Mini Normal 1829 - Game Over

[MariaR]

I FORGOT THIS STARTED LMFAO

VOTE: Shadow

I'm looking forward to playing with you!

[MariaR]

^ Scum claim ^

Shut up I already townread you now get in my pocket

[MariaR]

Jar and Michael are early scumreads

[MariaR]

Why is Trancend a town read?

Meta.

[MariaR]

Jar and Michael are early scumreads

K yeah let's be power town again *hops in le pocket*

YEEEE LETS GO
Okay time to share role pm's I flipped mafia sided sheriff you?

[MariaR]

Why are you still RVSing with two scumreads?

Why are you so uptight with only 60 posts we're not even close to out of RVS stage

[MariaR]

I've read every post Nero this is still RVS stage for me sorry I'm not matching up with your standards don't belittle me k thanks

[MariaR]

Where the F did I say "I want to stay in RVS stage!" I'm saying we're still in it

Michael's first posts have been a load of bs and feels like he's trying to get something rolling on town (ironic cause I'm doing the same thing)

Jarjar made one post and it wasn't a joking post it was a chainsaw lynch post that was god awful

[MariaR]

Not until you unvote me.

[MariaR]

VOTE: Transcend

No bad stop that.

[MariaR]

I don't like his soft defense of blitz and calling the wagon awful.

His reaction was towny to me I think he's town even if his game is normally meh.

[MariaR]

This is all cute and all you wanting me to explain my reasoning with a pressure vote because none of you scumread me I am null or townread simple your cheap try to get me to explain won't work if you unvote me I'll say why I made such a statement if not. I have nothing to say about it

VOTE: sable

[MariaR]

There are plenty of reasons to vote randomly you're smarter then that

[MariaR]

I don't KNOW anyone's role but the reason I want to start a be should be obvious
Come on think why would I want to start a bw on someone tr

[MariaR]

If you can find the right answer then we can move forward!

[MariaR]

VOTE: MichelSableheart

You should know the answer do you? Don't answer though!

[MariaR]

Look at how fast this bw on me happened I am obv af town no one busses scum this early and anyone who has played with me knows how good a scum game I play you really think I'd let myself get caught no

I seem to be getting votes cause of me talking about rvs when that is NAI it's not like I'm using it as a reason against anyone what logic is this

[MariaR]

The reason I'm not answering the question is because I want people's thoughts on the question I myself asked if anyone can answer we can move forward and talk about it if no one does I see no reason to say my logic behind it

[MariaR]

I will admit Maybe I need to adjust my town play a bit because I always feel rather confident when I flip town because that's normally where I shine on chat mafia (towntelling) but I guess it's quite different here

[MariaR]

I mean Maria is an acceptable policy lynch

U wot

I think he's upset I beat him how are you doing today

[MariaR]

Look at how fast this bw on me happened I am obv af town no one busses scum this early

Ur town af cause scum wouldn't bus this early? Any reason it can't be all town on your wagon?

I don't think town would vote me this early because I honestly don't see the reason I'm getting voted is it cause my RVS question or because I won't answer because I need someone else to take a guess on what it is first I truly don't understand why I'm getting sr I was really excited to flip town this game and I didn't expect to be at L-2 on day 1 I only can assume some scum are on my wagon

[MariaR]

I mean Maria is an acceptable policy lynch

U wot

I think he's upset I beat him how are you doing today

I'm fine ^_^
I have a lot of shit to do today tho
Wbu

Upset at this game for obv reason but besides that I'm okay!

[MariaR]

The reason I'm not answering the question is because I want people's thoughts on the question I myself asked if anyone can answer we can move forward and talk about it if no one does I see no reason to say my logic behind it

Ur not in a position to refuse to answer questions cause u want peoples thoughts. Ur basically @ L-1.

Can you answer the question for me then so I can answer it after?

[MariaR]

I honestly almost want to fake claim just to stay alive but I know I shouldn't do that on this site so I'm just gonna claim VT I don't know what I did wrong I guess my town game is awful on this site and my scum game is great that's ironic.

[MariaR]

Where the F did I say "I want to stay in RVS stage!" I'm saying we're still in it

Michael's first posts have been a load of bs and feels like

he's trying to get something rolling on town (ironic cause I'm doing the same thing)

Jarjar made one post and it wasn't a joking post it was a chainsaw lynch post that was god awful

VOTE: MariaR

Explain the bolded.

This is a great post.

unvote blitzkrieg

Let me answer your 2nd part first I was going to start pushing on Transcend slightly and take back my meta read but I don't want to answer why until someone at least tries to guess to see if they agree with my line of thinking

To answer the first part it's mostly cause I think sable wouldn't push on a scum buddy and I have him as my biggest scumread at the moment

If you could or anyone take a guess I'd be happy to say why I made that statement

Maria, why are you so sure the person* Michael is rolling is on town, as is the person** you are doing the same thing to?

* Blitzkrieg
** Shadow

Consider my vote on Maria at this time

Maria care to address my question here?

[MariaR]

The premature claim seals the deal

Maria is a good enough player to not get flustered like this as town.

Are you scum? You haven't seen me as town Elyse so how can you make such a statement that's quite untrue

[MariaR]

Oh I answered in quotes ignore that last thing
Let me answer your 2nd part first I was going to start pushing on Transcend slightly and take back my meta read but I don't want to answer why until someone at least tries to guess to see if they agree with my line of thinking

To answer the first part it's mostly cause I think sable wouldn't push on a scum buddy and I have him as my biggest scumread at the moment

If you could or anyone take a guess I'd be happy to say why I made that statement

[MariaR]

I don't really know what to say because I just don't understand why I'm getting scumread like If I understand why I can defend myself but I can't even make a defense for myself at this point all I can say is it wouldn't be THIS easy to catch me as scum could someone unvote me so we can at least talk about this
Not everyone has been talked yet (but that's kinda a weak reason)

[MariaR]

I don't need to see you as town

You had me as hard town last game when I was scum you think I'd make it so easy for you this time as I was mafia? I know what people townread me on as scum

[MariaR]

This is really disrespectful to me but I don't know what I have to be offended about? I guess people thinking I'd be this easy a lynch as scum idk.

[MariaR]

I won't even having fucking closure cause I don't know what I'm doing wrong

[MariaR]

It's page 7 two days into the game and you're claiming at L-2 asking what you did wrong. It seems like a calculated scum move to me rather than a genuine town one because of your skill level.

You still haven't explained why you wanted a bandwagon on a townread (assuming it's some bs about wanting to see who would hop on) or more importantly WHY you were townreading both the person you were voting and the person Michel was voting.

BECAUSE I WANT SOMEONE TO TAKE A GUESS I'VE ASKED SOMEONE TO 3 TIMES

[MariaR]

Can you unvote take a guess and we can talk on this if you're still not liking my answer feel free to put me back at L-1

[MariaR]

I'm begging here
thank you for thinking my scum level is amazing but you're giving me way to much credit to compare it to my town game

[MariaR]

No I won't unvote

I already guessed - to see who would hop onto an easy town wagon.

Now why are you townreading blitzkrieg and shadow

I don't tr shadow I tr bliz because Michael was pushing it and I think he's scum

I was planning on voting Transcend and taking my meta tr back because I think people towntell best under a ton of pressure so if he could towntell it would make it easier for everyone to understand my townread on him like I already have.

[MariaR]

I wanted someone else to answer to see if they got to that same line of thinking as me and they'd prob get a bit of town points on it.

[MariaR]

I've never been lynched as day 1 before so this kinda fking sucks I didn't expect to be so upset about it mostly cause I don't understand the votes on me

[MariaR]

If you do decide to show up and answer stuff...

This is all cute and all you wanting me to explain my reasoning with a pressure vote because

none of you scumread me I am null or townread

simple your cheap try to get me to explain won't work if you unvote me I'll say why I made such a statement if not. I have nothing to say about it

Why don't you believe anyone scumreads you?

answer this now

Sorry I didn't see this well mostly because I don't think I've done anything scummy.

[MariaR]

I don't see anything that I've done that can be looked at as in a scummy manner

[MariaR]

That's why I'm so flustered and upset if you scumread me for something I can understand okay I can forgive your mistake but I don't see anything that I've done!

[MariaR]

I thought a few votes on me were pressure votes to get me to explain my reasoning cause I understand that's a tactic but the fact my wagon keeps getting larger makes me think scum is on my wagon because I don't think I'd play so badly that all town bandwagon me like

Where I play my town game is amazing and my scum game is awful so the fact it seems to be in reverse is throwing me for a loop if you understand that

[MariaR]

It also doesn't make sense that Maria is flustered if she thinks the wagon on her is only pressure.

Plus townreading someone because a "scumread" pushes them is terrible on page 80, never mind page 2.

I never said the townread was strong but it's the best I have for a townread what you want me to lie and say there posts are amazing? Maybe I should have but what can I say I'm a sucker for it
My actions also do make sense I wasn't flustered when I thought it was pressure (look at post 89) but I'm flustered now because I see it ISN'T just pressure it's a legit sr

[MariaR]

Look at how fast this bw on me happened I am obv af town no one busses scum this early

Ur town af cause scum wouldn't bus this early? Any reason it can't be all town on your wagon?

I don't think town would vote me this early because I honestly don't see the reason I'm getting voted is it cause my RVS question or because I won't answer because I need someone else to take a guess on what it is first I truly don't understand why I'm getting sr I was really excited to flip town this game and I didn't expect to be at L-2 on day 1 I only can assume some scum are on my wagon

Who do you think are the scum on your wagon ?

If I had to say atm Elyse and Sable

[MariaR]

VOTE: elyse
if uve really seen scummaria before, u would know that scumher is consistent as f
this doesnt resemble her scumplay at all

Don't try to meta read me I change a lot of my gameplay going into each game even if I like your reasoning ^_^

[MariaR]

Is there anything that needs clarification?

[MariaR]

To go more into detail about me wanting to be Transcend I understand "Meta" isn't that much of a solid way to state you tr someone because no one can understand your meta besides the person saying it so I wanted to try and come up for a way to get him to town tell so everyone else could understand it there for starting a bw on him and getting him to towntell with a lot of votes on him of course I can't do that now but that was the plan.

[MariaR]

@shadow
yes but tell me why she would think approaching the game the way she did will help her as scum?
and she had chances to town it up but she kept baiting rope
this doesnt look like scum

Wait how am I baiting rope? o-o

[MariaR]

RWaTaeETTztaA HOW AM I SCUMMMYYYY???????

[MariaR]

Thor can you quote the question you asked me on Transcend I forgot it.

duplicate my town game as scum? Well I guess that could work but I change going into each game so I don't really have 1 type of game I know what some people town read me on and if I was scum in this case I'd use it to get me townread call it wifom if you want but it's truth.

[MariaR]

Ducking questions and doing walls of AtE and also acting like you need to be unvoted to start contributing.
None of those things ping my town bells.

Could you answer my meta questions to you about Transcend now?

I haven't been ducking questions I wanted to be unvoted to talk over something because I stay at worry at L-1 and rush my thinking/typing and that doesn't help anything.

[MariaR]

If you're gonna go on the logic that I only have 1 type of town/scum game you're gonna have a very hard time reading me I hate this so much because meta really shouldn't be much of a thing even if I use it because everyone thinks you have to mirror you're play it it pisses me off slightly

[MariaR]

but I change going into each game so I don't really have 1 type of game

Huh? That's like not @ all what u said.

???
I change my play going into forum mafia games every time because you people love to use meta so I'm forced to change it regardless of my role because it's really stupid

What do you think I said

[MariaR]

like you keep repeating how if u were scum, you'd never allow urself to be caught so easily.

Well can u be so sure if you keep changing ur playstyle?

I wouldn't be able to be caught because playing the room is one of my fav things to do as scum I can't go into full detail on what I do but I can tell you I would already have a way townreads and decent planning going on I don't have any plans and I try to change things a little each game for example

I used a ton of ate in 1 scum game I played all game

I tried to do it short bursts in another game as scum

My scum game changes all the time my town game is um...huh I don't really know how to describe my town game on forum mafia mostly because I kinda just say what I want I don't really have much of a plan as I just post and do what I feel like doing along with asking questions and scum hunting

[MariaR]

I try to change my scum game game after game so people can't say "Oh Maria acts like this as scum!" Although that could hurt me in the long run for games it's kinda something I try to do even if it's a bit lazy

[MariaR]

oh shit explosion

i'll catch up later

I'm getting lynched day 1 now I know how you feel

[MariaR]

My hero....

[MariaR]

I can't really make the statement I want to because I've said it as scum before so I'll prob get scumread for it but I tried my best still don't really understand half the sr's on me but at least I had a chat for a bit of closure I can get lynched now.

[MariaR]

Maria, I don't understand. If you're saying that as scum, people would already be townreading you, then why wouldn't you try getting townread as town? You obviously know how.

Because a lot of it I find rather cheap and don't really want to get a townread based off that I wanna be tr for my reads reasoning and logic know what I mean?

[MariaR]

Got Transcend in my pocket now it's time to rule the world.

[MariaR]

I was so ready for this to be like my first newbie game but shame. Can anyone voting me say why they sr me please and ty

[MariaR]

It is in the sense that we're gonna powerf*ck this game.

...I wouldn't use that exact wording but something along those lines
but I'm prob eating rope here

[MariaR]

Yes Thor I don't want to do those things to get them to townread me cause I feel like it's CHEAP if that makes you scumread me oh well

[MariaR]

His usual reaction to claims of meta is to sound like a 5 year old and claim that meta is trash, and he can't be read by meta.
He happily went along with your read.

How does that play into his meta in your mind, and also please explain the meta that got you to town read him - I want to know how much to trust it as a read.

I know Transcend better then any of you at this table you guys may not be able to meta read him but I can and I strongly strongly believe he is town.

[MariaR]

i understand that

but, asking for justifications about ~every damn action~ you take is ridiculous.

questioning some actions is fine.

THIS

having gut reads is scummy or not being able to explain every little thing is scummy like...please

[MariaR]

Yo ngl I thought of claiming IC just to get out of the lynch but some people hate fake claiming so I can't zzz

[MariaR]

Scum's main goal is to look like town and they feel like they need to justify their reasons a lot more then town because they know they're lying it's more likely for scum to be posting the giant walls over town

[MariaR]

People always think I'm trying to ate when it's just me saying my thoughts I'm saying my emotions and thoughts in every post I'm not holding anything but I don't think I need to the only thing i held back was saying "lynch me I'm not important" but I said that as scum so
If you read my posts as Ate so be it I'm gonna be posting a ton of Ate posts then my scum game may be good in this site but the fact you blindly think I'm that good seems like weak bases to want to vote me and if the me Transcend thing looks weird look at this game

[MariaR]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=67015

We did the same "weird buddy buddy" thing and look we were both town!

[MariaR]

I keep defeating every point Elyse tries to make on me and yet she's still voting me sigh

[MariaR]

Transcend, If we hang maria and she flips red, you don't get to use the "Why would I hard defend my scumbuddy?" defense tomorrow.

Just letting u know.

May I ask what you sr me on I don't wanna know what you tr me on

[MariaR]

I honestly don't want to sleep before I get more votes on me but idk what to do

[MariaR]

Also are u scumreading me?

You seem to be having real conflict when you prob could of kept me at L-1 so atm not rly

[MariaR]

Your vote didn't seem like a joke to me and it seemed like you wanted to line of lynchs on me and Transcend and it would of been easy for you place blame on others along with doing it

[MariaR]

I say none of you scumread me because I feel like I've done nothing that's a scumtell so that's why I think scum are on the wagon I hope you can make sense of that

and to answer your 2nd post it's honestly just true idc how scummy it looks I wouldn't let myself get roped day 1 as scum I'd pull out all the stops but I'm not doing that for obv reason.

[MariaR]

I pride myself in my scum game on this site and I will say it over and over I would never get lynched day 1 as scum *puffs out chest*

[MariaR]

I wouldn't let myself get roped day 1 as scum I'd pull out all the stops but I'm not doing that for obv reason.

Reasons aren't obvious to me. "cuz it's cheap" isn't a reason.

Cheap as in the way I get a townread I don't really like because people say I ate to much to the point where it's unenjoyable or I dumbtell and ask stupid questions that's not how I wanna get tr as scum and I've done it before.

[MariaR]

If i'm scum I wanna win by outplaying people with my reads and cases on people not ate and dumbtell

[MariaR]

@elyse
my point is her ate here is not helping her. its clearly backfiing on her
so stop with the "calulated" shit

Since when does calculated mean good?

if I was scum I would be capslock raging and self voting saying lynch me atm

[MariaR]

I think the reason he didn't go like "YOU CAN'T META ME"
Is because he knows I'm one of the only people who can meta read him

[MariaR]

I've explained my entire thought process to all of you and that I don't like getting tr by acting dumb or by getting tr by my ate even if I do it a lot I have said everything I could possibly say and I don't know what else you want I don't really have much to say at this point if you still scumread me and you're town I'm sorry I couldn't convince you

[MariaR]

Okay, that was the first part of the question, let's revisit the second part; can you explain the meta that you saw that enabled you to meta read him? (I'm asking this kind of tongue in cheek because I'm pretty sure the answer is no, but I'm obligated to ask anyway)

Are you asking me what this meta is that he normally does as town

[MariaR]

I'm sorry I couldn't convince you

No you're not, because you refused to use your super secret power CHEAP town read skills.
SO actually you're trying to intentionally play a less effective town game than you're capable of - so if we lynch you, it's your fault

I suppose you're right I'd rather lose and be proud of the game I played then feel bad and win

[MariaR]

Yes, I am asking you to describe the meta, so I can see your thought process and perhaps share your town read on the slot, as that would be helpful for me to sort both you and him.
It's a crazy habit I have when playing - weird, i know, but it works for me.

I'll explain the parts that I can he gets upset quite easy as town and does a lot of suboptimal stuff doing stuff that only transcend wants he's more likely to appeal to the town's needs as mafia I also think a big part of it is his non caring tone


Another part of it is having this vibe where you just know by the way they post and how things are going like "yup they're town with me" it's weird but true!

[MariaR]

I suppose you're right I'd rather lose and be proud of the game I played then feel bad and win

I wouldn't feel proud playing beneath my skill level - but whatever floats your boat I suppose.

You'd do anything you could do to win even if it could make the game unenjoyable for the people you're playing with? I won't judge but you do you

[MariaR]

I can careless about her meta tr on me as I agree with her sr and reasoning so I think she's town because of it

So you're just voting me because my play is bad to you and nothing else you don't even sr me dear god Nero I thought you were better then this

[MariaR]

I'll explain the parts that I can he gets upset quite easy as town and does a lot of suboptimal stuff doing stuff that only transcend wants he's more likely to appeal to the town's needs as mafia I also think a big part of it is his non caring tone

How has he particularly done any of this so far this game?

He hasn't made any suboptimal plays moreso than half the rest of the game.
He hasn't got upset beyond *maybe* the push on you as a scumread, and that came after your meta read of him.
I haven't particularly got a "don't care" vibe from him, and even if I squinted and decided it was there it appears to come after your read on him.

Am I just totally blowing this?

His sub optimal idc was going after the bliz wagon and the mini caps rage is what I noted

What shocks me is you don't get the "I don't care vibe" I think that's the most clear out of them all the other 2 I can understand if you don't get but the 3rd rly?

[MariaR]

I suppose you're right I'd rather lose and be proud of the game I played then feel bad and win

I wouldn't feel proud playing beneath my skill level - but whatever floats your boat I suppose.

You'd do anything you could do to win even if it could make the game unenjoyable for the people you're playing with? I won't judge but you do you

Huh? Aren't you telling us that this is EXACTLY HOW YOU PLAY AS SCUM?

Sometimes depends on my mood. I try not to though.

[MariaR]

That's some serious contradiction there.

Not at all?

[MariaR]

As town I could caps lock rage and say unvote me aswell but that's not fun for anyone I do it as scum to get votes off me and then stop I dislike doing it and only do it sometimes

[MariaR]

It's not even close to a contradiction but feel free to make more things up

[MariaR]

Anything I say you think is scummy why am I even trying I've given fact after fact and my clear logic on why I'm town you're just ego tunneling at this point.

[MariaR]

I pride myself in my scum game because I think I play a over good scum game and I'd do basically anything to win even if it's caps lock rage to some points and self voting but I don't want to do that so I'm trying to stop I know what it takes for people to tr me and I'd be doing that right now if I was scum but I'm not the fact you still think I'm scum makes me think you're just bad at reading the game and you're ego tunneling but carry on

[MariaR]

I'll play along

Huh? Aren't you telling us that this is EXACTLY HOW YOU PLAY AS SCUM?

Sometimes depends on my mood. I try not to though.

So it's entirely possible that you could be getting lynched as scum day 1 right?

Cause depending on your mood you might not "pull out all the stops" correct?

hmmmm hard question to answer because I've never been tested IE: I've never been close to being lynched as scum on day 1 so yeah maybe I think I may try a bit of "I give up w/e it's gg" but not the ate rage unless I was in a pissy mood but then again I've never been close to being lynched as scum before on d1

[MariaR]

You're talking out of 1 side of ur mouth saying "I try not to play that way cause it's unenjoyable for people"

And the other side says "Of course I'm not scum. If I was scum I'd totally play that way.

How can u pretend that's not a contradiction?

Ah I see what you're saying now
I try not to play like that but sometimes I just do because it's just an impulse to just try my best to win even if it upsets people so I'm trying to not do that...would I ate caps lock spam here...uhhh maybe for a little but not to the extreme I think as scum I could get out of this bind quite easy (in fact I don't even think I'd be in it)

[MariaR]

So as scum you play to win and hurt people's feels.
As town you always and always refuse - because getting a town role PM changes your breaking point.

Sometimes as scum i'll ate rage to get a townread and I only really yell at my scumbuddy because I don't want people to not have a enjoyable game cause it's a game ye know I want people to have fun when they play with me and yes I may ate a little as town but I'll mostly step back and walk away because I don't want to get tr on my ate more so as I want to be tr for my gameplay

[MariaR]

didn't want this to happen so early but mariar has given me permission in our pt

MariaR and I are masons.

....... I SAID I COULD GET OUT OF THIS

[MariaR]

I said let me try a bit more then out you moron

[MariaR]

well this game is off to a lovely start I was gonna claim my real role when I got back to L-1 but zzz

[MariaR]

OH GOD IM SO STUPID I SLIPPED MY ROLE LOLOL. im gonna go eat bye

THAT WASN'T REALLY A SOFT STOP IT

[MariaR]

I was planning on voting Transcend and taking my meta tr back because I think people towntell best under a ton of pressure so if he could towntell it would make it easier for everyone to understand my townread on him like I already have.

Pressure from a mason partner usually works awesomely.

Of course he knew I'd unvote but if others joined he could of prob towntold enough I wasn't gonna tell him what I was doing

[MariaR]

VOTE: Gerry
Guess who flipped scum!

[MariaR]

Gerry's "slip" seems forced but dat's just me,

Also I mean I thought it made sense on why I had the meta tr on him

[MariaR]

Kraska isn't scum. I would like a vote in Elyse/Sable to be honest

[MariaR]

I hardclaim mason if that's what you're asking of me

[MariaR]

it

You know what he means! :p

[MariaR]

Transcend, I don't have the time for bullshit tyvm.

Why did you sr me before

[MariaR]

@Gerry: any particular reasons to disbelief the maria/transcend claim, other than that they're two players who could try such a stunt as scum?

just doesnt feel right. why did transcend have to be the one to claim it for them when maria was the one being voted. couldn't she have just softed PR and left it as is?

I asked him to wait a bit and see if I could get some votes off me so he claimed before I would have liked (look back at our posts and you'll see) I didn't want to give crumbs to a role where I'd be clear that seems stupid

[MariaR]

She tr's me because of meta if I'm not mistaken

[MariaR]

She tr's me because of meta if I'm not mistaken

Yup, here's what SHE said:

if uve really seen scummaria before, u would know that scumher is consistent as f
this doesnt resemble her scumplay at all

Didn't you tell us that your play is in fact NOT consistent? That you always change shit up cause u don't want to be meta'd?

Yes but I don't tell people that and she's only played 1 game with me before (I was scum) so her logic adds up.

[MariaR]

EM stands for epicmafia it's a chat mafia site that me Transcend and Gerry play from I don't think anyone else does.

[MariaR]

She tr's me because of meta if I'm not mistaken

Yup, here's what SHE said:

if uve really seen scummaria before, u would know that scumher is consistent as f
this doesnt resemble her scumplay at all

Didn't you tell us that your play is in fact NOT consistent? That you always change shit up cause u don't want to be meta'd?

Yes but I don't tell people that and she's only played 1 game with me before (I was scum) so her logic adds up.

Wait. How can she call ur scum game consistent if she's only played one game with you?

You think THAT logic adds up?

I thought she meant it as in my game is wavering in this game and it was pretty perfect in the scum game so she thinks I'm town that logic seems fine to me or did you take it a dif way

[MariaR]

It's pretty easy to be calm in a game if you never get pressured. Were you put at L-1 early in that other scum game?

Nope I never got close to L-1 I think I got to L-4 or 3 the only reason I died was to a cop guilty

[MariaR]

I thought she meant it as in my game is wavering in this game and it was pretty perfect in the scum game so she thinks I'm town that logic seems fine to me or did you take it a dif way

You think it's ok to base a meta read on one game of experience?

Especially now that you say you change every game?

ughghdfhsgdsfad stupid mason claim I want to lynch you with fire

She didn't know that I'm not saying I agree but her logic adds up so I don't see anything fishy with it

[MariaR]

I still don't think I did anything to warrant a sr on me lol maybe I'm blind cause I'm clearish but meh

[MariaR]

I still don't think I did anything to warrant a sr on me

How many scum do you think voted you?
Yeah - you did stuff to get scumread.
You even admitted that you weren't doing towny things on purpose because it would be CHEAP - so what are you even talking about?

We're not lynching Gerry unless you can explain why what he did is scummy in any way at all.
In other news - vote for Elyse.

no I admitted I wasn't doing things that some people tr me on your def of towny is flawed you're not a dictator people already said what Gerry did for me it should be simple once you look at over he's not stupid enough to "slip" I already said that was forced as fuck

[MariaR]

oh maria is still voting me? lol. maria why am i scum?

Why are you worried about my vote over the other people voting you?

Mostly cause I don't think you're stupid enough to "slip"

[MariaR]

VOTE: Elyse

Transcend is town and I'm town there has been nothing that points to me as scum I've given my logic and reasoning if you can't see it enjoy the ML!

[MariaR]

in my eyes Transcend is still my mason buddy

[MariaR]

What could I possibly be scum for that I change things around I haven't made any contradictions I haven't done anything to point me as scum like I srsly don't see it
@Gerry I said you wouldn't do a slip as town like a moron you're either a pr that wants to be hit or you're scum

[MariaR]

maria can you answer my question or are you just gonna ignore it

I ALREADY ANSWERED IT TWICE NUMBSKULL

[MariaR]

Jar Transcend and Kraska are all in my town pool Elyse and Sable still in dat scum pool

[MariaR]

MariaR plz no fowl language. But, I refuse to believe you'd actually think that as town, which is prob why you flipped to someone else. good choice.

Believe what

[MariaR]

MariaR plz no fowl language. But, I refuse to believe you'd actually think that as town, which is prob why you flipped to someone else. good choice.

Believe what

that me softing PR is scummy, because you know I do it regardless of my role many times on EM. Also, I thought I was scummy, why am I not in your scum pool

You don't soft pr very much unless you really are pr I rarely see you do it as blue and you are scummy for the gamit but not on the tier of Sable/Elyse maybe I'm wrong on you could be.

[MariaR]

She isn't close to dumb.

[MariaR]

I just have bliz as dumb not dumb town or scum just dumb

[MariaR]

Funny how both of us can be town and

none

of you are willing to consider that scenario...

Na we can't both be town! I mean it's way to complicated for us to both be town

[MariaR]

Me and Transcend acted like this in our first game on the site together before you make claims like that please take a look at it and see if you think there's a dif or it's the same.

[MariaR]

Now that you know the mason claim is fake why are people not voting me nothing has seemingly changed so I want to know what happened?

[MariaR]

I also tr the mason play from him because it just seems something that Transcend would do for instance if someone like Gerry did that I'd be semi fishy with it with Transcend I wasn't at all fishy with it

[MariaR]

I also tr the mason play from him because it just seems something that Transcend would do for instance if someone like Gerry did that I'd be semi fishy with it with Transcend I wasn't at all fishy with it

I'm going to play a game with you which is called "pretend ur town"

Are you so confident that town transcend would be able to read you as town and thus pull a gambit like this to save you? Forget the risk of outing a possible other mason group had there been a CC...

I mean all I've heard is how great your scum game is...

Ur town read on him for doing such a thing is what scares me the most.

I think he would I think the point to focus on in this question is how did he tr me so hard but he normally does know when I'm town

[MariaR]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=67015

Once again here's the game where me and Transcend how a hard tr on each other for the whole game

[MariaR]

If I had my way Kra Transcend and Jar won't be the lynches today

Sable your vote was a bit questionable imo because you just bw'd off of bliz question of wanting me to explain something I said and after that you didn't unvote it seemed really weird and rubbed me the wrong way and the thing with gambits I think they can be valid to fake claim for reactions and to bait scum into killing you but we can agree to disagree on that

[MariaR]

wtf that is such a townsided set up

[MariaR]

Is every game on this site townsided to hell?

[MariaR]

https://epicmafia.com/topic/76126
^ BALANCED SET UP

[MariaR]

I forget but ik I had a good reason I'll tell you when I remember

[MariaR]

Now that you know the mason claim is fake why are people not voting me nothing has seemingly changed so I want to know what happened?

You act as though faking a mason claim means nothing changed

in regards to me nothing changed I did nothing else really so anyone who sr me should still sr me so wtf changed with it I don't understand

[MariaR]

VOTE: Transcend

@Maria
Do you think it's possible that Transcend is taking advantage of your experience with him and fakeclaiming masons to get you on his side? I've seen him say that you're obvtown (lol) but aside from the fake mason claim, you haven't explained why you're townreading him. And if the mason claim is the only reason, you need to take a step back and see the scum motivation in doing what he did. Read the game that I linked.

I don't think Maria/Transcend are both town and think it's far more likely Transcend is scum. Fakeclaiming mason to save a townread that wasn't even the definitive lynch of the day does not seem like a townie thing to do. Makes much more sense for scumTranscend to see an opening to get a pocket townread from Maria. And if he knows she is town, he probably expected her to flip first of the two. And even when she didn't flip mason, he would look good because she was still town. He might get called stupid and antitown for fakeclaiming, but not necessarily scummy. I literally did the same exact thing for the same exact reasons and sailed through the rest of the game.

Yeah it's not like i haven't thought that he could be scum trying to pocket me but the thing is his tone and very all play just screams town to me he plays like this all the time and I know he's good but I doubt he can mirror his play like he is now and the only reason he retracted the claim was because of blacklist he got the vote off me when I was at L-2 I think scum Transcend could of just went along and said "yeah Maria is scummy" and hammered me when you put me at L-1 and this day would honestly be over I am quite sure he is town

[MariaR]

Ok so aside from his "tone", you're townreading him for not hammering you?

That's awful. You think he would risk lynching a townie so early on in the day? Especially when he apparently knows your meta and you could throw him under the bus in twilight.

That's not even close to all I'm trying to not out all of my meta on him or he can abuse it when he's scum

[MariaR]

Something is off with the Transcend Maria dynamic. I feel one of them is mafia, but I'm not really sure which right now.

What feels off it'd be nice to get an outside look on it even if I think me and him are both town is it the fact we hard tr each other or you're jealous of our mad skillz

[MariaR]

Gonna get on my comp in a sec cause y'all are pissing me off for now

VOTE: karnos

[MariaR]

Maria is by far my topmost suspect. There is still her scumslip in post #78, and I would have hoped town maria would have realized how dangerous Transcends mason claim was.

That isn't a scumslip and I already said why I thought you were trying to get a bw going on town and I was doing the same thing so he can town tell so PLEASE tell me how that's a scumslip again

Also keep calling people idiots trans.

If you are town and get lynched here, it's because of your own terrible ego-driven gambit.

Garbage plays like that from town are what ruin perfectly good games of mafia.

shut the f up rn he has an ego but he's not fking stupid if he's town and I think he is just because something isn't normal for you or it's risky doesn't make it garbage the only reason I rarely do gambits here isn't because I think they're bad it's because I respect the site rule/motto but don't go on and say they're bad when they can be very rewarding the fact a blacklist thing is even in place is fking bs

I was literally protecting a townread.

Which is terrible play as town. Even if you're correct about it, by making that claim, the wagon dissolves and now we can't analyze the votes on it since everyone (town and scum) will all have the same reaction: unvoting.

Furthermore, you risk yourself getting lynched once the lie comes out.

Like I said, plays like that lose games for town.

No things that lose games for town is town being moronic and ego tunneling instead of looking for legit scumtells nad only voting who they want scum sometimes just play better no single person will lose a game for town and yeah I'm sure there have been some bad gambits but there has also been good ones

Gonna get on my comp in a sec cause y'all are pissing me off for now

VOTE: karnos

Is Karnos doing something more scummy, or is Elyse doing something less scummy?
I mean, I know I'm suggesting that you're just opportunistically vote hopping, but I'd love to hear your version.

Where is my sheep this button?

Oh wait, I'm already voting there.

You're not even doing anything you haven't stated why you sr me and aren't doing anything please don't act like you have any type of read on this game because you don't you're doing less work then shadow and kraska and your vote is placed on town so if you're town I highly suggest you get your ass in gear and do something thank you.

[MariaR]

Gonna get on my comp in a sec cause y'all are pissing me off for now

VOTE: karnos

Is Karnos doing something more scummy, or is Elyse doing something less scummy?
I mean, I know I'm suggesting that you're just opportunistically vote hopping, but I'd love to hear your version.

I guess you can call it an opportunistic vote on my part I do think Karnos last few lines are trash but I want to go on w/e bw out of Elyse/Karnos I think I can get more momentum on I think both are scum and votes that need to happen I pref this happens but if Elyse get's anywhere towards l-3 or L-2 I'll vote it without a second thought and nothing is going to stop me

[MariaR]

Also Sable I'm not fking stupid of course I see why scum Transcend could do what he did I said that is a post before I just see town transcend being more likely am I blind? Could be I don't think so

[MariaR]

Bliz and Thor are lost causes because they're ego tunneling at this post and should just leave.

[MariaR]

if we have a vig shoot Karnos please and if he flips green I'll self vote there is 100% mafia in Elyse/Karnos look at this back pedal

[MariaR]

Na you vote me now put your money where your mouth is

[MariaR]

True.

[MariaR]

hey look Elyse and me agree on something for once! That last line is what made me vote him wanna join me?

[MariaR]

I forget but ik I had a good reason I'll tell you when I remember

Hey Maria! Did you remember why you were scumreading me?

Yes!
I think you just used the "You're way to good to do this as town!" As a weak reason to vote me when you haven't even seen my town game so I don't know how you can even come to that conclusion
Pedit: What I was just telling the truth would you rather I lie

[MariaR]

I think you just used the "You're way to good to do this as town!" As a weak reason to vote me when you haven't even seen my town game so I don't know how you can even come to that conclusion

Here's my line of thinking:

I was impressed with your gameplay in our last game and consider you a good player from that.

You had a random meltdown for no reason in this game and since I thought you were a good player, I thought you were AtEing on purpose.

Hence my scumread on you.

Unless you want to argue that you're shitty as town? Idk I've never seen such changes in skill level between alignments.

Well I don't really know *shrug* maybe this just isn't my game I haven't really had a ton of town games so I don't really have much to base my town gameplay a lot of my posts aren't even meant to be ate I'm just saying what I'm thinking but it comes off as ate

[MariaR]

Also if i was gonna ate as scum it wouldn't be slight it would be:

UNVOTE ME YOU FKERS THIS GAME IS FKING STUPID DEAR GOD HOW ARE YOU DUMB LIKE WHAT THE FK I NEVER WANT TO PLAY WITH ANY OF YOU AGAIN

(put self vote here)

[MariaR]

On 2nd thought would I change it knowing I just played with Transcend and Gerry? ...hm maybe tone it down a bit hmmm...now I wish I flipped scum just to see how I would have taken this.

[MariaR]

It isn't a townslip I was going for I just feel people towntell better under pressure, Even if you disagree I don't think people are looking at my reasoning for doing these actions. I feel like I explained enough to show why I did what I did to me it shows the good intent I had in mind.

[MariaR]

I feel lime a lot of this sr on me is because people disagree with me. I don't think that's a valid reason to sr someone

[MariaR]

I could be wrong about this being a chainsaw reaction but that doesn't mean transcend isn't scum. Transcend could be scum independently.

If it's the chainsaw making you vote - you're doing it wrong.
If it's something else, you should talk about the something else rather than talking about the chainsaw.

Bliz and Thor are lost causes because they're ego tunneling at this post and should just leave.

Where should we go?

if we have a vig shoot Karnos please and if he flips green I'll self vote there is 100% mafia in Elyse/Karnos look at this back pedal

I'm glad you're not egotunneling...wait...

What about if we kill Elyse first, do we get the same deal?
If no - why?
If yes - why call out Karnos first?

Yeah, my specific ask was for scum to fakeclaim with scum, though I'll agree you could have read it differently, but that's what you were selling, and that's what I was suggesting never happens.

I was never selling that Maria and Transcend were scumbuddies who claimed masons together

Your initial comment was that I shouldn't scumread you for believing their claims.
I guess it works if you're only talking one of them as opposed to both, but it weakens your point.

If I was ego tunneling I'd be prob voting you I'm not ego tunneling. You don't get the same deal with Elyse because I get the nagging feeling they're not partners and my sr on her was for 2 posts while the rest of her game has been fine

[MariaR]

Oh and you should go away from the thread take a set back and say: "maybe I am ego tunneling I should relook at this." That would be fantastic.

[MariaR]

hey Maria, explain your town read on kraska please.

Oh sorry I didn't see this!
Well mostly because this seems like town kraska as I just played with her and her reasoning for townreading me doesn't seem made up at all it fits quite well to be honest I also think her going on the defensive alot with her reads comes more from town then scum as scum normally always have reasons to back up the read I strongly think she's town here and I don't get the sr's

[MariaR]

Okay.

I think Elyse and Michel are town. Elyse especially has come to about the same conclusion as me in 623

I'd vote transcend now if it was another player in the slot posting like he is, but... maybe this is just town transcend acting like transcend always acts, not voting him yet.

fakedit: I voted gerry because there was no reason to claim, it was obviously not an accidental claim. It might have been a harmless joking post, but we were way past RVS at that point and I didn't see any towbn motivation to start BS posting again.

Maybe we should just lynch transcend, because he is going to be lynchbait in lylo if he lives that long, and I don't scum killing him.

Gonna get on my comp in a sec cause y'all are pissing me off for now

VOTE: karnos

chainsaw?

Lets make it real.

VOTE: transcend

if we have a vig shoot Karnos please and if he flips green I'll self vote there is 100% mafia in Elyse/Karnos look at this back pedal

Okay Thor, I'll vote MariaR.

Get her to L-1 and I will hammer.

[MariaR]

Can't make up his mind with the fence sit acting like he was really thinking and then just gives a very weak reason to vote behind it and instead of voting me himself he has to wait until he can hammer me?
I can go more in depth on this if I really need to but atm I'm eating

[MariaR]

karnos is probably town he absolutely cranked me in one completed game as mafia this doesn't resemble his mafia play at all. like if he's putting on an act then wp but i think he's being genuine.

You're wrong.

[MariaR]

god, i hate day 1 in forum mafia. it's such a clusterfuck. And I can never get reads until one person is lynched. Someone mentor me in better day 1s as town and what to look for.

And Gerry is prob town fml

[MariaR]

@Maria - So, basically, the OMGUS?
I don't get what's pro scum with the hammer comment I don't get what's pro town with it either, but I fail to see how that adds to a scum case beyond the flop on you after you attacked him.

Na I don't really understand his thinking it seems quite forced and rapid like he wants to give off the impression he's in a conflict and that's what he did in the first few posts but then it changed so randomly I just don't see how you get to this thinking the omgus has nothing to do with it if he voted anyone that way it would have ringed bells

[MariaR]

am i wrong tho? i sincerely think he's just scummy town. like why the fuck would scum post what he posted...

You're wrong.

[MariaR]

sure of it???

pretty sure.

[MariaR]

[MariaR]

@Maria - So, basically, the OMGUS?
I don't get what's pro scum with the hammer comment I don't get what's pro town with it either, but I fail to see how that adds to a scum case beyond the flop on you after you attacked him.

Na I don't really understand his thinking it seems quite forced and rapid like he wants to give off the impression he's in a conflict and that's what he did in the first few posts but then it changed so randomly I just don't see how you get to this thinking the omgus has nothing to do with it if he voted anyone that way it would have ringed bells

I actually said the OMGUS had everything to do with it.
Have you ever played with Karnos before? Good logic is not his long suite - but he's not spewing utter dreck like I've seen him do as scum.

sure of it???

pretty sure.

You're volunteering for death if he flips town - I thought that was assured sure.

@first quote: Noted
@ second that's why I said pretty sure!

[MariaR]

OH BABY LETS GO

[MariaR]

Ever heard the story of the boy who tried to mislynch town and instead got dayvigged by said town?

I'll honestly hate you if this is a joke cause I'm so excited rn

[MariaR]

YASSSS

[MariaR]

Can I be clear if Sable flips scum?

Yes?

Thank you.

[MariaR]

Let's assume Transcend is scum why wouldn't he let my lynch go through as scum I think he's smart enough to think of the backfire the mason thing has and I may not have town read him for it doesn't it seem risky

[MariaR]

It was a GAMBIT???????

[MariaR]

JJD:

I don't exactly think you're scum for this but....

If you thought I was BSing my mason claim why did you vote me immediately when I retracted as opposed to when I was actually claiming mason...

STOP THE GAMBITTTT

[MariaR]

I like making filler posts what can I say.

[MariaR]

Like, Michael is using iffy logic - but he's presenting it clearly, not obfuscating, and openly is willing to debate.
That vibes town to me.
Sure, maybe not quality town I want to sheep - but I don't feel like he's trying to game stuff.

Maria did more of a fake reaction to your test than anyone did, and openly misrepped me, and when I pointed it out just ignored that she did it - which even in the kindest of world's suggests she's town who isn't reading for comprehension.

So why do you hate on Michael and love on Maria?

PEdit - opportunistic where and how? I called Maria out on being opportunistic and her best rebuttal was agreeing with me.

what did I do o-o

[MariaR]

Being the opportunistic person I am I will do anything to get my sr lynched

[MariaR]

If transcend isn't town I'm jumping out a window

[MariaR]

Why don't you trust me then when I say he's town I'm not tring him for the mason claim but for other reasons already stated

[MariaR]

I have never been more sure of a read then Transcend is town just because you dis agree with a read doesn't make the person scummy and once you guys finally understand that our play may not be what you're use to doesn't make it scummy I can't stress enough me and him have done this before and we're town I bet none of you looked at the game I linked over and over to show we've done it before he's town I'm town please just believe me

[MariaR]

Maria, if you happened to roll scum in a game where trans was town, would you try to buddy up to him and emulate how ur acting in this game?

Nope in fact the game just before this I did roll scum with trans town and I was the main person to get him lynched day 1 I'd prob do it again here.

[MariaR]

SOMEONE GET GIGA IN THIS GAME

[MariaR]

Yessss

@mod do that

Join my Mason circle of me you and the transcend slot?
Jarjar can join too

[MariaR]

I have never been more sure of a read then Transcend is town just because you dis agree with a read doesn't make the person scummy and once you guys finally understand that our play may not be what you're use to doesn't make it scummy I can't stress enough me and him have done this before and we're town I bet none of you looked at the game I linked over and over to show we've done it before he's town I'm town please just believe me

I buy into the idea of Trans' slot being town.
You - not so much.

keep your vote on me until the day you die then your reading skills need work and I've come to accept that. You're not going to be helpful to this town what so ever (This isn't an attack It's saying you're bad at reading) Just because I don't see the questions you ask and I answer them with solid proof that proves I can't be scum and yet you still push so hard because you NEED me to flip scum just to make sure you can pat your ego

[MariaR]

I read Transcend as town (to your mind good at reading)
I read you as scum (to your mind bad at reading)
I would think I'd break even, no?

You have not provided any solid proof that you can't be scum - that is laughable as a concept.
I can't do that, and I know for a fact I'm town, so don't spit in the air and tell me it's raining.
I agree that you flipping scum would boost my ego.

And you haven't given reason I'm scum
Filler posts-NAI
I've disproven your contradictions saying I'm not consistent isn't a tell when I know how to stay consistent as scum

[MariaR]

The one thing I hate about this site is if you're not giving hard facts like people flipping a role or you're not a pr anything you say is bs lol

[MariaR]

You're not going to be helpful to this town what so ever

Thor is easily one the most helpful players in this game. If you're not scum then you're one of the obstacles the town needs to overcome.

Like seriously, if ur town then u have to realize that fact that so many people are scumreading you as your own fault and how it's it's a distraction.

No it's not my fault people can't read and are upset that they can't handle a bit of out of the normal play I'm getting sr for filler posts and the fact I sr someone people tr like ????????????

[MariaR]

It's so sad that the only game town did something was in a newbie game.

[MariaR]

You know what fine I give up everyone just things everything I say is scummy I'll stop defending Transcend and I'll change my game 100% starting now is that what you people want fine you get your wish

[MariaR]

EEEEEEEEEEEEK

[MariaR]

I would pref to vote Bliz or Elyse since i can't get kar

But I will vote anyone over Giga and kraska

[MariaR]

VOTE: Elyse gotta lose some to win some

[MariaR]

Maria I hope you know that if you actually are town then I'm really disappointed

Only voting you cause I don't see any other wagon starting between and I tr giga over you sorry!

[MariaR]

Maria I hope you know that if you actually are town then I'm really disappointed

Only voting you cause I don't see any other wagon starting between and I tr giga over you sorry!

Translation: She's voting you because she's scum with giga.

Giga who refuses to finish reading the thread but has a townread on Maria.

Ohhh I can't wait to make you eat those words

[MariaR]

Obv back t back lynch bait is obv

[MariaR]

gerryoat not having any strong scum reads after like 30 pages shows shades of his scum play last game.

Nero,

can you elaborate on this more? Gerry is slowly moving into my scumpool but I don't really trust my ability to read players like him.

Maria,

is Gerry generally useless regardless of his alignment? I think in all of Gerry's ISO there was like only 1 post I found that was decent.

It could be the site but Gerry normally goes hard in other forum games he gets cocky quite easy and likes to take charge but he has said the "I hate day 1 blah" as town before idk if he's done it as scum but its' not that hard to fake

[MariaR]

Hey giga

Instead of asking other people for their thoughts on me, you should try explaining your scumread on me.

It's kind of expected when you're only scumreading one person who just so happens to be the biggest counterwagon to your lynch.

@JJD
The ascetic claim is scummy to me. Transcend didn't claim it and then giga's claim seemed more of a "just in case" claim if someone got a no result on him or something. If giga truly believes that claiming ascetic is protown, then I feel as though he would do it as either alignment. It's scummy to me only because Transcend didn't claim it.

Why do you think it's more likely to come from town?

Also the scumreads on me are awful and it's embarrassing if I actually get lynched. What are even the reasons for scumreading me? My vote on Maria was "opportunistic" when karnos' was worse? IAI's "tell" that he won't reveal? Maria deciding that I have to go even though "2 of my posts were scummy" just because I'm a counterwagon to giga?

Idk what happened but the Transcend slot is scum. Like Michel is arguing, it makes so much more sense to fakeclaim mason as scum than town.

If you can get a wagon that's not on giga going I'd support it.

[MariaR]

This is why I'm having so much conflict between you/giga in my head.

I am voting my top scumread - giga. You are not voting your top scumread. Yet you ask me to start another wagon. My strongest scumread is one of the leading wagons so no I'm not starting another one. You on the other hand have all of the reason in the world to start one and you don't.

It's actually jarring how different your play has been from the previous game. I know that's your intention but I can't tell what's genuine and what's not.

My top scumread isn't getting lynched I've tried and it's clearly not happening I could of tried harder but I gave up cause it's not happening Giga is my top tr so I will lynch anyone before them and since you're the counter wagon I have no choice *shrug*

[MariaR]

Will anyone vote Sable or Karnos? I don't think so

[MariaR]

Transcend has posted out Sables bs I pointed out karnos bs and no one is batting an eye and just calling us (now giga) scum like you can't say I haven't tried to stop this I take no blame for this and idgaf how scummy you think that is