Mini 619 - Ramen Mafia (Over!)
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Looks the only quirks in the rules here are basically activity requirements. Post every 48 hours, 48 hour nighttimes, and 14 day deadlines? I'd imagine if everybody is as active as the 48 hour posting requirements require, the deadline shouldn't be much of a problem at all.
Vote: Charterbecause he's the unfortunate soul to have posted first.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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This is essentially a constant unspoken rule. There's no debate that a random lynch is, under normal circumstances, better than a no-lynch. When deadline gets exceptionally close, town will behave accordingly.sthar8 wrote:Would it be advantageous to us as a town to create a plurality policy? That is, we agree that at some predetermined time before the deadline (-6 or -8 hours), if there is no consensus we will lynch the person with the greatest number of votes?Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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2 to 4 scum in general, 3 most typically. If Darla said '2/12 chance' then I'd call for a wagon. Unsure about what '1/12' means.charter wrote:
Isn't there normally three scum in a mini? This would suggest there's a 1/4 chance of hitting scum on a random lynch, not the 1/12 like you say.DarlaBlueEyes wrote:A random lynch has a 1/12 chance of hitting scum, which is better than a 0/12.
Its all in the math.
Darla: Clarification here?Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Found a non-random place for my voteaioqwe wrote:I thought my scuminess would get us out of random voting faster and more people would be questioning
Unvote, Vote: aioqwe
Getting out of random is good. If you're pro-town, getting us out of random by making us think you're scum is not good.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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4 votes on MLF is much more pushy than a dice vote deserves, in my opinion. Me thinks there's at least one scum on that wagon, unless there's another reason for voting him that I missed. Aioqwe and windkirby both have pretty crappy reasons for joining a wagon like that.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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charter wrote:Serious now, you're already trying to direct suspicion towards others, hence my vote on you. Not really towards a single person either...
What? 2 people, one of which I'm already voting for.strife220 wrote:Aioqwe and windkirby both have pretty crappy reasons for joining a wagon like that.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Anybody wanna give me the TLDR version of that opening post? I wasn't in PEGBAM, and I got confused/bored after the first few sentences (sorry flameaxe!). Not sure if there's anything useful or if it's all just flavor.
I admit I have no meta here, but this sounds like lying. In the 4 pages thus far you really don't seem like the calculating type. I'd peg you as the type of townie who would just play it as it comes. If I'm completely wrong here, I'd love some meta example of you as town pulling a calculated 'stunt.'aioqwe wrote:We can't necessarily wait for later. I had one game where we dragged on practically random voting the entire game. Especially considering the deadline restrictions, I'd rather not wait for later, get in something a tad scummy so people talk. That makes more chances for the actual scum to slip up.
My vote stands for now. I'm actually dead serious when I say I bet there's scum on that previous MLF-wagon. aioqwe and windkirby's votes were so terribly place, and now charter is crawling up my scum-list.
That's just a plain BS attack. Directing suspicion away from a wagon based off of random voting onto two people highlighted for opportunistic bandwagoning is in no way scummy. You also implied that I highlighted the entire wagon which I didn't. The vote also has an air of OMGUS to it since you were on that wagon.charter wrote:
I'll go ahead and fix this for you.strife220 wrote:4 votes on MLF is much more pushy than a dice vote deserves, in my opinion. Me thinks there's at least one scum on that wagon, unless there's another reason for voting him that I missed. Aioqwe and windkirby both have pretty crappy reasons for joining a wagon like that.
unvote
vote strife
If you're already going to assume that one of four people is scum, I'll just go ahead and assume you're scum.
Serious now, you're already trying to direct suspicion towards others, hence my vote on you. Not really towards a single person either...
He then takes a bit of heat for the the vote, and leads it up with another crappy vote:
Darla clearly stated that her unvote was temporary and promised a re-read before she voted.charter wrote:unvote
vote Darla
For hypocrisy and basically waiting for someone to build a case she can latch onto. (That's how I interpret 'look for anything that really jumps out at me')
That's two crappy votes in a row, worded in a way that made those being voted seem much more scummy than their actions warranted. Charter is my #2 suspect, just below aioque.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Not a whole lot to say today (nor time to say it). Everything I posted yesterday still applies, with slight more confidence in my aioqwe vote.
Would prefer not to have noise conversations in the game for the sake of re-reads though.
I don't see you saying you were going to play this game a bit differently, aioqwe. If you did say this, I'd like to see it.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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I like Darla's post 121 - and not Just because it picks me as town
He's actually right at least. 2 week deadline is actually a fair bit of time given people are actually going to be active. 5 votes on aioqwe is getting too close to a lynch. Decide on a lynch once deadline is really looming.aioqwe wrote:Seriously, do you have any other suspicions or are you just going to badger me all day? Most people try and get a lil' more out of D1 then try and lynch the first person they suspect.
Unvote, Vote Charter
The vote on me was horrible, your vote on Darla was horrible, and your overdefensiveness to me saying 'there's probably scum on the MLF-wagon' implies that I was definitely correct, and possibly even nailed both you and your partner.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Disagree here sort of. Aiowqe's bandwagon had a reason for it, and this game is under 2 week deadlines at all times. Bandwagons have to happen fast, and people need to take that into account when they're looking for scumtells.Oman wrote:Bandwagon grew faster than I'd expect scumwagon to.
"Sort of" being, what about Food's bandwagon? Page 2, 4 votes from using dice to random vote? If you think townie-wagons grow faster than scum-wagons, you must think it's because there is scum on them. Why haven't you invested much interested into the members of said wagon?
In general, I have no clue what the hell kind of conversation is going on between Oman and Muerrto. Muerrto's right about Oman's awkward playing here, yet by the end of the conversation they seem to be buddied up. Clearly Muerrto understands something I don't, and I think Oman seems to be soft-claiming, which I definitely don't like. If either of you are townies I suggest you stop the encoded messages immediately.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Only question of this post?Oman wrote:Final Question for this post:[/b][/u] Is "encoding" messages between two players like this inherently anti-town? If not, why do you disapprove? If so, explain how and whether you think that makes one, or both of us scum?
"Encoding" messages is not anti-town if the two players talking are confirmed townies. If this is the case, then town can ignore what you're saying and trust you.
The problem is, you're not a confirmed townie. Nor is Muerrto. And you shouldn't know each other's alignment - and if you do, your breadcrumbing information to scum while leaving town in the dark. Encoded messages imply that you both know something that we do not (informed minority), which makes town suspicious and paranoid.
Very convincing - I love the "trust me" argument. How are we supposed to know that what you're doing is pro-town?Oman wrote:Note: we're not encoding them. We're talking about something you don't understand. The difference is that what we're doing is not anti-town at all.
Case in point. If you and windkirby are both town, you've struck him with paranoia and distracted him from trying to find scum.Windkirby wrote:Oman is becoming a close second in that category.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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If it's not relevant then why did you say it?Oman wrote:
No. Its irrelevant to the game.strife wrote:ow are we supposed to know that what you're doing is pro-town?
Windkirby, I love you dearly, please don't take this badly but:Strife wrote: Case in point. If you and windkirby are both town, you've struck him with paranoia and distracted him from trying to find scum.
Thats not my problem, nor my fault. If a player is distracted by small simple things, then if its not me, it'll be something else.
If you do something that implies you're informed, and somebody else thinks "Woah... he seems like he could be an informed minority," then it is your fault.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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The fact that you're acting buddy-ish to Muerrto makes it seem like you know something about his alignment. It's strange for two players who Should be suspicious of each other to have a friendly chat.Oman wrote:Because its relevant to our relationship as people.
I am informed, about things that aren't alignments in the game. Where, in my banter with Muerrto, do I say anything about alignments that aren't my own.
WIFOM much?Oman wrote:More to the point, if we were scumbuddies, why the hell would we do this in thread?!
Agree here. This conversation may be interesting later in the game, but for now it's been exhausted and is distractingClockworkRuse wrote:
I don't believe they are acting anti-town right now. Perhaps a little non pro-town if anything. I don't think they are scum though, not yet at least.Oman wrote:Because its relevant to our relationship as people.
I am informed, about things that aren't alignments in the game. Where, in my banter with Muerrto, do I say anything about alignments that aren't my own.
More to the point, if we were scumbuddies, why the hell would we do this in thread?!
Windkirby, reasons on sthar and Oman would be nice.
I really don't know why I said 'definitely' there. Maybe I shouldn't be making posts at 2AM - the sentence "implies that I was definitely correct" is a bit self-contradicting. I should have wrote "reinforces my confidence."charter wrote:Sorry, I posted in the V/LA thread that I was going to be gone and I didn't have time before I left to pm all the mod's of my games... But I'm back now. I don't have much time now, but I went through quickly so I'll address this.
Now you've convinced yourself that you are correct? So according to you, since there's two scum in that four, what order would you lynch them in? Why aren't you arguing to lynch all of them, since you're "definately correct"? You think you know everything, but I can't see how you're so sure that you're right. I agree that the wagon on food was poorly justified, but I think you're reading much too far into it and whatever convinced you that you've already found two scum.strife220 wrote:Unvote, Vote Charter
The vote on me was horrible, your vote on Darla was horrible, and your overdefensiveness to me saying 'there's probably scum on the MLF-wagon' implies that I was definitely correct, and possibly even nailed both you and your partner.
On another note, Sthar8's post 173 is very accurate. Kiwi, Liam, Clockwork, and Food all have fairly unclear opinions and haven't given many contributions to the hunt.
Unofficial vote count:
Aioqwe [2] (Beyond_Birthday, DarlaBlueEyes)
Charter [2] (Sthar8, Strife220)
Melikefood [1] (Aioqwe)
Muerrto [1] (Oman)
DarlaBlueEyes [1] (Charter)
Sthar8 [1] (Windkirby)
Unofficial deadline count: about 7 and a half days.
We got a lot of content for 7 days of play, and I think it's time to start thinking more seriously about a lynch. If we don't have a majority by deadline, we go into no-lynch. As such, I think we should have our lynch target essentially decided at least a few days before deadline, in the situation where a role-claim reverses the wagon. I'd hate to bring a player to L-1 at deadline and have them claim cop without having time to discuss it.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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I think there's plenty of benefit for scum to set a situation where they plan a slow mason-claim or something similar. If they convince town, they get to ride to the end of the game. There's also motivation for one scum to buddy up town town.Oman wrote:Yes, you should probably say it just in case there is any confusion.
My biggest problem with WIFOM is that everyone misuses it. WIFOM only applies when there is an equal benefit. Basically, there is greater benefit to me and muerrto staying hidden as scumbuddies and only makjing cursory attacks on eachother than there is in us buddying up to project a townie look (through WIFOM anyway).strife wrote: WIFOM much?
That is: you're using circular WIFOM logic to make something WIFOM out of nothing.
Beyond_Birthday and Muerrto both have something to say now.
More importantly: I don't think I implied that I thought you and Muerrto were scum-buddies. I do think that the conversation was likely anti-town (if you're both pro-town) and will hold a wealth of information if one of you turns up scum.
And if you are pro-town, please stop saying BS things like:
to justify behaviour. "I always do it" is not an excuse to do anti-town things.Oman wrote:I play strangely sometimes, its part of my meta.
Beyond_Birthday's post 181 is good, and gets across some of my own thoughts nicely.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Page 1 and 2 votes are expected to be crappy and random. After 2 votes get on someone, subsequent votes need to be well justified. You're basically asking me "what's the difference between L-6 and L-3." Kiwi and WK have crappy reasons for putting their votes on late in the wagon.charter wrote:My reread. Don't know how I missed this one before...
The reasons people voted food.strife220 wrote:4 votes on MLF is much more pushy than a dice vote deserves, in my opinion. Me thinks there's at least one scum on that wagon, unless there's another reason for voting him that I missed. Aioqwe and windkirby both have pretty crappy reasons for joining a wagon like that.
Me - his name was first
Oman - "Dice tags are wrong and evil, and you should be killed"
kiwi - "outside of me, his actions seem interesting"
WK - "Not crazy about dicing"
What makes Oman's reason (or mine) any less crappy? You didn't mention Oman, but everyone who voted for Food had a poor reason.
I think the fact that you overreacted to me saying "I think there's scum on the wagon" is indicative that I was right. And... How am I not trying to get you lynched? My vote was first on aioqwe and now my votes on you. What else am I supposed to do, start making stuff up?charter wrote:
So you're still saying that me and another person on that wagon are scum? So I'll ask you again, why aren't you trying to get us lynched? You're voting me, but having made much of a big case on me.strife220 wrote:I really don't know why I said 'definitely' there. Maybe I shouldn't be making posts at 2AM - the sentence "implies that I was definitely correct" is a bit self-contradicting. I should have wrote "reinforces my confidence."
Any reason for you to give votecounts? Any reason for your revised one to be forged? If you added votes wrongly to someone else but me I'd chalk it up to an honest mistake, but since you're gunning just for me, it makes it seem like you want me to appear to have more votes than I do for some reason. Care to share?
The votecount is because I was interested, and because deadline is now looming and we have to start thinking more seriously about who to lynch. Votecount lays out everyone's opinion on that matter.
What do you mean my latter votecount was forged? Are you pointing out how I had to post two? If so, look at the time stamps. My first vote count was made one minute after BB changed his vote, hence the 'crossposting' comment.
I too would like more insight into BB's initial vote on WK. There had to be Some reason, even if you 'forgot it' later.
Windkirby has been on this site for over 4 months and has made almost 400 posts. Kiwi has been on this site for a year and has made over 700 posts. You're offering them a newbie defense?Oman wrote:Strife wrote:"Sort of" being, what about Food's bandwagon? Page 2, 4 votes from using dice to random vote? If you think townie-wagons grow faster than scum-wagons, you must think it's because there is scum on them. Why haven't you invested much interested into the members of said wagon?
Because I don't think that the members on it will give much. I took a look at them and decided it was a much more reasonable and a much more logical strategy to focus on other things which were more reliable. You see, newbies often wagon hard as town or scum, so its less reliable.
What are your feelings on Charter's OMGUS over-reaction to my accusation? Seen here:charter wrote:
I'll go ahead and fix this for you.strife220 wrote:4 votes on MLF is much more pushy than a dice vote deserves, in my opinion. Me thinks there's at least one scum on that wagon, unless there's another reason for voting him that I missed. Aioqwe and windkirby both have pretty crappy reasons for joining a wagon like that.
unvote
vote strife
If you're already going to assume that one of four people is scum, I'll just go ahead and assume you're scum.
Serious now, you're already trying to direct suspicion towards others, hence my vote on you. Not really towards a single person either...
This doesn't make me comfortable. It sounds like a good tactic for Oman to use if he's scum. i.e. you saw him do this as town last game, so if he does it this game, you'll think he's town again.Muerrto wrote:Oman loves gambits. He attacked me for god awful reasons and I SHOULD have seen it since he JUST did this to someone else in my last game with him, but since he targetted me I was like um...dude, those are god awful reasons.
Reinforced here:
You sound awfully confident that you aren't getting played.Muerrto wrote:The reason why I took his advice about Kiwi is because Oman loves gambits. I was basically asking if Oman thought Kiwi was legit about his. He thinks he was. I'm not convinced. His latest posts haven't really tried to do....anything.
And see here:
Oman has moved way up my scumlist. This looks and feels like scum taking a prime opportunity to buddy-up.Oman wrote:
Yeah...I was going to try it again. Which is why I didn't tell them I was doing itMuerrto wrote:Lesson 1 for new people: Don't worry that someone puts ONE vote on you. Had I left Oman alone his gambit to see who would leap onto me for his poor reasons may have caught someone. As it is, I think I killed it.
I can't believe you missed it man, that last newbie I tried pretty much the same gambit and then I was all "OMGWTFBBQ!"Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Just a quick note while I'm at work:
6 days until deadline, can we at least all agree that one of the top 3 should be lynched:
I'd like to see a consensus wagon and a claim within the next 3 days so that we aren't caught with our pants down right before deadline dissecting a claim. At the very least, Food, Liam, Clockwork, and Charter should all have their votes out.Flameaxe wrote: Aioqwe [2] (Beyond_Birthday, DarlaBlueEyes)
Charter [2] (Sthar8, Strife220)
Windkirby [2] (Muerrto, Oman)Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Believe him or not, it's not worth it to lynch him. Town has a lot to gain by having him alive if he's cop, and little to lose (at this stage of the game) if he's lying. It's not like we're in lylo or under immediate pressure.
I was going to say the wagon grew exceptionally fast on WK, but checking the votes it seems he was L-3. A little bit premature, but not much to say about it now.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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If there is another cop (or a 'real' cop and WK's lying) now is definitely not the time to claim.
You're right, I screwed up my vote count. BB switched from Darla to WK, not Darla to you.charter wrote:The only person who changed votes while you could possibly have been posting was BB. He changed his vote to WK, not charter, like you are trying to make others believe.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Still disagree here. Definitely not comfortable with the gambit.Muerrto wrote: What Oman did was bring a weak case on me to see who bit into it. It's not scummy it's called a gambit. Your wagon gained force so fast because you fell into it. Don't. Don't let someone else's case influence your decision, make your own.
Kiwi fell for it? Around Oman's crappy attack, you were attacking Kiwi. All I see is him trying to defend himself from your attacks, he didn't OMGUS and he didn't say anything to agree with Oman.
In fact, the whole scenario confuses me a bit. Re-reading, here are how I see what happened:
Oman attacks Muerrto for a crappy reason
Muerrto says 'that's a really crappy reason'
banter back and forth
Muerrto asks Oman "from experience, what do you think of Kiwi"
Oman says "nah, wagon grew too fast for it to be a scum wagon"
The part missing from this conversation is Kiwi doing something explicitly scummy that played into Oman's gambit. Even so, Oman's "wagon grew too fast to be a scum wagon" doesn't fit in.
Muerrto and/or Oman, clarify here please?
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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@WK: The only general cop rule is don't investigate someone you think is obv-town. Investing shady middle-ground players and investigating more obv-scum both have advantages. I disagree with Charter's statement that you should always investigate the person you see as most scummy.
Like everyone else said, don't let who town thinks is scum influence you.
I've convinced myself over the past few pages that Charter is scum. Kiwi's a good second choicesthar8 wrote:Can we get a quick count on who supports which lynch?Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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Hrm... I was just about to ask for a vote-count
it's 4 days until deadline, so once again, we need to get to wagoning. Kiwi hasn't posted anywhere on MS for 3 days. I'm not sure if he's received 'strikes' yet, but I believe if he goes another 24 hours without posting, he gets modkilled. Even if he returns, he'll have to post every 24 hours or else get his third strike. Correct me if my logic is faulty here, but I see no reason to lynch a player if they're going to get mod-killed anyway.
See rules here:Flameaxe wrote:10) I am requiring all of you to be active. If a player goes without a post for 48 hours, they will receive a prod, as well as one strike. After that prod and strike has been issued, the player will receive another strike for each 24 hour period with no posting.
11) When a player reaches three strikes, they will be modkilled without mercy. This is not helpful to anyone.
So given WK and likely Kiwi are out of the running, that leaves Charter and MLF as the only ones with votes currently. I still like a Charter lynch, as I think he's most likely to be scum. I'm still quite suspicious of Oman, but I'm going on the assumption that he will explain his crappy D1 play (dodging questions, avoiding concrete statements, etc) on D2. MLF looks like generic newbie town to me.
*Edit on refreshing, I see that Aioqwe has only received his first strike, and not two strikes for 72 hours of absence. Presumably the second 24 hour period starts after the prod. I retract what I said about aioqwe until he has received his second strike.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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When I wrote that I assumed Kiwi had a modkill coming up. I apparently do suck at reading the rules, but I wasn't excluding Kiwi's vote.
I didn't know you had two strikes, but even so, I highly doubt you're going to be mod-killed before the day is over. Kiwi still may be (if he goes 2 more days without posting), and if he is, we need to be ready with the lynch. If he does come back, then, like I said, I drop my statements about not having reason to lynch him.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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2 days until deadline, 2 hours until Kiwi gets his second strike. If charter claims something that forces us not to kill him, I really don't know where my vote is going to go. I think we should get him to L-2 or L-1 for a claim pretty soon though, since nobody seems to have a case on why he should live.
Muerrto: You say you've played a few games with Oman as town before. Is he always this seemingly useless? I would have thought someone who posts on this site 12 times a day to be a little more helpful as town.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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Did Kiwi just claim at L-4? I suppose time is of the essence here, but that's a little much.
Well that makes Kiwi either vig or SK. Either way, I guess town can use that to our advantage for today and pick both a lynch-target and direct Kiwi's nightkill. Which means... we have to pick two lynches, and make them both claim before Monday?
@Muerrto: If he does prove to be un-NKable (indirectly, by not getting NK'd), and proves he's got NK-abilitity (by town-directed choices), then we'll know he's either SK or vig. If he's SK, he doesn't need to be lynched until later in the game, and we can use his NK to benefit town. I think that's a pretty good reason to remove a vote.
Since Kiwi isn't mafia (maybe SK) and WK is a terrible lynched (claimed doc), I think we need to get cracking on 2 more lynch choices and (ughhhhh) 2 more claims.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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I'm confused. Charter and Kiwi both have a few votes on them. Why would you jump off one wagon to the other if you think Charter's more likely scum?Oman wrote:Unvote Vote KiwiSimulposted.
This guy is somehow avoiding a modkill, so lets give him a townkill.
NO, I don't buy it, no, I don't think he is more likely to be scum than charter, BUT I feel his has an above average chance of being scum i.e chance > random. So he's optimal if charterwagon don't fly.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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This is approximately my ordering as well. Food's play has been a bit scummy, but I feel there's a good chance he's newbie town. Liam's been contributing very little and has avoided making many concrete statements. Charter is, well, charter.sthar8 wrote:My current suspects are: charter, Liam, food, in that order.
I'd love to see a Charter lynch and a Liam vig.
We have 48 hours now to get everyone's opinion and lynch someone.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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We don't have to reach a majority, we just have to have enough people input opinions and Kiwi to say 'alright guys, I'm going to kill *Person X* tonight.charter wrote:I don't like the idea of the town deciding on your kill. First, there's no way we can reach a consensus. Second, you're letting the mafia influence your kill, hence I think it's plausibe that you're going to kill a townie.
Shouldn't let mafia influence the kill? Mafia influence every kill made in Mafia - that's one of the ways we're supposed to catch them. That's why we discuss reasons for and against lynching a player.
For example:
I suggest (again?) we lynch Charter and have Kiwi NK Liam. Reasons for charter have been explained. Liam stands out to me as a player who has went out of his way to say very little, is perhaps the least active (in terms of words posted) player, making him the lurky-est, and has done little-to-no scumhunting.
No counter-claim on Kiwi's claim from me - I'm not creamy chicken. I think discussing who he should NK is a much more pressing matter than whether or not his claim is believable. His NK ability is easily prove-able, and can be used to town advantage today even if he is SK.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Could you elaborate on this? You mean if we pick a target for Kiwi to off, and scum overlap the kill? This sounds like a big pro-town advantage, since scum would only do this if we chose a townie for Kiwi to kill. Moreover, in some games if two alignments target the same player for a nightkill, the flavor will say something like "Player XXX, shot and stabbed N1" to indicate he was double-killed.ClockworkRuse wrote:Here's my problem with picking Kiwi's target, just so you all know. Mafia could easily decide to NK to make it seem like he was lying and the the NK immune player out of the game. That would really hurt us. That's why it isn't worth following. It's too easily manipulated.
Expect more later.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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I'm actually not trying to turn your words against you. My main reason for voting you is still your reaction to my early day statement, the OMGUS on me, and the weak attack on Darla. I'm legitimately disagreeing with your points here.charter wrote:
Am I the only one noticing strife picked me for scum in the beginning of the game and hasn't dropped it or looked much for anyone else? You stretch everything I say strife to make another argument against me. I don't say he shouldn't let scum influence his kill. I say he can't help it. You in fact took the opposite of what I said and tried to twist it into another argument against me.strife220 wrote:
We don't have to reach a majority, we just have to have enough people input opinions and Kiwi to say 'alright guys, I'm going to kill *Person X* tonight.charter wrote:I don't like the idea of the town deciding on your kill. First, there's no way we can reach a consensus. Second, you're letting the mafia influence your kill, hence I think it's plausibe that you're going to kill a townie.
Shouldn't let mafia influence the kill? Mafia influence every kill made in Mafia - that's one of the ways we're supposed to catch them. That's why we discuss reasons for and against lynching a player.
I still don't understand your point "you're letting mafia influence the kill, and thus will probably kill a townie." Perhaps I'll understand your thought process better if you answer this question: If you were a pro-town vig this game (ignoring the fact that Kiwi has claimed vig), would you use your kill ability tonight, knowing that probability dictates that you'll likely hit a townie?Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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I already addressed this, but I'll do it again. How can mafia not using their nightkill be a bad thing?ClockworkRuse wrote:
Here, I'll chart it out.windkirby wrote:I must say I haven't understood CR's last few posts... I don't get the point he's trying to make with the vig-scum-nkill-whatever deal.
But anyway, even if kiwi is lying or is an SK, we might as well save him for a bit later. After all, if he is SK, he's after the mafia, too...
Town - Alright Vig, kill X.
Vig- Okay.
Night comes around.
Vig nk's X
Mafia no kills.
The next day, mafia puts blame onto vig saying he faked claimed to try to get rid of the NK immune vig.
What alternative do you suggest - that we just assume Kiwi is telling the truth and keep him around until end-game? Let him vig/SK unclaimed people who have confirmable roles?Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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Oman, your semi-claim isn't helping anything. You're not giving enough information to convince anyone (presumably including Kiwi) to agree with you. For the like 4th time, the "trust me" argument fails.
Given it's a day until deadline, I'll say let Kiwi live, and he gets his own choice, since so few people are contributing to the direction.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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Bolded = mine. Huh? Did I miss something? Did you mean WK (claimed doc)?sthar8 wrote:I currently support a choice between Liam, Oman, and no-kill for you, but if you reason well enough, I could probably accept any kill butClockwork.
Charter, I assume you don't have a claim that is going to reverse the wagon (else you would have done so), but you might as well claim anyway.
If Kiwi is going to make his own decision (which seems to be the guaranteed case), I suggest he keep it to himself, or he says it with enough time left in the day for said NKee to claim.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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Unvote
Full claim Charter: name and flavor.
We have a claimed cop, doc, and a NKimmune vig. If 3 of them are telling the truth (and there's no funny business to their roles) we're just about of power roles for a regularly balanced mini.
I'm at a loss. I'd much rather have a chance at hitting scum today than lynching the SK/vig - the night could tell us a lot about his alignment.
I'm having a harder time believing Charters claim, heavily due to lack of flavor, but I'm still not willing to risk lynching the cop though.
With the top 3 'scummiest' all claimed, this is a good time to lynch based on lack of contribution. In order, CallMeLiam, BeyondBirthday, and Clockworkruse have posted the least. I'm going toVote: CallMeLiambut will do whatever it takes to get a lynch off at deadline (like 18 hours away).Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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If Liam flips beef, I think Kiwi should NOT target him tonight. This will mean he's scum, but he's scum that Wants to be targeted by a NK for some reason. Kiwi should vig/SK someone else, and we lynch Oman tomorrow if he's lying.
If Liam flips scum, I think Kiwi should definitely target OmanLimited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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EBWOP:
I'm no ramen expert (we actually don't have it in Canada), but aren't there more than one kinds of beef flavor? Liam and Oman, double check your role PMs - definitely don't want to hear a BS "ooh... I was Spicy beef, not just beef... my bad" explanation tomorrow.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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Ah... never knew that about the 48 hour clock reset.
Yea Kiwi was modkilled- serial killer.
If he came up as a NK immune vig, I was going to have serious sanity questions on our cop. This makes me more comfortable with investigation results.
I'm going to assume that we don't have a vig, else they would have NK'd Kiwi (though Kiwi may be NK-immune). Which means that the kill on Oman came from Kiwi or scum. Given that Kiwi was creamy chicken and Oman was creamy lover (or w/e), I really doubt Kiwi targeted Oman.
So, why did scum target Oman instead of a claimed cop or doc? I really know know... but I'm still not interested in a Charter or WK lynch today. Depending on what Muerrto claims, a mass-claim may be in order to get a better hold of the situation. We're soon going to run out of likely non-vanilla roles.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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I'm still feeling a mass-claim. We have an outed doc and cop, a dead jack-of-all-trades, and presumably no vig. 3 power-roles is a lot of town power, and has to be balanced either by lots of scum-power, or by misleadingly weak town-power (insane cop, millers, etc.).
I'd like to hear everyone's input on why this is or isn't a good situation to mass-claim. I think it's good because our typical strongest powers are out, and unless there's a counter-claim out there for cop and doc, scum already have plenty good choices for NK.Limited access, Aug 29 - Sept 3-
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strife220 Mafia Scum
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