Magic: The Gathering,GO TEAM MS!

[Sudo_Nym]

Which is why I'm not sure. Ideally, a combo cube should have enough beats that people who don't get there on the combo can get there on the ground, but I don't even have a clue how the balance would work for that.

[Sudo_Nym]

I suppose I could do the newbie thing, and just make my first cube a standard power cube.

[Sudo_Nym]

I've only cubed like twice, but my favorite parts were always finding neat interactions in cards I wouldn't use if the format didn't require it. I remember taking cards thinking "well, it fits the colors I've drafted", and then having some fun with it.

[Sudo_Nym]

Madcap is interesting, mathematically. It les you get a guy through and gives +3 damage, which means it's better value than Searing Spear if you land once. Really, the only real drawback to playing Madcap instead of Spear is that you need a creature in play to use Madcap, and Madcap only aims at the dome. For a Gruul Deck Wins, those drawbacks are minor.

[Sudo_Nym]

I would say you probably don't need Pyrehearts in the board if you're running Madcaps, though. I'd be tempted to run Thundermaws for the midrange match, but it's an expensive card, and costs five to play, so I'm unsure.

[Sudo_Nym]

Basically. You aren't dancing around, being subtle. You're dropping threats and making the opponent respond. Aggro wins by having more problems than the enemy can answer.

[Sudo_Nym]

Yeah, but I feel like an aggro deck would rather topdeck a creature at 4 than a Chandra. I would imagine that if Aggro is in a topdeck situation where Chandra is better than Hellrider, something has gone wrong.

[Sudo_Nym]

Personally, I just feel like Power Creep has gotten way out of control. I liked Standard back in the Rav/TSP era, just because it felt a lot more like a game with long term consequences. Now a lot of it comes down to who rips the better bomb off the top at the right time.

[Sudo_Nym]

Modern is easier to get into, I think, but requires more work keeping up with the various sets. And I find it less fun.

[Sudo_Nym]

I'm legitimately curious, Shea- what would it take for you to actively enjoy standard, from where it is now?

[Sudo_Nym]

For what it's worth, I think it's fairly clear that Standard is bad; it's why I quit playing. I guess I was asking more along the lines of "What's the practical solution?" Power creep is getting out of control, ETB triggers are everywhere, creatures are overtaking actual spells; what does the next block need to introduce to get Magic back to a more enjoyable level?

[Sudo_Nym]

I suppose that, so long as Magic's profit margins are based on "Look at all these fucking overpowered rares", there's no real hope that the trend will reverse itself.

[Sudo_Nym]

I want an entire set where every card is One with Nothing.

[Sudo_Nym]

From what I remember, Zoo is a thing in Legacy. So are Goblins, Elves, and Dragon Stompy. None of them may be tops right now, but all are viable to play. Most successful aggro does trade some of Zoo's pure aggression for some sort of combo reach- my favorite is the Zombie Bombardment deck.

[Sudo_Nym]

Well, I'm using "combo" fairly loosely. It's been a while since I've been a part of the legacy scene, but the aggro decks that were best for me were the ones that had something to reach for the last few points. It's also entirely possible that a lot of the decks I'm used to simply aren't around anymore, of course.

[Sudo_Nym]

Anything that lets me get my hands on Thoughtseize is okay in my book. Didn't want to have to spend ridiculous amounts for a playset for Smallpox.

[Sudo_Nym]

To be fair, Shea, you do hate everything. That's not related to this, specifically, but it deserves to be pointed out.

[Sudo_Nym]

You should splash black, and then call the deck "Grimm's Junk"

[Sudo_Nym]

Personally, I wouldn't bother with Forbidden Alchemy. I'd just run Opportunity in those slots.

[Sudo_Nym]

I have UR Cloudpost. It's Pauper, but might still have useful trades.

[Sudo_Nym]

Anybody see Twoo's new Archangel of Thune deck? Looks really fun, and he did pretty well with it, but it's always hard to tell with a Twoo deck.

[Sudo_Nym]

Anybody see Twoo's new Archangel of Thune deck? Looks really fun, and he did pretty well with it, but it's always hard to tell with a Twoo deck.

I've seen an Archangel deck. No idea whether it's Twoo's or not. Had Scavenging Ooze, Gavony Township, Trostani

He had a straight BW build, where he was using Soulmender, Blood Artist, and Path of Bravery to trigger Archangel, with Cartel Aristocrat and Xathrid Necromancer as an alternate sacrifice plan.

[Sudo_Nym]

Here's what I'm thinking about (haven't been able to build or play yet):

4 Gatecreeper Vine
4 Goblin Electromancer
3 Archaeomancer
2 Mist Raven
2 Saruli Gatekeepers
1 Elvish Visionary
4 Ghostly Flicker
4 Negate
4 Pillar of Flame
4 Searing Spear
3 Amass the Components
2 Divination
2 Harvest Pyre
4 Evolving Wilds
4 Izzet Guildgate
4 Simic Guildgate
3 Island
3 Mountain
2 Forest
1 Haunted Fengraf

sb
4 Thunderbolt
4 Frostburn Weird
2 Essence Scatter
2 Naturalize
1 Wildwood Rebirth
1 Mist Raven
1 Archaeomancer

[Sudo_Nym]

So who wants to test?

[Sudo_Nym]

It's a trap, Oman! MTG is an unreal realm, fraught with annoying fat kids, tryhards, and never ending money sinks!

[Sudo_Nym]

Just completely changed my deck one day before my match is scheduled:

4x Ubul Sar Gatekeepers
4x Saruli Gatekeepers
4x Ogre Jailbreaker
1x Liliana's Shade
2x Crocanura
2x One-Eyed Scarecrow
2x Grave Exchange
4x Murder
4x Victim of Night
4x Devour Flesh
2x Tragic Slip
4x Sign in Blood
4x Dimir Guildgate
4x Simic Guildgate
4x Golgari Guildgate
7x Swamp
1x Forest
1x Island
1x Evolving Wilds

SB
3x Essence Scatter
2x Psychic Strike
2x Bloodhunter Bat
2x Dead Weight
2x Natural End
4x Beckon Apparition

So I guess this is Flickerless Flicker. The deck is intended to take advantage of some of Flicker's synergies, without being dependent on them. Most of the deck is dedicated to killing my opponent's stuff so I can drop a 4 drop. I have Crocanura and Scarecrow in the main since my weakest matchup is Delver.

[Sudo_Nym]

Jailbreaker is fine; if you've got a better suggestion, I'm open to it. I wanted a more controlling deck that didn't rely on Archaeomancer, and Ghostly Flicker gets worse if you don't abuse Archaeomancer.

Mist Raven didn't make it in because it costs double blue, which I didn't want to pay. Bloodhunter Bat is in the side.

[Sudo_Nym]

Also, it's hilarious watching my opponents hold onto their negates because they're waiting for Flicker that's never coming.

[Sudo_Nym]

Lost a mirror match. Don't like to complain, but G1 I literally drew 11 lands in a row while my opponent beat me in the face, and g3 I had to mull to 5 to get a land in my hand. So I'm not sure if that result means I have too many lands or too few.

[Sudo_Nym]

Descendant's Path is really cool, but you need 30+ creatures that can trigger off it to make it work.

Personally, if I were building on a budget, I'd try RDW:

4 Firefist Striker
4 Gore-House Chainwalker
4 Mogg Flunkies
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Rakdos Shred-Freak
3 Splatter Thug
4 Foundry Street Denizen
3 Dynacharge
4 Pillar of Flame
4 Searing Spear
22 Mountain

Probably could put that together for less than $20.

[Sudo_Nym]

I have faith in Wizard's ability to exploit anything well enough to generate profit.

[Sudo_Nym]

So, I lost my R1 match, but my opponent never reported, so the judge gave the win to me and dropped my opponent. Interesting.

[Sudo_Nym]

Complete skill, I assure you. Things worked out exactly as I intended.

[Sudo_Nym]

Channel reprint plox

[Sudo_Nym]

I say they scrap Theros, and just reprint Homelands.

[Sudo_Nym]

I think the point is that you can't really tell what cards will be "core" until you get a real spoiler. Right now, you might see a card and think it's good, only for it to have bad support or another card that neutralizes it. Meanwhile, they're are plenty of cards that look meh, but become core cards because they play roles in good decks you can't plan. I think time has shown that if you want the good singles post rotation, the best plan is to buy a box beforehand and hit the trades.

[Sudo_Nym]

This card. I want to make pauper decks with this card.

There's got to be someway to abuse this is in a Kiln Fiends/Nivix Cyclops style shell.

[Sudo_Nym]

I said that style, not the exact deck. Cyclops decks use a lot of non-targetting spells to boost Cyclops/Fiends. But you still are going to be borrowing a lot of the Mizzium Skin style effects from that deck.

[Sudo_Nym]

I don't think deckbuilding is as simple as "Cut the rotating cards and look for replacements." You're going to be brewing in a new environment, and the interactions and meta are going to be different. Simply saying "Okay, this is sorta similar, so use it to replace" isn't going to work out very well.

[Sudo_Nym]

Sure, some times some cards are so good that you know you'll use them. And some archetypes like MUC are always looking for the same sort of gameplan. But most archetypes will change dramatically as the cards they need to interact with change. It's an argument that really only affects the fringe cards and the roleplayers, but would something like Crippling Blight have seen any play at all in a meta without Thragtusk? Would Dissipate see play in a meta without Flashback? Most cards are like that- they play important parts of strategies because they happen to have good synergy with other cards in the meta, or happen to neatly counteract others. Change the interactions, and you change their playability. There may not be a card like Hellrider in the new set, but RDW may not even need or want it, depending on what else there is to look at.

[Sudo_Nym]

Come on, Shea, there's no need to him. If the art helps him avoid a , then I say we shouldn't that option.

[Sudo_Nym]

You used the new art for browbeat. How could you?

It was actually quite easy.

[Sudo_Nym]

You know what would be awesome with this set? Academy Rector.

[Sudo_Nym]

Honestly, I think it's a strictly worse Drownyard. Milling is only really good in the control matchup, and this takes up a non-land spot. In the control matchup, it'll be really nice; in other matchups, it's going to be really mediocre. I'm going to want a UB control deck, but this seems like SB material, not mainboard.

[Sudo_Nym]

I agree it's not drownyard, sure. I think it depends on the rest of Theros and the format. If UB get something that can boardwipe, or if the meta is slow enough, I think Ashiok has a place in the main. If it's a fast format, then no, it's sideboard tech.

True. Ashiok's stock goes up in a slower format, and Theros looks like it's going to be slower than Innistrad was. I still think that milling is way overrated as a tactic, though.

[Sudo_Nym]

The effect is neat, don't get me wrong. But she can't protect herself, the second ability is unreliable, and the ultimate may as well not exist. It's good for inevitability in the control match-up, but I just don't see it being good enough consistently enough to bother. Every once in a while you'll mill the exact right creature, come back around on your turn, and blow out your opponent with it, but it's certainly not something you'll see happen every match. If you want a good creature to drop, might I suggest running a creature in that slot instead?

[Sudo_Nym]

Not sure how I feel about devotion as a mechanic, but I'm hoping it means mono-color becomes a thing.

[Sudo_Nym]

The effect is neat, don't get me wrong. But she can't protect herself, the second ability is unreliable, and the ultimate may as well not exist. It's good for inevitability in the control match-up, but I just don't see it being good enough consistently enough to bother. Every once in a while you'll mill the exact right creature, come back around on your turn, and blow out your opponent with it, but it's certainly not something you'll see happen every match. If you want a good creature to drop, might I suggest running a creature in that slot instead?

No, because the purpose of this is to get rid of their threats as well.

People seem to underestimate how powerful it is just to get rid of shit your opponent can't play. Especially in control matchups -- a hand with one or two counterspells is disruptive enough already, but also being able to remove threats from the game?

"Unreliable" is basically saying "magic is a game of random chance and randomness is unreliable" which, I guess, is true. But so is drawing an answer to anything, or drawing a threat. I don't get the critique.

And if her ability targetted specific cards in your opponent's deck, that would be great. But it only targets the top three. Which could be something good, or something irrelevant. You could very well mill their best creature, or a few counterspells. You can just as easily mill three lands. She doesn't remove threats that actually hit the table- she only removes the possibility of a threat, and only if it that threat happens to be in the top three cards.

I'm not saying she's unreliable because "Magic has an element of chance", and don't put words in my mouth. She's unreliable because Mill does precisely nothing to affect the state of the board, and it's usually useless until it wins- if you're getting beaten down, you don't want the planeswalker, you want an answer. If you're trying to control the board, you want a spell, not the planeswalker. She doesn't answer anything, she just gives you the possibility of maybe milling away something, and maybe getting a chance to steal it later. But so many things have to go right that I don't see it being worthwhile- you have to cast her in the first place, you have to protect her, you have to hit a creature with the +2, then wait a turn protecting her again, and then maybe put the creature you milled into play, assuming you actually hit one and it didn't cost more than 5. Otherwise, you mill again, and hope you hit something again? If you can consistently pull that off in a meaningful way, then you're probably already winning the game.

Control decks don't play Drownyard because they're trying to mill away their opponent's threats. They play Drownyard because it gives them a consistent, inevitable wincon that's difficult for a control deck to interact with. Ashiok is not consistent, or inevitable, or difficult to interact with, and she does nothing to help you win the game unless you're already winning the game. You have better uses for a card slot.

[Sudo_Nym]

I doubt the Prophet is going to see much play. She's not costed aggressively enough for her ability to matter in the current standard. If things really slow down, then maybe- getting her to stick is probably game over, if some deck can make it work. It just feels very win-more to me, though.

[Sudo_Nym]

sudo don't you not even play standard or really any actual magic

Ad Hominem. I've played lots of magic, including in the current standard. I don't play limited, however.

[Sudo_Nym]

I disagree, but the argument isn't going to be settled here. Once we see how the new format actually looks, we'll have a better idea of if she's playable or not. And if she's better than I'm evaluating, I'll be happy to admit I was wrong.

[Sudo_Nym]

Is it just me, or does Modern look like a lot more fun than Standard does?

[Sudo_Nym]

Chamber knows what I'm talking about. Mill has never been strong as a mechanic, because it doesn't affect the board state. If you're stopping to mill your opponent, you're falling behind to an opponent who is actually developing his board. Mill does nothing unless you actually won the game with it. That's why, historically, the only mill cards to see serious play either win the game on the spot (Brain Freeze), or are very cheap to put in your deck and use (Drownyard). This planeswalker is neither of those, and I don't think stealing a creature is going to be consistent enough to make up for it.

And it's hard for me to believe that Wizards really cares about interactivity and power level when they're printing four mana indestructible mythic God cards.

[Sudo_Nym]

Or the entire Hexproof mechanic, really.

[Sudo_Nym]

Right, and I don't think it'll happen often enough to matter, and it can't happen the turn she comes down. Her entire playability is going to depend on the -X ability, so we'll see how it fairs in actual play.

[Sudo_Nym]

Which is part of my point. You're stealing nothing this turn, so you're spending a three drop and a deck slot in the hopes that you get to mill and steal a four drop on your second turn. But you could have done something else with your turn three, and then played a four drop next turn anyway. And it's unlikely that a random four from your opponents deck is going to have more synergy with your deck than the four you could have played instead.

[Sudo_Nym]

Which is part of my point. You're stealing nothing this turn, so you're spending a three drop and a deck slot in the hopes that you get to mill and steal a four drop on your second turn. But you could have done something else with your turn three, and then played a four drop next turn anyway. And it's unlikely that a random four from your opponents deck is going to have more synergy with your deck than the four you could have played instead.

except....

the random 4....


costs MANA? uses up an entire turn?

Like I have no idea what you're arguing... that he could eb a different card (creature) altogether???

Planeswalkers are engines. 3 mana planeswalker engines are usuallly very good. Ajani wasn't, but what engine does ajani build? None. You need to have a creature already, so he was kinda bad.



This one is a self contained engine, that if not dealt with, will provide value every turn. You can argue that the value is bad, but I think its a powerful effect in a lot of MUs

It's a random 4, assuming you actually get a random four. You can also get a random 3, a random 2, a random 1, or nothing at all. Against a lot of decks, nothing at all is most likely- if you've noticed, even aggro decks aren't stuffed full of creatures, from a numerical point of view. You're basically giving up everything else you could have done with three mana so that you can maybe steal a creature? And engine is a little strong- it's a card that does nothing when it comes down, maybe does something the turn after it comes down, and how many times will even have a chance to maybe do something? Your opponent isn't just going to let it sit there and accumulate counters, and it's probably going to be at low loyalty if you ever actually get the -X off.

So you're looking at spending your turn milling, maybe getting something, maybe surviving, maybe getting to cast it for free, and maybe surviving to do it more than once? And this is your engine? I suppose it could work- blue is notoriously terrible in Magic, and can't possibly do anything else worthwhile with three mana, so you might as well.

And what's the Domri Rade comment have to do with anything? "I argued about Domri Rade with other people, and they said it was terrible, but it wasn't. Therefore, a completely different card in a completely different context in a completely different context with a completely different person must also be good."

[Sudo_Nym]

Interesting article on drafting in M14: http://riptidelab.com/take-it-part-one/

[Sudo_Nym]

Still a three mana counterspell, but could be better than dissipate with flashback rotating out.

[Sudo_Nym]

it does a few things if you aren't being narrow minded

Such as?

[Sudo_Nym]

Well, it's a 1 mana counter, and 2/2 birds become less significant over time. It's not a decision you snap-make, but it's worth keeping in mind.

[Sudo_Nym]

It's mostly a surprise counter. Like, countering something with it early probably isn't that great, but being able to play out a threat and still leave U up to get a Sphinx's Revelation or something is a big game. I don't know that I'd play it in dedicated control, though- it seems like more of a tempo card.

[Sudo_Nym]

It's mostly a surprise counter. Like, countering something with it early probably isn't that great, but being able to play out a threat and still leave U up to get a Sphinx's Revelation or something is a big game. I don't know that I'd play it in dedicated control, though- it seems like more of a tempo card.

Eh? Dispel did the same thing and barely saw sideboard play.

Dispel only hit Instants. I'm not saying it amazing, but it can be a solid roleplayer in the right deck. For most decks, though, you're probably just better off with Izzet charm or Dissolve or something, but if mono blue aggro or fish become things, I'd look at Swan Song for them.

[Sudo_Nym]

I wonder if the format's going to be slow enough for Monstrous to matter, or if that's just going to be a block/limited thing.

[Sudo_Nym]

Still not taking action against Mono-U control, I see.

[Sudo_Nym]

At Pauper World Headquarters:
"Mono-U Delver is dominating the format! It has amazing matchups against everything! What shall we do?"
"Ban Infect, Storm, and Cloudpost! That should resolve the issue."

[Sudo_Nym]

It's almost certainly perception, sure. I personally played against Delver a lot more than 15% of the time, though. And I never once played against FissurePost. But I played almost exclusively Tourny Practice and 2-mans.

[Sudo_Nym]

I suppose I just possess an irrational hatred for all mono blue decks in any format.

[Sudo_Nym]

How about something like this:

4x Boros Reckoner
4x Ash Zealot
3x Fiendslayer Paladin
3x Purophos, God of the Forge
4x Chandra, Pyro
4x Elspeth, Sun's Champion
4x Assemble the Legion
3x Chained to the Rocks
3x Mizzium Mortars
4x Magma Jet
4x Sacred Foundry
4x Temple of Triumph
16x Other lands

Seems like there should be a niche for a Boros deck abusing Purophos+Assemble the Legion. A bunch of first strikers to gum up the board, then start legion assembling with a couple of planeswalkers for backup.

SB:
3x Wear/Tear
2x Celestial Flare
3x Stormbreath Dragon
3x Warleader's Helix
1x Chained to the Rocks
3x Anger of the Gods

[Sudo_Nym]

It wins faster! Plus, it's really more about trying to make Big Boros a thing than trying to get a combo. Purophos and Assemble the Legion are both good cards, and they work well together. So what if it's not strictly a combo?

[Sudo_Nym]

Yep. Pro black only counts on the field. Which means it does have funny interactions with Animate Dead.

[Sudo_Nym]

I don't see how you'll ever trigger Porphorus's devotion in Esper.

[Sudo_Nym]

To change tracks completely, here's a deck I'm really liking for Modern:

12 Swamp
3 Dakmor Salvage
4 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3 Mutavault

3 Deathrite Shaman

4 Thoughtseize
4 Raven's Crime
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Duress
3 Dismember
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Ensnaring Bridge
4 The Rack
4 Shrieking Affliction

SB
4 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Pithing Needle
4 Leyline of the Void

[Sudo_Nym]

I kinda like that the new format doesn't give access to easy 2-1s, so you can play with a wider variety of stuff. We'll see if it stays that way through the block.

[Sudo_Nym]

When has any mythic rare preordered at a reasonable price? I think even that stupid Lich Mirror preordered at something insane. And I wouldn't mind a chance to play around with the Standard Dredge deck sometime, if you're offering. How much did it cost to put together?

[Sudo_Nym]

I was looking at it myself; it looks like a lot of fun to play, but I wasn't sure what Thoughtseizes and Tombs were going for- haven't played in a while. Pretty sure all my decks are out of date, now...

[Sudo_Nym]

Wall of Fire sucks no matter what, but Waste Not is going to depend a lot on the support.

[Sudo_Nym]

I'm pretty sure I don't care about the frames. I'm pretty sure you're still bitching that they discontinued the old white frames.

[Sudo_Nym]

White frames?

See? This is exactly what I'm talking about.

[Sudo_Nym]

Sudo I'm like 80% sure not even you have a damn clue what you're going on about.

Thank you!

[Sudo_Nym]

I've heard Ben S and LSV broadcast together. They always seem to have that moment where LSV wants to make puns, and Ben S wants him to stop.

[Sudo_Nym]

I heard that the "Sealed Seminars" they give at CFB events are pretty great for that sort of thing, though I've never been personally.

[Sudo_Nym]

Will probably contain cards in each of the five colors.

[Sudo_Nym]

Yeah, but I'm pretty sure MaRo said in an interview that they're going to try and introduce a sixth color.

[Sudo_Nym]

So, Bitterblossom and Wild Nacatl coming off the ban list, Deathrite Shaman going on. Not sire if that's a net positive.

[Sudo_Nym]

Deathrite Shaman probably should be banned, being basically a 1 mana planeswalkers, and Wild Nacatl probably doesn't need to be banned anymore. I'm more worried about Bitterblosssom. That doesn't seem like a card anybody should get back.

[Sudo_Nym]

Abrupt Decay is about the only good answer the format has picked up since the ban, really. And that seems like a real odd choice, since Bitterblossom is a 2 mana card that provides a lot of inevitability. But I suppose we'll see what happens.

[Sudo_Nym]

Pyroclasm was around the last time Bitterblossom was, and that didn't seem to trouble it very much- the Blossom just keeps spitting out faeries.

It's entirely possible that I'm overreacting, but I remember Bitterblossom being a big problem card the last time it was around, and I'm not seeing many more answers to it. The format has shifted, though, so maybe it's not a problem now. We'll see how it plays out.

[Sudo_Nym]

Nacatl's banning was sketchy; as far as I know, it was just to slow down Naya Zoo, which I don't remember being dominant to the point of requiring banning.

Blood-Braid Elf is probably skirting the line; it's a built in 2-for-1 for a deck that thrives off them anyway, but I'm not sure that BBE's power is the problem.

I'm still not convinced that the Verdicts are the answer to Bitterblossom, though. Pyroclasm and Wrath of God are cards that existed before, and they weren't particularly good against Bitterblossom then. Why would they be good now? The only really good answer to Bitterblossom we have that's new is Abrupt Decay, which is good, but it usually sees play in Jund, which is, ironically, the deck that benefits most from Bitterblossom. The meta will settle it, obviously, but I'm still seeing a potential problem.

Golgari Grave Troll remains banned to try and stop the power of Dredge Combo; Dredge being one of those decks that's always prepared to dominate any format that doesn't come prepared to handle it. Of course, now we've got Grafdigger's Cage and Rest in Peace, so maybe it's blunted enough? It's hard to figure what Dredge's power would actually be short of actually playing it, though.

[Sudo_Nym]

Jund loved Bitterblossom last time, because it was another way to grind out CA, and they didn't have DRS back then. I don't see why they would turn their noses up at it this time. The whole point of Jund is to grind games into victory before your opponent can take advantage anyway, and pinging yourself for 1 a turn isn't going to work out fast enough. We'll see what happens, but I'm expecting that a lot of the early Jund alterations will be -DRS, +Bitterblossom, so it shouldn't take long for the meta to decide.

[Sudo_Nym]

Modern Jund. There's probably a lot of time overlap which makes comparing metas difficult. I'm just saying, Bitterblossom is a card that grinds out advantage, and that's the sort of thing that Jund loves anyway. So why wouldn't they love this one?

[Sudo_Nym]

No idea. I don't remember when all of the bannings and unbannings and format changes overlap.

[Sudo_Nym]

And Bitterblossom makes Mistbind clique reasonable, too.

[Sudo_Nym]

Which I think shows the power of the card. DRS has nothing to do with Melira Pod's main combo, but it made the deck viable by just being strong in the 1 drop.

Though now I think that DRS ban is probably going to result in a Snap ban, as well, since they just ousted it's main counter.

[Sudo_Nym]

The fetches are a fairly subtle power level, and it's hard to point to anything they do that's banworthy, but the fetches do enable a lot of these deck- 3 color+ decks would be much, much harder without fetches to fix for them.

[Sudo_Nym]

Reprint Strip Mine, unban Crucible.

[Sudo_Nym]

Not sure that Wizards cares to do that/actively doesn't want to do that.

[Sudo_Nym]

They like to reprint cards that will sell sets without harming the secondary market too badly.

[Sudo_Nym]

Enchantress is my favorite deck, but it's not going to win you anything. Were it me, I'd be tempted to play Enduring Ideal, just because.

[Sudo_Nym]

I suggest we ban island in all formats.

[Sudo_Nym]

You don't have to unban it. You can just play freeform!

[Sudo_Nym]

Hell, they made Modern based on having Modern card frames; I say we have Classic, where you can only play cards with the classic card frames.

[Sudo_Nym]

Hell, they made Modern based on having Modern card frames; I say we have Classic, where you can only play cards with the classic card frames.

I was joking when I said this, but I actually like it upon reflection. Cut off the power creep. Only problem is that it'd be a stagnant format.

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Legacy has a steep entry cost, but it's also the cheapest to maintain. If you're buying into Standard, it might cost you 500, but then you're constantly spending to keep up with rotations. If you buy a legacy deck, that might set you back $1000+, but after that, you're basically buying one playset every release, if that. Sometimes there's a sea change in Legacy, but it's rare.

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Yeah, I'm not saying buying in isn't expensive. I'm just saying, once you've bought in, it's a lot cheaper to maintain a Legacy deck than it is to maintain a Standard deck.

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Well, accessibility's long been a problem; that's why modern exists in the first place. I'm not saying you should definitely buy in, or even that it's wise- but I doubt that it's going to just outright die, because it's not as though a high buy-in is a new aspect of Legacy.

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Well, that's probably going to continue happening, since the cards not being in print does weird things to the supply/demand curve. That said, staples like Force of Will are always going to be expensive, the only question is how much at any given time.

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My biggest gripe about the PTQ system is that it exists at all. I say we should send invitations to the pro tour at random; maybe drop them from a balloon and let the jet stream decide who's in.

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I think the clans are all wedges, aren't they? I don't think there'll be a UWB.

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Countdown until Jeskai is banned in every format...

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And the Ari Victory Countdown is at 1.

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I have the deep suspicion that any deck not playing Treasure Cruise or Dig Through Time is wrong.

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Well, Fact or Fiction gets you the best 1 of the top 5 plus maybe 1-2 more for 4, while Dig Through Time gets you the best 2 of the top 7 for 2. So, yeah, Dig Through Time really is better, though it requires a little more setup, but getting Delve online should be easy in any format with fetchlands.

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I think it's more that Wizards doesn't really know how to balance card advantage.

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That ultimate, though. Take that, Wizard Tribal!

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BURN THE HERETICS

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Well, that's good, actually, because I've been thinking about getting back in, now that I've got a job that pays me actual money and doesn't time-conflict with FNMs.

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Went to my local gaming store for card sleeves. There was a sign, rule 4 and 5 were "Please shower before attending" and "Remember to use deoderant".

What the fuck, gaming nerds. What the fuck is wrong with us.

There's a certain subset of nerd who believe that being a nerd makes them an enlightened creature of intelligence and therefore above base physical needs like showering. It's certainly off-putting.

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Went to my local gaming store for card sleeves. There was a sign, rule 4 and 5 were "Please shower before attending" and "Remember to use deoderant".

What the fuck, gaming nerds. What the fuck is wrong with us.

There's a certain subset of nerd who believe that being a nerd makes them an enlightened creature of intelligence and therefore above base physical needs like showering. It's certainly off-putting.

It's more that many people who happen to take part in so called "nerdy" activities tend to fall somewhere on the spectrum of anti-social personality disorder, and honestly how they smell has never occured to them

Okay, but I know from my game store at least two who are of the "enlightened" type, since they won't shut up about it.

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I don't mind that Wizards needs to ban cards- they probably aren't pushing the envelope enough if there isn't a need for the occasional ban. I'm more concerned that they still haven't figured out the value of card advantage, and that power creep has made it hard to even pick these things out in advance.

That said, anything that shakes up Eternal formats and brings combo back to Standard is a good start to me. I loved the old-school RPS style of Aggro-Control-Combo, and chopping off one leg of it was not cool.

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Frankly, I don't see why any game should last longer than turn 3. As far as I'm concerned, if somebody hasn't comboed off by then, there's something wrong.

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I actually think I didn't reference Treasure Cruise at all in my post?

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The best magic game would be won on turn three, but only after both players each played 4 Shahrazads.

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Remembering ante? Remember when Flying Man was a great blue 1 drop? Remember when Channel-Fireball-Lotus was the best deck? Pepperidge Farm remembers!

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1UUU has to be Cryptic Command. 2GR might be BBE or Huntmaster?

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All cards in the future should be named Steve. Also, wizards should ban any card not named Steve.

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i dislike modern anyway

Then you're a fool. Modern is like the second most interesting format right now.

Modern is the second most interesting format, behind only Standard, Legacy, and Steve.

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Dude needs to charge their phone.

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I would have been stricter. Cheating in a tournament that costs that much time and money to get to, let alone play in, and has a cash prize? I'd have handed out lifetime bans. There's no excuses for this shit.

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There are certain levels of competition giving people second chances is fine. Anyone who's willing to cheat at this level is probably irredeemable, though, and good riddance to bad rubbish.

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Brainstorm is really only great if you have a shuffle. Treasure Cruise only requires you to fill your graveyard. Since the time when you want to draw cards is right after you've played a bunch, you should have some cards to delve.

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I suppose it depends on the situation. Brainstorm is a lot better early, but I feel like with Ponder and Serum Visions, you need the early draw Brainstorm offers less than the pure CA Treasure Cruise grants.

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No, Linvala is that much because it was printed with a unique and experimental ink that produces a euphoric high when smoked and a delicious herbal tea when steeped in water.

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Basically, it's part of Wizard's crusade against Combo and especially against eggs style non-interactive combo that takes forever to resolve.

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Fair enough. Here's hoping Wizards lets combo be a real thing again, though.

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I don't mind the color pie being seperate, so long as they're equivalent in power- it's fine if blue gets all the pure draw effects, so long as the other colors get CA generation of equal power.

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If a card sees play in more than 10% of decks, ban it. I want to see every single legal card in a given set find play.

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I don't think five mana for a wrath is unreasonable, but I wish the would include a no-regeneration clause. How else am I supposed to kill Rakshasha?

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Also, if you had mana to pump it, you had mana to regen it. Pure misplay.

Seriously, though. i don't mind that they took anti-regen clauses off a lot of removal, just to make Regen valuable, but it seems like the Wraths should keep it, just so there is a kill effect somewhere for these things.

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That said, why wouldn't you always hold up regen mana if you have it available?

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Possibly. Still, it's a real jerk move to assume that all your opponent's pump are on the stack and that you can take them all out with a Magma Spray.

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Let's ditch the obscure and irrelevant rules talk and answer a burning question instead: how does Humility interact with Opalescence?

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What happens if you play Oblivion Ring targeting an Oblivion Ring which has removed an Oblivion Ring with no other non-land permanents on the board?

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I've got OCTGN and a few decks, if you're ever looking for another and I'm online.

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UW Heroic? There a good decklist/primer somewhere?

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I think in current standard, protection and indestructible are more or less equivalent, right? Indestructible gets around End Hostilities, but doesn't stop Bile Blight, and protection is vice versa. So normally the cheaper effect is just better? Being able to strive to protect multiple creatures is nice, but I don't know how often the deck is going to have the mana to strive to protect more than two creatures at a time anyway.

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Didn't think about the block aspect, just the defense aspect. So yeah, protect is going to be more generally useful; Presence only seems better against sweepers and non-targeted removal, then. I suppose protect also stops Singing Bell Strike et al, but that doesn't seem like a major concern. And it also stops Seeker of the Way from even attacking with lifelink for value. So, yeah.

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Except mine is the PHYSICAL EMBODIMENT OF AMERICA ITSELF and was done custom for me by Brandi, which puts me two up on you.

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Has anyone tried out Durward's RG Bees?

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I'm up Portland way. And I haven't actually gotten back in yet; I keep watching videos and doing research, and then real life eats my paychecks before I actually get any cards.

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Not to doubt you guys, since I haven't played, but I've been doing research so I can get in when I have some money, and in limited, wouldn't it be best to try and limit yourself to 2 colors so that you can pick from 2 wedges? It seems that having 2 enemy colors as the base, picking up the best you can from the two wedges that contain the combination, and then maybe splashing some cards from whatever wedge you have extras from should be the best. I'm very open to the possibility that I'm wrong, though.

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I've been watching a lot of draft videos, and it seems like the ground tends to get super clogged in limited. Having stuff that can fly or stuff like Singing Bell Strike to impair blockers seems super valuable.

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Speaking of, the UWR Dig-Twin deck from LSV's recent videos looks super nice.

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You joke, but having a combo piece that doesn't die to Lightning Bolt seems to be of reasonable value in Modern.

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Awesome decks in awesome formats, that's what!

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If there's no winner at the end of 5 turns, the match is to be decided in the Thunderdome.

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I'm not 100%, but I think you have to choose a target for Sower when it enters play. The bigger issue is that you have to play your creature before the opponent does, so they get to see your Sower before they decide what to put out.

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If I'm remembering my LSV properly, you should just play a bunch of 7 drops and win that way. More balla

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Alternate solution: Get a bunch of lands and just write the names of MM cards on them, then draft that.

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How about instead of that, we get super drunk and play blackjack for 160 straight hours?

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So I've been hearing that a lot of cards are bugged in the new client. Any truth to the rumor?

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The Panoramas are common, and can tap for mana if you're not ready to fetch. Might be a solution.

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I think the big kill is either beating down with Salvage Titan, or using Altar of the Brood with a pair of Tops that are made free by Helm/Locket to mill. The Intuition is there because it searches up the combo and allows you to cycle through your deck to get your kill. It's certainly wacky, and I want so badly for the dream to be real.

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Wasn't there an Angel in one of the commander sets that can put Angels directly into play when attacking?

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Not sure how Manifest will work, though. Especially in a format with a lot of Morph.

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And what happens if you Manifest a creature with Morph? There's got to be some consideration given to that already. If I manifest a Ponyback Brigade, can I flip it for it's morph cost since it's face down, or do I have to use it's casting cost for manifest? If it then gets flipped back upside down with an Ixidor, can I reflip it for it's morph cost? I'm confused by the interaction.

And if I can't flip a manifested creature for it's morph cost, then is there some ordained method for identifying which creatures are manifested or morphed?

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I don't know if Soulflayer is going to be consistently good often enough to see a ton of play, but I love the idea of a 4/4 for 2; same reason I love Tombstalker.

Soulfire Grand Master feels like it should be a legendary creature.

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How do Hardened Scales and Doubling Season interact?

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So, Treasure Cruise is gone in Modern and Legacy, and restricted in Vintage. I suppose they finally figured out that Ancestral Recall is broken. Only took them 23 years of magic, but at least they eventually got there.

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There's got to be something awesome with Brutal Hordechief.

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Real men draft Alpha

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I'm tempted to get back on MODO just so I can play with Soulflayer.

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I understand the Pod bad; Pod is pure value town. Whether it's actually broken is a matter of debate.

That said, I do find it ironic that the secondary market is pricing people out; I thought the whole point of Modern was to give a format to people who were locked out of the eternal format by the secondary market.

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I understand the Pod bad; Pod is pure value town. Whether it's actually broken is a matter of debate.

That said, I do find it ironic that the secondary market is pricing people out; I thought the whole point of Modern was to give a format to people who were locked out of the eternal format by the secondary market.

I mean, Pod never broke 20% of the meta. Abzan was 25% in this PT. IDK, there's always going to be a "best" deck and "best" cards. Ban the birthing pod when the archetype actually becomes broken and dominant.

I haven't played Modern in a while (it's been 2-3 sets since I played regularly), but I've watched a lot of videos and followed results, and Pod didn't look like it was taking over. It was common, because of the insane value you could get, but it wasn't like decks were helpless against it. Treasure Cruise was probably more format warping than Birthing Pod was.

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(They're never going to bring back Extended)

(I still haven't heard an argument for why they won't)

(Because MaRo is still in charge)

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You guys all badly misspelled "Red Deck Wins"

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Let's say I want to build a top tier modern deck, but I don't want to spend more than about $20. Am I just priced out?

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I like the idea of modern, but it's certainly shown itself to be problematic. Maybe if it had more cards like FoW to help keep things in line.

I don't think just abandoning the format for extended is the solution, though. Not least because it won't happen.

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Any time there's a clear best deck is a bad time for any format, to be honest. Not sure how Modern gets around that, though.

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Could be worse, Tibalt. Dack isn't even pictured.

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Anyone got experience with Mono-Black Humans? Could be a neat budget way for me to get back in.

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KoC, what happens if I have a Humility, Opalessence, Night of Souls' Betrayal, and Crusade in play simultaneously?

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Which would imply that you need to keep track of what got delved by what which creature, just in case it turns out to be a Soulflayer.

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Slather your face in tabasco sauce and smash a watermelon on your forehead.

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What is the interaction between a Sharuum the Hedgemon, a Sculpting Steel, and an unladen swallow?

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We had a draft and Wrestlemania 31 watching party last night. Didn't pull anything spectacular, but ran white/red and dash was a winner.

Also, Outpost Siege and Sprinting Warbrute were totally awesome.

I agree that Sprinting Warbrute and Seth Rollins are totally awesome.

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But Act on Impulse is unplayable!

That's not true. Any deck that can pay 2R can play it.

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I'm also looking to get back in; if you've got some stuff for a good deal, I might be interetsed as well.

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Is that the MBC list with Coumbajj Witches?

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Rules-

Opponent casts

by paying one black and exiling 5 graveyard cards.

I cast

to counter it, with 1 card in my graveyard when I cast it.

Can he exile an additional graveyard card (since Tasigaur was cast using Delve) to pay that extra cost?

And it is only 1, since I only have 1 card in the graveyard? Or does the Disdain spell count itself?

Delve applies only the casting cost of the card itself. So, no, he can't delve an additional card, because that's a different effect.

Disdain doesn't count itself, because spells don't go to the graveyard until they resolve. Same reason why Regrowth can't return itself to hand.

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Yes- all cost increases and cost reductions for mana are calculated before they are applied. So that does work.

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Real men draft Homelands.

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As far as I remember, the rule is because there are a few cards that care about the order of the graveyard, like Ashen Ghoul, but Wizards decided to scrap that sort of mechanic, since the graveyard was public knowledge and looking through it became a pain in the ass.

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I hate foreign cards.

I hate white borders

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White borders, Shea? You got a problem with a strong, black border? You don't think black borders deserves spaces in our decks? I bet you think all decks should be white borders only.

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A quick look at my game store suggests that wearing pants is not required in face to face magic, either.

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Playmore McSpikington is my porn name.

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I don't believe you've cashed the last 4 GPs you've played in.

And I don't believe you're approaching the issues people have with rare redrafting from any perspective other than your own typically blinkered one. Beliefs are fun!

And I don't believe that this isn't butter!

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I suppose I'm lucky, then- my store is $15 to draft, and gives 8-4-3-2 for the top prizes; and everybody who didn't get a prize gets a rare from the junk rares box as a consolation. Of course, they probably make for the prize support with the overpriced concession stand.

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I hate the idea to split. Seems unsporting.