Mafia 93 - A Roccisi Summer - Over!

[charter]

Vote Seraphim

Cause he's scum.

[charter]

Hi guys. I am a alt. Feel free to start the guessing game.

unvote, vote OGB

No one cares. You're only trying to fire up wild goose chases instead of hunt scum or take a stance on anything in the RVS.

[charter]

I think Caboose, Seraphim, and OGB are all scumbuddies.

[charter]

Add Mufasa to that triangle, and I get you a scum quartet. Now to determine the number of scum in this game. This will be the challenging task.

[charter]

rofl, if OGB consistently ignores the game, he is scummy. If he ignores it over the span of three posts, I don't see where he is all that damaging to town.

No, he is spending his posts ACTIVELY trying to derail the town. The quantity of his posts is irrelevant. The quality of them is incredibly scummy.

[charter]

unvote, vote Mufasa

Lynch please.

[charter]

rofl, if OGB consistently ignores the game, he is scummy. If he ignores it over the span of three posts, I don't see where he is all that damaging to town.

No, he is spending his posts ACTIVELY trying to derail the town. The quantity of his posts is irrelevant. The quality of them is incredibly scummy.

Meh. I don't see his posts as actively anti-town, only passively. Do you think that only one avenue of discussion can be pursued at any one time?

Telling us to start guessing whos alt he is absolutely actively trying to derail the town. It serves no purpose and he is trying to get us to waste our limited time with fairy tales. He is trying to divert attention to finding alts, not finding scum.

Caboose is scum too by the way.

[charter]

Korts, why do you not think that OGB actively being anti-town? What is your opinion on Mufasa? Why did you not give one on him right after he claimed out of the blue and for no reason?

[charter]

AHAHAHAHAHA
Prolly copied from the front page. Good catch. Lynch Mufasa, then lynch Caboose.

[charter]

You have not given any opinion of Mufasa either. On what authority are you questioning my lack of stated opinion on the matter?

I said in the post I voted him that I wanted a lynch. What do you mean, on what authority? The authority that I'm trying to find and lynch scum. What the hell was the point of that question?

Roleblocker: we have real doctors who won't be roleblocked and who hopefully should be smart enough to chose the right person to save.

If anyone claims to use any action other than vig on you, they need to be lynched.

I really do not see why there is still discussion going on. After Mufasa's stunt, he must be lynched. Not only did he claim in his not first post of the day, but his claim has changed twice since he made it.

Well, let me be clearer.

(Policy, yea yea)

If OGB AND Mufasa are both town I will eat my hat.
If they are both town and are left alive we will lose.

One hangs, one hopefully dies. OGB first just because mufasa claimed, poorly, a role.

This is essentially the logic I'm going on. Mufasa first though, since he has declared himself to be the lynch. OGB is not so much a policy lynch as he is probably a scum lynch. I'm actually seeing Seraphim/Caboose as marginally scummier, but that's just splitting hairs at this point.

dudes mufasa is pretty clearly town, no one should be voting for him

No. After someone makes an asinine claim like that, then changes it a few times, you lynch them. I'm not going to spend the rest of this game letting Mufasa create havoc.

i mean, really, did anyone look at the EXAMPLE PMS provided with the ruleset? the name "jack-of-all-trades" is right there guys.

No shit, and that's exactly where I think he got it from. He certainly didn't get it from TDC, so that's why we're lynching him, fakeclaiming his role.

Unvote Don't like the speed of this wagon at all. Mufasa is definitely still my #1 suspect but pressuring him with votes isn't going to do any good.

Keeping my vote on whichever of Seraphim and Mufasa currently has the most votes. Seraphim because he is definately scum, and Mufasa because if kept alive he will become a trainwreck and an unacceptable detriment to the town.

However, are you ready for this, the fact he's claimed JOAT without the vig REALLY makes me think we have a separate vig around. If you shot him I wouldn't shed a tear.

In fact, if you don't shoot Mufasa tonight, I won't believe you if you ever claim.

obviously if mufasa is not really a jack of all trades, the scum will not kill him. and we can lynch him at our leisure in a day or two if that is the case. if he

is

really a jack of all trades, he has a list of very useful abilities which are dangerous to the scum, and the scum are given a choice of either killing him, or risking leaving him alive to try and secure a mislynch on a later day, thus leaving themselves open to his doc protect, roleblock, and whatever else he's got up his jack of all sleeve.

lynching him today is just stupid.

Really? He's already proven he isn't useful enough for a powerrole. He has no vig for the town to use a second lynch. All of his one shots are entirely worthless if he doesn't hit scum, and since he's not given an opinion on anyone, I have no idea who he thinks is scum and not. Mufasa needs to be lynched, and there's also a good chance he is scum to boot.

Seraphim needs a shinier wagon.

Agreed. It would be much to my liking if all those voting OGB voted Seraphim or Mufasa.

181- Holy crap. People seriously don't think Seraphim is scum?

190- HowardRoark is possible scum too. He drew zero conclusions in his post, but gave plenty of summaries. Plus he votes Korts for voting Seraphim, when Seraphim is almost certainly scum. Very, very scummy post.

Like I said, will contribute to both the Mufasa or Seraphim lynch as best I am able. Caboose and OGB and HowardRoark are my secondary lynch candidates.

[charter]

Once again, people fail to get an accurate read of my play. This is my town play, unfortunately.

charter, I have a difficult time defending against your attacks if you don't give me anything to defend against. Korts has given a case on why he thinks I'm scum, a case I can defend. You cannot say the same.

You'll get your case later when it's your turn to be lynched. With Mufasa's recent posts, he's the only one I'm interested in lynching today.

Interesting. I've found your play to be questionable and this is just adding to the puzzle. Having replaced Seraphim and reading other games he was in, this play is not out-of-line for him. You also overlook the questions I have posed. Most interesting is the fact that the first part in your post is an issue with Korts while you question my vote for him.

Yep, Howard is scum too. All of this is just there to sound good, more not adding anything to the stew. Once again, no conclusions drawn other than his vague baseless assertation of my play being "questionable", whatever that is supposed to mean.

God...so many people, not enough votes guns.

I know what you mean...

FOS Mixologist for 221. That post was a huge pile of fitting in with the crowd.

Whoever said he is trying to distract the town from scum hunting is ridiculous as its rather easy to attempt a guess at who he's and alt of/ignore him altogether and hunt scum at the same time.

I said this. I don't think it's ridiculous at all when all OGB is interested in doing is getting people to guess who he is. Playing guess the alt detracts from scumhunting, and I'd much rather quash OGB's mess before someone takes his bait.

Mufasa claims joat really early. Why? Charter and seraphim then vote for mufasa. Even more why?

Because he claimed for no reason on page three. Since then, he's changed his claim to make it utterly useless for town two times. He's a distraction and detriment to the town and is either scum or a townie helping scum out. Either way, I want him dead, and the sooner the better.

Anyone keeping their vote on Mufasa: please explain why you think he would be a good lynch for today. How informative would his lynch be? How likely do you think it is that we have a vig? Do you think Mufasa would make a better vig kill than a lynch?

Mufasa is the town's best candidate for a lynch today. He claimed when not under pressure. He can't keep his claim straight. He's clearly not a JOAT. When someone lies about their role, they are scum. If they are town and lying about it, they are helping the scum by risking a counterclaim by a real townie. His lynch would give mediocre information, but we're not lynching him for information. We're lynching him to win. No idea how likely it is we have a vig. I'm not interested in letting him live tonight and hoping we have a vig and hoping the vig kills him.

[charter]

@charter- How am

I

"fitting in with the crowd", when for the line above that you praise SpyreX for the exact same thing? Also:

With Mufasa's recent posts, he's the only one I'm interested in lynching today.

Playing guess the alt detracts from scumhunting, and I'd much rather quash OGB's mess before someone takes his bait.

Hi!!! Can you step on your own toes any more? Please stop fence sitting and pick a side.

I am sorry, but none of this is correct. Your post was a rehash of the general consensus of the town, not original thoughts.

I am most certainly not fencesitting. I have been scumhunting like no one's business. I started out the OGB and Mufasa (and maybe Seraphim) wagons.

[charter]

And also, where have I said anything remotely resembling fence sitting? Please point it out to me, because I do not fence sit.

[charter]

Well, I must say I'm incredibly frightened by how ekiM just responded to about everything directed at me. Very frightened.

You aren't the only one who has said it, so don't think I am trying to focus on you. But since you responded:
1. that's not "all ogb is intested in". Let's put it in to a bit of perspective: he asked a question that admittedly wasn't all that relevant to the game, but did so in the random voting phase, a period of the game that is debatable in regards to how helpful it is in determining scum from town.
2. how does it detract from scum hunting when you easily still scum hunt and just ignore his question?
3. furthermore who are these other people that you are trying to protect from "taking his bait". Do you think anyone in this game actually has taken his bait and has been so caught up in guessing who he is that they have been completely unable to scum hunt and therefore have put the town in a far worse position? Has anything even slightly resembling this happened?

1- Ok then, you tell me what else he is interested in except for voting anyone he can to try and relieve pressure off himself, because I sure as hell don't see anything besides trying to distract the town in his posts.
2- I know I can do both. I know there are many players who can do both. I know there are also many players who cannot do both and will get caught up in trivial things like that.
3- I do not believe this has happened to an unacceptable extent. I believe that the swift wagon on OGB shunned anyone who may have wanted to play guess the alt from doing so.

For example, if someone claimed doc early day 1 for no apparent reason, and isn't counterclaimed, should that person then be wagoned?

Absolutely. Not all games have a doc. I'd probably want to lynch this person.

The claim is confirmable, a likely NK target, and has been executed by a newbie with precedent of, um, let's call it unorthodox play as town; Seraphim's vote, in this context, is opportunistic and scummy.

PEOPLE CALLING FOR A MUFASA LYNCH/VIG ARE SCUMMY. I'll compile a list of these people later.

Um, no. Not one thing about his claim is confirmable. He claimed doc. Easy to "protect" someone when you're mafia doing the killing. He claimed cop. Easy to "investigate" someone when you're mafia since you know everyone's alignment. He claimed jailkeeper. Easy to "protect and roleblock" someone when it's easy for mafia to have a roleblocker and I'm sure a lot of people don't have night actions to begin with.

Those not contributing to a Mufasa lynch are scummy. No scum in their right mind would kill Mufasa. Sorry if you think I'm helping scum, but I give them more credit than that.

[charter]

I'd also like to say, that Mufasa later said he couldn't vig. Something the mafia cannot fake easily. Just increases his scumminess tenfold.

[charter]

Well, I must say I'm incredibly frightened by how ekiM just responded to about everything directed at me. Very frightened.

What do you mean? I responded to the stuff The Admiral said because it was originally directed to "whoever said [OGB] is trying to distract the town from scum hunting".

By the way Mufasa didn't claim cop. He claimed to have 1-shot Doc, JK, RB. Which is even less confirmable and useful.

Ok, I think this may have been a miscommunication or something. I took his points as being directed at me, since he was quoting what I said and then said "but since you[charter] responded", but it looks like you were under the impression he was still talking to everyone who said OGB was a menace.

Whoops on the Mufasa thing, not that it makes any difference.

ekiM, don't try to sell that bullshit about protects and RBs not being useful. Confirmable, only semi-, but that should be enough for now. Three kill-stopping abilities is pretty useful imo. You wanting to eliminate that the first night, if not the first day like charter, is pretty scummy.

Korts, dont try and sell that bullshit about Mufasa being able to effectively use any ability he may have (I still believe he's lying, so this doesn't really enter into consideration). Doctor protections are 100% unconfirmable unless we have a vig and we manage to direct both Mufasa's and the vig's actions, which I do everything in my power to make sure that does not happen. RB and JK are only confirmable if he blocks another power role, and I trust literally every other player in this game with a power role more than Mufasa right now. Not to mention, a scum roleblocker is so common, that Mufasa would be easy to frame and we can just waste all of our power roles each night on wild goose chases to confirm players.

ekiM is right when he says "How likely is a player like Mufasa to find the right target and time to use those abilities in a game this size?" Add on top of that the fact that Mufasa has given zero opinion on everyone, and who knows what damage he will do. Even if we can confirm Mufasa, so what? He is not doing anything to help the town win.

There is zero reason to let Mufasa live past day one. I do not understand how this is a difficult concept to grasp. If you do not see the light, please ask me your questions and I will clarify.

FOS Korts for trying to get half the town to waste night actions to confirm Mufasa.

[charter]

FOS inHim.

I am running out of FOS's. SpyreX, help me!

[charter]

Actually, inHim moves straight on up to full fledged scumbag. Has switched his vote in every single post, and I believe it was always for a current voteleader or someone under a lot of scrutiny. He has also contradicted himself pretty glaringly a few times that I see. I'll be pointing them out in a little bit.

[charter]

Mufasa is still looking like a complete and total liar to me. I'm like 95% sure he's lying about something. The question then becomes - well, even if he's lying, might he still be town? Which is not game I usually care to play. It's so much easier to just lynch the lying people.

Bump that 95% up to a 100% and you're right with me. I have no doubt he is lying, so he needs to be lynched.

271- Starbuck jumps off Mufasa after the wagon is getting some attention and stalling. Scummy post. Just jumps off, doesn't do anything else.

I'd also like to say, that Mufasa later said he couldn't vig. Something the mafia cannot fake easily. Just increases his scumminess tenfold.

I was actually thinking that scum would try to disguise their NK as a vigging. Wouldn't this point mufasa more towards town?

I don't think I've ever seen scum try and claim vig. They're more than welcome to try though, but I bet it won't work.

Yep, Howard is scum too. All of this is just there to sound good, more not adding anything to the stew. Once again, no conclusions drawn other than his vague baseless assertation of my play being "questionable", whatever that is supposed to mean.

Let's see . . . questionable . . . it's not pro-town . . . it's not quite scummy . . . so it's _____. (You can fill in the blank with a word of your choosing. I chose "questionable.")

Ummm, this makes absolutely no sense. If you're accusing me of something, don't leave any grey areas. Quote whatever posts of mine you have problems with and explain why, until then, stop intentionally leaving holes for others to fill in for you.

name one.

I'm not going to single people out like that. Also, I don't see the point of asking since this doesn't seem to reflect alignment.

So since his actions were only theoretically distracting to people you are only theoretically suspicous of him?

No, they were distracting. People wasted brainpower/time after that question. The intent behind the question was scummy. I am suspicious of OGB and wouldn't bat an eye if he were to be lynched/vigged/killed.

Starbuck's response in 283 to legitimate points is incredibly scummy.

charter, i'd like to make a sincere request for you to take of the tunnel vision goggles and look around the game again. i still think you're more likely town than not, but i'm even more sure that mufasa is town at this point, and you're only giving scum who want to wagon him a shield to hide behind.

Oh believe me, there is much more going on inside my head then "KILL MUFASA NOW". His wagon has already provided SO MUCH information. Now all we need is to see his alignment. We aren't lynching Mufasa because he has the best chance of being scum. We're lynching him because he is definately lying, it will be easy to catch scum using his lynch, he displays no interest in scumhunting, and I see him as a huge detriment to town. The fact that he could be scum (a fair chance) is just gravy.

[charter]

Ugh, I just saw that it's me and OGB voting Mufasa. Mufasa is seriously going to wiggle his way out of this? Starbuck is currently my second choice for a vote, but I'm not giving up hope just yet.

VOTE MUFASA IN '09!!!

[charter]

Starbuck, you are incredibly scummy. I explained why in my last post, how you just jumped off Mufasa, though it seems you're still suspicious of him. Also your response to legitimate questions was very scummy. I'm also not seeing you scumhunting or where your questioning is going.

inHim has cemented his position of scumbag with his latest post. Bad play comes from scum too. His skitzer vote is very weak.

[charter]

Right now I'm going along the lines of inHimshallibe/Starbuck/OGB/Caboose/(maybe alvinz/Howard) as the scumteam.
Starbuck and OGB are assuridly scum together, and Caboose looks mighty fishy with them both as well. Starbuck seemed eager to vote for Mufasa but barely mentioned OGB. She is probably the only to not say something about OGB (instead parroting what others have said).
inHim I'm actually not as sure about based on his haphazard voting which seems to be for whoever is under the most suspicion at the time (excluding his most recent skitzer vote, very puzzling).
OGB is scummy for reasons previously mentioned as well for adding zero to this game.
Caboose has an unnatural fixation on alvinz. alvinz has also yet to add something new to the game.

unvote, vote OGB

I swear... If Mufasa is alive tomorrow, bad things will happen...

Also, I'm pretty happy with who is voting for OGB and Starbuck right now. Do those voting them think they are scum together? or just the one that you're voting for? The reason I'm voting OGB over Starbuck is because he has more votes right now.

Going back over Howard's posts as well, he gets bumped into the OGB/Starbuck pairing. He hasn't mentioned either of them once (and pretty sure they haven't mentioned him either).

[charter]

Starbuck for SK! This just in!

Scum, read my post. Gosh.

[charter]

VIG, if you are out there and can hear this. I am begging you for a favor. Please, please, PLEASE shoot Mufasa tonight. Consider this my request for 20 years of forgotten birthday and Christmas presents.

[charter]

OGB: you have been accused of trying to distract the town by getting people to guess your "real" identity. You have been further accused of ignoring complaints against you and failing to contribute anything to the game. How do you plead?

axelrod appears to be coaching ogb into not playing like a bonehead, as if it will save him at this point

Well, I wanted to hear OGB say something and this is what he said:

You may be the more retarded than me, wow you level of comprehension in that last statement was next to none. Seriously look at your pm and look at the examples they don't state much of an ability.

I agree with this. I think Starbuck is another member.

Vote axelrod

I think I messed up that second one, but I agree with rofl's first two coaching points.

[charter]

charter - things i said about seraphim, agree/disagree?

Early on I thought he was scum, now I think hopelessly lost. I don't agree with you that he's scum.

I thought I mentioned Mufasa in my first post, but I forgot. Very disappointed he is alive. Very disappointed. Not going to continue wasting my energy if he isn't going to be lynched.

Starbuck jumping on board seraphim reads trying to save her own skin. I haven't forgotten about her yet.

and i really, really don't like this:

Mufasa could still use that bullet.

because no, he should not be shot, he is a town power role and thats even more evident today than it was yesterday

i suddenly understand why spyrex is on tubby's shortlist

spyrex also notably left charter off of the list of people who jumped wagons when he is the most blatant wagon jumper, being gung ho for an ogb lynch until mufasa comes along and is suddenly ZOMG THE ONLY PERSON WE CAN LYNCH BCUZ HES SO DUMB

Are you daft? Mufasa said he blocked Korts. Korts said he can confirm it was likely he was blocked. I'm not trying to find out why Korts would say this, but I sure as hell know if Korts was scum (not with Mufasa) he wouldn't say that (Hey guys, my mafia kill didn't go through ). I don't think you understand what I was going for yesterday (not sure how that's possible, but I'll restate). We are lynching Mufasa to win. Did Mufasa stop a mafia kill last night? I'm betting no. WHY THE HELL ARE WE CONTINUING TO LET HIM BLOCK PEOPLE THAT MIGHT BE ABLE TO HELP TOWN? Mufasa has shown that he is incapable of helping town and it sounds to me like he's hurting town.

I'm waivering on rofl being town. He was absolutely dead set on an OGB lynch from his very first post. I know a thing or two about believing your reads blindly and tunnel vision, and what rofl did yesterday reminds me of bussing a scum buddy, not town thinking they've got a scum in the bag.

But to believe rofl was scumbuddies with OGB you'd have to believe he decided to seriously gambit on his own team's 1-shot vig. right from the outset, just to try and set himself up to look better later in the game, and I don't really think that.

This idea has certainly entered my head. I've done it before, and I coasted to LYLO, where a slew of horrible choices by myself got myself lynched.

How did Starbuck have anything to do with the part that you quoted?

It didn't.

[charter]

rofl, my thoughts on what you posted about Seraphim.
post 356- I don't think there is anything to get from ThAd. I agreed with a bunch of what he said, which makes me think he probably didn't say anything about his mafia partners (or innoculous things or just very little)
I do see why you think Caboose and ThAd could be partners, but early on it looked like Caboose and OGB could be partners, so Caboose could be a great lynch regardless.
I think you're reading too much into what ThAd posted, I don't think he left that many blatent links to buddies.
I agree that Seraphim is looking for scum in all the wrong places.

post 357- This all just reads bad play by Seraphim to me. Sure he could be scum, but I'm not seeing this as a tell on his alignment.

Basically, I'm not thinking there is this obvious of connection between ThAd and Seraphim and I don't see what Seraphim has done as scummy as opposed to just bad.

given that the italian mafia had a doctor, and we know this doctor was not protecting the gf because the gf also died, it stands to reason that the mafia doc must have been protecting someone deemed even more likely to draw a nightkill than inhim was. this points to someone who was already under heavy suspicion yesterday being a part of if the italian mafia. seraphim was under heavy suspicion yesterday.

I missed this before, but this is a good point. I think it could have been Caboose too.

[charter]

Korts. We are killing Mufasa because he is absolutely worthless in finding scum and will be a trainwreck in LYLO. What is so goddamn hard to understand about that?

FOS Howard. If I had three votes, you and Starbuck would be getting them as well.

[charter]

Because you look a lot like OGB's scumbuddy. I believe I went over this yesterday.

[charter]

THANK YOU WHOEVER KILLED MUFASA. Now I can return to catching scumbags full time.

vote darkdude

for his last ditch attempt to save alvinz.
If Caboose has a better lynch candidate, I'm all ears.

Should rofl's mason buddy claim? I think he should.

[charter]

Ummm, because if there is just one more mason, they are confirmed town? Durrr.

[charter]

Tubby,

have axel and charter both gone all retarded or what?? why would the last mason member claim?? there are far to many unknowns left out there, that being said mason members shut up and say nothing more.

To confirm themself/ves town, and to avoid situations like: another mason dies tonight and tomorrow scum fakeclaims third mason, and we can't be sure that they're lying.

this is a really good reason for them to claim. If there is just one left, then the being mason part is useless, except to confirm them as town. I say if there is just one mason left, they need to claim, next post.

[charter]

And getting a mason NK'ed and never claiming helps us even less and then leaves the door open for scum to claim third mason if there really isn't one and then we have a confirmed "town". YAY. And what is this about neighborhoods claiming, why should they do that?

[charter]

I must say, if you can bodyguard yourselves, then it seems inconceivable that you wouldn't do that every single night, especially night one. I can kind of see night 3 not doing it because Caboose seems like he is a cop, but why on earth did you not protect yourselves night one?

Anyone else going to claim to be rofl's mason buddy?

[charter]

I am normally a proponent of massclaim, but I want to wait until tomorrow.

[charter]

Vote: darkdude

That last post gave me no reason to believe Darkdude is town.

Caboose, who do you plan on investigating tonight?

While I still think darkdude is scum, this is too egregious to not act on.

unvote, vote Seraphim

[charter]

Fuck it. darkdude is still obviously scum.

unvote, vote darkdude

Lynching Seraphim at the first chance after this I get though.

[charter]

Also Caboose, in case you suddenly went braindead, don't tell us anything more about your role, except who we need to lynch.

[charter]

He doesn't mean the role framer. He means because you're incredibly suspicious asking that and you're trying to set someone up.

I disagree, I think it's horribly scummy of you because why the hell do you need to know who he's investigating? He picked out both a scum and a miller. Do the math.

[charter]

There actually was a multitasker, under passive abilities. Not that that excuses Seraphim's actions though. Also, MILLERS DON'T CARRY GUNS. It's not rocket science.

[charter]

I'm just going to shut up before I accidently reveal Caboose's role because of Seraphim's extreme incompetence.

[charter]

Paraphrase of your nighttalk Seraphim and X. The rules don't say anything about straight quoting it, but that may be an oversight, so don't do that and get yourselves modkilled.

[charter]

I think Howard is probably scum with Alvinz, but we can leave him for tomorrow.

That paraphrase Seraphim/X. Don't forget it. Also, both of you need to do it, in your own words. I don't want a hammer before this. I really don't care if Mixologist posts or not, there's really little room for him to be scum in this game.

[charter]

Currently thinking ekim or tajo is scum. Tajo's first read of everyone had both ThAd and inHim as prob town. For whatever reason, was devoid in lynching Alvinz.

ekim, his darkdude vote, 484, I feel like that was a giant pile of trying to fit in. He never mentioned inHim. He had this wierd addition to my back and forth with ThAd day one.

vote ekim

Think he's more likely to be scum.

[charter]

Why the fuck are we voting Caboose? He is the last peson I'm going to be voting for a while.

Working on a response to ekim, but X just jumped up in scumminess.

[charter]

At Yos Beach Bash. Will post later.

[charter]

Ok, my attempt to catch up..

689- Utterly ridiculous vote on Caboose. Just because scum is too dumb to catch breadcrumbs doesn't make Caboose scum.
690- Still need to go and find this for ekim..
695- Horrible vote by X. He just flip flopped because tajo told him to.
698- Spyrex, why do you want to lynch a claimed cop who so far has been very accurate? Why do you even need to think about lynching him?
699- X, just because Caboose is lazy doesn't make him scum. He's done way more to help the town than you have, maybe we should just lynch you then.
716- ekim, why can X and Seraphim only be scum together? It's not possible one is scum and one is playing poorly? Why not?
720's- tajo claiming he's not suspicious of Caboose but leaving his vote on there. Also, he's doing more pointless setup speculation rather than giving us who he is suspicious of now. tajo is scum.

unvote, vote tajo

733- I don't like how tajo is arguing with Korts. Korts is making a lot of sense these past few days, there isn't much to argue with him about.
741- Howard, I don't see how me catching a scumbag makes me scum. No one else was remotely interested in lynching inHim day one, and I had other people I wanted lynched more than inHim. This is all obvious.
757- You know I like to tunnel on my scumreads.

Me and Lowell are indeed in the Seaside Neighborhood. I also believe him to be town based off what Mixologist said in there Night 1. His suspects matched mine at the time.

tajo is scum still.

[charter]

We're not masons, we're neighbors. I don't think Lowell realizes that there's a difference. We're not mod confirmed town to each other, but like I said, I'm reasonably sure he's town.

Paraphrase of our talk.
me- hey
mix- hey
me- (claim my role)
mix- (claims role)
me- pretty sure Starbuck is scum. Lots of obvtowns.
mix- suspicious of starbuck, caboose, darkdude. Ask's me what to do if mufasa isn't vigged.
me- Don't give him a great chance at being scum, but he's hurting the town too much to live. I'm not sold on darkdude being scum, acted similar in a marathon game. Axelrod and Starbuck look scummy. Ask him about his calling out of me, tell him I'm not going to pursue it in thread anymore.
me- game is going down in history
Lowell- hello
me- I think you're town.

[charter]

charter and I are mason buddies, though I cannot vouch for his towniness. Only mine.

Just thought I'd throw that out there, if anyone cares.

Name of the masonry.

Why do you think he is not town?

Also, charter please confirm, deny.

This guy is scum.

[charter]

ekim, post 248 was what I was referring to in 690, though now I'm pretty sure it's tajo, not you.

[charter]

720's- tajo claiming he's not suspicious of Caboose but leaving his vote on there. Also, he's doing more pointless setup speculation rather than giving us who he is suspicious of now. tajo is scum. unvote, vote tajo

First, I never said I was not suspicous of Caboose.
Second, setup speculation is never pointless since it is giving us the way to play the game. Its more probable to find a Italian than to find a Russian. Setup speculation ftw.
And finally Im not scum.

What I said regarding Caboose is that we know he is a cop. Do we know he is town? Fuck no. Lynching him today, even if the guy is scummy as fuck, its not optymal.

But yeah

unvote.

Caboose has given me more reason to think he's town than most of the other players in this game.

SpyreX, what post did that quote you quoted in 781 come from?

This question reeks of scum. Are you looking for possible footholds because you feel threatened?

Yes, exactly my thinking as well.

They've claimed to have an extra vig that gets enabled when one of them dies. I cannot see how they wouldn't kill the other ASAP if either were scum independently. An extra kill is a huge bonus.

I'd forgotten about this. brb

[charter]

They've claimed to have an extra vig that gets enabled when one of them dies. I cannot see how they wouldn't kill the other ASAP if either were scum independently. An extra kill is a huge bonus.

I'd forgotten about this. brb

Yes, I'd say that pretty much clears them then.

[charter]

Don't like how Spyrex originally seemed to parrot off tajo with his 'having a hard time stomaching killing the cop' but didn't commit one way or the other. I don't see how you could possibly waiver on this issue. It also looks like he was waiting to see what everyone decided before acting (which is confirmed with his latest, one of Lowell and charter has to be scum, which is moronic if you read our posts).

If someone else moves on to Spyrex, I could do a Spyrex lynch over a tajo lynch, but I'm not going to unvote yet, as that would help a Lowell lynch, which I'm 100% against.

[charter]

I avoided my mason buddy entirely the last time I was mason with kmd, you forgotten that? Hard to believe.

Night 0 is our role claims and before.
Night 1 is after that and up to my long post
Night 2 is me saying the game is going down in history
Night 3 is the rest.

Why would I not say I didn't think darkdude was scum? I wasn't going to stick my neck out to try and save him when he was being entirely unhelpful. Why should I try and save him when I'm not sure he's town? Your question is a massive grasp at nothing.

Why is this game going down in history? Duh. Is this a serious question? Town is doing amazing.

[charter]

Lynching me to confirm a neighbor claim WHICH LOWELL ALREADY FUCKING CONFIRMED is too retarded to comprehend. Spyrex doesn't have a case for why I'm scum. He just mentions some stuff that I didn't do (don't see why I should either) and declares me scum.

I'm sorry Seraphim, but your reads this game have been all wrong, this one included, I wouldn't put any stock in them. Caboose is town, I'm town, Lowell is town, unfortunately, it seems you are too, Howard is, I think I'm forgetting one or two.

It's either tajo or Spyrex or both. We need to be lynching them.

[charter]

Reasons I think you're scum, copied and pasted from what I said earlier mostly.

Tajo's first read of everyone had both ThAd and inHim as prob town. For whatever reason, was devoid in lynching Alvinz.

720's- tajo claiming he's not suspicious of Caboose but leaving his vote on there. Also, he's doing more pointless setup speculation rather than giving us who he is suspicious of now.

733- I don't like how tajo is arguing with Korts. Korts is making a lot of sense these past few days, there isn't much to argue with him about.

and the post where you question Lowell about why he thinks I'm not town, when he clearly said he did.

[charter]

If we assume game symmetry, at least one of Charter/Lowell is scum.

Right now, I'm more inclined to vote Lowell...if it comes to deadline, I'll vote for Lowell.

And why would we assume "game symmetry"?

I think tajo is scum. Why would he try to lynch the cop if he's the backup cop?

[charter]

Yeah well as far as game symmetry goes, do the two mafia families resemble each other at all?

Negative.

[charter]

The point is, why are you assuming "game symmetry"? It doesn't make any sense to policy lynch me or Lowell because of that.

[charter]

Charter, why do you think Lowell is town?

Also, if we are looking at simmetry, how does the Seaside Neighborhood fit in Lower-Rocissi and Upper-Rocissi Neighborhood?

I think he's town because I think Mixologist missed a few nights in our talking, which makes me think he either wasn't around, or wasn't looking, both of which don't point to scum. I'd think scum would be more likely to check it since they probably have their own scum QT to check as well. They also have a kill to make, so I don't think Mixologist was scum. Also the fact that they really haven't done anything scummy.

Don't ask me where Seaside Neighborhood fits in, ask TDC.

Would it make sense for a 1 town/1 scum neighborhood?

Why would that make sense?


I'm vanilla, except for being a neighbor with Lowell.

[charter]

Well, I don't know if I've ever seen Lowell as scum, but I've played with him as town a fair number of times, and he's on par right now.

When did he PM the mod? I thought it was the middle of the day, so I don't see why you're still so convinced.

[charter]

I've answered that Seaside Neighborhood is what's said in the role PM like three times.

[charter]

Well, I still think that if he was scum he would have posted something in our QT, but that doesn't really look good for him I guess.

[charter]

IF Lowell comes up as a vanilla mason (i.e. no active abilities) tomorrow lynch Charter.

Setting up chain lynches are we? Both of us are vanilla. This merits a

unvote, vote Spyrex

Plus there's the fact that you now all of a sudden are fine with calling him a mason, but when he misspoke earlier it was the end of world.

[charter]

That seems like a complete reversal from "IF Lowell comes up as a vanilla mason (i.e. no active abilities) tomorrow lynch Charter" to "I will be voting Lowell. If Lowell is scum I will be voting charter. If Lowell is town I will be confused as all hell".

[charter]

Care to address this one though? As in, cite examples.

I didn't actually go check if you were one of the people that did make a deal about it, I just remember you questioning our claim and lumped you in with the nitpickers without going and checking. If you say you didn't than I'll just assume that. I don't understand how you can think we're scum together. Why would our claim have been this shitty if we're scum together? We would have had it planned out days ago. This isn't really WIFOM since it would make sense for scum to have a solid sounding claim, not this jank we have.

Welcome Kison!

[charter]

I don't see how you can think me and Lowell are scumbuddies when there's already five scum dead. I'm sorry, but there is not seven or eight scum in this game. For that many you need ~30 players, and that's without them all having power roles and so far, all of our scum have ridiculously good roles.

Spyrex is grasping to try and set up the charter/Lowell chainlynch. I bet he's the last scum trying to figure out how he's going to win this game.

[charter]

Spyrex dying just saves us the trouble of doing it today. Weren't we going to massclaim today as well?

Kison should give his result first.

Lowell, if you don't think Spyrex is scum, who do you think is scum? The main reason I thought he was was his ridiculous charter/Lowell are scum theory.

[charter]

So is Korts the only person that isn't cleared/town then? Didn't he not want to claim yesterday as well? I want to see what he's cooked up for us today then before I vote him.

I think it was ekim/X that get a kill if the other dies (unlikely either of them is scum then).
Me/Lowell are neighbors, though I don't think he's scum.
tajo, Howard, Seraphim were all cleared by Caboose/Kison.
Am I missing anything?

[charter]

charter, why are you excluding Seraphim from your list of players? And no, ekiM is not in any claimed neighbourhood.

I thought Seraphim was investigated and it was an innocent? I was just going off memory on my list back there.

[charter]

Oh, it was Seraphim that was in the neighborhood with the extra kill. Now I've got it straight. You're buddies with X, correct?

I guess if Kison is confirming Korts, he does have that ability. I don't see why it can't be a scum ability, but I don't find Korts more suspicious than ekim.

[charter]

Request prod/replacement on ekim

Hasn't posted in forever and is supposedly back from v/la.

[charter]

Well, a vanilla doesn't mean anything, so process of elimination

vote ekiM

[charter]

Don't like these Lowell votes one bit. He's town, I'm telling you guys.

[charter]

I've already explained why. Mixologist wasn't posting in our quicktopic, and I'm pretty sure that if he was scum, and had just checked his scum quicktopic, he'd hop on over to ours and try and figure out what I'm thinking. His lack of participation I think means he wasn't interested, which I think makes him much more likely to be town.

[charter]

vote ekim

Pretty much the only person left since I don't think Lowell is scum.

[charter]

Oh, now that Lowell is confirmed town, I'm even more sure with my vote.

Seraphim, who did you kill?

[charter]

I don't know about no lynching. I think we need to wait for Kison first, because with three results, then we can pretty much kill everyone that doesn't have a not guilty.

[charter]

I don't know about a no lynch today. I'd rather lynch today and then no lynch tomorrow if we need to. I'm going to go back and reread and look at ekim in particular.

[charter]

Actually, I'm extremely certain that lynching today is the right idea if you don't have to make a kill each night, do you Seraphim?

If you do, then that changes things.

[charter]

Kison, can you hammer No Lynch, please? Unless you have some compelling reason not to.

This sounds like he's worried he'll get lynched. I think he's trying to wiggle his way out of this.

[charter]

Thanks for a bunch of my quotes, but you gave "no reasons" for me being scum.

[charter]

No, our neighborhood doesn't have any abilities, that is what vanilla means.

[charter]

Vote: Kison

Caught between a rock and a hard place are we?

This is what I'm thinking.

[charter]

Really, folks, it's not unreasonable. After repeated prodding,

nobody

claimed to have received an ability from Korts, which only suggests he was blocked instead of me the night before last, and unless you think I am scum with the abilities of blocking, killing,

and

investigating, I can't see how I could be to blame for the lack of its delivery.

Well, what doesn't make sense to me is why this is the first we are hearing of there being a roleblocker. Why did they let you investigate all these other nights, but now all of a sudden decide to block you? I don't think there's a roleblocker at all. With all the claims we've had, NONE of those people ever got blocked? I think not.

Plus, if you're scum, then I don't see where you have any roleblocking. This argument is a really poor one, coupled with how this is 100% different how you played in the endgame of that deep south game, and I am going with a

vote Kison

[charter]

It seems like it would have been much smarter for scum to kill you off earlier than let you live for three nights to get one mislynch when it isn't even LYLO.

Korts could have sent his ability to scum, in which case I doubt they would admit to getting it. (which is what I'm betting happened)

[charter]

Request prod on ekiM and Howard

[charter]

charter, don't you think it fits into the game's theme of defying normal Mafia expectations to have a Mafia cop with a town back-up?

I suppose. I'm voting for Kison, so I think it fits.

[charter]

I don't generally spell out my cases, including that with inHim. I never voted him because there were too many others that needed lynching asap.

Yesterday I thought ekiM was the scummiest, so I was voting him.

[charter]

I've got nothing else to say.

[charter]

Still nothing else to say.

[charter]

Well, I still think you're pretty scummy. I believe yesterday I was thinking that lynching sooner would narrow down the potential investigation targets and that it would increase the chances of us getting another successful cop investigation.

Today all other scumhunting has flown out the window with this roleblocker nonsense.

[charter]

Why am I scummy?

...That's actually a good question. I went back and looked and I've mostly just had you down as scum based off process of elimination. There was a bit towards the beginning where you (I believe) had a weird interaction with ThAd I believe, but I'd have to do some digging.

[charter]

Good job town! Thanks for modding TDC!

I would like to congratulate town on just mislynching once, that's really good. Plus we had like five obvtowns day one, so... yeah. Good work. Also, this was one of the most fun games I've played in. I believe I pm'ed TDC something saying that midway through day one.

I don't know if I'd have tried to pull a roleblocker the last day Kison. You could have easily gotten me to try and lynch ekiM, then maybe got me lynched the last day, but you were in a really really tough spot regardless.