Tales of You (Endgame)

[Just Sheep Us]

this game is gonna be really fun

walking dead vibes, specially with gyarados, rancid, stalin, lord business, and titan. the latter two should nip their shit in the bud sooner rather than later.

vote: clyton

[Just Sheep Us]

Hey guys, Bro checking in.

Fuck y'all for making me catch up so many pages. Will get to this tonight or tomorrow.

Working on a better avatar, the NZ fern+mini sheep worked out relatively poorly.

[Just Sheep Us]

Prod received. Cabd annoyed with me and Desp. He and I are still having trouble connecting, and I haven't made a chunk of 1-2 hours to catch up on this shit.

[Just Sheep Us]

i really need to start being permanently v/la on the weekends; my work schedule is insane.

bro said he'd speed read and dump a bunch of thoughts in our qt but then he got tired and fell asleep...i can sympathize.

i also basically only have townreads still. if i squint really hard i can make up a scumread on some people (orcinus, drake, peregrine) but they wouldn't have any conviction behind them.

unvote

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@ titan: you've seen me not be present as town as well, so how are you reconciling that and why do you think our lack of thread presence in the first week of the game is enough to constitute a top scumread?

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thank you for confirming that bro is not dead in a ditch somewhere

[Just Sheep Us]

That Cait was terrible.

I'd continue with my catchup, but I'm playing League some more. Gotta get back to Plat :/

I'll get to it in a bit.

[Just Sheep Us]

Hi guys. Theres not even a role PM in my inbox, he just skyped me it lol cause cabd is too mia for his own good.

I'm replacing this lurkscum. I could read these 40 pages, cough of some faked scumreads, and vote townies, but I'd really just cut to the latter part of that? If someone could point me to a wagon on a townie that I could hop on and get this mafia win secured, that'd be great.

You town mastin? I can smell the fear on you, just surrender now, are you mafia?

I'm bulletproof. Just kidding, I'm a lyncher for mastinSSK¹.

VOTE: Cabd.

Vote: Cabd

FoS: The mod

VOTE: MastinSSK
Because they're probably scum, and even if they're not, I'm going to end up thinking they are, anyway.

1. BULLETPROOF lyncher for mastinSSK

Oh hi there.

My motivation to finish that catchup post just increased substantially.

[Just Sheep Us]

My only request is that we lynch Yakuri whoever the fuck by D3 at the latest. Wow. If its scum, its gotta go. If its town, its REALLY gotta go.

It's GiF.

How much of Streetcar Racer did you read from before your replace-in?

[Just Sheep Us]

Good god, you're scum this game. Like. Normally. Normally. There's that paranoia. There's that, "Maybe he's actually town". Normally, your posting can give me some sort of goodvibes. Town, scum, doesn't matter. Normally, there's some redeeming aspect about you that throws things into doubt. But right now? Not seeing it.
At all.

Like...this is the type of thing that I can just tell. There's a town AP and a scum AP. This...just simply isn't a town AP.

It's like you're scum, who knows that pretending to be town won't work, so you pretend to be town so badly that you know I'll think too bad to be scum-pretending in the hopes that it rebounds back into town.

I lol'd

[Just Sheep Us]

And revoting the slot for emphasis.
ElementalHawk was a scumread.

VOTE: AngryPidgeon.
AP's just scum.

Wait are you serious.

[Just Sheep Us]

Players in this game who should recognize AP's entrance:

Me
Desp
mastin
Tammy
BS
ns
Cupcake
p5
Mac

Would scum-mastin be brave enough to make a push that scum-him made verbatim with this many players overlapping from the previous game?

[Just Sheep Us]

Nacho just told me that he's been posting early reads in our old Hydra QT from Legend of Zelda and I had no idea

And you didn't notice that the QT had new posts?

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Shit forgot that I'm making a catchup wall :/

[Just Sheep Us]

Players in this game who should recognize AP's entrance:

Me
Desp
mastin
Tammy
BS
ns
Cupcake
p5
Mac

Would scum-mastin be brave enough to make a push that scum-him made verbatim with this many players overlapping from the previous game?

What game are you referring to when you say "AP's entrance"?

The one that had all the people listed above in it. There's only 1 game that fits that.

Serious response:

Oh shit I can't quote the post from Anything Goes. It was Anything Goes.

[Just Sheep Us]

My only request is that we lynch Yakuri whoever the fuck by D3 at the latest. Wow. If its scum, its gotta go. If its town, its REALLY gotta go.

It's GiF.

How much of Streetcar Racer did you read from before your replace-in?

Not very much, but more than I have of this game. I hadnt looked at this at all and Cabd asked me to replace.

Wow BRO, your hydra has posted almost as much as I have.

Game started at a bad time for me, and I think you know my feelings towards games I'm not on top of.

[Just Sheep Us]

I think scum should shoot AP tonight because he's really obvtown.

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I have this in my catchup wall somewhere, but Cupcake's super obvtown and the mislynch bait that's probably going to get lynched this game despite me pointing out why it's obvtown.

[Just Sheep Us]

I have this in my catchup wall somewhere, but Cupcake's super obvtown and the mislynch bait that's probably going to get lynched this game despite me pointing out why it's obvtown.

Is this due to a post Cupcake made, or is it because he is topped with non-dairy icing and scum Cupcake never uses non-dairy icing?

Corpus-level stuff.

I trolled back and forth with him for like 500 posts in Anything Goes. His posting here resonates very differently for tonal and frequency reasons.

[Just Sheep Us]

I'm p sure their trolling here reads scum.

He has fewer posts than I do this game.

IIRC he has a major activity meta-tell.

[Just Sheep Us]

I'm p sure their trolling here reads scum.

He has fewer posts than I do this game.

IIRC he has a major activity meta-tell.

That just indicates that he's disinterested with the game?

I recall an argument in Anything Goes with kuribo and him about this b/c kuribo said "lol if u scum I'll tell b/c town you will lurk to replacement" and I was like "lol trust tells OP," but I can't find it now because fuck it I'm not going through a 9 page triple ISO.

[Just Sheep Us]

titan
kagura
carbon fiber

lord business
stalin
gyarados
cupcake panda

fox and the hound
peregrinev
angrypidgeon
mac

----------------------- <------- line of lynchability

clyton
yukari

orcinus
mastinssk
rancid drake

drake was the thor of the original set of five. lb, titan, gyarados, and stalin are all still town with the addition of carbon fiber, cupcake panda, and kagura.

cupcake is a bro read. ap's slot was below the line before he replaced in.

vote: rancid broderick drake

choo choo

[Just Sheep Us]

I mean, from a theory perspective, you may as well wait for me to 1v1 you. If our gladiator ability weren't a night action, I'd be using it today, but unfortunately it is, so tomorrow it will have to be.

Oh, you're a gladiator?

VOTE: RBD

[Just Sheep Us]

I want this group of players to burn with fucking fire: {AP, despbro, foxhound, PV, GIF}. And I've been wanting this for a while

Problem with this group.

AP's obvtown from his entrance.

Desp/I are obvtownlurk

p5's probably townlurk.

GiF's 100% townlurk.

So your list is complete shit.

[Just Sheep Us]

And trust me, despbro, if it's hard to lynch me as scum, it's a million fucking times harder to lynch me when I'm actually town. If you really want to awaken this beast and take it on, I'm down for that. But I will obliterate your fucking hopes and dreams, so you better be sure you want to do this because you're going to look fucking awful if I really do start giving a shit here.

Also cute posturing.

[Just Sheep Us]

Also you have Desp-Bro sitting here being like incredibly super scum lol. Not lying, we ARE gladiating them tomorrow if we don't lynch them today.

Then you die.

[Just Sheep Us]

Also, gladiators are neg utility as town, high utility as scum.

If you ever use your gladiate shot, I'm making sure you die.

[Just Sheep Us]

mastin, are you scum, or are you still just sucking?

[Just Sheep Us]

HOLY SHIT MASTIN, YOU'RE CALLING ME OUT ON A MISTAKE WHEN YOU'RE DOING THE EXACT SAME THING AND NOT TRYING TO RECALIBRATE.

LIKE.

ARE YOU THIS FUCKING DENSE.

I'D THINK THAT AFTER YOUR SHIT IN AP'S GAME TOWN-YOU WOULD TRY TO, Y'KNOW, NOT SUCK THE NEXT GAME.

[Just Sheep Us]

RBD is a gladiator.

They die.

It's relatively simple.

[Just Sheep Us]

(Also, to any future mods, if you want to include a gladiator in your game, don't. It's a poorly designed role that shouldn't exist).

[Just Sheep Us]

1) Marginal relevance.
2) Neg utility for town, pos utility for scum means that it's an anti-town role in the hands of town and a very powerful role in the hands of scum.
3) Marginal relevance.
4) That's not the only thing guiding the read.
5) Says the guy who's called obvtown Katsuki and obvtown me scum.

[Just Sheep Us]

Tier list of roles that shouldn't exist:

This role should have never been made, holy fuck why did someone thing this was a good idea:

Death Godfather.

Almost as bad, but marginally less terrible:

Death Miller.

Roles that are poorly conceived and should be uninstalled:

Gladiator.
Unrequited lover (especially cross-aligned ones)
Things that give scum an extra kill in non-large games.

[Just Sheep Us]

Tier list of roles that shouldn't exist:

This role should have never been made, holy fuck why did someone thing this was a good idea:

Death Godfather.

Almost as bad, but marginally less terrible:

Death Miller.

Roles that are poorly conceived and should be uninstalled:

Gladiator.
Unrequited lover (especially cross-aligned ones)
Things that give scum an extra kill in non-large games.

+Hider.

Also I ran a game with a death godfather once. It went better than expected.

Infinite shot hiders need to die.

x-shot hiders with marginal shots are k.

[Just Sheep Us]

Why are you reading katsuki as scum, then.

Because his posting in here feels nothing like his posting in Anything Goes where, after AP and I caught you, he very much engaged me directly to incite a response and bog down the thread.

Here he's doing nothing, and being very obvious about the fact that he's doing nothing.

[Just Sheep Us]

1) Bad assumption is bad.

2) That doesn't mean you don't lynch it.

3) Which game are you referring to, because if you're talking about AG, I'm not tracking your thought process (and that town loss was more a result of ignoring things like conftown fruitvendors)

[Just Sheep Us]

Unless your modification is "only works when you hit scum" or something, I'm not gonna hear it.

A pseudo-vig that doesn't conftown itself is a bad role and should feel bad.

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HAHA

BRO

You're so fucking clueless if you think you can actually push a lynch through on us. Good luck with that, you're just going to make yourself obvscum.

Come at me, BRO.

Go fuck off and run your cock through a meat grinder.

It's cute that you think you can spew half the vitriol I can.

[Just Sheep Us]

1) Bad assumption is bad.

No. It's called actually using my fucking braincells to have determined RBD is town.

2) That doesn't mean you don't lynch it.

I refuse.
REFUSE.
To believe a town you.
Is so incompetent.
As to legitimately.
Honestly.
Seriously.
Believe.

That you lynch a town role on policy just for being anti-town. Because that's what you're suggesting. Not a lynch on scum, oh no. Not a lynch because a player has done anything wrong. A lynch. On fucking policy. About a role that you don't like. In spite of how that role can (and has!) been used to great success by town.

3) Which game are you referring to

The town lost the last Tales game BY TAKING THE ATTITUDE YOU ARE.

1) "He has a complicated role, therefore he's town." EVEN THOUGH THAT ROLE MAKES SENSE AS A SCUM ROLE.

2) The fact that RBD rolled one of the two roles that I'll PL is icing on the cake. I'm not the only one that thinks they're scum.

3) Haven't read it, don't care.

Town also has lost games for not lynching the obvscum gladiator (last I checked, you WON a game that way), so you're points bad and you should feel bad.

You're either the most head-in-ass person I've ever had to interact with, or you're scum drawing a rise out of me since you know how angry I get and how easily I self destruct.

[Just Sheep Us]

1. I don’t tolerate ad hom wars

Please keep it relevant to the game, folks.

Then tell the scum to stop abusing my anger issues.

[Just Sheep Us]

HEY MUFFIN.

AP USED THAT EXACT ENTRANCE, NEARLY VERBATIM, IN A GAME WHERE HE WAS TOWN. AND WHERE MASTIN WAS SCUM AND PUSHED HIM FOR IT.

SO TELL ME MORE ABOUT HOW IT'S "NOT A TOWN ENTRANCE"

[Just Sheep Us]

I'D QUOTE YOU THE FUCKING POST, BUY TURNS OUT YOU CAN'T QUOTE FROM LOCKED THREADS WITH THE QUOTE BUTTON.

[Just Sheep Us]

Oh look, SSK decided to show up.

DOST THOU ALSO WANTETH TO BE SMITTEN

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Hey muffin.

Your hydra partner was just in a game where town-GiF lurked. Nice try with the "lol GiF lurking=scum"

I'm pretty sure I understand GiF's lurk better than you do given that I have fairly similar lurk patterns to him, and probably more developed theory on the topic of lurking alone than exists on the fucking wiki for all theory.

In all honestly I haven't read a p5 post that I can remember yet. He's also like z-tier priority right now.

[Just Sheep Us]

1) "He has a complicated role, therefore he's town."

No. But viewing the role as a whole IS AN ESSENTIAL PIECE OF THE GAME.

EVEN THOUGH THAT ROLE MAKES SENSE AS A SCUM ROLE.

Like hell it does.

I'm not the only one that thinks they're scum.

Sure, the others thinking they're scum are on my personal shitlist.

Town also has lost games for not lynching the obvscum gladiator (last I checked, you WON a game that way), so you're points bad and you should feel bad.

Yeah, key word, obvscum.

zMUFFINMAN. IS. THE. CURRENT. DON. CORELONE. NATIRASHA. IS. NOT. A. SLOUCH. RBD. IS. A. BEAST. And you think that their posting is obvscum?

Fuck no.

I get and how easily I self destruct.

Go ahead. Because I already have. Do me a favor, BROseidon. If you're town? Never sign up for a game I'm in again, because your arrogance. You making the same fucking mistake. Game. after. fucking. game. Is godfuckingawful.

1) Because scum couldn't have a gladiator (has to exist at a notable frequency as both alignments b/c of how it acts) or an age-cop (age mechanics are relevant in an unknown way). Right...

2) Not even gonna justify this with a response. Unless you're like a fucking mason or informed townie here, you can't overlook the fact that multiple people are scum reading the same person, and we can't all be scum (one, because I'm not scum, and two, because that's not how scum teams function).

3) Watch me not give a rat's ass about the scummy. Also, last time I saw Nati-scum, penguin and I both had him pegged independently within 10 pages and only didn't turbo-lynch him because of a well-placed PR claim that bought him time.

4) Feeling's mutual, except I only believe in blacklisting super-fringe cases. Why don't you go run more towns into the ground with StrangerCoug-esque lynches. Sounds like a great plan!

[Just Sheep Us]

But you have

just

been getting on my nerves. I

do

think that you are one of the scum. I think your pushes have been filled with bullshit. I don't like your use of meta.

It's getting harder to see how you're town and way more easy to see how you're scum.

You really want people to think that your scumread on me's a real thing...

[Just Sheep Us]

I am fully aware GIF has had access issues recently, but it's not the lurking itself that makes him scum, it's his whole attitude towards the game. I thought I made that pretty clear with the last sentence, but apparently I need to spell it out very clearly for the slower players

lololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololol

[Just Sheep Us]

I am aware one of you is town, but since whichever one of you it is has a secret scum win con, they die with the rest of them.

Classic scumtell.

[Just Sheep Us]

Hey BRO

Just so we're clear

You think we claimed Hated Miller Gladiator out the gate because... we're scum who decided claiming an extremely negative utility role that was easily provable was a gooooooooood idea because... DERP DERP DERP I'M BRO AND I'M HOPING NOBODY THINKS ABOUT THIS AND THIS MISLYNCH GOES THROUGH WITHOUT ME LOOKING OBVSCUM

Wait you're also hated?

Ugh you short-circuited my brain.

Also scum-gladiator claiming gladiator's completely fine. Scum claiming miller is a thing that's done. The hated part fucks with it, though.

[Just Sheep Us]

HEY MUFFIN.

AP USED THAT EXACT ENTRANCE, NEARLY VERBATIM, IN A GAME WHERE HE WAS TOWN. AND WHERE MASTIN WAS SCUM AND PUSHED HIM FOR IT.

SO TELL ME MORE ABOUT HOW IT'S "NOT A TOWN ENTRANCE"

So tell me this,

You see someone post something they've done as town before, "nearly Verbatim," and you think that points to them being town?

You know what I do when I'm scum? Try to fucking imitate my town game. You know what I don't do when I'm town? Repeat the same boring entrances I've done in another game and then criticise people who aren't reading me as town because of it when it's something that's easily fucking faked.

This is really simple stuff, and part of the reason you're obvscum is because town-you would know how fucking basic this is.

But instead you don't give a shit.

Because you're scum.

Never addressed this.

Why are you treating the entrance as a scummy instead of null if you think it's meta manipulation?

[Just Sheep Us]

Fuck it, I need to go do my translation theory homework.

I hope by the time I come back mastin/RBD's begging to be lynched so I don't have to deal with their dumbfucktarded bullshit.

[Just Sheep Us]

Never sign up for a game I'm in again, because your arrogance

you are a sad, petty scumbag

holy shit

[Just Sheep Us]

Hey BRO

Just so we're clear

You think we claimed Hated Miller Gladiator out the gate because... we're scum who decided claiming an extremely negative utility role that was easily provable was a gooooooooood idea because... DERP DERP DERP I'M BRO AND I'M HOPING NOBODY THINKS ABOUT THIS AND THIS MISLYNCH GOES THROUGH WITHOUT ME LOOKING OBVSCUM

last i checked you were completely off the radar for the first fifty pages of the game

so...???

[Just Sheep Us]

Because not only is he trying to pass it off as an "obvtown" entrance (because he knows he's done it as town before, but he also isn't stupid enough to realise it's something he could fake as scum, so it's not a fucking obvtown entrance, and him calling it obvtown is because he's hoping people draw the parallels and call it obvtown because he's done it as town before) but I think it's an entrance he specifically did as scum trying to imitate his town game because I already thought the fucking slot was scum prior the the replacement.

man that plan really wor--oh wait, no it didn't

so do you think ap is incompetent? why do you think scum-ap would tailor his game to you, of all people in this playerlist?

[Just Sheep Us]

It's the exact fucking move he'd pull here as scum, and the way he interacted with Mastin after it is further evidence of this

i really don't think you have any clue what ap would do as scum

[Just Sheep Us]

This is more reasonable. Do you think RBD is scum outside of the claim?

yup

[Just Sheep Us]

Gonna be honest, as much as I want to believe BRO is right about me, I really think hes going for townpoints with this gladiator push. I think he thinks its expected of him? Or hes just trying to get me on his side? BRO is an objectively good player and pushing gladiators because you got gladiated by scum once is not objectively good play.

what fucking townpoints are available for pushing a gladiator claim like 2 weeks after they claimed it when the slot has had less than zero pressure on it?

[Just Sheep Us]

So not liking: F-16, BRO, GIF. Would lynch. Also maybe Kagura, Bork needs to talk to me.

what in the fuck

[Just Sheep Us]

Why is this a reason for a vote?

rbd is scum and bro is butthurt over getting gladiated by scum once

[Just Sheep Us]

I'm preeeetty town this game, dunno how my opening posts didn't make that blazingly obvious. I cant claim town any harder than I already am.

Ok, Im through 49. Going to compile last thoughts rather than quote strip again (mostly) then sleep.

Go ahead. Because I already have. Do me a favor, BROseidon. If you're town? Never sign up for a game I'm in again, because your arrogance. You making the same fucking mistake. Game. after. fucking. game. Is godfuckingawful.

Errr. While I agree that BRO is probably scum here, this is uncalled for. I don't think you've ever posted anything like this before, come on. Step away from the keyboard.

GIF: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p5808121
Wow, I will SK the crap out of you if you make a singular other equally spammy quote post.

BRO: , breaking my heart. Bro actually cited AG mafia as a reason to townread my entry post. Come on man, thats really weak. I compiled my entry post from a few different places and copy+pasting something I did as town in one game does not make me town in another game.

Like, really? At first I was happy SOMEONE was getting my attitude this game, buuuut that initial opinion has just been run through the trials. Starting with this push on Nati for his roleclaim. Mastin basically already discussed this ad nauseum, but put simply: we aren't policy lynching a gladiator, jesus. Yes Im still a little salty about AG mafia, but Im not hellbent on revenge over it like you are trying to sell here? I suspect BRO is trying to fake town emotion here and falling short. The posts about Death Millers were also irrelevant and like "hey look over here, Im not the droids you are looking for!". I don't think this is house party BRO. I don't see the certainty, I just see bitterness over the Gladiator and bundling mastin in as scum with RBD because lol. Speaking of reasons to read people for their role, mastin not having a vote seems pretty severe to be a scum role. So ya hes just town.

Fox/Hound: Originally disliked them asking mastin about his read/push on me and was gonna call them on being weird (like scum upset at being caught here, trying to understand why Im off the hook?), but their follow up "ya lets lynch the smilie!!!" sort of makes sense to me. I have a hard time buying they are scum with BRO..it just feels to blatant? Pushing the same reads, cuddling up to me (don't Im still getting over my cold), dunno. Officially predicting a townflip here, but not really that confident and thats sorta dependent on BRO being scum ..which I mean he is, but ya.

RBD: Not scum so they must be town. I really would rather not be gladiated. Or lynched at all. I kind of expect to be NK bait, so ya.

- ap states that he's never been this town and his entry posts should make that obvious
- drake and mastin both scumread him for his entrance posts; bro townreads him
- ap townreads drake and mastin; chastizes bro for reading him as town for posts he himself states should make him obvious town
- ???

[Just Sheep Us]

conclusion: ap is scum

[Just Sheep Us]

Second, its the logic with which he presented the read that was forced/bad. He actually said "AP posted this same thing and was town before, therefore hes town here" which is really missing the mark and is just overjustified in a bad way.

so...what was the right mark? what should bro have actually referenced regarding your opening posts as being town that wouldn't have been forced/bad?

[Just Sheep Us]

AP, you realize I didn't state a town read on you until after mastin/RBD started pushing you on your entrance, right?

[Just Sheep Us]

Oh, you're a gladiator?

VOTE: RBD

Why is this a reason for a vote?

-b

RBD's scummy as and on a role that should always be PL'd.

That's like, 100% more reasons than just being scummy.

[Just Sheep Us]

No, I'm saying that positionally it makes sense for you to be town opposed to mastin/RBD scum, since they scum-pushed you on your entrance.

[Just Sheep Us]

To use a more jargon-y way of saying it:

I threw town points at you on a negative associative tell with two people I think are likely scum.

[Just Sheep Us]

RBD scumread is because they've been buddying the fuck out of mastin at every juncture, even when she's making pushes that are terribad (like the early tammy push, the CF push, etc).

I have a physical drawing up through page 24 of positional stuff, and the core of the game early on was very much mastin/tammy/f-16 once he moved in. Fox/Hound buddied behind Tammy, and RBD buddied behind mastin. This led me to strongly think that 1, maybe 2 people in that core group are scum. Fox/Hound and RBD make the most sense given how the attacking/defending/chainsawing mapped out.

Fast forward to your entrance, and with mastin/RBD pushing something on you as scummy that's objectively null, ESPECIALLY given that you're probably the trolliest "strong" player on site, and yeah, I'm not gonna let that shit slide.

[Just Sheep Us]

Okay I actually have to finish that paper that's due in about an hour now because I was too angry at mastin/muffin to finish it last night.

[Just Sheep Us]

@ ap: i just don't understand your thought process. you expected people to see you were obvious town, but you townread two players who scumread you for it and calling bro bad for saying you're town (even though this is what you expected?).

you still didn't answer the question btw. what were you expecting a town response to be to your entrance? because your actions since indicate that a town response would be to scumread you for posts you claimed made you obvtown and i mean maybe i'm just crazy but that doesn't make any fucking sense.

@ mastin: hahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Just Sheep Us]

Im not focusing on people's reads on me as a basis for my reads because Im not shit at this game.

>implying this is even what i was saying

you claimed bro's reason for townreading you was forced and unjustified despite claiming yourself that your opening posts were trust-tell levels of town. what did you expect town-bro to say and how did it differ from what he actually did?

[Just Sheep Us]

Im not focusing on people's reads on me as a basis for my reads because Im not shit at this game. Mastin is town because mastins push on me is borderline insane and way too overdone to be likely from scum. She knows she cant elude me forver when scum, so she rarely pushes me as scum, CERTAINLY not in 1v1 tunnel mode where Im way more likely to get her lynched. RBD is probably town for the hated miller gladiator claim and their tone/attitude/presence is just ridiculously town. I could point to some specific instances and wall about it, but they are just town. Everything about them is troll-y but determined, annoyed but spirited. If they are scum . I mean I guess they -could- be, I'd have to bow down to muffin for being the most unreadable scumbutt to ever scum the 7 seas.

scum mastin has been insane enough to make that push before.

muffin can fake apathy very well as scum (see 169).

So both your points are null.

[Just Sheep Us]

Ok BRO, so why am I town again? Is it literally just because mastin and RBD are calling me scum?

That, and the fact that you're acting like an insane schizo person with no discernible objectives.

[Just Sheep Us]

I built a {RBD, Fox/Hound, /mastin/, CF, Tammy} 1-2 scum structure group from the early clusterfuck

mastin's response to your entrance, and Fox/Hounds response to everything that's been going on, as well as your addition to that group, turned it into {RBD, mastin, //, Fox/Hound, AP, CF, Tammy}

[Just Sheep Us]

RBD scumread is because they've been buddying the fuck out of mastin at every juncture, even when she's making pushes that are terribad (like the early tammy push, the CF push, etc).

I have a physical drawing up through page 24 of positional stuff, and the core of the game early on was very much mastin/tammy/f-16 once he moved in. Fox/Hound buddied behind Tammy, and RBD buddied behind mastin. This led me to strongly think that 1, maybe 2 people in that core group are scum. Fox/Hound and RBD make the most sense given how the attacking/defending/chainsawing mapped out.

I don't feel like this is actually a real thing

I buddy strong townreads, that is just how it works, and I wouldn't call rbd scum for that reason either

But do you buddy strong town reads that are making bad pushes?

I've thought nearly every one of mastin's pushes this game have been bad. I've been positional opposed to her at every juncture. Granted, this has happened with both of us as town before.

But I don't think town muffin/nati would see the game so nearly identically. Also GiF pointed out a read flip that happened somewhere that implied a level of buddying. Let me go dig that up...

[Just Sheep Us]

I want this group of players to burn with fucking fire: {AP, despbro, foxhound, PV, GIF}.

1 Kagura (borkjerfkin + nachomamma8)
^Decent townread.

2 The Fox and the Hound (cephrir and DV)
^Strong. STRONG. Scumread.

3 Yukari Yakumo
^Definitely a townread.

4 orcinus_theoriginal
^Vaguely townish.

5 Titan (Tammy + Sir Arthur Dane)
^Eeeeeeeeh.

6 Rancid Broderick Drake (zmuffinman and natirasha)
^Seriously, seriously town.

8 Breakfast With Stalin (Hydra of ffery and beli)
^Pretty town.

9 ANgryPidgeon 9 ElementalHawk (Prohawk+3dicerolling)
^Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down, never gonna run around and desert you. Sorry gonna make you cry, never gonna say goodbye, on guard for lies, and'll hurt you.

10 Carbon Fiber (FourTrouble and F16)
^EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEHH...

11 Lord Business
^Decent townread.

12 Just Sheep Us (Broseidon and Desperado)
^Either didn't learn their lesson or are scum.

13 Red Gyarados (Brian Skies and notscience)
^Obvtown.

14 Cupcake Panda
^Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeh.

15 PeregrineV
^Need more, vaguely townish.

16 Clyton
^Decently town.

17 Mac
^Basically obvtown.

This hydra and us are now a four player hydra. Pretty much where I am except I have PV and Katsuki as hard town.

:3

[Just Sheep Us]

@ titan: you've seen me not be present as town as well, so how are you reconciling that and why do you think our lack of thread presence in the first week of the game is enough to constitute a top scumread?

it's worrisome when both your heads are doing it! There are a couple questions posed to you from rather early and neither of you answered the question or clarified. I thought the tone of your first post was really off, but kagura's post to you made it sound like that was a list of town reads, so the tone isn't as weird as originally thought.

You being absent makes it somewhat null, but still. Bro also being completely absent when he's so egotistical about his town game is really worrisome. I realize that it could also be town from you guys, but I'd like to sort you out. I don't have any great scum reads either, so consider it an invitation to town it up, so I can stop worrying about you guys and move on.

ALSO, Bro didn't post the player list when he checked in to say he's reading and that lack of posting the player list is what moved you ahead of Peregrine as a scum read!

BRO is egotistical, but lazy. In 167 he was pretty solidly mislynch bait until RC replaced in and killed Generic.

I'm pretty much constant mislynch bait :/

[Just Sheep Us]

also where's my shot?

Can I join? College turned me into an alcohol abuser!

[Just Sheep Us]

also where's my shot?

Can I join? College turned me into an alcohol abuser!

The more the merrier!

Awesome! I have like three fifths of flavored vodka, two fifths of flavored rum, Pusser's Navy Rum, some de Kuiper's Soul Apple, some Amarettto, and a fifth of 151 in my room that I need to get rid of before graduation!

Oh god that sounds terrible...

(Also, if you have anything you want to talk to me about game, wise, I'm semi-present right now while I do my hw).

[Just Sheep Us]

also where's my shot?

Can I join? College turned me into an alcohol abuser!

The more the merrier!

Awesome! I have like three fifths of flavored vodka, two fifths of flavored rum, Pusser's Navy Rum, some de Kuiper's Soul Apple, some Amarettto, and a fifth of 151 in my room that I need to get rid of before graduation!

Oh god that sounds terrible...

(Also, if you have anything you want to talk to me about game, wise, I'm semi-present right now while I do my hw).

I feel like we'd get along great.

I'm drinking a twisted tea while "doing" my homework (this will actually get done b/c it's a group thing, but odds of me getting through all my Latin tonight...)

[Just Sheep Us]

also where's my shot?

Can I join? College turned me into an alcohol abuser!

The more the merrier!

Awesome! I have like three fifths of flavored vodka, two fifths of flavored rum, Pusser's Navy Rum, some de Kuiper's Soul Apple, some Amarettto, and a fifth of 151 in my room that I need to get rid of before graduation!

Oh god that sounds terrible...

(Also, if you have anything you want to talk to me about game, wise, I'm semi-present right now while I do my hw).

I'll take some flavored vodka!

What is you guys' read on AngryPigeon?

Desp is scum reading him, I'm town reading him, neither of us are budging on it. I think it's our only out of sync read where we're so positionally apart that it's hard to reconcile.

I'm town reading him for two reasons: First, I don't see any intentionality to what he's doing. I could explain this in more depth, but the high-level thing is that AP's jumping around in a way that looks to me like he doesn't have a long-term objective, like he's not trying to accomplish anything. That reads as town b/c it demonstrates a lack of groundedness and defined objectives that scum-AP would have (especially given that scum have day talk). The only scum-goal I could possibly see is "bog down the thread tremendously," but given that this player base is pretty good at parsing through large amounts of bs, that seems like a dumb goal to have had.

Desp thinks that he's scum-theatreing with mastin and muffin/nati.

[Just Sheep Us]

Petronius's Satyricon. The Cenabis Trimalchio is really fucking bizarre.

Anything else you want out of me?

[Just Sheep Us]

Also I'm trying to think of whether I want anything out of you, and I guess something along the lines of a general reads list? I have your major positions mapped out through page 24, but, like, 36 pages of stuff...

[Just Sheep Us]

Yo ffery, is that you?

[Just Sheep Us]

Ah, I see how it is.

I'm fine with giving you space to digest; I'm looking for some sense of how your positions have moved, and how people moved in response, since reading through shit slowly and drawing arrows gets old :/

[Just Sheep Us]

Yo ffery, is that you?

yep!

Woohoo! We haven't had a chance to connect this game.

First thing's first re: you.

Up through 24, I have you as peripheral to the core of the game (mastin/Titan/RDB/CF/FoxHound). I also have you as having soft-pushed a bit on CF, but otherwise largely not taking stances on people within that group, instead focusing on Nacho/bork and GiF, and I have Orc having voted you (I think in response to one of those pushes, or as a reachout).

So, I guess a few things:

Have you taken more solid positions on that core group+APslot?

How do you feel about your interactions with Orc this game?

[Just Sheep Us]

You realize that was probably a muffin-pretending-to-be-nati post, right?

[Just Sheep Us]

So, ffery, given your current read-state, how to you view the narrative of mastin/Titan/RDB/CF/FoxHound/AP/myself based on your reads (i.e., who's doing what in terms of actions?)

[Just Sheep Us]

[insert content here]

Working on setup design and playing league. Will get to this tonight.

[Just Sheep Us]

So, ffery, given your current read-state, how to you view the narrative of mastin/Titan/RDB/CF/FoxHound/AP/myself based on your reads (i.e., who's doing what in terms of actions?)

hellifino

I'm refining reads on the basis of the interactions, but I don't have an overarching narrative about it. Not yet, anyway.

I've gone back and forth a little with you guys and had you in my scumpile at one point, but have more of a townfeel now that you're interacting.

:/

Why does nobody scum hunt the way I do

[Just Sheep Us]

And this game, he's doing the same thing. There are a fair number of people townreading him, a LOT from meta, because that's what he wants them to see. Instead of him actually being town, he's made himself look like town. That's basically the main reason AP's scum, too, because AP's done the same damn thing. Yes. They look good, because they put effort into looking good. No, they aren't actually good. Because that wasn't their goal. They aren't aiming to be town; they're aiming to do a good job of looking town. That's my read of them, of their posting, of their situation.

That's not what it is.

1) A fair number of people are scum reading him. I think I'm in the minority saying "this looks like town AP to me"

2) The meta points are null more than anything else; AP's too good and too erratic of a player to let meta be usable against him. It's like you're not reading what I've posted at all about why AP's town.

[Just Sheep Us]

Also, AP, remember that thing I said about why mastin was scum in AG because of how he read Ghostlin in Anything Goes?

This like an inversion of that thought process (i.e., she's trying to refute the town read without understanding the trajectory on it, and the misunderstanding of why the town read exists is showing)

[Just Sheep Us]

she*

[Just Sheep Us]

I can answer this a little better now that that damn 7p micro is over. I've only really been in 2 games with bro where I was town and not hydra with him. In street racers I waffled on him and kept wanting to scum read him incorrectly. He mostly brushed me off and we ultimately did push good lunches when I stopped getting dumb leverls of paranoid. He actually did do protown things there even if I found his conclusions wonky.

7p game I was disappointed in his lack of scum hunting tbh. Felt he was largely apathetic and I pushed him over it and he claimed conformable role and got me counter lynched for pushing him lololol. So I got trolled. Town was being dumb there though. FuDuzn was obv scum all game anyhow but was a shit lynch until survivor died. So meh.

Anyhow I don't think I'm a huge motivator for town bro and I don't think I have a good track of reading him. OK at best. I'm leaning scum I guess so he's probably actually town. #facepalm

You forgot the part where in Street Car Racers I wasn't really trying until you replaced in.

Still never read those 40 pages of day 1 where everyone derped around the Hannibal lynch.

And 2014 mafia was me being confused the entire time b/c even after that game I still don't know how to hunt for solo-scum.

[Just Sheep Us]

AP is not the type of scum player to make an intricate plan. He's impulsive, living in the now, for the most part. His best ideas as scum are done not well in advance, but at most with one night of planning before-hand. AP will have a map on what to do immediately, but his long-term plans are incredibly vague. You'd be lucky to see a kill/lynch map laid out from him, even given daytalk, since that's simply not his style. It's one of the main areas that he differs from me as a player. The drive behind AP's posting is to survive, not to lynch scum.

I think the "trying to survive, not lynch scum" scum tell works only on me, because most players care about getting mislynched.

[Just Sheep Us]

Welp, I dunno what to say about the hydra dissonance part of this, but your reason for townreading me makes complete sense. That is something that is distinctly lacking from my scumgame rather consistently. Which is part of why mastin calling my game here a lot like Antihero mafia was just flatout baffling. What did you think about mastin claiming that his role is deeper + rly useful beyond the vote thing?

Role-posturing's a null-tell; I've seen people do it as both alignments, and the theory behind doing it as either alignment is relatively sound. I'm not reading too much into it at this point.

[Just Sheep Us]

Problem with this group.

LURK LURK LURK LURK LURK LURK

Pv's not even town, GiF still has a chance of salvation but I wish for more. I'm still on the fence with your hydra.

How many times have lurkers been town?

Yeah, there's often 1, maybe 2 scum in the lurker group, but being able to tell scum-lurk from town-lurk is a skill that exists.

[Just Sheep Us]

................. what the actual fuck?

So are you going to disagree that saying that an entrance "100% cannot be town" is bad logic when that entrance has been used by the same player as town?

Because that line of logic really shouldn't be that hard.

[Just Sheep Us]

I'm not sure what to make of diplomatic broseidon.

OH MY GOD WAIT HAS BROSEIDON STARTED BEING DIPLOMATIC

I got warned for ad-homming, so I decided to ignore muffin and try to play nicer :/

[Just Sheep Us]

VOTE: mastinssk

Since apparently RBD ain't happenin'

[Just Sheep Us]

I'm leaning town on CF. It's not super-strong, but I'd rather lynch someone in my scum or null-scum pile.

Why are you writing off mastin's push on you as being from House Party Mini mastin instead of from scum mastin?

[Just Sheep Us]

The reason why it pinged me in the first place was because in Attack on Titan, you were like Tammy needs to get in here and town it up, towns without structure suck, which made me feel weird when you said it. So the seeming to work with others, is making me go what, BUT at the same time I know it's something you're working on, so.

There's a more nuanced theory point I could get into here about how scum and town generally try to work with people. I'm trying to work on the frustration with people not getting where I'm coming from, and explaining my lines of reasoning in more comprehensible way (which also requires me to understand my own reasoning, which is a bizarre endeavor in and of itself); I'm still not going to yield on reads I don't agree with and be particularly friendly to ideas like "compromise wagons" and "not pushing the thing I want to push for the sake of organizing the town."

[Just Sheep Us]

Vote: Just Sheep Us

*sigh*

I love players that have functional policies on me for no discernible reason!

[Just Sheep Us]

I reall do expect SOME level of competence from town-mastin.

Okay.

How's this.

I think I finally have it.

The scumtell that describes AP.

AP's scumtell is, put in simplest terms, "You can't

prove

I'm scum, nyehnyeh."

And that's what he's doing.

Except when Katsuki does the same thing literally two posts before this, you don't call him on it, despite it being what of a universal psychological trick?

I can't...

[Just Sheep Us]

Oh boy, muffinz’s wall. It’s dunkin’ time:

I don't have any opinion on AP as a player. I've played with him twice before (both times town) and he was average both times. I'm not sure what he's capable of as scum, but you're missing the point completely or you're just playing dumb here.

He used an opening he's used before as town, correct? You're following so far? Stop me at the point I've lost you because I know I'm talking to a special person here and I don't want to go too fast. Let's think about why he would do this. It's possible he's town and thought, "OMG, a good way to enter this game is to use an opening I've done as town before, an opening that I could easily fake as scum, and then berate people when they don't think I'm obvtown because of my opening posts! I'll call them really, really obvtown and criticise anyone who disagrees because that is a sensible thing to do!" You seem to think this is what he did. But again, I know you're a... very special person... so I'm not particularly surprised you think this. I think the more likely scenario is that he's scum and thought, "hey I'm going to imitate an opening that most of the player list has seen me do as town before and then criticise anyone who thinks it isn't a town entrance because they know I've done it as town before!" <- not only did he actually do this, but he didn't even have to bring up the past game he did it as town for comparison because it was an unconscious link that... special players like yourself... made. this is exactly the sort of thing i did in gif's touhou game with the way i approached the gaiden lynch D1; i didn't want to point out myself that it was unlike what i've done as scum in the past, i let cabd point out my usual bussing meta and then i let YOU (desp) point out that he was, in fact, wrong. i think AP was doing a similar thing here.

What you’re spouting here is bullshit. You’re effectively saying, “I see town and scum reasons for taking this action, and with no consideration as to which it is, I’m going to decide on one because ~reasons~.” Yes, the opening could have come from either town or scum; that’s not what’s driving my townread on AP. The relevance of AP’s entrance to my townread on him is the fact that he gave an explicitly null entrance, an entrance that could potentially mean multiple things, and mastin IMMEDIATELY came in and attacked it, and your hydra was, as it has been for the entire game, buddied so far up her ass that your attack came right in lockstep.

Is that clear, or do was my explanation too “special” for you?

How about this: next time you want to insult me for my intelligence, come at me with a point that doesn’t suck.

i think you're doing it not because you think it will give you town points, but because you think it's expected of you (as town, you would push a lynch on a gladiator claim is what you think. so you are not analysing things in a town way and instead you're blindly pushing this)

Or I’m town doing a thing that I do regardless of alignment?

You people suck at reading null actions as null.

No, I'm not scum reading AP for his entrance (though I do not think it was a town entrance). I'm scum reading him because I thought his predecessor was scum, and I do not think his play so far (up to p54, still catching up) looks town. The opening was one example, the back-and-forth with mastin was another.

Can’t comment on the EH read b/c I read maybe 2 of their posts.

AP’s been pretty fucking town, though.

Why didn't you?

BECAUSE IT WAS A NULL ENTRANCE FOR REASONS YOU’VE ALREADY GIVEN.

LIKE.

HOLY SHIT.

THIS LINE OF REASONING IS FAIRLY STRAIGHTFORWARD.

Why do you think this? Because you've still yet to really talk about it

I’ve given the tl;dr version like 1000000 times, which is that your head is so far up mastin’s ass it hurts.

You’ve buddied her at every corner. Every. Fucking. Corner. She pushes Titan with a shitty push? You push Titan with a shitty push. She pushes Fox/Hound? YOU push Fox/Hound. I even drew a diagram with arrows and everything that shows how much you’ve been buddying her.

This is in conjuction with mastin making pushes that were pretty much terrible, particularly the Titan push. You’re either supporting a scum mate who’s making plays, or you’re setting up behind a townie so that she can take the fall for pushing bad positions.

If this is BRO and he read _any_ of Xenosaga, then I'm considering this a scum claim. Because he should know I do this with mastin, he's seen my approach to mastin in many games now, this should not come as a surprise to him and he should not think this means anything about my alignment (though I would argue that I don't think I'd play it the same as scum, but *shrug*)

lol.

I read more of the dead QT of that game than I read of that game.

Uh, do they? Where was this stated?

It’d be a lot better of a fake townslip if it weren’t stated in the rules, and previously discussed in the game somewhere.

I am both appalled and disgusted that you think I would ever do something like that

Also, all the "alt slips" bar one have been because I don't want to log into a hydra from work (so no, that wasn't me pretending to be Nati) - I was at work at the time, thus no, any RBD post then came from Nati.

Which is why you signed posts made from your main account as Nati?

I can’t…

But it's not null, and I explained why it's not null when you asked me about it. Why are you ignoring that?

And I’ve stated why you’re objectively wrong. You’re taking Schrodinger’s Cat and declaring it dead/alive before looking in the box.

It's OK. I get upset when people peg me as scum, too. :<

You should be honored that I’m even taking the effort to dunk you here, because you’re being such a dick that I’ve requested the mod to warn you for the second time this game because of this post.

I'm getting a little fucking tired of seeing every reads list in every game I'm in, regardless of alignment, not include me in any place except null (or possible null-scum for ~reasons~) - i mean, even when i think i'm being really fucking transparent in all of my fucking posts, apparently people have trouble reading it. OK, I get it, I've burned some people before, but it's seriously fucking annoying. If you want to know where it's coming from (even prior to 1543 ending, though I think that was partially where my frustration was coming from) it's because I don't think there's anything I could possibly do that's going to convince anyone I'm town if they simply don't want to be convinced. Which makes me apathetic as fuck. I didn't want to play this game, but Nati asked me to. I didn't want to play it because I'm over games with this player list. Not because I don't enjoy playing with you guys (in general, I have nothing against you); but because it's so fucking tiring having such a fucking high mountain to climb every time I want to get town read when I'm actually town. I'm fine with putting in that sort of effort as scum because I consider it a challenge, but as town? I don't want to have to put in mountains and mountains of effort not knowing whether I'll be successful, not knowing whether it's going to even make a difference or whether it's just going to be fucking ignored because "lol muffin could totally do that as scum". There are some things I legitimately don't think I can do as scum, and while I don't really want to talk about them in detail, I'm hoping people figure it out at some point because I'm getting fucking sick of this shit.

So yeah, when I saw the multiple reads lists in this game that didn't include my name anywhere (literally; go read every single reads list in this game and try to find my name. you can't, except for maybe one or two recently) it sapped my will. It's fucking taxing. I don't like it. I don't consider myself any harder to read than, say, a player like you, but apparently people can form town or scum reads on you easily and have difficulty putting me as anything other than null.

You want us to believe you have apathy so badly that you wrote ½ a page in MS word about how much apathy you have.

(a) How the fuck is this relevant to anything? You weren't saying "it's possible they're scum lurkers or town lurkers", you were directly saying my reads are shit because they're town.

(b) If you can tell the difference between scum lurk and town lurk, then explain why they're town lurking rather than scum lurking?

Also there are times when the vast majority of scum is in the lurkers. Sooooooooooo saying "how often does it happen?" means nothing. It's dependent on who's actually scum, and who's actually scum is dependent on RNG, soooooo what's your fucking point?

Ugh…

Everyone you stated looked like a town lurker for [insert theory from chapter 3 of my treatise on mafia theory]. Seriously, there are differences. I would know; I manipulate my lurking more than any player other than maybe GiF, and I do it as both algnments.

Except p5. I just said he was probably town b/c you were pushing him. I don’t have a real read there.

Basically, the difference between a town lurk and a scum lurk is in how the lurk manipulates attention. The whole point of lurking as scum is to get forgotten, so that the game moves around you and people get lynched for being actively “scummy” over you for not doing anything. Now look at the way Katsuki is lurking? Does he post content that shifts or directs focus? No, his posts are actually quite loud, and he’s incredibly obvious about how he’s lurking. He’s also not lurking on an interval, which is a good way to control how people feel about your slot.

And yes, I’m aware that sometimes the entire scumteam is in the lurkers. I actually just had a game where that was the case, and I correctly identified on day 1 that all the scum were, in fact, in the lurkers. Shocker, my opinions hold more theory behind them than the rest of this site has combined.

First of all, you're blatantly misrepresenting what I actually said. I not only did not say that his entrance 100% couldn't be a town entrance, but I was arguing that the way he did it and the way he talked about it weren't town - not that he hadn't done it as town in the past.

And you've yet to argue against my actual point here, so I'm just going to assume you're scum trying to look like you have an actual point here.

Mastin was the one who said it was 100% not town.

And the way in which he talked about it was null. Taking WIFOM, balling it up, and throwing it into the game is, definitionally, null.

What does this mean? And/or do you think notscience is voting you for policy reasons?

No shit, Sherlock.

ns and mollie both have policies on me, which is really fucking annoying to deal with.

Done with that.

Not gonna let muffin sow apathy.

Gotta dunk dat scum

[Just Sheep Us]

Also muffin's doing that thing that katsuki did in Anything Goes that involves spamming down the thread in really long posts to make people feel worse.

[Just Sheep Us]

UNVOTE: ; VOTE: MastinSSK

Over it. You are the weakest link.

Holy shit took you long enough

[Just Sheep Us]

Votecount 1-18

With 17 players alive, it will take 9 votes to lynch or nolynch.

PeregrineV (1): Kagura
MastinSSK (6): CupcakePanda, Carbon Fiber, The Fox and the Hound, Yukari Yakumo, Just Sheep Us, AngryPidgeon
Just Sheep Us (2): orcinus_theoriginal, Red Gyarados
AngryPidgeon (3): Lord Business, Clyton, mastinSSK
The Fox and the Hound (1): Rancid Broderick Drake


Not Voting (4): Mac , PeregrineV, Titan, Breaskfast with Stalin

With 17 players alive, deadline is set for 18 days: (expired on 2014-04-18 00:01:39)

Wow.

ns's vote on me looks terribad if mastin flips scum.

[Just Sheep Us]

I can understand you referencing Anything Goes, but I don't understand what AP's entrance here has to do with it. Mastin's push against AP, maybe. But past that, not really understanding it.

...Read AP's first (maybe 2nd?) post of Anything Goes, where he claims BP lyncher to CTD...

[Just Sheep Us]

I don't understand this logic. A gladiator is a weaker equivalent to a Dayvig. And neither are alignment-confirmable.

Day Vig is far more often than not town, and the way in which it gets used is alignment indicative.

Gladiator has to be town a substantial portion of the time, because it's a scum-role in terms of its utility (regardless of the player with the gladiate shot)

[Just Sheep Us]

Desp/BRO: If you're town? Get into the game more. Nothing you've done this game has been really true scumhunting--if it exists, then I don't remember it. I see policy-votes and laziness. So get active. Post. And in particular, analyze AP. Who you should both be familiar with. Tell me with a straight face that this is the town-AP you know.

We've gone over this.

Desp thinks AP is scum. I think he's town.

I've explained my town read to hell and back.

I'm also not a fan of the emotional manipulation you've been attempting on me all game, especially with the attacks and appeals to my ego in combination. I don't think it's necessarily alignment indicative, but it does read like you're trying cheap tricks to get me to agree with you, when those cheap tricks don't work on me because I'm a fairly ruthless player.

[Just Sheep Us]

...Read AP's first (maybe 2nd?) post of Anything Goes, where he claims BP lyncher to CTD...

Why are you reading my posts so disjointedly?

I respond to things as I get to them.

Ie, I saw your question, answered it, then saw that you answered it yourself.

[Just Sheep Us]

Okay, fucking done with that shit.

God dammit I'm tired. And getting sick. I'm going to bed, fuckers.

[Just Sheep Us]

AP's obvtown from his entrance.

Also this suggests you were reading him as town from his entrance, so that would mean you were reading him as town off something you're telling me I should be reading as null, even though I explained quite clearly why I thought it was more scummy than null.

Unless his entrance encompasses all his initial posts except his actual entrance, in which case, do explain.

His initial+the other stuff that happened before I made that post.

[Just Sheep Us]

Yeah, so did Esp/Molla's voting patterns when I flipped scum in House Party.
...Oh. Wait.

(Normally, I wouldn't make this type of heavily snarky post. But admit it, BRO deserves that. )

Gonna respond to the rest of your wall in-full later, but this deserves special mention for bad things to post.

This is something that shouldn't need to be explained to you

[Just Sheep Us]

Hey BRO, Ive changed my mind. Mastin is just scum. Her push on me is really that bad.

Again, I'm confused as to why you too so long.

[Just Sheep Us]

@AP: earlier you said that Mastin is clearly Town, but due to recent developments, you are inclined to believe she is scum based on her behavior and actions towards you. Let me ask: is she your strongest scumread and therefore, you are voting her based on that? (Also, is this scum level stronger than she is town level?) Or do you just want to lynch her because she is the "weakest link" to the town and that there is no other viable scummy options at the moment?

No, I think Kagura is probably my favorite pick for scum right now. A side of Carbon and PV. Id probably rather lynch any of these 3 than mastin, but Ive long since given up on wagoning CF and Kagura. Mastin seems determined to accuse me of bussing PV and then not actually do anything when I suggest we wagon PV, so ya. Mastin is a fine place to vote unless people want to lynch my other picks.

Y u no lynch RBD with me

[Just Sheep Us]

Interesting.

It does feel like CupcakeTown is one of those "popular" reads this game though.

Probably because I've yelled about it a lot.

Sometimes me yelling about things works.

[Just Sheep Us]

Know what?

Fuck this.

It's not like I'm going to get nightkilled at this point anyway.

AP's going to get total revenge. Total revenge because not only am I right, not only is he scum, but also because he gets to lynch the one player he wouldn't be able to nightkill.

Claim: Ruca Milda, Reincarnated God

.

I am essentially a modified treestump. It's not called that. And is broken into two halves, but is the best description for my role. I'm not just nightkill immune. I'm immune to ANY form of death except lynch. That's the death-immune part. The no vote part you've already seen. I am a child from innocence from Naraka (which, yes, means I'm an innocence child ), but thanks to this trope (actually, a cousin trope, but it's the actual name of the ability, so I'm not sure I can claim that), I'm classified as both male AND female for abilities dependent on gender.

You can find my iso literally filled to the brim with things about this.
Like why this is a strong ability, why I wasn't afraid to hint at it, why I wanted to be investigated (because a scum who is both kill-immune AND investigation-immune is horribly overpowered), and why I said that it's a role that would either conftown me or get me speedlynched. (Depending on how it's perceived.)

So wait, you're a

shittier

tree stump.

And you're calling it the most powerful role ever?

Da fuq?

[Just Sheep Us]

All it takes is one of you. Just one of you to realize that you've made all the points you're going to make. Just one of you to realize that you're drowning out the game. Just one of you to realize that it's two days to deadline and this isn't helping. Just one of you to walk away.

One of you should.

Taking a couple days away from mafia did some good and I don't actually think I'll dip out of the rest of the day phase like I thought yesterday. However, I have shit ton of grading to finish tonight, so I probably won't be back until tomorrow unless I get a good chunk of this done or just need a break.

It would be nice if one of you would disengage.

This is also fixable by lynching one of them.

Preferably the one who's scum who somehow thought that a shittier version of a tree stump was somehow a god-role.

[Just Sheep Us]

WE'RE LYNCHING PV TODAY, EVERYONE VOTE IT UP PLEASE.

No

[Just Sheep Us]

@AP: earlier you said that Mastin is clearly Town, but due to recent developments, you are inclined to believe she is scum based on her behavior and actions towards you. Let me ask: is she your strongest scumread and therefore, you are voting her based on that? (Also, is this scum level stronger than she is town level?) Or do you just want to lynch her because she is the "weakest link" to the town and that there is no other viable scummy options at the moment?

No, I think Kagura is probably my favorite pick for scum right now. A side of Carbon and PV. Id probably rather lynch any of these 3 than mastin, but Ive long since given up on wagoning CF and Kagura. Mastin seems determined to accuse me of bussing PV and then not actually do anything when I suggest we wagon PV, so ya. Mastin is a fine place to vote unless people want to lynch my other picks.

Y u no lynch RBD with me

reads that would be relatively easy become conflicted messes when players I kinda think are town scumread each other so doggedly.

why do you think RBD is scum?

and ask desp if he thinks scum-nati would spend the Song uPick trust card today.

This read really shouldn't be that hard.

They've done nothing all game but make or support shit pushes. From the onset, with mastin attacking Tammy for... no good reason, they were immediately buddied up. There's a quote from Mean Girls that's pretty apt here:



There's also the whole burying the thread in noise thing and the alt-slipping and pretending to be each other to obfuscate who is thinking what, but that's more "icing on the cake" than "needed to demonstrate their scumminess"

[Just Sheep Us]

The first 50 pages of this thread are nothing but noise from you so don't play the "OMG I'm so town not creating noise" card, F16

I got plenty of useful stuff from 1-24, and AP replaced in on page 40ish.

[Just Sheep Us]

the alt-slipping and pretending to be each other has become a running gag, and has (sadly) been one of the more enjoyable things in what has turned out to be a serious pain of a game. The "noise" they've contributed pales in comparison to some of the other noise.

And keep in mind that despite the fact that mastin and AP have dominated this game in recent days, earlier today Titan was still 100 posts ahead of the next most prolific poster.

I own some of the blame because I disengaged rather than yelling about how helpful to scum that kind of thread-noise is.

It's not enjoyable. Do you know what's enjoyable? Scum getting lynched. Not scum doing stupid schticks because they feel like it.

Look at the interactions that lead Tammy to spam-post as hard as she did. She was the central figure in this game for a very long time. Why was that the case?

Because mastin and RBD started attacking her relentlessly for no good reason.

And yelling about how helpful thread-noise is to scum does jack shit; fixing the problem

by removing the scum who are causing it

it how to deal with it.

[Just Sheep Us]

the alt-slipping and pretending to be each other to obfuscate who is thinking what

THREE EASY STEPS TO FIGURING OUT WHO WROTE THE POST:

(1) DID NATI SIGN IT? IF SO, HE DIDN'T WRITE IT
(2) DID MUFFIN SIGN IT? IF SO, HE DIDN'T WRITE IT
(3) DID NOBODY SIGN IT? FIGURE IT THE FUCK OUT FOR YOURSELF BECAUSE OUR POSTING STYLE ISN'T AT ALL SIMILAR

How about you don't rely on stupid schticks and play the fucking game.

[Just Sheep Us]

I have been yelling for mastin blood, but have made it fairly clear that I'd prefer RBD first (95+% chance at scum flip is technically better than a 90% chance scum flip)

I would be yelling for AP blood if I were scum reading him.

pedit: I don't remember specifics of the attack, just the pretty arrows of RBD defending mastin and attacking whomever she attacked.

[Just Sheep Us]

ffery, let me draw you a pretty objectives hierarchy:

Tier 1 objective:

Town Wincon.

Tier 2 objectives:

1) Lynch Scum
2) Remove Noise.

Now, let's look at what means objectives of "Lynch mastin," "Lynch AP," and "Lynch RBD" get us:

Lynch mastin: Fulfills 2, very likely fulfills 1.

Lynch AP: Fulfills 2 less than above objective, very unlikely fulfills 1.

Lynch RBD: Fulfills 2 the least, most likely to fulfill 1.

Now, given that I value 1 over 2 by a fairly significant weighting (noise bothers me a lot less than scum being alive), my optimal choice is to lynch RBD. Regardless of how one biases the two tier-2 objectives, lynching AP is always wrong, since lynching mastin better fulfills both objectives.

[Just Sheep Us]

I saw me first matey rhymed
So I decided to tried
Mastin's prob town
but their buddying me is sound
so scum they may be
We shall see

I don't know about Titan
I'm kinda frightened
That Athena is back
In which case give 'em the rack!

VOTE: Titan

This is when I drew the "RBD attacks Titan" arrow on my diagram.

[Just Sheep Us]

Derp. Through two, not three.

I don't know why we're starting other wagons when we can find Tammy's alignment by bringing them to L-3 before Page 5.

VOTE: Titan

good point

tammy needs to town it up quickly

vote titan

vote titan

Hi!

VOTE: kagura

Okay here's what I need from you guys. Nacho, if you're town I need to feel it. Alternatively, Bork you can obvtown up your slot ASAP please. I will stay with you, but if you value my sanity at all (and if you're town you should!), you will please just do this for me.

I briefly skimmed the first couple pages, notscience here's an awesome town tell for me. I literally just woke up, and the first thing I did was log in to this game. Though I'd love to stay and goof off I've got to go to work.

This actually feels like a scum entrance into the game. Like...I guess it's the tone? The last post isn't the type of friendly banter from town trying to scumhunt a player they know and respect; it feels like scum forcing their way into getting towncred by being confrontational and trying to make it look like town. The earlier posts also feel fake, and honestly, really not liking those self-votes.

Here's mastin's initial attack on Titan.

Notice the post counts.

[Just Sheep Us]

AP.

NO.

EYES ON THE PRIZE.

REMOVE THE SCUM THAT FUCKING DOES SHIT.

[Just Sheep Us]

I flipped on that read eventually.

That was also the game where everyone called me bad for my Grimgroove read that formed around the same time that actually ended up being right so...

[Just Sheep Us]

AP, you mean mastin and RBD.

And ffery, go read RBD's posts. I even quoted two incredibly relevant posts for you to look at.

[Just Sheep Us]

I'm saying that mastin's shit push was shit.

And that RBD backed that shit push, as they have all of mastin's shit pushes.

Is that really unclear, because I've stated it fairly plainly a metric fuckton of times at this point.

[Just Sheep Us]

I already compromised when I voted mastin.

[Just Sheep Us]

WOOHOO YOU DECIDED TO CC.

VOTE: RBD

CAN WE STOP BEING BAD AND LYNCH SCUM NOW KTHX.

Also, p5 catching CF's read switching on cupcake and AP catching bork's QT thing were both things that had to do with the neighborhood (the cupcake-town read originated from me, and bork/Nacho being in the neighborhood means that they are dealing with multiple QTs)

[Just Sheep Us]

Also, muffin, he explained why he didn't CC earlier:

I honestly wasn't sure whether RBD were gambiting with their miller claim or were serious. It only slowly started to sink in at some point that they were serious about it. I was also certain enough about Mastin being scum that I was fine with a Mastin lynch followed by RBD locking themselves into a gladiate with BRO-Desp and then counterclaiming them. As it turns out, we seem to be headed toward a mislynch one way or another. I am not really sure at what point I realized that RBD were serious about their claim and re-read our role realized we had the same role. But on an initial read, I sort of skimmed through and didn't really register that we were a miller.

[Just Sheep Us]

Who exactly do you want to lynch today?

Cupcake and Yakuri would be the ones I'd most like to lynch. But that's less from a strong scmread and more frm a lack of townread.

I expect more from you :/

[Just Sheep Us]

Do any of the other game people have neighborhoods? Because that just screams 'global mechanic' to me

-b

F-16 can create them for each game, one per day. He chose Abyss first.

[Just Sheep Us]

Gonna relay what Desp said in our neighborhood QT, which is that we aren't voting for people who aren't mastin or RBD today.

[Just Sheep Us]

Who are the leading lynch candidates besides mastin at this point?

depends

how likely do you think it is for there to be multiple millers?

[Just Sheep Us]

You do realize CF thought that mastin and I were BUSSING EACH OTHER. THATS NOT A TOWN THING TO THINK.

pssssssstttt

i think you're bussing each other too

@ bork: i don't get the reference even after looking at the roles. what do you mean?

[Just Sheep Us]

i don't understand how that's even remotely similar to two people claiming miller. for all intents and purposes cabd just split a full rolecop into two separate roles and gave them other abilities.

[Just Sheep Us]

Whether it be miller, rolecop, tracker, whatevs.

there is an appreciable difference between multiple versions of the same town PR and multiple people claiming to be millers. why are you grouping them together like this?

[Just Sheep Us]

i'm not grilling him and it's all theory anyway so feel free

[Just Sheep Us]

Because I want to know why you think this is easily a more open and shut scenario considering we can confirm nothing about the millers other than they investigate guilty which won't help us?

how many miller claims would you be willing to accept and how do you envision a setup that is based around multiple town millers actually working?

i can think of a variety of situations where multiple town trackers makes sense. i cannot think of a situation where including multiple town millers is a good design choice. can you help me out here?

[Just Sheep Us]

desp. how big was your game and what was your thought process behind it?

pedit: worse.

[Just Sheep Us]

there's a big difference between a red herring and a cop returning 40% guilty rates.

[Just Sheep Us]

I mean I think you are right about one of them bieng fake, so moot point from me. I just disagree on which one. And it is -possible- they exist together. Im just not convinced CF handled the situation like an actual miller.

if f-16 is scum and he blew his load on this i would be fucking shocked

[Just Sheep Us]

like, "my entire interpretation of the gamestate hinges on f-16 being town" shocked

[Just Sheep Us]

AP, your refusal to lynch RBD makes zero fucking sense.

[Just Sheep Us]

This p5 flash wagon over mastin or RBD is shit.

[Just Sheep Us]

This p5 flash wagon over mastin or RBD is shit.

Okay. How many of {Kagura, AP, Mac} are you scumreading?
Townreading?
Nullreading?

'Cause that's the PV wagon.

Except you leave out the part where you've been pushing for it constantly.

And would be on it at this point if you had a vote.

[Just Sheep Us]

PeregrineV (4): Kagura, AngryPidgeon,

]MastinSSK

, Mac,

Clyton

,

Hey mastin:

Bolded are the names of people that are below the null/null-scum line.

[Just Sheep Us]

This p5 flash wagon over mastin or RBD is shit.

Okay. How many of {Kagura, AP, Mac} are you scumreading?
Townreading?
Nullreading?

'Cause that's the PV wagon.

Ive basically given up on JSU. Their reads are just terrible this game and they are being absurdly stubborn.

Oh come on.

I'm the only person who correctly read you when you came in.

You know what I'm capable of doing when I turn on.

Why the fuck aren't you working with me.

[Just Sheep Us]

Ignore the scum trying to scum-spin narratives and lynch it instead.

[Just Sheep Us]

It's generally a winning strategy.

[Just Sheep Us]

This is me all fucking game :/

[Just Sheep Us]

Like who names their hydra just sheep us

then lurks til called on it

then spits on me as scum

Fun Fact: every game where desperado was scum and I was in the game, he attacked me day one

META! META! META! MEAT!

Saying things repeatedly while ignoring context is obviously super townie.

Obviously.

[Just Sheep Us]

I won't help you with either of those goals.

THIS RAIL HAS NO BRAKES IN THAT CASE

I've only been paying scant attention, I wanna chat about despbro for a bit. You're marked for death tonight I'm fairly sure, so there's that.

Maybe so.

despbro's push on you was one of those shards that didn't fit until the counterclaim. It made perfect sense as a stance informed by knowledge of another miller.

I was pushing RBD long before F-16 claimed miller in the neighborhood.

[Just Sheep Us]

Maybe so.

despbro's push on you was one of those shards that didn't fit until the counterclaim. It made perfect sense as a stance informed by knowledge of another miller.

Agreed, but I'm also saying that I think they are actually playing F-16 like a fiddle right now. Desperado -should- know something was up with our miller claim.

Why're you acting like Desp is doing any sort of driving?

I'm the main force of this hydra.

I was scum reading you before your claim came into play.

Desp's just been in lockstep with me.

[Just Sheep Us]

Okay I lied about my role

I'm actually a mason miller hated age cop modified gladiator

Mastin's my mason partner.

It's because we're both demigods.

No

[Just Sheep Us]

RBD scum claimed.

Can we lynch it now? It's been flailing for like 60 fucking pages.

[Just Sheep Us]

The fact that people aren't blank-voting you at this point is fucking appalling.

[Just Sheep Us]

It's because they're scum.

[Just Sheep Us]

Guys.

I'm going to sit here and answer every question directed to RBD about their motives as "because they're scum."

It's really not that fucking hard.

[Just Sheep Us]

2--Due to site culture, any miller claim is town, and we needed to make sure to coax it out. We just didn't forsee a goddamn neighborhood.

Uhhhhh. Do I need to strongly reconsider this townread?

AP.

HOLY SHIT.

IF YOUR NEXT POST ISN'T A VOTE FOR RBD.

I CAN'T.

[Just Sheep Us]

pretty sure mastin's down the mastingambit as scum

[Just Sheep Us]

it's almost like that's the whole point of being scum or something

...

[Just Sheep Us]

Can we lynch Cabd today?

Why aren't you voting the slot that claimed scum.

That question really applies to everyone not voting RBD.

[Just Sheep Us]

@Mastin: Ya BRO pointed that out to me in thread after the neighborhood got outed. That Bork WAS probably subconsciously slipping about the neighborhood. Weren't you one of the people telling me tht my semantics argument was a reach though :S

fwiw everyone in the neighborhood also called it a reach.

I think we're both just kind of crazy :/

[Just Sheep Us]

You want a p5 lynch over the scum who scum claimed.

Are you fucking kidding me.

[Just Sheep Us]

Hey mastin, shut up and let your buddy fall on his sword already.

Seriously.

It's pissing me off.

[Just Sheep Us]

blah blah mist mist mist.

Is all I see from you.

Shut up and lose already.

(in b4 people tell me to stop being so mean despite the bullshit muffinz and you have been pulling all game)

[Just Sheep Us]

You've never read me correctly, even when you've been scum, so...

[Just Sheep Us]

You see, here's what I don't get.

You yell at me for my reads not evolving.

And yet all you've done in response to me scum-reading you is adhom my skill, appeal to my ego, and go about the same behavior that led me to scumread you in the first place.

RBD does the same thing, except throws in a fakeclaim for good measure.

You ignore my reads with respect to the rest of the playerbase. It's like you only care about my reads on you and RBD.

I wonder why...

[Just Sheep Us]

Yeah I'm not going to apologize for spending most of my time in-thread trying to get scum lynched, especially when my other reads and a lot of backend are on-record in the neighborhood QT, and when I have made other fairly clear stances this game.

Especially in the context of a game where scum (you and RBD) are trying very hard to drown everything under the mist.

[Just Sheep Us]

[Just Sheep Us]

Getting myself lynched first, watching as the town lynches my strongest townread, and secretly hoping the town loses is my thing. Don't go stealing it!

*shrug*

If Nati doesn't want to be lynched, he won't be lynched. I asked him to do something that could probably be considered against the spirit of the game, but since it's not a rule violation (I don't think) it will basically conftown us

In case it wasn't already obvious, I've asked him to pretend to paraphrase paraphrase our entire hydra QT re: this game (200~ish posts so far, almost entirely me) - from the pre-game receiving role reactions to current, in order. Because apparently this isn't something you can do as scum.

ftfy

[Just Sheep Us]

I

actually

don't think the stuff in our hydra QT could be faked by scum-us, but if he posts it, you'll get to judge it yourself, and if you're

actually

town and still think we're scum,

I will

literally

lol at how bad at scum hunting you

actually

are

Since I'm doing some commentary on Latin right now, let's dunk this shit commentary style.

actually – Use of the adverbial intensifier to emphasize how much he thinks of his opinion.

actually – Same as before.

I will – Failure to contract is a formalization of speech. Liars frequently slip into more formal speech when lying to seem more believable ("I did not have sexual relations with that woman")

literally – You really want us to think that you'll do this.

actually - 3x actually in a 2 line post. Wow. You are being soooooooooo honest

[Just Sheep Us]

Go ahead, do it.

[Just Sheep Us]

[Just Sheep Us]

I hate all of you.

I'm on 3 fucking hours of sleep, and I was expecting people to vote RBD

after they fucking scum claimed

[Just Sheep Us]

I saw no reason to bring it up because all claiming miller day one does is devolves any relevant discussion during the day into "is he faking or not" and ends with me being lynched, which is fucking dumb.

Here!

I think this might have gotten missed anyway--Desp should have remembered since this is part of what pinned him down in that game.

To go further, we decided to claim Hated Miller for two reasons at the beginning

1--shits and giggles, in case it wasn't obvious, neither muffin or I had any intention of playing seriously.

2--Due to site culture, any miller claim is town, and we needed to make sure to coax it out. We just didn't forsee a goddamn neighborhood.

[Just Sheep Us]

It meant that he thought they could claim miller, coast a bit, and then 1v1 the CC.

The neighborhood bit means they weren't expecting to have 3 other players backing the person who would CC them

[Just Sheep Us]

Wow my prose is shit on 3 hours of sleep.

[Just Sheep Us]

He creates a neighborhood for a game.

He chose "Tales of the Abyss" today, which has himself, me/Desp/GiFPie/NachoBork.

[Just Sheep Us]

We can deal with Clyton later.

pedit: ffery, are you trying to get me to scumread you?

[Just Sheep Us]

Votecount 1-28

With 17 players alive, it will take 9 votes to lynch or nolynch.

PeregrineV (4): Kagura, AngryPidgeon, MastinSSK, Mac
MastinSSK (2): CupcakePanda, Yggdra Union
Just Sheep Us (2): orcinus_theoriginal, Red Gyarados
AngryPidgeon (1): Lord Business
Rancid Broderick Drake (6): CarbonFiber, Just Sheep Us, PeregrineV, The Fox and the Hound, Clyton, Rancid Broderick Drake,

Not Voting (2): Titan, Breakfast with Stalin

With 17 players alive, deadline is set for 18 days: (expired on 2014-04-18 00:01:39)

Btw, want to crossreference the names on this Rancid wagon with the equally-large wagon on me, and see what overlap there is.

It's gonna be me/CF/Foxhound. Maybe p5?

[Just Sheep Us]

Counterpoint: The town play, in my mind, would be to take it back immediately, before it causes what it's causing right now. Instead, they threw doubt on F16's claim and continued scumreading him, then called him conftown like 10 pages later. I don't see town motivation in that delay.

Holy shit so much of this.

I'm going to be an insufferable dick until RBD is lynched because they're fucking scum and it's obvious-as AND HAS BEEN FOR THE WHOLE FUCKING GAME.

AND YET YOU FUCKERS REFUSE TO LISTEN.

[Just Sheep Us]

look at dis mastin grasping for every single possible counterwagon to RBD

Actually, Rancid's the counterwagon to all of those wagons.

DesBRO, PV, and Fox/Hound all had votes on them weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeell before Rancid did.

You're flagrantly ignoring game narrative and defining wagon as "having votes," which is a pretty meaningless definition.

[Just Sheep Us]

ITT mastin argues semantics that have nothing to do with my actual point. again

Except that this is no semantics debate.

Rancid IS a damn counterwagon. More specifically, a CW to PV. PV was the lead wagon with five votes (plus me), and a sixth potentially on the way. Rancid had two or three votes at the time.

Now he has six.

p5 was also a counter wagon to YOU, and there has been a decent consensus among the group that wagoned you that you and RBD are scum together so...

[Just Sheep Us]

I posted something in our hydra QT and flipped back to this thread and saw your post, clyton.

What I posted was that If I were playing on my own, I'd probably vote peregrine as a consensus measure with Mac and Kagura, with a full understanding that it's a compromise likely to result in a mislynch.

This is basically an untenable day 1 for me. I could put a vote *somewhere* and feel more useful I guess, but if I'm going to do that - waste our vote - I'd rather just not vote and take the heat for that tomorrow.

RBD have indicated they'll gladiate one of my townreads tomorrow, so even if they survive today, tomorrow looks like another shit game day.

Or you could just lynch them today, get the scum flip, and fix the goddamn problem.

[Just Sheep Us]

I suppose you could say:
My role is such that I'm not someone who never is getting lynched this game.
But my play is such that I shouldn't ever be lynched this game.

You claimed a shittier version of a standard tree stump, and your plays been scummy as.

I don't get how many times I have to say this to you.

Saying things over and over again won't make people believe them.

[Just Sheep Us]

Counterpoint: The town play, in my mind, would be to take it back immediately, before it causes what it's causing right now. Instead, they threw doubt on F16's claim and continued scumreading him, then called him conftown like 10 pages later. I don't see town motivation in that delay.

Holy shit so much of this.

I'm going to be an insufferable dick until RBD is lynched because they're fucking scum and it's obvious-as AND HAS BEEN FOR THE WHOLE FUCKING GAME.

AND YET YOU FUCKERS REFUSE TO LISTEN.

Well let's see.

Claim miller ................................................. 90 pages later counterclaim

Remind me which kind of town accepts a counterclaim that comes 90 pages later?

What's the town-motivation in holding it in the context of the gladiator claim?

What's the scum-motivation in CCing 90 pages later?

These aren't hard questions to answer, Mac.

[Just Sheep Us]

Why does scum Muffin, who is the fucking reigning DON CORLEONE on site and has fooled the majority of players in this game, feel the need to claim miller right out the gate?

Why does scum Muffin fake apathy and then go on to fucking admit it was fake and he just wanted to see if anyone would townread him?

WHY IS TOWN MUFFINATI BEING LYNCHED?

1) Claimed millers are conftown under current site meta (scum aren't miller claiming much right now). RBD already stated this. It's a moderate-risk, high-reward cheese play.

2) The repeated bringing-up of the Don Corleone thing is a load of bollocks. You were in NY169, where scum-muffin completely sucked and let himself get bussed, despite the bussing being the obviously wrong play.

3) Towncred.

4) Why are you town reading scum?

[Just Sheep Us]

Saying things over and over again won't make people believe them.

Actually, that does work a surprising amount of the time. I noticed once that good players often get their lynches through this way, so I tried it. It actually does work when the playerlist isn't stacked.

~Ceph

I hate people.

[Just Sheep Us]

He's not talking about the towniness of counterclaiming 90 pages later. He's talking about the towniness of not buying the counterclaim initially.

He asked "What kind of town accepts a CC that comes 90 pages later."

I asked the questions that *should* be the town thought process in thinking through such a decision.

Which would have made it obvious that CF is town.

[Just Sheep Us]

He's not talking about the towniness of counterclaiming 90 pages later. He's talking about the towniness of not buying the counterclaim initially.

He asked "What kind of town accepts a CC that comes 90 pages later."

I asked the questions that *should* be the town thought process in thinking through such a decision.

Which would have made it obvious that CF is town.

I think seeing that is easier and therefore happens more quickly from the outside rather than from the inside though.

If anything, it should be easier if you're faking miller because you know that you're not a miller...

[Just Sheep Us]

As mentioned, that was the snarking. More seriously, Rancid is the counterwagon to PeregrineV, because the wagon on PV was there first, and for much longer.

You're being hyper-technical while missing the point.

Or choosing to ignore it.

Because you're scum.

[Just Sheep Us]

(Let's ignore the irony in you saying my play is scummy for a bit.) As I recall, you started telling me this in House Party.

I'm pretty sure I say this to you every game at this point.

It's a cheap persuasion technique that pisses me off.

[Just Sheep Us]

Modified. Stronger in some ways, weaker than others. And, yes. My role is stronger in some ways than a normal tree stump. Among them being that I count as being alive rather than dead, and that I can place a vote even if the vote doesn't lynch, and that if the town trusts me, I gain the ability to vote at 9 players alive. Weaker in that I can get lynched.

As for my play, keep telling yourself that.

You know what a normal tree stump gets to do?

Be a VT that basically becomes what you are now AFTER it dies.

So it's functionally BP AND lynchproof, just getting shot or lynched costs it its vote.

That's a lot better than what you have.