Mini 437 - Hacker Mafia - Game Over

[Haut Boy]

Whee, I'm here~

And my Random Vote...

Vote: pancakemix

~<3

[Haut Boy]

Oh yeah, and I don't anticipate being back to check the thread until possibly 4:30-5:00 Pacific time, just so you know.

[Haut Boy]

Oh my, I'm away for a few hours and we explode to four pages~

Hm...while I was getting a scummy feeling from Net, I have to think this slip-ups were due to inexperience rather than over-eagerness because he made it seem like he could have been two different power roles (cop or doc). But since I'm guessing he's been replaced now, I'll leave that alone for the time being.

Hm...after rereading the thread up until now, I'm not getting anything from anyone else. I'm going to

unvote: pancakemix

and reread again.

[Haut Boy]

After another reading, I haven't gleaned much...as to be expected on day 1. Occult's statement that a paranoid town is a good town strikes me as a bit odd (since to me, thinking this out rationally is a better idea), but it doesn't deserve a full-blown FoS. So I'll give a

Pinky of Suspicion: Occult

.

[Haut Boy]

How is this odd? Paranoia is needed in a good town. Mafia can play around with rationality but parnoia is little harder to overcome. I'm not saying let's lynch people until we hit mafia. Just don't let anyone out of your sights.

Perhaps you mean a doubtful village ?

Definition: Paranoia is an excessive anxiety or fear concerning one's own well-being which is considered irrational and excessive

I think Rampage just stated what I was going to say earlier. Obviously, since someone is deceiving us, we have to be a bit wary. I'm inclined to believe that that's what you meant, since outright paranoia would be as you described: just lynching everyone until we hit scum. So with that in mind, I retract my PoS.

[Haut Boy]

Whee, and all that got posted while I was writing my last post~<3

[Haut Boy]

The "oh noes" reaction WhoMe? gave in response to Net's modkill strikes me the wrong way also. As DYH mentioned, it seems rather paranoid. However, I can understand reacting to an attacking post that seemed to him to be directed at him. It may have seemed rushed, but it's still somewhat understandable. Still, I have to cast my vote...

Vote: WhoMe?

[Haut Boy]

Trying to get some discussion to get going...it was good, then it slowed to a snail's pace. >.>

vote Occult

I find your first post interesting, maybe you're being cute because this is hacker themed, but maybe you were trying to use some sort of sinister role ability. Also you keep trying to drum up wagons.

Looking back at the staggeringly many 5 pages of this thread (I didn't think I'd be done reading until I was 30, it was that bad >.>), I see absolutely no evidence of Occult trying to drum up even one bandwagon. He did toss out a vote in the interest of drumming up discussion, but really, I think you're making a mountain out of a molehill.

Your use of hyperbole makes you feel scummy to me, but I'm still not entire sure that you're scum. But for now, my vote stands.

[Haut Boy]

just reread myself, just the van damien wagon, so the plural is mistaken

Even with that grammatical mistake, I still see no evidence of an actual VanDamien wagon; all Occult did was vote him in hopes of generating discussion. Just because he hasn't unvoted does not necessarily mean he is pushing for a bandwagon.

[Haut Boy]

does 3rd vote on same player on page 1 not count as a wagon nowadays?

The first two votes were random votes. Net's modkill removed his vote (which I think was moved off of VD anyway), and Nocmen has since moved his vote. Occult, though, has not pushed for VD to be lynched. I still fail to see how this constitutes drumming up a bandwagon.

[Haut Boy]

Since darkhen isn't posting I will. He's innocent and I'm innocent. We are masons.

And why are you claiming AND outing your supposed mason buddy this early in the game? It reeks of scumminess, it does. I'm still more suspiscious of WhoMe?, though.

HoS: blahgo

[Haut Boy]

Confirm Vote: WhoMe?

, then.

[Haut Boy]

-Who is looking scummiest?

I still say it's WhoMe?, though the interactions between VD, Nocmen, and Albert are making me think...

-Who is lying? Nocman or Rampage?

Still not sure...I need to go reread their posts.

-Do you see my vote on VD as Scummy

No. As I saw it, it was for discussion.

-WhoMe, scum or just slipped up?

I doubt it was a slip-up. I'll reread his stuff for good measure. But my vote still stays there.

-blahgo, your thoughts on him?

He strikes me really suspiciously, but I don't think he merits a vote at this point.

[Haut Boy]

Hm...I've got something. Pardon me if this has already been brought up; I'm not exactly fully operational at the moment.

I originally just took it as a random accusations to start the game. But here Net has gone and practially told us he is a Doctor from my best guess, and you still are going after him.

Basing your accusation on that sole argument justifies my vote for you

Unvote, vote: Nocmen

because its PAINFULLY clear that he wasn't referring to himself as doctor. This is not his first slip either, you have no reason to believe he meant that.

All fine and stuff. But then there's this one from the previous page:

no you are not alone there is someone watching over us

You mean a doctor ?

For all we know, Net could have claimed "i was addressing to God" to cover up a slip-up on his part. From that, I don't think it was "painfully clear" at all that he wasn't referring to himself as a doctor.

Going through WhoMe?'s posts again, I'm beginning to wonder if Occult's (or was it DYH's? I don't remember right now) speculation of jester tactics might be right. FOr the time being, I still want to keep my vote on him.

Still, I must

FoS: Rampage

.

[Haut Boy]

Anything I've got to say has already been stated.

unvote: WhoMe?

I'm still not trusting WhoMe?, but I think between Rampage and Nocmen, one of them is a better lynch for today. And based on what I would have said,

vote: Nocmen

. Rereading again finally outlined the false statements in my mind. However, I still have to maintain my FoS on Rampage. I get funny feelings from him, though WhoMe? is still definitely scummier.

[Haut Boy]

I'm not sure I believe the claim, but I'll still

unvote

for now.

FoS: Nocmen

, and all outstanding FoSes remain.

[Haut Boy]

Hey boy, how credible do you think is this statement ?

While I think net's PM to Nocmen certainly is plausible, I have doubts about whether someone's role would be passed onto someone else once modkilled. Now, I don't know if that's a common practice on MafiaScum or anywhere, but it still seems odd to me that that would happen. Still, in case he is actually not lying, then I don't want to end up lynching him.

Basically, I don't think it's terribly credible, but the fact that I still want to believe it means that I see at least some credibility in it.

[Haut Boy]

Vote: WhoMe?

Given all that we know, I still think WhoMe? is the best D1 lynch we have right now. (I still have my gut feeling about him, yes.) I don't really believe his vanilla claim, especially since he started to claim with 3 votes on him.

Also...

does 3rd vote on same player on page 1 not count as a wagon nowadays?

The first two votes were random votes. Net's modkill removed his vote (which I think was moved off of VD anyway), and Nocmen has since moved his vote. Occult, though, has not pushed for VD to be lynched. I still fail to see how this constitutes drumming up a bandwagon.

The "drumming up bandwagon(s)" accusation back then still really gets my hackles up.

[Haut Boy]

Oh also, I'm going to be out of town until 5:00 Pacific time on Monday~♥

[Haut Boy]

Hm, after night, this is what I think:

-I believe Jordan's mason claim (made by blahgo).
-I still have small doubts about Nocmen's claim, but I am willing to go with it for the time being.
-Something about Rampage rubs me the wrong way still. I am rereading Cycle 1 right now to glean some more information, though.

FoS: Rampage

I know pancakemix has a prod request out right now, but I still feel the need to give him a pressure vote for if he picks up the prod. If he is replaced, I will remove the vote.

Vote: pancakemix

Also,

Here's the situation- we have eight people left, and two killing groups it seems. We're in a situation where if we mislynch, we're going to require assistance from the presumed SK in order to win. Not an ideal situation by any stretch of the imagination.

Could you possibly elaborate on this, DYH? (Specifically, the statement regarding the SK.)

[Haut Boy]

Unvote: pancakemix

And happy birthday, yellowbounder~♥

[Haut Boy]

Night kill immunity has been awarded to JordanA24 and Haut Boy.

Although, seriously, discussion is slowing. Deadlines may be considered.

*falls out of chair* XD

And after my reread, my

vote

is cast for

Albert B. Rampage

. In particular, I am not liking the way he interacted with VanDamien.

[Haut Boy]

I'd just like to mention that he stopped suspecting me at the end.

Sorry about double post, but I also think that Occult has some sort of jester role.

What makes you think that?

Also, reviewing my thoughts on Albert, well, it's become clear that Albert plays in a fashion that reads scummy to me, but other than style, I'm not convinced enought that he'd be a decent D1 lynch, that is without more information to compare his responses to someone confirmed.

So,

unvote

.

Anyone want to come forward and announce their scumminess to the world before the deadline hits?

I'm aware of that; however, VanDamien is VanDamien, and I am me. Though he seemed to drop his suspicions (at least for the time being), I still find that I can't let go of mine. I will be reading again because I am not satisfied with what I gleaned, but I am happy with my vote at this time.

[Haut Boy]

Maybe deep down he did or did not stop suspecting me, but VanDamien admitted that his case was not grounded in enough facts to warrant a lynch, or even a vote for that matter.

At that time, it didn't.

Another reread is convincing me that my vote is in the right place

I don't have time to lay out my reasoning right now, since I need to go run errands, but when I get back, I will be saying something.

Mata, ne

~<3

[Haut Boy]

Daaaaaamn...I got held up with other stuff, and I come back now only to find that in more than 24 hours, nobody's posted at all? (Maybe it's a usual occurrence, but I was hoping I'd have something else to which I could respond...)

Post 17 (game thread, mind, not his 17th post): After looking at it again, he didn't ask if Net was the cop; he asked if he WASN'T. Not that that changes much, though, because that still feels really fishy...roleguessing on the first page. (Though the fact that cop is a relatively common role makes it slightly less suspiscious...)

Posts 61 and 62: Reexamination on my part reveals not power role hunting, but more of a roleguessing spirit. See my feelings about 17. However, the posting of the Wiki entry on Net a mere minute later still doesn't sit well with me. Smells like attention diverson.

Post 69 - Rampage's comment about laying low struck me as odd. Also,

3. I think that voting for me, while not an unreasonable action given the circumstances, is a mistake. I firmly believe I will be useful if I stay connected to the server.

That's a pretty scummy assertion. And a funny one to make when Nocmen and Net were the only ones voting for you. If you wanna claim, then claim; if you don't, then don't mention your role.

Post 88 - Now that I look at it, just going by Net's "someone watching over us" post didn't really make it seem like he was referring to himself as a doc, though it wasn't exactly "PAINFULLY clear." Also, I believe the possibility of him being doc wouldn't have been brought up if Rampage didn't roleguess right there.

Post 99 - The vote bargaining is EXTREMELY odd. I don't know whether I attribute this to town or scum, though, so I'll leave this point alone...for now.

Posts 135-137: Roleguessing again. The question posed to VanDamien: I feel it was a reasonable one at first, and that VanDamien gave a reasonable (albeit intriguing) answer. However, Rampage pushed for a simpler answer than the one given (false dilemma/excluded middle, anyone?)...post 143 does not allay any bad vibes from these posts.

I didn't catch much noteworthy in the arguments between VD, Rampage, and Nocmen that hasn't already been brought up. But the roleguessing, the bits of craplogic, and the vague hinting at his role are making me keep my vote on Rampage.

Notes I gathered on other players:

Nocmen: It appears to me that Nocmen is the one that actually started the rolehunt (post 66). My faith in his current doc claim is down a bit.

TonyMontana: He seems to be posting sparsely and cotributing little.

FoS: TonyMontana

I'd like to see what you think of everyone else so far.

DYH: It's been a few days now; could you please answer my question?

[Haut Boy]

Rampage: You are slightly less suspicious in my eyes, but I'm not ready to move my vote yet.

TonyMontana: You've increased my suspicion of you, but I will not make a decision about voting you or not until I've seen what you've got.

Everyone else: For the love of your mothers, please post!!!

[Haut Boy]

...don't even ask me how that doublepost happened, but that list was supposed to be in there in the first place.

[Haut Boy]

Oh snap, a lot's happened...o_0

Unvote

while I go back over all this again. I'm pretty darn confused right now, yes...

[Haut Boy]

Well, I think I've got it all sorted out now.

I

REALLY

don't like Albert's SK claim...to me, this suggests that he's a townie (not too likely), he actually IS the SK, or he's Mafia. I'm really not thinking his claim is true. But given our position right now, I am in agreement with Jordan that he shouldn't be lynched today.

On the other hand, I haven't been able to follow TM's arguments easily. I find it a bit odd that he only started to make good arguments after we threw major suspiscion onto him, also. And what with his avoiding my question to him, which he still hasn't answered! (I don't expect an answer to it now, though, since we've moved into heavy discussion. But still.) I feel really confident in hammering right now.

Vote: TonyMontana

[Haut Boy]

Oh dear, I'm at lynch-1 already~<3 Well, I guess it's claiming time, but that comes after I comment on a couple points against me.

On the other hand HB could be mafia. He's been fairly quiet and non-comital. It's possible that he's been watching and making his moves cleverly enough to pin the blame on the most obvious person while seemingly staying in the back seat.

Quiet, possibly. However, I remember at least twice where I went and actively tried to stir discussion when it was slowing down badly.

I think either Nocmen or Sil is scum, with HB 100% scum. He was the one who hammered his partner TM, when he knew that he had lost him. Reading it back, it feels like "sigh...alright, I have to do this or I will look scummy later".

From yesterday, I hadn't liked his sparse "contributions" and his failure to ever really get back to what I asked him. And his arguments in his defense put him out as scum to me, and really, you hammer those who are scummy. I can tell you now, I am not his scumbuddy...I think YOU are.

I'm a oneshot tracker, and I followed Albert last night. He wasn't doing virus-type activities (as we can deduce from the deathscenes, virus infection is the "cause of death", I'd like to remind you); he was hacking. I know you'll want a role name, so here 'tis.

bud.bonzi/Spyware/Tracker

Vote: Albert B. Rampage

is Mafia, and he must be lynched!

[Haut Boy]

That's

bud.bonzi/

Spyware/Tracker

, mind you.

[Haut Boy]

Oops, I missed Nocmen's unvote of me. Well, my claim and my info still stand.

[Haut Boy]

...Why would spyware be on the same side as the users? I'm not buying this...

I'm not one to question the mod's setup. But if you think about it, you can install spyware onto a specific person's computer to track their activity. It's not just stuff that comes with downloads in e-mail or on the internet.

[Haut Boy]

Nice try, but I call bogus.

Everyone, please vote Haut Boy immediately. We kill Haut Boy and follow Jordan's plan. GG everyone.

Heh, you have a good eye for fake claims. Especially your own!

So yeah, I didn't think the tracker claim would last long. But I can still give you convincing evidence that Albert is freaking Mafia. How's this, you all say?

I

am the SK,

NOT

Albert!

I killed VanDamien because he was giving me the scummiest vibes from D1 besides WhoMe?, and I killed Occult last night because I believed he might be scum. I haven't killed Nocmen in the case that he actually is the doctor, though I really think now that I should have killed him last night.

FoS: Nocmen

I didn't kill Albert because I was rather hoping that it wouldn't come to a 2-1-2 like this (and of course, it did). And I've left Jordan and DYH alone because I felt they were both innocent and my interest was more for getting rid of Mafia, which I managed to help the town accomplish by hammering TonyMontana.

I urge you all to lynch Albert; he is

NOT

the SK, and I am fully convinced he is leading you all around! I may have just lost the game for myself, but I am fully willing to help the town to win. But if you leave Albert alive, there is no hope of this happening.

[Haut Boy]

Pardon my BBCode messup in my last post.

And I forgot something, too.

Albert,

what possessed you to claim SK?

[Haut Boy]

I haven't killed Nocmen in the case that he actually is the doctor, though I really think now that I should have killed him last night.

To clarify my FoS, it is because he has claimed doc and yet still has not turned up dead by Mafia count. I partly didn't kill him in case he was doc, and partly because I was worried about a cross-hit.

[Haut Boy]

Look at this blatant and in-a-hurry lie. How would it not be 2-1-2 ? What did he expect, that the mafia kill HIM ?!? Certainly not. Then what ? Everybody knows that if Nocmen was doctor, he would protect Jordan. Nocmen can tell you how good I am at guessing his protection

Perhaps I have my numbers jumbled, but if I HAD killed you, there would be 1-1-2, and not 2-1-2. Since, y'know, you're Mafia.

Please make a re-read guys. I have solid evidence for killing VanDamien. His reason for killing VanDamien is completely fabricated. I killed VanDamien because he went hard after me, and I was scared he would continue going after me the next day. I thought I was safe to kill him since he had retracted some(according to my presentation of his posts to the town; Jordan quickly proved my real intentions and saw through the bluff, as he is witness) of his suspicions against me. My kill on Occult was pretty much random, I thought there was a 50-50 chance of him being mafia, but knew it wouldn't make a difference. I would actually preffered to have hit a town, ANYWAY.

Okay. Between you, VD, and Nocmen, you ALL looked pretty scummy on day 1. But under WhoMe?, VanDamien looked scummiest to me. I dunno about you, but the retractions themself seemed scummy in addition to everything else. Which is, of course, why I killed him.

Also, please look at the way Haut Boy says his interest is of getting rid of mafia. How can that be true, if according to his claim, he did NOT kill the claimed SK ?? If he was the SK, he would know 100% that I am mafia, and proceed to NK me that night. The fact that he DIDN'T do so, shows that the interest of the town was the FURTHEST thing from his mind. Just think of it. If his priority was to kill mafia, and he was SK, why didn't he kill the mafia ??? That's why his claim makes NO SENSE.

Okay, admittedly I did leave you alive in hopes of still being able to win. But I think what I've got on you is still more damning. Consider that YOU are the liar, yes~<3

Yes, he was worried that the real SK, me, would cross-hit. Again, witness how far his interest is for the town. He wants to kill the most town possible. He contradicted himself, LAL.

MAFIA CROSS-HIT, NOT SK CROSS-HIT! If this isn't twisting my words, I don't know WHAT is! Just because I don't specifically state who I'm worried will cross-hit does NOT say ANYTHING.

You want a name? I can give you that. It's W32.Beglae.ZXYZ/Virus/SK.

ALBERT IS THE ONE WHO IS LYING!!!

Confirm Vote: Albert B. Rampage

Die, filthy Mafioso!

[Haut Boy]

Yes. That is what I meant; if I targeted him and the Mafia also did so.

[Haut Boy]

Okay. At this point, I am not going to win this game. I honestly do not care if you all lynch me, becaue in the end it is better for the town if I do not stay alive anyway.

HOWEVER.

If and when you lynch me, and I turn up SK (because I WILL), you are going to wish you hadn't.

But just to clarify what I've said.

Haut, if you really are the SK, why are you going after Albert, when its impossible to prove to the others who is who? It leaves Silm open, and he would have to be the second scum.

I'm going after him because he's the only one that I'm absolutely sure is Mafia. I'm certain that Jordan is a mason like he says he is. I really don't believe your doc claim, but I still don't have anything definiteive to go off of. Silm/pancakemix hasn't said much this game, so I don't have anything to go off of from there, either. Frankly, I'm leaning more toward you as ABR's scumbuddy, but I can see still that Silm could be the other one.

Also, Haut Boy, if you really were the SK and Albert had false claimed SK, wouldn't that guarantee him as scum? Why did you not kill him the last night if that was what happened?

I didn't kill him last night in the vague hope that I might not be suspected as SK; I was not anticipating that I would come under any major suspiscion today, especially since I have not raised anyone's hackles for the past two days (at least that anyone's said).

[Haut Boy]

Before I leave for the night as well, I pose a question to you both. Why do you insist on going after each other instead of going after the person who is almost guaranteed to be scum? One of you would have to have it as your scum partner, and the other would be the SK. Tell me why the SK would not want to take out someone who is guaranteed scum at the moment?

Because ABR is the fucking liar. And like I said above, I'm on a split between you and Silm, and I'm leaning more toward you. ABR is the only one I'm certain of.

[Haut Boy]

Okay, since this isn't going to anywhere, let's

Vote: Silmiriel

and end today, since most everyone thinks Sil has to be scum. We'll see what happens tonight, then.

Oh, and no matter whether I'm right or wrong, good game, everyone. It's been fun~<3

[Haut Boy]

My gosh.....I wasn't actually expecitng to WIN! =D This was my first time--ever--as an SK, and I'm really new to online Mafia, too!

Great game, everyone! This has been a LOT of fun, and I hope to be able to play with you all again at some point or another, or mod a game with some of you in it. And of course, special thanks to YB for modding this game. =)

[Haut Boy]

Yeah, good job Haut Boy - and thanks for killing me :/.

Makes me wish I had stuck to my guns day 1. Albert's uberscummy play in another game were in was making me think it's just his playstyle, and I knew I could investigate him that night. I got the result, and planned on claiming first post Day 2, only to find out I was dead.

Honestly, I don't remember why I killed you at this point--but I was pretty surprised when I found out I nailed the cop. XD

[Haut Boy]

I don't understand why Haut didn't kill me N2 tough.

I didn't want to do what everyone expected the real SK would do to a fake SK. Before you fakeclaimed, though, I did consider infecting you that night.

[Haut Boy]

It was a really terrible move. You couldve gotten lynched, gotten NK'd by me last night, etc.

Yeah, in hindsight I realize that now. Of course, it seemed logical then.

But yeah, massive kudos to you for claiming SK. I wouldn't have ever thought of doing that if I were Mafia.

[Haut Boy]

Oh, definitely /in for the next one. =D