NY 168: (GAME OVER) The Mod is Dead, Fire and Ice Edition

[PeregrineV]

/confirm

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Maxous

I think we were in a game about this same time last year, and I haven't seen in you a while.

[PeregrineV]

I almost voted Slandaar for being so dang impatient, and because I have nothing to do at the moment, but I'll shut up for now.

Your caution during RVS is noted.

Vote: YuniChikako

[PeregrineV]

Why so slow to the party, PV?

Holidays and work.

[PeregrineV]

Initate Buddy Effect

Mastin is town.

[PeregrineV]

Initate Buddy Effect

Mastin is town.

Yes, but I'm not writing you off as being a cheeky scumbag yet.

OK.

You put the wagon to L-2. Consider yourself a second italicized name on there.

Yeah, after continuing to read, I was somewhat dismayed that the wagon grew so quickly. But then Yuni gave 68. It did not appease my inner suspiciate, so vote remains.

[PeregrineV]

@Mastin- 105 has way too many townreads for a game that is supposed to be multi-scum.

Flip it and say 50% of the "Not Voting" is scum.

[PeregrineV]

@Mastin- 105 has way too many townreads for a game that is supposed to be multi-scum.

Nope! Multiscum doesn't mean "everyone's scum". It just means that there are more scum than normal. With only 19 players, that's pretty damn guaranteed to be three per faction, making six total scum.

Furthermore

, because there's six total scum, I should have ~12 townreads, which is more or less the total you come out with when you look at my post.

Honestly, I think that there's 3-5 scum on the Yunichika wagon now that I think about it (I sincerely doubt both scumreads have the entirety of their teams on there, hilarious as that may be to try ), and that the remaining 1-3 are off it. You're assuming that these numbers are arbitrary, but they're not. You're also assuming that I'm making blind assumptions, but I'm not. Of the [1] voters, the ones that stick out the most to me are Maxous and Matias. Of the Not Voters, they're basically mostly null, but I have ideas on some of them that if true would make them town, ideas I haven't followed through and researched, but which exist all the same.

Yeah, Maxous is your off-the-wagon, meaing you thinking a full HALF of the Yuni voters are scum.

Anything specific about the 5 scummiest?

(And note this is not agreement, this is brain-picking)

[PeregrineV]

I don't understand the Bulb wagon . 1 vote is random . 1 vote is a sheep vote . 1 vote was a vote by other player to try and start a counter-wagon to their own wagon .
@mastin : Why do you think yuni is innocent ?

The 3-vote Bulb wagon?

Do you understand the Yuni wagon, because it seems you do by inference. If you do, please explain it.

[PeregrineV]

Do you understand the Yuni wagon, because it seems you do by inference. If you do, please explain it.

(You're still on it, PV. )

Yeah, but that's different. I didn't like the lack of initial RVS vote when it could have been made, but she explained that.

But then, her bad reads list in 68 means I keep my vote there.

And I'm town, so my reasons are legit.

I want to hear Aptil's thoughts, since her post skipped the biggest wagon to express concern for the tiny 3 person wagon on Bulba.

[PeregrineV]

Prod dodge.

**Too slow.**

[PeregrineV]

Man this game has come to a standstill.

Yiley?

You should vote someone.

[PeregrineV]

Sunday check-in, but Monday is when any real actions happens.

[PeregrineV]

Wanna know who's really coasting this game? PeregrineV. But that's kind of always the case.

Gotta love that the only case made against me was Desperado's and he hasn't responded to my criticisms of it at all.

You call this coasting in 13 pages over a weekend?

Not hardly.

It's funny that you are calling out Toomai when he is looking at your wagon trying to gain information from it.

What information have you gained from your wagon?

[PeregrineV]

Votecount 1.10

0

1

2

3

4

5

6

7

8

9

10

Dry - Fit[6]

-Desperado, Matias, Yiley, mastin2, T S O, Toomai

Yunichikawowwow [4]

- Slandaar, JKLM, PeregrineV, OhGodMyLife

Toomai [2]

- Maxous, Dry-fit

JKLM [2]

- Bulbazak, Garmr

Bulbazak [1]

- ArcAngel9

Desperado [1]

- aptil

Maxous [1]

- Yunichikawowwow

Not Voting [2]

- Antihero, evilpacman18,

With 19 alive, it takes

10[/i]

votes to lynch.

Deadline is on the 23^rd of December 2013 at 10am GMT ((expired on 2013-12-23 10:00:00))

Prodding evilpacman18, OhGodMyLife and ArcAngel9.

V/LA

aptil : to 8/12

[PeregrineV]

.My gut churns when Pereginge V is around as I feel like his not hunting and just is here.

I'm a Zen Buddhist. I don't find scum, they find me.

But for really, what's your opinion on Dry-fit and his wagon?

[PeregrineV]

I was down to lynch Dry-fit when the wagon started but 269 makes him seem town to me. He's not too concerned with his own survival to still scumhunt.

Anyway I'm caught up finally.

Do you think his lack of defense is related in any way to the fact he doesn't have one?

[PeregrineV]

Sorry, no time at work today, will have to try later from home.

[PeregrineV]

I was down to lynch Dry-fit when the wagon started but 269 makes him seem town to me. He's not too concerned with his own survival to still scumhunt.

Anyway I'm caught up finally.

Do you think his lack of defense is related in any way to the fact he doesn't have one?

Do you think not having a defense is scummy?

A defense, or a good offense. My wagon sucks because____________. These are the scum on my wagon because ________________. Let's talk about my reads which are ___________________ because _____________________.

Stuff like that.

[PeregrineV]

I was down to lynch Dry-fit when the wagon started but 269 makes him seem town to me. He's not too concerned with his own survival to still scumhunt.

Anyway I'm caught up finally.

Do you think his lack of defense is related in any way to the fact he doesn't have one?

Do you think not having a defense is scummy?

He does have a defense, it's just mindbogglingly stupid (and scummier than no defense at all).

Wow, missed it. What post?

[PeregrineV]

But for really, what's your opinion on Dry-fit and his wagon?

What's YOURS?

I asked first.

[PeregrineV]

What did you think of Matias' claim, Pere?

Just skimmed back through and didn't see it. Post#?

[PeregrineV]

Mod, I hate to ask this but its family emergency. My uncle is in hospital and not in very good condition. Please replace me out.

Hope everything works out.

[PeregrineV]

Hah, site is back up!

I feel like my Yuni vote is delicious, but want more torque on Dry-fit.

Vote: Dry-fit

[PeregrineV]

Oh God, you didn't catch his softclaim?

Trying so hard not to be a dick right now.

No, but it doesn't matter to me. Point it out later when it's significant.

Unless you think it's fake, but then I guess you'd be voting him....

[PeregrineV]

Saturday checkin- vote good.

[PeregrineV]

I did and still do think Dry-fit is a good lynch. But I think the deadline's far enough away that we have time to generate additional wagons for analysis later.

+1

But who?

And once we massage the wagon, will it get back to Dry-fit if the new wagon isn;t better?

[PeregrineV]

@PeregrineV

Why is Dry-Fit scum again?

1. Lack of response to interogative

Wanna know who's really coasting this game? PeregrineV. But that's kind of always the case.

Gotta love that the only case made against me was Desperado's and he hasn't responded to my criticisms of it at all.

You call this coasting in 13 pages over a weekend?

Not hardly.

It's funny that you are calling out Toomai when he is looking at your wagon trying to gain information from it.

What information have you gained from your wagon?

2. Appeal to Emotion, lack of addressing votes or voters on his wagon ----> (365)

I was down to lynch Dry-fit when the wagon started but 269 makes him seem town to me. He's not too concerned with his own survival to still scumhunt.

Anyway I'm caught up finally.

Do you think his lack of defense is related in any way to the fact he doesn't have one?

3. Attack on OhGodMyLife who appears to be calling both Toomai and Dry-fit scummy & attampted redirection towards JKLM (391)

Hah, site is back up!

I feel like my Yuni vote is delicious, but want more torque on Dry-fit.

Vote: Dry-fit

All in all, a very underwhelming response, as were most of his 10 posts.
Decided to not let him lie low until the heat wears off.

[PeregrineV]

Is antihero a double voter?

Only when he is "Not voting".

[PeregrineV]

Hey let's lynch this not voting fellow he is scummy.

7 days absent. Maybe a prod/replace.

[PeregrineV]

Again, the only person who's given any king of reason for voting me is Desperado. I've tried to address that with him several times. If you guys want hypocrisy to be some kind of ultimate tell of ultimate scumminess that makes someone confirmed scum, it's your funeral. And mine I suppose. No one else has given any real reasoning. Look at mastin ffs, he just keeps going on about how good the wagon looks.

And your play seems to be throwing your hands up in the air going "What can I do?" when you can question the people voting for you before they decide (like me) that your apathy is more scum-motivated and less town frustration at being misread day1.

Formal invite-

@Dry-fit-

Please give your opinion on each person who is voting you. How strong is there case or reason for voting you, both in presentation and strength of argument?

In addition, outside of those players voting you, who are you two strongest townreads and why, and who are your tow strongest scumreads and why?

[PeregrineV]

Uh, I said in my last post I think OGML is town. Did you think OGML's vote was good? And I'm not attempting to redirect to JKLM. I said I needed to look into him, because he's a player with an emerging wagon who's been under my radar. I want to see what hat wagon's about.

I looked at JKLM's iso, and I knew I didn't remember much of anything he's said this game, but I didn't realize just how little he's offered. That said he seems just null, I don't think the case against him is too strong. Garmr you may be right about his meta, but I haven't played with JKLM before and I don't trust meta reads from anyone but myself. Too many people just seem to do it wrong. Also Toomai is on that wagon, so there's that. Still think Toomai is significantly more likely to be scum.

So, you are claiming less interest in the Dry-fit wagon, and more interest in the JKLM wagon?
A wagon on town (you) and wagon on null (JKLM)?

Dry - Fit[8]

-Desperado, Matias, Yiley, mastin2, T S O, OhGodMyLife, PeregrineV, JKLM

JKLM [5]

- Bulbazak, Garmr, Toomai, evilpacman18, Maxous

It's a crazy world, so how many scum are on your null-read counterwagon? How many town?

[PeregrineV]

RachMarie is an amazing Person and replaces ArcAngel.

Ok, yeah, she is.

Welcome RachMarie!!

You scum this game?

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Aptil

It was a crappy hammer.

Now, who had Maxous pegged as scum day1?

Also, Merry belated Christmas to everyone!!

[PeregrineV]

Why are crappy hammers scummy?

They are not, always. It depends on how it's done.

Do you really think ice-scum announced their Maxous scumreads and then murdered him? That doesn't seem like good multiscum play to me.

Well, I think a player found Maxous scummy, and said it in the thread. Probably only once, maybe twice at the most. When they realized they couldn't get him lynched, they shut up, because they then figured they would NK him instead.
Granted, this is only speculation, and maybe it was an Ice member that Maxous called scum instead. But, it's a criteria to look for.

[PeregrineV]

The sum of Antihero posts were to vote Dry fit and accuse Toomai.

Why does that earn him death?

[PeregrineV]

Also, slowbrain now, but Maxous' group was the one that shot Antihero.

[PeregrineV]

Happy New Year!

Will catch up later today.

[PeregrineV]

I think I've caught up. Would like to do some more rereading, but probably not going to happen at this point in time.

[PeregrineV]

Lack of votecount + lack of interest

Vote: JKLM

I like Toomai and pacman for town. Mastin is probably town, but

@Mastin- focus on finding scum, sort the teams out as it becomes necessary.

[PeregrineV]

Mastin is probably town, but

@Mastin- focus on finding scum, sort the teams out as it becomes necessary.

How is Mastin town? Because he can post walls?

No, it's more the wall content. He is actually attempting to reach conclusions. Even if they are wrong, I see this as town-Mastin in the trying.

[PeregrineV]

No he hasn't. He already knew what conclusions he wanted to reach, and then made up some BS for each VC so that he could reach them. If you had been paying attention to his posts this game, you should not have been surprised by any of his conclusions.

Yes, he reached those conclusions on weak information, and then tried to bolster them through some VCA. But, he always does that. The fact is you can see HOW he reached his weak conclusions in the first place.

Think of it as putting the cart before the horse. The horse will push instead of pull, and it's not as efficient, but you'll still get to where you are going in the end.

Go look at just his first 11 posts and get back to me with thoughts.

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Desparado

Sorry you got a scum role this game.

[PeregrineV]

You are telling me someone suggesting they don't know it is multiball makes them town. I am saying that actually scum wouldn't come into the game acting like they know it is multiball.

But isn't it a distinct disadvantage for scum to come into a game advertised and titled as multiball and act like it isn't? At best it makes them stand out; at worst it makes it obvious they're only hunting for one opposing group.

Vote: Desparado

Sorry you got a scum role this game.

This is the first non-RVS Desperado vote all game. Explain it.

Vote: Desparado

Sorry you got a scum role this game.

How did you come to that conclusion ?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 9&sr=posts

[PeregrineV]

You are telling me someone suggesting they don't know it is multiball makes them town. I am saying that actually scum wouldn't come into the game acting like they know it is multiball.

But isn't it a distinct disadvantage for scum to come into a game advertised and titled as multiball and act like it isn't? At best it makes them stand out; at worst it makes it obvious they're only hunting for one opposing group.

Vote: Desparado

Sorry you got a scum role this game.

This is the first non-RVS Desperado vote all game. Explain it.

Vote: Desparado

Sorry you got a scum role this game.

How did you come to that conclusion ?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 9&sr=posts

This is a very bad way to answer a question . You are trying to be a smartass here .
What posts made you feel like he is scum ? What contents from a post ? Is it that you feel every word of his was scummy ?

Not being a smartass, but I thought it was self-evident.

Deparado's last post in this game was 5 days 5 hours ago.
Over the course of that time he made 41 posts in 5 other game threads, and 2 non-game threads.
One of those threads is also in New York.

So either he "forgot" about this game over the course of one day, or he's ignoring the thread because he's scum and is hoping to not post.

Of course, there is also other reasons also, which you may now present as to why the above postings have taken place elsewhere but not here.

[PeregrineV]

I scared everyone away.

[PeregrineV]

wait a minute did you posts posts from an ONGOING game Pere

I am still alive but having trouble staying up at the computer due to the superflu.

Trying to catch up in this game and that stood out to me.


DO NOT POST OR LINK TO OR TALK ABOUT ONGOING GAMES.

Not in any way. Clicking on the post shows user's posts they made.

My point still stands.

[PeregrineV]

Vote: Desparado

Sorry you got a scum role this game.

How did you come to that conclusion ?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 9&sr=posts

A better explanation for your vote would be nice.

Deparado's last post in this game at the time I posted that was 5 days 5 hours prior.
Over the course of that time he made 41 posts in 5 other game threads, and 2 non-game threads.
One of those threads is also in New York.

So either he "forgot" about this game over the course of one day, or he ignored the thread because he's scum and is hoping to not post.

Of course, there are also other reasons, which you may now present as to why the above postings took place elsewhere but not here.

[PeregrineV]

@PeregrineV: I've been thinking lately of a FEA block of much towniness.

My reads were kind of off that game, but if we get to the point we can agree on 4+ more players, then sure.

[PeregrineV]

Hey people, I should be caught up soon. Let me know if there's anything in particular you want me to address.

scum Deparado
scum Yuni
scum Gamerantz

Mastins alignment

[PeregrineV]

Hey people, I should be caught up soon. Let me know if there's anything in particular you want me to address.

scum Deparado
scum Yuni
scum Gamerantz

Mastins alignment

Garmantz ????
I am Garmr.
Garmantz is mantisdreamz and I and that's for another ONGOING game.

Also I'm curious why you wrote scum for the first three. Instead of asking PA what she thinks of them can I ask the reason why?

In the course of addressing the scumminess of the above players, I'm sure I'll learn what Penguin thinks of them.
I gave the list so she has the focus she requested in 706.

re: gamerantz
my bad.

Change that to scum Garmr, then proceed.

[PeregrineV]

6 days left.

[PeregrineV]

Got the daystart message, but about to leave for the day. Want to see how the Yuni wagon developed, considering his day2 play was much improved over his day 1 play. Even i saw that, and I thought he was scum day1.

pedit: I have him as a town read.

[PeregrineV]

This sucks, I was playing a pretty decent game too.

You were actually. I thought you were town.

Vote: Evilpacman

[PeregrineV]

Catchup today, but lots of work, so minimal posting.

[PeregrineV]

Catchup today, but lots of work, so minimal posting.

I lied- no time.

[PeregrineV]

feel pretty good about PA and Slaan being town.

This makes Rach Firescum just so everyone knows.

From Firescum perspective when Pacman is confirmed Icescum I look very town because I am not Icescum with Pacman (obviously). Firescum know I am not Firescum (again obviously) hence Firescum will view me as town when they can see I am not Ice which is what has happened here as we get my name lumped in with PA's in her townreads out of nowhere.

You had me at Rachscum.

Vote: RachMarie

[PeregrineV]

Back and not much to change this. Would also vote Desp.

[PeregrineV]

As for Pere his reasoning to vote for me was based on some statements Slaan made early on, sheeping him just on that even though Slaan had not even voted for me just made statements.

So yeah feel pretty good about Aptil and Pere being scum.

Not even sure what this means, but pretty sure that's not the reason you're scum.

But, let's talk about Desp instead. Is he town, ice scum or fire scum?

[PeregrineV]

that's admittedly a good vote.

Is he bussing or voting to kill the other scum?

[PeregrineV]

Why are you white knighting Aptil so much Slaan?

That is not what he said. Yes I did talk about hammers but I did not only complain about hammers. I also did one of the hammers.

Meanwhile I still think Aptil is scum I also think Pere is scum.

Pere as for who is fire and who is ice I really dont know that yet, other than the flipped read. I am just trying to find scum cause whether they are fire or ice they are still scum and we need them gone. Do you have anything else besides Rach is scum and asking me about Des?

I have to find scum one at time.

I suspect one of them might be you.

I suspect another might be Desp.

I'd like to hear what you think about Desp.

[PeregrineV]

He might be, I am not sure because I have misread him every time I have played with him save for the time we were both scum together, then I knew his alignment.

So, when you are scum together, you knew he was scum, so didn't have to read him.

And otherwsie, you are saying he was the opposite of whatever you read him?

Then, problem solved! You give us your Desp read and we will assume the opposite.

Unless of course his play matches the time you were scum together.

[PeregrineV]

Sweet, sweet hammer.

If Desp flips scum then RachMarie is on his team.

Vote: Desparado

[PeregrineV]

I protected Slandaar last night FYI; he's a weaker townread for me and so seemed like a decently more unexpected choice.

Mod: Considering how all previous kills were flavoured as belonging to a team, can you be more specific than "killed" for penguin_alien?

Sorry Mod is sleepy and Forgetful ~JS

well that means fire and ice shot the same person.

I is confused. Please to clear up post 1089.

[PeregrineV]

I have Slaan as a town read could someone please explain their scum read on him?

However I still think Aptil and Pere are scum. Since we are waiting for Aptil's replacement,

VOTE: Pere

Going to look at the flipped scumz and see if I can narrow it more to which team they are on.

Interesting.

Why are you white knighting Aptil so much Slaan?

That is not what he said. Yes I did talk about hammers but I did not only complain about hammers. I also did one of the hammers.

Meanwhile I still think Aptil is scum I also think Pere is scum.

Pere as for who is fire and who is ice I really dont know that yet, other than the flipped read. I am just trying to find scum cause whether they are fire or ice they are still scum and we need them gone. Do you have anything else besides Rach is scum and asking me about Des?

I have to find scum one at time.

I suspect one of them might be you.

I suspect another might be Desp.

I'd like to hear what you think about Desp.

He might be, I am not sure because I have misread him every time I have played with him save for the time we were both scum together, then I knew his alignment.

He might be, I am not sure because I have misread him every time I have played with him save for the time we were both scum together, then I knew his alignment.

So, when you are scum together, you knew he was scum, so didn't have to read him.

And otherwsie, you are saying he was the opposite of whatever you read him?

Then, problem solved! You give us your Desp read and we will assume the opposite.

Unless of course his play matches the time you were scum together.

Then push that tomorrow Bulb we do not have time and a NL is bad juju. ESPECIALLY with two potential kills a night.

Town

TSO
Bulb
PA
Slaan


Scum

Des (light read)
Pere
Aptil

The rest I am not sure of because I was gone and then so sick I did not get a chance to do in depth ISO research and VCA.

However please look at VCA and look for patterns, I am sure there is at least one scum on my wagon and one off of it maybe one from each team but not positive on that.


GOOD LUCK town you will need it.

Ok you can hammer me now and I will join the dead thread (if there is one).

[PeregrineV]

That being said, it is probably a town derp hammer. Though it is multiball so by itself is not enough to be a solid town read. uggh

Well will work on catching up more while we are on night I guess.


Was going to let all my games know I would not be on much at all tomorrow since we will be flying to TN for the holiday, and to look at some houses. We may end up moving there.

I am fine with voting for Aptil

VOTE: Aptil

@Rach- talk me through Point A to Point B.

[PeregrineV]

We can assume Toomai isn't Fire, and we can assume Desp thought he was Town, not Ice.

I don't get this either. Are we assumign Toomai isn;t fire because we are assuming he's the doc?

Why we would assume Desp thought Tommai was town and not scum-Ice doc?

[PeregrineV]

Peregrine, I don't think Rach was bussing Desp.

Well Desp was a town read until questioned about it, then he was an "I can't read him", then he was a light scumread when he was about to be lynched.

[PeregrineV]

I protected Slandaar last night FYI; he's a weaker townread for me and so seemed like a decently more unexpected choice.

Mod: Considering how all previous kills were flavoured as belonging to a team, can you be more specific than "killed" for penguin_alien?

Sorry Mod is sleepy and Forgetful ~JS

well that means fire and ice shot the same person.

I is confused. Please to clear up post 1089.

@TSO-

If we believe the doc claim, why does Garmr say 1089?

[PeregrineV]

I saw someone explain Slandaar's defending of Desp, but I'll have to go read it before I consider it "protecting a scumbuddy".

Meanwhile, everyone's take on RachMarie would be appreciated.

[PeregrineV]

Garmr

I have been transparent about my scum reads how is that not scum hunting? I have pushed on Pere and Zek who are my two top scum reads.

Still waiting on what Pere's question is?

Guessing 1114 and maybe 1117.

[PeregrineV]

Clearly common sense prevails here; just discount Garmr's vote and continue with the knowledge it is 5 to lynch now. No harm is actually done by doing so and that is what everyone

should

want.

Zekrom, you should claim.

-_-

Not sure what this means. You are either dead or so close to dead that only the mod's retraction can save you. There really is no better time to claim than now, while you are in limbo.

[PeregrineV]

i enjoyed this while it lasted

So, not town, huh?

Fire or ice?

[PeregrineV]

Fire would give us a few extra days.

[PeregrineV]

see you after this game ends

at least tell us if we are hot or cold.

[PeregrineV]

see you after this game ends

at least tell us if we are

hot

or

cold.

which one do you think ?

First thought is Fire.

[PeregrineV]

Mostly from Desparado relational posts of aptil.

[PeregrineV]

ok

Don't suppose you want to share your team's ICE suspects?

[PeregrineV]

Then TSO is conf. town. He neighborized me n1.

I'm guessing since TSO did not refute this, this is true.

That really leaves Bulba, Rach, and NJAC for scum.

@TSO- Thoughts on Bulba from QT posts please.

Re: Rach- I was thinking fire scum from her Desp stuff from before.

re: NJAC- I didn't have much a scumread (or townread for that matter), but I know others did yesterday.

re: Bulba- leaning town, but want to hear from TSO before cementing this read.

Still leaning Rach, but I kind of want to look at the NK to see why each team picked who they did.

[PeregrineV]

Oh look, it's my scumday!!!

[PeregrineV]

Vote: RachMarie

I stand by my vanished posts.

@Rach

- thank you for again for the time-warped happy scumday wish!

[PeregrineV]

Where did everyone go?

See, here's my issues.

me- got a town PM
TSO- confirmed neighbor by Bulba. Since I think it's 3/3, confirmed town.
Bulba- Didn't have out TSO and thereby confirm him, Very most likely town.

That leaves

NJAC- who I think is scummy, but it's more overall play instead of anything specicifc.
you (Rach)- Your distancing from Desp was the most telling thing to me.

So, pretend you are me. My choices are NJAC and you. Why would NJAC be scum over you?

You make a case for that, and we'll talk. Otherwise, quoting my posts doesn't do anything for me.

[PeregrineV]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=30724 Xenogears Both Des and I were scum here.

I'll look through it, time permitting.

Unvote.

JIC

[PeregrineV]

I'm here and will drop more wisdom later.

[PeregrineV]

VT here.

[PeregrineV]

Need to do some studying, but it will have to be after the weekend.

[PeregrineV]

Common sense dictates no-lynching.

But, each player needs to give all of their reads before we do so.

[PeregrineV]

It should be noted that TSO seems to have had a townread on PV, since he added him to the neighborhood last night.

Confirming this.

[PeregrineV]

- ArcAngel: What I was suspecting about Arc was that she delayed starting the game because she was strategising with her buddies pre-game first (since I happened to see her post elsewhere without confirming here) but her complete lack of activity since has blown that theory out of the water.
- Desperado: I liked how he was pro-active and agressive in pushing the Yuni wagon early, as I think scum would of voted and sat back at the point.

[PeregrineV]

Screw it. Bulba's town (I think). No reason to waste another day

Vote:Aegor

[PeregrineV]

Unvote.

One or two more cross checks.

[PeregrineV]

Looked at Desp/Max treatment of AA/Rach, Bulba, Anti/NJAC/Aegor.

Still want to check NJAC treatment of Desp/Max.

[PeregrineV]

Vote: No Lynch

Play this out tomorrow.

[PeregrineV]

Also, not sure it will matter but V/La Mar 28-31

[PeregrineV]

C'mon.....

Bulba are you scum?

[PeregrineV]

Re-reading

How's that coming?

[PeregrineV]

Looked at Desp/Max treatment of AA/Rach, Bulba, Anti/NJAC/Aegor.

Still want to check NJAC treatment of Desp/Max.

Still going to base mine off this. Comments for/against other players based on these posts are being accepted.

[PeregrineV]

PV decided to hold a private conversation in our neighborhood.

Answered your question there, too.

[PeregrineV]

Going to address PV here, since I don't see the sense in keeping the discussion out of the main thread.

I disagree that the Rach kill only points to me. As I said, you would have been the one I would kill, not Rach. An endgame with Rach and Aegor would be perfect, because then I could fake paranoia and uncertainty on who to lynch, all while cursing TSO and you for not making the choice easier. Both Rach and Aegor would be suspicious of each other and would likely cross vote, with me hammering whoever I want. Besides, I'd be afraid of your paranoia as scum, and I wouldn't need you alive in the neighborhood at all. In fact, I could pretend to have gotten last reads from you, which I could use to push the lynch on whomever I wanted.

The Rach kill benefits you in pretty much the same ways as you listed for me. You could use the neighborhood to buddy me and lynch Aegor, or you could act paranoid and aim for my lynch. An Aegor kill wouldn't really benefit you, because you'd have to really rely on the buddying, since Rach would be more likely to suspect you.

As for Aegor, I really don't think there was an optimal kill for him as scum. Sure you could argue that he'd want to disband the neighborhood, but he could always count on paranoia to work for him. Killing either neighbor has the high chance of leading to his quick death, especially since Rach was starting to suspect him. Killing Rach still leaves 2 alive that suspect him, but it also increases the chance of neighborhood paranoia.

I've actually been pondering whether you as scum would hold a QT exclusive conversation like we've been having. However, I don't see how that would be optimal for you as scum. I'd suspect that as scum, you'd have said everything in the thread and pushed hard for my lynch, rather than going back and forth in private. I really don't see how that benefits scum you. Also, I remember doing ISOs shortly after the Zekrom lynch, and I was immediately hit by your towniness, which means I can't see you being partners with Maxous or Desperado.

You've done ISO reads, what do you think? Do you really think that I bussed Desperado when there was no need to? Do you think I hard bussed him when nobody was looking his way?

I'll be honest, I haven't been impressed with Aegor's slot at all. NJAC felt incredibly scummy to me, and Aegor's entrance into the game felt contrived. I also think whatever he was doing with the vote/unvote was pretty fake as well.

Let's keep the conversation out of the QT and actually use the thread. What are your impressions based on your readthrough?

I'm just still gunshy after loosing that last large normal for town.

But, all my reathroughs look like Aegor is more likely scum by dint of you being less likely to be scum.

Either way, ending the game now.

Vote: Aegor

[PeregrineV]

Tbh, I wanted to read through PV's ISO one more time. I'm going to place my vote before the end of the day tomorrow.

This means I picked right. Personal victory no matter who you vote.

[PeregrineV]

I really can't see PV being scum.

Vote Aegor

Now tell me you're not scum.

[PeregrineV]

I'm not scum. Are you scum?

Nope.


Hurray!!

[PeregrineV]

GG PV

Thanks. Not sure why you picked Rach to kill though.

[PeregrineV]

I didn't. I did not kill anyone because I am not scum.

Well, you're lynched and Bulba said he's not scum. And I'm not.

@Bulba-

why the trolling? If not, then

Aegor

, why the trolling?

[PeregrineV]

You forget I'm old and probably don't get it.

[PeregrineV]

I didn't. I did not kill anyone because I am not scum.

Well, you're lynched and Bulba said he's not scum. And I'm not.

@Bulba-

why the trolling? If not, then

Aegor

, why the trolling?

PV

, why the trolling?

Game's over so I don't bother.

[PeregrineV]

If I was scum, you would have seen a very important key word by now.

then back to Aegor...why the Rach NK?

[PeregrineV]

I'm trying to remember what it was I saw in my ISO readthrough, but I think she might have made herself obv. town at one point, and Aegor was trying to play up the neighborhood paranoia.

I guess so. But if you'd died he'd have a chance to talk me onto Rach, whom I was pushing for for days and hadn't fully lost suspicion of.

[PeregrineV]

Then I'm calling it Karma for 164: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=28253

[PeregrineV]

Please tell me it's town karma and not "I get a win and fooled you" karma.

It's I screwed up and picked wrong in lylo in 164, so I rebalanced Karma by picking right this game. one town loss, one town win.

[PeregrineV]

I am still definitely town.

OK. Jacob will settle it when he does.

[PeregrineV]

Sorry Fire team. I know my NK was unorthodox, but after my case on Rach did not really gain any steam, and after Bulba insisted he would be NKed, I decided to take a risk. I guess I miscalculated how much PV actually suspected Rach.

I did much earlier in the game. And you yourself didn't exhibit scumminess. Rach just came across as town enough that I dropped my read and started re-reading all interactions from scratch.

[PeregrineV]

If I am understanding you correct, then my original assessment was right. I discerned that swinging a lynch on Rach with you, she, and I in lylo would be difficult given NJAC's history, so I tried to take advantage of the WIFOm of Bulb surviving. Killing you would ahve made no sense because Bulb was not going to vote for Rach anyway and Rach rightly thought I was off.

It almost worked.

[PeregrineV]

all other QTs can be released by their participants.

Neighborhood QT.

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/9L92fptna38h6