Mini 881 - Moviestar Madness - Game Over

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I didn't realize the thread was open, either. Ah well. I've found it now.

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Vote: DragonsofSummer

. Mordy gave a legitimate reason for voting DoS; I find his OMGUS accusation disingenuous.

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Go read through her fake smileys-only-post-restriction game. In fact, just read her in isolation. Is great fun, and you'll get an idea of why people are encouraging you to treat her a certain way.

Judging from the types of roles my actor typically plays, I don't think claiming roles would lead to very reliable information.

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I agree with you when it's a player like zwet who both has low-content activity and is hard to read. DGB, on the other hand, is a pretty active player; she'll have contributed a great deal by the end.

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by the end of what?

The game.

I like DGB's case on cat.

Unvote; Vote: cateraction.

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The comment about breadcrumbing on page 1 didn't make much sense to me at the time; however, it makes perfect sense in light of DGB's contextualization. I think that level of evidence trumps DoS's largely RVS vote for Mordy.

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There're some other odd pre-game and RVS comments that could be construed as breadcrumbs, even if they weren't as explicit as yours. You may be right that there are fewer than DGB implied, but I still prefer my current vote to my prior.

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how do you know when she is going to leave it?

I don't. I was just analogizing with other DGB games I've read through. In context, I was differentiating her from other players with unusual playstyles.

I've had a girlish crush on her ever since I read the smiley-restriction game. Not that that was one where she contributed as well as she could have, but ye know.

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Vaya was pretty active as town in the only other game I've played with him.

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I had the same thought as O when I read Vaya's response (i.e. not enough thinking critically about DGB's alignment), but I'm struck by his comment that he's only posted twice since the game started. That pattern might indicate general inactivity rather than something specific to this game.

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I can understand the basis of tajo's meta-based suspicion of me. However, I think he's interpreted it the wrong way. I replaced into Twilight mafia (the game I assume he's alluding to) on page 20-something and came in with a big post on the game and so forth. That obviously hasn't happened here because the circumstances are different. Refer to Rabbit Doubt mafia (or tajo's I-love-you mafia, really) for a game where I think my play was pretty similar to how it is here.

I don't understand why the cateraction vote was scummy. I'm happy with it for the moment. Maybe you could explain?

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(My name has 2 e's.)

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It's pronounced /jekerInt/ in IPA, if the e's were epsilons and the r were upside-down.

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np bro. The second e can be a schwa if ye want; I ain't picky.

I always assume that players are trying their best to make serious votes unless they unvote in the same post. Granted, "their best" may not extend too far during the so-called RVS.

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I don't begrudge Mordy for pointing out that players were buddying DGB. They kinda were. Normally, I think it'd even be appropriate to keep on bringing up the point, except that this is DGB and she's kinda a celebrity, so I think people can be forgiven for doing that sort of thing early on.

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What exactly are you insinuating that he's "soft-claiming"? The fact that he has a role? Also, if you think he's soft-claiming, why on earth would you advertise it?

Besides, soft claims are pretty meaningless this game. By all indications, our roles change as the game goes on.

MS's post is very silly. Scum posts a lot because they try to look town! Looking town is scummy, guys! Better lurk!

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WIFOM is totally over-the-top and unapologetic.

Unvote; Vote: milkshake

. Bummer about cateraction, though.

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Nah, I'm just communicating that I was perfectly happy voting cateraction, especially given that he's sort of not playing the game.

I have difficulty believing that a player can present the opinion that MS presented without apologizing for it/contextualizing it upon being called out ("Vaya said she had a lab report!") or having an ulterior motive. The most obvious ulterior motive to me is a scum connection.

Also, that is a mean name.

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EBWOP: To be clear, my happiness is relevant because it contextualizes my feelings about MS's play.

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I am sympathetic to your view that Vaya is scum. However, his play in the linked game is way, way scummier than his play here IMO. He basically doesn't post for a week, then comes in with this post the 8th day the thread's been open:

Can't say I'm thrilled about the idea of another quicklynch(I never even got around to posting Day 1 before it ended), but I can't see how this situation makes any sense with mipe being a vanilla town. I'm not going to stall a scum lynch just for the sake of more discussion.

Vote: mipe

"I hate quicklynches, and I've lurked all week that the thread's been open, so I'm gonna quicklynchhammer! " I mean, this is MS-level absurdity.

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EBWOP: Said vote was indeed the hammer, to clarify for everyone.

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A few isolated players had commented that he was lurking, but that's all. It wasn't a major discussion topic. No one talked about the post afterwards, either, except for zwet and plum, who said they would've hammered if Vaya hadn't. It looks like he got a pass because it was a popular wagon. I haven't read the thread apart from the few pages around his post, but I think they really overlooked said post.

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He was lying as town? Fair enough. I didn't read the thread very carefully except your post, the bit around it, and what people were saying about you.

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cat, I notice that you are not voting. Is there a non-Vaya wagon that you think is less silly?

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Hmm? Policy-lynching zwet?

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I find your suggestion that cat may be zwet persuasive. He has a similar avatar at present, and his posting style is also similar. When I saw CKD's post, I read it as, "now that [lynching zwet] is something i can get behind." I find wanting to lynch zwet in the absence of zwet-relevant evidence that he may be scum on D1 to be highly suspicious.

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Well, he also hasn't responded yet. For all I know, you were just reminding him that cat existed and was kinda suspicious and he was feeling guilty for not voting someone, so he did. I was asking him the question because the answer would affect how I interpreted his statement.

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Psycho, why didn't you point out that you were L-1ing?

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Oh, I hadn't noticed that last sentence. Vaya, please link to said game.

cat, please accept or dispute Vaya's assertion about playstyle change. Explain if necessary.

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Certain roles probably have mechanisms to learn about corpses. It does seem like the self-selection makes it a bit swingy, though, innit.

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Also --

Unvote; Vote: cateraction

. I decided I liked my vote better where it used to be. I may reconsider where to put it pending reading Vaya's cat game.

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Jason went from 4th scummiest to 1st scummiest on Vaya's list. It's true that he was arbitrarily in the "scum" category both times, but Vaya could just have easily have had fewer players in the "scum" group, in which case jason would've gone from Neutral to Scum. I think the appearance that Vaya's vote is based on after-the-fact information is an illusion resulting from that. In reality (in this view, at least; I hadn't even noticed that jason was playing the game until yesterday), his current posts are what make him scummiest because he was only 4th scummiest before them.

I doubt Vaya would allude to a cat game where he was "talkative and obvtown IMO" if it weren't true. It's not as if Vaya's going to get a quicklynch on cat prior to having to produce said game. If there's really a significant playstyle difference, I think that's a good enough reason against cat that he's a better lynch than MS. Besides, MS has been well-behaved lately.

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cat posts literally almost every day, and often multiple times per day, in the game Vaya's posted. (Not sure why you're saying his activity wasn't as high as you remembered, Vaya.) I think cat needs to justify the difference, either by pointing out games between then and now (the linked game was July09 - September09) that demonstrate his new style or by demonstrating that he has been a highly active player as scum. He survived to endgame in the linked game, so I'm inclined to believe he had little motivation to drastically alter his town style.

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Didn't Psycho put Vaya at L-1? Or did Jason and Psycho both do it at different times? I agree with Mordy's approach to MS's comment.

I strongly encourage everyone to at least skim cat in iso in the game Vaya posted. Unless cat can justify the discrepancy, I think more players should vote cat and fewer should vote Vaya. If someone thinks that cat's play in the earlier game is not relevant, they should explain why.

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Because they're lurking a bit?

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Yes, I saw the list. I'm just pointing out the only aspect of their recent play that is interpretable.

I don't like listing town reads, but I really doubt tajo is scum. I could see towntajo getting a scum read on me on the basis of how we interacted in the prior game we played together as town. I don't like that he disappeared, though.

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Don't be silly; DGB has made plenty of well-reasoned statements today.

That said -- DGB, could you explain your town read on CKD?

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I'm just waiting for cat to come and explain himself. His play in Vaya's posted game is night-and-day compared to what's here. Also, Vaya's response to being L-1'd here was the same as it was D1 in tajo's I Love You mafia, where he made a good case on SSK after being pressured. (Well, SSK turned out to be town, but he picked up on good points IMO.) Vaya ended up being mislynched ftl at endgame. Not sure whether that's a Vaya-tell, though.

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My mistake. At any rate, pressure led to scumhunting that impressed me on both occasions.

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cat > jason >>>> vaya >= psycho

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Cat -- do you think that either or both of Vaya and Jason are scum?

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I don't think we should have had him claim yet, but I guess it can't be helped at this point. I don't hold it against him as DGB suggested it; I'm ambivalent as to whether to hold the request against DGB given that we're pretty close to deadline. Even with the claim, I'd rather lynch cat.

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It was really just DGB and me? That hurts my feelings a little. I didn't realize it was so few.

It would probably be effective for bringing back the NK'd, but it'd be a little silly as we wouldn't know their alignment.

I'll contribute to hammering JT if it gets too close to deadline, I guess. Can't say I'm crazy about it.

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Better than a NL, and you're my second-favorite.

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I interpreted his statement as a reaction to the piling-up of votes onto jason that happened yesterday.

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Read it in the context of the previous sentence to get my interpretation, unless you're just pointing out that you interpreted it the same way as me.

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I had the same thought as my-interpretation-of-Psycho just before he posted it, but my interpretation of said post may've been colored by my indifference to J's wagon. It would be nice if Psycho could clarify.

I vaguely recall that Psycho has asked for the basis of players' town reads on you without getting a good answer; I kinda identify with him as I did the same thing and didn't get back anything satisfactory (e.g. references to your "dashing good looks," etc.). So that may be the reason. I think Psycho is unlikely to be scum, except with DGB.

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lol @ jason's recent post. Vaya is tunnelvisioned AND she wants to go with the popular wagon. Amazing. <_<

I agree that the wagon on him sorta grew extraordinarily fast, though.

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I think most players in the game are only looking at you and cat at present. And Vaya, maybe.

In other news, tajo is not giving me the attention I deserve.

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Al Pacino would sort of seem to've been scum, I guess. I don't know how else we're to deduce alignment other than that it's as unambiguous as that. Maybe someone has an omnipriest who'll be able to confirm a lot of players later on.

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Vaya didn't intend to hammer. The lynch occurred with only 6 votes. Either cat was Hated, or an ability leading to a lynch at 6 votes was in play.

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I come bearing facts! My death D2 was a function of my role that day. Here's some information for everyone:

Exactly 1 of the players who were not "alive and free" D2 was mafia. (Mod-confirmed)
Exactly 1 of the players who were not "alive and free" D2 was 3rd party. (Mod-confirmed)
DragonsOfSummer was almost certainly town. (Mod-strongly implied)

To be clear, the scum and 3rd party players potentially include Psychologic and DGB, but this is not necessary. Anyone with resurrection powers should resurrect DoS today or tonight if possible.

I think cateraction was probably scum. Since at least one of Ortolan and Cateraction was not scum, Ortolan may have been town, though it's possible he was the 3rd party player.

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Sure; let me explain what happened. My ability D2 allowed me to fake my death and then come back to life when a condition I prespecified was fulfilled. The Mod clarified on questioning that I could specify conditions I would not otherwise be aware of, so I chose that I would come back to life when at least 2 non-town players were non-aliveandfree. I chose 2 because I was pretty sure that at least 1 non-town was among the flips, but I wasn't sure about 2. I was allowed to choose my flavor with restrictions, too, which is why I eat 2 pretzels in my death post.

When DoS died and I didn't come back into the game, I sent a message to the Mod trying to confirm that I was still fakedead. (Reading along, I thought DoS was scum.) He confirmed that I was. Then, a few hours later, he indicated that he had erred D2 -- when I initially sent in my condition, it had already been fulfilled, but the Mod had not counted a certain 3rd party player as non-town. He indicated that I would come back D3.

So, I hope that clears things up. Unless either the Mod was both mistaken about DoS's alignment AND about the 3rd party player and neglected to clear this up after the fact (very highly remote) or the apparent error is a function of another player's role (also remote), DoS is town.

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I think the best option is either Vaya or milkshake. I'm leaning Vaya, but I don't necessarily want to put him at L-1 so quickly.

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I second DGB's question @ Psycho.

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It looks like you may've already figured it out, but my ability could be used at any point during D2. I could have fakedied just before the lynch if I had wanted to. I spent the first block of D2 haggling over how broken a "return" condition I could specify, which is why it took awhile.

DoS is town because, had he been scum, the Mod would have returned me to the game N2 in spite of his having missed the non-A&F 3rd party at the start of D2. It's possible that DoS is a second 3rd party that he overlooked again, but it's simpler that he was town. I agree that he looked like scum, though; his claim was particularly odd.

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If we assume that bussing occurred, I think that Vaya is the most obvious choice. DoS is cleared unless the Mod is playing a mean trick. On the other hand, characterizing it as a "bus" is a bit unnecessary, as Vaya was one of the major suspects that day.

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By "since Tuesday," you mean since 10 days ago, right?

Vote: milkshake

. I am ambivalent between MS and Vaya.

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Regarding MS's last post -- it's true that that was a possible interpretation of the post at the time, but I don't think it's feasible any longer. We probably would have already won the game. Mordy alludes to this. I think he's already answered Mordy's question, though. MS, I'd like it if you would explain why you think Mordy is scum, unless it's just gut.

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I think Mordy is town unless he's scum with DGB (remote)

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If you sent tajo to an island, why do you think he died? Did you receive a message that you were roleblocked? And why did you target tajo to save him, anyway?

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If that's the case, why aren't you more suspicious of Vaya? She claimed to have killed tajo N2.

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I can't argue with that, but we could've played with him a little more to get some information....

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Sorry for eating you N1, O. I was really on the fence about it.

Mordy totally fooled me. It kinda hurts my feelings that she killed me. Ah well. Good thing Psycho killed her.

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So, cateraction could have either killed someone at L-1 or been killed at L-1? Or how did his role work?

How did Vaya's "Collateral" ability work? (It says Serial Killer - Vig.)

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I was Gary Oldman, so it seemed reasonable to me.

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Well, no, Gary Oldman's a great actor, but I think you know what I mean. They're both not choices as obvious as "Tom Cruise" or "Brad Pitt."

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You lurked a little more D1 than I thought you normally do. I also managed to convince myself that Vaya was much townier than cat D1, which made you one of The Bad Guys. Can't speak for anyone else.

Also, I literally just figured out your breadcrumb.

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<3PSB<3