Undertale Mafia: Friends & Corpses [GAME OVER]

[Not Chara]

My role includes a killing component.

Can we use it as a dual lynch?
Where are the kills?

As long as we keep making really bad lynches, I'm not making a single kill this game.

...is this you calling the Narna lynch a bad one?

oh, never mind. you were telling Titus why you hadn't killed anyone yet. still, not sure i agree with that. why not shoot Narna after McMenno's flip yesterday?

[Not Chara]

i embrace death.

Titus and Shiro are scum.

[Not Chara]

If Narna is town, scum are dividing and conquering or lurking.

scum off the radar is exactly what i think.
still questioning whether you're one of them but we'll see.

i embrace death.

Titus and Shiro are scum.

Don't worry, Andrius will be a little preoccupied tonight with pet-sitting ^_~

What if I told you I received a 1shot cop ability last night.
I would be very interested in using it but obviously pointless if I'm being jailed.

use it on me. i'm a side-note on several scumlists, i'm sure it would be telling.

[Not Chara]

lmao i can't believe this hadn't occurred to me sooner.

I jailed massive last night. Narna is lying or I was blocked again, I guess.

scum doesn't out a night action on massive-
(why did you block massive and not try to protect someone?)
-to further incriminate a lynched player. Nahdia's town.

[Not Chara]

Maybe we should start with Leonshade.

Leonshade isn't lurking.

i say lynch Shiro.

[Not Chara]

Probably didn't notice/forgot your presence.

you must be joking. Andrius has objectively been present.
and i have no idea why Almost50 is on your list.
or me, for that matter? actually, none of it makes sense.

[Not Chara]

in what world is Peregrine lurking this game?

[Not Chara]

Okay, you're not lurking, yet don't feel confident to put you as town.

But guess what? I feel confident to put Shiro as town.

why.

[Not Chara]

Okay, you're not lurking, yet don't feel confident to put you as town.

But guess what? I feel confident to put Shiro as town.

Its because I'm supposedly the Serial Killer isn't it.

my bet is still on alignment-switcher, in some form. perhaps neutral to town or scum depending on choices made.

pedit: so why is Shiro town?
how are you unsure if you've payed attention or not?

[Not Chara]

See, let's create a definition of lurker. It can include active lurking. Then we have a pool to debate from.

this sounds more like a debate exercise than scumhunting.

[Not Chara]

There could have some active scum posters.

And we sort them by looking at which lurkers they value and why.

If we make the pool the three lowest posters out of the top 6 players most frequently listed as "not voting", we should get a pool we can debate from.

this game had three separate players all purposely not voting because they wanted to hammer, to differing success.
this is an arbitrary measure.

i could lynch Giovanni. Titus, do you want to lynch Giovanni?

pedit: Titus, i'm not agreeing to a policy lynch. is the point. we've had

three

info lynches. use them.

lynch Shiro tomorrow. if not them, then Giovanni. if not him, then Titus. sound good?

[Not Chara]

no, switch Giovanni and Titus in the order of my preference.

[Not Chara]

Govern: Narna

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yx7XyYwRKiE

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Shiro

[Not Chara]

i don't know why this is being discussed. there is no way scum Leon would risk governing his partner Narna. not when claimed killing roles continue to scumread him. Narna's scumflip would only out Leon.
either both are town or one is, at most, scum. i think both are town. and even if i'm unsure about Narna, an investigation like that is one we should let gather reports, not lynch.

i don't think there's death masking going on. there's a difference between receiving a false investigation report, and a player's flip being wrong.

[Not Chara]

Titus's Creature scumread at this time is really coming out of left field. the townread vanished because Creature expected Titus to find scum? really? i'm not saying he's right to assume that, but it's such a weak, textbook reason (BoP) to completely flip a read.
and us two on a team doesn't make any sense.
VOTE: Titus
i feel better about this before Shiro.

[Not Chara]

Nice new avi chara

thanks.
was my first avatar. we've come full circle.

tell me: are you only scumreading Shiro because they aren't scumreading you for apathy, or is it multiple reasons?

[Not Chara]

vanilla cop is the most suspicious claim here. almost certain this is role madness.

[Not Chara]

you PEOPLE are your DEMANDS. i adopted that readlist style specifically so i could be lazy, yo.
SlySly is scum because shadiness is a trait I prefer to see only in trees.
Titus leans town because their frustration with trying to steer the lynch has felt like a towntell to me and also I don't know just tonal I guess which is probably a bad way to be reading someone like Titus but meh.

Nahdia, have you reevaluated your Titus read lately? she's remained in the top bracket or your readslist for a while.

[Not Chara]

i didn't mean the very top. i mean she's been a pretty solid townread.

[Not Chara]

Nahdia, i don't know what you're trying to tell me. you have her as town, don't you? can you just explain what i'm misinterpreting?

[Not Chara]

I have titus firmly in my "woeful optimism" category.

...ok.
can you tell me where the scum is in Snarky? i've ISOed you but i might have missed something due to only checking the name "Snarky".

[Not Chara]

coasting.

...it's Snarky. he's been playing the game, just not as actively.
this is sort of underwhelming.

[Not Chara]

why would i scumread you for being wrong on a tunnel, Titus? i was also supporting the McMenno wagon by day 2. saying i should have pushed you there is a false expectation.
Fire: why me over Titus? no one's forcing your vote.

this is town Almost, i'm pretty sure. don't waste a night action on him.

the rest, i won't be responding to.

[Not Chara]

Not to mention the wholly inconsistent position Narna has of a death lawyer existing but pushing on someone who lead a lynch at all. If a death lawyer existed, then I could have been right in my analysis. That would be clearing. Yet, it acts like it knows I was wrong.

you were the one saying Death Lawyers are a type of bastard modding 'lie' that wouldn't be in the game..?

Narna was also being facetious with his claim of there being a death lawyer. this was explained.

i'm happy to be a companion wagon to Titus. let's do that. pick your sides. Leon is a bad lynch, it's not divisive enough, and scum supporting it (Titus) have the defense of his Govern being scummy, objectively. i don't want to be saved as a late-game mislynch later by the scumteam.
whereas my townflip would be much more telling. or Titus's scumflip. (or townflip, depending on your view)

[Not Chara]

let's see if he governs anyone else tomorrow. he can't govern Narna again.
Leon was being townread, he wasn't under heat. now he's basically assured he won't make it to lylo, if scum.
or, the more likely explanation, he's town who acted as he explained.

[Not Chara]

almost, ISO me and search Titus. tell me what you think. i don't remember if you have concrete reads on either of us, remind me.

pedit: if Leon is scum, it's likely he would only have one shot. if town, he could have more. it's not as farfetched as you keep framing it.

Almost: haha, did you really forget? how about you be annoying tomorrow, and give me some reads today. c=

[Not Chara]

Giovanni: opinions on Titus, myself, Narna, and Leonshade?

[Not Chara]

oh, i believe that you'll be annoying either way.

can you tell me why she's town if single-ball? and, in my opinion multiball is likely, taking into account flavour, this game being bastard, the apparent popularity of multiball in large themes, this being Skullduggery's last game, and finally: this wagon formation has been sort of ridiculous. the latter is the most convincing to me.

i'm townreading SirCakez. not end-all strongly, but a lot of his scumreads have fit with mine, and for those that don't, i can see why he feels how he does. what gives you the strong scum lean inklings?

i'm thinking the general off feel to this game has to do with multi-ball and third parties. the kills have also been really strange. i'm sure there's a reason beyond random chance with this group of players interacting in this manner, but i don't know what it is definitively.

pedit: Titus, if you want to break the gridlock, then help me pseudo-gladiate you. <3 having an assured town determine the lynch just removes every single interaction we might have had from wagon building.
is this how town Titus tries to get a game moving? anyone with meta can chime in.

[Not Chara]

@SlySly, You. I don't think anyone doubts you.

Also, you should specify exactly who is in each side.

If t v t, scum duel both.
T v s, then that will help town immensely.

pocket attempt. the above.
Maxous is more universally townread, and SlySly has been having problems with (and vocally expressing frustration about) being listened to this game. this proposal neatly fills out the latter point.
having a single player determine the lynch is also a terrible idea. it reduces it to a vig kill. we can consolidate without this.

and don't pretend this isn't a roundabout way of lynching Leonshade.

[Not Chara]

Titus asked Nahdia for an explanation of their reads in an appeal, but hasn't engaged with that explanation. Titus?

between Not Chara and Titus I'd vote Titus. I don't want to vote either though.

i want to see more opinions like the above. give me your preference between us two, even if you don't vote.

i don't think Snarky will get support today, there isn't really a case. Shiro is a lynch i could see happening. or Leon. i'd obviously strongly prefer the former, if Titus vs. Chara doesn't catch on.

pedit:
Almost: true, we haven't had a lot of night-kills. i suspect any third-party scum roles would need to fulfill conditions. this is a large, i doubt it's one-kill per night regardless.
i might have to abandon the MB theory if this lack of kills continues. in that case, more grey-area roles is likely to me. or we suck.

Titus: then why are you approaching SlySly? even if he's being townread, my second statement still applies. respond to that.
i believe that you used it as town in Wake's game. and i could be wrong on the theory of this being helpful. but i question how you're going about it. it's like you don't want me lynched.

[Not Chara]

If you wanna lynch Leon and let me take the shit if he flips town - go ahead.
Giovanni cleared me anyway

where would that leave us day 4?

what's the problem in letting Leon live one more day? he's a proven Governor, it's not like he'll have a night ability we need to worry about if scum.
if there's something wrong with choosing between Titus and i, tell me what it is.

[Not Chara]

If you wanna lynch Leon and let me take the shit if he flips town - go ahead.
Giovanni cleared me anyway

where would that leave us day 4?

what's the problem in letting Leon live one more day? he's a proven Governor, it's not like he'll have a night ability we need to worry about if scum.
if there's something wrong with choosing between Titus and i, tell me what it is.

Leon would only let town lynches go through and becomes de facto king of the game.

hm.

You seriously postulate Leon has two shots?

Titus's expected shot number for Leon's govern appears to change based on convenience.

[Not Chara]

I do want you lynched. I want Narna lynched. I want Leon lynched.

Please, if you think I ever back off from a challenge without evidence...

Person please. [Tone: Bitch Please]

Nahdia hasn't given an explanation although I think she tried so I stopped hounding, because she tried but cannot. I cannot get blood from a stone.

out-of-game: i appreciate the conscious decision to not call me a bitch, even in jest. <3

anyways.
there's support for a lynch on me. from your townreads. but instead of pushing me, you put your vote there, then start trying to get SlySly to pick today's lynch independently. (which would likely be a Leonshade lynch)

[Not Chara]

If you wanna lynch Leon and let me take the shit if he flips town - go ahead.
Giovanni cleared me anyway

where would that leave us day 4?

what's the problem in letting Leon live one more day? he's a proven Governor, it's not like he'll have a night ability we need to worry about if scum.
if there's something wrong with choosing between Titus and i, tell me what it is.

Leon would only let town lynches go through and becomes de facto king of the game.

hm.

You seriously postulate Leon has two shots?

Titus's expected shot number for Leon's govern appears to change based on convenience.

And here's the throw mud diversion.

Not Chara just complained about giving one confirmed town control over the lynch, yet doesn't seem concerned with Leon having the power to veto lynches however many times.

Instead, it plays a semantic game, moaning that I do not know how many shots Leon has.

no. actually, i've made the intelligent decision to assume that this game does not have a scum Governor with the power to

veto several scum lynches

. a fact you also seemed to believe.
you're fear-mongering.
buzzwords are easy.

pedit: finally.
you still haven't answered my other comment. shall i quote it for you again? :> or do you not have a good explanation yet?

[Not Chara]

do you think Leon could veto his own lynch?

pedit: Titus, give your lynchlist again.
and tell me, from a theory standpoint, why you vs. me is an idea you don't like.

peditx2: i

know

Leon can't shoot forever. are you pretending there isn't a reason for a power role to hide their number of shots?
yet you're using his undisclosed number of shots as a reason to kill him today, instead of later. fear-mongering. 'he'll control the lynch if we let him live!' as if.
i'm not spamming. that's false.

objectively

.

[Not Chara]

what's the problem in letting Leon live one more day? he's a proven Governor, it's not like he'll have a night ability we need to worry about if scum.

That's a really weird defence.
Just lynch scum.
Titus is a vanilla cop anyway - that's high priority to eliminate???

that was part of my general 'why not lynch me' point, Maxous. you should see by the rest of the conversation that i'm talking about why the fear for scum Leonshade is so silly.

50 town points to whoever can explain what Titus isn't thinking through here.

did i not cover it?

pedit: i'd definitely compromise on Shiro.

[Not Chara]

i'd also lynch Creature, but he's behind both Titus and Shiro.

[Not Chara]

and tell me, from a theory standpoint, why you vs. me is an idea you don't like.

there are more things i want answered, besides this.

pedit: Almost, Leon can't govern twice in one day.
if Leon governed himself the next day, Narna could still be wagoned.
and i agree on Snarky probably not being scum.

[Not Chara]

i'd also lynch Creature, but he's behind both Titus and Shiro.

That's like barely but still acceptable.

Why would you want to lynch him though? All he's done is be your lapdog?

why is it 'barely'? he was on your list of players you'd lynch today.
...i find it very funny that you've asked me why i'd be fine with a Creature lynch. incredibly funny.

Not quoting, but @not chara: look at all the town roles.

It's entirely reasonable that scum have strong powers

i suppose that's legitimate.
but if Leon's scum, and i'm scum.. that doesn't explain a preference for Leon over me. do you see my point?

[Not Chara]

i'd also lynch Creature, but he's behind both Titus and Shiro.

That's like barely but still acceptable.

Why would you want to lynch him though? All he's done is be your lapdog?

why is it 'barely'? he was on your list of players you'd lynch today.
...i find it very funny that you've asked me why i'd be fine with a Creature lynch. incredibly funny.

[Not Chara]

Creature is possibly scum. Now that you're dancing around bussing him, I want to see why you suspect him.

"now" that i'm dancing around bussing him.
i flipped my read on Creature. i only want him lynched now. i never did before this, i've never talked about him. i've been downright avoiding him!

[Not Chara]

Creature is possibly scum. Now that you're dancing around bussing him, I want to see why you suspect him.

"now" that i'm dancing around bussing him.
i flipped my read on Creature. i only want him lynched now. i never did before this, i've never talked about him. i've been downright avoiding him!

[Not Chara]

town.

[Not Chara]

i've been downright avoiding him!

This is what I've been talking about. There seems to be a lot of this going around. There's a lot of pages in this game and there are a lot of players that haven't said one word to or about each other in this game.

the post you quoted was entirely sarcastic.
my point being Creature is one of the top players mentioned in my ISO, for those who would actually look.

[Not Chara]

why would scum Leon plan to govern Narna, but kick off that plan by tunneling and then randomly deciding not to lynch him after all right at the end? there's no evidence of pre-planning. it's too messy.

[Not Chara]

SlySly: where did you get that lynchpool? it's missing Shiro, for one.

[Not Chara]

why would scum Leon plan to govern Narna, but kick off that plan by tunneling and then randomly deciding not to lynch him after all right at the end? there's no evidence of pre-planning. it's too messy.

I think the plan shifted in the long twilight given the lack of town cohesion.

what does that mean.
there was town cohesion in the Narna lynch, as you keep saying. he was run up very fast. what would change things during twilight?

[Not Chara]

Narna's role detects anyone with the ability to kill or just anyone with the ability to kill that hasn't killed?

anyone with the ability to kill, or that had the ability to kill in the past (but may or may not still possess the ability)
the way he claimed it, he would get a positive on a player who had received/was a 1-shot vigilante, but had long since expended the shot.

[Not Chara]

why would scum Leon plan to govern Narna, but kick off that plan by tunneling and then randomly deciding not to lynch him after all right at the end? there's no evidence of pre-planning. it's too messy.

I think the plan shifted in the long twilight given the lack of town cohesion.

what does that mean.
there was town cohesion in the Narna lynch, as you keep saying. he was run up very fast. what would change things during twilight?

actually. why would scum, if possessing a governor, not plan to use it to protect their buddies? if Leon really wanted to look town, it would have been better to let his buddy Narna get lynched, then govern town on another day. this plan of action doesn't really save Narna, who still isn't making it to lylo, and makes Leon look terrible if Narna is scum.

[Not Chara]

SlySly: where did you get that lynchpool? it's missing Shiro, for one.

It's the living who haven't claimed.

oh, thank you.

[Not Chara]

those voting me should say why. i'm sure you all have very good reasons. if you're town, explain where you're coming from so you don't get mislynched after i die. and if you're scum, i'd like you to talk about why you're voting me as

much

as possible.

those townreading me: i've never been more sure about a read. Titus is scum, absolutely. this isn't confbiased town. busy now, more later.

related but unrelated: is the notion that i'm scum with Leon and Narna funny to anyone else?

i would compromise on Shiro and Giovanni if they built up, but i'd much rather focus on Titus.
it bears repeating: vote one of us two. if you won't vote me, vote Titus.

Firebringer, i'd say your vote confuses me the most. are you scum?

[Not Chara]

i forgot Giovanni claimed weak. i wouldn't lynch that.

[Not Chara]

Titus, why are you telling me who not to lynch? i'm scum. when i flip scum, my reads won't matter. :>

[Not Chara]

Not Chara, you never did explain your Creature read.

i thought my sarcastic response was enough to tell you to ISO me and ctrl-f Creature. go on.

pedit: Shiro isn't unlynchable.
tell me, how did Narna go from being a townread to being confscum?

[Not Chara]

by your logic, i'm protecting my buddies, and my buddies are protecting me, since my wagon is entirely town. you should be able to find them pretty easily that way.

why is Firebringer town?

[Not Chara]

Firebringer is town.

of course he is, he's on the Not Chara wagon.
but, seriously... why? he voted me because 'the powers that be made him do it'. and no one questions that at all?

[Not Chara]

no. pretending to not know why i was scumreading Creature won't work.
more recently, the read stagnated somewhat, and him and Shiro both voting you leave me to wonder if neither want to be on my mislynch.
why don't you articulate your read on me.

pedit: when did Firebringer become a townread for you? he was listed as a scumread, along with me, then... what, suddenly he's definitely town? what sort of progression is that?

[Not Chara]

oh, correction. why did i think Shiro was voting Titus? they're not voting.

[Not Chara]

this is painful

i really wouldn't mind shifting focus to Shiro but. i'm just so

sure

Titus is going to flip scum. and i'm sick of seeing green flips. most of your reads are in line with mine, honestly. barring Narna, which owes a great deal to Titus.

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Shiro

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Creature

[Not Chara]

I just feel like Leonshade had enough town cred that opening himself up to be scumread for governing Narna would be a bad move. I don't feel like Narna's claimed role is THAT critical for scum to keep around and waste town cred over.

i agree with this.

those scumreading Almost: i'd like to vouch for him. he wouldn't avoid posting because he's scum. more likely, he's been busy, so you aren't seeing the activity that might be usual for him. plus, Gamma was town.

if Titus won't become a healthy wagon, Shiro and Creature are fine options.

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Shiro

[Not Chara]

Maxous, Andrius, SlySly, Ankamius, Titus? i believe. i have a problem with Andrius, who i believe is third party, and... well, it's obvious where the other issue is. she's been calling herself the weakest oart of the townblock for a while. apparently that's why i've been trying to lynch her

Leon, i already tried that. i have no idea how to get Titus lynched today, but good vote.

my scumread on Creature has sort of... vanished. he's been more present today, and looking back, i really do believe he was improperly reading the thread for a large portion of the game. Creature, what changed in this game for you?

VOTE: Titus
Cakez, when did you think you'd moved your vote?

[Not Chara]

wait, doesn't massive have a clear result from Narna's ability? lynching him before Narna's flip would be bad play.

[Not Chara]

criteria for lynching is now known: disagreeing with Titus/Andrius, and being lynchable. good to know.

did i completely miss where massive was being spoken about as scum? i can't remember when this was brought up.

pedit: i know, i'm asking what changed. if it was just having more time, or if it was the gamestate. i'd be interested in knowing.

..is that your lynch list? it's almost entirely townreads, plus Titus.

[Not Chara]

i'd avoid direct comparison of meta between wildly different games.

Fire, why are you still voting a player you're townreading? i've asked this before, but it seems Fire hasn't been keeping up.

Andrius: i was under the impression that lurking was normal for massive

[Not Chara]

he's already said his vig-claim was trolling.

[Not Chara]

no, seriously. when did Firebringer become hard town to you, Titus?

[Not Chara]

I have a feeling Maxous is different compared to The Walking Dead Season Finale mafia.

again, this logic shouldn't be applied. it's incredibly weak meta. there are many more factors that aren't alignment that affect how a player posts from game to game.

[Not Chara]

Almost is town.

let's consolidate on these vanity wagons.

[Not Chara]

you think scum!Almost is taking refuge in absurdity?

[Not Chara]

chara you got the evil eyes!
It actually looks good.

<3

Fire, i do have questions for you! why are you voting me as if you have no other choice? why did Titus perform a 180 on you?

[Not Chara]

Have you ever heard about the word "moderate"??? Cuz it seems this town either posts too much or not at all!

haha. i should do my part too.

i can't let go of my read on Titus. you and Nahdia have her as town, but whenever i try to look for that behaviour, i can't find it.

i could join you on Creature again, and realistically i know there's multiple scum.

Leon: you're on Titus as well. i'm on my phone, so apologies for asking. what's your Creature read?

i'll say again: even if i'm wrong on Narna, i'm incredibly confident that Leon is town. and that has nothing to do with scum Narna's hypothetical role.

i think i was asked about a defense of Almost? he was being voted, and since wr need every vote we can get, i don't see the issue in communicating that Almost is very likely town.

[Not Chara]

You are not really convincing me of you being town or if I am wrong protown NC.

There's only one person I doubt on your wagon. You aren't looking to solve your wagon though fmpov.

Show me I am wrong. I want to be wrong.

If you think your wagon minus me is town, what do you think you're doing wrong?

i'm not trying to convince you, you're my strongest scumread.

but i don't think discussion is ever bad. for one, i

am

trying to solve my wagon. besides yours, Firebringer's vote is suspicious to me because as far as i knew, he was either townreading me and sort-of townreading you, or sort-of townreading both. i don't understand who's strong-arming him into choosing this, and he hasn't been engaging with me on the topic despite my questions.
i still think Andrius is third party, but the rest of my wagon (including SlySly) is likely town. some of Maxous's recent opinions/moves have bothered me, but i don't see him as scum with you. if you're town, that's where i'd look.

i'm not sure what i'm doing wrong. being scumread as town as part of the game. and according to several other players who are townreading me, i'm also doing something right.
where i'm wrong has been on my flipped reads so far, undoubtedly. at the time, i was happy about it, but now i wish Narna's lynch had just gone through so we could move pas this. what i can't abide is lynching Leon being the answer.

why do you want to be wrong? i don't understand the sentiment.

[Not Chara]

i'm not sure how i feel to be told i'm doing nothing, but alright.
i don't really have a reason... not to townread massive? or to lynch him before Narna, who's claimed an innocent result. if he flips scum, by all means, massive is no longer cleared of anything.

i also... forgot massive had voted me, entirely, until i went to check his ISO in response to your question just now. in your opinion, provided Narna is scum, what's the utility in claiming an innocent on a partner when Narna wasn't in a fantastic position, reads-wise? or do you think he thought he'd be able to dodge the rope?

i've come to understand a reason for Fire's behaviour, based on yours. i wish he'd said something in response to me, still.

[Not Chara]

Dammit Shiro

I am Gerson - Psychologist

I can investigate a player every night and find out if they have or have had the ability to kill up until that point. So Massive has had no ability to kill as of n2, and therefore he is town.

are you talking about my Creature read? i'm still willing to go back there, but i confess i was annoyed at being asked to talk about him, as if i hadn't already. it would be like someone saying to me 'oh, were you scumreading Shiro?', in my opinion. i can go back and talk about Creature again.

[Not Chara]

i think i said my scumread of Creature vanished. i take it back. he's been posting better, sure, but i still disagree with nearly all of his reads, and he's still citing very weak meta as reasons for them. Shiro read, as an example.

before that, it was his constant, constant dodging of my questions.

to reiterate, since the two above posts were made while i was typing that:

this is not the day for VCA

.

i'm considering jumping ship to Creature, because this is ridiculous.
see his posts today, specifically the answers to me. concern about how he looks more than just playing the game. taking an eternity to respond to questioning because he

really

wanted to think about his answer. very little scumhunting.

i think that sums it up. 'not reading' can only take one so far, and that behaviour is simply an NIA explanation, not an excuse.
before then, it was the whole issue with Cakez. Creature admitted he didn't read the spoiler, that he simply saw it and thought 'oh, Chara is proposing a Cakez wagon, i could go there'. this is with a prior townread on the slot. it reeks.

..why did i even let go of that? i was concentrating too much on you and Shiro.

[Not Chara]

...i'm willing to try for the day. i don't have the drive to continue pressing you right now.

for what reasons do you scumread Creature? or have you already said.

[Not Chara]

and what do you think about my reasons?

personally, i'm not sold on the BoP point. i suppose it could get stronger when combined with his weak meta points.
can you quote posts of his that feel like he's faking suspicion?

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Creature
happy to oblige.

massive: ...wagon hopping with little reason is anti-town in general. you disagree?

[Not Chara]

has it really been three days? oh dear.

i don't want to lynch Leonshade, i also don't want to lynch Creature. but i do want to lynch Narna, curiously enough.
obviously, he isn't to be lynched.

who's left? is it just me? i feel like Creature is the only option, but he's giving me second thoughts.
i'd rather Shiro, but we're running out of time, and i've been gone for a while. longer than i meant to be.

[Not Chara]

okay, Cakez.
VOTE: Leon
on me for giving in if Leon is town.

[Not Chara]

You phucks don't want a lynch.

Fuck that noise. I will hammer Leon if I have to (because he's lylo lynchbait) but I modded a game once with a dumb as bricks governor. Want to know what happened? This.

so you had nothing to say about this before. when you were calling me scum for not wanting to lynch 'obvscum Leon', and not thinking critically. if you're town, i'm giving up.

[Not Chara]

this game has gone a bit off the rails, in my opinion. i'm jealous of the scumteam, because this would be really funny to be a part of if i were scum.
well. we might have been off the rails from the beginning.

[Not Chara]

i'm not really referring to the end of day, i'm referring to the whole game.
we can't both know something that i know to be false.

if you're town, you're just wrong, and if you're scum, i commend you on being impossible to lynch at any point in this game. i'm no longer confident enough in a read to really press them. for example, i'm pretty sure Cakez is town, but i don't know why he's so confident in the townread on me. i feel the same about Nahdia.
Almost is a townread i'm actually very confident in. and really, i still think Leon is town. and Narna. it's just that logic is telling me Narna is scum.

and Andrius's grandiose posturing has looked so incredibly fake this entire game, but i can't think of that being a good reason to just lynch someone. i was wrong on Magna, too. Menno, i'm not sure if i ever thought he was really scum, but it seemed to make sense. and i zig-zag on you only because i keep thinking your terrible decisions can't be the result of good scumplay, so you must be wrong town. but could you be

this/

off base? it's just hard to tell.

pedit: could you give the rest of the count? i'm liable to miscount something if i tried.

[Not Chara]

i mean, i've been just as wrong so far, so i suppose i can't really say anything if you're town here.
i wonder if we'll no-lynch. will Leon flipping really help things? the more i think about it, the more his govern really did screw town. if

he's town, i'm the next lynch. if Titus is scum, she's using this time to not look terrible after the Leon lynch.
if he's scum, fantastic. but it doesn't feel like that's going to happen?

[Not Chara]

i've been calling Shiro scum for a while. not that it matters.

i wasn't saying you were going to chain anything. it's simple fact that i'm the next lynch on the table after Leon, unless something changes.
and: explaining to me why i'm scum isn't entirely helpful. i'll certainly help you on a Shiro lynch tomorrow. or help you bus Shiro. i don't know.

where's the scum that was trying to protect you for towncred? i'm curious.

[Not Chara]

damn, i missed this. how did the Leon wagon happen? Titus vs. Not Chara was a much healthier gamestate. Leon is just messy policy.

[Not Chara]

hello, Andrius. there still might be time for a lynch on me. as long as you're filled with

determination

. wouldn't it be funny if my role was Chara?

pedit: you forgot me. i don't really have objections to the ones there either.

[Not Chara]

hello, Andrius. there still might be time for a lynch on me. as long as you're filled with

determination

. wouldn't it be funny if my role was Chara?

pedit: you forgot me. i don't really have objections to the ones there either.

You're grandstanding and vindictive with a decent shot of being scum (better than Leon), but I am more confident in the list above.

it's all just a game, in the end. i don't think vindictive is the right word here. it isn't at though i'm out to punish the town.

i have to wonder what scum

would

be feeling vindictive. like i said, if i was scum, i'd be very happy with the gamestate. i mean, i've managed to dodge the lynch for three days due to being townread by a good chunk. at least, enough to keep me away from the rope. in that way, Titus, our positions are the same.

[Not Chara]

No
I don't care about flavor
I just want to lynch scum
And worse comes worse we lynch the governor
Even if town
He can't screw us out of a lynch again
Sigh

it was more of a joke about my name than anything else, combined with you scumreading me.

i guess Andrius is town.

[Not Chara]

Titus and andrius look super scummy today. Especially titus...

Leon is obvtown. That post where he calls out titus for claiming my role was too strong to be real, yet not good enough to clear massive was the best post of the phase.

Titus has been called out on similar logical errors. she's usually been able to talk her way out of them by vouching for the validity of both sides of the issue.

Grandstanding is definitely the right word.

and i didn't deny that! c=

[Not Chara]

I'm starting a petition to make pardoning someone a policy lynch because goving town is anti town as fuck.

is there precedent for useful governs? when you think about it, it's almost negative utility. forcing the lynch away from the popular choice by one player's demand... at best, it's stopping town from lynching town that will be lynched another day, and at worst, it's stopping a lynch on scum.

[Not Chara]

unsure. in one corner, i'm Leon's buddy, defending him. in the other, i'm scum who was scrambling to look good when town Leon received backlash for his govern.
;>

VOTE: Creature
i'll be here until deadline. no need to worry on the last votes.

[Not Chara]

don't shoot Almost.

[Not Chara]

but now that i think of it. Almost, Cakez

did

call you scum recently, it's in his ISO.

[Not Chara]

sorry. seems i'm falling asleep after all.
VOTE: Leon

[Not Chara]

Is that seriously a thing.

fairly sure that was a joke on SlySly's part, Andrius.

[Not Chara]

Titus, i don't understand you voting Shiro here. i don't see you suddenly trusting Narna's results like this.

[Not Chara]

Almost is town.
VOTE: Maxous

[Not Chara]

you skipped all of the posts there where Gamma actually explains why he changes the read.

[Not Chara]

Nahdia: i forgot about that.

UNVOTE:

[Not Chara]

you know. i don't really want to lynch Creature at all at this point. at all.

VOTE: Titus

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Narna

[Not Chara]

If Narna is lynched and flips town, someone who was actively pushing for Leon and Narna lynch will hang.

Your vote doesn't match with your words Creature scum.

how does this not match with his vote on you?

[Not Chara]

If Narna is lynched and flips town, someone who was actively pushing for Leon and Narna lynch will hang.

Your vote doesn't match with your words Creature scum.

how does this not match with his vote on you?

He's saying rope the Leonpushers, yet I saw Leon was town and began pushim Creature wagon, which died.

that isn't what happened. you had Leon as scum in 5073. then you don't mention him again until you vote him in 5472, then vote me. your decision to settle on Creature was not prompted by 'Leon is probably town' or 'Leon could be town'.
it isn't until 5155 that you say Leon is town, and by then the lynch on him is inevitable, so all you gain from that is towncred.

[Not Chara]

Nah, that's a bonus.

When scum saw someone was not voting in the Narna/Shiro dichotomy, they went crazy trying to fuel any wagon but Narna.

Snarky was not getting rope today.

i voted you there because you voting Snarky didn't follow from your feelings yesterday.
i don't know about the others.

[Not Chara]

5515 is what i meant to type.

[Not Chara]

Nah, that's a bonus.

When scum saw someone was not voting in the Narna/Shiro dichotomy, they went crazy trying to fuel any wagon but Narna.

Snarky was not getting rope today.

i voted you there because you voting Snarky didn't follow from your feelings yesterday.
i don't know about the others.

You voted Maxous before voting me, both occurring after my Snarky vote. The maxous vote is just bad given his clear by Giovanni.

i'd forgotten Maxous was clear. after thinking things over during night 3, i thought that i'd dismissed him as town for no good reason and didn't like his play. and then moved to you (for reasons explained) because i'd been reminded of his clear.

[Not Chara]

*shrug* It's pretty clear what I thought and the fracture off of obvious scum or nesscessary lynch is done by scum.

could you reword this? i don't think your intentions were clear until you made the post explaining why Leon was town.

[Not Chara]

so what were your intentions? wait to explain that Leon was obvious town until after his lynch was inevitable? what did you gain from holding that information to yourself, exactly?

[Not Chara]

i don't feel that you had any interest in stopping the Leon wagon. explaining why Leon was town by your analysis while pushing Creature might have helped votes actually move there, instead of staying on Leon.

[Not Chara]

@SirCakez, I think Narna's fake.

I do not practically count as an investigative, and I knew it the minute McMemno claimed. A lot of the investigative are nerfed like that. The others are leashable.

For instance, we can force Shiro to target Leon because his role is the source of a lot of debate and Narna (although probably scum) we can force them to check Shiro. That way when Narna gets lynched tomorrow we either get an almost rock solid result or they have to make associative tells that help solve the divide.

why would Narna ever check Shiro? why, oh why, could that possibly happen?

[Not Chara]

i don't feel that you had any interest in stopping the Leon wagon. explaining why Leon was town by your analysis while pushing Creature might have helped votes actually move there, instead of staying on Leon.

So, you ignore plain english, don't ask why (and still don't) and blame me for you not listening. Yet, you know why I felt Creature was scum.

Meanwhile, you ignored this pattern repeatedly about scum not voting major wagons and hoping town get into apathy.

what do you mean 'don't ask why'? i've asked why you didn't say Leon was town earlier. i know why you felt creature was scum, for a time i agreed with you. we're not talking about creature.

pedit: how would Narna know the specifics of Shiro's miller role?

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Titus
lynch Narna all you like. i won't be part of it.

[Not Chara]

whoever that was wants Narna lynched.

[Not Chara]

so you think they... didn't want Narna lynched? or perhaps were just using their power because they wanted to? conclusions have to be drawn from

somewhere

.

[Not Chara]

Not Chara, do you think Shiro and Titus are a scum team?

yes, that would make sense.

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Narna
i'm bad at mafia.

[Not Chara]

Creature can be next.
no idea why Titus's townflip means i'm scum, according to SirCakez.

[Not Chara]

Wait, wait, let's discuss what has just transpired. Lay down the pitchforks.

Why in hell would the scumteam kill Titus? It makes absolutely no. fucking. sense. She was been scumread and she would have been a prime lynch candidate even today. She could easily be the wagon opposite supposed scum!Narna.

Why Asriel Dreemurr is not attached to a scum role? Then who can be scum, flavor wise? Asgore I can get being Town, but why Asriel is not scum?

Titus was one of my neighbors.
That should explain a lot.

Anyone posting without a vote on Narna is claiming they are her scumbuddy.

How the fact that Titus was your neighbor is in any way relevant? How could scum know that she is your neighbor?

More importantly, I targeted Narna last night and got an investigative action result. Also, I am not dead.

Giovanni is Weak and we've seen no evidence of night action shenanigans. this is an odd result.

Narna would also need to explain how he got a guilty on Shiro even after discussing that a Miller wouldn't return a positive to Narna's investigate. i'm sort of floored by this result.

[Not Chara]

Town is getting trolled. Nahdia is/was not able to kill a player.

explain your Shiro result.

[Not Chara]

Giovanni not dying after targeting Narna makes sense IF THEYRE BOTH SCUM.
He is trying to get us to step back from the NARNA LYNCH.

i buy this. only reason Giovanni was taken out of the lynchpool was his weak claim.

[Not Chara]

Creature can be next.
no idea why Titus's townflip means i'm scum, according to SirCakez.

because of your battle with Titus
Also A50 is next, not creature

you agreed with me to a point that Titus was acting scummy, but as soon as she flips town that's invalidated? i don't believe you.
and Almost is town.

[Not Chara]

You know Flowey, right? Asriel and Flowey, I think, are the same person. One is clearly evil and the other clearly good (as the game made out Asriel to be). This only occurred to me after reviewing some Undertale, and now I regret lynching Shiro for that flavor claim.
Correct me if I am wrong.

bit of an oversimplication here. also not sure what this is really in response to.

scum could just have town flavour claims, there's plenty of precedent for that. it's also possible that in addition to Gaster and Chara, other characters were used as antagonists. it could be nearly anyone if spun the right way. Mettaton and Muffet, for example. the Mad Dummy.

[Not Chara]

Can we stop the flavor speculation?
Please?

fine. let's just lynch Narna.

pedit: sure, why not.

[Not Chara]

I'm not trying to rain on your happiness if this is your jam but we need DEAD SCUM desperately and we're at 250 pages and flavor spec is so not useful right now.

I am truly sorry if I'm being a killjoy.

you're not, really. suddenly i just find myself agreeing with you. Titus flipping town killed what little motivation i had left.

[Not Chara]

Titus was a vanilla cop and my role is just as useless. scum being able to look for a vig is not a stretch.

[Not Chara]

I just want this to end.
This game of mafia is basically about suffering.
Those of us left have to suffer and we basically have to learn to suffer together.
And I, for one, am being terrible at suffering with all of you. Namely Fire and you, NC.
if nothing more this will be a personal learning experience for me.

i feel like i only got half of the meaning you meant here.

[Not Chara]

can we just. let's just massclaim. while voting Narna. the number of players with unclaimed roles is low anyway.

[Not Chara]

I took off my mask for a bit here.


Massclaim is likely not going to solve anything though.
Scum has a huge advantage right now, massclaim will not change that.
DEAD NARNA WILL THOUGH

that's fair.

[Not Chara]

Nahdia, you are doing a very good job of killing my townread. just vote Narna. how do you even confirm a player with a jailkeep?

pedit: Yoshi's town, by the by.

peditx2: haha.

[Not Chara]

but narna's right, I can't kill :T

i'm sure i'll find your joking cute some other time. :>

[Not Chara]

a universal miller, that is.

Narna said he asked Skullduggery about this possibility.

[Not Chara]

Big news from the mod god. I just needed to word my question a little better. A miller would not return as having the ability to kill if they lacked that ability.

Vote: Shiro

Ank what did you ask Skullduggery when inquiring about your miller status?

[Not Chara]

If Narna flips scum, then come at me

weak roles don't get false innocents.
Giovanni is a good after-Narna wagon. if we aren't all doomed, i mean.

[Not Chara]

Spoiler:

are you really feeling the effects of this game when you replaced Snarky? are you just jumping on the apathy bandwagon?

[Not Chara]

i had to run the image through an editor to see the hidden Gaster.

if Narna flips town, i'm voting Draw.

[Not Chara]

VOTE: Draw

[Not Chara]

oh, you know. it's this and that.

[Not Chara]

Shiro the rolecop said Cakez was likely town.
Narna scum requires Giovanni scum, he claimed a Weak clear on Narna.

pedit: Nahdia is the correct spelling, and so you've seen the claims, good.

[Not Chara]

Giovanni lying means Giovanni scum. busdriven Giovanni requires a busdriver no one has seen any evidence of.
all investigatives so far have their results returned properly with names, and while this game is bastard due to certain mechanics i very much doubt we would be being purposely mislead with how night results are worded, by an experienced mod who just made the long post above.

aside from that, i just wanted to make sure you had the investigations and such taken into account.

[Not Chara]

i've no idea.

(35) Although this is a bastard game, I can promise a few things:
I will never intentionally mislead you or flat-out lie to you about anything.
If you ask me a question, I will answer you truthfully.
All of the information contained in your role PM is trustworthy. Your role functions as described.

i'm simply going by the first post. any more is unsupported setup speculation, such as my belief that Frisk can switch alignments, or something to that nature.

pedit: Giovanni voting Narna and saying such things as "if Narna flips scum", are what make me think both being scum is a good possibility. that and Giovanni only getting a pass because of his Weak claim.

[Not Chara]

'when they could have just bussed Narna'. if Narna is scum, he's already caught, so him faking a guilty to get a townie lynched (which worked, i might add) is a perfectly reasonable thing to do.

[Not Chara]

theory: scum are trying to confirm each other for the win. if we dismiss ever scum member as town by role or confirmation, or 'there's no reason to suspect scum would try and inno each other' a town lynch is inevitable.

fits with scum having control of the game.

[Not Chara]

N1 - Shiro
N2 - Nahdia
N3 - Not Chara
N4 - Creature.

For disclosure

i wasn't blocked on night 3.

[Not Chara]

the best evidence for town Narna right now is him never claiming to be roleblocked, in my opinion.

[Not Chara]

i'm waiting for a response right now.

[Not Chara]

Nahdia, were you the one who said a massclaim wouldn't help us?

[Not Chara]

another question: where did Firebringer claim neighbourizer where Nahdia could see? i don't remember that claim.

besides massive's role and Cakez, the unclaimed players are myself, BigYoshiFan, Creature, Peregrine. am i forgetting anyone?

[Not Chara]

if i was trying to sling mud, i would have checked first. it was a question.

[Not Chara]

But Maxous' action on Night 3 failed and I didn't target anyone, I shouldn't have been able to be redirected that night. That would still need an explanation.

This is all wild speculation. I need scumhunting dammit.

i'm curious as to why you immediately believed me when i said i hadn't been roleblocked night 3.

is it just a strange thing to lie about as scum?

[Not Chara]

that said, being redirected every night is a possibility. and would account for the third roleblock ability. if Maxous was redirected, it would explain why i wasn't blocked.

[Not Chara]

Almost: i'm beginning to have doubts about you. what are you attempting to do this game? can you refresh me on who's scum?

Maxous: Nahdia did claim day 1, so if they're town scum could have safely redirected (yourself as well, if it happened) without ever hitting an investigative by accident.

[Not Chara]

to avoid casting suspicion on Nahdia and/or Maxous for roleblocking investigatives? because targets have been telegraphed? because one or more of the investigatives are scum? it could be any number of things. i think we've reached the limits of this line of thinking without a massclaim. i keep bringing it up as an option because the number of unclaimed/hinted players is very small.

[Not Chara]

roleblock situation: it was just confirmed to me that i was absolutely not roleblocked on night 3, in case that was in doubt

Almost: okay. though i had a second question. ;> who are the scum?
i agree with Ankamius. Peregrine is town.

[Not Chara]

Giovanni: ask Skullduggery about your possibly being roleblocked. if you're an investigative, you should know whether you were roleblocked, or if your target simply did nothing.

[Not Chara]

what do you mean 'hasn't been affected by the mood of the game', Nahdia? besides Andrius, who here is reacting strongly or with hopelessness, and where do you get the feeling that i'm not as without direction as you seem to be?

i'm just wondering how you got that impression. or why i should have reacted by saying i was turning the heat up on you, or something, when i wasn't doing that in the first place? i was wrong on both counts after i asked about it, so it would of course have amounted to nothing.

[Not Chara]

i'm confused as to how Giovanni isn't clear on whether no action was performed, or if he was blocked. i can say with a hundref percent certainty, a simple question to the mod about the result can confirm that. unless Giovanni's is some kind of needlessly bastard role that gives vague results in those situations. which would be silly, none of the other investigations are like that.

pedit: i'm fine with trusting Mathblade.

[Not Chara]

a) doubtful. who would be empowering me and not claiming it? what point would there even be to that? i was unclaimed as an investigative until today.
b) i just had to ask the mod for clarification to be

sure

i wasn't roleblocked. my role is simple and easy to understand.
c) this is the only one that holds water.
d) this didn't happen, if it had the mod would have said something when i asked about it.

pedit: oh, there you go.

[Not Chara]

if Narna is "misunderstanding" his role there is gonna be war

- -

Alrighty. I already did Nahdia was redirected or a liar for night four.

none of this explains how *I* could be scum based on Night 4 actions.
If Nahdia was re-directed they were re-directed by somebody not me.

but w/e. This argument is done.

did i miss something where it was said that if there's a scum redirector, it has to be Maxous?

[Not Chara]

do you think i'm scum, Maxous?

what prompted you to propose that Leon was scum governing his buddy?

[Not Chara]

my god. you have to be specific when speaking to Skullduggery. very. specific. i've been told now that i really have no way of knowing whether i had been roleblocked or if there was just no result to get. meaning test roleblocks on me are rather useless.

as was most of today's discussion. the way investigations are being resolved with roleblocks is explicitly non-normal in this setup.

i'm taking a break from night actions. hopefully someone was given interesting alignment info from reactions to this regardless.

[Not Chara]

sorry. i must have asked in the wrong way, and i asked again in a different way earlier just to be sure.

[Not Chara]

i didn't misread my role. i didn't ask the right questions when checking with the mod to see if i'd been roleblocked or not. my role as i received it in the original PM, of course didn't contain any information about what results i would receive if i were roleblocked.

i can't confirm or deny if i was roleblocked night 3, or not.

the result i got is a result, but it seems my results don't differentiate between being roleblocked, and simply nothing happening that night.

i'll be back later to read up.

[Not Chara]

Skullduggery is resolving abilities in decidedly non-normal fashion. i agree that looking at the wiki definition for miller wouldn't exactly help here, and that's Almost's point.

[Not Chara]

the result i got is a result, but it seems my results don't differentiate between being roleblocked, and simply nothing happening that night.

Let me try to make this even clearer: Assuming you were a Tracker (which is probably not true, but is a hypothetical assumption to get the point through) you'd get "You saw NOTHING" whether our target had no night action or you were locked, so you cannot differentiate between the two. Am I correctly understanding this?

yes, that's exactly it.

[Not Chara]

i'm having trouble keeping this information in my head. the most i've gotten from this is Mathblade being town.

[Not Chara]

i don't know the count, but i saw Maxous's claim. can i vote, Math?

[Not Chara]

even if he's telling the truth, he can win with scum and scum are winning. by his own win condition he's going to play anti-town.

VOTE: Maxous

[Not Chara]

Almost: no one can be insane because it's a hidden modifier. Skullduggery was explicit in saying our roles function as described. i'm believing the mod on this, and you should too.

[Not Chara]

why would an insane Narna's flip confirm anything? if Narna doesn't know he's insane, i doubt he would flip as insane.

[Not Chara]

Almost: no one can be insane because it's a hidden modifier. Skullduggery was explicit in saying our roles function as described. i'm believing the mod on this, and you should too.

Like I said, I do not care to explain how it happened for now. We will learn about that later. All I know is this IS scum Mathblade, and Creeps, Nahdia & Yoshi are the rest of the team. I also know Maxous is anti-town regardless because of the way our win-con was worded. Go check your own PM and verify "all NON-TOWN" is in your win-con. He admitted to being non-Town, so he gets lynched today.

P.S. THIS from someone who usually defends 3P survivours.

'we will learn about that later'. that's weak. unless you're proposing someone gifted Narna with insanity, it doesn't make sense. i know you're hinting at something, but if you don't explain what i'm not going to trust you on it, and definitely won't lynch a good townread because of it.

Maxous is anti-town, i do agree with you and want him lynched. there's just simply no way Narna is insane.

pedit: well, i doubt that's the case.

[Not Chara]

there isn't anything you can't reveal now if you claim to have the scumteam on lock. if it would really win the game for us.

[Not Chara]

Almost: Narna would know if they got a fake guilty through a redirection, our reports have names. i just think your theory has a lot of holes.

[Not Chara]

not to mention accidentally forgetting a name when copying a list is NAI. scum wouldn't be purposely inconsistent with removing their partner from a scumlist while quoting that scumlist, for no reason.

[Not Chara]

there isn't anything you can't reveal now if you claim to have the scumteam on lock. if it would really win the game for us.

We do not have a single scum flip to build on. NOTHING. They COULD have a Framer, but that would require them guessing who Narna would check beforehand. Otherwise they may have a redirector, and that doesn't needs knowledge of the target beforehand, but needs Narna NOT to be checking on scum (in which case the probabilities are on their side because the Town has a majority still, even assuming Narna never outs his reads and picks randomly).

not what i'm referring to. your theory has holes, and unfortunately i can't trust it. i won't be voting Mathblade, Narna being redirected is impossible, him being insane is impossible unless you have concrete reason to think otherwise, and by your admission Framer is very improbable. i don't see the basis for your theory besides having Math, Nahdia, and Creeps as scum, and wanting Narna's results to fit.

well, that and wanting your intepretation of how Shiro's miller role works to be correct. it's easy for Shiro or someone to ask a question or interpret something differently and think he wouldn't be a universal miller. simply put, we don't know.

[Not Chara]

Almost: Math isn't scum, they're just wrong. we've all been really wrong. and please acknowledge the point about redirectors messing with investigatives.

[Not Chara]

....No. That is ridiculous. As I explained already. You are bringing up bad arguments again. Go to sleep. Read a book. Do something else and come back later.

one thing throwing me off right now, Math. this isn't how i'd talk to a solid scumread of mine.

[Not Chara]

Math's reads, some of them, are wrong, but everything they've said mechanically is sound. and.. to be fair, i haven't seen you concede your theory except to say that you did to Math just now.

of course, from your pov, math is wrong on your alignment. that's mafia. it's not grounds to dismiss their other logic, and certainly isn't a point against anything.

[Not Chara]

If you think that is wrong explain why.

Because I received a TOWN ROLE. You can't convince me that I'm not Town no matter how hard you try. I mean, you can convince the whole site; not just the players in this game, but there are TWO people you won't ever convince and these are myself and Skullduggery!

Math was referring to other scumreads besides the one on you.

trust me on this, would you? even if i'm wrong and Math

is

scum, the logic of your accusations doesn't follow. having bad reads doesn't make someone scum, this game has proven that plenty.

Narna: if a miller wouldn't mess with you, the only other explanation is Shiro being framed, and as a claimed miller that's exceptionally unlikely. are you sure your questions didn't seem correct but really have issues? i made the same dumb mistake by being too specific in one case, and too vague in another, when asking questions.

[Not Chara]

This a50 is reminding me of caught a50 in deathnote mafia.

this would be a lot easier if that was the case.

1) his theorizing in that game was more grounded in mechanics that were actually possible, though it was an attempt at replicating his town meta. and this wasn't my influence, because he was doing that on his own.

2) i doubt he'd resort to a tactic i just saw him try as his hydra partner in this game.

3) besides that, they don't look similar to me. can you be more specific.

[Not Chara]

Would a miller return as is/was capable of killing even if they could not kill.

Nope nope nope they wouldn't

'a miller'. we're not talking about the wiki's miller, we're talking about the miller in this bastard game. was Skull answering for the generic 'miller' or for a universal miller? or did you specifically ask about Shiro's flipped miller role?

pedit: that.

[Not Chara]

@NC:

Well, not responding to you directly should've told I concede and have no argument. If I didn't I do one of two things:

1- Respond back rephrasing my argument (as I was doing with Math a few posts ago);

OR

2- Respond sarcastically ridiculing yours and making it known that I refuse to accept it.

Come on.. you still have a few things to learn about me. Maybe in our NEXT hydra game (which I'm already looking forward to)

sure :>

but can you really fault Mathblade for thinking you weren't listening. if you didn't really respond to me?

[Not Chara]

Ank: can you clarify something for me. earlier you said Narna

would

get a positive result on you. was the situation different?

[Not Chara]

thanks.

[Not Chara]

i don't know, Creeps, i found that the last few pages made me a lot more confident in Yoshi scum.
lines like 'i wanted to get my suspicions down so it wouldn't look like the read came from nowhere.'

[Not Chara]

not sure if i did say anything. i'm not in the habit of leaving a candy trail of reads because i'm worried someone will call me inconsistent. ;>

i can tell you erroneously think that's a scumtell, based on how worried you are about other players thinking you're being inconsistent.

[Not Chara]

no, i'm saying you're worried you'll be thought of as scum for inconsistency, and when i pointed that out all you had to say was that i shouldn't be allowed to say my scumread of you increased, because i hadn't explicitly stated i thought you were scum before had.

you're avoiding the behaviour you think is scummy purposely.

'erroneously' there means you think it's a scumtell and i'm saying that's wrong.

[Not Chara]

Creeps: what's the issue with Mathblade now? sure, the argument with Almost earlier was a bit of a nonsensical back-and-forth, but arguments and pressing are mafia.

But suddenly coming forth with a read you never mentioned isn't inconsistent, it's just sketchy.
I question it because it looks opportunistic. (Yes, you can make the same argument there, go ahead)

now, see. that sentence in brackets just looks like it's there so you aren't called a hypocrite. you're apparently thinking your reads haven't been mentioned before, and thus need explanation,

and

according to your last response to Mathblade, have not given enough reasons for your reads. acknowledging either of those but not rectifying them doesn't make the behaviour a sudden non-issue.
'i'm calling you out for this, feel free to calm me out on the same' isn't scumhunting.

did you actually check my ISO for whether my read on you was out of nowhere or not? how many times are you going to call Mathblade LAMIST and arrogant, as if that's an actual response to a scumread on you? you're going for the player's behaviour as if that's enough to say the scumread is bad. you've also yet to say anything in response to the

reasons

i've outwardly stated for scumreading you.

[Not Chara]

speaking of, Peregrine: you haven't talked about why i'm scum since the pepto/Gaster translations discussion. we have some hours left, let's chat.

pedit: that reminds me of a question. Ankamius, have you played with Mathblade before?

[Not Chara]

speaking of, Peregrine: you haven't talked about why i'm scum since the pepto/Gaster translations discussion. we have some hours left, let's chat.

pedit: that reminds me of a question. Ankamius, have you played with Mathblade before?

It started way back when I kind of expected you to be the flavor master, and to use your flavor skills to try to solve the game. However, a few times when flavor questions came up and we (or at least I) was wondering what it meant (or even could or might mean), you gave nothing.

So I waited, and when speculation came up, you were quiet. That soured me on you from prob-town to prob-scum.

In the last 5000 posts or so, you haven't done anything to change that opinion.
And, except for some sort sprints voting Creature/Math and Giovanni, according to VCs you've always voted to lynch town.

There you have it.

i expected more.

what are you talking about? i've been talking about flavour when thoughts occur to me, but every time i did Andrius jumped down my throat, and it wasn't useful to anything. i thought Shiro was scum for their Asriel claim, and i've been calling the Gaster player anti-town from the get-go. what did you want from me? you had some false expectations that i didn't meet. give me an example.

voting to lynch town is only the legitimate part, because i have been. mainly, because we've only lynched town.

[Not Chara]

I went into exactly where my Mathblade suspicion came from in the neighborhood, so you don't get to lie about it in the main thread.

>tfw ankamius tells me not to tell ppl he's in the neighbourhood
> I act like his main thread posts are all i read
> Tfw scumread for not telling people ankamius posts in the neighbourbood

Your read is gut, pretty sure the "explanation" you gave in the alleyway is nadeup since it's nonsensical, im comfortable telling everyone you're a useless player who ignores real info in favor of dumbass gut reads

quote related.

Ankamius, i asked because it sounds like you just have a problem with Mathblade's tone and style. the only reasoning i've seen from you is that Math gives you bad feelings. apparently there's more in the hood, is there a reason you haven't shared that?

[Not Chara]

is there something you have on Mathblade from earlier on that isn't Math's stubborn misunderstanding of how your role works, of their argument with Almost being suspicious?

related, how do you feel about Yoshi in that case?

[Not Chara]

Mathblade isn't in your hood, what do their arguments have to do with your claimed role?

The way Mathblade has been posting in the thread the last 10 or so pages fits a scum-trying-to-force-a-town-leader role a lot more than anything else.

this logic, is something i can actually follow. it's not really something i agree with for a few reasons, mainly with Yoshi pushing Math, but i can see where you'd get it.

[Not Chara]

i figured that would be what you'd say. the logic sort of feels like: 'assuming Mathblade is scum, their questioning of my role is therefore suspicious'. what math was questioning you on isn't even grounds to lynch you, it's semantics. i'm not convinced why scum wouldn't just shoot you in this case. if they're scared of your role, they can't lynch you by that alone.

can you answer on Yoshi as well?

pedit: Wisdom did try to cement himself as town leader. Mathblade isn't Wisdom. they are so utterly different from each other in their approaches in these two games wonder how you've compared them.

[Not Chara]

right. i answered you there. completely. i don't remember you asking for more, and there was literally no reason to move further with unfounded speculation.

later, all of that spec did matter because it had a lot to do with how i was viewing Andrius's blatant Frisk flavour-tells, which ended up being false. and SlySly's penchant for hammering ended up being unrelated to his role as well, so following that line of logic and suspecting SlySly for it would have gotten us nowhere.

and yes, i

would

expect more from a scumread that you've held all game. your reasoning is, literally, 'Chara didn't flavour-break the game'.

[Not Chara]

why does it feel like everyone posting just ignores the conversations that don't directly involve them?