Flash Mafia: You won!

[a girl on the internet]

ready to rock! ^^

[a girl on the internet]

Yeehaw, time to lynch all liars:

Vote: A girl on the internet

>_<

meanie

Well, this is certainly stupid. Mufasa is at lynch-2 and it's not even page 3. I mean, I suppose I should be happier that stuff is happening, but this is just silly.

vote: RayFrost

for putting the fifth vote on and

Suspect: spyrex and pomegranate

for similar opportunism.

do you think there was a real risk of Mufasa being lynched that early??

I don't agree with mike on the opportunism bit.

p. obvious you won't agree when you're the one he's voting

tajo - moderately scummy

why's that?

You know that whole "lynch me" swapping to "look at all this discussion I'm generating"

Yea.

That can go LOS ROPOS.

totally.

Vote Ray Frost

After a quick read, Ray is top scummy.

gonna get so confuzzled with the snow girls if they keep sharing opinions too <_<

rofl, ray & crypto give me warm fuzzies. mbf & mufasa don't.

vote: mufasa

[a girl on the internet]

a girl voting mufasa at this point - me no like

that's funny, cuz i don't like your ray vote. that's a dumb wagon.

i don't really like my mufasa vote either if he's being replaced tho.

Pome, at first I thought posts 63 and 64 were a doublepost but why did you change this between these two posts?

good catch, that is weird.

unvote, vote: snow bunny

cheering the ray wagon from the sidelines + srs wishy-washyness on mufasa = scummy.

[a girl on the internet]

AGOTI, why is the Mufasa wagon dumb?

it's not. the ray wagon is the dumb one. he's clearly town.

Also what do you feel about having an L-2 on page 5?

warm and tingly. ^_^

means we're gettin stuff done. sides, page numbers are not a useful measure of anything ever. L-2 is good or bad dependin on the reasons for it, not cuz it's on pg 2 or pg 200.

lyncher jester jesters jesters jester jester

-_-

@AGOI. Calling me SW is fine.

it's not what to call you that's the prob, it's remembering the diff when i'm readin. idk, i'll figure somethin out.

@AGOI why is the Ray wagon stupid?

cuz he's obv town.

CONTRADICTION AGOI.
You state you do not like the mufasa wagon post 105.

no i didn't. i said i didn't like my vote on mufasa, cuz he was being replaced. the mufasa wagon was a good wagon. but not so much any more.

while mufasa was around, it pressured him to explain himself. but all we're ever gonna get from his replacement is "no idea what mufasa was thinking, soz guys". pressure's not gonna change that, so there's much better things we could be doin instead, like lynching snow bunny. k?

In the same post you berate Snow Bunny for have a “wishy washy attitude” toward Mufasa. So you think she should just find him innocent? Or vote him?

either one would be fine, yeah. not having an opinion is fine too. it's suspish that she uses so many words to say so tho. like, what separates him from all the peeps she just plain didn't mention? they're neutral too, right? and bringin third parties into it is even worse.

[a girl on the internet]

Oh, one thing I noticed and I don't think anyone has pointed out, is that prozac refused to place a vote right before snow bunny refused to place a vote and everyone jumped on snow bunny, and nobody said anything about prozac. I would like to know what the difference is. I only mentioned snow bunny because I didn't like her third party comment... but on the field of not voting, snow bunny should not be mentioned without mentioning prozac.

you're right, prozac is def scummy too. specially that L-1 vote, it's totally at odds with the whole cautious persona he's been playin most of the way thru.

unvote, vote porochaz

[a girl on the internet]

Lastly, and i really hope i dont end up with egg on my face with this, if RayFrost is ScumRayFrost, VT is a really shitty fakeclaim.

^ town

[a girl on the internet]

@agoti:
What? You're one of the people who jumped on snowbunny and said nothing about Prozac. Now Prozac is scum because *you* went after Snow Bunny?

MAKE SENSE DAMMIT!

wow, idk how the heck you got that out of my post.

prozac is scummy for the same reason snow bunny is scummy - pushing a wagon without commiting a vote to it.

prozac is extra crispy scummy, cuz his excuse for that was "i'm a big ol' scaredy-cat who won't dare to put an L-2 vote on", but then he turns around and quietly slips an L-1 on ray like it ain't no thang.

everybody jumping on bunny and not prozac earlier has nothin to do with it.

[a girl on the internet]

I've become a fan of voting/pressuring before revealing most or all of my underlying reasons

and yet half of your case on me is that i've been statin reads without revealing my reasons. who's bein a hypocrite now?

[a girl on the internet]

Basically, we need to start getting our shit together and putting votes together. Spreading out is doing nothing. I suggest people vote mbf.

i'm on board with this. mbf's a good enough choice, though i still think prozac is better.

i'm also in a sharing mood, so i'm actually gonna answer some of crypto's qs from earlier.

^ town

Why the heck do you feel the need to mention this?

btw, i like that you ask why i mention it, not why i think it. much better question. anyway, two reasons:

1. cuz that post was not a post i think snow white would make if she was scum. unless she was scum with ray, and she can't be, cuz he's town. anyway, by pointin this out, i hope to get smart town peeps to think about that post more and realize i'm right.
2. to see who gets all mad about how can i possibly be sure and whatever. no surprise it was prozac.

Why does RayFrost give you warm fuzzies if you don't like how he disagreed with whoever said he was opportunistic? Or was that comment of yours not intended to be a criticism (in which case it was just more crap fluff in a post full of crap fluff)?

yeah, it was crap fluff, i guess. def wasn't trying to accuse ray of anything with it.

Why do you suspect mikeburnfire?

at the time, cuz his first post was lame "oh no, someone has too many random votes" stuff. p. much just slowing down the progression out of RVS.

now, we can add in the rolefishing, cuz spyrex and elvis are totally right about that. and the "i'm not saying ray is scummy for not scumhunting, but ray is scummy for not scumhunting" doublespeak, cuz spyrex was totally right about that too, and mbf's response made like zero sense. something about red and blue pens, idk what he was talkin about.

Why are you liking roflcopter if you don't even know why he's voting for populartajo – or are rofl's mere actions so pro-town in your eyes that you don't even care for the underlying factors?

fair enough. i actually like your answer

this. concedin that ray's response was reasonable made me think he was actually trying to figure ray out and not just lookin for a scapegoat.

rofl wasn't voting tajo, btw, just called him scummy. i asked him why cuz i wasn't seein it, and normally i do see where rofl is coming from. (OMG, i am someone who knows rofl! it's a CLUE!)

Why do you suspect Mufasa?

i agreed with spyrex. seem to do that a lot.

You haven't so much as mentioned his actual play?

that's not a question?

Is your Mufasa suspicion just your attempt at trying to cover your bases and hop on his bandwagon if you need a quick wagon?

nope! ^_^

What's wrong with voting for players who are replacing out?

nothin, in general. but at that particular time in this particular game, i didn't think keepin my vote on mufasa's replacement would be helpful.

Bang, FAIL. You didn't like Mufasa. That is to say you announced suspicion of him. In that case it's not about pressure. It's about voting for scum. Are you expecting Mufasa's replacement to just claim scum and admit defeat? Your cute little vote won't make the slightest difference in the degree of pressure he feels.

um, no. votes in the early game are prob gonna be a lot more about pressure than about voting scum. you pressure to help you figure out who is scum. then you can vote them.

like, you gotta find some sorta scummy point to decide who to pressure, but that's mostly just cuz no one feels any pressure from totally random votes.

bored now.

unvote, vote mbf

[a girl on the internet]

hmm. after reading her iso, i got two main issues with pom:

- poms' first post, votes mufasa, states "bandwagon!" as her reason
- mbf attacks her for being "opportunistic" by putting a third vote on mufasa
- pom's second post, defends herself by saying she thought it was only the second vote and so it wasn't opportunistic. it wouldn've been opportunistic anyway! and also THE REASON SHE SAID SHE VOTED MUFASA WAS TO START A BANDWAGON!! so she wanted to start a wagon, but she agrees that more than two votes is opportunistic?? that don't add up.

also, ray vote. the only reason for it appears to be "rofl is acting like ray is his scumbuddy". i mean, even turning off my 'ray is obvtown' blinders, i don't see how that is enough of a case that she would be happy to push him to L-1 and demand a claim, and geez guys, you've seen how wagon-happy i am, rite?

eh, i guess i'll see how this one goes. rly hoping the merry go round of rotating wagons lands on prozac next tho.

unvote, vote pomegranate

[a girl on the internet]

Another awesome post. Really, next time try and post like your town... just a little.

i will if you will!

[a girl on the internet]

ray's hammer was majorly bad, but i still don't think he's scum.

here's the real one that got away:

vote: mikeburnfire

[a girl on the internet]

I was thinking the "have to unvote" rule would mean your vote (and mine) wouldn't count, rofl.

YOU LIE

ebwop, i remembered that rule about the obligatory unvote, so pom isnt lynched.

Still, I dont think rolf and frost knew this, so my accusation still applies.

I did remember it

um, what? this is not a contradiction. this is the opposite of a contradiction.

lern2read.

ray's hammer was majorly bad, but i still don't think he's scum.

why?

well, hammering without gettin a claim first runs the risk of-

lol, kidding. i guess the use of not explaining my town read on ray has run its course. so, why is ray town?

well, for one, cuz the three scummiest players in the game all came in and voted him in the first three posts of the day. i take that kinda thing as a sign.

posts like this and especially this show a particular cluelessness that is emblematic of newbtown, and way harder to fake than ppl give credit for. yeah, i know ray's played a gazillion games even though he's only been here for like a month. he's still a newb.

another town post. for one, he's basically daring bunny to vote him to L-2, and i think he'd be tryin to avoid that kind of attention if he was scum, or at least not brazenly trying to attract it. and also, "where's the vote" was an excellent question to be asking there, cuz bunny (and prozac) not voting was totally scummy.

those were the main reasons for my original read on him, and since then, the way he has been constantly coming under attack from scummy players in such a relentless way is just screamin out to me that my initial feeling was totally on the money. ray is rly bad at this game, and hammering pom without a claim was the biggest example of that, but he's still town, and policy lynches for bad play are for suckers.

vote: porochaz

this is the right lynch

glad to see rofl is town after all. i was havin some doubts.

unvote, vote: porochaz

plz tell me this will actually happen today. it would make me so happy.

[a girl on the internet]

see, maybe i'm just gullible, but i actually buy that ray thought the vote wouldn't count and wasn't actually intending to hammer. that makes it bad play and not scummy play imo.

loving how prozac keeps on clinging to the OMGUS mantra as if the fact he voted me first totally erases all of his scummy play.

[a girl on the internet]

Snow_Bunny, roflcopter, tajo, Snow White, and AGOTI, list/spectrum of player reads, please.

ok!

town

snow white
ray
rofl
spyrex
elvis
crypto
tajo
snow bunny
mbf
prozac

scum

note that there is a huuuuuuge gap between tajo and bunny, wheras elvis/crypto/tajo are pretty much interchangable.

[a girl on the internet]

Anyone opposed to me hammering Ray tonight or tomorrow morning needs to speak up NOW. I'm not waiting.

well, i think spyrex should stop being a scrub and listen to his gut, which is clearly telling him that ray is town, and help lynch some actual scum instead.

but so many people are dead set on RAY MUST DIE that i can't see him not bein lynched today, so you should probs just get on with it.

[a girl on the internet]

I'm not sure exactly what rofl is going for here. If I look at that last post and try to find something scummy, I would say that it's prozac wanting to go after AGOTI no matter what ray flips. I think prozac should want to take the info from the ray lynch and refine his read based on that.

not only that, but he's also not even considerin the possibility that i die tonite, or he dies tonite, cuz he knows it's not gonna happen. i'm the designated mislynch for tomorrow, he's the scum, obviously neither one is a scum target.

quotin for iso-readers.

[a girl on the internet]

I want AGOTI to respond to my case.

but it's so biiiiiiiig >_<

ok, i'll start now:

- putting words into elvis's mouth

this never happened.

here is how the conversation went:

me: snow bunny is pushing a wagon without committing a vote, that's scummy
elvis: prozac did that too
me: you're right, prozac is scummy too.

at no point did i suggest that elvis was saying prozac was scummy. it is in fact blatantly obvious that this never happened. this is a totally ridiculous accusation, tbh. even if it was based on actual reality, what would scum-me actually gain from putting words into elvis's mouth?

don't feel like goin through the rest right now, maybe tomorrow. i bet there's some zingers in there tho!

[a girl on the internet]

k, i'm prob getting lynched today. i can live with that. not gonna waste time defendin myself against prozac's lame case that i could be using to find scum instead.

rofl is one. like, duh. would've figured that anyway based on his d2 play, which is clearly coming out of the gate thinking ray is a dead man walking and intendin to bus asap, then changing his mind when it looks like there might be a chance to get someone else lynched. but srsly:

agoti - this came early on, and this caught my attention yesterday

you don't need to make a case on me. i have been defendin the shit out of ray for basically the entire game. everybody knows this. saying it "caught your attention" is acting like there was any kind of subtlety in my defence, which is a huge lie. he's treatin it as some kind of big revelation that i look like ray's partner when it really, really isn't, and i don't think he would do this as town. comes off as massively artificial to me.

---

lookin into some vote analysis to figure the less screamingly obvious scum. this votecount, and what followed, are v. interesting:

Rayfrost(4)

: Mikeburnfire, Roflcopter, Snow white, Elvis_knits

Mufasa(4)

: Populartajo,

Pomegranate, Spyrex, A girl on the internet

Spyrex(1): Mufasa

Mikeburnfire(1): Crypto
Snow white(1):

Rayfrost

Not voting (2): Porochaz, Snow_Bunny.

with 13 players, it is 7 to lynch

we've got now confirmed scum and now confirmed town sittin at 4 votes each. everyone besides tajo on the town wagon is known town (i will be after you lynch me, before you go ragin at me calling myself confirmed town). seems like scum would be all over that one, unless one of them was already there - looks bad for tajo.

i don't think both scum would be bussing ray so early, so assuming i'm right about rofl, town points for mbf, snow white and elvis.

mufasa wagon dissolved straight after, and the new snow bunny wagon appeared:

Rayfrost(4)

: Mikeburnfire, Snow white, Elvis_knits

Green Crayons(3)

: Populartajo,

Pomegranate, Spyrex

Spyrex(1): Green Crayons

Snow white(1):

Rayfrost

Snow_bunny(3):

A girl on the internet

, Crypto, Roflcopter

Not voting (2): Porochaz, Snow_Bunny.

note how rofl is quick to jump away from the ray wagon when somethin else juicy shows up, while still throwing out posts like this to act supportive of the ray wagon without actually helping it go anywhere.

mostly, this count suggests that bunny is not a rofl buddy - why would he bother jumping from one buddy to the other?

---

that's all i got time for right now, i'll get to looking at the rest of the game in detail later.

Vote: roflcopter

[a girl on the internet]

geez, elvis, couldn't you have claimed before i started analyzin everything thinkin rofl was scum? now all my reads have been all thrown off again!

snow white's still town though. that is the unmoving eye of the storm. scum would never get so bugged about people callin them town.

iamausername watch: 4 posts yesterday
2 posts today

iamusername watch: 7/8 posts dince last post.

hey everybody, check the timestamps, i (or my alter ego) did not make a single post in between these two counts. prozac is pretty much resorting to lying about my activity to try to rush through this lynch. like, technically, both posts are true, but the way he phrased them totally makes it look like i've made more posts from one to the next, and no way is that accidental.

merry xmas, one and all!

unvote, vote prozac

[a girl on the internet]

scum would never get so bugged about people callin them town.

Really? That's what makes you think Snow White's town?

yes. snow white's reaction to me thinking she's town is the only reason i think she's town. FOR I AM PARADOXIA, QUEEN OF CIRCULAR REASONING.

Iamusername also has posted in the site numerous times while agoti never posted here.

no, sorry, this is bullshit.

iamausername performed modding duties, and even that was a lot less timely than usual. iamausername has clearly been posting just as little in the one game he is PLAYING over the last few days as i have been posting here. come back when you've done more than a cursory glance at post histories, kthnx.

prozac attacking me for this stinks a lot more, tho, cuz he clearly already has done more than a cursory glance, yet he still chose to plow thru with this crap in an attempt to get me lynched quick before i had a chance to tear apart his lame ass case. cuz he he knows i could if i had the chance. and if i could be bothered. which i can't, fyi. ^_^

Rayfrost(4): Green Crayons, mikeburnfire, crypto, Porochaz
Mikeburnfire(4): Spyrex, Elvis_knits, A girl on the internet, Pomegranate
Snow_bunny(1): Roflcopter, Rayfrost
A girl on the internet(2): Snow_Bunny
Pomegranate(1): Populartajo
crypto(1): Elvis_knits

Not voting (1): Snow white.

with 13 players, it is 7 to lynch

Yeah, as the majority of people missed it the first time, I strongly suspect the mbf wagon was pushed by a scumbag to counter the frost wagon. With elvis being prob town here and pome and spyrex dead and townies, then agoti becomes very likely scum in this scenario.

this is a totally legit reason for thinkin i'm scum tho. just a shame it's wrong.

however, with the added knowledge of my alignment, it's actually a strong argument for mbf-scum. counter wagon to scum appears, but no scum take advantage of it? it's cuz that wagon is scum too. it's totally cool if you gotta lynch me first to trust this, just don't forget it when i'm gone.

if it's not prozac/mbf, i'd put rofl/crypto + elvis as insane cop as most likely. but that scum team would already be screwed, so lol.

unvote, vote mbf

[a girl on the internet]

Shes ignoring my case and the fact that there is a lot of suspicion surrounding her, please can we do something about it?

i'm not ignoring it, i'm embracing it! ^_^

@AGOTI. Could you make a scumlist provided you have the time?

yeppers!

scum

prozac
mbf
tajo
rofl/crypto
snow bunny
snow white
elvis

town

mbf made a good point about tajo in #781, his "one of the ppl undermining elvis's claim is scum" bit was real shifty. he's throwing blanket suspicion at 1/3 of the players in the game while voting someone who's not even in that group. that's hella shady.

This snippet REALLY rubs me wrong, especially the boldface.

why?

pretend for a moment that you are scum with rofl, and that elvis is therefore an insane cop. do you think you have any chance of winning?

Nope, sorry, I won't waste my time with you.

trying to convince snow bunny that she is scum would be a waste of time, sure.

but... i'm not seeing what you are seeing on her, at all. and judgin by the vote count, i'm not the only one. if you're right, you're gonna need to do something to convince the rest of the town, cuz as things stand, that lynch is not happening any time soon.

[a girl on the internet]

hi

will be makin a more substantial post later today, i actually got some time now.

i'll tell you right now though that i'd much rather lynch tajo than bunny.

unvote, vote tajo

[a girl on the internet]

will be makin a more substantial post later today

i have no idea how long a day is.

well, the site going down at inconvenient times slowed me down a bit, but admittedly i would never have been on schedule anyway. >_<

so anyway, the way i see it, there are possible 7 scumteams here:

rofl/crypto
mbf/prozac
mbf/bunny
mbf/tajo
prozac/bunny
prozac/tajo
bunny/tajo

the first one is a special case that doesn't need thinkin about today. so let's iso the four players contained in the others and figure out who is most likely.

---

mikeburnfire

post 38: much has been made of this, and how it looks like unnecessary posturing for town points. but looking back, i think maybe it actually was possible that someone might not have noticed how many votes Mufasa had received, so i guess i can buy that mike felt the need to draw attention to the fact. spyrex and pomegranate being suspected for "opportunism" here is still baloney tho.

post 42: very blatant rolefishing. more on that story later.

post 134: "I will leave my vote on [Ray] for now. I believe it is not misplaced." - ya, that reads really unnatural. definitely adds to the feeling of bussing. i bet crypto will totally dig this case.

"Snow Bunny seems fine for now. Don't know where this wagon is materializing from." - it's pretty easy to see where the wagon was coming from, by reading the posts where people voted her. it's not like the reasoning for it wasn't explained at all. i think if bunny was mbf's partner, he'd at least make some attempt at actually refuting the case instead of pretending it didn't exist here (or join in and bus, i guess). the passive disapproval is much more of a 'scum wanting town points for being against a town wagon, without actually doing anything to stop it' move.

mbf/bunny --

post 142: this is a bad post. the first part is a lame excuse for dodging the question. fair enough if you haven't thought about it before being asked, but that's no reason not to start thinking about it there.

the second part is much worse, since it a) throws dirt at several players indiscriminately, tying them to ray, and b) totally contradicts the first part. mbf hasn't thought about potential scum teams at all, he says, but clearly most of them were already voting mufasa when ray joined. all but one of the players in question are now confirmed town, btw. the one who isn't is tajo, which i guess is a slight

mbf/tajo -

post 171: this is where we come back to the rolefishing. mbf's continued insistence that he had done nothing wrong is actually pretty convincing. i mean, it doesn't convince me that he did nothing wrong, but it convinces me that he

believed

he'd done nothing wrong, which amounts to the same thing in terms of what it says about his alignment.

the "pomegranate is setting up for a future cop claim" bit is totally ridiculous, but again, i don't think it's an alignment tell. it's just mike being dumb.

now the last bit, though, that looks bad to me. being concerned that spyrex isn't commenting on anyone besides mufasa, that's fine, but the way he specifically brings a lack of comment on ray into it is just awkward; it looks like someone who already knows that ray will flip scum trying to tie someone else to him. again.

post 190: this, otoh, has quite the opposite effect. suggesting that i am scum looking for town points when ray flips town would be an odd leap for a ray scumbuddy to make when the "agoti is scum with ray, protecting her buddy" line would be so much more obvious.

post 216:
- draws particular attention to bunny (and spyrex) for lack of posting

mbf/bunny -

- mentions tajo, but hidden in the middle of a longer list

mbf/tajo ++

- no mention of prozac at all

mbf/prozac +

skipping a bunch of posts that were just arguing the same old points with spyrex. i'm not gleaning anything useful from them besides the fact that cannot fathom how mbf's brain works sometimes. "i am not saying ray is scummy for not scumhunting, i'm saying he has done scummy things like not scumhunting". this is something that mbf seems to honestly believe makes any sense at all. i don't know what to do with that.

post 319: i'm struggling to parse this one with ray being scum. it makes so much more sense from an mbf-scum/ray-town perspective, seriously.

post 325: again with the tying other people to ray. come on.

post 399: and at this point it's so brazen that i'm starting to think along 'too scummy' sorta lines. well, that and he's actually got good reasons for a couple of these, pom's post

was

terrible, and prozac's eagerness to go after me instead of ray does look bad in light of ray's flip.

that's it for d1. d2, there's the obvious "RAY MUST DIE" right from the start. at this point, scum or town, mbf was definitely going to do everything working from the assumption that ray was scum, so i don't see further instances of tying people to ray as scummy.

post 546: calls out tajo for "hiding all day, then showing up when the wagon's been formed and criticizing the wagon" which is entirely reasonable, and is definitely a

mbf/tajo --

post 722: seriously, i don't understand how prozac is higher than crypto here. crypto is completely obvious town UNLESS elvis is insane, which is a possibility mbf has already Gambler's Fallacied away. elvis claiming to save buddy rofl from the lynch, i can see how someone might believe that, but why the heck would she want to prevent rofl's lynch if crypto was her buddy? there is no reason.

also, no, prozac is not at all townish.

anyway, for obvious reasons, that's an

mbf/prozac +

,

mbf/tajo -

,

mbf/bunny -

post 775: yeah, at this point i'm convinced that either prozac is his partner, or mbf is town. there's been a whole heck of a lot of things pointing against him being scum with tajo or bunny leading up to this which absolutely screams it out. the lack of care about who gets lynched makes the mbf/prozac possibility look more likely again, but the isoreading as a whole actually makes me lean more towards the 'mbf is town' side.

---

populartajo

post 93: interaction with bunny here, the way he nudges her towards saying mufasa is scum seems more likely to be leading town astray than coaching a buddy.

tajo/bunny -

post 271: putting bunny second place on his scum list might seem like it should be a minus too, but the fact that he opts to vote pom even though there is already a wagon on bunny makes this a

tajo/bunny +

the fact that tajo completely ignores prozac throughout d1 is definitely

tajo/prozac ++

.

post 545: "regardless of x's flip, y is scum", now there's a phrase that a town player should never be saying. since the y includes bunny,

tajo/bunny -

tajo promises to hammer ray here, which is a promise he never follows through on. definitely looks like he changed his mind about bussing when he realised that there might be enough idiot townies like me who still thought ray was town to get a different lynch happening.

post #593: "I really need a good argument to not vote Ray and I dont think there is one."

and yet, still no ray vote. because he was still holding out hope that someone else would provide that good argument against lynching ray that he couldn't come up with himself.

post #643: hilarious.

right, so, tajo says these two sentences, with nothing else between them:

"Of the frost defenders, rolf's flipflopping yesterday and also 635 is scummy as hell.
He is basically attacking people for something that he also did"

!!!

"rofl's flipflopping is scummy as hell"
"he is attacking people for something that he also did".

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLL.

(what i'm saying is that tajo is attacking rofl for something that he also did, and then also accusing rofl of attacking people for something that he also did)

(that makes tajo a double hypocrite. a hypocrite squared.)

post 776: "So tl/dr, elvis is prob town. If she stays alive for 2-3 more days, then she is prob scum."

hey town, if we can't kill elvis, do it for us plz.

post 777: the very first time that tajo gives any opinion whatsoever about prozac. calling him scummy, but obfuscating it with attaching the same point to snow white, and making absolutely zero attempt to actively pursue a case against either of them.

tajo/prozac ++

post 890: "Re: bunny-tajo scumpair. Feel free to speculate what you want, Im not scum and therefore all arguments based on this relationship are bs."

this is an incredibly useless comment, which feels designed to encourage the idea of the tajo/bunny pair in people's minds.

tajo/bunny -

i didn't mention any of his mbf interactions, but there was definitely nothing to sway me from the read i got from mbf's iso. so just like with mike, i come to the conclusion that if tajo has a scum partner, i'm pretty sure it's prozac. unlike with mike, i am not at all leaning to the "tajo is town" side after isoreading. tajo/prozac ftw, i'm pretty sure.

i'll iso the other two to see if anything compelling crops up to change my mind, and i'm also going to skim through the thread as a whole, since isoreading alone misses out on some of the context if exactly where the gamestate was when particular posts were made.

but for now, here is this post. enjoy.

[a girl on the internet]

hey tajo, remember how iamausername lurked through the first half of that game, and then made a massive post summarizing his reads, in which he named four players as scum, and all of them were scum?

obviously, since situations in that game and situations in this game are one and the same, this proves that i am right about tajo and prozac. QED, bitchez.

(starting work on part 2 now)

[a girl on the internet]

Porochaz

post 85: an auspicious start. there's plenty of significant stuff gone on that prozac could be commenting on, not least of which is ray attracting a somewhat serious wagon. lack of comment on this = prozac hoping it will blow over soon, as early wagons tend to.

post 103: i accept that some people disagree with the line of thought that says you should have a vote down at all times on at least d1, and not doing so is anti-town. (i don't accept that they're right, just that they exist). but i don't think anyone will argue with the fact that refusing to vote

or do anything else

is anti-town.

post 154: the first time that prozac makes a post that one might actually be able to construe as helpful.

the thing that sticks out to me most about this is the "it's like me having a neutral read on ray" that seems to be apropos of nothing. it gives the impression that he had "need to comment on ray" at the forefront of his brain in writing that and jammed it in there any old way, despite how badly it fit.

also, attacking every single person on the snow bunny wagon is most definitely a

prozac/bunny ++

post 156: "i'm waiting for ray's response" is a really bad reason not to vote him.

post 170: i simply cannot comprehend why prozac unvotes me. there is zero reason for it. no one else was voting me at the time, so there was no danger of an accidental lynch, he says himself that he isn't feeling any better about me, so why????????

i don't even think it's scummy, i just don't understand.

post 179: the fabled L-1 vote that apparently clears prozac. the thing is, from my point of view, it's virtually guaranteed that

somebody

bussed ray, and i'll take the guy who went from refraining from commenting on ray -> claiming a neutral read on him -> saying "oh yeah that's a good case but i'm waiting for his reply" and trying to get a wagon going on someone else -> voting him to L-1 over someone who was on ray from the start and actually made significant contributions to the case instead of just agreeing with others' reasoning any day.

post 239: ...especially when he hops straight away from the wagon again one post later.

post 278: prozac is highly dismissive of spyrex's mbf case.

prozac/mbf +

post 335: prozac is the only person who seems to spend any significant headsapce on figuring out my secret identity before i outed myself. that, to me, seems like an unnecessary distraction from actual scumhunting. i mean, you could probably make a case that figuring out the identity of an alt could help you get a better read on them through meta, but... prozac clearly isn't interested in that; his whole argument here goes against that. scummy behaviour is scummy behaviour, whether it's a vet or a newb making it, that's what he's saying. so why does it matter if i'm a vet or not? why devote so much time to thinking about it?

also, this is the one and only post where prozac makes any mention of tajo on d1. "someone whos currently in the background - ie tajo rofl etc, crypto", it's an offhand comment buried in the middle there. tajo is the very first person he thinks of when bringing up lurkers, and prozac is completely happy to let tajo get by with that, since everyone else is. that's like a

prozac/tajo +++++

or something, seriously.

post 402: "But I do not deal in absolutes so I will make a diclaimer and say everything in this post is my opinion."



this is just exposing the abject stupidity of the whole "dealing in absolutes" argument. of course it's your own opinion! you know how i can tell? because you are the one posting it! why why why would you need to state this explicitly? do you think people are going to be confused if you don't? are they going to think you are stating someone else's opinion? COME ON.

post 440: haha, no, i'm still not responding. and there's nothing you can do about it. booyah.

and d1 out. here is the thing with prozac's d1 - he settles pretty early in the day on "agoti is scum, ray is scum", and never deviates, or does any kind of scumhunting elsewhere, just coasts on through, taking potshots at me every so often and insisting that he is totally happy to lynch ray, honestly. what part of that is pro-town play, seriously?

post 539: again, "whether x flips scum or town, y is scum" is just a terrible thing to be saying.

post 630: this is where i did reply to one point in his case against me, and prozac... completely fails to even read my response.

"you put words in elvis's mouth! she never said i was scummy!"
"um, i never said that elvis said you were scummy."
"no, look at this post! ELVIS NEVER SAID I WAS SCUMMY!"

like, i'd already figured that responding to this case would be a huge waste of my time, but that is some pretty strong confirmation right there.

and yeah, d2 is even more so with the complete lack of interest in anyone besides me and ray.

post 664: let me ask you this, prozac. why do you care if i answer your case? why is it so important? this case i am making right now, against you, i give no crap if you want to respond to it or not. it's not for you. i think you are scum, and i am explaining to the rest of the town why i think that. but you, on the other hand, you don't seem to care what the people you supposedly think are town think of your case, you are just obsessed with getting into a quote war with me. that's phenomenally unhelpful.

post 687: prozac finally acknowledges the existence of other players in the game. well, except for snow bunny. clearly he genuinely forgot she existed, and i can't see scum forgetting about their partner entirely, so

prozac/bunny --

post 692: clarification that it was white he forgot, and his comments on her were meant for bunny. the same point still applies - i'm sure he'd find it much easier to separate them in his mind if he knew they had different alignments, so the fact that he still confuses them suggests that he is not scum with bunny.

post 705 and post 729: here is where prozac clearly misrepresents iamausername's postings to give the impression that i was specifically avoiding this game when taking even a meager glance at post histories would show that i was pretty much absent across the board. really struggling to see how the change from "6 posts" to "7/8 posts" when no new posts had been made was not malicious.

post 869: "Not only have I taken an active stance in the game I am leading the charge against AGOTI as well."

i like how these are listed as two separate points, when they are in fact one and the same - the only active stance prozac has taken is leading the charge against me. that is the only thing he has done for like the entire game.

post 971: ridiculous claims about how the tajo lynch is bad because "if he is town, it will give us less information", like that doesn't apply to

any

lynch that turns up town.

prozac/tajo ++

post 1021: THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYIN.

in summary: prozac decided pretty early on to go after me, and has done virtually nothing else for the entire game. i encourage everyone to isoread him and see this for yourself. he gradually shifted his d1 stance on ray from no comment -> neutral -> oh yeah scummy as the wagon developed, and pushed for my lynch ahead of ray's any chance he could get. prozac and tajo's interactions with each other (or lack thereof) are seriously screaming scum team. that is all i have to say.

---

snow bunny

post 82: the "neutral on mike" is odd, why even mention him if you have nothing to say about him?

bunny/mbf +

post 285: me no likey. it's much like prozac with the pushing away from ray, while claiming to continue supporting his lynch. the last sentence in particular bothers me - it almost seems like gloating at the fact that the ray wagon has disappeared.

wow, her posting on d1 was even more sparce than i remembered. no comments at all on prozac or tajo, but then, there's no comments on like half the players in the game. it's mostly just whining about the fact that anyone could have the audacity to suspect her.

post 614: makes no sense. i'm scummier than ray, but ray deserves to die more because "he's already survived one day". um, so did i? what?

it's nonsense that reflects well on her though. if she thinks it's reasonable to consider me scummier than ray, then one would think she'd also be trying to get me lynched over him if he was her scumbuddy.

the reads on the other three, i think the mbf point looks the least like scum. "i had a town read on him before, but i'm starting to doubt" -> given that mbf was getting the most heat, that looks a lot like priming herself to jump on another townie if she felt the need later.

prozac is listed as town, with a "just gut" qualifier added. spyrex got "town" without any qualifiers; the fact that she finds it necessary to justify her town read on prozac in some way could be an indication that she was worried about looking connected.

tajo gets the "neutral", which i think is the most likely scumbuddy position, though. it says "i am totally not with this guy", but doesn't require one to actually push for a lynch on him.

bunny/mbf --

,

bunny/prozac +

,

bunny/tajo ++

post 680: wait,

crypto

was unnecessarily delaying ray's lynch?

bunny/tajo +

, because if that's a point against crypto, tajo clearly deserves heat for doing the same, only much worse.

post 820: "And, on light of that new thought, I can't say much on Tajo. There's something I don't like about his posts. Can't say exactly what it is. As someone else said, there's certainly a connection between him and AGOTI, but I would prefer first an AGOTI's flip in order to build a case upon that."

whoever it was that pointed out how this totally looks like bunny hoping to make tajo look good off my town flip, you're totally right. especially when you factor in this comment of hers from 680: "Truth be told, I'm not much of a fan of scum-for-association (I think it can lead to many misunderstandings)".

bunny/tajo ++

post 1007: OMG, this is ridiculous. elvis is not scum with crypto. here is the huge flaw in your reasoning:

"And, if the gambit is to save a town-rofl (Elvis-crypto), the risks are lower. If Rofl gets lynched, then Elvis and crypto would be left as confirmed towns, and surely getting them an insta-win."

let me narrow it down a little more:

"If Rofl gets lynched"

there it is! THAT WILL NEVER HAPPEN. elvis guaranteed that that will never happen by claiming innocent on him. something that she had absolutely no motivation to do if she is scum and he is not. he would have been lynched today, that's pretty much a fact. i almost certainly would have gone tomorrow. then elvis and crypto just have to turn whichever of you/mbf/prozac/tajo/white they decide to leave alive against each other, and easy money.

why on earth would elvis want to make it so much harder on herself by preventing the rofl lynch, and risk being counterclaimed, and force herself into coming up with results every day? there is no reason for her to do that. it is absurd to think that she would do that. elvis is not scum with crypto, you can take that to the bank.

...

anyway. after isoreading bunny, i am surprised to discover just exactly how useless she has been, and definitely seeing a strong chance of a bunny/tajo pair from her side. enough so to counteract the negative data i got on that from the tajo read, fo sho.

---

in order of likelihood:

tajo/prozac
tajo/bunny
prozac/mbf

definitely think it's one of those three. so, lynch me, lynch tajo, lynch prozac. if tajo flips scum and prozac doesn't, lynch bunny. if prozac flips scum and tajo doesn't, lynch mbf.

(we can skip the 'lynch me' step if you want, i don't mind.)

done.

[a girl on the internet]

To me, her case whilst was finally some much needed content, it wasnt stuff that I hadnt responded to before and even going beyond that, her case consists of her being slightly upset that I havent really gone after other people.

did you notice that i posted quite a lot about three players who aren't you? do you have any opinions on any of that?

[a girl on the internet]

Got some internet!

Welcome rhinox. To sum the game up for you, RayFrostscum got lynched early, Elvis claimed cop with innocent on ROFL and you, and a few players have claimed vanilla townie.

thanks, and thanks for the heads up on my claim. woulda sucked to claim cop or doc or something later on down the road if I were too lazy to read what my predecessor claimed somewhere already

yer misreadin, dude

elvis claimed innocent on rofl and you
a few players have claimed vanilla townie

that comma is important

i hope someone freaks out about your pretend fakeclaiming, lol

[a girl on the internet]

I'll go for a

unvote; vote AGOTI

for her comments about "I hope somebody freaks out about your fake claiming comments."

dude, seriously? of all the reasons you could have for voting me, that's the one you're going with? like, how is that even scummy? idgi

[a girl on the internet]

it was a non-gender specific 'dude'. i was channeling juno macguff.

Amirite?

no, not at all.

let me translate:

i hope someone freaks out

about

your pretend fakeclaiming

,

lol

rhinox, i get the joke

it was funny

i hope someone else doesn't get it, cuz that would make it funnier

i know that rhinox is not incredibly stupid, therefore i rejected the idea that it did not occur to him that only scum would have to worry about their predecessor claiming something different to them, thus leaving 'he is making a joke'.

i kinda hope that you don't think i'm incredibly stupid, and would therefore reject the idea that, as scum hoping to see some town on town fighting, i would indicate this by saying "BOY I SURE HOPE WE GET SOME TOWN ON TOWN FIGHTING!!!!!". thus leaving the correct interpretation detailed above.

---

hum, i might isoread snow white, just in case. i guess there's a couple of suspect points in that crypto post rhinox linked.

[a girl on the internet]

i'd really rather lynch tajo. i can see tajo being scum without bunny, wheras if bunny is scum, tajo is the only plausible partner.

and there is no way that this is a good faith argument.

and tajo's massive stalling on the ray lynch yesterday when compared to his efforts to rush through a lynch on me today is obvscummy.

and "I really need a good argument to not vote Ray and I dont think there is one." clearly = "cop, please come out with an innocent on my godfather".

basically, tajo is scum, so we should lynch him. i could live with a bunny or a prozac lynch today, cuz one of them is his partner, but really. tajo needs to die and he needs to die now.

[a girl on the internet]

massclaim is a good idea. but probably worth holding off till tomorrow. which i doubt will even happen, cuz we are gonna lynch snow bunny, and she's gonna be the last scum.

that little bit of hysterically defending herself against the charge of being tajo's partner, in twilight, before we'd even seen tajo's flip, has sold me on her over prozac.

vote snow bunny

now somebody hammer. there's really no reason to delay this lynch.

[a girl on the internet]

Also, I don't think it is in anyones best interest to quick lynch Snow bunny

hell with that. it's in everyone's interest to quicklynch snow bunny. the longer we hold off on lynching the obvscum, the more likely townies are to get into stupid arguments with each other, increasing the odds that they end up getting themselves lynched. it's already starting to happen with snow white.

i agree that rofl has a pretty compelling case against prozac (i made half of the case, after all). there's also a very compelling case against bunny. if i had to pick one of them to lynch, and only one, i would actually spend some time deliberating about that decision. but luckily, we DON'T have to make that decision! there's two of them, and we have THREE chances to get this right. a monkey with severe brain damage could make the right choice in those circumstances.

whether we lynch scum today or tomorrow, we win the game. let's please not spend time agonizing over which of the two likely candidates is more obvscum when we still don't lose even in the ridiculously unlikely event that neither of them are. let's just lynch them.

[a girl on the internet]

first thing we need to do is massclaim. rhinox should decide the order.

[a girl on the internet]

AGOTI, why do you think a Massclaim will help at this point?

i don't, necessarily, but if it does help, it will help more today than it would tomorrow, and it certainly won't

hurt

.

it's worth doing on the off chance that it gives us something useful, even though i expect it won't, cuz there's really no reason not to do it at this point.

[a girl on the internet]

vanilla. go prozac.

My biggest concern is that I still have a town-gut read on Porochaz, and if he turns up town, then I'll likely have to choose between AGOTI and White, and that's not a situation I want to be in.

would having to choose between prozac and me, or between prozac and snow be any better?

[a girl on the internet]

all vanilla. no big surprise there. now lets lynch prozac.

here are some good quotes for everyone. i rate them A+++ would read again.

the fact that tajo completely ignores prozac throughout d1 is definitely

tajo/prozac ++

.

post 777: the very first time that tajo gives any opinion whatsoever about prozac. calling him scummy, but obfuscating it with attaching the same point to snow white, and making absolutely zero attempt to actively pursue a case against either of them.

tajo/prozac ++

post 335: this is the one and only post where prozac makes any mention of tajo on d1. "someone whos currently in the background - ie tajo rofl etc, crypto", it's an offhand comment buried in the middle there. tajo is the very first person he thinks of when bringing up lurkers, and prozac is completely happy to let tajo get by with that, since everyone else is. that's like a

prozac/tajo +++++

or something, seriously.

post 971: ridiculous claims about how the tajo lynch is bad because "if he is town, it will give us less information", like that doesn't apply to any lynch that turns up town.

prozac/tajo ++

I dont have anything else to say in regards to this game atm. AGOTI is very likely scum but I can go for a Snow Bunny lynch.

unvote vote Snow Bunny

I believe you have done so already but if you havent, its time to claim.

this is at the point when action very suddenly shifted yesterday from tajo to snow bunny. all of the sudden prozac is willing to entertain a non agoti lynch? yeah, thats because its all anyone but tajo and he just wants to get through the day with a mislynch.

i got plenty more if you want em.

vote porochaz

[a girl on the internet]

I guess she thinks it'll be easier to convince me to lynch AGOTI than to convince AGOTI to lynch me.

even though i've been acting like she's confirmed town for no apparent reason for most of the game! it's like she doesn't trust me or somethin. geez.

here is something else that struck me from prozac which hasn't been mentioned yet:

Tajo made little sense to me. Yes, he was very lurky and he delayed the Ray lynch by a hell of a lot but really they were the only 2 points against him and whatsmore in regards to information, (I believe I tried to explain this already I assumed we would get more information from Bunny's flip than we would from tajo. In the end, however, Tajo was lynched based on the fact he needed to be replaced. Yes there was some backing behind it but really the last two votes were just not to have the hassle of waiting for a replacement to read up.

does anyone else detect strong hints of bitterness here? like prozac is upset, cuz he doesn't think there was a valid case on tajo, yet tajo was still lynched? because that is definitely the vibe i am getting from this. and i don't know why a townie would be upset about a scum lynch.

also, his "i don't have a case or any reason to think mbf is scum, but WHAT IF MBF IS SCUM???" crap today is obv flailing cuz he's realised he needs to get TWO mislynches and he doesn't know how.

[a girl on the internet]

Im tempted to vote to end day. Can someone please give a weighting on the matter?

that'll be tough when no one is at l-1.

you should vote prozac anyway tho.

[a girl on the internet]

so, props to whichever one of you is scum, cuz i never saw it coming.

at the moment i'm leaning snow, because mike had a much more convincing case on her yesterday than she had on him. and i can see her motivation for keeping rhinox alive more than i can see mike's.

but yeah, rereadin' time.

Okay. Whose been not online the past five days??? *witchhunt*

me. but only because i only sign into this account when i'm making posts in this game. ^_^

[a girl on the internet]

i can see her motivation for keeping rhinox alive more than i can see mike's.

actually, scratch that. i was thinkin along the lines of "who would

need

to keep rhinox alive"; white needs rhinox to persuade mike to lynch me instead of her. but if you think "who would

want

to keep rhinox alive", mike's motivation is obvious; rhinox was pretty clear about the fact that he will not vote mike, and with rhinox still alive, town will need that vote to win if mike is scum.

(just got to 782 in my reread, totally doubting myself on white scum again. this came just after elvis claimed and the rofl wagon collapsed, and i happened to be sitting at l-1 at the time, and was in middle of my worst phase of lurking. no one woulda blamed her for hammering.)

[a girl on the internet]

and then i get to #886, which doesn't look anything like bussing either.

myk, are you absolutely sure prozac wasn't scum?

[a girl on the internet]

Im saying that there's no reason why i would leave Rhinox alive.

why would i leave rhinox alive?

btw, i started declaring you town well before ray died, actually.

[a girl on the internet]

@AGOTI what the fuck's changed? EH?

um, both the people i was sure were the last scum turned out not to be the last scum? i don't know about you, but i find i sorta have to change my worldview when somethin like that happens.

why would i leave rhinox alive?

answer this question plz.

[a girl on the internet]

but if you have no motivation to leave rhinox alive, as you say, how would it set you up??

[a girl on the internet]

You asked me why i thought someone else would leave me alive. Do not twist my words.

What you are now asking me is if i am scum how would i set myself up? Why would i bother?

wait, what?

i asked you why i would leave RHINOX alive. i asked how leaving rhinox alive would help ME set you up.

these are the things you are accusing me of doing, and i want you to try to justify that accusation.

[a girl on the internet]

here's something that's bothering me. snow white really seems to be genuinely surprised that i am attacking her today. i've been grilling her for two reasons:

one is to try to get her to see the inherent ridiculous nature of her position re: rhinox being alive.

FAO snow white: if the best justification you can come up with for ME to leave rhinox alive is that i'm doing it to frame YOU, does that not necessarily require that there must be a more obvious motivation for YOU to leave rhinox alive?

the other is to try to figure out if she is fakin that surprise. and it doesn't feel like she is. that being the case, it really doesn't make a lot of sense for her to leave rhinox alive. if she's still takin all my "snow white is town forever and ever" comments at face value, then surely she would expect that i would immediately vote mike here, so why bring the guy who refuses to vote mike under any circumstances into endgame with me? that's just gonna muddy the waters.

rhinox, help me out here. why are you so sure mike is town?

[a girl on the internet]

do you even read my posts

[a girl on the internet]

FAO snow white: if the best justification you can come up with for ME to leave rhinox alive is that i'm doing it to frame YOU, does that not necessarily require that there must be a more obvious motivation for YOU to leave rhinox alive?

the point of this argument is not "snow white is scum", the point of this argument has never been "snow white is scum".

the point of this argument is "a girl on the internet is town". apparently more elaboration is needed, though i really don't see why. it is freakin obvious.

also notice how she doesnt ask the possiblity of Mike being the one to set me up and not her.

BECAUSE HE'S NOT THE ONE YOU'RE ACCUSING. WHICH IS RIDICULOUS, BECAUSE MIKE IS THE ONE WHO ACTUALLY HAD ANY MOTIVATION TO LEAVE RHINOX ALIVE. THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT.

let me run through the possibilities for you. if snow white is scum, she had six options:

1) kill rhinox, convince mike to vote agoti - quite difficult, but worth considering, i'd say

2) kill rhinox, convince agoti to vote mike - also quite difficult, but apparently not from snow white's perception
3) kill no one, convince mbf and rhinox to vote agoti - looks easier than convincing mike alone

4) kill no one, convince agoti and rhinox to vote mike - rhinox was pretty clear about this never happening

5) kill mike, convince rhinox to vote agoti - looks easy until you realize that killing mike would be a ridiculous thing for agoti to do. call in the wifom brigade.

6) kill agoti, convince rhinox to vote mike - lol

if mike is scum, six options:

1) kill rhinox, convince snow to vote agoti - probably not too hard
2) kill rhinox, convince agoti to vote snow - woulda been pretty easy, but mike might not have thought so
3) kill no one, convince rhinox and snow to vote agoti - also probably not too hard, and rhinox makes a nice safety net by refusing to vote mike ever.
4) kill no one, convince rhinox and agoti to vote snow - really seems to add unnecessary complications to plan 2), but still, the safety net is again appealing

5) kill agoti, convince rhinox to vote snow - why would snow kill agoti. no.
6) kill snow, convince rhinox to vote agoti - why would agoti kill snow. no.

if agoti is scum, six options:

1) kill rhinox, convince mike to vote snow - mike was already willing to vote snow over me without me making any effort to convince him so i'm damn sure he'd still be willing with it, fucking duh this is what i'd do

2) kill rhinox, convince snow to vote mike - much harder than 1), ergo pointless
3) kill no one, convince rhinox and mike to vote snow - harder than 1), ergo pointless
4) kill no one, convince rhinox and snow to vote mike - lol
5) kill mike, convince rhinox to vote snow - really out of left field, this play. prob would be my second choice, i guess, but it's no plan 1)
6) kill snow, convince rhinox to vote mike - lol, lol, a thousand times lol



^ bolded the ones that I think are at all plausible. snow white's option 2) looks like the best option from her pov, and doesn't involve rhinox being alive. mike's option 3) looks like the best option from his pov, and

does

involve rhinox being alive.

what does snow get out of leaving rhinox alive: a townie who, unlike mike, is more suspicious of me than her
what does mike get out of leaving rhinox alive: a townie who refuses to vote for him ever, thus guaranteeing that he will NEVER LOSE
what do i get out of leaving rhinox alive: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

Doesn't sound like you anticipated that Snow White would take your comments at face value and you had to keep some options open.

what does that even mean? what options? what possible bearing could this even have on my actions as scum?

then broadens her net to asking Rhinox why mike is so innocent. Its like she's covering all bases for gods sake

or maybe it's like i know i can trust rhinox, so i want to know why he's so sure about mike when i'm so conflicted. because either he's right, in which case hopefully his reasons will convince me, or he's wrong, in which case i need to show him why he's wrong, which is pretty freakin hard to do when i don't even know what he's thinkin.

[a girl on the internet]

yeah i'm still here.

I still like AGOTI for the lynch though. She hasnt explained why she let go of her suspicions of mike in favour for me. Because Rhinox is alive today.

you've said this like a hundred times, and it is not and has never been true.

IT'S NOT BECAUSE RHINOX IS ALIVE. that's actually the one thing that's makin me suspect you LESS right now.

it's because prozac and bunny are both dead and both town. sooo i had to reevaluate my opinion on BOTH you AND mike. because yesterday, i was convinced that BOTH of you were town. and now that can't be true.

Well, there was the whole pursuing the case on ray. MBF is the one who got the wagon back onto ray when the town started going other directions.

granted. ray interactions are a huge point in mike's favour. if it was a bus, he started it early and never let up.

Aside from that, yesterday I made it clear I wouldn't vote MBF and wanted AGOTI or poro lynched. MBF could have played along with that, but instead he started pursuing a case on white. That doesn't seem to me like something scum should do.

disagree with this one tho. scum without any partners don't care who gets lynched, so long as it isn't them. they can basically push whoever they feel like.

But neither you or white didn't make it easy on me and crossvote each other either which would have made me pretty certain one of you are scum.

well, she did. so i guess she must be the scum. ^_~

for real though, i'm gonna go through the game one more time and compile all the evidence for and against both of them and maybe then i can make my mind up.

I still like AGOTI for the lynch though. She hasnt explained why she let go of her suspicions of mike in favour for me. Because Rhinox is alive today.

you've said this like a hundred times, and it is not and has never been true.

IT'S NOT BECAUSE RHINOX IS ALIVE. that's actually the one thing that's makin me suspect you LESS right now.

it's because prozac and bunny are both dead and both town. sooo i had to reevaluate my opinion on BOTH you AND mike. because yesterday, i was convinced that BOTH of you were town. and now that can't be true.

[a girl on the internet]

deadline is one week from now.

for real though, i'm gonna go through the game one more time and compile all the evidence for and against both of them and maybe then i can make my mind up.

whoop, better hurry this up then. workin on it right now.

[a girl on the internet]

SNOW SCUM/MIKE TOWN

post 56: ray and white detailing their previous game together strikes me as being seriously over-explained for random votes. like, they're taking too much care to make sure everyone else understands it - generally townies voting each other on past games will just say "you know why" or sumthin, and not care if anyone else knows what they're talkin about.

post 60: tajo lists ray, rofl, spyrex and mike as townish. i find it more likely that he'd ignore one buddy than listing both as town so early.

post 128: rly long post. here is the important bit:

Also. You could have contributed to the questioning mike was doing of Mufasa. Which was in fact, outside of the RVS. We have passed the stage quite quickly and this makes me happy. I see Mikes intervention as a good thing. L-2 is dangerous. You dont know who the scum are on any given wagon, do you Ray?

looks like coaching to me. the last bit especially, like she's reminding ray that he's supposed to be acting town.

post 190: scum-mike suggestin that i was maybe trying to look good off a ray townflip instead of suggesting i was protecting scumbuddy ray still seems totally counterintuitive. i mean, not if he was using it as an excuse to avoid voting ray, but he def wasn't doing that, soooo...

post 194: snow unvoting here looks bad. like she was just doin a bit of harmless distancing then all of a sudden ray looked like he was actually going to be lynched and she got spooked.

post 333: again, quotin' the relevant part:

(fight goddammit*providing yor town*!! You havent been tunnelledvisioned that hard have you?!?)

it's the "*providing yor town*" that does it for me. looks ridiculously unnatural, and so comes off as trying way too hard to say "i totally don't know ray's alignment".

post 489: snow says she hadn't read the thread and didn't know ray hammered. for one, i find it highly dubious that anyone would notice that a game they're in went to night, then back to day again, without even looking at how the lynch happened. not reading every post if you're busy, sure, but you're at least gonna look at who hammered, surely.

besides that, while it might explain not voting for ray, it doesn't explain why she votes for mike here. that seems like a pretty relevant point too.

post 590: and she's readin the latest posts but i guess still hasn't noticed that ray hammered pom? i do not believe it.

post 672: snow has been repeatedly remindin everyone how she spearheaded the lynch campaign against tajo on D3, but let's all take a moment to notice that she actively refuted the idea

when anyone else was interested

. yeah.

post 862: this isn't the first time he mentions it, but it's just occured to me with this post; mike specifically suggests that me/tajo is the remaining scum pair throughout D3, but totally changes his mind and switches to attacking snow white after tajo's flip, even though there's a lot less support for her lynch. i know i said earlier that mike attacking snow white didn't strike me as a significant tell either way, but it does now i remember that he was definitely setting up the idea of me and tajo as partners before tajo's death - i don't see why scum mike would go out of his way to bring that up and then never follow through.

post 886: oh rite, here's where his mind changes re: me/tajo pair. makes sense. much like snow, mike's vote on tajo is full of strong and also new reasoning and it comes at a time when a tajo lynch was nothin like inevitable. though more likely at this time than at the time of snow's vote.

post 899: so yeah, snow white's apparently been pushing for a tajo lynch all day, but when it starts to look like one will actually happen, she suddenly gets worried and unvotes. very sus.

post 901: aaaand, this even more. "Actually...... now ive said my peace i can revote Tajo. Because anyone who would hammer would be considered scum if tajo flips innocent." like, could you say "i do not want the person i am voting to actually be lynched" any more clearly than that? i don't think so.

SNOW TOWN/MIKE SCUM

post 171: mike mentions how spyrex hasn't commented much on anyone but mufasa. fine. but then he goes on to specifically talk about how spyrex hasn't said much about ray. that seems like it would be covered in the first part, so it just looks like an attempt to tie spyrex to ray.

this point becomes moot with post 344, mike is clearly not setting spyrex up to look like ray's buddy.

post 202: huh? no one else said anything about wanting to be the hammer. and considerin how long it takes mike to get back to voting ray, this does look like a poor excuse to slow the momentum on that wagon.

post 271: tajo lists both ray and white as town. if white was scum, i think he'd be much more likely to stick her in the neutral section here.

post 633: spyrex dead night 2. i'd say mike had more motivation for making this kill.

post 782: white votes tajo. it is a pretty well explained vote, and it is not reasoning that anyone else has brought forward against tajo.

post 947: wtf, mike. surely you know the "run someone up to a claim, unvote at their claim, run someone else up" cycle is just a horrible idea. why the heck didja need to get any more claims after tajo's?

---

that's everything up to the end of D3, and tajo's death. i guess there might be something worth looking at in the following days, but i tend to think it's a lot less likely that scum will drop significant tells once they're the sole survivor of their team, and frankly there is enough in here to leave me pretty happy to vote for snow white at this point.

gonna wait for responses from all before i do so, but i'm having a hard time seein myself voting for mike now.

[a girl on the internet]

I'm not too worried about this deadline. If nobody gets lynched today then we'll be back tomorrow; either exactly where we left off or without Rhinox, who's here on borrowed time anyway.

ok, this strikes me as a towntell too. i think scum mike would only benefit from the deadline panic, so i don't see why he'd point this out and remove it.

[a girl on the internet]

Your wrong.

is that all you've got?

[a girl on the internet]

here's me not hammering

[a girl on the internet]

snow, you have one post to convince me not to hammer. use it wisely.

[a girl on the internet]

well, alrighty then.

Vote: Snow White

[a girl on the internet]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.