Team Mafia: Pick Your Power (Game Over)

[Amrun]

Just to clarify, Danny Dipietro and Spyrex cannot be both scum. The same is true for faraday and slaxx.

Unlike Grey, I don't think scum would pick the same numbers on purpose.

Assuming this, then only one or less players in these following groups can be scum.

Hoopla
Amrun

Super Smash Bros. Fan
Debonair Danny DiPietro
Spyrex

Lady LambdaDelta
Papa Zito
Faraday
Slaxx


Similar but slightly different to Papa Zito's list.

[Amrun]

>.> SpyreX's list. My bad.

Anyway, here's another list I've compiled including everyone and not just those picking non-unique numbers.

Kise

PranaDevil

GreyICE

quadz08

Hoopla
Amrun

Super Smash Bros. Fan
Debonair Danny DiPietro
Spyrex

Lady LambdaDelta
Papa Zito
Faraday
Slaxx

[Amrun]

LLD, I don't know yet as the game just started.

GreyICE is acting oddly, though.

[Amrun]

His opening post is lacking in logic, which is unusual for him, imho. It's already been commented n several times.

In fact:

VOTE: GreyICE

My vote might as well be doing something.

[Amrun]

I have no stances!

I prepared those lists pre-game before anyone posted anything.

Give me YOUR stances, LLD.

You know who is scum on page 2 when likke half of the playerlist has posted? Bully for you. I don't.

[Amrun]

Grey essentially is an RVS vote.

He seems to stand out the most to me as of yet, so I voted. By no means am I sure he is scum.

I like to wait until everyone has posted before deciding on alignments with any amont of conviction.

[Amrun]

I'm not apologizing for not having solid reads on page 1-2.

Dealwithit.jpg

[Amrun]

I guess it depends on your definition of RVS.

It isn't a truly serious vote.

Grey is acting oddly. I haven't decided yet if that means scummy or just oddly.

I decided to stick a vote on him because I wasn't voting anyone and for pressure.

I didn't do a "hey, hello, wassup" vote because there was already content being posted so what is the point?

[Amrun]

And in my experience, grey does not take wagons seriously unless they start to grow a bit and I wanted his reaction, which is basically ruined now.

I still have no firm scumreads and I don't care if that makes me scum supposedly.

But this mini wagon on me has already been useful, reads-wise, better than the grey wagon, which is good.

P-edit: I do have reads, they are just not concrete. And I have no significant scumreads. I don't seee the merit in sharing my townreads so I won't.

[Amrun]

I just don't find reads this early that useful when it's not even guaranteed any scum at all are posting.

[Amrun]

Well, basically the only thing I got from the grey wagon was that SpyreX was probably town.

So far, I have flip-flopped on LLD a couple of times, currently null leaning scum, mostly on gut and for pushing what I think is a terrible case. However, someone has said that type of aggression from her is townish, so I will take a look at her meta when I get the chance.

Faraday seems townish so far, too.

Once again, it is quite possible that EVERYONE currently posting is town. That's why I think this is all an exercise in futility.

[Amrun]

I giggled a little, I have to admit.

[Amrun]

Six was the most commonly selected number last draft.

Ergo, scum decided to double pick six on the logic that in no PYP game ever have scum doubled up on numbers. They got outwitted by two townies picking six as well. Therefore 2/4 6 picks are scum.

Vote: LadyLambdadelta

Start at the top, work your way down.

And yet you call GreyICE scummy for this alone. One post in isolation.

[Amrun]

Congratulations!

Scummy=/= scum.

If you payed attention to what I wrote, I said that inklings can be gained and ideas can be formed. But having CERTAINTY is something that cannot be achieved.

But you don't read. Or rather, you selectively read.

I'm not trying to say you said scum. Just pointing out that you're walking a fine line of contradiction here, splicing hairs to call someone else scummy for something you have been very close to doing yourself several times.

[Amrun]

Congratulations!

Scummy=/= scum.

If you payed attention to what I wrote, I said that inklings can be gained and ideas can be formed. But having CERTAINTY is something that cannot be achieved.

But you don't read. Or rather, you selectively read.

I'm not trying to say you said scum. Just pointing out that you're walking a fine line of contradiction here, splicing hairs to call someone else scummy for something you have been very close to doing yourself several times.

Fine, I see your point.

But the fact remains that I maintain a clear distinction between "You are SCUM" and "You're acting scummy". They seem VERY similar, but they are entirely different.

One is MUCH more certain than the other.

And one, in my opinion, cannot be determined from a single post. The other can.

For scum, yes. For town, it can be a little different sometimes.

That being said, I don't see what is giving Faraday that amount of confidence in Slaxx. I am even-keeled null on Slaxx myself.

[Amrun]

For the record, I put up my personal numbers speculations for use later in the game, not for use right now.

[Amrun]

I didn't say everyone here WAS town. I said it was possible. As it is, I do not think that is the case.

I think it is most likely that LLD is scum out of the currently active posters. I've re-read the game so far, as short as it may be, several times now, and I keep coming back to her. Her attacks on me seem forced and I sense some internal conflictions in her reasoning. I was a little wary of this feeling at first, wanting to make sure it wasn't just an annoyed OMGUS coloring my perception, but I'm certain it is more than this, now.

My teammates agree, too.

Also, it has come to my attention that LLD favors scum roles, which makes me suspect her more, since if her team drew a scum role, I could totally see her taking it.

I still want to see Grey's reaction to the suspicion on him, but I cannot justify keeping my vote on him when I legitimately suspect LLD.

VOTE: LadyLambdaDelta

IGMEOY: GreyICE

[Amrun]

I liked sss's points on LLD, but the way he backed off of me was strange. It's sort of like he wants to go with the crowd ... but then that doesn't add up with the rest of his post. So idk.

[Amrun]

A teammate told me but I am not sure how much detail I am allowed to go into.

It is possible that information is flawed. It is only what I have been told.

[Amrun]

You are getting far too emotional for unfounded accusations.

I just told you the source. I assumed my teammate was right, but I should have checked. I far from based a case on it, though.


And no, please learn to read more closely. I didn't refrain from voting for you bevcause it might have been called OMGUS.

I refrained because it might have BEEN OMGUS. Key difference. And as I said earlier, I kept flip flopping on you.

When my team agreed that they thought you were scum, it was enough to tiip me over the edge.

[Amrun]

I didn't want to accuse LLD of being scum if I just wanted her to be scum and was confirmation biasing it to be true in my mind.

I don't see how that is rocket science.

I want to post something about LLD's "debunking" of sss case but computer overheated. More later.

[Amrun]

Several misreps on the "case" on me from LLD. Will respond properly when on computer.

[Amrun]

First off, could you sit on the fence any harder SSBF?

LLD is scum because she attacks Amrun! But she makes good points~!

Amrun is scum for the points LLD made~

Seriously, bro?


3) Uh, SSBF? Do you know how to read? Maybe you should read the repeated posts where I not only denounce GI's Logic, but also call him scum.

FURTHERMORE, the GI post wasn't a read based on a single post like Faraday's was. It was a setup speculation read.

So the situations are entirely different ANYWAY, and your connection and "contradiction" isn't actually there.

I agree with the first part.

The second part is not true at all; the GI read WAS based on a single post. Because that one post contained some set-up speculation disproves your point more than proves out.

This is an old post that was in my browser so while I get caught up/post on more important things, I might as well post this.

[Amrun]

The rest of it I didn't want to comment on.

I should have noted that I did so, though. My apologies.

[Amrun]

Personally, I did not go through the other games and what was chosen and I don't think my teammates did either. We did try to choose a strategic number, though.

[Amrun]

Kise is giving me the same feel he did in Naruto mafia, where he was scum. Need to check if he does that as town, too.

Prana: If what you're saying is true, why would I isolate myself and Hoopla as a group possibly containing 1 scum? What is the scum motivation there?

[Amrun]

Sorry, guys, been busy and restricted to phone posting until now.

So far, Amrun has done the following:

10 Good Reasons Why Amrun is Scum

1)Posted Setup Speculation in an attempt to look more town.

I posted set-up speculation as an attempt to HELP the town. Point #1 suffers from confirmation bias; the action of me posting lists that were compiled to help myself scumhunt to make them public is actually null. I would only want to "look more town" if I was scum, but if I was town, this wouldn't be the case. Therefore, it is circular reasoning and can't be used to call me scummy because it's only scummy if I AM scum, which I'm not.

2)Voted GI based on an apparent scum read, then backtracked when pressured, stating it was an RVS vote

Once again, this is simply a difference in the use of the term "RVS." I wikid it after this exchange and I was the one using the term farther from its standard use. My point is that it was simply a misunderstanding and I already explained what I actually meant. You are choosing to ignore it.

3)Stated that she had no reads in the game currently when pressured, but then votes GI based upon a scum read.

Once AGAIN, I didn't know if GI was simply acting oddly or acting scummy, but decided to put my vote there so it would do SOME good. This is not exactly a scumread.

4)States there is sufficient content in the game that RVS is not needed, but refuses to generate a read from said content. (If there was enough content, she should have a scum lead)

There was enough content for my vote to be doing something useful - in this case, pressuring GreyICE. What good would have been something like, "Vote LLD. Hey, nice to play with you again!" at that stage of the game? None. Though my reads were still wavering, the gamestate was not one that would have benefited from RVS. I do not know why this is so hard to understand.

5)States that wagon on her has "given her good reads, and better reads than the GI wagon". SpyreX asks her to elucidate, and she provides the suggestion that "everyone currently
posting could be town". This is obvious appeasement and attempt to dismantle her wagon.

No, this is an obvious attempt to misrep me. When SpyreX asked me to elucidate, I gave the specific reads that the wagons had given me, even sharing my townreads which I had previously been reluctant to do. I also said that I didn't think such read lists were useful until a point in the game when everyone was participating, since it was statistically possible that everyone participating was town, though I by no means suggested that everyone participating actually WAS town. I don't believe they were, but that doesn't change the fact that it was statistically possible.

6)Until SSBF posted his case, Amrun was VERY quiet about attacking me. The second SSBF posts his case, Amrun agrees with him and proceeds to vote him. Never does she state on what points she agrees with him or why she does. She simply sheeps his case and votes me.

That is not true at all. I expressed suspicion of you before SSBF did, and my decision to vote you had NOTHING to do with SSBF. SSBF doesn't look good to me precisely because he attacked you while agreeing with your points on me - does not make sense. That did not change my independent scumread on you, which I had taken to my Team Mafia QT and asked their opinions on since I wasn't sure. When they agreed that you looked scummy, it gave me enough confidence in the read for a vote.

7)The only reasoning provided for the vote on me is META and GUT. There are NO FACTS or INTENT reads in the case. It's based on "Lambda seems forced" and "My team says Lambda likes Scum PMs".

Once again, not true. I think the accusations you've fielded about contradiction have merit, and you even conceded a point on the matter to me. I think you're trying to call people scummy for things you are basically doing yourself, then finding some arbitrary difference about it after the fact to claim contradiction.

"Seems forced" isn't gut at all. Your. posts. seem. forced. That is something ABOUT YOUR POSTS that I find scummy.

And someone on my team did say that you preferred scum roles. I should have verified that, and I didn't, but that was not the basis of my vote on you at all. What was significant about their input is that they shared my read and 4 heads are better than 1.

)Amrun blatently LIES about a meta read on me, in an attempt to build a stronger case on the next biggest wagon besides his own, and sheep SSBF further. (The meta was proven false
when I posted the CYS link, a game in which I was able to choose my alignment and chose TOWN.)

I was simply repeating what had been told to me. I should have verified. I didn't. Lesson learned. Either way, not a lie. I believed it to be true.

9)Amrun states DIRECTLY that she was afraid that if she voted me earlier, it would be OMGUS. This is not a town thought. Town votes their scumspects regardless of "OMGUS" claims.

You still don't get this. I don't give a fuck who tells me my vote is OMGUS or bad or what have you. I DO care if my vote is actually on scum. You have done some things that strike me townish and some that strike me scummy. My read on you kept wavering, and you were annoying me, and I wanted to make sure that wasn't influencing my read on you. So I took it to my team. They are totally objective, not sharing my annoyance, and their agreement with my read was what I needed.

10)Amrun BACKTRACKS on both her meta claim and the OMGUS accusation. In the case of the Meta Claim, she blames FALSE INTEL GIVEN TO HER BY HER TEAM.

I did not backtrack on the OMGUS. You just refuse to try to understand what I am saying, instead interpreting it in your own special snowflake way.

I did go back on my word about the meta, because I was wrong. It's not actually a backtrack, and perhaps you should look up that word. I admitted that I made a mistake.


This is a post I've been meaning to make for awhile. I disagree with every single point, as noted above.

That being said, I (and my team) have re-evaluated, and I'm not as sure on my LLD read. I keep looking at the wagon and who's on it with me and it does not make me feel like a confident, happy camper.

UNVOTE: LadyLambdaDelta
VOTE: SSBF

I've re-read it several times, and I still can't get over that one contradictory post.

Grey, why should SSBF's lurking deter you from voting there? Why are you acting so differently this game than I've seen you before? Do the other players intimidate you?

[Amrun]

Zito, please quote and point out my supposed backpedaling. I have pointed out how and why I have not done this already.

[Amrun]

What does your second sentence mean.

Yes, you blame your poor teammates, I get that.

So, you are talking of the thing about LLD's meta.

I am not blaming anyone but myself. A teammate of mine said it, but I did not bother to check before posting it in a game. That is my fault.

It's not really "backpedalling" in the context it is normally used on this site. I asserted something based on faulty information, and when I was made aware that the information was faulty, I corrected my mistake in order to base my conclusions on fact.

[Amrun]

Well, we're at an impasse, then and I'll leave it alone.

[Amrun]

So that's your only response to my breakdown of your points against me?

Is that admitting that all your other points are crap?

[Amrun]

I think your reasons are the not-so-great ones, LLD.

[Amrun]

DDD, your lack of scumhunting is severely concerning me. It is unlike the last time I played with you.

What is beetlejuice?

[Amrun]

That might be L-1, because I don't think the mod had Kise voting and he is...

Ugh, great.

Please, no one hammer without a claim.

[Amrun]

I didn't notice it until just now when I double-checked, zoraster.

Okay, compiling an L-1 post... Not a great day in mafia for me.

[Amrun]

It will.

I can claim immediately if people swear not to hammer me until I have my final thoughts up. I just didn't want to risk it.

[Amrun]

Fuck it. My possibly final long post will take awhile and I don't want to keep people up.

But please, do not hammer yet. I am not ready. I want to leave the town with more than this after I am gone.

I am a gunsmith. I was ecstatic to get the role and decided to go for a role that needs some longevity to be useful precisely because I have never been lynched early.

Now that I am claimed, the role's usefulness is cut drastically, which is unfortunate.

[Amrun]

If Faraday gets on before I complete my post, I have the following questions for him:

-In your own words, why do you think I am scum?

-Who else do you think is scum, and why?


I also want to know why Kise thinks I'm scum, and if DDD has any thoughts of his own on me that aren't parrots of LLD and any other thoughts on the game at all.


Working on the real post.

I was honestly surprised I got gunsmith. I considered going for n3 vig because it was safer I thought but decided to go for broke because I think gunsmith is a really cool role and I've never had it before.

p-edit: My team and I thought there were several other better roles, such as role cop, that would go first.

[Amrun]

The you was directed at Faraday, but I would like you (Spyre) to answer as well.

And yes, my team thought role cop would go over gunsmith. We did realize going for gunsmith at six was ballsy but we went for it anyway and it paid off.

[Amrun]

Yes, answer the questions I asked Faraday.

[Amrun]

Spyre, I didn't address it to you originally for a reason. How about just who else you think is scum? That's better for you.

What about "my OMGUS thought process," Faraday?

And what do you mean by post #265?

p-edit: Read his post, Faraday.

[Amrun]

I do. I just wanted you to make a nice concise list for me.

I didn't ISO you before I asked you questions and this is what I get. >.> I ISOed the others to make sure I remembered what they said and attributed it properly.

[Amrun]

Do you know who my team is? I wasn't aware it was public.

That's a stretch either way, Faraday.

[Amrun]

How do you know my team? It's not public at all.

[Amrun]

But the identity of my team has nothing to do with my motivations for choosing gunsmith. I like the role and I chose it and crossed my fingers. There was more analysis than that that led up to it, but in the end, that is all that matters.

[Amrun]

We did. Apparently your team was better at it than ours. We still have a couple of unkown teams.

[Amrun]

Faraday, I think your team's teamhunting is off, because I have a very ballsy player on my team.

Trying to get post up before I sleep.

[Amrun]

>.> SpyreX's list. My bad.

Anyway, here's another list I've compiled including everyone and not just those picking non-unique numbers.

Kise

PranaDevil

GreyICE

quadz08

Hoopla
Amrun

Super Smash Bros. Fan
Debonair Danny DiPietro
Spyrex

Lady LambdaDelta
Papa Zito
Faraday
Slaxx

So after game play today, here's what I'm thinking.

For me to successfully get gunsmith, AT LEAST ONE, but possibly two, of the people above me have to be scum.

I don't think Hoopla is scum. It's unlikely she'd have chosen a cop-type role as either alignment, though, because as I recall, she hates them.

One to two of the other 4 though is scum, though. My picks for scum from this group are Kise and one of PranaDevil / GreyICE.

My pick for the other scum, assuming there are 3, is either one of Super Smash Bros. Fan / DDD or one of Faraday / Zito. More likely, it is one of SSBF or Faraday or SSBF AND Faraday.

Independent of numbers, here are my base reads:

Scum

Kise
Faraday
GreyICE
Super Smash Bros. Fan
Debonair Danny DiPietro
PranaDevil
Papa Zito
Lady LambdaDelta
Slaxx
quadz08
Hoopla
SpyreX

Town

Give or take a couple of slots up and down.

More to come on the top portion of my list.

[Amrun]

Kise

It's actually difficult to explain my Kise read, because it's all based off of his 2 posts and the majority of it is tone.

I have played with Kise scum before and he acted all macho aggressive just like this, ESPECIALLY in early game when he thought he could get away with it.

First and foremost, I would like to state my driving force here is to play for points > everything. Interestingly enough, I would also imagine scum here - and in every TM game - would want to secure points for their team > a simple win. If you're scum here and you're not on any possible mislynches, oh well. Stay scared, and stay behind my team in the rankings.

This part of his first post really struck me as off. I can't really say why; there's nothing textbook wrong with it, but I don't see the town motivation for posting this. "I'm going to be playing the way scum would - but it's not because I'm scum!"

He then tries to mix it up with the numbers talk but he's late to the game and doesn't say anything new or useful.

He makes some points on me, mostly parroted, but one original.

He clears Faraday on grounds of meta and speaks cryptically to him. I could see a possible connection here, but it's far too early to say, really.

@SpyreX: No. Don't even give SSBF a pass to Six Flags. He and Amrun placed 6th and 7th in the draft.

Their scumteam likely lucked out and became goons.

It's a very plausible idea that scum would scramble to save each other and shoot down early scumreads against their own partners, knowing that town overpower them.

Just finished page 5 but I need to run.

What is he even saying here? It seems like he's stretching to draw some sort of connection between us in any way possible.

Overall, it's really tone that makes me keep coming back to Kise. I've never hung a case on this before and I'm surprised to do it now, but something in my gut is telling me there's something here. Last time I played with him, I had a similar feeling and I let him live in the lower parts of my scumreads, going after more explainable lynches and leaving Kise scum alive.

More coming.

[Amrun]

So the meat of my post is currently stuck in my frozen browser. Yay.

[Amrun]

Faraday

I liked his early play. It seemed logical.

Later on in the day, he simply kept repeating my name, misspelled, over and over again. This is not content and it is not scumhunting. He's relying almost exclusively on meta, including team-meta, to make his decisions and this strikes me as off.

He doesn't explain anything; he clears people as town and he doesn't say why; he calls people scum and doesn't say why.

SSBF comment on the issues at hand. Thanks. You can catch up later. I want your thoughts on Amrun's claim.

Like in this post, he demonstrates that he's not reading carefully. For someone who says he is in "go, scumhunting" mode, he hasn't done much of it, and none of it original. He clearly doesn't even read the thread properly, which I don't think town professing such interest would actually do.

Again, there's not a lot I can point to and say, "This is a scumtell." It's feeling and emotion in the posts that don't strike me as the excited person he claims to be, at least not in the way he claims.

In addition, my teammates also have an off feeling about it. None of us are really sure, but that's how I'm feeling about it and I want it out there.

GreyICE

Perhaps Grey should have been above Faraday, perhaps even above Kise. Don't take the order too seriously.

Basically every post of GreyICE's is designed to take himself out of the pool of suspicion. He starts in his opening post:

Six was the most commonly selected number last draft.

Ergo, scum decided to double pick six on the logic that in no PYP game ever have scum doubled up on numbers. They got outwitted by two townies picking six as well. Therefore 2/4 6 picks are scum.

Vote: LadyLambdadelta

Start at the top, work your way down.

He backtracks on this in his next post.

My post on the numbers was a ridiculous idea I kicked about. The scum habit of choosing low/middle/high in reasonably even spacing was very apparent from games 2-4, as was their 'we never double up' meta. If they decided to double up, the number 6 wasn't a bad one.
...
I think doubling is possible this game. Though it's probably safer to assume that scum aren't in the 6s, and let the goon cop/gunsmith figure things out.

He distances himself from his own idea, which has been attacked, and backpedals completely, saying doubling is merely possible, but it's safer to assume it hasn't happened. This is not a good post, but I didn't read it carefully enough the first time around.

The graph also annoys me because I don't find the information in it to actually be very useful at all. It took a lot of effort and is very shiny, but it doesn't tell us anything we didn't know or would ever need to reference again.

The GreyTown I know puts all of his effort into scumhunting and half the time can't be arsed to explain his reads despite pushing them heavily and calling everyone else idiots for not seeing it. He does NOT waste his effort making graphs about nothing and doing no original scumhunting.

I: First post was terribad, when you look at his iso he has failed to comment on anything game related besides the main wagon. Definitely not the aggressive Grey I know, and the setup speculation works as a good guise for actually looking helpful. Doesn't work with amrun scum, but still works with SSBF scum.

The 'aggressive Grey you know' was from Camden, our completed game together. I was a mafia goon.

I need a good solid scum lead before I start the pressure, and Amrun may or may not be it. I'd love to push SSBF because based on team composition I think he has a better than fair chance to be scum, but he's lurking. Other than that, this game contains:

Debonair Danny DiPietro
Faraday
Hoopla
SpyreX

All are very good scum players. And the only one I have a solid town read on is SpyreX. I do have another read though... Hoopla is somewhat scummy. Her soft defense of Amrun is reasonably damning, since if Amrun is town, she falls under greater suspicion due to the doubled number theory. Therefore it would be in scum-Hoopla's best interests to have town-Amrun live as long as possible.

In addition her 'lynch a unique number' theory ignores the fact that the scum either have to kill unique numbers that are town (thus solving the problem) or deal with the fact that most of the singles, with only 4, will have power roles. While one of us might have doubled up, it's unlikely that two did.

So, of course.

Vote: Slaxx

No one's paying attention to you, and this bothers meeeeeeeeeeee[/quote]

This post is of note for several reasons. First, Grey again tries to focus attention on people in groups. Since he's an independent number, if he can get people to focus on the interactions of people in number groups, this benefits him.

Also, he is quick to try and discredit Hoopla, who is the only person advocating that we lynch unique numbers. Guess who's a unique number? Grey.

And then that vote on Slaxx. It's terrible! I've NEVER seen GreyICE make such a terrible vote, regardless of alignment, but certainly not as town. He says he wants to vote SSBF, but SSBF is lurking? No, he was not lurking. And it's straight bullshit what he tells Slaxx about aggressive Grey being a scumtell: he's even MORE aggressive as town!

Sorry, this town is rife with leaders. I'm not going to be one here, so I'm going to be poking into things my own way. If you want me to be leadering, you better get me a different game, because it's a hundred years too early for me to be telling this crowd what to be doing.

What is this humble pie from Grey? It's AtE and I do not like it.

This is not the Grey I'm used to seeing, and I don't think he's been truly intimidated out of his playing style. I think he's faking it, and it shows through when he starts to get angrier - which is, of note, when more people start advocating lynching high unique numbers.

Browser recovered this, thank goodness. One more post to finish up, I think. Want to get this off before I lose it again.

[Amrun]

Had a quote mess-up in that wall, but it's still followable.

I don't really have a lot to say about the others on the list that I haven't said. SSBF's initial contradiction is still scummy, though his explanation of it appeased me somewhat.

DDD is still giving me bad vibes.

Prana's most recent posts are bad. He seems a bit desperate to have the lynch go through on me, but he's also acting as if he has made some spectacular case on quadz, which he has not even come close.

Zito not feeling great about either, but he's not scum with Faraday. If Faraday turns out to be town, Zito will need to be looked at again.


My cases are surprisingly paltry for what I normally have so far in a game, and that shows me that I am in a game with good players, which would please me if I wasn't unlikely to be out of the game very soon. I still have quite a bit of the learning curve to climb, obviously, but it's been a pleasure nevertheless.

Upon reviewing my own cases, I've decided that the Grey case is more substantial than the Kise case. My FEELING on Kise is stronger, but the evidence is better for Grey, which is a more productive vote anyway.

UNVOTE: SSBF

VOTE: GreyICE

[Amrun]

Amrun dies.

Today.

No excuses.

She's probably the scum's only POwer Role.

SSBF dies tomorrow.

This is probably the worst logic I've seen all thread.

SCUM GETS ONE POWER ROLE

CHOOSES GUNSMITH

HERP DERP

[Amrun]

Are you sheeping me, Grey?

[Amrun]

If I was the highest scum number in the draft, it makes absolutely zero sense for me to pick gunsmith. That's pretty amusing, actually.

[Amrun]

LLD, the logic doesn't make sense.

And Kise: in one of your posts, you said I had not mentioned SSBF's post before what you quotted. That is patently untrue. I talk about it more in thhat same post, and also in an entirely different post right after SSBF's post occurred.

[Amrun]

Grey, my vote on you has nothing to do with numbers.g

[Amrun]

Are you not going to claim, Grey?

I could definitely bite on a Faraday wagon, but then there's Grey, and it's unlikely they're both scum.

[Amrun]

I was right about you, Faraday. :3

I had an innocent on DDD before I died.