Mini 237- Basic Mafia - Game over!

[Nightfall]

Vote: Seol

I want to be able to vote for him at least once before he some how manages to convince me that he's pro-town

Good nigh- er... Morning everyone.

[Nightfall]

Vote: Seol

Vote: Nightfall

in retaliation. Seol is far too nice a chap to lynch. (Unlike that evil Rainbow Brite girl.)

Hmph
That's why I voted for him now, I've been in 2, maybe 3 games with
him so far and have not once voted for him. I wanted to vote for him at least once, and if I was to wait for him to say somthing scummy, I'd be waiting all game...

[Nightfall]

It's not to brag, it's just to display. Good or bad.
Statistics don't just get better if you hide them.
And if you think my record here is so bad,
please continue to underestimate me
but maybe you should wait until after this game, when it will be 2/4 :b

[Nightfall]

Shhhh... I'm ah..., going back in time... to.... ah....Shuddap.... -_-'

[Nightfall]

Canadian here,
Ontario Canada

[Nightfall]

*Checking in*
Will post something of more context in the next day or two.

P.S. Is KingEnigma still around though?

[Nightfall]

That was pretty quick.

[Nightfall]

Why the FOS on me though?
I haven't posted that much so far, I agree, but as far as I can tell so far
this whole game has just been home to a misunderstanding and multiple
people being replaced or going to be replaced. I'm not sure who I find
scummy just yet.

[Nightfall]

Maybe I should just lurk.

Yes, come join me. I've got snacks and drinks...
But I have to admit, that after you had been throwing your
votes around rather loosely, it does seem kind of odd, that
you'd just stop doing it now.

[Nightfall]

FOS: Mr Stoofer and mikeburnfire

Because they really seem to pounce on any slight little change of mind people
have been having, try to make others suspicious of these people.

P.S. Falcone, yes I have been lurking quite a bit lately, but I will be able to post a whole lot more come this friday. At that point I will do a whole reread and try to post something more content worthy of being here.

[Nightfall]

Right now the big arguement seems to be which "gut fealing" wagon everyone is on, either for ChocoCid- 3 (ibaesha, viQLes, mikeburnfire), or Stewie- 3 (d8P, Mr. Stoofer, Commodore Amazing). Im not sure if I'm just not seeing something that some others must be, but neither of these two look the scummiest to me. Infact Mr. Stoofer- 2 (Falcone, ChocoCid) is the one who looks the scummiest to me. Stoofer either A) makes a post of very little content, B) makes a post that appears to be for no other reason other than to move his vote around, again, or C) makes a comment about how someone elses post make little to no sense, when to me at least they did. So, if all that we are going on for voting today is gut fealings, then I have to go with my own, and

Vote: Stoofer

[Nightfall]

Yipee I win! ... er wait... -_-' Votes AREN'T good.... dang.
The question now is whether anyone whose voting for ChocoCid would like to switch over to voting Stewie, or should we ask for a deadline extension?

[Nightfall]

unvote: ChocoCid

Fair enough.

vote: Nightfall

During my re-read Nightfall came to my attention. He has hardly contributed anything of substance to the game, has lurked and the one post in which he voted for Mr. Stoofer contained reasons, but said reasons seem to be a misrepresentation of Mr. Stoofer's behavior in my opinion.

That's all I have got so far. And I did specify that it was gut fealings that lead me to vote for Stoofer, which is what 90% of this game has been based on so far.

[Nightfall]

I've just finished a game (Newbie 142) with Nightfall. We were both townies there. But I'm getting a very different vibe from him in this game than I did in that game.

Remember that we lost that game...
I'm trying not to duplicate that mistake by taking this one a bit slower.
Seeing as we may hit a deadline before my liking though, I may need to spped things up...

[Nightfall]

Can I get a vote count? And just so everyone knows, if it's between Nightfall and Stewie, I'd rather vote for Nightfall at this point. I think Stewie is perfectly justified in voting for someone to keep himself alive.

Just quoting this for future reference, in the case that I might have to change my vote to Stewie, in attempts to keep

me

alive.

[Nightfall]

Nightfall remains my top suspect, and I invite him to give a defense.

What kind of defense are you looking for?
I can tell you that I'm town, but that really means nothing in terms of a defence right?

My vote on Stoofer, it was a gut vote, but any gut fealing has to be started by something, and the reasons I gave for voting him were the best I could gather.

As for my lurking, I have been pretty busy lately, but with every game I still like to post a fair amount to show that I am not purposely trying to avoid the spotlight. As many of you can probably vouche for me, I ussually post quite a bit about what I think. The problem with this game though is that, I don't see either the past case against Choco, or the current case against Stewie as being that strong, or really having much of anything I can say about them.

Also a good deal of people seem to be saying that they would rather gamble a little and vote me to have a lynch at deadline, instead of going with a no lynch. But wouldn't it make more sense to extend the deadline a little?

[Nightfall]

The deadline already was extended, NF.

I'm going to extend this deadline

exactly 48 hours

. Which means you have now until Thursday afternoon 4 pm Eastern.

Multiple people have expressed their fondness to lynch me since then.

[Nightfall]

Sorry, I think I forgot to unvote the first time I did this in post 149, but

Unvote: Seol

Vote: Stoofer

[Nightfall]

What more, short of maybe a claim, would you want from me?
ussually I'm not overly against claiming, but with two masons already out in the open, it might not be the best option here.

[Nightfall]

What more? How about explaining your votes, your suspicions, your reasons, and pointing out any of your previous actions that could possibly clear your name? I don't think you realize, but you're becoming eerily close to being the first lynch, yet your posts are abrupt and infrequent.

Nightfall remains my top suspect, and I invite him to give a defense.

What kind of defense are you looking for?
I can tell you that I'm town, but that really means nothing in terms of a defence right?

My vote on Stoofer, it was a gut vote, but any gut fealing has to be started by something, and the reasons I gave for voting him were the best I could gather.

As for my lurking, I have been pretty busy lately, but with every game I still like to post a fair amount to show that I am not purposely trying to avoid the spotlight. As many of you can probably vouche for me, I ussually post quite a bit about what I think. The problem with this game though is that, I don't see either the past case against Choco, or the current case against Stewie as being that strong, or really having much of anything I can say about them.

Also a good deal of people seem to be saying that they would rather gamble a little and vote me to have a lynch at deadline, instead of going with a no lynch. But wouldn't it make more sense to extend the deadline a little?

[Nightfall]

As the deadline approached on day 1, the lynch-leader was Nightfall. But that bandwagon never really got going, even when it looked as though the alternative might be no lynch. On the other hand, the viQles bandwagon built up much faster. Now admittedly there was substantially more reason to think that viQles might be scum that Nightfall; but the difference in the speed of ther bandwagons was startling. Scum trying to save their buddy?

Vote: Nightfall

.

Stoofer, I was being band wagoned because of my low post count.
Innocent as viQles was lynched because of a believed scum tell.

[Nightfall]

Sorry that ment to read...

Stoofer, I was being band wagoned because of my low post count post content.
Innocent as viQles was, he was lynched because of a believed scum tell.

[Nightfall]

Just checking in too.
Would say more, but I've typed out two posts so far,
only to realise afterwards that d8P already says what I want to say,
and better in post #300. Sineish's comment on how the 3rd Mason would have to come forward in the event of d8P's death, was the comment that set off the most warning signs for me.

[Nightfall]

Sineish's comment on how the 3rd Mason would have to come forward in the event of d8P's death, was the comment that set off the most warning signs for me.

The way I see it, there was doubt yesterday about ChocoCid's alignment. Sure, he was a confirmed mason, but there was discussion about whether he may have been a traitor. Although I didn't say this in the thread yesterday, I gave this some weight, especially as 3 masons and not the usual mini-game 2 had been claimed. This is what I mean by saying that ChocoCid was far from 100%.

That being the case, it seemed obvious that d8P would be the prefered target, and given a 3 mason game and the doctor dead, it is likely that their kill would have gone through unopposed.

I have hidden the other mason's name in what I've posted and can tell him/her how to reveal it in the case of our deaths (which will prove his/her innocence).

This is a great strength to the town, especially in the end game, if the 3rd mason can wait as long as possible to claim. Naturally, the scum will want to get rid of this mason before then, and I reasoned that by leaving a mason alive with a claim that was open to question, that the 3rd mason could have been forced to support ChocoCid and hence reveal themselves before the endgame.

Your answer to my post was making me start to believe you, but your answer to d8P is confusing me. Why would the 3rd Mason be forced to reveal himself before endgame? to try and save Choco from a lynch? why would we want to try and lynch him? Or am I just still missunderstanding you?

[Nightfall]

We know that Sineish was innocent, so either:
-a- Ibaesha was a non-sane cop with a guilty on Sineish,
-b- she had a guilty on Nightfall,
or
-c- she investigated someone else and got innocent.

If it was -b- her play wouldn't make much sense I think, so it should be -a- or -c-, with -c- by far the most likely. All in all this doesn't give us much information. I'm very curious why the mafia has killed her, tough. I don't see anything in her posts that gives away she's a cop, so why kill her instead of d8P, the confirmed innocent?

Falcone, one things for sure, I can assure you that it wasn't choice
B. There's a chance it could have been option a.
Looking over Ibaesha, I don't really see anything that gives her away. she wasn't
overly agressive towards anyone, so I don't think she had a guilty result.
C, seems the most likely to me. And Stoofer, your claiming that I would have
Killed Ibaesha after she gave me an FOS? I think I would be a bit more discrete then that if I was really scum.

[Nightfall]

Sorry for the double post but I have two little questions,

-a- Ibaesha was a non-sane cop with a guilty on Sineish,

Non-sane cops in minis are

incredibly

rare.

Are non-sane cops really that rare in minis? I think about 30% of the games I've played so far have had one, either non-sane or some other type. Although that percent is low, I dont think I would call it incredibly rare.

I'm very curious why the mafia has killed her, tough. I don't see anything in her posts that gives away she's a cop, so why kill her instead of d8P, the confirmed innocent?

This one's obvious - they know the masons aren't the cop. Aim at a non-mason, and you've got a better chance of hitting the cop (or vig, or roleblocker, or whatever), which generally pose a greater threat.[/quote]

On the topic or rare roles, is it that common to have a town role blocker?
Most games I've been in so far, even hinting at the chance you may be a role blocker seems to draw some votes your way.

[Nightfall]

This really isn't nearly money in the bank, but so far I've played two games with CA, who was on both bandwagons this game.

viQLes: Mr.Stoofer, Seol, Commodore Amazing
Sineish: Mr. Stoofer, Commodore Amazing, d8P, Seol

In these past two games, one of them he was scum and the other town.
I remember that in the game he was scum in, he tended to make more
....snappy? comments while trying to provoke a lynch. Durring the Sineish lynch he posted,

FINISH HIM!

I'm not moving my vote.

This lynch is taking too long. Sineish is scumbo. A shademeister. A mafiosisimo. A McBadGuyVer.

I'm not sure if this is normal CA banter , and it just happened to skip a game, or what, but it is starting to remind me of that game we played were he was scum.

[Nightfall]

Top of my list right now would be CA. He was on both lynches, and seemed to be pretty pushy in getting sin lynched. Seol and Stoofer would be a distant 2nd and 3rd respectively. This is due in a large part to the fact they were also on both lynches.

[Nightfall]

I just realized that I only answered 1 of d8p's 3 questions so...
2. Yes I agree with Stewie's plan, and
3. No I am not scum.

Also, could someone please answer my two questions from before?

Sorry for the double post but I have two little questions,

-a- Ibaesha was a non-sane cop with a guilty on Sineish,

Non-sane cops in minis are

incredibly

rare.

Are non-sane cops really that rare in minis? I think about 30% of the games I've played so far have had one, either non-sane or some other type. Although that percent is low, I dont think I would call it incredibly rare.

I'm very curious why the mafia has killed her, tough. I don't see anything in her posts that gives away she's a cop, so why kill her instead of d8P, the confirmed innocent?

This one's obvious - they know the masons aren't the cop. Aim at a non-mason, and you've got a better chance of hitting the cop (or vig, or roleblocker, or whatever), which generally pose a greater threat.

On the topic or rare roles, is it that common to have a town role blocker?
Most games I've been in so far, even hinting at the chance you may be a role blocker seems to draw some votes your way.

[Nightfall]

So is the COMPLETE order then Seol, Commodre, Nightfall, Stoofer, Falcone?
with Mike and d8p already claimed.

[Nightfall]

I am a Cop.
.
.
Yes, I know what I just did... claiming the same role as a dead townie, but I do have more to say. I'll explain once the claims are finished.

Next Roleclaim is Stoofer.
P.S. Stoofer, when you roleclaim, could you please reread Mike's post 390, and tell me if you see anything that you disagree with?

[Nightfall]

Okay, here's my info.

First off, if Stoofer really is a townie I can see why he didn't pick up on what I was asking him. In Mikes post 390, Mike stated that he blocked me on night 1, and Stoofer on night 2; when in reality I was blocked on night 2 not night 1. Eiither Mike just made a typo or there's something more going on.


As for my results, Day 1, I had a little bit of a gut fealing that Stoofer was scum so I investigated him night 1.

I made this post ->

Stoofer

, I was being band wagoned because of my low post count.

Innocent

as viQles was lynched because of a believed scum tell.

During day 1, I lurked quite a bit, and although it was mainly because I was really busy, but it was also in part because I didn't want to draw that much attebtion to myself. Falcone then drew quite a bit of attention to me. This continued still on day 2. Stoofer did pressured me again on this day, but with an innocent result I didn't think much of it. Night 2 then came along and I investigated Falcone. I investigated Falcone because he seemed the most desperate to lynch me. I didn't get a result though since I was roleblocked. See post->

Falcone

, one things for sure, I can assure you that it wasn't choice

B

. There's a chance it could have been option a.

L

ooking over Ibaesha, I don't really see anything that gives her away. she wasn't

o

verly agressive towards anyone, so I don't think she had a guilty result.

C

, seems the most likely to me. And Stoofer, your claiming that I would have

K

illed Ibaesha after she gave me an FOS? I think I would be a bit more discrete then that if I was really scum.

(You'd be surprised how long it took me to try and figure out how to get those letters there, and to not be completely obvious)

So yeah, I was role blocked. Day 3 we then wake up to see that our "cop" has died....
Now I really don't know what this means, but the following are some possibilities that I have thought up.

1. Ibeasha was sane, I am not. This would mean that my innocent result on Stoofer, would mean that I had found scum.
2. Ibeasha was insane, I am sane. Stoofer is really innocent. This could be true but Ibeasha being called "Cop" and not insane cop puts a few holes in this theory.
3. Ibeasha and I are both sane cops. This would, in a regular game make for a pretty strong town and therefore unlikely, but it has been thrown around lately that are mafia seems to have stronger then usual powers too? A two cop town might be a way to help restore ballance?

[Nightfall]

@Falcone - Nightfall and mikeburnfire are lying about their roles. They planned it together last night. There

are

two vanilla townies in this game, me and (probably) Mr Stoofer. I knew you were a mason

It's kind of funny that Nightfall and mikeburnfire put together their fake claims before hand, but mikeburnfire messed it up and said he blocked Nightfall on the wrong night.

Come on, would a cop hide his clues like that? We never would have found that if Nightfall had been night-killed. Those are little things that cops leave behind to fake a claim later. Nightfall was probably unhappy to see that ibaesha was cop, but decided, "Oh, what the heck, I went through all this work, might as well go on pretending I'm a cop." And two cops in a mini? This should be an easy vote.

vote: Nightfall

. I'd vote for mikeburnfire since getting rid of the mafia roleblocker is better, but I know that the vig and the masons might want to keep mikeburnfire around on the off chance that he's town and that he'll save us if we're wrong about Nightfall.

@My favorite Brits - what do you think? Are you the only vanilla townie in this game?

How do you

know

that there are 3 vanilla townies? Not one, not three, not even maybe zero? maybe the 3 of you are our 3 scum.

I also find it really hard to believe that you Knew Falcone was the 3rd mason.

[Nightfall]

Correction:

How do you know that there are 2 vanilla townies? Not one, not three, not even maybe zero? maybe the 3 of you are our 3 scum.

[Nightfall]

CA could you answer my question, before you go spitting out more stuff for me to question you on?

- Stoofer never said you should be quiet, or that they don't want to hear your ramblings.
- If I was scum, and I did think that "since I went through all this work, might as well go on pretending I'm a cop." , do you not think that I would have enough of a brain to figure out a much easier way to have stayed clean? What if I claimed townie? what then, there had been two townie claims before me, would another townie claim look that odd in the bunch? No. Had I been scum I could have easily done that, much like I'm thinking you have, but no I claimed Cop. A role that a fellow townie has already had at that. If I was scum faking a claim, I would think that I would give up the work that I did setting up the cop claim, and claim townie rather than still claim cop, where I would have to go through stuff like this (so much more work) to try and prove it.

[Nightfall]

I have never been in a game where a non-sane cop was merely called "cop" in his death scene.

The horror movie mini I was in a little while back listed our cop as "townie" on his deathbed...

[Nightfall]

My thoughts:

1) There's no way there are two sane cops in this game. Therefore, either Ibaesha wasn't sane (no evidence for that in her role description), Nightfall isn't sane (which would likely make Stoofer scum) or Nightfall is a lying mafia member.

2) One of Mike or Nightfall is scum. It would surprise me greatly if they were both scum though. I agree with Stewie that Nightfall has been more suspicious earlier, but that it's more important to lynch Mike if he really is a scum roleblocker. I have to say that Nightfall has been more convincing in his story than Mike. It's mostly the fact that Mike said: "Even if I'm not a pro-town blocker, that doesn't mean I'm a scum blocker", that makes me very suspicious. It seems logical to me that a mafia blocker would claim roleblocker, rather than vanilla townie. One thing that bothers me, is that I don't see why he would lie about his night choices, even if he were scum.

3) I noticed immediately what Nightfall was doing in his first post today (spelling "block" with the first letters on each line). So I don't agree with Commodore that hiding clues like that is useless if he was a real cop, because no one would find them. My first thought was that he meant he was a roleblocker himself, especially when he asked how common roleblockers are in Mini's. That's the reason why I FOS'sed him on Day 3 without giving a reason.

The reason I asked what I did about roleblockers was because, I had been roleblocked, and I was trying to do one of two things.

1. Try and get the point across that I knew there was a role blockier, since I had been blocked,
2. I was, and still am for that mater, not sure what the odds are that a roleblcoker could be a townie.

[Nightfall]

Well I was blocked on Night 2.

Possibillities of what might have happened.

1. 1 of us is lying.

2. Someone else interfered.

A) Role Blocker: I don't think there would be another role blocker, to account for my block. Then again if there was it could mean you were blocked day 1, which is why I wasn't blocked day 1?

B) Name switcher: Very low chance, seeing as he/she would have to have targeted me and who ever you chose to block both nights.

C) Delay?: Is there such a role that would delay a night act by a night?

3. Your still making a mistake about the days


I'm more inclined to think its #1

P.S. This might make this whole post pointless but, in your last post did you say that you were a townie that claimed roleblocker? Because I was Roleblocked night 1 regardless.

[Nightfall]

Bah, typo.

P.S. This might make this whole post pointless but, in your last post did you say that you were a townie that claimed roleblocker? Confused Because I was Roleblocked night

2

regardless.

That was embaressing .

[Nightfall]

On this basis, I'll formulate the following Cunning Plan: We lynch Mike. If he's scum, Stewie vigs Commodore. If he's innocent, Stewie vigs Nightfall. Nightfall should investigate Seol.

I too approve of this plan and will happily follow Falcone's vote.

I too will agree with this, but I have to raise the question, but what if I am insane? What if Seol is town and Stoofer is Mafia, and I get reversed results?

[Nightfall]

Seol > Okay, Thx,I got it now.
CA> Did you change something in that quote?

[Nightfall]

Three, I think.

[Nightfall]

Well, truth be told I wasn't expecting this, so my result doesn't really help that much anymore. I actually veered from the plan too. I thought it would be beter if I was to check my sanity by investigating Falcone. Whom I got an innocent result from. I had thought that, If CA had been killed, and was scum, an innocent result on falcone would have shown that CA and Seol were scum. If I had got a scum result, then it would be Stoofer and CA as our scum. Finally if CA turned out not to be scum, and I got a guilty on Falcone, then that would meen that Stoofer and Seol were scum.

[Nightfall]

let's laugh at Nightfall's "cop investigations" first.

I get to make more then one?

[Nightfall]

he said that I hadn't

[Nightfall]

Vote: Commodore Amazing

[Nightfall]

My thoughts:

1. I was shocked that d8P's reveal that he had a post restriction didn't tip anyone off that he might be unique in his masonness- Choco specifically said he had no post restriction. When people were thinking that the town had too much power, they probably should have gone back and reevaluated from day one.

2. The Mason PMs didn't say that everyone was pro-town, but gave the implication- another reason for close reading.

3. I was shocked when the mafia killed the cop- I'm curious as to what tipped them off- that was probably the turning point in the game.

4. This game is a PRIME example of why not to use voting patterns to determine scum- Seol and Commodore were on both townie lynches, and mikeburnfire and Nightfall were on neither, and d8P was on only one of them.

5. Also, kudos to all the players in the game! A long game and yet the mafia won- another sign of running contrary to popular wisdom! I'm also glad that I only had to make one replacement.

6. Any other thoughts, questions? Was the game sufficiently balanced, or not?

1. I was kinda surprised too.

2. I would have fallen for it too.

3. This was a pretty funny night. We were actually kinda cop hunting, but we didn't think Ibeasha at first. We were going to kill CA because he seemed to overly reak of being the cop, but then Falcone voiced to d8P that he found CA suspicious and we decided to change. Our next thought was Stewie, who we thought could also be the cop, or some other dangerous role. We were really close to sending in our kill, when Mike at the last moment questioned Ibeasha's role. She appeared to be fitting more of a cops role then Stewie did, so we made the kill.

4. We were also discussing this night 2. We were surprised how little work we actually had to do.

5. Yipee.

6. When we were playing I thought it was unfair on the scums behalf, but seeing the list of roles in the end it looks quite a bit more ballanced. Seol was one person we really could have had problems with.

I think a big part of our win had to do with my cop claim going over so well. I had thought this game would have been filled with power roles for both sides. Thankfully many others did too. This is why I thought there very well could be cops of both sanities. I was actually planning on being the insane cop from the start. In end game I was really surprised though that I wasn't investigated night one. I had actually tried to act pretty scummy, and to get investigated. Thereby when my cop claim came around, the only person that would probably counter claim me, would have had an innocent investigation on me, and we would as a town reach the conclusion that I was insane.

Great Game Scum!

P.S. d8P I guess from now on, if I die night 0, I should assume your mafia?

[Nightfall]

Oh, and I just see that Mike really blocked Nightfall N2. I think that's hilarious.

I have never actually had a night action of mine blocked before, so I wasn't sure if when it really happened if people recieved a pm saying they were block, or what... I wanted to make sure my claim was as believable as it could be, so I asked Mike to block me, to see if I did get a pm that I could refer too.

[Nightfall]

Great, now Falcone and d8P are going to probably lynch me the first chance they get
I'm pretty sure I've been speedlynched in 2 of the last games that I've been playing in because of little grudges like that