiased”, confibiased means it’s just my opinion, where as all of the available evidence - which I’ve already laid out the points - very clearly leads directly to them.

I think you're attributing too much negativity to confirmation bias. Confirmation bias on correct reads wins mafia games - I think you're probably confirmation biased on a correct read.

Some of the stuff you're highlighting makes a bunch of sense with scum!RR, some of it is just content which could kind of happen regardless of RR's alignment.

Either way, RR doesn't feel that they can play the game while you're here. You're town so at some point we'll need to TF you. I sincerely think there's a huge benefit in removing you sooner and leaving RR in the game so they either feel comfortable engaging, or if they're scum as we all suspect, need to change their narrative.

I think you're right. All I'm saying by confbiased is that I think you're absolutely certain that you're right - I don't think that's an unfair comment.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Gloria, propose who should leave the game before you.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Gloria, propose who should leave the game before you.

I ship you and Shelley

for now

That leaves me and two other confitown + Pooky, Jake, RR.

why shelly and me?

[Necessary Sneasel]

I trust Sneasel

sorry if this loses the game town

i had a Sneasel dabbing image for this moment but I can't be bothered finding it so please settle for a shorter shitpost:

YOU FOOL
IT WAS ME ALL ALONG

[Necessary Sneasel]

I'll leave the game today

do you support my Gloria/shelly suggestion?

actually in general, other than Gloria, does anyone else see what I'm getting at by suggesting Gloria/shelly need to go together?

[Necessary Sneasel]

dot points because I'm tired.

- RR won't advance their reads while they feel Gloria is shutting them down
- Gloria isn't evaluating her RR read because she feels absolutely correct (nor should she really, I wouldn't if I felt confident)
- we can have two living scumspects at endgame, and the only way for us to evaluate the POE (including RR) is to have them evaluate each other
- RR will not become more readable as long as Gloria is alive which means they are anchored to the POE, this isn't a constructive gamestate.
- we need to sort Pooky/Jake satisfactorily and Gloria's "I townread Pooky but I'm so sure it's RR I'm fine having him alive at endgame" does not convinced me she's able to sort Pooky/Jake satisfactorily

[Necessary Sneasel]

I'm not going to be sorry for trolling, there's another universe where uncrowned picked me and I could be on a beach somewhere rather than here tearing my fur out

[Necessary Sneasel]

I deserve to amuse myself at everyone's expense

[Necessary Sneasel]

including my own

[Necessary Sneasel]

I wish I was a hectic alt

[Necessary Sneasel]

it is so tempting to just leave and let the rest of you sort Gloria and the POE out

Gloria I wasn't looking for "I agree" or "I disagree". I was looking for you to explain why you think it's better that you're here in endgame.

if people don't see what I'm getting at with Gloria and we're wrong on RR and y'all trust the wrong one I'll be disappointed

[Necessary Sneasel]

the sky isn't falling lol it just feels like such a obvious way to check scum's narrative that I'm confused you're disinterested in taking it

whatever, I'll go with what akarin/fidget want. this game is rapidly moving towards a Jake/RR final 2.

[Necessary Sneasel]

that's pretty misleading. your being in the game only doesn't effect it if we all proceed with the assumption that RR is absolutely scum. they have said clearly that they can't bear this game because of your presence and I think that shines through more than their alignment does.

that's the last I'll say on this to you because I really don't think you're following what I want to talk to you about. I need more minds on this. if akarin & fidget are also in favor of keeping you in the game and praying RR is scum, my ability to follow through on this concern is very restricted.

[Necessary Sneasel]

actually in general, other than Gloria, does anyone else see what I'm getting at by suggesting Gloria/shelly need to go together?

I understand why you're saying it, I just disagree that it matters I guess.

alright if you're all satisfied I'm along for the ride

that's pretty misleading. your being in the game only doesn't effect it if we all proceed with the assumption that RR is absolutely scum.

they have said clearly that they can't bear this game because of your presence

and I think that shines through more than their alignment does.

that's the last I'll say on this to you because I really don't think you're following what I want to talk to you about. I need more minds on this. if akarin & fidget are also in favor of keeping you in the game and praying RR is scum, my ability to follow through on this concern is very restricted.

Okay, you’re actually being mean now. I won’t engage with you if you continue to do that. :/

that's nearly a direct quote? - I don't intend to be mean here, just honest.

[Necessary Sneasel]

It's really a LYLO situation with a bunch of spare ICs around and I do like us all being around, but maybe RR would play the game more once you left with someone, Gloria. I assume Sneasel wants it to be me and Fidget because of who he thinks will personality clash with Rainbow and who will try to draw them into the game. I just kind of feel like, emotionally, on Rainbow's part as well as the rest of us, that ship sailed like 4 real life days ago. My objection is just that I don't think it will matter, but I do think it's like objectively the right play.

yeah this is exactly it, if you're seeing inside my brain and aren't all that bothered than it's probably just me overthinking shit which I'm known to do

I'm also floating shelly because I think others have a greater ability to reevaluate their own reads without necessarily flipping them, Shelly's powers do seem weighted towards scumplay (she is better at getting elims through than having strong read progressions & re-evaluations).

Now I've been mean to shelly aw mannn

[Necessary Sneasel]

I also don’t think it’s acceptable that he thinks he has any kind of right to try to force me out of the game. I already compromised, did not engage directly with RR and backed off of them. It’s completely unreasonable to even suggest, let alone demand - and extremely disrespectfully and cruelly to boot - that I be forced to exit the game. He has absolutely no right to do that.

Gloria Clearly makes this game unbearable, yes.

I'm a clown, not a bully. Don't look for offense where none is intended.

Your attempt to engage RR failed. That was either because they can't play with you, or because they're scum who are relying on the false narrative that they can't play with you.

This failure isn't a fault on either of your parts exactly? Sometimes people just don't like each other? Like it would clearly be easier to talk to RR if they weren't stuck in a game with a player they can't stand engaging with. That's not me talking, that's human emotions talking. I can't fix the fact RR made this post. I can only advocate for a gamestate where we can try to better read RR.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I disagree, what he said to me was entirely uncalled for and nasty. I don’t see how it’s the right play because as I have already said, I don’t believe RR will become more readable but Pooky and Jake likely will, so why shouldn’t our focus be on the players who have already demonstrated their willingness to be readable over a player who has shown no interest in doing so? I backed off and did not engage them to test Sneasel’s theory and it made absolutely no difference anyway but now that Shelley has mindmelded with me on Pooky town which you might not realize is huge, I think it’s more a matter of who pairs with whom first and the order of their respective exits. I still of course want to hear more from Jake but I feel pretty confident we can win with pairing Pooky. However, we will have plenty of time to see what both he and Jake does in the next phase and of course, you, me and Fidget should hopefully all be in sync on that.

Jake still isn't posting
Pooky is still posting the same cute drivel as all game except people are starting to townread him via some Poe issue because Jake and RR are refusing to post

Neither of those players are becoming more readable. How do they become more readable? If we approach the POE in good faith and give RR a chance. That adds pressure to scum in Jake/Pooky's need to survive.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Gloria, I don't think Sneasel is trying to insult you. He is just relaying RR's wishes because he wants to force a game state change that he thinks will be better.

removing people really doesn't make a difference- it's just having fewer town voices here.

the decision has to be made regardless.

This still looks exactly like how scum Pooky needs to be playing this gamestate

I'm sorry but whaaaat

[Necessary Sneasel]

I feel like 1217 intentionally ignores the entire strategy behind why I'm suggesting what I'm suggesting in a way that plays perfectly into the gamestate shifting towards people trusting you.

I legit don't think anything you've posted is towny

[Necessary Sneasel]

Jake still isn't posting

What do you mean by "still"?

I've read better posts from a damp crumpet

where is your head at this game?

[Necessary Sneasel]

I swear Pooky is gloating but now I'm aware I'm confbiasing

[Necessary Sneasel]

if Fidget has no issues I'm going to trust Pooky just to get this over with

[Necessary Sneasel]

Because you're a lurksack, Jake. We need to solve this game around you, and that means I need to evaluate how likely I vs. other town are to be correct.

[Necessary Sneasel]

Jake, you've got an indeterminate amount of time to make me change my mind. If I get annoyed in the meantime you're endgaming.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I feel like if Pooky is scum I'm going to be in postgame massaging my temples but if he's town I'll feel very at peace

[Necessary Sneasel]

I think this is probably the only time I will play with Jake. Damp crumpet etc.

[Necessary Sneasel]

I mean any scum in RR/Pooky is surely fairly confident that Jake is just not going to get TF'd

This could be the t/t ELo situation which loses town a bunch of games (with Jake being scum), or could be a situation where the scum in RR/Pooky is confident enough in their mis-elim that they don't feel the need to shade the other towny (that being Jake).

Sadly don't think this game style makes typical ELo analysis all that useful and don't think any of these 3 have played enough of the actual game for us to work it out

[Necessary Sneasel]

INDETERMINATE PERIOD OVER

I trust Pooky reluctantly

[Necessary Sneasel]

I don't know you but I don't think we are going to get anything out of interacting - bye Gloria.