Mini 881 - Moviestar Madness - Game Over

[DrippingGoofball]

So I'm scum no matter how Vaya flips then? Hmm.

That certainly would be true if you're scum.

But there are no reveals unfortunately.

So why don't you tell us now if you're town or scum. We'll start with that.

[jasonT1981]

OK going to take it from where I last posted.

Page 6 – Sorta agreeing here on Vaya, seems to be a legit case of a sum tell lurking... the links Vaya provided as her defense really didnt appeal to me as she was not really lurking in them. Though I do think DGB so far is very aggressive and tunnel visioned against Vaya. Though I can somewhat understand.

I do however agree also Mordy is trying to find anything to argue about.

So far Vaya seems to be posting, but not actually scum hunting very much

Not too sure if I picked up on DOS buddying up to DGB as Mordy mentioned.

Post 145 Mordy calls me a lurker.. can I just ask here, what defines lurking? I always thought lurking was reading the thread and keeping up to date but not posting... I have not been near my computer for the better part of 3 days now though due to flu.

Post 146 – Hmm, Mordy missed Ice, and then points out that she missed him, is this an attempt to cover her tracks? Maybe thought people would pick up on her missing him out and think there is a connection? Not sure how I read into that one.

Page 7

I agree with DOS vote, he made a decent post against Mordy

More Mordy posts where she is seemingly more concerned with finding things to argue about rather than scum hunt.

Pointless debate between DGB and Ice over the spelling of Ice name.

Psychologic claims.... why? I really saw no need for him to make a claim here.

Not heard from Vaya in a bit, maybe with what is going on with Mordy she feels she can slip back into the back ground?

Page 8

DGB changes his stance on Mordy because scum would not be this irritating? But then encourages him to be more irratating to keep people on their toes? OR MAYBE keep being irritating to keep the heat of scum??

Milkshake gets a strong scum read on me, for being defensive... Its how I play, if someone attacks me I do go on the defensive. Its a neutral read really as I do it as both town and scum.

CDK says about Mordy role-fishing... not sure if I see it as role fishing.

Still no Vaya

hmm Mordy mentions about CDK softclaiming, this I now see as role-fishing or at least an attempt to out a role. Not sure if I like that..

post 194 by DGB I like a lot, this supports more evidence towardss a scum tell of lurking on Vaya, I really think I would be happy with a Vaya lynch right now.

Page 9 now, still no Vaya...

Mordy vote on Vaya, I can understand, reading the games that have been posted I would agree her lurking is a major scum tell.

Ah, Vaya is back, about time...gives a town to scum list posting with a vote for cateraction claiming she 'lost' her post on everyone, sorry not buying that at all. You should be able to, from memory remember quite a bit of it, at least main bullet points against each person.

Nice questions by CDK which he asks for reasons why Vaya thinks he is scum... she replies with she cant as she dont have time.... so, lost notes... now cant post the case when asked? Not liking this one bit at all now.

cateraction can not understand the Vaya wagon? Distancing himself from it maybe? The linked games, along with her 'lost post' and 'dont have time to make my case' is damning to me.

Conclusion.

CDK and DGB are most likely town at the minute to me, Mordy, Cateraction and Vaya are most likely scum, but the case outlined against Vaya I can get behind. I think it is very good evidence to go on

unvote
vote: Vaya

Major FOS on Cat though, seems he wants to distance himself from a Vaya lynch.

My appoligies for taking so long, I have been dosed with flu for the best part of this week. I am feeling quite a bit better so should be about until Friday again, where I am away for the weekend as per usual and have limited access..

[Vaya]

Okay, explaination for my scum reads now, I'll start with jason.

Psychologic is town, actually.

Will get a full catch up tomorrow. Just home from a night out and it is 3AM But this I find to be a very bold statement. And I actually agree with MordyS suspicions

One thing I know... if DG was scum.. He would know Psych is town.

other scenario is masons as has been said I believe... but why would they out themselves so early in a game?

I could see this as potential buddying up though

This post was what got my attention at first. I don't see anything wrong with saying someone is town like that, it seems like a weird thing for a townie to sincerely be concerned about. His reaction to it felt odd and a bit artificial to me. This gave me a slight town read on him. In addition to that now though...

Unvote
Vote: jason

That last post of his was just awful. He does nothing but follow and agree with all the popular targets and doesn't seem to offer much of any original though.

Ah, Vaya is back, about time...gives a town to scum list posting with a vote for cateraction claiming she 'lost' her post on everyone, sorry not buying that at all. You should be able to, from memory remember quite a bit of it, at least main bullet points against each person.

Of course I can remember what I said, I just didn't have time to type it out again. I said I'd explain it again anyway, I don't see how this could bother you.

Nice questions by CDK which he asks for reasons why Vaya thinks he is scum... she replies with she cant as she dont have time.... so, lost notes... now cant post the case when asked? Not liking this one bit at all now.

Awful, just piling bad points on to the popular target. You have no reason to think I'm lying about losing my explanations, and I said I'd post my cases later, you never even gave me a chance to get around to it.

cateraction can not understand the Vaya wagon? Distancing himself from it maybe?

unvote
vote: Vaya

Major FOS on Cat though, seems he wants to distance himself from a Vaya lynch.

I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out that this guy's scum with cater either.

I'll get to explaining my other 3 scum reads soon(I have a feeling I'm wrong about CKD though, due to something I noticed that I don't think I should point out, I'll still explain why I thought he was scum), I just wanted to get this out first.

[Vaya]

EBWOP:

This gave me a slight town read on him. In addition to that now though...

That should read, "slight scum read" of course.

[Psychologic]

Vaya, your case on jasonT1981 is mainly based on his case made on you in post 227.
Your case reeks of OMGUS, and I feel you only targetted him due to his most recent post.

Unvote. Vote: Vaya.

Don't think i'm not still suspicious of you, milkshake.

I will respond to other things directed at me when I get back home in three hours.

Sincerely

,

Psycho

logic

[Vaya]

Vaya, your case on jasonT1981 is mainly based on his case made on you in post 227.
Your case reeks of OMGUS, and I feel you only targetted him due to his most recent post.

Unvote. Vote: Vaya.

How'd I guess that someone would try to write off my reasoning as OMGUS? I don't see why I can't point out how I find someone's jumping on the one wagon I know is on town scummy. Yes I targeted him mainly due to his most recent post, because it reeked to me of scumminess.

[DrippingGoofball]

Vaya, you had jason at the top of your scumlist after he wrote what, ONE post?

Then when asked to explain your read, you MOSTLY based it on a post he made AFTER you put him at the bottom of your scum list!

Hahahhahaha.

[Vaya]

?

I honestly don't know what you're talking about Goofball.

Psychologic is town, actually.

Will get a full catch up tomorrow. Just home from a night out and it is 3AM But this I find to be a very bold statement. And I actually agree with MordyS suspicions

One thing I know... if DG was scum.. He would know Psych is town.

other scenario is masons as has been said I believe... but why would they out themselves so early in a game?

I could see this as potential buddying up though

This post was what got my attention at first. I don't see anything wrong with saying someone is town like that, it seems like a weird thing for a townie to sincerely be concerned about. His reaction to it felt odd and a bit artificial to me.

Jason was at the top of my scumlist, as in he was the least scummy of the people there. My original read was only a slight scum read based on one thing he said that bothered me, mentioned above.

But I really don't like his most recent post, which moves him further down my list.

[DrippingGoofball]

Refresher:

Town

Psychologic
MordyS

Townish

milkshake
Iecerint
DrippingGoofball
populartajo
DragonsofSummer

Scummy

jasonT1981
curiouskarmadog
ortolan
cateraction

Vote: cateraction

Where's your case on cateraction? ortolan? And most of your case on jason occured AFTER his most recent post, and largely based on it. He was already among your 1/3 scummiest players.

[Vaya]

I'd just like to remind everyone that I'm at L-1 right now, so nobody do anything stupid like quick-lynching me now.

And most of your case on jason occured AFTER his most recent post, and largely based on it. He was already among your 1/3 scummiest players.

That's because, as I've said repeatedly, my jason read was only a slight scum read before his last post. If I explained my read before that post, I wouldn't have had to much to say. That's why most of my read is based off of his post after my initial comment.

The one thing that bothers me about ortolan was his reaction to your case against me. I think its odd that after beating him as lurker-scum once, that he would laugh it off at first when someone points out that I'm behaving in a similar fashion here. He later gets on the wagon, but seems a bit reluctant. I'd think he'd be a bit more cautious of me if he didn't know whether or not I'm mafia. It feels like he could be scum who's cautious of getting on what he probably see's as an easy townie wagon.

As for cater, I just have a bad feeling about that guy. He's posted very little, and he's not even pretending to scumhunt, he's mostly just been screwing around, which doesn't sit right with me. In the last game I've played with him, a newbie game I replaced late into, he was talkative and obvtown IMO, so this change in playstyle bothers me.

[Iecerint]

Psycho, why didn't you point out that you were L-1ing?

[DrippingGoofball]

Vaya, please point out the evidence concerning cateraction.

unvote

[Iecerint]

Oh, I hadn't noticed that last sentence. Vaya, please link to said game.

cat, please accept or dispute Vaya's assertion about playstyle change. Explain if necessary.

[milkshake]

This game certainly has taken on an interesting aspect of heavily debating reads and playstyles instead of dissolving into "You're illogical, no you're illogical, you use ad hominem blahdy blah blah." I like, but it means I can't take on my usual role of telling everyone else that they are arguing like crazy chimpanzees. ^^

jasonT is my new addition to my top suspects for jumping on the Vaya wagon so late in its journey. I really don't know if he actually believe the whole vayalurking-is-scum thing. He seems more like he's copying previous reasons without internalizing them. And it's the L-1 vote. Vaya is

so

not worthy of a L-1 vote.

unvote, vote: jasonT

By the way, no reveal really does make it difficult to decide who to lynch since you can't weigh what you gain from the flip (something I tend to do alot). Confusing.

[Iecerint]

Certain roles probably have mechanisms to learn about corpses. It does seem like the self-selection makes it a bit swingy, though, innit.

[Iecerint]

Also --

Unvote; Vote: cateraction

. I decided I liked my vote better where it used to be. I may reconsider where to put it pending reading Vaya's cat game.

[TonyMontana]

No Reveal on Death - Vote Count

L-2

Vaya

(5) ortolan, MordyS, DragonofSummer, Jason, Psychologic
L-5

cateraction

(2) curiouskarmadog, Iecerint
L-5

Jason

(2) Vaya, milkshake
L-5

MordyS

(1) populartajo

Not voting: cateraction, DrippingGoofball

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch

Deadline is in

3 days and 11 hours

[curiouskarmadog]

holy shit, this page I believe will be one I am going to come back to during future rereads...

Before getting to this page, I thought my vote would find it's way to vaya....then this page...I hate Jason's jump on the Vaya bandwagon.....after that, I was sure my vote going to be on jason. then I read Vaya's "case" against Jason, which had a ton of after the fact information...super scummy.

also iece vote confuses me after the amount of information that has been dumped into our laps from this page.

unvote.

thinking things over.

also vaya....still waiting on reasons my I am on your scum list....

[Iecerint]

Jason went from 4th scummiest to 1st scummiest on Vaya's list. It's true that he was arbitrarily in the "scum" category both times, but Vaya could just have easily have had fewer players in the "scum" group, in which case jason would've gone from Neutral to Scum. I think the appearance that Vaya's vote is based on after-the-fact information is an illusion resulting from that. In reality (in this view, at least; I hadn't even noticed that jason was playing the game until yesterday), his current posts are what make him scummiest because he was only 4th scummiest before them.

I doubt Vaya would allude to a cat game where he was "talkative and obvtown IMO" if it weren't true. It's not as if Vaya's going to get a quicklynch on cat prior to having to produce said game. If there's really a significant playstyle difference, I think that's a good enough reason against cat that he's a better lynch than MS. Besides, MS has been well-behaved lately.

[Vaya]

viewtopic.php?t=11802

The is the game I was referring to. Actually, looking back though, a lot of his posts were still short one liners like they are here, so its not as big a change of playstyle as I remembered. Still, he was being a lot more helpful and townie-looking than he is here right now.

then I read Vaya's "case" against Jason, which had a ton of after the fact information...super scummy.

I really don't get why this bothers people. I like the way Iec explains it, he seems to understand where I'm coming from. Jason was basically a null read, slightly leaning scum based on one odd thing he did before. If I had put a neutral category in my list, he'd have been in it towards the bottom, and I wouldn't have had too much to say about him when I explained my read.

But I felt jason's last post was extremely scummy, in the way that he comes to the conclusion that everyone the town mostly doesn't have a problem with is town, and everyone the town doesn't like is scummy. Also, a lot of his reasoning for getting on my wagon was awful.

also vaya....still waiting on reasons my I am on your scum list....

Sorry, I'll explain why I thought that soon.

[Iecerint]

cat posts literally almost every day, and often multiple times per day, in the game Vaya's posted. (Not sure why you're saying his activity wasn't as high as you remembered, Vaya.) I think cat needs to justify the difference, either by pointing out games between then and now (the linked game was July09 - September09) that demonstrate his new style or by demonstrating that he has been a highly active player as scum. He survived to endgame in the linked game, so I'm inclined to believe he had little motivation to drastically alter his town style.

[MordyS]

jasonT is my new addition to my top suspects for jumping on the Vaya wagon so late in its journey. I really don't know if he actually believe the whole vayalurking-is-scum thing. He seems more like he's copying previous reasons without internalizing them. And it's the L-1 vote. Vaya is so not worthy of a L-1 vote.

How exactly would you detect whether someone authentically believed or didn't believe vayalurking-is-scum? How exactly does one internalize reasons? This milkshake post concerns me. It sounds like he's doing to jasonT what he accuses jasonT of doing to Vaya. (Of course, he's not putting jasonT at L-1, which might make the difference).

[milkshake]

Hm. I thought I was making original comments on jasonT not recylcing them... MordyS you just keep saying things!

[MordyS]

Hm. I thought I was making original comments on jasonT not recylcing them... MordyS you just keep saying things!

That last post of his [jasonT] was just awful. He does nothing but follow and agree with all the popular targets and doesn't seem to offer much of any original though.

jasonT is my new addition to my top suspects for jumping on the Vaya wagon so late in its journey. I really don't know if he actually believe the whole vayalurking-is-scum thing. He seems more like he's copying previous reasons without internalizing them.

Did you really think that? Cause like -- you weren't. Also, wanna answer my questions?

[milkshake]

Well fine- Vaya came up with the same thing more or less (well, it's obvious), but I was more specific. My comments were still original, not obviously taken straight from, like, three other posters.

Also, wanna answer my questions?

How exactly would you detect whether someone authentically believed or didn't believe vayalurking-is-scum? How exactly does one internalize reasons?

These "questions" are just my post put into question form.