DrippingGoofball wrote:Sorry, that's 708, not 703.
Also, http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 171#776171 skitzer fakeclaimed miller
708.farside22 wrote:Do you know of anyone scum before who claimed at the start of the day before?
skitzer didn't claim out the gate. I will have to persue Adel's game a bit.DrippingGoofball wrote:708.farside22 wrote:Do you know of anyone scum before who claimed at the start of the day before?
I have never seen a fake miller claim. I have seen a truthful miller claim, if I remember correctly, twice. That's a 2 out of 2 in the other direction than you're suggesting. I have been around for more than a year so I have to ask: how many miller claims, fake or not, (approximately even) have you seen altogether?DrippingGoofball wrote:Are you serious? You need to be shown games with fake miller claims?farside22 wrote:@DGB: Every game thus far except 1 all miller claims have been town. Can you link games where millers are scum?
At the top of my head, 7 or 8. I recall clearly being wrong about 2. One was a fakeclaiming townie of all things, maybe even BM... I just know after a while, I decided that I had seen enough miller fakeclaims and giving them the benefit of the doubt was a losing proposition.Korts wrote:I have never seen a fake miller claim. I have seen a truthful miller claim, if I remember correctly, twice. That's a 2 out of 2 in the other direction than you're suggesting. I have been around for more than a year so I have to ask: how many miller claims, fake or not, (approximately even) have you seen altogether?
Depends when the person claimed and how they answer questions under pressure.Skander wrote:@ Korts and farside: IN your opinons when you see someone claim miller Day 1 does that make them more or less likely to be scum than a random player who has not claimed miller (or does it not change anything)?
Since when does one day of not posting warrant this sort of question?Korts wrote: vollkan, youconvenientlyignored this question:
On the bolded: Nice to see that we are sticking to objective language.Korts wrote: BTW I see you did the same to charter as I did to elvis. If you think my action was scummy, what is your justification?
Anyway, look again at what I said in relation to you doing likewise on Elvis:It's pretty obvious, but I didn't anywhere attack you labelling a voll-EK scumpair. What I was making a fuss about (with a level of seriousness which I will leave it to your good will to judge) was that you didn't vote with your OMGUS attack.Voll wrote:Ahem...Korts wrote: OMGUS, OMGUSEK wrote: I am scum.
Also, vote korts DIE!At least when I make a OMGUS, I have the guts to vote.Korts wrote:vollkan-elvis pair, gogogo
I was saying neither of those things. I was simply asking skander to explain why he claims toEK wrote: So, vollkan, are you saying you like the wagon on you? And you liked the speed?notlike the speed of the wagon.
Well, to state it now, "YES, I APPROVE OF THE WAGON ON ME"EK wrote: Just making sure that I'm right about you approving of this wagon.
My own desire to be amused by casting an ironic "OMGUS-explosion" vote in response to you saying I was being too "defensive" (which, as some of you may know, is a word which sets my scumdar pinging)neko wrote: vollkan, is there anything besides omgus behind your vote on me?
I'd forgotten all about Panama...until now :Evil:ABR wrote: Can I claim Miller? I claim Miller. I am not bulletproof so please refrain from shooting me on the spot. I will not name anyone so foolish and reckless as to shoot unprovoked, but you know who you are. I'm looking at you DGB. And you too, volkan. Although we are friends now, there is no telling if you still secretly want revenge for Peril in Panama.
On the other hand, I am firmly of the view that Millers should claim as early as possible (and this is early enough).
It's not really a crush so much as requited love.EK wrote: Okay, now explain why you have a crush on vollkan.
As I intimated above, I approve of early miller claims (which is exactly what I did in Omod).EK wrote: I was in a game where vollkan was a miller. Omod mini.
Vollkan, I know you've been a miller. What do you think of ABR's claim?
My reasoning, if you want it, is basically that a Miller claim is not a viable strategy for scum - it prevents them from keeping their fake-claim options open and is guaranteed to place them under heightened scrutiny. Moreover, it ensures that the scenario doesn't arise of cop. claiming a guilty, only to be met with a truthful miller claim.
Of course, ABR could still be scum. And I don't think Miller claims are a towntell. But I am nonetheless of the view that millers should claim early.
EK wrote: Where IS vollkan?
Given your opinion, which is (surprising to me) shared by many others, how is the bolded part of your statement true? In particular, what kind of scrutiny are we speaking of here, if a player follows the 'rule' of claiming very early?vollkan wrote:My reasoning, if you want it, is basically that a Miller claim is not a viable strategy for scum - it prevents them from keeping their fake-claim options open and isguaranteed to place them under heightened scrutiny.
Can you elaborate on that? What timing is more likely to be scum and what timing more likely to be town?farside22 wrote:Depends when the person claimed and how they answer questions under pressure.Skander wrote:@ Korts and farside: IN your opinons when you see someone claim miller Day 1 does that make them more or less likely to be scum than a random player who has not claimed miller (or does it not change anything)?
Wait so was it serious or not? Did you vote neko since you didn't like the word 'defensive' or was it to amuse yourself?vollkan wrote:My own desire to be amused by casting an ironic "OMGUS-explosion" vote in response to you saying I was being too "defensive" (which, as some of you may know, is a word which sets my scumdar pinging)neko wrote: vollkan, is there anything besides omgus behind your vote on me?
Bold mine. If they are not a viable strategy for scum why isn't it a town tell?My reasoning, if you want it, is basically thata Miller claim is not a viable strategy for scum- it prevents them from keeping their fake-claim options open and is guaranteed to place them under heightened scrutiny. Moreover, it ensures that the scenario doesn't arise of cop. claiming a guilty, only to be met with a truthful miller claim.
Of course, ABR could still be scum.And I don't think Miller claims are a towntell.But I am nonetheless of the view that millers should claim early.
I almost universally treat all claims that come when not under serious pressure as null and pretty much just ignore them. If that person has acted scummy enough to warrent a lynch, their claim doesn't get in the way. As for people's reactions, I think farside and DGB's are interesting. DGB says 80% of miller claims are scum, well that right there is a reason for her to go after ABR tooth and nail. 80% IS THE ODDS FROM THE LOINS OF JESUS! Farside made a lot of questioning and then went nowhere with it. I don't even see what she could have done with those questions. Quite suspicious of both of them.skander wrote:@everyone: How predictable is the miller reaction around here? I see that pretty much everyone that responded refernced their own personal beliefs about miller claims. How easy is it for someone to predict the responses that a miller claim will bring?
Straight from the horses mouth, I think he needs another vote.vollkan wrote:Well, to state it now, "YES, I APPROVE OF THE WAGON ON ME"
Good catch, make that two more votes.skander wrote:Bold mine. If they are not a viable strategy for scum why isn't it a town tell?
It appears so. I've had little time, so I pretty much skimmed the thread (i.e., didn't read vollkan's wall of texts) and malthusis's posts struck me as the most scummy.neko2086 wrote:Sorry for the double post, but CarnCarn, is that all you have for us so far?
I believe charter tried to silence you first and foremost. Any reason you keyed on korts?DrippingGoofball wrote: In fact, some players are suggesting that placing ABR under scrutiny for his claim is to distract from your wagon. Korts, for example, is actively trying to silence me. Your opinion?
Are you questioning Miller Worship?roflcopter wrote:something about this game makes me think miller is not a terribly likely role
Well let's see. According to charter, players that question the Worship of the Day 1 Miller Claim are sketchy, according to charter. And players that question the players that question the worship, but not vigorously enough, are sketchy, too.roflcopter wrote:@dgb:
charter is town, y/n?