Mafia 81: SSW II - Game over!

[SpyreX]

With a careful analysis of the people currently in the game the following conclusions can be made:

zyzzy is a dog which is close to a werewolf
farside is a monkey
Mr.Flay IS a human - just look

BUT, EVEN WORSE

Grimmy is TWO HUMANS

AND EVEN WORSE

OhGod is TWO HUMANS AND A HORSE

Only one thing to do

Vote OhGodMyLife

- Even with short days there's no way I'm not havin funvotes too.

[SpyreX]

Gasmask - that could go either way. You could be a human trying to HIDE, or a werewolf pretedning to be a human thats hiding therefore.. . *explode*


I know its Nibbler - so, zyzzy is a Hyper-Intelligent Space Dog.

[SpyreX]

Hey now, I thought this was still fun jokin phase.

What I was implying (knowing that wolves are town in this one) was a WIFOM joke:

1.) He could be a human trying to hide his filthly humanness behind the mask.
2.) Or he could be a wolf pretending to be a human thats pretending to hide to see who comes after him.

I guess it was just a poorly worded joke based on your avatar.

[SpyreX]

Bandwagons produce information. A discussion of whether my actions were scummy, whether I'm scum or not, helps the town. If it results in my lynch, it's not helpful for me, but information-wise an informed lynch (even a wrong one) is a Good Thing.

I think that, of course, looking at voting histories and how bandwagons formed does help the town. I also understand that the first few bandwagons that ebb and flow with the tides are normally started from jokes or spurious claims to see how people react.

Only problem here is a day one policy lynch out of the start really doesn't tell me a lot about anything or anyone except that you come of scummy for it. In fact, it actually creates a way where scum can hide easier on the bandwagon forming for you (as in the raw amount of scumminess a policy lynch holds) - I'm not voting you yet, but as it seems we are out of the joking time.

unvote

FoS: Xyzzy

[SpyreX]

Good LORD I need a preview before post button - I'm still not used to a game that moves this fast.

But, I think my post answers most of the questions addressed to me.

[SpyreX]

Ok, time to go back into the fray (btw I love this game already for the speed).

Xy, after reading everything I only get a more scummy vibe from what you're doing here. This really sticks out on me:

Just because something is the random voting stage doesn't mean we don't hold it up to some standard.

This is said in response to my joking vote (which, so far is the main point of your vote on Korts as far as I can tell). Now, of course we should hold even jokevotes to -some- standard. However, it does not appear that you were really kidding with suggesting a policy lynch and, even if you were, wouldn't that need to be held up to the same standard you're applying to my joke / Korts response? To me it really feels like there is a doublestandard there and I dont like it.

Aside from that, the only other things so far this game that have caught my notice:

1.) Nitro and Flame's coming in with the vote without seeing whats going on (not really bothered because, hey, we DO need some jokevotes even in a 3-day long day)

2.) For a fast game we've still got some lurkers that I'm really hoping start posting.

3.) I didn't like Flay trying to kill the jokevotes out of the box - I think that it, regardless of speed, does help set a tone for how its going to go.

My FoS stays as for now.

[SpyreX]

Flay,

The reason why I dont like you trying to kill jokevotes out of the box is that, honestly, the joking helps set a tone and will give topics of discussion more than a random vote will (for me at least).

A perfect example is the fact that I, personally, am not just going to random vote someone BUT it sure looks like my joke vote sparked some discussion. Part of what lead us to this.

Phoebius,

I'd like to see more contributions - I was prodded when I was asleep and it looks like you, who hasn't said really anything, asked for the prod. Why?

[SpyreX]

I don't like that we are being caught up in only one thing here though. Can't see anyone as being all that scummy right now because ZZ seems to be forced on the defence and not much else seems to be taking place.

I, personally, am trying to watch what everyone is doing but

nothing

has been even remotely as scummy as this whole zz situation. It's not even the fact that the initial vote was a policy lynch as much as how transparent and misdirected the defenses of it have been.

Aside from that, the only other player that's -really- catching my eye is Phoebus.

1.) "active lurking"
2.) The prods when he's given no real content.
3.) This one really gets me:

Well, to be entirely honest...I saw something about Grimmy but don't remember what.
For now, he's not done anything to make me want to unvote.

So, you're voting for someone but you dont remember why yet, somehow, he's still holding your vote? I dont get this at all.

That aside, ZZ has been far more scummy to this point and the only reason I haven't voted is because I'm hoping for more discussion and dont want to push the tide to him being hammered yet.

[SpyreX]

Putting my vote where my mouth is? Wow. Even though I may agree with you that he's scummy, I =still- dont like the way you're trying to push others to make their decision.

I think ZZ is scummy based on his actions, not some kind of awesome bandwagon I feel the need to be a part of.

ZZ has not defended himself well, or at all. I was hoping for a real defense of those actions and, if thats not forthcoming.

Vote xyzzy

[SpyreX]

I'm gonna be sporadic until late tomorrow - I'm going to try and check in, but if not I'm giving a synopsis of my feelings so far on whats going on (needless to say, my vote isn't changing).

Why ZZ is scummy -

I'm not going to rehash everything involving the policy lynch and the whole set of terrible defenses brought up trying to justify it. However, one thing above all that stands out and really makes me go hmm...

i'm voting for the person who overall has acted the scummiest. At this point in the game, not everyone has even posted, so that's not a very large pool of info to choose from.

At this point, he has his vote on Korts. Korts had what even I could see as a quasi-legimate question about how I worded things and, once -I- replied, removed it. Now, there are other Korts related developments that come later in our discussions, but at this point he's basing this off one thing Korts said versus all other points of discussion. I really, really dont like this.

Why Phoebus is scummy -

This is an exact copy of what I said before, and he hasn't said anything that addresses any of it.

1.) "active lurking"
2.) The prods when he's given no real content.
3.) Voting for someone but not remembering why but not doing anything that wanted to make him unvote.

Why Rogue Shenanigans is scummy -

One thing that really gets me in games is the "bystander defense" - I can understand using what was -said- to try and putting it into context (Flay and Rogue both did this in explaning why I didn't have an "obvious scum slipup by seeing how what I said fit in with the other things I said). However, Rogue later jumps past that into a mental-defense of ZZ -

It was his first post on day one, a simple bandwagon to get things moving out of the random stage as fast as possible. Thats how I see it at least Don't read too much into it.

I -do not- like this. No WIFOM or anything else, at this point in the game defending someone on WHY they may or may have not done something is bad for two major reasons to me:

1.) No one should be clear and you sure as hell shouldn't be defending WHY they did something without context.
2.) If they are scum, you are simply giving them a reason for a scummy action AND you are setting yourself up as a potential lynch when they die and flip scum.

With the addition of the "Chainsaw Defense" to me it looks like Rogue both defended ZZ and then turned around and starting attacking OGML who is, by far, the most aggressive ZZ hunter at the moment. That together really bugs me.

Distancing himself by saying he's attacking the methods and not because of the target -kind of- works but, with that one post that really reads as an unnecessary defense it bothers me.

My feelings on everyone else -

OGML - You are very aggressive, but so far I understand that you are not pigeonholing yourself and are watching ALL the players.

Korts - You seem to be spiraling; after a 'questionable' vote on me (which I understand at least) you've seemed more a parrot than trying to add to whats going on. I'm not liking it.

Farside - I'm very ambivalent. I understand your reasoning with Korts to a degree but your post on this page sits wrong. Something with the use of the quote there. I'm really not sure why.

Flay - Of the active players, right now I think you are the least scummiest. I'm not going OMG TOWN, but you definitely dont give be a bad vibe.

Me - I'm awesome.

Everyone else - Every other person has not posted enough or their posts have no personality that stands out. STOP LURKING FFS.

Thare we go!

[SpyreX]

To me, ZZ has been flailing and his whole policy "vote" != policy "lynch" is a terrible semantic argument and I am not buying it.

I really, really dont understand why you defended him then and -still- seem like you are defending him.

Honestly, I am baffled at defending another player this early on and, to me, the tone of your posts are very defending towards ZZ (otherwise WHY ARE YOU ANSWERING FOR HIM).

At this point, I'm thinking ZZ is scum and, really, if he flips that way its going to take an act of god for me to not think you're his buddy.

Vote count

(13 players alive = 7 to lynch before deadline)
(4) xyzzy – Mr. Flay, OhGodMyLife, Flameaxe, SpyreX
(2) Korts – xyzzy, farside22
(1) Grimmy – Phoebus
(1) Mr. Flay – Grimmy
(1) Jenter Brolincani – Nitro Styles
(1) OhGodMyLife – Rogue Shenanigans
(1) Rogue Shenanigans – Korts

Not voting:

Jenter Brolincani, killa seven

Deadline:

Monday 9 June 1:00 PM (GMT -5 according to forum clock)

[SpyreX]

I'm off for about 24 hours. I stand behind my posts as they are. i'll read up asap when I'm back.

[SpyreX]

Well, lets get this party started:

vote Rogue Shenanigans

Like I said yesterday, if ZZ came up scum it would take an act of god to make me think you weren't his scumbuddy. Lo and behold.

To top it off:

I would also like to note that the semi-quick lynch on ZZ could be reason for the lack of a NK. Scum could have thought they still had a day and a half to choose.

Once you guys realise that I am all kinds of town

I suggest we go after Nitro or K9

This really strikes me as:
1.) Pretty much lynch anyone but me, guys, with no real reason.
2.) That once you guys realize I'm all kinds of town -really- rubs me the wrong way after, of course, you'd already rubbed me wrong.

@Phoebius -

Yes, I, like everyone and their cousin, found the behavior strange. I'd commented on it more than once before I made that post. I'm not sold on you being scum (especially when compared to Rogue above) but those

actions

were and are scummy. I'm going to go look back at everything you've said and see if I can make a stronger judgment.

[SpyreX]

I went looking to see if I could get a better read on Phoebius (which I can't - his playstyle or whatever it is seems scummy to me for reasons said before). However, my look gave me another

very

scummy player.

I present to you, ladies and gentlemen: Farside

Since he's weighing in with a whopping EIGHT posts I'll go ahead and give the play by play:

1.) Jokevote for grimmy (I think its a jokevote at least)
2.) Suggesting killa seven as a kill -regardless- of alignment.
3.) Responding to prod. Saying seeing a lot of arguments with no substance.
4.) FoS on OMGL for being pushy (he is, but so what?). The first real gem:

Are you trying to get the lurkers to talk more or trying to get xzzy lynched before anyone is paying attention.

5.) In reply to Korts voting for Rogue:

Even I disagree with this. I am not attacking OMGL first of all. I'm just saying he is aggressively attacking zz and pushing for the lynch hard. I'm not used to it. I'm not defending zz either. As for this comment I think Korts lost it or is scum.

6.) This one is really a winner (especially with day 2 information):

What OMGL are you looking from zz for? Did he not explain his actions to your satisfaction?

Do you think scum to be idiotic on page 1?

These are reason's I'm not sold on your idea for zz as scum.

7.) Yet another doozy:

Says the man who has said next to nothing this game. My vote is for Killa or Korts at this point.

8.) In finale (after ROGUE has voted for him):

This should not be a surprise to anyone from me.
vote: killa seven
Also tempted to vote muffinhead.

What do I pull from this set of posts?
1.) Farside -really- seems buddy-buddy with rogue. That last killa vote, which of course has no real explanation, comes not long after Rogue does the same. Super HI-C tip: dont hold hands with the scummiest player in the game right now.
2.) In the eight posts, the only "substance" I can really see is saying the ZZ case wasn't good, FoSing OMGL for it and trying to say that scum wouldn't be so stupid as to be that scummy on page 1 (Hint - they were).

I'm not even going to FoS - my vote is on Rogue barring some kinda miracle. However, when Rogue flips scum and the game isn't over, I'm lookin your way farside.

[SpyreX]

So.. We may have two trackers and farside went nowhere?

Now, here's a noob question about how games work on here - when mafia submit a nightkill, do ALL the mafia make the kill or is it a single player that makes the kill on behalf of the mafia?

I guess my question is more - could the trackers prove an innocent OR do they just catch a guilty?

With that, though, I'm trying to think of the scenarios (I'm not saying yay or neigh to the claims or to the chance it happened - let me know if I missed one)

1.) We have two trackers. Farside did nothing because he was town.
2.) OGML is lying and tried to kill Farside but Farside was protected.
3.) Rogue is lying and got -very- lucky in picking what the actual tracker did.
4.) We have two trackers. Farside did nothing because he forgot to send in his night action.
5.) Rogue AND OGML are mafia and this is some elaborate gambit.

I'm betting I missed some, but because of how the game went I'm really thinkin its gonna be 1 or 4.

So, for now.

unvote vote farside22

Farside didn't say anything addressing the scummyness I found and verbatim copied what muffin said in response to my post about him. I need a lot more than that for me to think he wasn't just riding coattails.

[SpyreX]

Hmm... so, short of a cop investigation no one is actually cleared.

With that in mind, I still have my doubts about Rogue being town (not being a tracker, thats, to me, not in near as muhc doubt at the moment.)

I do not like Phoebius posting/playstyle but I am not getting enough of a read to say for sure if its just personal dislike of it or if it is actually scummy to me.

Farside seems like a "me too" parrot and really does feel scummy.

[SpyreX]

I may seem like a me too, but post like this with no reasoning = scummy in my book. Killa looks to be trying to distract town along with SpyreX towards me. Sure I'm not active or giving a good run with finding scum admittedly, but I'm adding more then some people.

I'm not trying to distract the town. I think you're scum. Phoebius has been acting scummy, but I'm still not sure if thats just his playstyle rubbing off on me.

If, by tonight, Phoebius hasn't tried to explain himself - I will be much more inclined to believe its not just scummy, but that he is actually scum.

[SpyreX]

With two posts I'd like to see more than just a vote from you Nitro.

[SpyreX]

I'm not 100% sold on Nitro being clean, but even if he is.. I'd like to see farside or a true luker take the bullet. I am also in favor of the tracker chain.

If Rogue is a scum tracker, could he track Phoebius regardless? Would this in any way clear him?

I know Phoebius has been lookin at me as a vig target, and I'd hate to see it happen, but I am not sure how to refute Phoebius's "feelings".

So,

Unvote

Vote Nitro

I still want to give nitro the chance to explain his lurking, but with Flay holding on the speedlynch I will put my money where my mouth is.

[SpyreX]

God, I meant to say 100% sold on ROGUE being clean, not Nitro.

[SpyreX]

I think the Nitro wagon really does help.

If, somehow, OGML, Rogue and Phoebius survive this night AND there is the vig kill and the scum kill then I'd think I'd be a lot more inclined to believe them all.

My gut tells me something stupid is gonna happen though.

[SpyreX]

Correct. I'm not sure what the deal is muffin, but I didn't think it was that hard of a replacement to what I meant to say.

Tonight's actions should really give a better read on Rogue though, regardless of what happens.

[SpyreX]

Wow, I go to sleep and more madness. Good gravy...

So, as it sits (assuming all claims are true AND town).

Town has:

1.) A cop
2.) A tracker
3.) A tracker
4.) 1-kill vig

I'm not sure what the normal spread of power roles is, but is this starting to get a little high?

Again, I guess we'll give the role a chance to claim - good thing is that, now, we either get a cop report OR the tracker-chain of love goes through.

Of course, now I'm losin what I thought were scummy targets.

As it sits I'm going to have to reread and try to get a feel for whats going on again - I, personally, think we've got a liar out of those claims up there but who I cant figure out yet.

unvote

[SpyreX]

Phoebius,

Honestly, I dont know what reasons I can give for you not to kill me.

All I can really say is I've tried my best to be proactive and forthcoming with my votes and my reasoning throughout this game.

I haven't played many games on here (this being 2) so I could not get a read on you whether it was scummy or just how you play (I still cant say 100% but I'm sure getting the feeling you ARE the 1-shot vig)

Your actual choices for your kill are low in reality - I probably wouldn't go after any of the claimed roles (let them figure each other out, which should be easy enough).

The only REAL thing I'm going to say in my defense is look back at what I've posted and see if I'm trying to help the town. If it feels like I am, line up that scope behind a lurker (or just a low content contributor).

I'm not sure exactly who I'd gun for if I was in your shoes. Hopefully its not, in part, an OMGUS because I couldn't (and can't) get a read on you.

[SpyreX]

Or... WOULD WE!

Hmm, well, assuming cop is a cop... god, I have no idea. Is it a lurker then for today?

[SpyreX]

Right now, OMGL should be tracking Rouge who is tracking Phoebius.

IF our cop dies and Rogue DID track Phoeb, then that helps clear him. If the cop doesn't then we'll know whats up.

If OGML dies well, the cop should get a result on Rogue - unless there is ANOTHER roleblocker scum as well. So

[SpyreX]

Killa,

You're either not reading everything or not expressing yourself well.

Do you not believe the cop claim or?

[SpyreX]

Well, huh.

I'm going to go ahead and say we do NOT have a Doc (at least thats how I feel) - Rogue was, to me, the obvious choice to protect to keep just this situation from happening.

So, with that, I really dont think Phoebius's target (whomever it is I wasn't in the first game and I do not see how quasi-crumbing helps) was protected from the kill.

With the broken link in the chain (assuming OGML actually tracked Rogue and didn't do someone else) we managed to pull no real information.

I see, so far, two scenarios:

1.) Everyone is telling the truth and Phoebius was roleblocked.
2.) Phoebius is scum and killed Rogue who would have seen his target be the only death for the night.

Regardless, I have a feeling we are losing another power role tonight so we better make it work today.

My questions for the veteran players:

1.) In this setup, would a recruiter and a roleblocker be a "normal" setup for mafia?
2.) With this many players AND a recruiter, what do you think the chances are we have 3 mafia to deal with?

[SpyreX]

You decided to track Eek? Why Eek instead of Rogue like the plan was?

My scales are weighted a little in favor of Eek actually being the cop, but that does bring up a few questions. Of course I'm not saying kill Eek since scum cant let a real cop live much longer anywho.

Is it normal, if there was just one mafia left, to be able to roleblock AND kill?

[SpyreX]

Before I vote I'd like Phoebus to flat out say who he "shot"

[SpyreX]

We all dead up ins?

[SpyreX]

Although I'm leaning towards that myself, I'd like more than just a vote?

[SpyreX]

I love doubleposting -

I'm out for about 2 hours. I really hope Phoebius has, at the least, flat out said who he went after and why. I really want to know what the hell actually happened last night.

[SpyreX]

Sigh, he's got until I wake up or I'm putting it one more closer to hammer.

[SpyreX]

See, I hadn't had a chance to read that game all the way through yet. I'd be surprised if I was the only one.

Who he shot would have to come out - in fact, wrapping it in riddles or whatever you want to call it (making it easier to see) does NOT help the town. If anything it just gives him longer to think up a way out of it.

We are the uninformed majority - it is our purpose to do everything in our power to inform ourselves to deal with the menace. Phoebius is not doing that.

That couple with the fact that Phoebius would have been in a situation where killing Rogue versus going after the cop (which is what I would think scum not in that position would have done) makes me think its scummy.

Vote Phoebius

You've had plenty of time to make me think otherwise and you haven't.

[SpyreX]

Sigh, making it harder, not easier to see. L2Read your posts before posting.

[SpyreX]

Let's see what Eek says - I hope he didn't target rogue...

He did. He already said he did. Furthermore that was the plan yesterday.

I've been rereading the whole thread trying to get a feel for all the players and the game as a whole. It's been interesting and I'm going to give my views on all the players and why.

1.) Phoebius -

Scum

. Not even scummy at this point. Rereading I do not like the vig claim at all and, based on the night actions, I really dont like how it went out. He is, 100%, my vote for scum for the day.

2.) Jenter -

Unhelpful Town / Mildly Scummy

9 whole posts, nothing really useful to be found in them. The reason I say mildly scummy was it was Jent who mentioned with a Recruiter 2 maf would make sense and, for some reason, that makes me question him being the secret third maf if we are wrong.

3.) Mr.Flay -

Highly Town

. Flay has actively been trying to help discussion and move the town forward. There's sure been a focus on lukers and questionable voting, both of which I approve of.

4.) Muffinhead / Korts -

Mildly Town

. Korts really felt like, although poorly, he was trying to scumhunt. Muffin's posts make my eyes hurt but, from what I can pull out he does seem to be trying to help the town albeit not what, to me, seems well.

5.) Flameaxe -

Lurker / Moderately Scummy

. Agressive without rationale out of the box and his one real post with a decent amount of content doesn't sit right. Partially OMGUS because he says he's hoping for more contribution from me by Day 4 posting. Definitely too low to get a read on and we're approaching the point where thats becoming scummy.

6.) Eek / Nitro -

Town?

Claiming cop could be a good scumroute but with tracker claims out it gets a little hairer. Nitro had 2 posts which could be luker-copdom. I think Eek, for now, is townish.

7.) Grimmy -

Highly Suspicious Town

. Not a whole lot of content but a decent amount of posts I guess (more than I thought, which says something for the content). Eluded to being able to clear Rogue if he didn't die and said he would claim today - haven't seen that claim and, honestly, would have forgot about it all together if I hadn't reread. Also, quasi-justifies Phoebius not just saying who he targeted. Blah.

8.) Farside22 -

Quasi-Confirmed Town

. If it wasn't for the fact the cop, whom I believe as of now, confirmed him I'd think he was scummy. It felt like he was defending ZZ and Rogue to a high degree and was 1-tracked on K7 aside from it.

9.) Spyre -

OMG TOWN

. I thought about not putting myself in at all, but sure. I've tried to be as scum-hunty as I can and, being able to read my PM, sure helps me clear myself.

10.) OGML -

Highly Town

. Right now, OGML would be the only one that if they were scum would make my jaw literally drop. Agressively scumhunting and trying to keep the game moving ahead. Also, as I'll point out below, smart enough not to be scum bussing a buddy day 1.

11.) Rogue -

Dead Scummy Town

. I still dont believe the flip on some level. After day 1 I was SURE he was going to be sucm.

12.) Killa 7 -

Dead Unhelpful Town

. Thats all I have to say.

13.) ZZ -

Town MVP!

. Of my reading, I think ZZ is going to give me the most help for this game. Here's my reasons (this is gonna get really meta gamey but).

a.) ZZ flipping

recruiter

scum, to me, clears both OGML and Flay. Flay wouldn't have been stupid enough to just let a scumbuddy try to policy lynch him (chances are high that one of the two would be dead for it - probably ZZ). OGML -might- have powerbussed a scumbuddy day 1 but he sure as hell wouldn't have done it to the damn recruiter. If it was only two and they were determined to bus, it would have been the other way around.

b.) ZZ tried to paint me as town to setup a town-lynch down the road if he was caught. It was subtle, but he did really try to say I, specifically, felt like town. Now, this sure doesn't clear me, but hopefully my actions will help show that I AM town and this was a, in my opinion, nice I've screwed up move by ZZ to try and get a town devoured later.

c.) Aside from the above, ZZ tried to push a bandwagon on Korts / Muffinhead. This, sadly, doesn't absolve Muffin in my mind since it could be the other side of the saying I'm town coin. Worth mentioning though. Esepcailly towards the end when he says korts is being obvious scum - this feels almost WIFOMY.

d.) The only two people he really mentions by names are Flame and Nitro for lurking votes. This, I think was just trying to sound "towny".

e.) He doesn't mention, ever, in any fashion Phoebius. Even though Pheebs put him at L-1. I know its partially because I think Phoebius is scum but this really doesn't sit right.

So, in general as it sits now I say:
Phoebius today
Lurkers need to post more
Jenter / Muffin tomorrow - depending on how things go (if there IS a tomorrow)

[SpyreX]

'Ello? Did I kill everyone with ma words?

[SpyreX]

... Huh

This is something special now.

All I know for sure is, if no one so far is lying, I think we would have been destroyed if ZZ had a chance to recruit. I mean, seriously - 5 power roles outed so far if I'm counting right with TWO vigs?

If anything, this makes me want Phoebius more. There is/was two trackers, so I guess there could be two vigilantes - but with a recruiter? I dont think so.

Again, night actions are going to play a huge role in tomorrow's debate, so I'm not sure what more I can pull without it.

I would like to see flameaxe say something though.

[SpyreX]

Good LORD another person with a kill-role?

I was having a hard time internally buying TWO kill roles with a recruiter for balance reasons...and now we have three?

I'll go on the record right now saying that I will be highly surprised if we don't have a liar somewhere in those three one-shot vigs.

[SpyreX]

Of course, from the above I'm leaning towards Pheob being the liar. If not, I'm really not sure.

The Alpha, again, increases my belief we dont have a doctor.

[SpyreX]

Well... crap.

Lets get some actions out from last night and see what the hell, if anything, we can find out.

[SpyreX]

Wait... we have 3 trackers? I thought it was Rogue and OGML.

I'll reread again - I am 95% positive Phoebius claimed first.

[SpyreX]

I, too, am just a werewolf (aka townie).

I'm kinda glad I'm not the only one.

[SpyreX]

Well, I'm not going to push for WHO, but I think I'd like to see our vigs utilize their shots before they get eliminated.

We've got 8 left with, probably, 1 mafia in there.

We've got one cop-checked townie, and, to me, 3 highly likely townsman (Jenter, OGML, Flay).

We've got 3 potential kills today (1 lynch, 2 vigs) if no one is lying on that front.

IF 3 of the others were eliminated today (including me as a potential target) I think the chances are very high that we would hit a mafia there.

The only problem is that if I'm wrong and there is 2 mafia and we hit 3 town then we would lose after the mafia nightkill.



On a side note - huge

FoS: Grimmy

not for the grandpa comment, but you haven't really contributed anything all game and are being a lot more active today out of the gate. I'd like some content.

Even with that: BM, I think the grandpa comment was just more joking (not what I'd build a case around)

[SpyreX]

Actually, my plan requires knowing if, even if they are killed, a vig's shot goes through.

It was like this:

We hang A
Vig 1 kills B
Vig 2 kills C

If B & C dies, but no one else, B or C is most likely the mafia. If B, C and another die, B & C are probably cleared (and chances are we've won at that point).

If B or C lives, we have an obvious liar.

Of course, if one is killed and their shot doesn't go through this falls apart.

[SpyreX]

EBWOP: I think that line should read, "If B & C dies, but no one else, 1 or 2 is most likely the mafia. If B, C and another die, 1 & 2 are probably cleared."

God, yes. (I apologize for mistakes I make today - yesterday was a huge work deadline and I haven't "slept" yet. I'm a little off).

Also, what does EBWOP mean?

Please, let me know what I'm missing in that plan. I think instead of just killing power roles we should use them to ferret out mafia OR themselves if they are liars.

The only thing I could see that would cause an issue would be a roleblocker, BUT if we hang the blocked one and he comes up legit I think tracking down the roleblocker would be easy enough.

[SpyreX]

I guess, also, do we know if the flavor on death is different for a shot versus a humanizing death?

[SpyreX]

Ohh game, now I get to do something I was railing on someone for doing before, defending another player!

So, lets just get this ball a rollin'

Spyrex’s explanation in post 39 makes no sense, and undermines the defence of him which was on the grounds that he just made a mistake.

If it doesn't make any sense to you, thats fine. It was an obvious joke after my other jokes that I was, in fact, trying to make fit the kind of paranoia often seen in these games. I didn't care about undermining my 'defense' because it was pretty damn obvious that I was, in fact, joking in context. I was just explaining the joke for Korts.

Post 99 by OGML stinks of setting up multiple lynches.

No kidding? What tipped you off..the fact he said it outright? Based on how that day was going, OGML wasn't the only one thinking just that. I sure as hell was.

He originally claims that he doesn’t want to vote for Xyzzy yet, but under pressure from OGML, concedes promptly, without fulfilling his originally stated intention of ‘waiting for Xyzzy to defend himself’

I did put my vote in and I clearly said I didn't agree with his methods. However, I agreed with him that ZZ was scummy and THAT is why I put my vote down.

Also, look at the day 2 exchange between Rogue and OGML early on. Rogue claims tracker saying someone went to farside, OGML calls BS because he was the tracker and went to farside and farside didn't go anywhere.

In this exchange, for OGML to be sucm:
1.) He took a gamble that Rogue was talking about him (fairly likely, honestly).
2.) He took a gamble that farside didn't go anywhere (with the number of power roles, highly unlikely)
3.) If he was wrong about farside, he would have hung that day, flat out - it was early enough along that outing himself for this as tracker served no purpose.

And, seriously, to think that it would have been better for OGML out of the gates to bus his Recruiter in a game where we have this many power roles is just, to me, silly. If we hadn't nailed the recruited day 1 I honestly think we would have lost - ESPECIALLY if you are telling the truth and there was a potential 3 vigs to be absorbed into the black morass.

Even with all that aside, I dont agree 100% with OGML's plan. You are right, and you are confirmable. I want you to confirm with a bullet versus a track (which you could lie about a whole lot easier).

Hell, I'll lay out my whole specific plan now for everyone to see.

Today:
Lynch Grimmy
Jenter shoot muffin
BM shoot ME (yep, I'm one of your scum targets and I'm giving you what you want because, in my mind, I'm WAY less confirmed than some of the others).
OGML track Flay.

If muffin is alive (which I doubt) then I'd push for a lynch on Jenter tomorrow.
If I'm alive (which is a much higher chance) then BM tomorrow.
If there are only two kills and we get proper flavor and both of us were shot then...flay or farside (depending on OG's tracking report)
If If there are only two kills and one is a mafia kill, well... easy as pie.
If there are three kills then it would be flay or farside (depending on OG's tracking report).
In this situation, if OGML IS actually mafia I think he's still boned - Jen and BM and farside will be cleared. Thats enough to keep him from being able to pull it off. Of course, I still hold to jaw-dropping if OGML is mafia.

The only losing situation, really, is if there are two mafia left.

Take a look and poke some holes (is it uncouth to ask the mod how flavor on death is - this is REALLY dependent on that).

[SpyreX]

Jenter,

the only reason its muffin is because muffin, much like me is an unknown.

Honestly, I expect muffin and I to be town sacrifices. I really think the maf is Grim or BM.

Flay - I am against the nolynch. UNLESS there are two mafia's left and BOTH mafia are in the subset of (OGML, Flay, Farside) this is a better situation since it eliminates more unknowns.

I am voting for Grimmy - I just haven't done it yet to allow more talk to go through before a sneeky powerlynch.

[SpyreX]

Grimmy,

Just your playstyle is why you were the sacrifice (if you are not scum) - that, and, really you are like me an unknown in this plan.

I want to KNOW that everyone has confirmed their part before I vote.

Jenter - Sent in.
BM - ?
OGML - ?

[SpyreX]

Just waiting on BM to say he's gonna shoot me.

[SpyreX]

Still waiting for BM to say if he's on board or not.

[SpyreX]

Excellent! Run through != vig shot I'd imagine.

I really hope BM comes back so we can get this party started.

[SpyreX]

It is making it seriously hard to move ahead with this, seemingly, solid plan when someone integral falls of the face of the earth.

[SpyreX]

OGML, if BM hasn't replied by then I, too, will add my vote because I do NOT understand why the sudden silence.

Have fun in Paris.

[SpyreX]

BM,

Look at post 209 & 210. In conjecture with everything else that has happened that really makes me believe OGML is town.

Post 487 Jenter says he's confirmed his spot in this plan.

Kill me TONIGHT, not vote for me now.

Nice in calling us lazy and stupid when this has been there (and I looked and never saw you saying you were going V/LA - I could miss it, but if I did, we ALL did ffs)

Regardless of what I think about anyone involved in this plan (except for Farside and OGML) it will clear or damn the rest of us. I'm not seeing what the bad part of it is. God, I'm even willing to die for it and you're voting me.

Just please confirm you're going to kill me and we can move on. Once you say you're in, I'm voting for grimmy.

Also, town, if anyone says they didn't do this plan, kill them. Its a given, but everyone should really be going ahead as PLANNED this time.

[SpyreX]

Dead in here AGAIN, blah.

I'd really like to see the plan move ahead.

[SpyreX]

Vote BM

I swear just say you're in so we can go before we get deadlines

[SpyreX]

Well, I'd really like BM to get confirmation that he did put in his shot - is it common for someone who is roleblocked to recieve roleblock flavor?

I REALLY shouldn't be alive - and I dont like it one bit. Part of the reason I wanted to die was that because I am an unknown I did NOT want the town to waste a lynch on me...and being alive DOES make me a huge suspect.

Before I get into what I think could have happened, I hope OGML can actually hop on even for a second.

Muffin, even though you're dead. The reason why I liked my plan was that IF it went off properly we would have had the game in a basket.

As it sits, I believe we have only 1 mafia left for sure, which is good. The two scenarios that really make sense (mafia roleblocker or maf didn't get in a nightkill) would only work with 1 mafia. So, we've got some time to think this out and can make another mistake.

As for who would be mafia (in least to highest)
1.) Jenter - HIGHLY unlikely now (he'd have to be a mafia vig)
2.) Farside - VERY unlikely now (he'd have to be a mafia godfather roleblocker)
3.) OGML - VERY unlikely STILL (although possible, he'd have had to bus his recruiter AND be a roleblocker AND have had that guess on day 2 AND know that he'd be in a position where, at best, tomorrow it would be him vs flay on mylo)
4.) Flay - Semi-likely (still not sold on it; the play has been town AND there was the scum losing gambit at the beginning although it could have been a situation where the recruiter sac'd himself to make who he voted for look better)
5.) SpyreX - Likely (THIS is why I'm pissed. I'm an unknown AND my plan that got us to here did NOT take into account 1 night death - all scenarios were really based on two minimum. The only reason I am not the most likely is because I, at least, know I am town and my play has tried to reflect that)
6.) BM - Highest Chance (Reasons aside, his kill didn't come through. The mafia also didn't kill - which would make sense if his role was a lie (he couldn't kill mafia style) also, his role is the floater role when everything else has been doubles. In addition, was the largest voice against what was a solid plan AND was very absent towards the end of the day).

Thats my suspicions as of now, BUT we do need more information before we can really move ahead.

[SpyreX]

Well, more role conjecture -

If OGML is telling the truth (which I believe) flay COULD NOT be a RB because he would have visited someone. Jenter, I hope COULD NOT have vig'd and RB'd.
I'm not sold on the Godfather Roleblocker (although it could be I guess - although didn't OG track him as well?)

So, really, its either BM or me. Now, I know its not me, but its up to you. I think we have this won (unless OG is the maf) so, town, decide which one of us dies today and which one dies tomorrow.

[SpyreX]

In fact,

Vote BM

A myslynch today isn't a loss, AND a mafia kill is going to make it more apparent who the dirty dog really is (but I am 90% sure it is BM now)

[SpyreX]

Farside, that doesn't wokr because if he's mafia he wouldn't show vig flavor on the kill. He'd have been outed right away.

[SpyreX]

If there WAS 3 scum I'd really be surprised. The recruiter makes it hard for me to swallow 3 - it was about the luckiest thing possible we hit it first day.

A recruiter roleblocker could happen.

However, I think we had a recruiter and a vanilla. BM is, as far as I can tell, the vanilla.

Farside, if you believe OGML's reports (like I do) BM HAS to be mafia (he couldn't have been roleblocked by flay) and flay -could- be mafia but unlikely.

BM, as far as I can tell (if you believe OGML) either:

1.) Was roleblocked (by who? It couldn't have been Flay)
2.) Is mafia (most likely)
3.) Decided not to shoot (already said he did implying a roleblock, but if he DIDNT then he should go regardless).

You are right that it really should be BM or me today. I'd just prefer it to be BM first Since I think that's game.

[SpyreX]

Yes, I could of. Thats why I am not even arguing that point - if BM isn't maf, I KNOW I'm the other person who easily could be with the way it sits.

The only thing I can really say (since somehow I've avoided EVERY form of tracking / cop) is that I'm town and I've done my damn best to make sure we win. I dont mind dying for the cause - I'd just rather it be BM first so I could be alive when we win.

[SpyreX]

1.) Yes, I think its 209 / 210. Its not "confirming" but its more clear - OGML would have had to have a series of lucky events AND bussed his partner.

2.) Dont misconstrue what I said. If there is a roleblocker, it would make sense for it to be me. However, it still could be you if you have pretty much ANY mafia role and lied about your role.

If I end up being hung, I really want OGML to track you. The way that post came out like I was setting you up for a fail (I wasn't, it could have been you or jent IF a scenario like this played out).

It, to me, is really going to be either me or BM and I, of course, know its not me.

[SpyreX]

That where's its at, I think. Personally, the rest of the town is fairly, if not totally, clear.

If its not BM, it would make sense it is me. If I'm wrong about BM I know I'm hanging and, sadly, that means that maf wins but I dont see HOW that can be the case.

[SpyreX]

At this point, I'm fairly certain based on play alone that flay is town. His tracking result actually proves very little since the mafia doesn't seem to have killed last night. It does however prove that flay can't be a mafia roleblocker, because tracking would have seen him roleblock somebody.

Exactly - and me not being shot, since I know my role, would mean BM was roleblocked if he was town and, of course, that means either flay or farside and of the two it would have been flay more likely of the two. So, either I'm a roleblocker (which I'm not) or farside is a godfather roleblocker (which I doubt) or... BM is the mafia.

Kind of a meta-question, but our mod has been good with flavor. BM said he shot, but never got any roleblock flavor as far as I can tell. Not that it would have helped (since town wouldn't have had a roleblocker to compare flavor againt) but it would have been something.

First real vote count of the Day

(6 players alive = 4 to lynch before deadline)

(2) BM (Spyrex, OhGodMyLife)
(1) SpyreX (farside22)

Not voting:

Jenter Brolincani, Mr. Flay, SpyreX

Deadline:

Tuesday 24 June 2:00 AM (GMT -5 according to forum clock)

[SpyreX]

In 210, all OGML does is refrain from actually claiming a result. I suggest EVERYONE READS post 210 again, and see what OGML ACTUALLY says. If anything, his non-committal way of claiming a result is another strong point against him. It surprises me that you didnt see this...

209:

I am a Tracker. Last night I got a result. I tracked a player to farside22.

210:

Sorry, wrong.
I'm the tracker. That makes you a scum and me awesome.
I tracked farside last night and she didn't go nowhere.

So, AGAIN, 209 Rogue says he tracked someone to farside.
210 OGML says Rogue is lying because he tracked farside and farside didn't go anywhere.

If OGML is mafia, he assumed he was the one tracked AND that farside did not have a role where he went anywhere (which, in this setup, is actually not THAT likely). OGML didn't, of course, think there would be two trackers. However, I think we have two trackers and had two berserks. Its your JOAT on TOP of them, combined with the events of yesterday, that I dont buy.

Right, so i roleblocked myself? Try to use a bit of intelligence please. Which ever way you look at it, there isnt much of a case for me being Mafia RB.

God, you're going to tell me to use intelligence and not read my post you even quoted? I said:
1.) If there IS a roleblocker, it would make sense for it to be me.
2.) BM, however, could still be pretty much ANY mafia role and nokilled last night.

I dont think you're a roleblocker, I think you're probably vanilla mafia. BUT, your role doesn't matter. Its alignment.

And what's more, claimed 2 other confirmable abilities? (doc isnt really confirmable). I've already pointed out another possibility-and perhaps one that is more likely at this point- Spyrex is NK immune scum. It fits right in with his intense desire to see me take a pop at him as opposed to anyone else-something that is utterly inconsistent with any protown role.

You really didn't see my plan yesterday? At all. Or you're actively misconstruing it.

I didn't care WHO shot who. I was, in essence, eliminating every vanilla role (grimmy by hanging, me and muffin by shooting, flay by tracking) BECAUSE I believed one of you claimed powerroles was lying. I still do. The only reason I suggested YOU to shoot me is because you wanted to all of yesterday anyways.

If I am wrong about you I hang tomorrow. Thats fine. Why is it that YOU are being so defensive about it all.

If I was mafia, I would have put myself in a position where there is no way I could actually win it. You think that I would have a chance at lylo after setting up a plan where I should have died but I didn't and yet I am still claiming vanilla especially when I could have just as easily kept my mouth shut.

So, still, I say once again: one of BM and I is highly likely to be mafia. We WILL be hung in succession. However, I know I am not and am only asking the town to believe me enough to hang you FIRST and if I am wrong then I go tomorrow.

Unless you think I've got some clever ruse to get out of that

[SpyreX]

*sigh*
I dont think you are really thinking about this logically. Perhaps its just that, from your viewpoint, double-negatives don't exist. But, speaking personally, when i read what OGML ACTUALLY SAID, my first thought was that he was saying that he had seen Farside go somewhere, and didnt want to claim where.

The fact is, OGML claimed in such a way that he could not possibly be wrong. That you can't see that is really staggering... 0.o

We're looking at two different parts of it. I've heard lots of people say didn't go nowhere, actually. But, yes, that is a valid concern.

However, as far as I can tell you're saying this is the scenario that played out that makes OGML scum:

1.) Day 1, very early on, he busses his recruiter scumbuddy out of the gate, resulting in a lynch.
2.) Day 2, in response to Rogue (who REALLY looked like scum) claiming he tracked someone to farside he counterclaims tracker and uses ambiguous language to make it readable either way.

Now, my problems with this scenario: (ohh WIFOM, how awesome you are)

1.) I still can not see how bussing, that early and that actively, your recruiter in this game is a good idea. Even with 2 mafia (which is what I believe), and now knowing the role structure they had, all the mafia had to do really was lay low for 2-3 days and they would have won, hands down. Hell, I think there is a scenario where they could have won night 2 (I'd have to play it out, but I think its possible).

2.) No role-discussion had happened that day 2 yet. Rogue did feel scummy from day 1. WHY would you cc tracker when there are so many other roles you could use to say why you were tracked to farside ASSUMING that you were the one tracked. Instead, I see that whole thing as OGML instantly calling bullshit because he believed Rogue was fake claiming tracker.

So, to me, OGML telling the truth makes a lot more sense than him being both a bad mafia on day 1 and a lucky / poor decision making mafia on day 2. I've said, since then, if he's scum my jaw would drop and I still believe that.

And yet you encouraged Jenter to shoot MuffinHead, who he had shown no real emnity towards. Why?

Hmm, maybe because you said more than once you wanted to shoot me?

Grimmy, of us totally unconfirmed vanillas, looked the most scummy. He made the most sense for the lynch canidate (since, of the vanillas, he had the highest chance in my mind to be scum).

Aside from that, there was two totally unconfirmed vanillas - me and muffin. There was two claimed vigs - you and Jenter. You said you thought I was scum, so I was letting you shoot me. Jenter, at that point, had the other.

Also, if there was gaping holes in this idea, is the whole town scummy? I think most people thought it was a good one because it WAS a good one - even this scenario should result in a town win.

What? You mean you wish you hadnt claimed vanilla? What would you have claimed if you could go back and try again? How would 'keeping your mouth shut' help in a mass claim?

This plan was MY idea. I thought it had the best chance of clearing the most people. Why would I have brought it up if I was scum? Why not just let the town do whatever (as long as it wasn't getting ME killed). No, instead I made a plan that should have killed me and if it didn't would have put me in the spotlight some. Thats not really smart if I'm scum.

I dont see why you are that worried about being hung last, if you genuinely believe i am the last scumbag? I, on the other hand, think there is a strong case for OGML to be scum- and not necessarily with you either.

You're right. Honestly, as long as the town hangs you, I dont care if its me first. If the town decides to vote my way I'll hammer myself - as long as you realize that you will be tomorrow. Just like how if I'm wrong with you.

Maybe because, the more i think about it, the more i realise that there is no real case for me being scum.

No case?

1.) The only scenario(s) in which you are not scum are I am a immune NK scum OR I or OGML roleblocked you.
2.) We've already got a pair of vigilantes. You're claiming a 3rd vigilante role (even if 1 shot) in a small game that had a mafia recruiter.
3.) OGML, your major suspect, is built on -so far- one piece of evidence that is very fragile at best.
4.) Yesterday, from a look, it really seems as though you were the only one really against this plan and NEVER made solid reasons for it.
5.) You wanted to track and not kill OGML even though you're so sure he's scum - because, of course, if you had killed him it wouldn't have been a vig kill AND it would have been the only mafia kill. Tracking isn't hard to do, especially when the town lays out what every power role is doing.
6.) Personally, you posting first saying "where's my kill" and then telling the mod to be sure to check his PM's also bothers me (this is 5 because it matters the least).


So, really, if the town wants they sure can hang me first. When I come up vanilla, I sure hope to God they dont even listen to the backpedaling that will have to happen.

BM isn't a roleblocker, but he sure is scum. What type doesn't matter one bit because ANY type would have been able to do exactly what happened last night.

[SpyreX]

Can you explain to me why you're so hell-bent on being dead with BM, even though you seem to believe it will result in a lose (post 573)? Maybe I'm stupid on a Monday, but that's only true IF we have two scum left AND no saves occur at night, right?

If I am wrong about BM, especially with the way this all went down, barring some kind of magic, I can not see the town not lynching me next. Hell, I'd do it.

I dont think we have the ability, assuming everyone is telling the truth, for there TO be any saves left - so, tomorrow we'll be at 4 if I am wrong and I would be the optimum lynch target.

So, yes, I'm so sure that BM is scum that I have put myself in a position where if I am wrong I think the town will lose because there's no reason whatsoever to not hang me. Hell, how could I really defend my thought process and the events of today without Bm or I being scum?

So, maybe its a martyr thing - all I'm saying is that I am so sure of:
1.) There being only 1 mafia left and
2.) It being BM
That if I have to die for it thats fine. I'll still win, but I really wanted to be alive during the celebration.

[SpyreX]

Unless I'm wrong about Jenter, I don't see how it can be anyone BUT SpyreX or Battle Mage.

Maybe I'm just wording everything I'm saying wrong. THIS statement is why if BM dies and is town I expect to die tomorrow. It makes the most sense it is one of us.

However, if it IS some other scenario, my push on BM will result in both BM and I dying which, of course, makes the town lose.

Flay, I thought about suggesting letting BM use his night action again but (since I think he IS the scum) my money would be on him faking a tracking report (which would be easy enough since all the roles are known) or claiming roleblocked...again.

Really, there isn't a way now for BM to clear himself. At best, he'd make it a 50-50 shot tomorrow if I died today.

Having no protective roles left also makes it more difficult. Otherwise, I could use OGML to clear me (or, if the scum gambit'd create a no-lose situation for the town tomorrow). However, as it sits, BM and I can not really be cleared.

Okay that silliness is over. I think there is 2 scum. No one can tell me differently. Either SpreX or Flay or BM and Flay. Those are my thoughts. Looking at the fact that both BM and Flay are voting SpreX and with 12 hours left and Jenter not in sight. I feel a bit safer voting BM with OGML then Flay's vote

Farside, I really, really do not think there are 2 mafia left. If you want, I can detail out the multiple scenarios where if we started with 3 mafia (and one was a recruiter) where the town was flat out boned (day 2 win if coordinated right, easily).

I'd like to see what Jenter has to say about everything.

[SpyreX]

Lets put it like this. Assuming you die today, and we have an NK tonight. That leaves myself and 3 other players. 1 of whom is a claimed Tracker himself. OGML can track me, and i can track whoever. If his claim is true, he will see me track whomever i do, and NOT kill them. Do the math.

All thats going to do is create another gambit:

If you are scum and there IS a nightkill:

OGML: I tracked you to the dead person
You: Nope, I tracked (not dead person)

Its either of you.

If you are scum and there is NOT a nightkill:
OGML: I tracked you and you did nothing.
You: Nope, I tracked (anyone).

Its either of you lying again.

Or...and this is what I'd bet. We move forward and... OGML is the night kill.

None of that would confirm you. We do not have a doctor to protect OG and you could very easily lie. So, no matter how it goes, I'm not seeing how you could be cleared (any more than I could).

I'm also not getting how flay is cleared but og isn't for day 1 in your mind. Both were cleared for the same set of reasons.

OG - I still really doubt there is 3 mafia. I -guess- farside could be godfather but I dont see it as likely. My analysis of this game as well as my gut points to 1 recruiter + 1 vanilla mafia for balance and us getting the recruiter was about the most amazing thing we could have done. 1 recruiter and 1 godfather could be, but doesn't seem near as likely with how useful the recruiter is in a small game like this.

[SpyreX]

Look at the timings of the votes. Flay voted towards the end of the wagon, and hence, would not have missed the kill, except as a gambit. OGML on the other hand, could easily have been caught off guard.

You're now saying OGML bussed his partner out of the gate and yet, somehow, didn't think to send in a kill request?

Please, dont do what you usually do, and cast a half-baked vote that didnt have alot of thought. I actually expect you to LEARN from all the times you get me killed and you're wrong. Where's the meta analysis?? Christ, where's the thread reading?!

And you're telling him to meta with the gamblers fallacy instead of looking at how the last 2 days have went down?

This is really looking like flailing before the noose comes up.

[SpyreX]

As an aside, what is scumchat? I'm still mega-new and that one I dont know.

I haven't even thought to look at Flameaxe's play before the replacement, but I might go ahead and do that

[SpyreX]

I didn't see much about Flame -

He votes zz but says he didn't read before his vote (yet left it there). That, easily, could be playing both sides of the fence if he was scum.

Aside from that, just one-half of a megapost that, honestly, didn't even really get the feel of the game to that point. It seems like (and I am probably clouded some because BM is mafia) it was an attempt to interject without actually taking a stance/saying anything of merit.

Soo.... yep, no real changes there.

[SpyreX]

1. Was 96 hours too short time for a day? (I actually preferred the 72 hours pace used in my first game – but maybe that’s just me)
2. Any opinions on the night choice mechanic – that you had to PM it before the deadline?
3. Any opinions on the private communication (werewolves) could go on at all times?
4. Was the game balanced considering power roles?
5. Should I permit conditional night choices (= kill X, but if X is lynched I kill Y instead)?
6. Would you join another swift game? why/why not?

1.) I liked it. After the other games, fast is better. I would love to do a 72 and you were a great mod. So, keep me in mind if you have another coming up.
2.) IF the power roles can use conditionals, I think it will work fine.
3.) I think scum should always be able to be in full communication. So, yes. A neat way to do it too.
4.) With the revelation that it was only a 1 night recruiter, yes. Scum tracker seems, honestly, kinda useless in comparison to other scum roles. Also, two vigs was an interesting call that could have cinched it for the town or made us lose off the bat. So, I like it.
5.) YES! Without the time for night action (which I like, because of the speed of the game) the conditionals are almost a necessity.
6.) Without question. This one was a lot of fun and I'd do it again in a heartbeat. Like I said, look me up when you mod another.

BM - you played a great game (I was worried there for a minute that I was actively leading the town to a loss getting both of us hung). However, I still couldn't dig OMGL actually powerbussing - if that was the trick he pulled, he would have earned the scumwin from me.

[SpyreX]

If anything, it was my genuine suspicion of him that hindered my attempt to get YOU lynched.

I agree, and the funny thing is that if ZZ was almost any role but recruiter I probably would have been pushing for the OG lynch a bit more (or at least hoping the cop checked him). Recruiter is one of those FEW roles the maf has where it'd be worth it to even appear a little scummy to make sure they live long enough to recruit and there was no hesitation on OG's part.

Like I said, you played a damn good game, but it was just one of those reaaaly tough situations to pull out. If we had lynched anyone but ZZ day one I think it would have went really different.

[SpyreX]

I'd like to know too.

[SpyreX]

^ Preach on Korts! A bigger SSW would be boss and if Joo doesn't get me in it I'll make voodoo dolls I swear.

[SpyreX]

Muhahaha I added myself whether you like it or not.