Mini 753 - Really Deep South (Game over!)

[elvis_knits]

I am scum.

Also,

vote korts

DIE!

[elvis_knits]

BANDWAGON ON KORTS!

[elvis_knits]

I AM SCUM. THE OTHER SCUM MIGHT WAS WELL CLAIM NOW SO WE CAN COORDINATE ACTIONS AND WIN. THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO WIN IF YOU ARE SCUM. CLAIM NOW.

[elvis_knits]

Vote: vollkan

for modding AA mafia, which was a great game!

unvote, vote malthusis

Joins rival bandwagon and pretends it's a random vote.

[elvis_knits]

Did none of you read the queue thread? Did none of you see charter and me joking?

Regardless, all the scum still need to claim ASAP.

[elvis_knits]

Vote: vollkan

for modding AA mafia, which was a great game!

unvote, vote malthusis

Joins rival bandwagon and pretends it's a random vote.

In all seriousness, malthusis has made scum tell. He joined the vollkan bandwagon while giving a random vote reason.

[elvis_knits]

I'm not sure what you're asking me.

I am serious when I say that malthusis made a scum tell by joining a bandwagon while giving a random vote reason.

In my mind, malthusis is the only person who has done anything concretely scummy.

[elvis_knits]

I'm not sure what you're asking me.

I am serious when I say that malthusis made a scum tell by joining a bandwagon while giving a random vote reason.

In my mind, malthusis is the only person who has done anything concretely scummy.

If you think voting on a "random vote reason" is scummy, it follows that you also think there are better reasons than joke ones for voting. My question was whether this reflects your thoughts, and if so, examples would be dandy.

I don't think voting with a random vote reason is scummy. Joke voting, random voting... that doesn't bother me. But voting with a random vote reason ONTO A BANDWAGON is scummy.

It's like he's ignoring the fact that he's joining a bandwagon. He's hopping on the bandwagon but trying not to take responsibility for it. So that later, if we look at the people on the bandwagon he can say his was not a bandwagon vote, but just a random. But I don't think you can honestly call it a random vote when your vote is part of a bandwagon.

[elvis_knits]

Charter, both these things were posted before malthusis voted:

vollkan-elvis pair, gogogo

vote:vollkan

We need a good rival bandwagon here methinks.

There may not have been 5-6 votes on vollkan at the moment, but there was a general consensus that a bandwagon was forming.

[elvis_knits]

Elvis should know...

unvote, vote: malthusis

I think DGB is saying malth is my scum buddy.

[elvis_knits]

Hmm. EK, do you not see any possible merit in a random bandwagon?

I see the merit of random bandwagons... gets things moving and possibly see people acting oddly in reaction to it.

But the reason I don't like mal's vote has nothing to do with random bandwagoning. If mal had posted "bandwagon go! vote vollkan," I wouldn't have thought that was suspicious. It's that he's joining the bandwagon while making no mention of it, and giving a random vote reason as if vollkan has no votes on him. He's ignoring the implication of his vote, and joining a bandwagon without acknowledging it.

[elvis_knits]

I now understand the Volkan argument but I'm happier with Malthusis. I dislike how fast the volkan wagon grew.

Unvote, Vote Malthusis

Elvis is right, scum have particular voting habits.

When they're bussing a scumbuddy they make it well known that they were voting them but when they vote innocent townies they tend to want an out or plausible deniability so that when the lynch goes awry it isn't traced back to them.

Malthusis voting Volkan randomly after the "rival bandwagon" comment means it's doubtful that it really is random.

I'm not getting this, exactly what are you getting at here? I just decided to vote vollkan because he made a good game I was in (Ace Attorney Mafia, great game by the way). It's just a random vote. If you don't like the bandwagon in particular, why don't you complain at the people who took it farther? I only put the second vote on.

I've explained it like a billion times. How come you respond to skander, and not to any of my arguments? Your vote was the third vote, and others were talking of a bandwagon on vollkan, before you cast your vote. Why did you put a "random" on him without commenting on the building bandwagon?

---

What is the scum reaction that Volkan made in his first post? I've read it over 3 times and I can't see it.

And is everyone voting for Volkan voting seriously?

The above is a weird reaction to BW votes. I see people who panic with votes that are being voted against but not something like this. It's like a protective action on someone for no reason.
I don't know what site you played at here but random BW in a speed game is normal.

In newbie games I often see newbie scum OMGUS vote for their partner -- someone votes their partner, and then the newb scum votes the person who voted their partner.

So I see what you are saying, and think it's possible that skander is feeling protective of vollkan. But I also think it could be that he dislikes/is not used to random bandwagons. (Although, I don't think the vollkan bandwagon is random... but he might have at the time).

For me, it could ge either way. But I do think it is important to note.

Also, ABR is hot for vollkan.

---

I see korts reasoning on vollkan, and think his reading of it is possible (ie that vollkan is scum).

However, I dislike neko's last post. Vollkan is L-2. Anybody is going to be defensive, no matter their allignment. I dislike his wait and see attitude -- like, "I like how vollkan is getting attacked and I look forward to his defense so I can call him defensive."

[elvis_knits]

neko, what don't you like about vollkan's defense? Being defensive does not indicate scum. (Saying someone is scum for being defensive, however, is scummy).

Personally, this is the only part of vollkan's defense which I don't like:

also, you're obviously scared about my vote. Did I hit a nerve, scum?

I am terrified about your vote. Since you are scum, I know that your vote is only going to be used to advance your sinister agenda.

As far as I can tell, the only reason vollkan thinks korts is scum, is because korts is voting vollkan. And that's no a good reason to be that sure.

[elvis_knits]

Hmmm, the deflection is a good point.

[elvis_knits]

I'M NOT SCUM DAMMIT!

Don't continue this farce. If you have any balls at all you will claim scum.

[elvis_knits]

@EK: I have this thing about reading newbs too well sometimes. :S

Do you think skander is newb scum? (with vollkan buddy?)

[elvis_knits]

I dislike how fast the volkan wagon grew.

Huh? What was so bad about the wagon on me growing quickly?

So, vollkan, are you saying you like the wagon on you? And you liked the speed?

Just making sure that I'm right about you approving of this wagon.

As far as I can tell, the only reason vollkan thinks korts is scum, is because korts is voting vollkan. And that's no a good reason to be that sure.

EK is also treating me as serious.

I can tell some of it's joking, but all of it? You're not at all serious about anything you're saying? You are not taking the wagon seriously when you are at L-2?

[elvis_knits]

I AM SCUM. THE OTHER SCUM MIGHT WAS WELL CLAIM NOW SO WE CAN COORDINATE ACTIONS AND WIN. THIS IS THE ONLY WAY TO WIN IF YOU ARE SCUM. CLAIM NOW.

Can I claim Miller? I claim

Miller

. I am not bulletproof so please refrain from shooting me on the spot. I will not name anyone so foolish and reckless as to shoot unprovoked, but you know who you are. I'm looking at you DGB. And you too, volkan. Although we are friends now, there is no telling if you still secretly want revenge for Peril in Panama.

THIS IS A GOOD START.

SCUM, PLEASE CLAIM NOW IF YOU WANT ANY CHANCE OF WINNING!

(I AM LOOKING AT YOU, MALTHUSIS, VOLLKAN, AND SKANDER).

[elvis_knits]

Okay, now explain why you have a crush on vollkan.

[elvis_knits]

ABR, do you want to die?

[elvis_knits]

I was in a game where vollkan was a miller. Omod mini.

Vollkan, I know you've been a miller. What do you think of ABR's claim?

[elvis_knits]

The women have taken over this game. We are in charge now.

[elvis_knits]

Where IS vollkan?

[elvis_knits]

I agree with continuing to pressure vollkan.

I have asked him questions. If vollkan posts here without answering them, I vote him. If he doesn't post reasonably soon I may still vote him.

Also, malth hasn't answered my questions...

[elvis_knits]

In fact, some players are suggesting that placing ABR under scrutiny for his claim is to distract from your wagon. Korts, for example, is actively trying to silence me. Your opinion?

I believe charter tried to silence you first and foremost. Any reason you keyed on korts?

[elvis_knits]

I think we can discuss the miller claim and pressure vollkan at the same time.

LOS
vollkan
DGB
Elvis/farside

I agree on vollkan, but not the rest.

[elvis_knits]

I'm still interested in this, vollkan:

As far as I can tell, the only reason vollkan thinks korts is scum, is because korts is voting vollkan. And that's no a good reason to be that sure.

EK is also treating me as serious.

I can tell some of it's joking, but all of it? You're not at all serious about anything you're saying? You are not taking the wagon seriously when you are at L-2?

Were you saying you weren't taking the wagon on you seriously, even though you got to L-2?

Some time has passed and you're still at L-2. Do you take it seriously now?

[elvis_knits]

I asked ABR someone questions because he didn't claim on his first post and wanted to know more about why he claimed when he did and why he didn't claim in his first post.

unvote:
vote: volkan

Oh, Vollkan, you're L-1 now. Taking it seriously?

[elvis_knits]

He keeps his cool? Please, he's barely posting.

That's how I define that he's keeping his cool.

This is what I was getting at by asking him why all his defenses were joking and not serious. I mean, who gets to L-2 and doesn't take it seriously? I'd be peeing my pants. The coolness has got to be an act.

[elvis_knits]

Vollkan is dancing around my questions to him.

I'm still interested in this, vollkan:

As far as I can tell, the only reason vollkan thinks korts is scum, is because korts is voting vollkan. And that's no a good reason to be that sure.

EK is also treating me as serious.

I can tell some of it's joking, but all of it? You're not at all serious about anything you're saying? You are not taking the wagon seriously when you are at L-2?

Were you saying you weren't taking the wagon on you seriously, even though you got to L-2?

Some time has passed and you're still at L-2. Do you take it seriously now?

Oh, Vollkan, you're L-1 now. Taking it seriously?

I deny the premise of your question - that I have never been serious.

As far as I can tell, the only reason vollkan thinks korts is scum, is because korts is voting vollkan. And that's no a good reason to be that sure.

As with her remarks on defensiveness above, EK is also taking everything as serious

Your answers to these two questions seem like you're deliberately trying to be difficult and to hide your true feelings. First you tell me I'm taking you too seriously. Then you tell me you have been serious at some times (but won't specify when). Then you tell me I am taking you too seriously again.

And the whole time, never giving a genuine reaction to being at L-1. Mostly what you are doing is responding to questions without giving actual answers.

I smell deception.

ALSO:

Since I am at L-1, however, I shall spill the beans (or, 99% of the beans)

What? I saw you spill no beans.

[elvis_knits]

I think malth is scum too, so I like that vote, but...

The vollkan wagon has served its cause

What do you think the vollkan wagon accomplished?

[elvis_knits]

What do you think the vollkan wagon accomplished?

We'll find out when we know vollkan's alignment. I suspect he served as a distancing board. Korts backing off after vollkan's 'non-claim claim' seems reasonable on one hand, but a calculated out, on the other. This is a nightless game. The scum daytalks. I see a possible sign of coordination here.

I just don't see that vollkan has done anything townish, and I don't see how he merits an unvote. He has danced around questions, dismissed things as jokes when people call him on scummy behavior. Korts was all about the vollkan wagon until now. I don't see what could possibly have changed his mind about vollkan.

[elvis_knits]

Vote: Korts

Leave Volkan alone, he has done you no harm.

I fail to see how this is a random vote.

[elvis_knits]

vollkan has addressed everything he needed to adequately

Really? I think his answers have sucked.

[elvis_knits]

DGB, do you think claimed millers should be policy lynched?

[elvis_knits]

DGB, do you think claimed millers should be policy lynched?

Eventually, yes, unless they're vig'ed earlier. Because you know they're not getting NK'd, ever. Only the town will eliminate a claimed miller. Do you disagree with this reasoning?

I guess I agree when you put it that way. But I don't feel like lynching abr for his miller claim alone, when so many others are dripping with scum. As the game moves forward I would look at abr and make sure he got a lot of scrutiny, to better judge his scumminess. And also, think about lynching him before lylo.

[elvis_knits]

Well done on snipping what I said [bolded]:

Since I am at L-1, however, I shall spill the beans (or, 99% of the beans)

Some of you may know that in recent times I flirted with being a start-of-game-self-voter. Self-voting was getting stale and leading to the same inevitable debates and dividing lines, so I decided I would experiment with a playstyle variation (surely some of you must have notice that I haven't been myself this game? )

On the first question thing. You accused me of not being serious. In fact, as the bolded explains, I was making a deliberate effort to temporarily embrace a "WTF" playstyle, as an alternative to self-voting. See, I began with an overdrawn reaction to Korts, and he retaliated also. What was interesting to me was how the wagon built up seriously, as reflected in the analysis at the end of my last post.

Vollkan... I read that bolded statement the first time and I don't see how it's very interesting, or crazy, or informative. It doesn't seem like some big secret. I cannot comprehend how that's "spilling the beans."

It seems natural that people might expect you to claim when you're L-1, people have asked for a claim, and you say something about spilling the beans. The explanation you provided is a gimme explanation and even if you weren't planning to claim, I would have expected something more earth-shattering. Some type of plan you concocted... or theory of the game or theory of who is scum. Merely saying how you decided not to self-vote this game... is not wild and crazy.

[elvis_knits]

Now you love vollkan?

[elvis_knits]

No, but why do you want him to claim unnecessarily?

Have I ever told him to claim?

I only expected he would because he said "I'm spilling the beans" [/big drama].

Also, I would have understood the spilling the beans comment if he had said anything else (other than a claim) that I thought was a surprise. As it was, his big revelation was a lead balloon.

[elvis_knits]

DAMMIT

[elvis_knits]

I think I had the most fun playing this game, out of everything I've ever played. I definitely thought I was going to die the first day since I was being so aggressive/obnoxious. So that just made me post as much as was humanly possible until I got killed. Reading the QT is funny because the team agreed to kill me the first real-life day. I had some suspicions on the right people, skander and ABR a little, but I was fooled on DGB, and I wanted vollkan and malthusis dead. All in all, not sure they should have been scared of me. But it was fun to go out on a high note!

Player list here was insanely fun. Active fun people to play with.

Good game all.

[elvis_knits]

I think I had the most fun playing this game, out of everything I've ever played. I definitely thought I was going to die the first day since I was being so aggressive/obnoxious. So that just made me post as much as was humanly possible until I got killed. Reading the QT is funny because the team agreed to kill me the first real-life day (although they changed their mind a few times). I had some suspicions on the right people, skander and ABR a little, but I was fooled on DGB, and I wanted vollkan and malthusis dead. All in all, not sure they should have been scared of me. But it was fun to go out on a high note!

Player list here was insanely fun. Active fun people to play with.

Good game all.

Reading more of the scum thread is funny. ABR is so wrong on so many things... and is such a pompous pain in the ass. No wonder you guys bussed him hard...

Please operate from the premise that I will live a very long, healthy life. I know what I'm doing.

Good times.

[elvis_knits]

Dammit I thought I was editing myself there...