Mini 1404 - Monopoly Mafia - Game Over
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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Hi all, I'm still reading through all the posts from day 1 and I'm about a third of the way through but it's slow going so I may appear inactive for a couple of days as I get through it, I'm a pretty slow forum-reader especially when trying to analyse.
I'm perfectly capable of spelling the word 'you' too, if you were wondering.-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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I was about half way through this thread then went back to re-read the first few pages after the n1 kills were announced and BS + UN flipped. Now I've also read the last two pages before the lynch so I found out that Lurker slipped and found the post with a bit of digging.
So I'm going to put some thoughts down on the original Lurker wagon whilst it's all fresh because I'm horrible at note taking and remembering things so I want it posted, then I can come back and see if I feel any different. Apologies if its stuff already covered.
L-1 wagon was:
Agent_Ireland (unvoted 1st (after claim))
Jal (unvoted 3rd)
Xisiqomelir (unvoted 4th)
Lord Mhork
Mogadishu Jones (unvoted 2nd)
StrangerCoug (CheeryDog)
Jake also labelled Lurker scum but didn't put his vote there until scum slip was caught.
Mogadishu was actually on the wagon, off the wagon, on the wagon then off after claim.
There were two people I see as against the wagon or at least the people on it and that's baby spice and mehdi. UN at the end sounds like he tunnelling jal hard and she was the person that spotted the scum tell.
That leaves mehdi as only one that was against it or negative about it still alive whereas all six on the original wagon are alive. That's too conienant at the moment because all I've got so far I see mehdi as annoying town, not scum. I'm not sure it's the reason for both scum kills but I think one killed one of the two dead townies because they were bussing lurker and removing someone that was on the original wagon means they lose part of their crowd that they're hiding in.
I don't think its Jal, she found and mentioned the slip, Jones/TBG was on and off the lynch erratically which I think is obv town. Which pairs AI/Xis up as those that got off the wagon, potentially off their partner and LM/SC as those not wanting to get off, potentially to gain cred if partner was lynched and they were seen on it all along. Jake, not putting a vote on a scum read is a tell for scum not wanting to buss their partner early on, so I'm considering him in the list.
I'd like to find the killer in the pack to lynch today and at the moment I'd say my strongest reads to the scum side out of those 7 would be AI, Xis and Jake.
Something else, it took 30 hours,18 for scum slip to be noticed by someone who posted, in that time those who posted where jal, baby, xis, tehbrawl, mehdi, UN, jake-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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I'm not answering for what Robert wrote, I can't. Understand I can't stop you from making reads about the slot though.
In post 923, Jake from State Farm wrote:Correction, I was specifically asked my thoughts of mhork v lurker by mehndi and said if I had to pick one it would be lurker. Get your facts straight
They are, thanks. You mentioned you'd join lurkers wagon but you never did. I'm not ignoring that mention from any pre-scumslip wagon analysis.
In post 924, Jake from State Farm wrote:The point about noticing the scum slip, its Probably because nobody fully read that wall of text.
Scum could have read the walls and ignored it. If there's a SK then they'd want it ignored too so they can get rid of obv maf night one themselves.
I'm sure people may have missed things but I don't understand why in a game where reading = hunting you would not be reading everything.
In post 947, Mehdi2277 wrote:
In post 903, Mehdi2277 wrote:Xis I don't suspect currently.
Safety if you can find one game where scum have killed based on voting records and not voting intent or many other rreaspns night 1 I'll consider the theory, but I've never seen kills for that basis (and mafia didn't kill both spice and un since mafia vigs are very powerful and very unlikely to exist).
I did mention I didn't expect both kills were for the same reason but the possibility of one of them. I'm trying to understand the reason behind why sucm chose them (and yes, its with limited knowledge atm, I haven't read everything) and all the people on the initial wagon are still alive. I want to find out why. My view that since the lynch was a formality because of the slip, you can't read too much into the actual lynch-wagon whereas the original wagon pre-claim is more valid.
Mafia Vigs may be too powerful but what about maf getting a one-shot from a card? Do we even know for sure its not a 3 maf team + vig?
In post 947, Mehdi2277 wrote:
I was unsure whether to reveal this but considering it doesn't reveal my role sure, I also got a chance that gave me a 1 shot doc. I can reveal who it was on, but the main point is chance/community chest cards can give other role powers beyond things like a vote.
Who was it on?-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 974, Mehdi2277 wrote:Mafia getting a vig shot is very rare. I think there's only been one or two mafia vigs in 13ps for the history of this site.
I mainly think that robert's choice to vote jal twice makes him pretty likely town. As scum double voting is fairly useful and to put it on someone that no one wanted to vote as well I don't think is likely for him.
So it's possible?
What a waste the double-vote was. Suppose that's the luck of it. Was a bit pointless it ending up on an inactive and on such an obvious lynch.
You didn't respond to the last bit of #968 btw.-
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In post 976, Mehdi2277 wrote:Tbg was the person I chose. I considered jal but I was expecting UN alive and assumed jal might be kept alive by scum to have un keep on fosing her.
Possible yes. Done in about 1 percent of games on site this size also yes.
Ah ok. Well your electricity bill says otherwise. You stayed at home last night. No reason for VT to lie.
VOTE: Mehdi2277-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 984, Cheery Dog wrote:In post 980, SafetyDance wrote:
Possible yes. Done in about 1 percent of games on site this size also yes.
Ah ok. Well your electricity bill says otherwise. You stayed at home last night. No reason for VT to lie.
VOTE: Mehdi2277
Is this a claim to have picked up the Electricity company?
This confirms that dead player's card are randomly redistributed amongst surviving players then.[/quote]
Yes, I got the Electricity company card during the night that Lurker claimed he had. I tracked Mehdi and he did nothing.
Which I thought was a waste until he claimed to visit someone.-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1004, Mehdi2277 wrote:In post 887, Guy_Named_Riggs wrote:It is now Day 2.
So you did a night action while your slot was empty?
I replaced in during the night, GNR gave me the role pm and all the cards were in it.
Why don't you ask him?-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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PEdit - yeah:
In post 1014, Cheery Dog wrote:In post 1010, Mehdi2277 wrote:I mentioned an rb as an unlikely possibility on you and that became I knew there was an rb.
A roleblock could possibly have been on you though.
To add, you still brought up roleblocking. It was at the forefront of your mind. You didn't even try to claim you yourself was rb'ed.-
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In post 1018, Lord Mhork wrote:In post 1013, Mehdi2277 wrote:Anyways the bigger point to address mhork is me vs safety.
I have to pick? Why?
You both are sketch, but I was reading town on you. I do not see, though, why the use of a chance card wouldn't count as a visit. Nor do I see why you would even try to lie about taking an action when you didn't take one. That makes no real sense to me and I see no scum motivation. I wanna hear what the mod's ruling is before I consider voting you.
I'm a little confused, though, why he has the Electric Company. The mechanic of randomly redistributing properties after death doesn't really make sense to me, though, because that seems to go against the spirit of the 'screw your neighbor' flavor Monopoly. His push on you looks town motivated too though, 'cept for the whole having that card part.
A thought, maybe the cards get distributed among the faction responsible for a death? Would that make any sense? Random just seems too swingy and illogical. >.<
You'll note I had a town read of mehdi before #947 too.
I have the EC card. It wasn't one of the original ones sent to Robert. I don't know how it was distributed but I have it and used it on Mehdi.
The result was Mehdi didn't do anything n1, so he's not one of the killers. Still, there's no reason to lie. Mehdi didn't send in the kill, so he's not alone which means a 3-maf team at least.-
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In post 932, Jake from State Farm wrote:And I had not read the game fully at that point and wasn't putting anyone at l-1. If I wasn't asked by mehndi I probably wouldn't have had an opinion on either at that time.
But SC's l-1 for no reason but sheeping definitely was odd, especially since it came right after I voted him. Bus makes sense because I could easily be accused of starting a counter.
I will say i too have some info but not sure what to do with it. Hopefully some discussion will help me figure it out if the info I have is helpful or not.
P.edit - huh?
Can we have that info now?-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1025, Xisiqomelir wrote:In post 993, Mehdi2277 wrote:And xis scum motive to claim 1 shot doc who saved no one is?
That doesn't exist either.
@SafetyDance: What is a general description of your result's format? Is it something like "Visited: X" or "Did not visit"?
That I decided to do the action against the player mentioned but didn't see anything.-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1037, Jal wrote:In post 890, SafetyDance wrote:Hi all, I'm still reading through all the posts from day 1 and I'm about a third of the way through but it's slow going so I may appear inactive for a couple of days as I get through it, I'm a pretty slow forum-reader especially when trying to analyse.
I'm perfectly capable of spelling the word 'you' too, if you were wondering.
Why did you decide to track Medhi?
There was less than a day left of night and from what I read early on he was the one I thought was looking most scummy. Almost had it on UN, glad I didn't now.-
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[quote="In [url=http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4632789#p4632789]post 1046 [/url], Mehdi2277"][quote="In [url=http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4632555#p4632555]post 1021[/url], SafetyDance"]You'll note I had a town read of mehdi before #947 too.[/quote]
When did I become townie after being most scummy?[/quote]
It's not too hard to follow.
During night: Scummy read
After NA: Town read
After #947: Scum"You got a chapter in one of those books on jumping to conclusions? You attach an assumption to a piece of evidence, you start to bend the narrative to support it, prejudice yourself."-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1058, Cheery Dog wrote:In post 1056, Jake from State Farm wrote:P. edit cool, you tracked UN and didn't visit anyone ekse right?
I visited someone else with a different power (although as far as I tell it's currently useless).
UN didn't visit anybody.
What power and whom?-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1072, Jake from State Farm wrote:@ safety - 2 questions
Did you got your night action PM before the day started?
also question regarding your report, you claim your action said you didn't "see anything" but that is completely different than "no result" or "didn't go anywhere" don't you think?
I am also curious how you got your extra card at night, but Xis claimed to get an extra card during the start of the day. It doesn't add up personally.
1.) Think about this. Why would I get to do night actionsafterthe day started? I joined the game, got my role pm during the night phase, and did my night actions before the day started.
It seems like you're presuming some serious bastard-modding happening from GNR to let me replace in during the day and still do night actions. You'll have to get clarification from him personally as to if this is the true and why he posted I replaced in at the start of the day (@mod, your cue...).
2.) GNR was vague (purposefully?) in his reply. I think you can read it both ways. Didn't see anything could equal didn't see Mehdi go anywhere is/was my line of thought rather than no result. If CheeryDog is telling the truth and got the same message with the waterworks on UN who was definitely townie and can't have possibly gone anywhere, then I think that yes, that's further proof that message means that person didn't do anything, which counters what Mehdi is saying. Unless you're of the opinion that both CD and I were roleblocked. I can't even imagine the odds on that.
3.) Did you notice Jal also claimed getting a new card? It's pretty safe to say now that dead people's cards get redistributed to the living players, to whom and by means is unknown to us. Who died before the night? Who also claimed to have the card I now possess. Now put two and two together...-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1082, Mehdi2277 wrote:Either a. I was role blocked or b. safety is scum or I am are the only two options that have decent chances of being true.
And VOTE: AI. Partly just sheeping tbg and partly that guille's last post puts him a bit less of a lynch desire as AI right now.
You're not entertaining the theory that CD could be trying to put two townies against each other by supporting one side?-
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In post 895, Mehdi2277 wrote:And that same scum miller got nominated for a scummy. Kind of means something and if you want an opinion of a non townie who read the game I commented and said sala played pretty great. Policy lynching millers is a bad idea if you don't care much about their play.
I'll check the cards I got later, but I've gotten 2 already (one was at night and the other I mentioned during the day before).
Where did gnr mention the kills like that in the OP?
I think this needs to be clarified. How'd you get a card at night? Lurker's two cards have been claimed.-
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Also, I think we need to be perfectly clear when claiming cards.
Deed Cards = properties
Special Cards = chance or community chest
For instance myself/rob: 2 deed cards at start of game, 1 community chest during day giving double vote. One deed card at night and then another CC card with money today. (nothing here is anything that hasn't been claimed in previous posts).
The way I see the role setup at the moment is:
1st level - normal game roles and abilities
2nd level - power roles/actions gained by deed card (randomly and regardless of your alignment/role?)
3rd level - temporary/one-shot actions that can be gained from special cards.
Does this point to role madness? It seems to point to a lot of roles that we can get in the game. It will be interesting afterwards to see how it was all balanced out. Must've taken ages to set up.
With the deed cards from previous players, do we know everything that's been claimed?
Lurker's properties have gone to guille and I
Baby/UN have gone to Jal and Monkey.
Was there anyone else claiming new cards? As Jal mentioned there should be at least two more.-
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Aside from the Mehdi stuff, I think the Agent_Ireland/Monkey slot is looking scummy too. It's one of the slots I found in my early reads was giving a scummy read after the initial lurker wagon.
Just look at his ISO and his first 8 post.
Post #8.... RVS vote on scum
Post #226 Dodge
Post #291 "A lot has happened but I'm not going to post anything". Keeps RVS vote on lurker with no reason given
Post #299 card speculation
Post #306 ditto
Post #309 quick unvote after lurker's claim
Post #319 request for prod
Post #333 lurker is now town
Looks like a bus to me. He was lurking, not giving a lot of information himself about anything yet was active enough to request other to be prodded. He was very quiet during the entire day. When Lurker went to L-2 he was the only vote on it without a valid reason or giving any actual reason at all but he was one of the first off it and in his next post gave him as a town read.
It's hard for Monkey to answer any of that (I dont think he can) but it doesn't change AI's play.
P-EDIT: @Mehdi As Scum? Probably defecating in my pants. I dont really want to imagine that too hard.-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1139, Jake from State Farm wrote:the problem I have with all of this is the fact that Safety claimed he got his tracker ability from the card he got from lurker, lurker already claimed it was a watcher and later switched and said it was a tracker, the fact that now SD is claiming he got that same card and in deed it has a tracker ability, I am not buying it for a second.
I believe CD that he visited jal, I find it hard to believe a mod would let a person perform 2 actions but I have to assume he's telling the truth about visiting CD. 2 tracker claims plus my role doesn't make sense as all being town sided so if I had to guess I'd say SD is scum over CD
the only problem I have is I don't trust mehndi one bit, so I am down with lynching him, but if he flips town I think it pretty much confirms SD as scum.
SO i'd rather lynch SD first because I don't buy 2 tracker claims but if I can't get an SD lynch, I will gladly take a mehndi lynch.
As for Monkey, I have no clue what to make of him, my gut wants to say he is scum but I will give him a chance to see if he can communicate his reads better and also see how he explains the question I asked him.
p.edit - this mock lynch is the stupidest thing I ever heard
Firstly, I think you're either being purposely dense or you're not understanding everything.
About my tracker claim - I'm not claiming I'm a tracker, I'm claiming I have a deed card that gives me the tracker ability.
Now, I read through the Lurker stuff recently so it may be fresh to me but I can't believe you don't know what he claimed, since it was the biggest event day one. He claimed his EC card was a watcher then slipped saying it tracker. If my slot got the EC card last night and it is a tracker, how can I be lying? Are you trying to claim by process of elimination that the ECwasa watcher?
You also seem to be forgetting that CD backed up what I said I got in the role pm. How can I fake that then, being the first person to mention it? He is also saying he has the other utility and that it gives the same ability. Doesn't that make any sense to you?
You're the third or fourth person (jal, mehdi, cd, jake) now to soft-claim a PR role. You're right town could appear too strong, which is why if you were reading before, you'd notice I came up with the same thoughts, scum must be powerful or have some strong ability to counter all this,
I can't say I'm confident mehdi is 100% scum, all I know for sure is that he didn't do anything last night when he claimed to moonlight as a doc.
Speaking up isn't really beneficial for my survivability either. If mehdi is scum I'm still not likely to survive the night anymore than if he is town and there's a vig.
I'd like to know how, other than gross misrep of the situation, you can think I come out of this with anything but a town-motive.-
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In post 1143, Jake from State Farm wrote:that's just it, he fake claimed watcher and later claimed it to be tracker so that means that he never had either ability, aka it's fake aka you don't have the tracker ability imo
what are you referring to about your role PM that CD backed up, I don't recall seeing this, can you link me to what you are talking about.
and as for the fact that you came out with your info meaning it's only town motivated, that may work for someone naive to automatically assume that but I have seen scum volunteer info like that before. Look at what happend, everyone has claimed. In fact you were the one asking people to reveal their info aka role fishing.
I am also not going to assume that both water works and electric company are both the same ability nor am I going to assume that they both are town roles. I absolutely don't believe anything associated with the electric company since lurker obviously lied about what ability it has.
Careful who you're calling dolt. From my end its you.
Interesting that you're calling Jal and CheerDog naive, I'm sure they appreciate it. I asked CD to backup what he said and he did (after your prodding, mind, which is interesting), you'd note that from my response to his claim. You kept hinting that you did stuff at night. You don't hint shit unless you're going to claim it. What do you expect? People to give you a free pass because youmighthave something pro-town. Yeah, just trust everyone because of what they might have. Put your cards on the table so to speak. I find it annoying that we have 4 soft-claims for a town aligned pr yet no one is revealing anything about what it is. I'm calling bullshit and it would be a lot simpler if it ended up being mehdi. Also, if I didn't come out with the info I have on mehdi we'd have gotten no where with anything.
There is nothing that CD claimed after me with the same role and result that I didn't mention before. If you don't think we both tracked and one of us is lying then you'd have to presume its him because he's copied/agreed with my claim. I don't want you to lynch CD either, I'm just trying to show there's no way I can be scum for claiming tracker with CD claiming the same thing. I'd have had to have known his role and result before hand. I'm not omnipresent.
I got a card which says Electric Company and I can track with it. Lurker claimed the same thing in his slip (a scum slip after all is the truth coming out right?). Since the Easter Bunny isn't in this game and Lurker is dead then yes, I'm going to believe its come from him. You should try coming up with an alternative theory if you think its wrong.
You can't really respond now to the end which defeats the purpose of reply I guess, but anyway, good luck with your surgery.-
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Actually, just realised I can confirm (the remote chance) I wasn't roleblocked last night.
I was going to avoid this but since CD did claim who he visited I'm going claim another card role with a successful result because it doesn't really matter for me at the moment. I don't care, I caught mehdi potentially lying and if he's scum then it should be an easy win for town. I already had a target on my back for other scum during the night if true anyway.
In post 1139, Jake from State Farm wrote:
I believe CD that he visited jal, I find it hard to believe a mod would let a person perform 2 actions but I have to assume he's telling the truth about visiting CD.
Aside from the fact that the mod did say you can perform 2 night actions, I can confirm it because 1) I did it myself and 2) so did Cheery. I did try to hint a bit I had more power in my cards and had checked CD:
In post 1050, SafetyDance wrote:Whilst we're wondering,looking at the cards I have, I think they are far too powerful if they're all like this and town has actual role alignments and pr as well. If we do have this much power then I think in balance scum could have something big up their sleeves too, like a double night kill.
In post 1071, SafetyDance wrote:That makes sense.
I'm V/LA for <24hrs>48hours if someone has questions for me and wondering why I'm not responding.
One of my original cards is a purple. Mediterranean Avenue and it allows me the Watcher ability.
So CD can't be a killer because Jal is still present. He hasn't (fmpov) lied with anything he said, even when it would have been easier to do so, or not say anything at all. With mehdi's rb'ed claim there's now no chance Cheery could be a scum roleblocker himself so I can't see him being anything but town too.-
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Sorry, I thought I made it clear. You know when you do something late and you're tired? I omitted the bit where I said I watched Jal.
Second last paragraph should read:
One of my original cards is a purple. Mediterranean Avenue and it allows me the Watcher ability. I chose to watch Jal because she was the one who found the scum slip-
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In post 1162, guille2015 wrote:
Robert/safety: I've labeled as scummy for mostly 181. 980: It makes me wonder, that would mean that he received that card from Lurker. Lurker had two cards. I received one of them. He lied about the electric being a tracker. but he then admitted to being scum rather than saying that he misread.If someone else received a card at the end of the day other than Safety, then Safety had the Electric card prior Lurker being lynched.
Oh yeah because if anyone else had the EC they would have kept it quiet? #980 was days ago, even the lurkers have read it by now, I would be getting rope burn around my neck right about now if there was another counter claim. This is funny too, anyone could claim they got the railway card, your claim of getting Lurker's card AFTER my claim of getting one of them, actually backs up my claim. You realise you could be counter-claimed too?
You and jake seem to have difficulty grasping things too. I'm going to give your intelligence the benefit of the doubt and say at least one of you is (or was in jake's case) is being obtuse on purpose. So I've noted that.
You are implying way too many things. You're implying that the tracker-slip wasn't the truth after lying about it being the tracker. You're implying the watcher was the true claim? You're implying that CD is lying too in his Utility claim and night result.
Also, you can't get mod to confirm night actions, absurd.-
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In post 1172, Jake from State Farm wrote:unvote: safety
But I have a question for safety, if you saw cd visit Jal, why didn't you react weirdly when he claimed to track UN?-
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Ignore 1182, sorry.
In post 1182, SafetyDance wrote:In post 1172, Jake from State Farm wrote:unvote: safety
But I have a question for safety, if you saw cd visit Jal, why didn't you react weirdly when he claimed to track UN?
Because unlike you I know you can do more than one thing at night? And you dont consider pushing him to claim what else he did as suspicion? My strategy with CD was the same with Mehdi.
In post 1170, Mehdi2277 wrote:I think so since my power has an obvious way to get upgraded (in factlurkers one card Mediterranean poweris more useful then my two oranges together).
It was never Lurker's, I have made no such claim.-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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In post 1070, Cheery Dog wrote:Well since I have told everyone I have it, yeah I guess it won't hurt. The other one I used on Jal.
In post 1071, SafetyDance wrote:That makes sense.
I'm V/LA for <24hrs>48hours if someone has questions for me and wondering why I'm not responding.-
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In post 1189, Mehdi2277 wrote:Are we going play the entire game speaking in hints? The more important thing is do you think cheery is lying and why?
Safety/cheery what do you think of me right now?
You're one of the people speaking in hints. Right now I see yourself, Jal, CD, Jake as having hinted at information and having withheld all or some of it.
Anyway, were getting some counter-claims which is good.
On Cheery, his behaviour hasn't given any indication of it and he's told the truth when as scum he could just have easily said anything else (or nothing at all) but yeah there is the chance that CD could be a role cop or role blocker or some other scum-motivated role. I just don't see it as likely.
Mind you as I mentioned before, I'm not any town power-aligned role, we know they were decided before cards (as per Monopoly preview) so there's at least two tier or power available which suggests mafia have something up their sleeves to compensate. If town and scum can get same power from deeds then having power from cards is not a town tell and I think the deeds pr roles are neutral and the scum have power roles as well as anything from cards.-
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SafetyDance Mafia Scum
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property deed or from a special card?-
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New pages suck. So what is it then Jal, is it a property that's normally on a Monopoly board or are you claiming its something completely different?
We definitely know they do for lynches-
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In post 1203, Jal wrote:Oh wait, hah, I was reading the card wrong. It's a deed.
THAT IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU PLAY THE CANADIAN FORM OF MONOPOLY MOST.
It should be a classic Monopoly board, I don't even know if Med Ave is Park Lane or Mayfair.-
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In post 1208, Cheery Dog wrote:Is it on the board that is pictured in the OP? (which annoys me with the house placement every time I look at it, but I doubt those have any point)
I think we've had 3 claims of picking up cards at the start of today.
Ah, well going to have to bookmark that picture then I think. I didn't even notice the colour difference in the first two properties.-
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In post 1208, Cheery Dog wrote:Is it on the board that is pictured in the OP? (which annoys me with the house placement every time I look at it, but I doubt those have any point)
I think we've had 3 claims of picking up cards at the start of today.
2 claims? I can only remember Jal and Monkey. Jake was claiming he did something last night iirc but not that he got a new card.-
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Exactly, balls of wifom for scum to admit that.
But he backed up my result when he didn't have to and he mentioned he visited you when he didn't have to. It would be far simpler for scum to not say anything.
Because I don't doubt for a second there's lurking scum here holding up their cards and enjoying the conversation whilst working how has what etc-
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In post 1251, Jal wrote:if I were the SK I probably would have left Uber alive so he could hunt down the scummies for me as I sat back on my town cred, rejoiced, and killed town at night and seriously scum hunted during the day. But if cards of the same deck are similar of power and Uber or Baby didn't kill last night, then we probably have two vigs at the very least. By the way, I just realized that the card doesn't specify the type of killing action, but I still don't see why scum would kill Baby Spice.
I feel like I should be voting Medhi for Safety not seeing him go anywhere last nightbut everything keeps else keeps telling me no bleh.
At least one person has claimed to not have any powers at any sort of time. Hmm.
I'm feeling bleh about this game right now.
To be honest, everything else for me is saying the same thing, I just have that contradictive night report to his claim. At the moment fmpov, even if there are better scum suspects I see it a bad thing to just let mehdi as potential scum get into night where the recipe for disaster will be higher.
In post 1233, Jake from State Farm wrote:But given the 2 purples are watcher cards, it's possible that the 2 utility cards have the same ability.
Finally.
Not sure what to think of CD's deed counter claim. I'm not sure if its worse than a no-kill, lying, one-shot doc but it does seem a strange role. I guess it's value would be higher if they got to the end game? I also thought your power CD came from your alignment, not your cards, so does this mean there's no town pr roles before cards? At least with three different people claiming now, someone should get through the night clear.
I disagree that a Vig killed during the night because none of the lurkers are dead. That doesn't seem very pro-town to me.-
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I like that topic Jal linked too. I'm actually surprised myself how much aversion there is to trying to find out why someone died during the night.
If Jal did get a Vig card today then yes its weird because it poses the question of why did UN or BS kill the other one when the person they were arguing the most with is Jal, who just so happens to have gotten the card today?
Also, Cheery, did you think Jal claiming she didn't have 2 cards meant she was claiming only one and not three? If your power only lets you check that someone has 2 or more, isn't it useless? We know everyone has at least 2.
Pedit: CD, Mehdi has claimed he breadcrumbed a role somewhere in his 200+ posts. I also doubt Mafia wouldn't be allowed to night kill. That seems too bastardy.-
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Just as well he came back too. That affirmation that mock-lynching is a bad idea has really helped us. *fistpump*
Cheery, getting power roles solely from cards changes the game, if that's what everything is pointing to now. At least from my perspective, my figuring out was based on what I said in Post #1133. You'd have to wipe off that 1st level of roles. We'd all be just VT or Goon and any abilities come from cards, which to me makes maf look too weak.-
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Vig kill night one is totally randomly. Sure after a scum lynch you more or less have a free shot to aim at whom you will but without any knowledge the pro-town move is to aim at a lurker to limit the passengers coasting through a day and I can't see any vig-related reason for UN or BS to be vigged by anyone other than Jal who has claimed to only have the card today and doesn't strike me as a crime-of-passion type player anyway.
Still if we only get powers from cards, then it could just as well be a scum-vig who killed. Do we know what set the Vig card came from? There could be 2 more of them in the game.
EDIT: Jal, but he could be just a goon like Lurker sans any power cards-
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In post 1369, Lord Mhork wrote:Why is there a giant wagon on mehdi? 0.o
In post 1370, TehBrawlGuy wrote:People like to follow roles blindly without scumhunting or using any logic.
(see: policy lynching millers)
I found two guys who haven't read a thing this day! Ignorance slip *hi5*
In post 1375, MonkeyMan576 wrote:
I got boardwalk, it gives me the vigilante power to kill one player each night. I just got this today so I haven't used it yet.
You're going to have to explain this. A lot better. Today as in 01/17/13 or today as in this current day this mafia game is on?-
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In post 1368, TehBrawlGuy wrote:
Tonally Town, content post-early D1 is Town,1-shot Doc claim is Town. Tracker result is weird, but I'm chalking it up to a roleblocker.
Ya rly?
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p4348301-
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This is annoying. If it wasn't for Mehdi's night action claim then I would totally be up for lynching between Monkey and Jal right now. There's gotta be some bad claims in amongst this and I think this one takes it. AI's play from the start was bad too.
Anyway, there's no rush to hammer, not that I'm adverse to get a lynch out of the way before a deadline, but we need to discuss everything and all permeations because I don't doubt that all tracker/watcher claims are going to get out of the night alive, or at the least not roleblocked so we need to be prepared and make sure we're at least set up so that if anything happens we can catch it. At least take this up coming weekend to discuss everything, I have plenty of thoughts I need to put down and working out to go through as well.
In post 1381, Lord Mhork wrote:Hang on, so is it actually possible the mafia has no killing roles? Is that balanced?
Seriously, where have you been for the last day of play? You're one of the lurkers or coasters here but your reads have looked pro-town, especially on Lurker early on but now you're either claiming stupidity or feigning ignorance. Massive game-play change.-
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This is...crazy.Will need that mod clarification please.
I'm trying to work it out and if Monkey is claiming his slot got a card during the night (after lynch) of once the day started because then that's 3 cards being claimed from lurker who definitely didn't have a vig card because he'd have been saying the same stuff Monkey is now, not trying to claim watcher.
We had assumed before that his claim of getting a new card was during the day, he made no mention of anything then , will have to back track to confirm what was said because it's largely confusing.
Ignoring Monkey's vig claim and looking at Jal then:
If Cheery was telling the truth, because UN didn't visit anyone last night that would mean the card came from Baby who killed UN. So the million dollar question then is why?
Monkey and Jal may have both received vig cards after the day which would mean Baby/UN could have vigged kill the other but I do not think it means that the only way to kill in this game is through the cards. Mafia losing their night kill on top of all the cards town can get it too extreme in my eyes. Mafia need something more to balance it in their favour, not more imbalance.
It's a bit disappointing at the moment we've had no counter-claiming despite the large amount of claims that's happened.-
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In post 1460, Guy_Named_Riggs wrote:~Yes. When MonkeyMan replaced in, I sent him the same PM that I sent Agent_Ireland at the start of the game. Only later did I forget to send in the PM that contained the extra card the slot recieved~at the start of the day phase
That clarifies that up. Itwasat the start of the day, so based on claims we know that all three dead had only 2 cards each.
TBG and CD have as of yet, claimed if those cards have contained any power (leave that for now) but we have Jal and Monkey both claiming to have gotten vig cards. This means that, presuming Baby or UN didn't have both cards, they'd have had one each. If scum killed like they do every game, it means one didn't shoot and one did. Using Cheery Dog's tracking of UN, he didn't go anywhere so that would mean Baby killed UN and UN didn't shoot, whilst scum killed Baby.
That's the scenario I see based on the claims ("facts") we have. Anything wrong with it?
So what questions it leads to is why Baby would have killed UN, why UN didn't shoot anyone (especially after his tunnelling of someone) and why would Baby be a target for scum.
As for not giving scum targets to kill? FFS, we've got 2 watchers, 2 trackers, 2 vigs out in the open, what more could they want?-
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In post 1475, Xisiqomelir wrote:@SafetyDance:
In post 1461, SafetyDance wrote:
TBG and CD have as of yet, claimed if those cards have contained any power (leave that for now) but we have Jal and Monkey both claiming to have gotten vig cards. This means that, presuming Baby or UN didn't have both cards, they'd have had one each. If scum killed like they do every game, it means one didn't shoot and one did. Using Cheery Dog's tracking of UN, he didn't go anywhere so that would mean Baby killed UN and UN didn't shoot, whilst scum killed Baby.
That's the scenario I see based on the claims ("facts") we have.Anything wrong with it?
Plenty.
1. You assume that there is only one scum faction.
2. You assume at least one town vig used their power.
3. You assume that there was no role interference by either scum denial or town protective.
Assuming that the expensive properties actually do give vig powers (this I consider true) I still think that most likely neither vig shot, the SK killed UN and mafia (or only very slightly possibly, a vig) killed Baby Spice.
You forgot one. I'm also assuming everyone is telling the truth.
You seem to be assuming your guess on what exactly? I'm at least looking at everything we have and trying to make a theory out of it, not apply my own theory to the current circumstances.
We have two claimed vig cards with the town who ended dead last night but you think its more likely that a standard SK (with no power from cards) killed rather than two of the people who held the cards? I think you're the one assuming a lot here. A vig can't have killed Baby Spice unless you're claiming Cheer Dog is lying.
We could sit here until next Christmas thinking about who got roleblocked or re-directed but if you know anything by an educated or more on whom it may have been, say so and explain how it breaks down the chain of events.