Open 801: Trust Fall (Game Over)

[Necessary Sneasel]

eh probably

why the "probably"? what qualms do you have?

I'm going to go file my nails instead of answer this

[Hectic]

I am BACK

I've fallen behind in like all of my games, so I'm just going to play from page 19 and look to new horizons. Give me some important pointers if I missed them.

[Equinox]

Trust Count 1.14

Uncrowned (1) - Necessary Sneasel

Not Trusting (9) - Akarin, Fidget, Hectic, Jake The Wolfie, Rainbow Reads, Gloria Cleary, shellyc, Uncrowned, PookyTheMagicalBear

The deadline is Sunday, December 6, 2020, at 7:30 PM EST (UTC-5), which is in (expired on 2020-12-06 19:30:00).

[Akarin]

When we do start pairing up, instead of pairing top townreads first, I kind of think we should pair from the middle pairs until we hit scum, then reevaluate for the last few.

akarin is scum because the four pages between this & her last post are filled with actual content and this is a really peculiar moment to pop in with a mech comment - go back and reread from her last post to this one and tell me you think an akarin who is reading and trying to solve the game makes this post without commenting on anything else

unconscious guilt over me saying I was going to trust her is showing

bet on it.

Yeah that was a prod dodge.

[Akarin]

you think Jake and rainbow are that similar? can you try rainbow again?

They obviously have different playstyles, but yeah I think they're basically going to amount to the same in terms of difficulty reading. Neither strikes me as the scummiest player, for reasons I mentioned before, and your previous point on Rainbow, but at the same time I'd be super-hesitant to bet the game on both of them being town near endgame.

You disagree?

[Akarin]

I am BACK

I've fallen behind in like all of my games, so I'm just going to play from page 19 and look to new horizons. Give me some important pointers if I missed them.

Fidget is still cute. Has been generally towny.

Gloria Cleary replaced Rockhopper and will surely post enough that you'll be able to read her soon.

Jake The Wolfie has been prodded. Flirted with Pooky a bit but didn't propose. Has had no real content.

Necessary Sneasel has rabies but is pretty likely town. Thinks I'm scum because of the post I quoted just above this one. Also was doubting that Uncrowned was town for a while even after previously trusting Uncrowned, but has since decided that was paranoia and is trusting Uncrowned again.

PookyTheMagicalBear is my father.

Rainbow Reads

?

?

?

?

?

?

shellyc is someone I have no faith in my ability to read and hasn't done anything really notable but has been questioning Sneasel a bit

Uncrowned is probably* conftown.

[Akarin]

Oh, and I suggested we pair Rainbow+Jake first.

Read my ISO for me explaining it over and over to Gloria, I think I eventually explained why well enough.

[Jake The Wolfie]

Oh, and I suggested we pair Rainbow+Jake first.

Read my ISO for me explaining it over and over to Gloria, I think I eventually explained why well enough.

This does not appear to be the popular choice.

[Akarin]

Oh, and I suggested we pair Rainbow+Jake first.

Read my ISO for me explaining it over and over to Gloria, I think I eventually explained why well enough.

This does not appear to be the popular choice.

What makes you say that?

[Hectic]

I am BACK

I've fallen behind in like all of my games, so I'm just going to play from page 19 and look to new horizons. Give me some important pointers if I missed them.

Fidget is still cute. Has been generally towny.

Gloria Cleary replaced Rockhopper and will surely post enough that you'll be able to read her soon.

Jake The Wolfie has been prodded. Flirted with Pooky a bit but didn't propose. Has had no real content.

Necessary Sneasel has rabies but is pretty likely town. Thinks I'm scum because of the post I quoted just above this one. Also was doubting that Uncrowned was town for a while even after previously trusting Uncrowned, but has since decided that was paranoia and is trusting Uncrowned again.

PookyTheMagicalBear is my father.

Rainbow Reads

?

?

?

?

?

?

shellyc is someone I have no faith in my ability to read and hasn't done anything really notable but has been questioning Sneasel a bit

Uncrowned is probably* conftown.

I suddenly have little faith in reading shelly too honestly, she's shifted her meta a lot and I'm scared

Uncrowned looks conftown to me unless he's scum who wants to stick around to shitpost, but nah, probably just town

Read back on that Sneasel paranoia and I actually kinda like it, it's like really unnecessary as scum and rules lawyering in a good way on something I didn't even notice. It's unnecessary at the end of the day if he's scum, since Pooky would just repropose at some point and it'd put the matter to bed

Jake Jake Jake....

Pooky, do you want to fall into my arms?

Pooky if you don't fall into my arms I'm going to drop kick you to the floor

Why'd you say this? Do you read Pooky as town?

[Hectic]

Oh yeah, we should do a thing where we propose to the towniest people, and have them not accept. We can "clear" people if we slowly propose to the UTRs until we have a smaller pool. So we can IC people while keeping them in the game while they can continue to weigh in

[Hectic]

There is a deadline for trusts though, maybe it doesn't work then unless we treat the game like a blitz. first person to leave should obviously be Uncrowned, question is with whom

I Trust Uncrowned

I swear I'll catch you, Crowns, look into my eyes and see my towny liver

As for other candidates, I think Akarin is still solid off the top of my head. I should probably look back and see why Sneasel thinks she's sus though

[Akarin]

As for other candidates, I think Akarin is still solid off the top of my head. I should probably look back and see why Sneasel thinks she's sus though

When we do start pairing up, instead of pairing top townreads first, I kind of think we should pair from the middle pairs until we hit scum, then reevaluate for the last few.

akarin is scum because the four pages between this & her last post are filled with actual content and this is a really peculiar moment to pop in with a mech comment - go back and reread from her last post to this one and tell me you think an akarin who is reading and trying to solve the game makes this post without commenting on anything else

unconscious guilt over me saying I was going to trust her is showing

bet on it.

Yeah that was a prod dodge.

[Hectic]

Meh

Only reason, Sneasel?

[Rainbow Reads]

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{Rainbow Reads}

{Necessary Sneasel, Uncrowned}

{shellyc}

{Akarin}

{Equinox, Fidget}

{Hectic}

{Gloria Cleary, Jake The Wolfie}

{PookyTheMagicalBear}

{}

[Akarin]

@Rainbow

Why did Jake get scummier since v2?

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

akarin is scum because the four pages between this & her last post are filled with actual content and this is a really peculiar moment to pop in with a mech comment - go back and reread from her last post to this one and tell me you think an akarin who is reading and trying to solve the game makes this post without commenting on anything else

unconscious guilt over me saying I was going to trust her is showing

bet on it.

You dare insult my daughter?

HURT: Sneasel

[Gloria Cleary]

Because it would flip them now and the endgame would be actually readable players, and they don't seem like they're scumreading each other particularly.

We shouldn’t ship anyone unless we think they’re both town. If the majority think this then great but that’s the only way that makes sense.

Nothing about either has really pinged me either way but I want to hear from players who actually have reads on them. Like Sneasel and Fidget for example. I would be extremely shocked if either one of them flipped scum here, so I think I trust their reads the most.

don't slander me I have no reads

rainbow reads weakly town because I don't feel like they're trying to look town (this is a setup which necessitates scum being very likeable), so much as doing things which they need to do as town. their iso is very undersold.

jake has done nothing in this game

Um what? I called you one of my strongest trs. How am I slandering you?

[Gloria Cleary]

i skimmed but isnt unc conftown or something because of not accepting the Trust

Okay, I think you’re town here. I don’t have a read on uncrowned yet but Hectic will tell you that it is possible for scum to do something like that. Nothing is pinging me about him so he’s probably town though.

[Gloria Cleary]

I am BACK

I've fallen behind in like all of my games, so I'm just going to play from page 19 and look to new horizons. Give me some important pointers if I missed them.

Fidget is still cute. Has been generally towny.

Gloria Cleary replaced Rockhopper and will surely post enough that you'll be able to read her soon.

Jake The Wolfie has been prodded. Flirted with Pooky a bit but didn't propose. Has had no real content.

Necessary Sneasel has rabies but is pretty likely town. Thinks I'm scum because of the post I quoted just above this one. Also was doubting that Uncrowned was town for a while even after previously trusting Uncrowned, but has since decided that was paranoia and is trusting Uncrowned again.

PookyTheMagicalBear is my father.

Rainbow Reads

?

?

?

?

?

?

shellyc is someone I have no faith in my ability to read and hasn't done anything really notable but has been questioning Sneasel a bit

Uncrowned is probably* conftown.

Hectic already trs me. He called me “wholesome”.

[Gloria Cleary]

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{Rainbow Reads}

{Necessary Sneasel, Uncrowned}

{shellyc}

{Akarin}

{Equinox, Fidget}

{Hectic}

{Gloria Cleary, Jake The Wolfie}

{PookyTheMagicalBear}

{}

Why do you have the mod in your readslist? And you shouldn’t have me this low.

[Gloria Cleary]

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{Rainbow Reads}

{Necessary Sneasel, Uncrowned}

{shellyc}

{Akarin}

{Equinox, Fidget}

{Hectic}

{Gloria Cleary, Jake The Wolfie}

{PookyTheMagicalBear}

{}

Why do you have the mod in your readslist? And you shouldn’t have me this low.

Fidget is also too low.

[Fidget]

I don’t think Pooky is necessary lockscum by that but however Sneasel is correct about the setup. It is possible for scum to guilty themselves because if both scum trust each other then nothing happens, so yes if they do that then they are 100% guiltied.

Ahh, I forgot.

Okay, well if Uncrowned is scum then I'll think about that but otherwise it doesn't make much sense to assume S-S just because of a rescinded request. And I don't think Uncrowned is scum regardless. And if he is, we probably have already lost anyway.

Like there's a significant chance Rainbow-Jake is T-T, and in that case we remove the... noise about their lack of noise from the game. And if one is scum we'll have just done the POE paranoia elim a bit earlier than doing it at endgame. If both are scum the pairing will fail and then game solved! (No way is it gonna be that easy.)

They are likely T-T, why?

You want to pair them together because they might miraculously be scum together. Why would we do that rather than just pair off townreads and proceed from there?

I think I'm like 0.01% more likely town than random on Jake and absolute coinflip on Rainbow, but I'm not sure I see it getting much better than that, and I see some value in removing them from the equation, because statistically everyone is a bit more likely town than scum anyway.

Why should we trust them rather than kill them? Leave them alive til the endgame and see how much they want to win and then decide their fates there, is what I would think.

Oh, hang on, that probably doesn't count as a contentful post

Pooky is my soul mason
Akarin is pleasant
Sneasle is reliable
Gloria is wholesome
Jake is awesome
Fidget is cute
Rainbow Reads is fun
shelly is inspiring
Uncrowned is adorable

That should do it

Mm, I do still resent this read, for the record.

If we pair consensus town reads first we have no one trustworthy around to give opinions.

I do like this line of thinking, even if I don't get pairing the nulls.

[Fidget]

I actually almost proposed to Sneasel earlier today, not that I think he'd accept, but I'm having some paranoia there. I think he's probably more likely town than not but I don't know, something about the "I'm gonna pair with Akarin, somebody stop me" thing. Plus, if he is town, I wouldn't want him to actually accept anyway.

There's 4 hours after Sneasel proposed to Uncrowned where Uncrowned was admittedly not that active but

did

have a couple posts on site elsewhere and there's not enough scum for it to be Sneasel + Uncrowned + Pooky. So scum!Uncrowned should have paired with whichever was town, or either if they both were.

I don't see what the gambit does for Uncrowned here if scum, and it's possible that it's Pooky + Uncrowned and Uncrowned missed the Sneasel thing but I think that's

much

less likely than Sneasel seems to think it is.

I think Akarin is town now.. I like the recollection of her thought process here.

You know how when you get like halfway through a normal game and you just want to eliminate those players who have done absolutely nothing towny all game and you can't stand them making it to endgame, but then they flip VT?

I feel like that's Jake and Rainbow.

Maybe. Playing the odds, sure, random nulls have a 4/5 chance of being town. There's only a 65% chance that

both

true nulls will both flip town, though, if I understand math.

Unless we have evidence that Jake and Rainbow would do more as scum, I'm not sure it's a good idea. For example, I have known Jake to ghost out of a game when he was mafia. I want to say it was either 2d3 & Monks + Masons, but I'd have to check.

I’m curious as to why you have a slight paranoia on me but you apparently read my predecessor right so this question is more out of curiosity than anything.

Also tell me more about your Pooky paranoia. I’m trying to understand why they’re not giving reads. It really doesn’t make sense coming from either alignment.

I promise I will get back to you on this if/when I decide to fully townread you. It's not a terribly large paranoia, though.

With Pooky, it's tricky. Usually I would expect him to seize hold of a gamestate as scum, whereas as town he might just do whatever. In this game though, I am not sure. You aren't really obligated to do anything except for get trusted, as both alignments, really. Figuring out who we shouldn't trust is helpful, but technically the bare minimum a townie must do is be trusted.

Pooky can get away with not reading people terribly much and just messing around as either alignment.. I'm not sure what to expect. I'm gut-worried that the messing around, setting up couples without much game substance and all that he's doing is faked, but I don't have much in the way of reasoning or why I think that exactly.

[Fidget]

Um, the POE thing doesn't make sense the way I just said it, but it makes sense logically if you think about it.

Neither is likely to be anyone's top townread or top scumread is what I mean.

True but you can have townleans, so I think we save our strongest trs closer to the end and ship a pair that most people at least townlean both of them. I certainly won’t miss not being able to read RR’s posts in any case.

That is my thinking also.

The only worry I have is that scum has an incentive to get townread, perhaps slightly more than town do, so I might mistakenly put scum in my "weakly townlean" section as a result of their efforts. I would say I have a slight tendency to hard townread town, light townread town and scum, and then nullread town.

But I can't exactly suspect people for being townie, can I?