667: Random C9 (Game Over!)
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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I don't think that's the scummiest action so far, I also don't like how you label it as such.KrisReizer wrote:
I see backpedaling here. You first attacked my random vote and now you agree with my defender. Mind you this is early in the game, but this is the scummiest action so far.JDodge wrote:
I am aware. Conversation doesn't just happen because someone places a vote - you have to stir the pot before the true flavour of the soup comes forth.afatchic wrote:Jdodge. votes can result in a lynch, but they have many more uses than just lynching people. you can use it to force pressure on people, get conversation started, which is what all this is doing right now.
Lastly, I don't like how you tell off Moo for not having content filled posts when other's have posted less content. I get the impression you're looking for an easy fish to fry.
Can you put the number of the game in the title/first post please Sim?-
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charter Beware of Dog
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I don't see a contradiction there. I think it's bad how he had to come back later and add to his statement, but I don't see contradiction or backpedaling.
You don't necessarily have to have found all the scum by page two. I don't think agreeing is necessarily scummy, because some points need to be reiterated. I'll give you that this one didn't need reiterated. Twice.KR wrote:If you'll notice, I'm frying everyone on whom I have a lead. As an explanation of my attack on Moo, I ask you to consider this. On whom can I make a better argument? Someone who has posted very little content? Or someone who has attempted to fake adding content? The reason I call Moo's post scummy is that it added nothing to the discussion, but attempted to look as though it did by containing an agreement with a statement already on the table.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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Note really accusing you, just throwing my opinion out there.KrisReizer wrote:
That's called a defense. When someone attacks you, you're supposed to defend yourself. In a logic game, I do that by showing the flaws in the arguments that state that I am scum. I've given support for all my actions. Where's your support for this accusation?charter wrote:So... KR is grossly reacting to everything, especially comments directed at himself.
No. (also I just noticed that your name isn't a bunch of random letters, haha)afatchic wrote:does anyone else see a problem with my post 25 and 41? i think they fit thee situation good.
unvote, vote MoospikerPage three is way too early to claim. Clearly fishing for power roles.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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This post screams scum. Every time I've seen someone 'come around' to a case against someone such as the one on Moo, that person has been scum. Need to do a reread before I reevaluate where my vote is.afatchic wrote:yeah one quick point is that in post 97 by KR that is actually moospikers quote not mine, i got really confused because i didn't remember saying that. but yeah i don't like how he just kinda gave up defending himself and said believe me if you want, but i don't have anything else to say. at first i just got a newbie town feeling from him, but its quickly changing. can we get a vote count before i vote him?-
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charter Beware of Dog
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You said you used to have a town feel of him, but it's quickly changing. This changing the read of a player in this manner is used by scum to switch over onto the next hot (and in this case, lynchable) wagon.
It's the manner in which you're changing your assessment that I find to be perfectly in line with how I see scum doing it that is making me suspicious of you. I would understand a sudden change to thinking he's scum based on something (such as asking for a claim too early) but you're doing a gradual shift when Moospiker's posts don't give me town vibes at all, and certainly don't facilitate a slow change over into thinking he's scum.
I think I can do my reread shortly as well.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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Don't buy this. But that said, there's another acceptable place for my vote, which I'll get on when I get some free time.Moospiker wrote:Fine, I'll claim. I'm cop.
From page four.Moospiker wrote:Damn!Please, can everyone post a bit more?Quickly?DPQ. Caeser-shift back a letter = COP.
There you go.unvote
I would call you a smartass and quote my earlier statement for you again.MM wrote:What if I asked you "Can you give me your specific thoughts on afatchic, Vi, Avynil, MM, Moospiker, and JDodge?"-
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charter Beware of Dog
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He only comments on Moospiker asking for a claim after others have said that it was horridly scummy. Also votes for a lurker, not the person he finds scummy. Ironic as he averages one or two very short posts most pages.Avinyl wrote:KrisReizer: Rereading, it seems you have explained it sufficiently for me.
afatchic: The point was that he would vote and in the same post be ready to unvote, which felt wrong to me at the time.
Those posts that i picked out was those that stood out to me while i read the game. I didn't particulary search after scummy posts you had done.
On another unrelated note, I currently find Moospiker scummy, partly gut, partly because of the unsubstantiated demand for Krisreizer to claim. I think he currently has 2 votes already, so FoS Moospiker.
I also find starrie lurky. 3 posts, the last of which was three days ago, and next to no content.Vote starrie. JDodge hasn't posted in six days.
Flip flops on Moospiker. Moospiker hasn't done anything less scummy since asking for a claim.Avinyl wrote:Hm. I am unsure about Moospiker. rereading, he doesn't feel as scummy as before.
Oh, look at that, being suspicious of Moospiker is popular again. Also ignores some questions directed at him (which I think he definately should have answered).Avinyl in 98 wrote:Moospiker's post 98 fels very wrong. It is not a good thing to stop defending oneself.
Also ironic as his reason for voting starrie was lurking and starrie made one post, and said essentially nothing.Avinyl wrote:Unvote Starrie. On further rereading, Moospiker feels wronger and wronger to me, but mostly it is just his post 98. I am going to be away until monday, but if I'm lucky i may be able to post something.
Also agree with MM's summary in 149.
For the constant flip flopping, hypocracy, and ignoring questions directed at him and important events in the game as they occur (or waiting way too long to respond to them).
vote Avinyl
Did you miss the 'when I get some time' part? I really haven't made a case on anyone else, so I felt like it might be a good idea to post some reasons rather than an out of the blue vote.jdodge wrote:Also, points off for charter for saying he has somewhere acceptable to place his vote yet does not actually do so.
Ummm, so who are you more suspicious of?Moospiker wrote:Hmmm... I'm going back to thinking KrisReizer, and subsequently Vi.
Unvote, Vote: Vi
I wasn't clear, I could care less about the breadcrumb, with one that extremely vague, I'd bet money he threw a doc one in there too somewhere. I don't buy his claim. That said, I'm not interested in lynching a claimed power role in any of these setups on day one.vi wrote:@JDodge and charter: Both of youse said you didn't buy Moospiker's breadcrumb, but unvoted anyway. Considering you were both adamant about Moospiker's lynch as recently as Page 6, what swayed you?-
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charter Beware of Dog
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Some questions directed at avinyl.
And in post 68 there's more.afatchic wrote:
you seem to be jumping around a lot, but why doesn't he feel as scummy as before? im still unsure about him but in the opposite way, his remarks just sound like an agrevated newb scum to me.Avinyl wrote:Hm. I am unsure about Moospiker. rereading, he doesn't feel as scummy as before.
I also figured out a pretty damn good reason to not believe Moo's claim, Anyone think it's odd that he asks for a claim when he himself claims to be a powerrole? What was he hoping to hear? Oh, I'm the doc? Not protown in the least to out the doc. Possible there's a slim chance it's a second cop, but like I said, very slim.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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charter Beware of Dog
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I'm still convinced he's guilty. Where have I backpedaled there? I said I'm not interested lynching him today, I even reaffirmed that in 179, where have I shown otherwise?
If you're going to accuse me of something, do it, don't make half assed statements like that. But to shoot your point down anyway, do you not see a difference in asking for a claim on page 3, when one of the votes was from page 1, verses asking a claim on page 7 at L-1 and with others saying they are suspicious of the person?Vi wrote:And last,
This is interesting in light of the L-1 claim question.charter 139 wrote:Gathering from Vi's read on you, you should claim now.-
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Which question?Vi wrote:I was referring to your refusal to answer M-M's question.
I don't have a town read on afatchic for sure, but I don't think anything he's done is on the avinyl or Moo level. I'll have to go reread the following people case, I didn't think it was the strong, but didn't consider it too heavily.Vi wrote:So, have a direct query - What is your opinion of afatchic, and the general mullings-about that he's parroting people/following you around?-
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Not interested in lynching a claimed cop day one. This is the fourth time I've said that I believe.eld wrote:charter, if you don't buy the cop claim, why unvote?
You think scum would counterclaim someone they know isn't scum and is claiming cop?eldarad wrote:
My gut reaction was that Moo plays mafia elsewhere and he was following whatever the meta there is. A second plausible reason would be that he wanted to catch the scum out in a fake-claim.charter wrote:I also figured out a pretty damn good reason to not believe Moo's claim, Anyone think it's odd that he asks for a claim when he himself claims to be a powerrole? What was he hoping to hear? Oh, I'm the doc? Not protown in the least to out the doc. Possible there's a slim chance it's a second cop, but like I said, very slim.
I would like Moo to comment further on this.
Post 162. Your opening post didn't help your case either.eldarad wrote:
I hope you have a good explanation for this.charter wrote:Waiting for avinyl to get lynched.
Still haven't read it yet, will shortly though.Vi wrote:Even so, you have no comment on my line of thought vs. afatchic?
Still think avinyl/eldarad is scum.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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Vi, sorry, I kept forgetting to reread. I don't think there's a whole lot to your afatchic following me theory, though I'm obviously biased.
Your first one, my post 111, I saw his actions as bad because he did not immediately do it. I don't think that it was me specifically he was waiting for, but just someone's opinion. I just happened to be the first one to do so.
I don't really think 123 is a solid one either. I just don't see any motive behind him as scum doing that. No town motive either.
136 is the one I think has merit. I don't think the bad part of this post is so much 'following' me as it is him voting Moospiker for absolutely no reason (other than to spice up the game and my declaration of him being scum)
141 I think is also bad for him. If he actually feels the same was as I do, I think he would have posted it himself rather than just piggy backing on me.
As a whole, I don't think there's really an 'afatchic is following charter' case, I'd say it's more of an 'afatchic is following everyone' case. However, you did have good points, and while I'd prefer an avinyl lynch, I wouldn't be opposed to an afatchic one.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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True, but if two people claimed cop in day one, I'd be all for lynching one. The two cop scenerio is too unlikely in my opinion. If Moo is cop and someone else claimed before him, I can't imagine not seeing a counterclaim.eld wrote:Given that Moo hadn't claimed cop at that point, scum wouldn't be counterclaiming anyone - they'd just be claiming. Given your stated position that you don't want to lynch a claimed cop even though you don't buy his claim, it would be a pretty good claim for a scum to make, wouldn't it?
Also, I only said I don't want to lynch him today. Tomorrow is a whole different story.
You gave virtually no original opinions. A lot of what you said was a rehash of what has been said or happened, or you talk about your 'gut' which is really an excuse to say whatever you want. All in all, it wasn't an impression opening post, and certainly didn't do anything to alleviate my concerns about your predessor.eldarad wrote:
How so?charter wrote:Your opening post didn't help your case either.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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You, you just make a few open ended statements on him. You don't give an opinion on him either way.eldarad wrote:
I think my opening post gives my opinions pretty clearly, whilst - being a catchup post - it inevitably also includes the points that I thought were interesting as I read through.charter wrote:You gave virtually no original opinions. A lot of what you said was a rehash of what has been said or happened, or you talk about your 'gut' which is really an excuse to say whatever you want. All in all, it wasn't an impression opening post, and certainly didn't do anything to alleviate my concerns about your predessor.
Reading my opening post, can you determine my opinion on Moo?
Yes, this is the only player you elaborated on. You set yourself up to vote him. I get the impression that you saw he's the easiest target besides yourself and are gunning for him for that reason.eld wrote:On afatchic?
Barely, the obvious answer is you don't agree with it, no one agrees with their own wagon. I find this a pointless question to ask me.eld wrote:On the Avinyl wagon?
I've read your posts, I still think you're scum.eld wrote:The fact that you criticise my for using my gut shows that you haven't actually read my post recently, if at all. That bothers me, given that you're trying to lynch me.
No, but what I mean when I say I'm not opposed to an afatchic lynch is that his lynch will give lots of information regardless of his alignment. It isn't an obvious mislynch.eld wrote:Do you think afatchic is scum then?
I think it makes him slightly less useful, but I don't consider usefullness a scumtell.eld wrote:What do you think about my idea that afatchic hasn't expressed any opinions on this actual game, preferring instead to talk in abstract theory terms?
How does that impact on whether you think afatchic is scum?
Sure am. I think you're scum, doesn't much matter to me who hammers you.eld wrote:Are you satisfied with the current situation, where afatchic is currently in a position where he could hammer me to end the Day? Why?-
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That is implying I'm scum.Vi wrote:That sounds much, much more confident in your theory than someone with limited information should be.
Why aren't you questioning everyone then? The only possible explaination is that you have more information than everyone else.Vi wrote:Of course, this suspicion can't be wrong; pressuring or suspecting afatchic would be wasting time at best because he's Town by your current theory.
I'd sooner take a "suspect until proven cleared" approach to Mafia, personally.
I see your point, but you're not even trying to see mine. I don't see the need to question everyone I find even slightly suspicious. I've already said, I think AFC would be a fine lynch regardless of his alignment, but I think an eld lynch would net us scum.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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That was my summer job. There was barely any work for me to do, so I did whatever I wanted. It's schooltime now, I should update that.
Eld is just out trying to discredit everything I say. Looks like he's been caught. I'm fine with afatchic getting lynched, I don't think he's scum, but he hasn't done much to help us out either.
I don't understand your vote for me, but don't much mind. The only problem with it is it isn't being used to lynch eld.-
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charter Beware of Dog
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This is actually getting quite ridiculous. I'm not in this game to defend afatchic. I'm not in this game to defend why I think someone is town. I'm in this game to catch scum, not townies. I'm not going to say why I think afatchic isn't scum anymore, or why I don't care if he's lynched. This is the last time.
I do not think afatchic is scum. I think Moo/eld are scum. I think afatchic's lynch will give us lots of information to go into day two with and will be a good lynch.
Don't ask me again, I'll ignore everything you write from now on if you do. I'm tired of wasting time not lynching eld and talking about afatchic. If that's who you guys want to lynch, you're going to do it without my vote, get used to the idea.
Really? You catch all the scum day one without knowing anyone's role/alignment? I don't believe it. It gives us something concrete to work with in the coming days. This is a basic and fundamental principle in mafia. Let me ask you this, what is better for the town on day one, lynching a townie after 10 pages, or lynching scum in the first five posts?What additional information would an afatchic lynch give us over and above knowledge of his alignment?
It's not cut and dry... Depends on how someone does it. I don't jump all over every scumtell I see, that's how you get tunnel vision on townies that screwed up.Do you think that reluctance to name players as prob-town, or as definite-scum as scumtell?
See above.Do you think that a reluctance to scumhunt, preferring instead to talk in abstract terms about game theory, is a scumtell?
He has. I don't think he's done them in a very scummy manner however.Do you think afatchic has done either of those things?-
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Cute, just as expected.
Vi, those statements don't contradict. You're wrong about the second part too. Also, don't answer questions not directed at you, you influence the answer of the person's answer I'm interested in hearing.
JDodge, I've already commented on the matter several times. Useless is not scum, do people really not realize that?
Eld, No one else has asked me anything that isn't related to afatchic, and my opinions really haven't changed in a while, so I haven't had anything to discuss. If you want to talk about something I haven't already talked about at length already, ask. I'm fine with any lynch as long as it's not an obvious mislynch.-
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Vi, I siad I THINK they are scum, not that I've solved the game already. Something you probably don't know about me, I overstate my suspicions bigtime.
No, it's quite possible he's scum. I don't think he is, but he's certainly not what I'd consider an obvious mislynch.Vi wrote:And an afatchic lynch is not an obvious mislynch to you?-
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I don't understand what just went on. Vi, you get that I'm calling eld out for his blatent trying to make it seem like I said or insinuated something I never have?
I would have to go back and reread JDodge, he really hasn't done much in this game, but I haven't thought him very scummy.
No.Is it okay to lynch someone you don't think is scum at this point?-
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charter Beware of Dog
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Wait, why am I blatently linked to afatchic? I don't get that. I also don't like eld's lynch one so we know the other's alignment. Hey, let's lynch charter today. Charter flips town. Hey, that must mean afatchic is scum! Lynch afatchic, possibly lose.
Setting up lynches like that eld? At least try and be more subtle about it.-
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I've said I don't think afatchic is scum. Repeatedly. I haven't failed to do anything. I oppose the afatchic lynch (pretty sure I've said that) because it's not an eld lynch.eldarad wrote:charter has gone out of his way to create 'scumbuddy' links with afatchic. Bear witness:
- the repeated failure to read afatchic and express an opinion on him. Compare and constrast charter's actions towards Avinyl/me.
- the repeated refusal to express an opinion on afatchic
- the fact that charter neither supports or opposes an afatchic lynch
Glad someone besides me saw that as well.Vi wrote:
"Cleared" is a big word. The idea nonetheless stands; IYO afatchic would look better no matter how charter flips. Which the way you put it just sounds like an excuse for a charter lynch.eldarad wrote:
Given that I didn't say that I would clear afatchic if charter flipped town, I don't see how you reached that conclusion.Vi wrote:So you're interested in clearing afatchic from charter's flip, regardless of how charter flips...?
Unvote: charter-
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charter Beware of Dog
- Beware of Dog
- Beware of Dog
- Posts: 9261
- Joined: July 12, 2007
- Location: Virginia
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charter Beware of Dog
- Beware of Dog
- Beware of Dog
- Posts: 9261
- Joined: July 12, 2007
- Location: Virginia