Tales of You (Endgame)

[AngryPidgeon]

Ok, my life is calming down a little. I'll catch up tonight and possibly be around sporadically during the Day.

Nacho: We should talk, how caught up are you in general on Today?
Mastin: We shouldn't talk. I am legitimately flabbergasted at what I've seen, skimming right now. And disappointed in you on a personal level that I wont go into right now. I'd -almost- consider policy lynching you for what you are doing. I'd throw some adjectives out to describe how I feel, but I'd probably just end up swearing at you. Jesus, I really do hope you are scum though since that would actually justify some of this shit.
--
Why did you flop onto Nacho despite them being confirmed-would-game-throw levels of town?
BRO: Can you explain your CF town read to me like Im 5 then? Or Derperado I guess assuming ya'll are on the same page there.

[AngryPidgeon]

Um.

Um.

UM.

how do you know rancid caught their VIG crumb?

oh hi there mastin I bet there are two scum in the Abysm, wanna guess who?

It's probably not GiF, and if you even think about trying to lynch that slot you're not making it to Night 1.

Unlike muffin, I like PV because he's easy to figure out the alignment of, you just have to wait til day four.

By then if he's town, a vig might just shoot him.

Found it! I think, anyway.

Apparently, I misremembered and Rancid didn't point it out, but *I* certainly noticed it. I dunno if it was here or earlier, butyeah. I saw a vig-'crumb, and townned them for it.

Ok, so this stands out like a sore thumb. Mastin, explain why you THOUGHT RBD picked up on this if you can. Not sure what I'm expecting out of that question, but eh. I think as town you may have just been so far up their ass this game that you cannot see them or yourself doing any wrong so of course they must have been smart enough to pick up on this.

I read the Red Gary posts btw, I dont think that was a vig crumb and I REALLY dont get why you brought this up at all; did you ultimately go anywhere with this point?

[AngryPidgeon]

@Titan: Im not buying that was a townslip from PV. I mean... maybe, but:
Lets not cut corners. Scum drop fake towntells all the time, which I'll admit isn't exactly something I'd expect from PV, however I know I get games jumbled in my head frequently and there was a mod announcement about the game going to private topics. Hypothetically everyone should have known and someone suggesting this is sort of a reach to call someone obvious town for forgetting the game is on PTs...which PV probably isn't checking during the Day if he -does- have one. So I don't know. Basically, I think this point is weak enough + fakaeable enough to not really mean anything.

fery: we could 1v1 mastin/ap today

Gladly.

Thing is, though, that'd remove chance of productive content today other than choosing in that fight, soyeah. I'll do it in a heartbeat, just not THIS heartbeat. When the battle drums are sounded, I'll enter the fray to answer their call. But it is not this day, this time.

God this makes me want to just vote you. I've had about enough of mastin for the rest of this game. The circlejerking, the Appeals to Authority, the endless waffling about half the player list in wall format, and posturing on this in a way that will definitely make people want to lynch me if you flip scum. Ugh. Ugh ugh.

[AngryPidgeon]

God this makes me want to just vote you. I've had about enough of mastin for the rest of this game. The circlejerking, the Appeals to Authority, the endless waffling about half the player list in wall format, and posturing on this in a way that will definitely make people want to lynch me if you flip scum. Ugh. Ugh ugh.

And I want you to know that I MEAN THIS.

I know you are going to post some horseshitalong the lines of "AP would never PL me, hes confscum ", fuck off.

You are being a distraction. You are being extremely unproductive. You are actively refusing to take any hints about how your posting comes across and continue to be a fucking babbling zealot and make this game painful to try and catchup on, which is a large reason Im sure why 25% of the players are doing 85% of the posting or whatever.

I'm town. I have LEGITIMATELY had all the mastin I can stand right now. I dont think I've ever actually entertained a policy lynch in my life, but holy fuck it takes all my restraint not to right now.

[AngryPidgeon]

Anyone who calls F-16 town is either scum or in my "ignore this" book for the rest of the game.

DUDE. Can we compromise on F16 today please?

[AngryPidgeon]

I feel like a bomb just went off in the middle of the dinner table and you're passing the gravy here.

Are you referring to Mastin's series of 100 walls as the metaphorical bomb here?

HOLY SHIT. SCUM. THIS IS NOT A TOWN REACTION TO BRO's POST.

Holy shit dat typo.

CF is town. Apparently "isn't" is hard to type :/

What the FUCK, BRO.

Anyone who calls F-16 town is either scum or in my "ignore this" book for the rest of the game.

Ok, please clarify for me. Where was the isn't supposed to go in this sentence and what was your thought process behind correcting this post.

[AngryPidgeon]

BRO, I should be doing work but I dont want to. Get over here and chat at me. I have momentum right now and I just dont wanna stop believing (hold on to that feeeeeeling)

[AngryPidgeon]

NO WAIT SERIOUSLY ARE YOU POSTING TWO YEAR OLD META AS YOUR BASIS FOR READING ME WHEN THE BOARD GAME GAME IS LESS THAN A MONTH OLD AND I'M ACTUALLY MORE ENGAGED IN THIS GAME THAN IN THAT OTHER GAME THAT JUST ENDED AND YOU'RE POSTING TWO YEAR OLD META.

:/ :\
I really don't get whats so egregious about this that is making you rage. Its old meta. People reference old meta semi-frequently, antihero referenced ~2 year old meta of me recently and I just told him he was wrong.

He had me on confirmed would game throw levels of town because he wanted me to feel good. He flopped on me because he's trying to pull the same "Nacho townreading me = Nacho town and Nacho scumreading me = Nacho scum" shit that Ceph pulled in ASOIAF.

Alright Nacho, Bork left me with a weird taste in my mouth so I need something from you. Why is your mastin read is whatever it is right now? I kind of like this reaction; it sort of gels with what I'd expect given mastin's post, even if this is potentially just confirmation bias, but details please.

That wall about my response this game to my response in Wicked is so far in my head that I don't think scum could possibly get there.

WELP. I can't really argue against this point at all. This feels wrongto me though. Why is CF "so town that anyone scumreading him is stupid/scum" when the reason for you townreading him so strongly at all is due to his opinion of an OUTSIDE GAME matching yours. I certainly haven't spent more than 5 minutes skimming that game and I dunno who here actually -has- read it.

But literally none of F16's post was good analysis, it was all IIoA:

- Consider the amount of emotional involvement that BRO has had in the game versus Wicked. Once he and Desp got themselves involved and placed that vote on Rancid, we were dealing with a very tense gamestate and BRO's personal involvement in the game was incredibly high. This was compounded when Rancid were insulting BRO every step of the way. I think the insults furthered the amount of emotional investment that he had in the game and the more they insulted him, the more personally involved he got into getting them lynched. This isn't unusual. When someone is kind and friendly, but a player thinks that they are scum, that player wouldn't be as desperate to get their opponent lynched and they'd be less angry if their opponent got away. What Rancid did in the game was heighten tensions between them and BRO. They trash-talked, insulted BRO's posting, tried to rile him up, took digs at him, challenged him to a gladiator match, sized him up etc. There was really no end to what they did on D1 and you know how Muffin gets when he really wants to rile someone up. I think that BRO reacted to this by getting even more invested in their lynch and wanted them lynched very, very badly.

Tl;DR: Rancid was baiting BRO with trash talk. Tensions were high especially as a result. Is it REALLY alignment indicative to want to lynch someone a lot and be invested mroe because they are talking shit? Fuck no and F16 is sort of implying it is without saying it which is also crap.

- This level of investment doesn't happen very often and the way Mala and Cabd/Penguin persued him in Wicked was markedly different for these reasons. Penguin even told me later that she wanted to work with BRO and had that happened, she would have chosen to neighborize him N1. Malakittens didn't bait BRO, she didn't insult his posting and make him badly, desperately want her dead. She played a fair game and won. Considering that, I wouldn't expect BRO to have the same fury at being lynched in place of his target during Wicked. He was lynched by players that genuinely liked him and cared about him and went about it in a decent way. While he was frustrated, it is not to the extent that it was here.

Tl;DR: BRO didn't act like he did in wicked when getting lynched, but its justifiable. Ok, so? The point? That doesnt mean BRO is town at all.

- Now onto the mechanics of how the lynch happened. BRO-Desp, Pie, and I were pushing the wagon on Rancid and it seemed likely that it would go through. At least upon Pie's replacement, the likelihood of a Rancid lynch magnified. This gave BRO hope that they would be lynched. The wagon stalled at times, and I could sort of sense BRO metaphorically drumming his fingers on the table waiting for the lynch to be pushed through at deadline. It was by no means a guarantee, but there was a good chance it would go through and I think BRO was waiting on tenterhooks for it to happen. It was almost assured that he, BRO, wouldn't be lynched. It was either going to be his choice of lynch (Rancid), or a lynch he would prefer not to happen (a lurker), and that was the dichotomy that BRO was looking at. Nacho came in and starting shaking the wagons around just when momentum on the Rancid wagon was stalling and I could tell some of the hope was lost and the disappointment started to etch through like a crash after a sugar high. It became apparent that he would fail and all the work was for nothing. I think anyone would be disappointed and upset.

Tl;DR: BRO REALLY wanted to lynch RBD. Once again, not a fucking tell? Not by its own at least. This is more IIoA and while I tend to agree with his conclusion, his way of reaching it feels excessively drawn out because it looks better than simply stating that BRO's zeal felt town.

- From that emotional state, I think the final straw that broke down BRO was the sudden flashwagon on his slot at deadline. So, here we had BRO pushing the Rancid wagon by slowly working through obstacles to finally get this lynch through, and all of sudden, it seems not only is his adversary getting away, but he himself was being wagoned with no resistance at all. It was an astonishing sight to watch from the outside and I can see why BRO who was the target would meltdown at that point. After all the insults from Rancid, the sizing up, the dick-measuring, everything, and he, BRO is target of a dumb deadline wagon that some people hopped onto without a care in the world. This wasn't the case in Wicked. He was battling a worthy opponent (Malakittens) and she won fairly. There was frustration if you read the Wicked thread closely. BRO was annoyed. Just not as much as he was here.

Tl;DR: This is not BRO from wicked, but his meltdown made sense because he was getting wagoned for no reason. Once again, this has no actual opinion in it. Just an enormous waffle stating that BRO being upset at being wagoned makes sense. Guess what? Scum get upset at being wagoned for shit reasons too! I know I have in pretty much all my scum games ever.

-

Look at it from a scum POV: there is no way BRO as scum is this invested in getting a lynch

. He wants to survive sure, but the burning desire for Rancid to die and the constant and consistent efforts to make it happen is highly unlikely to come from scum. This is most of what I was referring to from the neighborhood. It is apparent that BRO wants Mastin and Rancid both lynched with an intensity that I've rarely encountered before. He didn't meltdown because he cared about surviving as scum. I think he melted down because his efforts were not only ignored, but at a very, very crucial, critical point when he was losing hope in achieving his goal, the wagon, almost unbelievably turned right at him and it was no longer a question of whether he could get Rancid lynched but of whether Rancid could get him lynched.

Tl;DR: Ok, first off the underlined is terrible. Scum get invested in lynches all the fucking time (Majiffy in Street Racers, Dr.Pepper on me in that Micro game, off the top of my head). Scum aren't just playing to not get lynched. Scum are 100% capable of being emotionally invested in the game and getting upset when they lose, its just human nature. F16's case sure is a lot of words, but I really don't like the points he is masking in all his smoke here.

--

Why is F16 talking about Wicked mafia so much since he agrees that BRO acted differently there? If he thinks BRO was different in Wicked Mafia, why the fuck is it such a central part of the wall in his explanation for BRO being town? It shouldnt be and he keeps restating the same goddamn point which comes back to "Well ok BRO wasnt like this in Wicked mafia, but I think RBD taunting him makes it make sense here". The rest of his case is mostly restating that tensions were in fact high on D1 and that BRO's meltdown, was not in fact scummy.

Basically the entire wall is arguing that
1) Scum wouldn't tunnel on RBD (despite RBD tunneling on them and insulting them on a personal level)
2) The meltdown was not explicitly scum motivated and looked genuine.
with enormous amounts of unnecessary references to wicked mafia to talk about how BRO was different there.

What the fuck actually resonated with you in this pile? There is no actually good analysis in their other than those 2 points ^ fluffed up ad nauseum with references to wicked mafia thrown in. F16 is 100% capable of making the point that you behaved differently in Wicked mafia as scum. Its really REALLY obvious that games are always different and that this one has been an emotional clusterfuck from the get-go.
So what are you seeing there that looks SO TOWN MOTIVATED that they must be town?

[AngryPidgeon]

Alright Nacho, Bork left me with a weird taste in my mouth so I need something from you. Why is your mastin read is whatever it is right now? I kind of like this reaction; it sort of gels with what I'd expect given mastin's post, even if this is potentially just confirmation bias, but details please.

Confirmation bias? How do you figure that?

Ok, maybe this is why I want to see your progression mastin more transparently cause TBH I feel like the hydra was 90% Bork and I never caught any wind of him wanting to vote mastin.

Im just saying that mastin went from calling you conftown for a fairly shitty reason to "lolol Nacho is obvscum cause he isnt townreading me" which...if that happened to me I know I'd be looking a lot like

Do you think mastin could have said that as town is what Im getitng at, I get the potential scum-motivation/scumminess behind it, but I can see it being from town, especially considering the level of derp mastin is determined to play at right now.

p-edit: @Titan. Town. I think. There are a couple things about mastin that bother me alignment-wise (and a ton of things that make me want to just lynch her regardless), but I think shes town. Shes melting down and actively deluding herself about that. I think as scum she'd be more focused and controlled. Not impossible, more later on that hopefully cause there is one thing that feels off to me in a deja-vu sort of way, but the sheer amount of fucking nonsense coming from her right now with no self-screening at all is probably from town. When mastin word-vomits as scum there is at least generally a theme to it of some sort. Mastin has been way too all over the place this game for her to be probable scum IMO.

That said, her flop on Bork really bothers me and that one-liner about RBD having caught the Vig crumb (and also outing the perceived crumb) make me squint at my screen realllly hard.

The former I can see town motivation for, however bad it matches with the deluded world that mastin is currently posting from. The latter could just be a legitimate scum slip and involves RBD and mastin being scum together which would be fairly earth shattering for me, but I am thinking about it. BRO and Desp seem to find it likely and I -do- trust their judgement a little (they are one of the few I actually trust to read mastin other than myself) even if I dont like to admit to trusting others ever

[AngryPidgeon]

progression mastin

progression on*** mastin

[AngryPidgeon]

Alright, I realize I missed a few pages before these last couple..random thoughts:

Fox/Hound: Can you two explain where exactly you stand on everyone right now and on reads that you disagree on, why? Im having a hard time recalling/tracking what you two actually are thinking. Your vote on me and unvote (fake edit) and vote on mastin and unvote is really non-committal. Do you actually have a reason for thinking Cupcake is scum or is that just a whatever vote?

Desperado: What is your read on Beli/ffery exactly?

Holy shit. Holy shit. Holy shit. holy shit. Please just be scum.

Belisarius: What is your read on Brian Skies and why? Have you talked about it with Ffery at all?

I can squint and make out a cupcake/mastinssk team, maybe. I dunno.

Is this based on connections or just individual posting? I still have less than zero thoughts on Panda's alignment.

The game still leads right back to MastinSSK and AngryPidgeon. Happy to see Mastin getting lynched today. I want to hear if anyone has any other thoughts before moving forward.

What are you honestly expecting people to say? Is there anyone in particular you think needs time to read and/or generate content?

Officially not reading mastin posts for now unless they get referenced somehow because fuck that.

re Mastin vote: We've talked it over a little bit. I still feel conflicted about the slot while DV still leans scum on it. We're both pretty strapped for scumreads.

Huh well this might explain why you have both felt fairly lackluster Today. Do either of you have a read on: PV, Nacho, F16?

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm pretty sure you did not answer this. I'm pretty sure I want it answered.

I think that was one of those two clownfucks arguing that me saying "I got a result on Kagura" and saying that "My role targeted Kagura but failed" was inconsistent.

At least that was how I interpreted and responded to it at the time, they can correct me if that wasn't their point.

But the other problem I have is that you created an imaginary dialogue with you and AP saying that you and Rancid buddying hard as scum while bussing Hawk is unlikely for you to do as scum as well as the you-AP back and forth but is it really? When Rancid was being wagoned, you, Rancid, and AP all worked really well in tandem to put in your best effort to derail the lynch. That fits in quite well with what you would do as scum. A pseudo-townbloc consisting of scum.

Yes and if you read Anytihng Goes, or any mastin game, you'd know that the odds of mastin bussing me to hell and back with us being scum/scum are reallllly low, bordering on not happening ever.

Tammy: What is your read on JSU? I noticed you mentioned lynching them then sort of dropped it despite no content from them that I can recall.

Another worldview is that Nacho and ffery are scum (either one of them or both of them). This is a little weaker but I wouldn't completely rule out ffery not voting at all on Mastin but happily voting BRO at deadline. (As an aside, I know you suspect them but you'd know there is not a chance they are scum if you see the neighborhood thread so I am basically assuming they are town and seeing who votes them). I also wouldn't rule out Breakfast being the last scum along with Mastin/Rancid/AP either. But there are a few things that heavily made me lean town on ffery so I am holding back. And her explanation that she didn't want to lynch Nati's townread in order to save him isn't a bad one either.

Uhhhhh. Explain your ffery reasoning to me slowly. This flows awkwardly with the rest of your post. First, Kagura could be scum (but dunno if it fits with your view). Then Maybe ffery and/or Kagura are scum but ffery is pretty town? Why bring her up here? Who would be scummy if Stalin/Kagura were scum together?

[AngryPidgeon]

Though Clyton did mention thinking we had a lurker, I don't know why he thought that.

Probably because its just the two of you in the neighborhood and the other supposedly had 3? that sort of independent thinking sounds town though.

I'm still concerned about desp/bro, and I know meltdown yada yada but what I'm concerned about is if you look at BRO in Wicked when he was run up and compare it to here, it just doesn't feel the same.

Ok, this justifies a bit of CF waffling about Wicked Mafia as much as he did, I didnt realize there was more context to that.

You've been a nullread. Not a scumread. But assuming a scum gladiator. Not a chance in fucking hell would it be Rancid.

K, so this is just untrue given your narrow suspect pool which has Orcinus in it rather verbosely. And the bit about gladiators is irrelevant and doesn't really mesh with you reportedly thinking Orcinus is 'null' right here.

In fact, Orcinus comes out looking pretty town here.

Except that you're trying to have cake while eating it. The circumstances of your claim were desperation, and a need to use the role to 'prove' yourself. Rancid, not so much.

Thus, of the two, Rancid's was townier.

It's a trivial argument overall, though. Since I'm not even sure of a scum gladiator. (I suspect as much, though.)

Huh, maybe mastin is just scum. This argument with Orcinus is really terrible. Orcinus claimed because he was getting ran up. That doesnt make him any more or less likely to be scum. And mastin is seemingly simultaneously arguing that one of the gladiators is probably scum and therefore must be orcinus (terrible) and also that the claim itself was scummy despite them being a "null read". I mean wow the cognitive dissonance is at an all new level here.

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm seriously tempted to just go, "Kagura's alignment aside, this is just scumposting", but I realize that's not exactly the most productive thing to say.

Since when has your posts not being productive stopped you even remotely in this game?

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm just not real sure what's going on this game. I feel like there are several alternate universes in play right now and I can't figure out which one is the real one.

Probably none of them. People put too much stock in townblocking and taking sides.

Remember HPATPL? that game basically became MoI vs Mastin for a Day phase or three and people kind of lined up on different sides of the fence. I know my scumteam divided itself on the issue of lynching you and definitely ended up in different camps on that central mastin/moi walls being flung up.

TBH, I'm not reading any posts from anybody that make me want to just trust them this game.

I get your paranoia of BRO/Desp. If F16 is actually town, I may end up looking there. After catching up a lot of posts really quick, I see they are sort of coasting on Yesterday's towncred and opinions. I havent seen anything very intereting from them recently except Desperado's push on Stalin which I don't really understand the origin of.

At this point Im gonna try and get down where I stand for my own sake. Also, I think clyton said something I want to respond to when I can.

Probably Town:
Tammy. The few concerns I had when catching up here were pretty much already addressed by the time I finished and Im just having a hard time seeing a lot of her posts coming from scum, especially the ones about out of game things which I guess may seem on the weaker side of reasons to be townreading he but all the self-auditing and admitted uncertainty looks extremely town to me.
Clyton. Newish player. Looks to be pursuing his own train of thoughts rather than caring what other people think about them so much. I think that tidbit about a lurker in the neighborhood is extremely more likely to come from paranoid newbtown than scum doing god knows what.

huh and thats a bit depressing that there is no one else I really feel comfortable putting into this list.

Less-strongly-Town:
JSU. Im seeing arrogance from BRO which ultimately makes me want to townread them. Desperado's posting has left a lot to be desired and their presence Today has been fairly weak. Their opinions have been mostly static (the Stalin pressure form Desp being the only thing that really wasnt that I see) and everything else they've said looks pretty conf-biasy regardless. That said, I think they are town from their play yesterday. BRO looked really smug which is probably from town and I dont knoe if BRO is insane enough to meltdown like that as scum. Like it looked pretty town and Im sure the emotion was genuine, but I just have a hard time with that cause I know I -could- do that as scum. Oh and I get the constant paranoia that BRO is scum and WKing me cause every time I say something that disagrees with him he constantly reminds me that hes the only person to correctly read me and I just want that to be town so much. But ya, all that paranoia aside, think they are town mostly from D1 play.

Orcinus. The large lack of content from this slot is annoying, but the mini-war with Mastin and the "lets 1v1" seemed fairly unabashedly town to me. If I were super motivated, Id probably read Teenwolf mafia to compare him to, but I wont cause fuck that. The reaction to mastin calling him scummy for his role looked town for reasons Im having a hard time articulating which maybe is partly why Orcinus isn't in my higher tier list which I briefly considered putting him in. I just have a hard time seeing Orcinus as scum pushing on mastin so hard for that. It felt really strongly that Orcinus believed his points against mastin I guess.

Fox/Hound: Sort of a tammy-ish read but to a lesser extent. I have a little bit of a hard time folllowing where they want to go, but their reported lack of scumreads does make a lot of sense with their behavior and the hydra dissonance they post is pretty damn artful if they are actually scum. So not an extremely good read here. Oh, I remember really liking their response to pressure when getting wagoned. They just feel open/honest this game and lacking in any specific agenda.

Stalin?: I feel like Stalin has been a pinata for the last few pages. A lot of people seem to be holding them to standards and sort of BoPing them a little. I want to talk to Beli a little more to solidify this and TBH my main reason for listing them here is gut and is partially influenced by the general flow of everyone else having them as town D1. More on them later when Im not time crunched.

Mastin:
Mastin. Not really much more to add on this. I have mixed emotions right now about the Vigilante crumb bullshit and Mastin's argument with Orcinus which looked terrible once I actually sat down and read it on my computer. Still I don't think Im wrong about her bring town so I may just stubbornly take that read to the grave. At this point, can I lynch her for the toldYaSo and policy lynch factor? Maybe.

-----
Hmmm:
F-16, Nacho, PV, Panda, Yggdra, Red Gary.

More on these in a bit. Except Panda. I legitimately have nothing there.

[AngryPidgeon]

But AP - what do you make of Mastin's posts to Ffery last night?

Looking..(why do you torture me, have I offended you greatly? )

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p5859763
I see mastin admitted that she isn't actually accomplishing anything finally. That is a positive step towards recovery. Other than that, mostly QQ about Stalin not working with them. Im pretty over that sentiment this game from everyone. Also in all games. Im just over that sentiment.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p5859779
This was all ffery and not Beli? I think mastin is wrong in calling her Conf-biasing since Ffery has been saying that she is explicitly waffling on mastin's alignment and TBH it did look terrible that mastin was interjecting to buddy up to F16's questions when BRO -DID- just post something from left field about F16 that stalin was trying to clarify F-16's reaction about with F-16. Which is pretty town motivated actually since I know I looked at their reaction and hated it. They didnt jump to the same conclusion, but still them finding it interesting makes complete sense to me. so mastin accusing them of being blatantly sucm motivated is missing the forest for the trees and I could see that being from scum. The follow up makes little sense, but meh. MEH.

All I see is mastin still refusing to understand that shes being insufferable by spamming the thread and regurgitating opinions and posturing over and over again and refusing to understand WHY someone might not want to interact with her. Shes sort of using the same point on me to scumread me, so yeh.

People seem to think that is similar to a scumgame of mastins that I haven't rad. In my vacuum I still think this fits with mastin just being batshit insane town.

P-edit: IF you think I have any intent of rading those...Well I mgiht cause I need something to do as I walk to lunch.

[AngryPidgeon]

I looked at their reaction and hated it

Their reaction being CF's reaction to BRO.

[AngryPidgeon]

Cf, it really annoys me that you can just ignore comments and questions directed at you so readily by people who aren't Tammy.

Tammy: Why should PV have you as scum right now??

[AngryPidgeon]

Its like your primary concern is pandering to Tammy to stay in her good graces.

[AngryPidgeon]

Actually Belisarius is 90% of the reason I think Stalin is town.

ffery has been non-commital and wishywashy. Beli is actually fairly transparent with his thoughts.

[AngryPidgeon]

Jesus. you wonder why RBD was so pissed off at you, this is why. You are so fucking full of yourself. Its been a great displeasure this game CF.

Go fuck yourself.

[AngryPidgeon]

I want to hear if anyone has any other thoughts before moving forward.

That's exactly what I was worried would happen with Mastin and AP making a ton of noise but neither getting lynched and lurkertown was deadline lynched instead.

UNVOTE: ; VOTE: Carbon Fiber

Id continue the line of questioning I started about your lack of vote and all that, but I just cant be fucked too. This vote probably wont move before deadline.

P-edit: Except you aren't doing that because I was explicitly trying to be reasonable in my catchup and you flatout ignored my questions that were rather tangible and reasonable just to blow me off and give me some shit about my wallpost that I half took-back after realizing it was in response to Titan talking about Wicked.

[AngryPidgeon]

to*.

[AngryPidgeon]

Oh also you are scumreading me and mastin and RBD on a connection case that is just bad. And I tried to talk to you about that and that got blown off as well. There is LITERALLY no way mastin or I would be doing this as scum buddies. Literally. And from someone who has apparently been wellread in mastin meta, you should know this.

Your holding back and waiting for something to happen makes no sense given that you are also expressing paranoia that not acting will result in another lurker lynch. That is scummy cogmnitive dissonance.

Your ignoring my questions because "Im scum and you dont care" is scummy and Im over it.

I dont care that literally everyone is misreading you in this game. I dont think Ive accused a single damn person of misrepping anything in this game, so your little tidbit of what an argument with me is like is just a deflection. The only person Ive been having crap arguments with this game is mastin, through no fault of my own. But Ive pretty much given up caring about her for that reason.

P-edit: no, Im not.

[AngryPidgeon]

And you trying to get the Vig to out themself does not mesh with you absolute 100% conviction that RBD was/is scum.

[AngryPidgeon]

Also, if a vig killed Rancid and know their affiliation, it might not be a bad idea to speak up. Just remembered I played a game offsite where there was a janitor vig and only the vig was informed of the target's affiliation.

If anyone does know Rancid's affiliation right now, it would be helpful to reveal.

Im not buying this sentiment.

ESPECIALLY because you believe yourself to have hard CC'd RBD at multiple points both Yesterday and Today:

Also, I obviously was personally involved with the whole cc'ing miller thing so was more certain than someone watching from the outside. I don't know how it looks like from your viewpoint so I want to see where you are coming from.

I got irritated when she defended Rancid even after he was cc'd

[AngryPidgeon]

And why are you so certain that RBD janitored by town?

If mastin is scum with RBD, surely her team would have mountains of motivation to Janitor RBD if possible.

[AngryPidgeon]

Maybe. But after that back-and-forth with Bulbazak in that Micro game, I have an aversion towards interacting with players that I can sense will create a lot of noise if interacted with and too little content

Once again, I can and am blaming mastin for that.

[AngryPidgeon]

Me, I'd talk to you all sweet and nice like you convinced me you weren't scum to try and get you to out your buddies. And I might do it poorly, but other than that I'd probably not much listen to you.

Point is, trying to work with someone that thinks you're scum is hard to do, so not sure why you are trying to work with Carbon and then getting bent out of shape about it when he doesn't want to.

Ok, I might rant a little here and it might be peripherally related, but Im gonna try and stay on track. I *HATE* the whole "X is treating me like town despite having a scumrad on me, they must be scum" tell. That almost always lands on town and I think its terrible to expect someone to treat scumreads like DGB does just because they are scum. Doing that is arrogant and encourages confirmation bias. If F16 is town, if he took maybe one iota of effort to interact with me and indulge my attempts to scumhunt him, maybe he would wake the fuck up and stop shoving a crappy connection case to me on Mastin because Mastin and I have apparently been just x-bussing and scum theatreing all game (because apparently we really are just bad. He hasnt made a single comment about why Im scummy other than Im just clearly getting bussed to hell and back by BOTH my buddies and being upset about it so I must be scum. And despite my attempts to try and ask him questions about perceived inconsistencies he doesn't actually bother to help me or himself by even acknowledging that I said jackshit. And when I call him on it I get a "Ya whatever, I may or may not respond to you later cause I dont care" when his "scumread" on me is based on unflipped players in the first place and hes either too scum or too arrogant to reconsider it. Instead he spends all his time whispering sweet nothings in Tammy's ear and insulting me on a personal level.

So I really dont care. I did honestly try to be civil just now and that worked like shit for me so its back to tunnelfuck mode.

[AngryPidgeon]

Actually Belisarius is 90% of the reason I think Stalin is town.

ffery has been non-commital and wishywashy. Beli is actually fairly transparent with his thoughts.

Yeah but being non-committal and wishy washy isn't necessarily a scumtell. I feel non-committal and wishy washy right now. Why isn't it a problem for you that I am?

I don't think its a scumtell or I'd be waffling harder on them. I just find it annoying and its difficult for me to parse. I read players who are more stream of thoughts oriented better (*sigh, mastin*) because I like to read things carefully and just take in the opinions and feel out whether or not I can see that player doing that. People who are all over the place are easier to do that for in my opinion cause they document readily all the things that make them think what they think. Its less about the content and more about whether I think the opinions match omething reasonable. Ffery has been rather nebulous this game and that was part of my pressure on her D1 was to get her to do something (like lay a vote down) so I could pass a better judgment there.

Belisarius posts are more flash-bang and I can get a sense of where he is looking and why. In particular, I think his mastin pressure looks town from him.

P-edit: lol.

[AngryPidgeon]

And when AP did show up, Bro comes up with some half-assed reason to townread AP. I still don't like it but you guys say he's been town as shit in his neighborhood.

Bleh, I sort of touched on this in my last list. Basically, I agree. Emotionally, BRO's focus has looked town and the breakdown has felt town. Their read on me and general lack of progression (cause lol neighborhood?, except not really cause they haven't updated their reads either way) looks sketchy. And I still really don't like BRO hinting that him townreading me should make me trust his reads and him this game...constantly.

I just think Nacho is more likely to deflect onto easy mislynches when he's scum. The timing of the Orci wagon was terrible and something I don't think would have benefited town at all.

He also tried to wagon me and I claimed before it got a huge amount of traction. But I think hes scum on that or someone who sheeped it fast was. Would have to look.

Notty doesn't like Orci's lack of trajectories or some other stuff that I haven't read through yet. I don't think his cagefight choices are particularly damning because:

I think the mastin trajectory looks legit from him.

I actually completely missed you claiming yesterday for some reason (I may have been selectively ignoring you, I don't know). I also share the same game flavor as you and would now be interested in a neighborhood if you're town (apparently the game Notty chose isn't as obscure as I thought?).

I also find all the votes on you pretty hilarious when the things you've said regarding your claim checks out from Day 1.

Is it just us in the hypothetical neighborhood? I'd still like that regardless.

Also, I find it strange for people to roll a 'cop' role and still have trouble keeping up or being motivated to play a game (with regards to the hydra that actually rolled 'modified cop'). It's just w/e though and I'm not holding any weight in it.

Im having motivation issues? You cant be serious. I was on V/LA last week in all my games due to being out of town and having a bomb blow up on me at work. I've put in a fuckton of effor on D1 and I lagged a bit on D2 but am back in force now.

Your target is notified of your investigation?

Not that Im aware of. Bork did not seem to know that I had (although can easily be scum faking) and indicated that he had reason to -know- that I was roleblocked. Actually I still want to clarify that with Nacho cause he sort of dodged me bringing that topic up.

How does roleblocking you make any of your investigation targets likely to be town? If you're not going to get your result, they can just choose one of their own and not give any fucks about it.

Because Bork explicitly said something about me not receiving a result was consistent with his knowledge of the game state. I.e. I think they could be a Mafia Ascetic or something and I was allowed to target them BECAUSE it would cause my role to fail and potentially make them look town in the process.

Hmm? Maybe. Wondering if Mac was deadset on targeting Kagura and AP wasn't just roleblocked.

Ya, also possible. This is another avenue that Im thinking along that could explain why Nacho knows I was blocked (self-voyeur or something?)

Not really of relevance, but did you know that people who claim they are 99% sure of something actually tend to be wrong more often than not?

Heh. There might be some truth to that. I recall calling 99% sure in that first mini normal with mastin that the team was her and 2 other people and all 3 were ton . Also mastin quoted me saying that and said "Whats the 1% for, backpedaling after you ML us??". Good times.

[AngryPidgeon]

Like hell it won't. 'Specially if I ticked you off. (Well, I'm not going to do so intentionally, but I'm not going to go out of my way to not tick you off, sooooooooooooooo...)

You know I love you.

Well, yeah, he was, but now, he's looking at other factors, other things about us.

Bullshit. There was large amounts of drama cause Muffin was trying to get them to explain any of their scumreads yesterday and they refused for pages and pages. I have yet to see anything today that explains it at all.

F-16 is reconsidering his stances on the matter. Like, thinking we're both scum but knowing only one of us would be, for instance.

I havent really seen any indication of this either. At all. What.

As scum, I'd want to take a fucking stance or two and let the attention drift elsewhere.

Eh, I guess. It occurs to me that I've never actually seen you as scum before. It kind of felt that way this game though with your towntowntown reads on Bork/Titan/?Mac? and then just sort of coasting from there. But thats mostly irrelevant. I guess I am somewhat expecting Ffery from Xenosaga who actually scumread Flandre D1 and rolled with that pretty hard and Im not seeing it here. But thats just a niggle on my end that is irrelevant. I still think you are probstown. Can you explain your current read on Nacho?

eta: x-posts. tia for the response carbon thing

[AngryPidgeon]

I am considering different possibilities.

What exactly are you considering? If RBD were town, would it notably affect your reads / where would you go? It just seems so odd to me to fish for that information. That is partly because it never occurred to me anyone would know (except scum obv). I strongly doubt Mac could have been killed from anything other than scum, so I suppose I agree that they make sense as a town kill. My kneejerk reaction to that was to wonder why you didn't ask inside your neighborhood since the highest concentration of people scumreading RBD seem to be in there (Yggdra, JSU iirc). Instead you ask everyone which I dont quite get the motivation for to assume you have been wrong about your reads all this time despite having a very large conviction to the contrary.

It is possible that you are conf-biased town seeing more and more new reasons to confbias your original read but I don't think that that is the case. For one, I can tell you are a sharp player in general, possibly objective, and able to see through the surface level to find deeper motivations. That's what I gathered from the way you play. You insistence on calling me scummy with new reasons each time feel like opportunism.

I mean, opportunism? I think Im actually literally the only person in the thread with a scumread on you and have been since RBD fell off a cliff last night. Opportunism suggests that I am getting some sort of easy scum advantage for hedging an opinion on you, which Id love to hear what that could be cause I've mostly gotten flak from the entire player base (Mastin, JSU, you, others?) for my read on you that I ultimately just sort of stopped caring at the start of D2.

I think you and Mastin are quite capable of coming up with new interactions each time you are scum together. Do you feel that your interactions are so set in stone that you won't try a distancing tactic for once?

Ok, I'll admit its not "impossible" for us to do this as scum/scum, but why do you think its likely the case? You spent all D1 talking about how mastin and I were just creating noise and saying we were both scum with RBD. Im most certainly biased on the issue given that Im town and townreading both of those players, but I just have an extremely hard time seeing why someone would find this -likely-. Mastin has a fairly extensive history of not bussing and is proud of it. Im more sporadic, but I would never bus a buddy so hard when they are actually salvageable and when me bussing them could be the tipping point in a lynch.

--
Re Town case on BRO. I think my main beef when I read that was the extensive references to Wicked. It felt like you were trying to overjustify the read. You kept acknowledging that BRO wasnt playing like Wicked as if you -should- have a good reasson to think hes scum but were somehow determined to townread him and wanted to be explicit that about ...Im at a lack for a word right now, gah. Covering your bases? It felt a little guilty in nature I guess and weird to presuppose that BRO wasnt playing to town meta and then conclude the opposite. I didnt see Tammy had explicitly referenced Wicked as a meta point on BRO until after I responded. So I recant a bit of my feelings there.

The incredulity that he was wagoned came from a justified feeling that he was right. He felt that the "right" thing to happen was for RBD to get lynched and all of a sudden, him getting lynched was startling. Scum do get frustrated at being caught for the wrong reasons. That's not what BRO's frustration looked like. He was frustrated at the idea that someone could think that he was scum more than any particular argument.

Hm. This is goingto just have to be an agree to disagree point I guess. I just know that as scum Im totally capable of freaking out and convincing myself that I am right and town.

Actually, that reminds me of something I wanted to talk about re Mastin. Because I know in Game of Champions mafia (I was scum) I tried SO HARD. I busted my ass that game and ended up winning. At some point, mastin commented on the game and mentioned that I had an unhealthy obsession with winning as scum. And I think she said something here that felt like she was actively ignoring that side of me that she is fully aware of and called me scummy for something else.....But ya ignore this bit until I actually find what I was looking for.

Fake edit: Ugh. I dunno anymore. I think its just Yggdra. I cant remember a single good reason for anyone finding them to be town. Im quickly entering Lord Patator realms of waffling here and I dont wanna. I dont have that much snaity left : [

[AngryPidgeon]

"I don't really trust anyone" *next line* "I'm basically trusting you".

Ya, no. By trust anyone I mean "trust anyone's reads". you cant actually be arguing that I said I dont have any townreads and then listed them as town. And I dont typically just trust anyone's reads. Its not very common for me to pull the townblock + synch method of scumhunting.

This read feels out of place overall, though. Seems too low.

What does this even mean? You think I should be throwing heaps of townpoints at them for the meltdown? I called it town, I just am wary of things like this for good reason (read any scumgame of mine)

And his posting really doesn't seem to be reflecting these as his scumreads.

Im going to throw my computer out the window. you are actually joking right? First off, this is a PoE pool. Second, I've been scumreading/voting Kagura pretty much all game and similarly for PV on D1. F16 has also been a constant scumread and its pretty hilarious to have just responded to his post telling me that my posting all games indicates the exact opposite of what you are saying here. What am I supposed to say? I cant please you cause you are conf-biasing on me and making these throwaway one liners about me instead of ever engaging me on my Nacho/Bork read or anything. IDGI. I really dont. Oh and I also am getting simultaneous accusations from you about being unmotivated and F16 for posting too fucking much.

Don't think. AP would ever truly consider. An actual policy-lynch.

Then why did you also post this:

This vote probably wont move before deadline.

Like hell it won't. 'Specially if I ticked you off. (Well, I'm not going to do so intentionally, but I'm not going to go out of my way to not tick you off, sooooooooooooooo...)

Thus, why focusing on what was obviously a typo was...
...Nothing but a distraction.

It wasn't obviously a typo, I know I read it and got excited at first. It wasnt even phrased in a way that looked like an obvious Typo. And you yourself are trying to argue you think Stalin is town now, so clearly you can see why your scumread on them over this is bad, right?

because scumreading either of them is a red flag

Also Id like to point out that you have admitted to blindly NKing zMuffin in another game despite him townreading your slot and are arguing that he was a scumkill here.
And you scumread me in Anything Goes. "But AP I thought you were actually scum!!!".. "Then you actually are terrible at reading me in that event cause I was pretty obviously town there and still am here.

[AngryPidgeon]

UNVOTE:

Im going to actually do some work. Go fora relaxing trip to Safeway. Smoke some stuff. And think about this game carefully.

NACHO: If you see this, meet me down at the town square for a good old quick draw duel to the death around 7pm PST. Or just we could talk about the weather I guess instead if you'd prefer.

[AngryPidgeon]

I have a hard time seeing your push coming from town because my posts have been genuine and transparent enough that my thought processes and motivation is obvious.

Except that you pretty actively refused to talk to me (and admittedly so) so you cant play this card that you are surprised I dont find you transparent. All I've seen from you is talking backandforth with Tammy and never updating your reads on anybody. You've actually admitted to having precisely 3 scumreads all game afaict (Me, mastin, RBD) and your townreads have been fairly static as well (the neighborhood and Tammy mostly).

RBD got upset because they asked you for pages to explain your scumreads and they kept getting upset that you WERENT and I agree with their take on that. So I really would not hold that you are transparent and I mean I guess I can see you thinking you are since everyone should be transparent to themself >.>. I think mastin looks pretty transparent this game.

[I also find it hard to believe that you staunchly believe in Mastin being town even after he pushed you and scumread you for it. You are writing him off as bad town consistently no matter how hard and prolonged the push has been today.

Wow, I really am going to just heave this computer right out the window. Why should I scumread mastin just because she is pushing me? That is what you are actually admitting to doing on me I suppose, but wow. Being wrong is not a scumtell and I really think mastin has been fairly transparent, I mean shes basically using the thread as her personal blog which is anti-town and obnoxious, but it makes her feel really genuine.

--

Ok lets try this then. What are you still hoping to accomplish today / what has been accomplished today? Your reads seem 100% unchanged from halfway through D1. Mastin is a revolving door. Ffery is still waffling but has downgraded Bork to somewhere still above the lynch line. Why no vote?

[AngryPidgeon]

Except that you pretty actively refused to talk to me (and admittedly so) so you cant play this card that you are surprised I dont find you transparent.

And its not even just now. This all started back on D1 over the DV meta that you explicitly brought up as a reason to townread them. I meantioned it and asked you to clarify and you kept stalling/waffling on it instead of actually justifying it. You finally did, but not before giving me the run around about your self-meta and various excuses for NOT doing it.

[AngryPidgeon]

AP I wrote you a fucking novel about my nachobork read. :/

Err, I guess I didn't have any follow up on that. I was wondering if you/Beli coollectively were interested in lynching them at all and I guess you aren't.

Your trajectory on that makes sense to me though.

[AngryPidgeon]

Yet we're in the top 5% of theme games ever played, page-wise.

And we're still climbing.

Yes and thats not pro-town. Stop it.

Yes, but still a scum pool all the same. My posting is more akin to how I'd expect a town-you to be handling a scumlist with those names.

I found this picture of you.

So what of those 6 Poe scumreads (Cupcake, Yggdra, Kagura, PV, F-16, Red Gary) doesn't make sense? Cause I know at least 3 of those make a ton of sense from my previous content yet you ignored that.

Wut. Like. You're using a completely and entirely random post. You'd vote me, especially if emotional. It wouldn't be on policy, nor would it be a proper policy-lynch. (There's a difference between voting and advocating the lynch of a player.)

Yes. Thus, was playing like town. If I'm scum and know you to be town, I need to SAY you are town. If I'm scum and actually think you are scum, then I don't. You're proving my point, not dismantling i

No I think I did just prove that your statement that you dont scumread me as scum ever is either a blatant lie. You have been arguing that you DONT scumread me as scum which is a lie.

Killed him anyway, fully aware that whatever his read on me may have been? It was going to turn into a scumread.

Just saying, you conveniently forgot to bring up that you-scum has 100% motivation to scum kill RBD in this game.

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm really curious about this because I'm pretty sure you heavily implied that both of you should be aware of your 'investigative action.'

If I did, it was only because I was still defaulting to thinking they were scum and would therefore know.

[AngryPidgeon]

As to what I hope to accomplish, I want all my townreads to get on the same page and agree on lynching someone that we genuinely all agree is scum, and preferably not have a repeat of D1 with bad deadline wagons.

Im gonna be as straight as I possibly can be (which takes effort considering how

fabulous

gay I am): these goals are highly mutually exclusive, as evidenced by yesterday.

extent PV, Cupcake

Why are these townreads? PV I can almost see. His frustration with mastin at places made me waver on my read a bit (although Im concerned I just WANT to agree with it). I havent read too much of PV v Tammy in depth Today although I dont see why PV would necessarily stick his neck out like that if he didn't have to.

Panda though? Why panda?

[AngryPidgeon]

Are you concerned about the strength and switch of my trajectory on mastin? Because that's a different thing entirely and has nothing to do with confirmation bias.

Uh I suppose so. You looked like you were already scumreading mastin and then she dropped that bomb about you being scum for not townreading her and you were quick to call that scum motivated.

because he believes there is either a town!Nacho that reads him right or a scum!Nacho that reads him wrong, and his thinking wrt that is completely binary.

Yes? Mastin has been pretty egotistical this game. I think half the reason shes scumreading me is because she cant admit to herself that Im being 100% honest about finding her play atrocious (and here Rg is supposed to be the atrocious pokemon) so shes just somehow convinced herself I must be scum in order to feel better about herself. I really do think that is a thing that is happening. Mastin will deny it, but thats part of the whole denial approach she seems to be stuck in this game.

p-edit:

[AngryPidgeon]

He's trying to back me into that corner as we speak: he talks about how town-Nacho would try to work with him and figure out his alignment as opposed to put him closer to death as his head's on the chopping block and votes me because supposedly that isn't happening, but my vote isn't on him. His vote is on me. I'm still engaging him. He's going on rants about dreams he had last night.

Is that scummy though? Ranting about peripheral nonsense in the thread isn't exactly a scumtell and I really really -can- see Mastin thinking this way as town. I'll give you that yes it CAN be scum motivated, but I dont think there is any reason to assume that is the case or the only case. What recent things make you think this is just blatant bulllshit from mastin?

Do you really think that I'm going to buy that you posting a bunch is a towntell when we pretty much destroyed effort =/= town together a very very long time ago?

Meh, can't really argue this. I think mastin is imploding.

You were hoping to fake a paranoid attack on me, and you thought you could get away with it because you thought I would be lazy, you thought I was getting a little paranoid with the unshakeable townread where others had doubts, and you thought all you had to do in order to shake that paranoia was fake some yourself.

Huh. This really did come right on cue after a few people started posting doubt about their Kagura reads. IDK.

Nacho, why did you roleblock me last night?

[AngryPidgeon]

Has there ever been a game where mastin, as engaged town, has really been so lost in herself while simultaneously attempting to keep everyone else's egos in check? I have trouble imagining her not making ego checks every once in a while when she says things like what she said to BRO earlier.

Are you referring to the post where she told BRO never to play with her again if he was town? I just remembered that; that post left a bad taste in my mouth at the time.

[AngryPidgeon]

And I hate how she talks about her emotions instead of shows them.

, this is actually one of the things I look for a lot. People talking about how they feel without expressing it. It makes for shitty literature and scummy posts. I thought mastin has felt fairly emotional at places, but its possible Im misremembering that. IDK, I was extremely involved in the whole mastin v AP debacle that led to Cf calling us scum theater and I felt mastin was fairly equally involved, so I may have been biased? I'll keep thi in mind though; I dont think Ive ever actually seen anyone mention this as a point on anyone and I almost always look at this behind the curtains in my games.

[AngryPidgeon]

Nacho, why did you roleblock me last night?

If I were scum, I would have roleblocked you for obvious reasons.

Uhhhhhhhh, is this a claim then?

What's also wonderful is that Mastin's apparently gotten that the case I've provided on him is that he's spamming + repeating the same thing over and over again. Do you think that's my case on him?

TBH I had no idea what your case on mastin was until like 5 minutes ago. Now you are arguing that mastin is being opportunistic in sheeping people's doubt on you for easy towncred and that shes not actually made any effort towards scumhunting you. I don't really have a good response for either of those.

--

I tried to find that MAstin post about BRO to remember the context, but I cant seem to find it. God I wonder why that is.

[AngryPidgeon]

Thus, why focusing on what was obviously a typo was...
...Nothing but a distraction.

Wait to be clear, since Nacho just requoted this.

Are you SCUMREADING me over this? Realizing of course that Im not the only person to mistake it for a serious post.

[AngryPidgeon]

[AngryPidgeon]

More seriously, I'm not actually sure how to properly articulate my current reasons for scumreading AP, really

See, this is why you are wrong about me entertaining a PL on you. You are being the worst combination of noisy, unproductive, wrong, and then ^ this on top of it all. Oh and people are annoyed at me for getting sucked into it. So yes Im actually pretty stunned by your play in this game, its been a fairly earth shattering experience for my opinion of your playstyle. Pretty much the primary thing making me think you -could- be scum is burden of proficiency at this point but Im thinking this is just Mastin:SC/BRO::Mastin:AP/Nacho. Fuck, Nacho could even be scum, I dunno. But nothing you've said is a compelling reason to believe that.

Do you think CF is getting lynched?

Clearly not. I dont even know what to make of him, its quite clear our playstyles are fairly polar opposites regardless of what he flips. Ive been rather annoyed with him and that could be affecting my read there. Fortunately, I have the luxury of not having to hash out that read right now because he ISNT getting lynched even if I

fake an innocent

...

fake a guilty

.... howl about him being scum until I cant anymore. I'm interested in hearing what you have to say about PV. I actually sort of liked his interactions with Tammy (and Tammy made me , but dont think its affected my read there).

p-edit:

You can talk to me about it F16 ; )

[AngryPidgeon]

Also, Tammy said as much as she wanted to say about him. I doubt that would change until he shows up again.

Why? I think its pretty rare to find someone play emotionless most/all of the time. Like PV is more on that side of things and even he broke down a bit on mastin this game.

[AngryPidgeon]

Woah that was the wrong quote. Meant to quote this:

Late day 1, the cracks in the emotionless exterior bothered me.

[AngryPidgeon]

Usually when someone fabricates a town read on me it's close to this form. But in this case it's zeroed in, not floaty.

Could you expand on this?*

*Disclaimer: I dont really have a good ingame reason for wanting to know, Im mostly just curious.

[AngryPidgeon]

Cupcake you can call scum. You'd be wrong

[AngryPidgeon]

I also wanted to see what he'd say about my own self-description of my play. He accepted it at face value, which suggests something about how deeply he's processing the game.

I dont understand. You expect someone to be nervous that you are lying about your playstyle? In a game full of people who would know you are lying about your playstyle? And really, I dont see why its that important of a thing in the first place.

[AngryPidgeon]

(expired on 2014-05-07 22:26:21)

^ So whatever happens today, can we not just circlejerk until deadline and then panic?
I was p serious about wanting an arbitrary 5 day out deadline.

[AngryPidgeon]

It doesnt sound like a strategic thing to begin with TBH.

[AngryPidgeon]

It doesnt sound like a strategic thing to begin with TBH.

What do you make of a player saying it is?

I dont think its alignment indicative, to be sure. A lot of people think silly things about strategy.

I dunno. I'd make an opinion on your assertion that hes taking away from his own strategy by saying it is a strategy, but I certainly dont understand what he thinks hes accomplishing enough to say whether or not thats true. And I've had people (you?) use this as a point against me incorrectly in the past when I've talked about wanting player X to rage in order to be come readable, etc so I dont put much stock in it as alignment indicative.

[AngryPidgeon]

Yuo are saying he's wrong. Fine.

Now you need to convince us of Carbon's scum motivation in counterclaiming, backing it up, and pushing for Rancid's lynch.

Because you are not just arguing with Carbon, you are voting him.

PV: Why didn't you comment on that Clyton post at the time? At first I thought oyu might be behind, but it looks like you were caught-up-ish and your only response to Clyton or reference to Clyton was this.

Just not feeling you thought he was super town.

Oh and clicking that link brought me back to all the Replica CC nonsense which makes me want to lynch CF again >.>

[AngryPidgeon]

On the Clyton 2208? Because The Carbon claim and Clyton response, I didn't look at the sample scum PM. Never had any reason to, but the fact Carbon mentioned replica like it was important and Clyton also brough up replica made me go read the sample PM.

Err. When exactly did you go read the sample PM? Right after the Clyton post?

[AngryPidgeon]

[AngryPidgeon]

Our major ah ha over the last 24 or so hours is that we have 3 bet the farm town reads.

Is one of them me? Im worth a farm.

[AngryPidgeon]

Nacho pass a judgement on my alignment for me.

[AngryPidgeon]

Nacho am I town, scum, or fptslbooa?

[AngryPidgeon]

Nacho am I town, scum, or fptslbooa?

Scum. Unless you die soon!

If I shove you really hard will your team NK me?

Also, why was I blocked?

[AngryPidgeon]

I have some peripheral town reads, but a complete and total lack of scum reads yes. There are things that bother me about players, but nothing that I've gone aha that's scum!

This is part of my hesitation in scumreading weaker players in this game. I feel like this wouldn't be the sort of gamestate we would be in if the scum were mostly less active or less skilled players.

What? Tammy is saying she doesnt have clearly defined scumreads and you are agreeing with her?

I think you have the opposite problem.

[AngryPidgeon]

Ok, well what I've been mulling over in my spare time today is what the current gamestate means for scum.

While town as a whole not having a decisive direction, or even multiple decisive directions is nice, it's a volatile state. And I think it means that there aren't that many town players who are vulnerable to mislynch. Most of the players who could be considered lynchbait really aren't in this playerlist, if that makes sense.

I've seen this sort of dilemma for scum in smaller games.

How would you as scum tackle this gamestate?

Me? I have no idea. There are very few instances in which I can think like scum when I'm not scum and even when I am scum.

This gamestate is especially difficult because it's hard to assess who the actual town possible scum groupings are.

And it's even more difficult for me because I'm not a planner at all. I think the most I come to planning is in night actions, if I'm the most influential person, in which I look at who would be most valuable to keep and who is most dangerous and needs to die. That's the sum total of my planning in any scum game.

I guess my scum plan would be the same as any of my scum plans. I always expect to be lynched early when scum. I feel like my alignment is written all over my posts either way. As scum my goal is always to make it look like people who aren't my partners are and those who are my partners aren't, so upon my inevitable lynch and flip they make it to end game. I really don't think beyond that.

I never expect to last long as scum either so I work on many of the same parts of the game during the day.

But one thing my first mafia mentor tried to get me to focus on was who I wanted around at mylo/lylo and to figure out what I could do to make that happen. What I'm probably most weak on, though, is seeing what the best final configuration actually is. Fortunately, I don't usually have full controll of that because the game usually evolves in unexpected directions.

CF, in the Wicked game you were hydraing with one of the best players I've seen at making scum stone soup out of a tough list of townies. Thoughts on how you would be applying some of that to this game if you were scum?

CF: I think the game state is whatever it is because you/tammy/ffery are talking about peripheral things and waffling back and forth forever. Mastin 2 for that matter. No one is pursuing scum reads just getting paranoid about I can't even tell what. Phone post

[AngryPidgeon]

And making plans as scum beyond a day or 2 out is silly because of course things will go unexpectedly. At ffery: the direction is pretty much mastin getting lynched. There has been no other direction.

[AngryPidgeon]

Nacho am I town, scum, or fptslbooa?

Scum. Unless you die soon!

If I shove you really hard will your team NK me?

Also, why was I blocked?

Your target was me but it failed.
Seemed like you weren't blocked to me!

I want to lynch this cheeky clown fuck

[AngryPidgeon]

nowhere in that sentence do I see the word scum.

[AngryPidgeon]

[AngryPidgeon]

im proud as fuck at this game

So am I! Thoughts about that game cheer me up whenever I am starting to get a little annoyed at this one.

Hey, do you wanna hydra with me sometime in the future when you are back from your mafia break.

I would love to!

Awesome.

*Waits for Pidgeon to call me scum*

Actually....

to post is to be perceived AP, start posting town and I'll start thinking you are town

That hasn't been in my sig for a while

Also we should hydra when one of my games ends or something. I like it more when we coordinate our trolling efforts.

Bacde, Tracker, killed Night One

AngryPidgeon, Mafioso,

killed Night One

Also I found this gem from that game >.>

Shit in drunk. . Lynch kcudz, hes maf. Bacde, babe, roll with me on this. Im 95% sie its kcudz.

[AngryPidgeon]

ap are you a child?

No? why?

[AngryPidgeon]

I think ffery might be scum :/

[AngryPidgeon]

Hey I already posted that at Clyton earlier :p

[AngryPidgeon]

I think ffery might be scum :/

I'm finally breaking out of brainfreeze and you're scumreading me NOW?

You are breaking out of brain freeze? IDK why are you trusting BRO's read on me? Or is it just his comment about my gambit?

It just felt ridiculously hedgy when you quoted me and said I didnt call Nacho scum in that sentence when... I've been mostly calling them scummy all game.

[AngryPidgeon]

If I am right about Mastin/Rancid/AP being scum, then they are the scum that helped derail the wagon and were happy to "work" with townies who wanted a different wagon, not so much in the way of votes but more of influencing the direction of the lynch with their voice. This makes any counterwagon much easier to push than Rancid themselves. Not that they pushed Orc in particular but helped push those multiple other wagons along with you and Nacho. In that way, forming a counterwagon is obviously easy. And it will be easy today (for you or anyone else) to form a counterwagon to Mastin at deadline depending on who the target is.

Except Mastin and RBD were BOTH trying to get me lynched so this point is just weird.

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm sorry. Here's our game theme song.

Why did I laugh so much.

[AngryPidgeon]

also mara's replacing in with me

Oh sweet Orcinus is confirmed town now.

[AngryPidgeon]

[AngryPidgeon]

On phone but: at brian: that sentence of mine is just poorly punctuated. I was responding to say I targeted Bork but I was also told it failed. "You. And I was told... " was the intent. I forgot the period. Not that sstaring sentences with and us good grammar.

[AngryPidgeon]

With "and" is* : |

[AngryPidgeon]

Why the he'll are you town reading them due to ns flaking over irl issues???????

[AngryPidgeon]

F16: ffery said nothing was happening at all. I corrected her by pointing out that mastin was quite clearly a thing that was happening. Cause I mean wow. How could anyone not see that as the centerpiece of today.

I agree nacho pposts look really town wrt. Tammy.

[AngryPidgeon]

page 13ish... whats changed from then?

When/where/why did your read on mastin change from town to scum?

[AngryPidgeon]

Strong Town:
Titan

Town:
The Fox and the Hound
Just Sheep Us
nachomamma8
Breakfast With Stalin
Red Gyarados

Weak Town:
PeregrineV
AngryPidgeon
Rancid Broderick Drake
Carbon Fiber
CupcakePanda
MastinSSK

Null:
magenta_thegreat
Yggdra Union

Are you a ffery alt >.>

[AngryPidgeon]

I had a question addressed to you to!

How in sync with Orci are you / how much have you read?

[AngryPidgeon]

Hi PA ^^. I'm glad you replaced into probable town.

[AngryPidgeon]

What the hell just happened?

Tammy, all you are saying is that if Mastin is town, you think someone pushing her is scum, right?

I dont see why that is an egregious opinion if thats what it is. PV could easily be scum on that. Magenta could be although I oscillate about Orci.

[AngryPidgeon]

It's nothing to really worry about until mastin flips anyway. I mean sure there could be scum in your neighborhood regardless, but my paranoid looking at you guys cross-eyed certain there's string pulling in there really only occurs if Mastin's town, and then can you blame me?

Ok, so assuming mastin is scum, who are her buddies?

[AngryPidgeon]

I don't even know ho to respond to that.

Press Close and Reopen firefox to Restart AngryPidgeon_bot.js

[AngryPidgeon]

^That was @ f-16.

[AngryPidgeon]

Are you reading the game? Serious question.

Yes?

I guess I forgot? you had taken a hard stance on people other than Peregrine and Nacho. And you are sort of implying that Mastin being scum means Nacho isn't now.

[AngryPidgeon]

NAcho.

[AngryPidgeon]

Im drinkingthis enormous margarita thats baiscally 60% tequila.

What do you think of your neighbors?

[AngryPidgeon]

ap i have to go soon or i'll blackout befor ei hang out with the homies

But I love you ; (

I feel like you are finally adding some sanity to this thread.

MAgenta is weirding me out a little recently although Im not sure if its scum or just Mara.

Hi Mara! Tammy was right I was being sarcastic over the GIF thing.

[AngryPidgeon]

Ugh Im so annoyed Im not allowed to say something atm, but NACHO. About mastins emotions. Shes generally more emotional as town, no? Mind reader mafia? Yes we got lots of bullshit walls and talks about square dancing ,but I think this is diferent/

[AngryPidgeon]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... start=3275
Wait this game is over now omfg.

OK look at this shit. Look at it.

Mastin was pissing me off tha tgame cause she was on my team. Yet she put forth zero fucking effort in it. Meanwhile shes posting up a storm over here. I think she was just wanting to be a hero. a town hero.

Also f16 is double dipping on me/mastin and it continues to be scumvuille.

He has called me scummy for tunneling on him since D1 and when asked said that the scum motive for doing this was that I could just keep tunneling him w/o him being lynched.

Now hes saying that Im trying to set him up q/ a mastin flip. when Ive done fucking nothing but say mastin is prob town. Idgi. please advise.

[AngryPidgeon]

okay, tomorrow.
i'm going to listen to proper drunk songs and sing karaoke as i walk to the frat

Are you a BROseidon alt?

Stop thats me.

[AngryPidgeon]

nacho/Mastinssk/Pigey/Carbonfiber

scumteam 2014

LOL. I am scumreading MastinSSK and Pidgeon with Rancid being a third scum. Don't know about the fourth. So, just help me "bus" Mastin and Pidgeon for now I guess. Until you finish catching up and figure out that I am town.

Wow why are you so desperate? You've been calm all game. And things have pretty much been going your way.

On a more serious note, I'm not as weirded out by Claytons list as much as orci is, and I kinda wanna kil CF

Ok I forgive you of your sins. But why the fuck do you think Mastin and cf are scum together? That seems rather unlikely. Read on RBD?

Im obviously town

Yes we get it NAcho you can

stop drunkposting

drunkpost with me : (

[AngryPidgeon]

i can't wait until AP and i hydea and this is all of our posts

When we do this, I think we need to make a rule that all posting in thread or QT happens while legally drunk.

I don't have drinks but soda will have to do for me.

Only scum would want to be sober.

should I get drunk too

i'm not even 21 ~

Stop making me feel old. Also definitely yes.

i'm really too drunk to nvigate a sea of bullshit right now

I might sig this after the game, lmao.

why the fuck are they playing metallica at a punk bar? and why can't my phone spell metallica?

Because Metallica is amazing? But admittedly not punk which is probably my fav genre of music. Bonus points for punk/alternative.

[AngryPidgeon]

my read changed after an overnight reading session, though i had a strong mastin town read in the neighborhood overnight, got shit on because they hated said read so much, and i thought one really goo point tthat was brought up was how mastin responded to bro anxiety attack

Expand? Fake edit: oh

because bro broke the fuck down in thread and mastin didn't even take a break from calling him shit to go "hey bro, are you okay?". he didn't even take a moment to reflect, to hesitate, to whatever he just brushed it the fuck aside and kept moving on

Huh. I can think of one reason why tht wouldnt be in THIS GAME but sort of doubt it so meh. ID have to read that again to determine of this pont is sailent.

I had gotten hammered one night, and was sitting right infront of my dad who was completely oblivious to my condition while I did stuff on skype

Your dad needs to learn to scumhint.

i also thinkt aht the exchange with me that no one will read is complete and utter bullshit, and i know i get irrational when i get passionate about things, but i know i'm not wrong about her. i know i'm not.

Ugh Im starting to doubt myself again. You are on my shortlist of people I sort of trust to read mastin after AG.

[AngryPidgeon]

I've decided to not arse myself with the dead, but initial impression was lean-town

Ok. Its jsut there is a lot of deama about rbd where people seem rather opinionated about him one way or the other. and think he is scum with mastin as a reason for scumreadin mastin. which tbh i can sort of understand knowing how mastin treats buddies usually, but i tihnk they are both town.

[AngryPidgeon]

no i'm seriously in a frat
i don't think anyone else in mafiascum is in a frat sooooo

BROseidon is definitely in a fraty.

[AngryPidgeon]

Area of focus is extremely small, but still.

I don't really see the point of continuing that discussion, though and it's noise we could have less of. At the same time, though I don't know mastin enough to try and go after partner-tells

ok. Im not going to argue rbd with you i just want ed to know which camp you ewer in for future reference.

[AngryPidgeon]

So are you gys toen? Or just costing scym.

[AngryPidgeon]

Negative ghost rider. Feel free to do town town things though for cred.

[AngryPidgeon]

So none of your reads actually changed?

[AngryPidgeon]

AP, are you avoiding me?

Not intentionally.

What do you think of Tammy's point that he's using what is probably the least valid game possible to assess her, and doesn't seem to care about that?

This is taking me A LOT longer than anticipated, so I'm just going to post and get to some uni work I need to do before tomorrow. I'll try really hard to finish by tonight, but man this game feels like a chore.

Are you honestly saying that using stale meta is a scumtell? I mean, I dont think it means anything alignment wise? If PV is scum and thinks he can get Tammy ML'd by bringing up stale meta in a sleazy way, hes sorely mistaken. And I tend to doubt that purposely misrepping meta is something PV as scum would do in the first place. So I dont really think that even if the game hes bringing up is egregiously out of date, that means anything about PV's wincon in this game. Im interested to hear you talk to me about how it is if thats what you are hinting at here.

If you think hes just being lazy...well? I don't know, his whole backandforth with Tammy was sort of sticking his neck out and making cases on Tammy isn't going to get her lynched at this point. That he used (arguably, I have no idea and am not going to read it) crapmeta to push her just seems uninteresting to me. I get that Tammy got upset about it and PV sort of took that as a bad sign, which once again, I dont really see anything terrible about. That said, I really dont know how I feel about PV. I thought some of his D1 posts look vague, waffly, and scummy. Hes sort of 180'd that Today although hes on the mastin wagon and mostly just pinging mastin over her waffles and BS and spending more effort pushing on Tammy.

So? Actually if mastin flips scum I could kind of see a PV/mastin team given their interactions and mastin mysteriously just acting as if PV isnt in this game anymore. But I dont feel too amazing about that, but if mastin flips scum Id definitely be looking at PV as a plausible busser on the current wagon. The other names...Orci, JSU, CF, Yggdra...I dont think CF and JSU are likely on a mastin team.

[AngryPidgeon]

Ya ok mastin. If you are still scum reading nacho after last night's posts Idk what to tell you.

[AngryPidgeon]

You also got ran up in ny 172 due to apathy. Not planned. Just you not giving a shit. Which is a large part why I'm upset at you. And you probably are town for actually giving more than zero shits about this while that went down. DV back me ip

[AngryPidgeon]

No you did fuck all to stop your lynch in 172. You are trying here at least. Who is scum on your wagon then?

[AngryPidgeon]

So why HAVEN'T you?

Because there is no point? Nothing I do today has any fucking sway and I -was- voting Nacho until him getting townread dissolved that possibility. And I sort of think Nacho is town after last nights drunkfest.

4) Regarding AP townreading Mastin, I explain it in my list of reads. Brian caught it as well. It is that I thought their interactions are weird.

No, there isn't. Unless not-omgusing is a scum tell now. Is this opposite day?

It's pathetically easy. Stay out of the spotlight. Keep townblocs from forming, and induce paranoia in them. For instance, if players are absolutely convinced that they have a townbloc, just with a Thor in it (oh gods, I'm actually using that)...emphasize the need to find the Thor, which induces enough paranoia to break the townbloc into smithereens. Keep the town divided into camps, and have scum on both sides of the camp. Keep cards spread out, so that when necessary, you can chose to stack the deck.

To your credit, you haven't been doing it although AP has been with the way he intercepted Titan/CF conversation.

---

I'm wondering if it makes sense to just lynch AP first. If Mastin is bussing, we'll help him bus. If he's town, then good.

If I flip town Today, how would your reads change?

And just no. You can fact check yourself before posting generic shit like this thanks. The assertion that Im "staying out of the spotlight" id fucking hilarious.

[AngryPidgeon]

Hey Mastin, I think PA just sunk your battleship. Is it a scumship though?

[AngryPidgeon]

Angry Pidgeon. Nachomamma8. magenda_thegreat. Red Gyarados.

There is your scumteam.

:/

Copying me from AG mafia. You are wrong though.

[AngryPidgeon]

If you flipped town after all of this, I'm not really sure how I'd feel.

I know how AP will feel.
Achievement Unlocked: Total Fucking Revenge.
/circlejerk.

But seriously. You'll feel bad about having pushed my mislynch in the QT, but will not let it influence your play overall. You'll display whatever emotion you deem most appropriate to it, most likely involving some sort of apathy.

Do me a favor and get spoilers from Cabd if you are town. I want you to dwell on how fucking awful your posts about me have been and hoe hindering they have been for me.

[AngryPidgeon]

As scum, know what I'd do?

You've pretty much written a 10 page single spaced essay using this question as your topic Today.

JEsus, please just stop.

[AngryPidgeon]

I've been giving this game. So much. So fucking much. That it's come at the complete cost of other games, the one AP linked among them.

So a legitimate fuck you if you so much as seriously fucking think that I am scum, here.

I SUSPECTED YOU WERE TOWM HERE BECAUSE OF THE GAME SINCE BEFORE IT ENDED IN PART BECAUSE OF YOUR EFFORT LEVELS.

NOW IM POSTING IT TO TRY AND MAKE A CASE FOR YOU. WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU?

IVE BEEN GETTING FLAK FOR MY TOWNREAD OF YOU AND IT WAS HUGELY BASED ON YOU

FUCKING ME OVER

IN THAT SCUM GAME BY LURKING LIKE A FUCK.

[AngryPidgeon]

BUT NO YOU HAVE TO ALIENATE THE ONE FUCKING PERSON WILLING TO STEP UP TO BAT FOR YOU AND NITPICK THE SHIT OUT OF EVERYTHING I DO AND POST BULLSHIT LIKE

"IM HAVING A HARD TIME EXPLAINING MY AP READ THIS GAME" INTERMIITENTLY.

[AngryPidgeon]

I fucking told you all Clyton was town. Also, I'm probably going to stop letting mastin walls block up my reread and just not read them, because feeling like I needed to was what caused me to stop.

K this could be scum with mastin TBH if mastin actually is scum.

Also Imma let you finish but I was townreading Clyton the most.

[AngryPidgeon]

.....

I submitted Peregrine, Orcinus, and Stalin.

I was told that Stalin is not a replica.

[AngryPidgeon]

Alright so I've been really just stressed out about shit and not really giving my games as much of the old college-try as Im capable of for a variety of reasons. But Im still here and somehow getting results back with my cop role, so I'm going to be efforting today which HOPEFULLY should mean lot more peaceful rereading of the thread in light of flips and less just getting caught up in endless backandforths and getting drawn into the mist.

Yggdra kill seems largely uninteresting given the sheer number of people townreading them iirc, although it makes me wonder if scum would shoot inside the neighborhood if they were in it? <-- need to think on that.

Oh Im guessing RBD was a vig shot. I dunno if it was intentional on Cabd's part but he made the flip right after asking me to confirm if I was finalized with my 3 investigate choices and I said 'ya sure'.

p-edit: holy crap x-posts

[AngryPidgeon]

@AP: It appears you weren't roleblocked this time. Weird that they'd let you look at Stalin.

I was definitely not role blocked. In hindsight, Im not horribly surprised? I dont think Stalin was really ever mislynchable seriously. I mostly had them on my list out of paranoia and I feel a little silly after getting them back. I convinced my self Yggdra was town enough to not submit on. I sort of regret not putting you guys on over Stalin, but hindsight is 20/20.

And ya I want a neighborhood if for no other reason than all the cool kids have one.

[AngryPidgeon]

TAMMY IS CLAIMING SCUM.

What the hell. She talked yesterday along these lines, you are acting surprised when I dont find this trajectory all that surprising? When she suggested all this yesterday, you just tried to assure her you were town >.>

[AngryPidgeon]

Then the game has (at least?) two blocking roles.

Mac's role was capable of blocking roles indirectly.

LB flipped Roleblocker IIRC.

Apparently we have a confirmed RB floating around. Unless..

Did you happen to target NAcho last night if you are comfortable with saying?

[AngryPidgeon]

She just gave me a heart attack. I can't tye rught noe,. I need to go use the restroom. I'll calm down and talk aboyt ut more in a little bnit

Uhhhhhhhhh

Holy crap. I did not see this breakdown coming at all.

[AngryPidgeon]

Wait so BOTH Stalin and RG are claiming that they are 100% sure they were blocked.
I was not blocked.
CF, you use your power any time during the day right?
Can everyone not yet in a hood claim their game? I need to look mine up...Tales of HEarts / Spir Maze.

[AngryPidgeon]

JUST FUCK OFF> QUICKLYNCH ME NOW. I CANT BEAR THIS FOR FOURTEEN DAYS.

:/

Ok I don't want to be a dick in case you really are going through things right now, but Im really having a hard time understanding whee this came from.

Can you calm down and summarize what happened in the Neighbor QT over night?

[AngryPidgeon]

Dang, I was hoping for a scumflip.

I am Yuri Lowell, Town Lone Wolf (modified vig), Tales of Vesperia (you can guess the modification). I didn't shoot last night because I wanted to see Rancid's flip. I shot him night1 because he was total scum (even if he flipped green).

Going home, but want that out there for discussion. I'll try to check in tonight.

Were you not on the site sometime after the RBD flip happened but before deadline? Or did Cabd tell you you couldn't wait for it and still submit a shot?

Elaborate on what you knew/know about the Janitoring aspect of your role. You are claiming that you were responsible for the janitoring, right?

[AngryPidgeon]

I told Nacho to bring it. I told him to tell Tammy in the scum QT to attack me (As a jkoke). I did not expect that at all. I reeally didn't

You really think NAcho and Tammy are scum together and Nacho told Tammy to push you? Why would NAcho have to be involved in Tammy's decision to push you (assuming she is scum)?

Because he started setting me up fr the hammer in his first post f the day.

F-16: Why did you not vote at all Yesterday? IIRC, you never voted even once despite tryingto get mastin lynched from the sidelines pretty much all Day. Why no vote ever?

[AngryPidgeon]

NAcho, can you summarize the progression of F-16's reads and emotion over the night?

Like hes reacting like he literally just read the mastin flip and RBD flip at the same time and its weird on an emotional level.

What explicitly did he say about Tammy last night?

[AngryPidgeon]

He said maybe we were scum together and we were going to blow our cover and mislynch him today

: |

And then he freaked the fuck out

.....kay....
Fucking. There have been way too many meltdowns in this game and its all starting to blur together in the 'fuck it' part of my head.
Im not sure if him reportedly expecting this treachery from Tammy/Nacho makes the emotion make more sense "I knew this would happen!!" or not. My gut is really at ends with it since if he expected it (and apparently even taunted NAcho about it), why is he so emotional over it actually going down. Or maybe its something more specific that bothers me. Like hes frustrated, but more in a "I give up" when I'd expect more anger or raging? I'm really over trying to understand all the emotions in this game at this juncture :/

[AngryPidgeon]

I didn't expect Tammy to push me if she was scum at all. I expected her to continue to push BRO. I expected you to push me.

You can read BRO 100% Pushing BRO might as well be a scumclaim.

It is the same for Tammy and me. Neither of us failed to read each other correctly before.

the underlined is not at all true. I misread BRO horribly in the one Micro game I was in with him. The only other game I was in with him (where I was town) I waffled excessively on him and vote him at points even though he was town. So I dunno where you got this impression unless BRO said it in the neighborhood which is pretty unjustified if he did.

I can handle pushes from people that know me before.

Does Tammy not know you?

Her reaction is a total scumclaim after I responded to it. She didn't even ask me if I was okay although you did.

: (

--

Ugh. I felt like I had my 2nd wind spiritually after actually getting role results back when I fully expected to be 100% useless in that dept all game and now its like the wind was knocked out of my sails again.

My logical side wants to believe that F-16 is faking all this, but my instincts are screaming the opposite.

Im going to check out of this game for a little bit, be on later.

[AngryPidgeon]

I -promised- myself Id do work and not look at this game, ugh.

Your hammer looked scummy.

Why did the hammer look scummy? You literally just pointed out to me that there were plenty of people off the wagon who would have done it when I asked about you. And you had lterally all Day to vote mastin who was reportedly your top suspect.

Also, someone is being ridiculously dead-pan about events in the thread and I think they are skyrocketing to my favorite lynch rather quickly.

[AngryPidgeon]

Also, this is the part where I tell you all I FUCKING TOLD YOU ALL ABOUT GIF FROM THE FUCKING ONSET, AND I FUCKING KNEW HE WAS A MODERATE TO STRONG PR.

clap clap

I told you all about mastin.

[AngryPidgeon]

Oh look another read I was right on.

Why is PV's claim obviously from town?

He actually claimed that he didnt shoot last night because

he was waiting for RBD to flip

which....RBD DID flip so what gives.

[AngryPidgeon]

You act like I've been in the neighborhood.

You realize that I've borderline site flaked at this point, right?

Hey BRO Im in a sort of similar state right now so work with me then?

Ive been turning up a lot of town losses recently and its getting depressing even if a lot of those were hydras where my buddy acted alone or I got NKd N1 and ya Im a little worn out on trying to do this shit. And I feel like Ive lost my old dedication to rereading things objectively on my own time to try and piece things together and take a reasonable approach. The goddamn apathy and bias and waffling in this game is like a reflection of my spirit in town games recently. So lets say we both actually give this game a good kick in the teeth for once? I think if we actually try we can pull this shit out still.

Deal? But you gotta stop hiding out in that damn private topic.

Also Im not totally convinced your town after recent F16 events, so lets work on transparency woooo.

[AngryPidgeon]

I also have reason to believe that you're telling the truth, even if everyone and their mother still seems to think otherwise.

Mmmmm. I'm tempted to ask you to elaborate on this cause I can see you meaning one of multiple things here potentially. And Im loosely paranoid that this is just manipulation, but if it is that would be EXTREMELY shitty so Im just gonna sit on this for now.

Right now my reads on Tammy and Ceph/DV are most in question. I feel like they've positionally benefited from the noise that's happened this whole game (interesting that, since the day start, I'm the only one to even bring up Ceph/DV).

Ya, I think my read on them is from D1 and fairly stale. I sort of realized this at some point yesterday and asked them if they were coasting and one of those clowns said something that made me . So they are priority to sort for me.

[AngryPidgeon]

I give up. If the only person I think is town in this game actually thinks I'm scum then I just give up. I don't know what's going on here at all.

Stalin?

[AngryPidgeon]

IF PENGUIN IS TOWN SCUM CAN READ OUR NEIGHBORHOOD!

What?

[AngryPidgeon]

You are going to have to explain that one for me carefully. All I see id you and CF hamming up the thread. And CF pushing you looks rather OMGUSy at the core, regardless of his alignment.

I dont think Stalin ever called you scummy, they've had you as a moderate townread all game for the most part?

And Stalin is confirmed town, by the by.

[AngryPidgeon]

On a total sidenote though: If CF is scum, maybe he -can- access other neighborhoods somehow and just hasnt claimed it?

[AngryPidgeon]

Also, someone is being ridiculously dead-pan about events in the thread and I think they are skyrocketing to my favorite lynch rather quickly.

I kind of expected someone to bite on this or at least play 20 questions with me.

Buuuuut no one has, so I'll say that these posts have stuck out like a sore thumb:

Hi

Team

Was Yggdra actually a scum nightkill?

i want to do a flavor mass claim

Its like Magenta became a robot over the night phase.

Did anybody use a robot-izer on Magenta or are they just scum?

[AngryPidgeon]

I feel like I'm at a costume party without a costume.

[AngryPidgeon]

That's probably the point tbh.

[AngryPidgeon]

I think Im finally starting to take pity on all the people who post way less than me in games.

[AngryPidgeon]

Ugh, just got back. Tammy as scum doesn't make any sense whatsoever. I'm going to respond to all of those posts in a bit.

Hello FourTrouble, haven't heard from you in ages!!

I just don't understand how you can't see how Mastin was going to be the lynch. There was going to be nothing but two more days worth of the same thing. Noone was changing their minds.

Stalin was sort of waffling about it, tbf. The main thing I don't get is that CF himself was pushing the mastin lynch but now posting things about it being a setup.

Quite frankly when you unvoted Mastin at the end of the day, it looked suspicious to me after Mastin flipped town. I thought you were trying to demonstrate fake uncertainty on the lynch you'd been pushing the entire time and that you decided that actually the noise would be more beneficial to have around than lose.

He voted mastin at some point?

AP

FULLCLAIM NEXT POST

I already have? Im a modified cop. I submit 3 names every night and the mafia team selects one for me to get either Replica or Not Replica on. I was allowed to target Kagura on N1 and got no result which was weird. I got Not Replica back on BWS last night. Im in Tales of Hearts. Calcedny Arcome, Town Lawful Commander. I think I claimed all that before but its possible I havent.

[AngryPidgeon]

Assuming scum roles only work on one of kids/adults, the fact that they have fail/success during the past two nights would lead them to the conclusion of what age group their target belongs in. If each scum targeted different people (which is very likely) the past two nights, they would have age groups of 8 people (2X4=8) while townspeople with same limitation only have the age groups of those they targeted.

This is not making any sense to me.

Why would scum roles only work on one of adults/kids? And why not mention beasts? Annnd, you are using this as a justification for a massclaim of flavor. Why do you even care?

thoughts on ffery/beli and Brian/ns? I think the latter has a chance of being scum

Confirmed town and plausible scum respectively.

2) I have AP as a clear scumread. For whatever reason, it became more clearer after Mastin and Rancid flipping town.

Why was he, at the same time that he was so damn convinced that Mastin was scum that he wouldn't do anything else, also saying I was setting him up in the case of a town flip. Like I never said anything of the sort.

Hm. Im trying to remember, but I think he did something similar in my mini theme. But its possible Im just remembering BRO's part in that, but I think Desperado also tunneled on the mastin mislynch there as town. What worries me is that these guys were so gung-ho about it again despite just having mislynched mastin horribly in a very similar fashion.

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm really really trying to see what you see in des/bro but all I see from there is manipulation.

I have really mixed thoughts about BRO. And I am still really REALLY concerned about his interactions with me. Its like good-cop, bad-cop. BROseidon shows up to remind me at regular intervals that he was the only one to townread me correctly and than I should sheep him. Desperado apparently thinks Im scummy and I dont really hear much of that directly, but Im still fucking baffled at their angle this game. Im deeply concerned that BRO is just trying to aggressively buddy me, although I have a reason for thinking he wouldnt quite go as far as he did at one point as scum, but fuck. I know I thought similar thoughts about Iecerint in mykonian's bastard cult game and he was actually just scum the whole time and doing something similar. So BRO to be scum would almost have to be cashing in all of his future trust and goodwill cards that he could possibly play. Like he'd be burning them. But I know I burned all my trust cards as scum since back in Legends of the Hidden Temple >.>, but Im not actually sane or rational like BRO tends to be.

So this looks lie ka waffle and it is. The tl;dr is Im not ruling out BRO scum, but I will be fairly stunned if it is. And I really want more activity from those two clownfucks so I can actually be sure about this read cause I get the crippling doubt that they are ablindspot in my reads.

[AngryPidgeon]

I tend to doubt that roles would secretly fail on certain characters without it being made explicit in a role PM, but fuck if I know.

I don't understand your question. Obviously CF's ability is confirmed to be flavor based. I dont see why Magenta is on a crusade for flavor full claims when they are a claimed VT at this juncture. And on top of that she is spending her time justifying the massclaim by pointing out that scum may already have the info (or most of it) rather than justifying why she wants the claim in the first place.

[AngryPidgeon]

AP feels oddly detached. The soft push on the claimed vig isn't great, but if he actually wants to work with BRO that might be a decent sign. Street Racers was on and off in his willingness to work with BRO, so I'll be watching how that develops. I didn't have a good sense of him in 172, and he kept trying to steer me there. I don't trust him putting ffery in as a cop choice, and I also have to give some credence to mastin's read on him post-town flip. Waiting to be wowed.

How do I feel detached? Since when is not immediately trusting a vig claim scummy? PV said something that doesn't make sense "I didnt shoot cause I was waiting for RBD to flip" and I questioned him on it. Then he fullclaims on the spot today for no discernible reason. I'll give you that vig claims are generally town, but the janitor aspect of his role + him strongarming the mastin lynch while RBD was unflipped feels divey. There is no reason why PV can't clarify the sketchy part of his role (the Janitoring part) for me while in the meantime I dont try to break a game on claims and flavor like everyone else seems determined to do .

What exactly are you looking for with me/BRO? I generally work with whoever I want, and I know Ive upset/annoyed players before by explicitly NOT working with 'old favorites' cause I often do better when Im interacting with new people instead. Im not sure how me reaching out to BOR is alignment indicative at all this game. Why is ffery a bad investigate choice? Stalin was under pressure from DESPBRO, CF, Mastin, Cupcake, and others? yesterday and I was a little worried about them near the end. They were a perfectly valid investigate choice (although I do admit I feel sill in hindsight). How much of this game have you actually read?

[AngryPidgeon]

Your over the top push on Tammy comes from nothing reasonable I can see. And I did what you asked overnight and read through your ISO. Part of what I discussed with Tammy was that I wasn't seeing strong town-you in it, so while I can maybe see that my read on you comes out of thin air, rest assured that it's been building for the last couple of days.

I remember your tragic penguin pics (my soul hasn't recovered, TYVM) but even there you had an agenda with being OTT, like you did in Resistance. Trouble is I don't see the town agenda here for flipping out on Tammy. I'd say it's emotional, except let's face it, neither of your past OTT responses have been anything other than strategic, either trying to paint me as scum or figure out if I'm scum.

What are these penguin pics?

What do you feel about CF dropping his tammy suspicion at the drop of a hat and what do you look for in Town CF that isn't here? I am serious about hoping to do a peaceful reread of this mess, but I like your CF pressure.

I hope I am wrong and that you are town too. It's what I would like. Clyton's post where he claimed watcher was a trigger that almost confirmed to me that the slot was scum after seeing Mastin flip town. I don't know why he claim it but in light of you saying it was fake, I'll think about it.

WTF. Why would a watcher claim make Clyton scummy to you. And why would an un-claim make you like the slot more. Its like when RBD unclaimed miller and they were clearly scum for that...except not this time.

This whole Day feels like I'm playing Mafia in Bizzaro Universe. On hallucinogenic drugs.

I'll drink to that; 'til I get fat. (and until this game starts making sense).

Talk to me about Penguin though. I have much stronger opinions there.

Since when? I thought I was your #1 undesirable still?

Scum (Strongest->Weakest):

10 AngryPidgeon
11 Penguin_alien

Did you follow NY 172?

Im pretty concerned that neither you nor DV bothered to listen to my point about mastin's play in that game compared to here. I'd probably say its scummy of you 2, but I know you are confirmed so whatever I guess. Still extremely annoyed that no one gave a shit about me waiting to out this.

--

response to DV separate if I have one, I see they posted a wall.

[AngryPidgeon]

@AP How do you interpret the sample role PM then?

No I fully understand that there are classifications of flavor and that people have explicitly claimed role interactions dependent on it.

RBD said their gladiate worked differently depending on age. CF's ability works off of game flavor. Im saying I expect people to be AWARE of oddities with their role in their ROLE PM like RBD evidently was.

My role does not say anything about age mattering so I'd find it to be a little bastard if my role failed on certain people for no real reason.

[AngryPidgeon]

@Angry-

You just finished 172 as scum with ThAd the scum ascetic. Why are you acting so clueless yesterday when Kagura/Nacho said that "no result" matches his information?
And now that game is over, have you mentioned it all as the possible reason for your result? Or at all?

Lolz. I actually was worried about Nacho being an ascetic/commuter of some sort and said as much at some point on Day 2. I could fish up the quote, but I really dont want to dive through the depths of my ISO right now. I had a working theory that I was allowed to investigate Nacho cause scum no my role would bounce off of him or something. Of course its possible that I really was blocked. Apparently there are potentially multiple roleblocks going around and nobody else was claiming to have had their role behave oddly yesterday so its totally possible I was just blocked and Nacho is a red herring. I tried to clarify with him at the end of Yesterday about some of the shit Bork said, but Nacho was being evasive. Made me wonder if he was actually a hider or something (oops did I just say that) but fuck if I know. I could waffle about spec about my role forever so Id rather just read him off play which Im still digesting. His and PA's push on mastin felt more genuine than some of the others to me.

[AngryPidgeon]

mastin was scummy in house party and then she pushed the coug wagon through because he couldn't produce the right flavor quick enough. i don't even come close to regretting that and i don't understand why that game should automatically prevent me from pushing her in this game.

Im not saying its impossible for you to have a legitimate scumread on mastin, its just the certainty that was attached to it.

You guys basically did fuckall except posture on mastin and apparently post some paranoia in the neighbor QT. Did you not once wonder "huh I wonder if this is town-mastin and we're wrong" cause you tunnelfucked her pretty hard Yesterday and didnt seem to have a singular iota of doubt about it.

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm really really trying to see what you see in des/bro but all I see from there is manipulation.

@Tammy: Oh, oops. I meant to quote this part of your post? Not sure how that got messed up. I was talking about BROSeidon/Desperado. They were both town and they both tunneled on mastin-town very recently in my mini theme (BRO more than desp I think but Im pretty sure both did) and it was just incredibly similar looking back. Im weirded out that neither of these 2 had any doubt about this after misreading mastin so bad recently.

[AngryPidgeon]

we are also aware of which situations our role will fail in

We aren't aware.

But, the language of our result stuck out with the emphasis on it failing. Also, RG used a word in his post 5123 that echoes something about our PM about our role failing. Not our action. Our role.

So you think that your action failed because your target was not of the correct flavor?

[AngryPidgeon]

I'll help you with your Nacho digestion. What posts scream town-Nacho and which scream scum-Nacho to you?

My opinion of the slot has generally gone up since Bork replaced out of it.

I can fish up some quotes later, but off the top of my head thing's that felt town from Nacho.
The mastin push. I don't see why he as scum would stick his neck out there to shove that cart forward when it was already headed in the direction steadily, based off the timing of his pressure and flip-flop on mastin. I felt his posting at mastin was rather genuine; it just felt like Nacho was 100% convinced in what he was seeing. The drunk posting near the end of Day 2 also felt uninhibited and town to me although Id have to pull up quotes to dive into that more.

The being divey about their role is weird to me, but Im not going to just demand that they full claim I guess, so I'll hope that that resolves itself at some point. I disliked Bork's reaction to pressure. It felt haughty like he was tryingto shake me off by being overly-confident and his whole defense wsa like "look how town I am, everyone else thinks Im town!!". I dont think he actually said that, but it came off that way to me at the time and it felt like he was just coasting without doing much. Annnd Im still trying to decide what I think about Tammy v CF with Nacho sidelining on that aggresively. I thought him trying to get CF into the neighborhood was probably town thinking I guess, but I could see him being scum if CF is potentially. probably. maybe. definitely.

[AngryPidgeon]

Yeah, because as a town hider he really needs to fear being killed. And I think he'd have 2 confirmed town by now.

They also said something to RBD out the gates about it mattering if their claim was real. I was rereading at some point and that stuck out to me . Made me wonder if they were a hider and were concerned about them hiding behind people who got gladiated or something which would be unproductive for obvious reasons.

[AngryPidgeon]

MastinSSK

(8):

Just Sheep Us

,

PeregrineV, Yggdra Union

, CupcakePanda, Penguin_Alien, Red Gyarados, The Fox and the Hound, Titan
AngryPidgeon (1):

MastinSSK

Not Voting (5): Nachomamma8,

Carbon Fiber

, Breakfast With Stalin, AngryPidgeon, magenta_thegreat

Blue is pretty much town to me, but since there are 4 scum left, where are you contending they are voting?[/quote]
For serious? In this VC? Im not sure what you expect me to say. Cupcake, RedGary would be my picks for plausible scum on the wagon. Maybe Foxhound/JSU.
Off the wagon bets shot is magenta/Cf and maybe Nacho.

[AngryPidgeon]

You and I was explicitly told that my role failed.

Hmph. Ok. This result (and only this result) is consistent with my worldview.

Why did you start out with a fake report on CF?

-b

@PV: Why the hell wouldn't they? Maybe they actually just roleblocked me and plan to claim later that they thought I was scum and likely going to make the scum kill after I flip.

Maybe they really are a Mafia Ascetic and plan to just claim that at some point.

[AngryPidgeon]

Tales of Hearts:

AP, RG

???: Panda PV, Stalin, orcinus

You guys probably claimed some of this before, but what is everyone's game?

[AngryPidgeon]

Tales of Abyss?

: CF, JSU, Nacho

Tales of ???:

PA, Tammy
------

Tales of Hearts:

AP, RG

Tales Of Rebirth

: Stalin

Tales of Vesperia:

PV
???: Panda, orcinus, FoxHound

You guys probably claimed some of this before, but what is everyone's game?

updated. forgot Foxhound before.

[AngryPidgeon]

Though I do have to wonder at pere trying to instigate an argument again that was talked out last night. The trollish language and goading makes no sense from town at all.

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen.

This. Is. Not. Town.

Mastin? Is that you? Did you get reincarnated into a 3rd hydra head with Tammy?

[AngryPidgeon]

FOX HOUND WHAT IS YOUR GAME FLAVOR TIA

[AngryPidgeon]

AP

FULLCLAIM NEXT POST

I already have? Im a modified cop. I submit 3 names every night and the mafia team selects one for me to get either Replica or Not Replica on. I was allowed to target Kagura on N1 and got no result which was weird. I got Not Replica back on BWS last night. Im in Tales of Hearts. Calcedny Arcome, Town Lawful Commander. I think I claimed all that before but its possible I havent.

THANKS FOR MAKING UP YOUR N2 ACTION YOU LYING SCUMFUCK

VOTE: AP

AP IS SCUM PLEASE LYNCH ACCORDINGLY

VOTE: Cupcake Panda

Lying or gambiting.

[AngryPidgeon]

Nothing changed, they've been scum this whole time. By the way are they calling me scum yet? If they aren't Mara hasn't read the thread

Care to explain this?

Also I want Cupcake Panda dead today. I dont care if this is Katsuki a la Fate Mafia 2 or just scum, but Im not putting up with this shit.

I know for a 100% fact that my role succeeded on Stalin and there is zero way Panda can have any belief of the contrary.

[AngryPidgeon]

why?

What. the. fuck?

Katsuki is softing that I'm lying about having visited Ffery or some shit.

Which is a lie, because I got a fucking result back on Stalin last night 100%. Lynch Katsuki's bullshit please.

[AngryPidgeon]

why?

What. the. fuck?

Katsuki is softing that I'm lying about having visited Ffery or some shit.

Which is a lie, because I got a fucking result back on Stalin last night 100%. Lynch Katsuki's bullshit please.

Sounds more like he's counterclaiming. Let's see what he says.

Counterclaiming ... modified Lawful Commander cop role? 2 Days after I made the claim? Horseshit.

[AngryPidgeon]

There is literally a 0% Panda has any rolerelated reasons to believe Im anything other than town.

Plesae everyone lynch the fucking Panda today. I swear to god, its really this easy sometimes.

P-edit: Escept I did and I got a result.

[AngryPidgeon]

I dont give a flying fuck about destiny mafia, you are confirmed lying. Unless for some fucked up reason I dont show up to trackers/wratchers, which I can ask Cabd but that would be retarded.

[AngryPidgeon]

UNLESS YOU CAN CONVINCE YOURSELF THAT SOMETHING COULD HAVE INTERFERRED WITH MY ACTION

BUT LOLNOPE YOU DYING TODAY

I dont need to convince myself of anything. Do YOU think sometihng interfered with your action?

[AngryPidgeon]

I If I go down today you are turbolynched tomorrow.

[AngryPidgeon]

we are van grants, instructor master, even night tracker. ap visited stalin last night.

out ability will fail against replicas.

VOTE: PANDA

[AngryPidgeon]

YOUR ACTION EITHER FAILED OR YOU'RE LYING BUDDY #1

CHELSEA TORN
TOWN DELAYER

N1 MASTIN
N2 AP

YOU ARE LYING. I AM CONFIRMED VISITING STALIN.

I HAVE A PM IN MY INBOX SAYING STALIN IS NOT A REPLICA.

[AngryPidgeon]

DEAR SCUMFUCKS:

NOW IS THE TIME

TO BU THE SHIT OUT OF KATSUKI.

KATSUKI IS CONFIRMED LYING; THE TRACKER RESULT CONFIRMS IT.

DEAR TOWN:

STOP BEING FUCKING TERRIBLE AT THIS GAME. ALL THE TOWNREADS ON PADA WERE SHITTY.

[AngryPidgeon]

AKA, THERE IS NO WAY AP COULD HAVE POSSIBLY GOTTEN A RESULT LAST NIGHT. HIS ACTION LAST NIGHT SHOULD NOT HAVE RESOLVED UNTIL N3.

I AM CONFIRMED ACTION AND CONFIRMED TOWN.

GET WRECKED.

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm just having a hard time right now accepting a scum fake claim on day three when the game is going really well for them.

What. The. Fuck. Do not talk yourself out of ridiculously obvious scumclaims.

Panda is CONFIRMED LYING.

This is KARTSUKI we are talking about, apply occam's razor please.

[AngryPidgeon]

Great.

Vote: Orcinus

This vote is a scumclaim.

We are lynching either me or Panda today.

[AngryPidgeon]

SO THEN EITHER YOU GUYS ARE BOTH FAKECLAIMING, OR SOMETHING INTERFERRED WITH MY ACTION

DO YOU THINK IT PLAUSABLE THAT ANYONE WOULD TARGET ME OF ALL PEOPLE?!

I THINK NOT

DespBRO -could- be scum, but I know 100% that you are lying.

You keep bringing up that you could have been blocked so you can fall back on that. NOPE. Not gonna happen. You got counterclaimed, deal with it.

[AngryPidgeon]

You're the ActionDan of the game (or the PeregrineV, if you will). Checking you or putting a block on you is SOP.

But if you were blocked, that means scum probably had no better targets.

REMINDER:
Panda was not roleblocked. They are scum. They are lying about their role. They only mention getting blocked because DespBRO countercliamed their result.

Please everybody stop being dumb for one Day phase, that is all I want.

[AngryPidgeon]

@f16, no im not. we are even night only and

aps role is scum directed

.

Huh?

[AngryPidgeon]

If you believe Desp is town then panda Is confirmed lying. Everyone please shut the fuck up and lynch confirmed lying scum.

[AngryPidgeon]

I was not mislynch able before the claim. PV what are you doing idgi. Panda is lying. Stop circlejerking about why scum does what it does and lynch it. There was a CC. Panda starts flinging mud at it and waffling about rbs in response. Jesus.

This is so easy.

[AngryPidgeon]

I was not mislynch able before the claim. PV what are you doing idgi. Panda is lying. Stop circlejerking about why scum does what it does and lynch it. There was a CC. Panda starts flinging mud at it and waffling about rbs in response. Jesus.

This is so easy.

[AngryPidgeon]

Falcon - how did I become the towniest you've ever seen me?

After you checked out last night, I went back and read through all of your responses to me a couple of times, saw the way in which you handled the situation, and it was really obvious that you were trying to figure out my alignment and the perspective from which you were speaking from made sense. You also had that reasonable tone that I hadn't seen in any of your scumgames, that is harder to quantify. I'll give a detailed explanation if you still want to get at how I formed the read but I feel refreshingly certain in a way I wasn't before in this game. I don't think you'd make some of the posts you made last night as scum.

Hey uh, you do realize that JSU is claiming an INNOCENT result on me right?

And Katsuki is claiming that I LIED about my night actions.

Why are you waffling about Katsuki's motivation for this instead of actually addressing the elephant in the room?

[AngryPidgeon]

Well, sorry for being paranoid about the guy who gloats about getting cop confirmed double self-targeting docs mislynched?

I am trying to figure shit out.

Ok well the only way I can be scum is if BRO-desp is scum, so I'll let you resolve that cognitive dissonance then.

[AngryPidgeon]

AP IS OBV FUCKING SCUM

AND YOU GUYS EXPECT HIM TO GO DOWN QUIETLY?

There is an innocent result claimed on me. Yet you still want to lynch me first over the person claiming Im confirmed town.

Get wrecked scum.

[AngryPidgeon]

You could be scum that actually visited Stalin with BRO-Desp tracking you there. BRO-Desp's role is OP. There could potentially be some kind of GF-type role to counter it with yours being it. Like I appear guilty to all cops, perhaps scum have a role that appears innocent to all cops? As for Katsuki's actions on you, perhaps you or one of your buddies is immune from being delayed or scum have a counterpart to Tammy's rolestopper role and used it on before game start? That's a lot of speculation but I can't see a clear scum motive for Katsuki to up and claim "AP didn't visit Stalin" for no reason at all either. He's a good scum player as you know from Anything Goes. He'd expect to survive and win the game.

Oh my god.

If you are town I seriously give up on you for the rest of ever.

Fucking Occam's razor. Why people have to conjure up mystical defenses to shield themselves from reality. Either scum or just WOW.

[AngryPidgeon]

You could be scum that actually visited Stalin with BRO-Desp tracking you there. BRO-Desp's role is OP. There could potentially be some kind of GF-type role to counter it with yours being it. Like I appear guilty to all cops, perhaps scum have a role that appears innocent to all cops? As for Katsuki's actions on you, perhaps you or one of your buddies is immune from being delayed or scum have a counterpart to Tammy's rolestopper role and used it on before game start? That's a lot of speculation but I can't see a clear scum motive for Katsuki to up and claim "AP didn't visit Stalin" for no reason at all either. He's a good scum player as you know from Anything Goes. He'd expect to survive and win the game.

Vote: Cupcake

Finally somebody who isn't fucking delusional.

Guys. KAtsuki claimed a guilty.

KAtsuki got COUNTERCLAIMED IMMEDIATELY by JSU. Katsuki then proceeded to throw mud at JSU and continue to vote for their claimed innocent result over them.

If you are talking yourself out of a Panda vote, I have no hope for you ever. Ever. ever. ever.

[AngryPidgeon]

While this is true, do you remember town!mollie in the Reckoning wanting to lynch UT even though I claimed an innocent on him?

Yes, but panda is lying about their action on me

Panda claimed that I am lying about my role.

They got CCd.

Panda claimed that I am lying about my role.

That is noe claimed/confirmed to be false.

PAnda is lying about their role.

Panda is lying about their role.

Panda is scum.

Please tell me how this compares to Mollie being a VT and just derping.

[AngryPidgeon]

Tammy are you DENSE?

I got an innocent result on Stalin.

Panda is claiming that is impossible.

Unless you want to argue that they actually WERE roleblocked (in addition to the alreadyclaimed RG and Stalin blocks?) what the fuck?

I am 100% certain that Panda was either blocked or is lying and the former seems EXTREMELY unlikely

[AngryPidgeon]

He's saying he's scum for the thought process, but a very town mollie wanted to lynch UT after I weak neighbored him while at the same time thinking I was probably town. It's not unheard of that people make weird moves.

And in this situation, he has a role that says AP didn't do something he said he did. It's just not as clear cut here.

Do you really want to see the fallout if all three involved in this are town? I sure as hell don't. And I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this play coming from katsuki!scum right now.

PANDA IS SCUM BECAUSE THEY ARE LYING ABOUT MY ROLE.

BUT.

I DONT EXPECT EVERYONE TO BE ABLE TO ASK CABD TO CONFIRM/DENY WHETHER OR NOT I GOT A PM ABOUT STALIN IN MY INBOX.

SO YES. IM MAKINGA GODDAMN CASE ON KATSUKI.

WHO IS LYINGABOUT MY ROLE

[AngryPidgeon]

Because he was bored?

Because he got up this morning and he poured himself some Apple Jacks to eat but there was no milk in the refridgerator so he thought "fuck it Im claiming a guilty on AP"

Maybe Ive been unkillable at night cause Im getting protected?

I dont know. Occams razor. Consult Occams razor.

[AngryPidgeon]

I'm just also trying to make sure that everything is thought through. If katsuki comes back town, how likely do you think it is that one of you escape being lynched tomorrow? And if you're town? We're fucked.

Ok maybe Im biased because of ~reasons~, but this is one of those times that people are just goingto 2nd guess thmeselves on.

Maybe because this town has just no motivation after the RBD and mastin flips. Maybe because everybody wants to break the setup.

Maybe because everybody has their head so far up their own ass that they cant be fucked to reevaluate things to get their internal worldview in tune with reality (CF if he is actually town here).

--

Propose a scenario for me that makes sense for Panda town then, assuming Stalin and I are both town.

Scum roleblocked Stalin. RG is lying about being roleblocked maybe?? Katsuki was redirected?

IF ANYBODY BLOCKED OR REDIRECTED CUPCAKE LAST NIGHT, CLAIM IT IN YOUR NEXT POST

[AngryPidgeon]

Maybe Ive been unkillable at night cause Im getting protected?

How would this work?

I dont know and I dont care. People are asking me why Panda would do this as scum and I really dont care.

[AngryPidgeon]

You can earn my vote for Cupcake by linking 3 other players to him.

: |

Ok but I do really need to get some work things done here. This is a request that actually requires thinking on my end rather than cheerleading a wagon on confscum. So I will later on tonight.

[AngryPidgeon]

Im just ridiculously startled that Katsuki is claiming that I lied about my role (Im not) and when someone steps in and confirms my action and my alignment in the same swoop, everyone starts circlejerking instead of wagoning Panda.

Really guys? I dont even have words to describe the level of bad townplay in this game has reached.

[AngryPidgeon]

Like people have been townreading Panda for doing FUCKALL all game. Seriously its "meta" because Panda is being way oo goddamn useless to be scum apparently (fuck that logic) and is chronically lurking. And when claiming a guilty on me which is now known to be untrue, people continue to WK panda and beat around the bush wrt setup to justify them being town?

Delusional is the word Im looking for.

[AngryPidgeon]

I remember Bro saying that if you and he are on a team together that you're practically unstoppable. It's no secret I've been suspicious of both of you on and off during this game. Bro's entrance into today did seem like he got a result on you; he laid it rather low and it was kinda subtle but you picked up on that maybe they were buddying you. I can see you guys planning something like that but I'm not so sure how much I buy it. However, in a recent game scum "enhanced" their role by saying that it also had a cop element, so that part makes me wary. However, if they're scum enhancing their role then you're still town and telling the truth.

Occam's razor. Do you honestly think BROseidon-scum decided off the cuff INSTANTANEOUSLY to go for broke and defend me from a guilty claim?

So panda gets lynched today and flips town. And BROseidon and I just got ourselves chain-lynched because he couldnt keep it in his pants?

I dont get how you think that is remotely possible.

Dont get me wrong, BRO could be a Mafia Tracker or something like that. Not saying its likely or probable and dont particuarly care to figure it out right now. But Katsuki is scum.

The only way I can see Katsuki being town is if the scumteam is RG is lying about being blocked and maybe JSU is also scum just bussing, i really dont know.

[AngryPidgeon]

maybe JSU is also scum just bussing

Errr. Going after Panda-town.