Mini 1044: Lie to Me Mafia - Game Over

[ZeroFang]

/confirm

[ZeroFang]

Happy Scum Day Stef

[ZeroFang]

Timezone:

Central US

Experience:

Two completed games on this site, two replaced ins, four ongoing, and five games off site.

Playstyle in a nutshell:

Well there's not a lot of room in a nutshell. I'd probably try to break out :p
I don't know how to describe my playstyle. I generally try to be as goofy as possible while still maintaining a serious attitude towards scum hunting.

Are you familiar with the theme?

No.

Fave Alignment or Role:

I enjoy every role for its individual perks and purpose in the game, even vanilla townie.

[ZeroFang]

I noticed how Taz was the only one brave enough to say that his favorite alignment was scum. I also noticed how Tasky put his preference in all caps.

Vote: Tasky

because his emphasis on preferring town is scummy. If you prefer town, you should just say it. Highlighting it like that looks like you're trying to score town points.

It's the beginning of the game, vote is highly subject to change, etc. etc.

[ZeroFang]

(1) What are your rules for defining RVS?

RVS is before we have any real information. The moment someone votes for a reason (even a weak one) is the moment RVS ends.

(2) What do you call the stage after RVS?

Dawn.

(3) What are your rules that define the next Stage?

People will vote for weak reasons, but it is the motive and thought behind them (as well as how good their cases are) that determine whether or not they are scum.

(4) How many times have you played mafia alignment?

In nine total completed games on and off site (including replace ins), I've been vanilla townie every single time.

(5) What makes it less favorable to you than playing town alignment?

See question (4)

[ZeroFang]

jimfinn, for the love of god, make your avatar regular size. It bothers the f*** out of me.



Espeonage, you too.



I apologize for my OCD.

[ZeroFang]

Photoshop

[ZeroFang]

Why am I a plagiarizer?

[offtopic]

lol you can use the one I made you or...

Paint.net or Gimp

They're basically the same thing as photoshop, just a little less professional.

Alternatively, you can use regular paint and stretch/skew/cut the image until it's 100x100, but it looks like crap and takes a long time.

[/offtopic]

[ZeroFang]

Why am I a plagiarizer?

Using bold, blue text inside the quote box.

FFFFUUUUUUU ok fine I'll use italic red.

@jimfinn it's not RVS anymore and obviously you didn't read the thread because there's been several scumtells thus far and like four people have already voted Tasky.

[ZeroFang]

Zerofang, what IS a vanilla townie's purpose in the game, other than to find scum?

To not get lynched, to dilute/filter out scum logic, and to be such a threat to the mafia that you get NKed in place of a PR. Getting lynched as town is a failure of you to help the town, or a failure of the town to listen to reason.

How could you enjoy playing roles you haven't played before?

(1) I can't, and (2) I decided a long time ago that every role has its place and I'll be happy with whatever I'm given.

Why did you decide to answer those random questions?

At that point in the game there was little information to work with. I chose to answer them to increase the overall amount of information available to us.

Name the scumtells you saw in post #8.

There were none. #8 was a confirmation post with nothing else in it.

Who is scum, other than Tasky? Who is town?

Shepherd has made several cases and switched his vote around a bit, but he's also the only one really posting well made cases this early in the game. Besides Tasky, he's the only one that stands out to me.

[ZeroFang]

Tunneling me HARDCORE is a pretty good reason for me to keep my vote on you.

LOL are you kidding me? Maybe recently, but he's made a lot of different cases. You just happen to be his latest.

[ZeroFang]

ZERO FANG needs to be replaced. He has not posted in 5 DAYS.

Or prodded. Or I could suddenly get very, very active since my schedule freed up. I had no idea I let this game go this long. There are so many things I need to address it's not even funny.

[ZeroFang]

Nachomamma8, shoot Taz. do it.

This isn't helping me not think you're scum, just for the record.

[ZeroFang]

Antihero's basically been making weak cases and expecting votes for the entirety of the game. He hasn't done that much scum hunting, and his contributions are quite hard to fine without an ISO.

CMAR is basically lurking like I was. When he came back, he did a couple ISOs, and didn't comment on any of them except to state his read. Then he voted me without explanation.

Espeonage hasn't done anything in two pages of posts, and he hasn't posted in ~3 days.

jimfinn's been lurking up a storm.

Maddie posted twice. First to confirm, than to promise a post.

Nacho claimed one shot day kill, and then asked a bunch of individual questions. While they stimulated some conversation, he hasn't done much else.

Ghostrider never posted, and his replacement, Narsis, has done nothing.

Robbnva's helped with the Taz case. That's pretty much it.

SoW has three pages packed with content. It's unfortunate that he's nearly the only player with substantial enough content to really comment on, which I will definetely do in a post following this one. I don't believe his case for Taz is all that strong, though he's certainly contributed to the thread.

Tasky. My first vote on him was very weak, intended both to get reactions and to investigate the first semi-scummy action in the game. His ISO #11 was absolutely dreadful. He suggested we day kill a player who at the time (and even now) hadn't done much, and then tried to absolve himself of any responsibility. He's my first scum pick.

Taz has made frequent use of bad logic, and has tried to get the largest contributer in this thread lynched for suspecting him. I've been in one game with him before. He acted sort of like this, and he flipped scum. He's my second scum pick currently.

I myself don't have any useful content thus far (except maybe this post).

TL;DR and conclusions: Scumhunting in this game is very difficult due to the number of lurkers and people not contributing. Essentially, we have three people who've even done anything to influence the game. Two are scummy, one's a mafia veteran. I'm guilty of this too, but really, more contributions would be nice. We can't go on forever tunneling the 2 out of 3 people who are actually playing the game.

[ZeroFang]

I am aligned with the town.

[ZeroFang]

1) are you lying when you claim town?

No. Considering the scum lied once I'm not sure asking us again is of any use. You can't get much more clear than "I am aligned with the town".

2) Do you know who is lying?

Nope.

3) Do you know who is telling the truth?

No. I really hope that wasn't rolefishing.

4) Why did you claim town alignment?

You told us to.

5) Are you just following suite to claim as "town" because tasky told you to claim as town, and you did for the sole purpose of fulfilling his request?

At your and his request, yes. Claiming like this effectively turns it into one of those boring "follow the cop" games where barely any scumhunting is involved and we all vote to lynch whoever investigated as scum. I

hate

those games, so yes. I did it solely for the purpose of fulfilling your/Tasky's request.

6) Who are your confirmed townies, and WHY?

Are you asking for town reads (which you previously stated as useless)? This isn't an open game. It's nigh impossible confirm yourself 100% as town.

[ZeroFang]

His ISO #11 was absolutely dreadful.

ok... now you tell me what's so dreadful about that post.

You suggested we hang the vig tomorrow if he doesn't use his kill now. You also suggested he use it right now, without hesitation. You suggested he kill a different person than the last time you mentioned it, so now you're contradicting yourself as well. You don't care who he shoots as long as it's someone. That's scummy. Your reason for shooting Robb was that he was scummy, no explanation. That's also highly scummy.

then you tell me how suggesting a vig kill is scummy.

You're suggesting it for many different people and suggesting using it immediately. Townies would want to wait to get more information.

and then you tell me where I "tried to absolve [myself] of any responsibility".

Are you willing to be the lynch for today if he flips town?

no, why should I?

[ZeroFang]

But, one thing I was not expecting is that Cal Lightman would be Vanilla. I thought he would be the "Lie Detector" role. So, I am confused by that.

Nowdays in themes we assign random names to roles to prevent mod WIFOM/claiming bullshit.

I do not believe anything Espeonage says at this point. He has not merited anyone trust.

I believe he just claimed something.

[ZeroFang]

The content level of Zero's last post = 0;

Is there an unwritten rule that all posts must have at least X amount of content to qualify? If so, I wasn't aware of it. Notice how I commented on the small post with quick answers rather than the large post that requires time to answer. I don't have time right this second to answer a wall post. If I answered it right now, I'd be answering based on skimming and my answers wouldn't be as clearly thought out as I would like them to be. Your frustration is warranted. Your misplaced aggression is not.

[ZeroFang]

VOTE: jimfinn for reasons listed below

I wouldn't say anything so far is truly all that scummy (since it's still pretty much RVS/RQS), but I'm going to RVS VOTE: Tasky

This is the 5th vote on the Tasky wagon, and it's already page 4; yet, jim calls this vote an "RVS" vote. Scumfail

He doesn't seem like he's paying attention here. Normally this could be dismissed as a quick random vote without any context, but if we go on...

There are several Tasky votes, yes. What scumtells there are are minor at best, nothing too serious IMO. Wagon reactions are more likely to create scumtells that I pick up on than RQS answers and related discussion.
---
That is to say, disagreements over the meanings of terms such as rolefishing and the odd capitalization of TOWN do not seem (at least to me) to be anything significant, and no serious reason for voting is brought to my attention, though I am very curious to see how the wagon plays out. Wagon players up and down and see how they react - that's how you catch scum.

This makes it very clear he knew

exactly

what was going on, and he voted Tasky anyway. That's a pretty blatant scum tell.

The argument between SoW and

Trinidad and Tobago

Tasky and Tazaro makes me think that at least one of the three is scum, but I'm waiting for more exchange of rhetoric before I feel confident as to which of them.

Please tell me that everyone sees the fencesit in this post.

I do see it, but I don't think it's as strong or scummy as you make it out to be. You've already shown us why jimfinn is scum. Now you're just reaching.

I agree with Nacho's plan.
unvote; VOTE: Tazaro

This is obvious piggybacking to just get a lynch.

Bolding mine. This is heavily reinforced by Taz's flip.

no kill last night...interesting.

Well, that sucks. More scumpoints for Narsis.

I'm sorry, I don't quite understand. Care to explain?

@everyone: thoughts on the Tazaro flip?

Not falling for that one

That was a perfectly legitimate question which you acknowledged and dismissed.

why switch your playstyle? cause you mistakingly caught town?

No, because it's a protown thing to do.

Than why weren't you doing it before?

[ZeroFang]

This is a reference to Tarhalindur's standard tell. From the wiki:

The "Well, That Sucks" Tell

I wanted to say "Dammit, dammit, dammit, dammit, DAMMIT!". I'm curious what you would have thought of me.

That was a perfectly legitimate question which you acknowledged and dismissed.

Yes, I did dismiss it. Because it wasn't going to get us anywhere.

Than you could have answered it, correct?

Than why weren't you doing it before?

Why wasn't I doing what before?

Playing pro-town.

---

SoW: your post at the top of this page in particular is the one that pings my scumdar. Jim's suddenly becoming one of your suspects - convenient, considering that Antihero, ZeroFang and myself all now want a Jimfinn lynch

I also noticed how he put it "If Tasky is scum, jimfinn probably is too".

Zerofang is starting to redeem himself today.

I was until I stopped posting. Please don't give me more credit than is due.


I have a lot to say about the main cases, but I'm going to comment when I'm not in a hurry to get ready for school.

[ZeroFang]

so I voted him for it. it was, indeed, a weak vote, but it was the best I had at that moment. now, luckily enough, you have revealed yourself as much scummier than Robbnva, so I dropped that "case" (if you want to call it a case).

He admits he had a weak case on Robbnva. And insists that he was lucky enough to find me. And, he "dropped" his case.

He was really strongly pushing a case, saw it fail, and then switched to the guy who was gunning for him yesterday. We are in agreement here.

[Tasky] really demands Nachomamma shoots and kills. Funny thing, he would not vote for Tazaro, but he would call on someone to kill him. And, then later it was entirely against his principles to vote for Tazaro.

Thus absolving him of any responsibility if Taz flipped town. We covered this yesterday. I still find it scummy.

So, why did [Tasky] not demand I get vigged? I was his top suspect. Why did he not want Robbnva vigged? He was second on the list. And, earlier he wanted him vigged for being scummy. But, why switch to Tazaro? He did not even care, UNTIL THIS TIME, that Tazaro was scummy. Yet, later it was still against all his principles to vote him. All the sudden, "it would be a shame to miss the opportunity to vig Taz." If he DID NOT see him as scum, and he DID see him as town, why would it be a shame to let him live day one? Really, this is an easy kill without the responsibility of having to vote a TOWNIE.

Again, I said the same thing yesterday...

More proof positive that he tried to get someone he didn't even care about vigged so he wouldn't have to take responsibility for his actions. I think we get it by now.

Below are the real fears of tasky.

you just want to throw dirt on me.

Earlier he accused me of the same thing. He really is worried about being show in any bad light.

you are definitely NOT trying to find out my alignment, you are trying to prove I am scum and discredit me.

as soon as you flip scum, I'll definitely keep my eye on ZeroFang... IGMEOY

Robbnva, you need to be todays lynch.
UNVOTE: VOTE: Robbnva

He calls for Robbnva to be Day 1 lynch. Robb was not even close to being lynched. Tazaro was. Why not ask Nachomamma to vig kill him?

I would like to add that we nearly suffered from a no-lynch yesterday, and while discussing the vig kills he wanted Taz to be the kill (who had all the votes), and not Robb (who Tasky thought suspicious enough to push for a lynch). In other words, he wanted us to vig the one with all the votes and escape a vote count, while simultaneously "looking town" by pushing a lynch when he

knew

that lynch wouldn't happen.

damn
this goes against all my principles, but a Taz lynch is definitely better than a no lynch.
UNVOTE: VOTE: Tazaro

Here is the post where it has always been against ALL his PRINCIPLES to VOTE for Tazaro. But, he was willing to have him be an easy, no responsibility, vig kill.

SoW, I think you missed the scummy point here, or at least failed to express it properly. He was hesitant to vote Taz as if he knew he would flip town, and that'd look bad, but at the same time he voted him anyway and distanced himself with "this goes against all my principles". Reinforcing a point is nice, but belaboring the same point eight different times in the same post is a bit much, especially if you're missing the worst scum tells by reinforcing your first point instead.

Nacho is town.

I believe ya

I do not like how easily he accepted that Nacho was town. He was adamant that he would push for a Nacho lynch. Yet he hands down accepts this town claim.

I do hope you understand that Espeonage is practically a claimed lie detector now. Accepting that isn't a scum tell.

Tasky, why was it against all your principles to vote for Tazaro? Did you really have inside knowledge that he was VI and not scum? He was the scummiest player by far. And, he really buddied up to you. I wonder what convinced you he was not scum. Please do tell.

I was never convinced he wasn't scum. the thing is, I know him (a little) and know his play style. and I know that he behaves that way when he is town (I never played with him when he was scum), so I thought lynching him was the wrong play. but on the other side I am aware that he has to die sooner or later since I really can't get a read on him, that's why I wanted him vigged. since we wouldn't have lynched anyone else that day, a Taz lynch was probably better than a no-lynch, especially since there was, after all, a possibility of him being scum.

He thought lynching TAZARO was the wrong play, but not calling for him to be VIGGED. Denying responsibility. He wanted him vigged early on DAY 1. Why? cause he can read him. Not because he was scummy. That is brilliant for town.

Lynch the UNREADABLE before the SCUMMY.

That's true, but again, you missed the big scum tell here. He believed from meta Taz was town and

called for vigging him anyway

. I agree with the philosophy of vigging the unreadable. That isn't a scum tell, that's a meta/philosophy tell, and arguing about that gets into a discussion about how generally to use your vig kills. The scum tell is that he wanted

town

to be vigged. I'm really very surprised everyone missed that. He blatantly distanced himself from Taz, called him town, and then called for his vig. This is why he's scummy. It's not because he has (in your opinion) bad vig philosophies. That's a ridiculous argument.

---

After doing an ISO of myself, I found I'm having a hard time keeping this game straight from another ongoing game that has Tasky in it. I believed I had been contributing a significant amount more than I had.

If I'm not mistaken, I have a bit to comment on the jimfinn case, and a huge amount to comment on the Narsis case. I'll be handling those in separate posts for overall convenience. If I have time tonight, I'm going to study ISOs. If I find anything excessively scummy, I'll have a new case to make.

[ZeroFang]

This is a reference to Tarhalindur's standard tell. From the wiki:

The "Well, That Sucks" Tell

I wanted to say "Dammit, dammit, dammit, dammit, DAMMIT!". I'm curious what you would have thought of me.

so you don't think the "Well, that sucks"-tell is a scum tell?
Why would you say "Dammit"? Wasn't the night favorable to us?

viewtopic.php?p=2535862#p2535862

I don't think any tell that relies on night reactions is a reliable one.

WHERE DID I SAY TAZARO IS TOWN?

Right here.

the thing is, I know him (a little) and know his play style. and I know that he behaves that way when he is town (I never played with him when he was scum), so I thought lynching him was the wrong play.

[Tasky] was really strongly pushing a case, saw it fail, and then switched to the guy who was gunning for him yesterday. We are in agreement here.

huh? what the hell are talking about?

Read it again.

so, Zero, tell me: DO YOU THINK I AM SCUM, YES OR NO?

Yes. I said this yesterday. It's really nothing new, and the case on you only strengthens/confirms my suspicions.

you are pushing a case against me, yet you don't vote me.

I'm voting jimfinn, who I also believe to be scum. We have a week, and nobody else seems to care about the case on you. I'd rather get a guaranteed lynch on an scummy player than a possible lynch on a scummy player.

you just called SoW out on some ridiculous arguments, do you think he is scum because of it?

No. I don't think he made those arguments maliciously. However, I will keep those in mind when you flip.

[ZeroFang]

lol. game mix for the win.

/facepalm

I NEVER SAID THAT I THOUGH HIM TO BE TOWN.

No, I guess you didn't. You only said you

believed

him to be town based on meta.

is your "really strongly pushing a case" referred to my first Robbnva-case? if yes, we really have different opinions about what "strongly pushing a case" means.

Ok, I don't know about first and second cases on people, but I do know that you insisted Robb was scum and than said your case on him was weak. This makes no sense from a townie perspective.

you just called SoW out on some ridiculous arguments, do you think he is scum because of it?

No. I don't think he made those arguments maliciously. However,

I will keep those in mind when you flip

.

right, because you already know I will flip town, right?

No, it's because I don't believe any lynch should be empty.

[ZeroFang]

Why is it better to lynch jimfinn over Narsis?

jimfinn's made some scumtells, Narsis has just lurked/not helped.

Why do you want to keep Narsis around?

That question makes the assumption I want to keep Narsis around. I don't.

Why do you want to keep jimfinn around?

That question makes the assumption I want to keep jimfinn around. I don't.

[ZeroFang]

SoW: this post is really scummy. totally scummy. awfully scummy.

Your hair is really green. Totally green. Awfully green.

Saying it doesn't make it so. If you think it's scummy, explain yourself.

I WANTED TAZARO VIGGED, NOT LYNCHED. THERE IS A HUGE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO THINGS.

Yes, but it's you who doesn't seem to understand this.

If I'd wanted a Tazaro mislynch I would have just voted him.

Nice scumslip.

Lynch me if you want. It will not help town win.

whining already? WHY ARE YOU TALKING TO ME LIKE I AM TOWN? weren't you suspicious of me just a moment ago?
you know you failed with discrediting me, so now you try to buddy up to me. LOL.
NOBODY EVER TALKED ABOUT LYNCHING YOU.

Wrong, wrong, and so very wrong. First of all, he's not whining, he's martyring. There's a difference. Second, we can't go around assuming people are scum all the time. We have to assume they're town to get anything accomplished. Just take everyone's cases with a grain of salt and a pinch of logic and you'll be fine. Thirdly,

you've been talking about lynching him this entire game.

Don't give me any of that "NOBODY EVER TALKED ABOUT LYNCHING YOU" crap when you're the main one on his case, trying as hard as you can to get him lynched.

Scumteam:
Robbnva (85%)
SoW (90%)
ZeroFang (60% if Robbnva flips scum, 50% otherwise)

I'm noticing here that your scumteam consists of a lurker and the two people who suspect you the most. If this is an attempt to save your hide, it's really failing. It's pretty blatant. A noob could see through it.

The people making cases aren't scummy because they made the cases. You're scummy, and the result is people making cases on you. I say that to you, and to everyone here to expose your survivalist mentality. Your main reason for believing SoW is scum is that he thinks you're scum. Not only is that terrible logic, but it's scummy, survivalist, and quite anti-town.

the only reason I prefer lynching Robbnva over SoW right now is that SoW posts a lot. If we let him live today, he HAS to keep up his posting if he doesn't want to give up and will therefore give us much more information than Robbnva

Than why didn't you suggest vigging Robbnva and lynching SoW. If that truly is your philosophy, you're not very consistent with it.

Lynch me if you want. It will not help town win. In fact, it will help town loose. It would be a waste of towns effort to lynch me.

Martyrs are anti-town.

[ZeroFang]

Does anyone else see Narsis' blatant fence sitting in that last post?

[ZeroFang]

VOTE: Tasky

Since my vote is now on a dead guy. I've explained my thoughts on him thus far sufficiently, yes?

[ZeroFang]

We could just have him be the lynch for the day and resume the game at night 2.

[ZeroFang]

I believed you.
Then I remembered that Stef was handing out fakeclaims to town and scum alike.
Now I remember that Scum knows there is a doc and wouldn't claim to be one.

AHHHHHH My head is asploding.
UNVOTE: jim I think we have two docs.

Ok, why would we have two doctors? I know it's a hidden setup, but its flavor strongly suggests there are going to be several lie detector roles, or at least a custom role or two. One doctor is a little surprising in a mini flavored like this, two doctors is nigh impossible (especially when you consider the setup was reviewed by Zorblag, a long-standing member of the community who probably knows a lot about balance).

[ZeroFang]

VOTE: jimfinn

[ZeroFang]

Narsis, I was about to not get lynched. What are you doing?

And, how does that convince you that Narsis is town? What was so persuasive about that?

It appears as if jimfinn tried to buddy Narsis, or at least throw a WIFOM in there. Your response is either planned as scum or you played into their hands.

I'll have more to talk about that in a minute.

ZeroFang is the first person I've seen to chainsaw defend someone and bus him at the same time.

I'm curious as to why you think that, especially when the two contradict each other. An explanation would be great.

At least either I am great at choosing my targets or scum are scared of me confirming townies so much they aren't killing which is a good thing for us.

There are a lot of possibilities. The scum could have been role-blocked the first day and you protected successfully the second, or one of the days the scum could have forgotten to send in a kill and then got roleblocked, or any number of things. I believe your claim, but we don't know if you got lucky or something else happened.

[ZeroFang]

lol yeah it should.

Better?

[ZeroFang]

Preemptive VOTE: Shepard of Wolves.

While skimming I found this crap and lol'd. All bolding/formatting is his.

The most PRO-TOWN act today, deadline day, is to LYNCH TAZARO. Who ever is not on the WAGON is suspect. It is so pro-town that I think

TAZARO SHOULD SELF LYNCH

.

It is a vital, extremely important sacrifice for TOWN. We must lynch him at all costs. If he does not lynch himself, and no one does, than he must be LYNCHED for Day 2. That is wasted time for dead, town.

Seriously, we do not have even enough active player to lynch. Unless TAZARO self lynches. Or, Anyone who calls themselves town.

So yea. There's that monster. I should have a full-blown case on him before I go to bed, and if I don't I'll unvote, but Felix tells me I'll find something.

Response to Antihero:
Section 1: You mean my case on him.

Section 2: I said that to SoW too. There's a certain point at which you stop making a good case on someone and it becomes a rant which actually isn't relevant to your otherwise valid case. It's a strike against you, but it's weak. If I were trying to make a case on you I'd make it.

Section 3: If you were wanting it to be noticed you should have made your case more clear and brought it up more. I know SoW's posting was hard to keep up with, but there are ways to make text ultra-visible.

Section 4: The day, the suspects, his activity level, his scumminess, his aggression, and most of the hardcore tunneling.

I actually read you as slight town, however misguided.

[ZeroFang]

How do you make text ultra-visible?

Everyone will read this.

[ZeroFang]

CLAIM

God dammit.

UNVOTE: SoW

[ZeroFang]

PS: should I hypothetically die tonight and flip cop, you should know that I have a guilty on ZeroFang.

That's impossible unless I'm miller, which I really doubt. I'd also like to point out to you that we have a doctor who detects lies and a vig who detects lies. You cop claim is inconsistent with the flavor, the alignment, and the balance of power between alignments. Gentlemen, we have found a scum.

VOTE: Tasky

[ZeroFang]

ZeroFang

I see, I made it ultra-visible when I

posted

. I thought you were suggesting that you could make it ultra-visible when

reviewing

to build a case. I thought you were making a suggestion for better reviewing technique.

No, I was talking to Antihero about how he didn't exactly try to push his case on jimfinn militantly, despite hardcore tunneling him.

Where is the rest of your case, that felix is leading you too? You were going to remove your vote unless you posted a case. Why did you lie?

I didn't. I fell asleep, and then you claimed, so there's no point. I have it saved in a notepad file if I need it.

[ZeroFang]

Millar isn't exactly a PR, and I really don't think I am.

[ZeroFang]

Infact, Zorblag had to have us PM our roles to him, so that's absolutely impossible.

[ZeroFang]

ZeroFang, you better claim. And your claim better be DAMN GOOD.

Tasky, why would you have me claim at L-2? What is your interest with outing town PRs?

[ZeroFang]

I think it would be a good idea if the four unconfirmed players (i.e. ZeroFang, Antihero, Locke, Narsis) fullclaimed. discuss.

This caught my eye at the beginning of the game.

- Additional -

1.) This game cannot be broken by mass flavor claim.

Which assume means that even if we all were to claim, it wouldn't out scum. It would only out our PRs assuming we have any more. At that point we'd basically be giving the scum more choices, which I consider a very bad thing. I'm against it.

[ZeroFang]

Should Locke claim before I put him at L-1?

[ZeroFang]

SoW is cleared by being a PR.
I'm twice cleared, once by Espy, once by SoW.
Tasky is cleared by SoW and his role.
Nacho is cleared by Espy.

Antihero is not cleared.
Narsis is not cleared.

There are most likely two scum left. There are two players not cleared. I can do math.

VOTE: Antihero

[ZeroFang]

The second no-kill was because nobody submitted one. The first was was half strategy. Nacho argued that no-kill was the best option because it'd validate his claim (which it did) and even though I was a little unhappy at the time with no-killing, it turned out great. The second no-kill there just was none submitted, so it wasn't strategy. It was pure coincidence and luck that Espy protected me and we ended up with no NK, which validated me as town.

Nacho already said this, but I also want to say that there was too little scum-hunting and more process of elimination

ZeroFang uses the lying coach on some post that I could look up but which didn't actually matter.

I was protecting post 110, Nacho's "I am town aligned" post. It still doesn't matter

[ZeroFang]

The town forced us to lie anyway, so the mod certainly didn't need to. I'm convinced the only reason we won is because we got lucky, and Nacho plays a wicked awesome scum game.