Mini 1868 - Sakura Wars: So Long, My Love Mafia [GAME OVER]
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Tammy Survivor
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Hi!
So glad this game started on the weekend. Heads up - school starts on Monday and I never know how the first week of the semester is going to go, so I might not be around that much at all next week. If it looks like I won't be able to be here at all, I'll officially go v/la but hopefully it won't be crazy like that. BUT I am kevin mccallister right now, so you have my undivided attention!
VOTE: reflektor
Nacho please be town. I was going to write a jokey appeal, but every time I do that you end up being scum. So, I'm going to be simple. Please be town and let's have fun. I think it's been like six months since we've been on the same team; hopefully the mafia gods will be kind to me for the new year. My luck you're scum with Fate and Cabd though and then I'll have no one to hold my hand.
Hi Fate! Hi BB! I haven't played with you guys in forever.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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You're not? I like to have some chance at winning.In post 18, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:I don't math but sounds about right. Why do you seem so concerned?
It's a rare occurrence to get a scum lynch day one, and it's a rarer occurrence that a vig kill lands on scum. That puts us at losing night two unless the stars align perfectly.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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That means nacho's chances of being scum just went up even more
So, this is basically an evil mod game, right? Like hey, games aren't hard enough. Scum don't win enough games around here, let's add an extra member. Oh and as if that's not enough, let's make one of them a godfather too. And limit the cop. Yep that sounds just right.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Are you voting no lynch because this is a new quirky thing you're doing or do you think it will be beneficial with the set up.
Also I said hi to youI am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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There's no reason not to be aware of what we're up against and try to figure out what our best chances are.In post 24, Aj The Epic wrote:*insert snarky response about you just being bad*
There's really no point in worrying about D2 already. If Vig shoots tonight and misses, then we'll have to mass claim tomorrow. That's about all there is to it.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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It's definitely a you problem.In post 27, Reflektor wrote:I haven't bothered trying to break the setup as the vig/gunsmith introduce so much uncertainty, if nobody else wants to try I can later.
VOTE: Tammy
Don't like the opening posts. I'll review your games later to see if this is a me problem but those opening appeals read horrifically.
I've been awake for well over 30 hours and will be in transit for another 7, so you'll have to deal with Nacho for now. He gets to pick the icon, too.
-Prism
Just talk to your other head. You'll have to wait until tomorrow though.
But I would like for you to explain what about them reads horrifically? Like how do you not read that and go oh that looks like she has experience with my other head, maybe I'll talk to my other head about it? How does that not be a thing that enters your mind at all?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Okay have funIn post 31, Reflektor wrote:It's obvious you know Nacho, that doesn't mean I buy the appeal. Me consulting with him later is a given.
-Prism
What don't you buy about it? Was it the appeal itself or something else about it?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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I don't remember you liking scum?
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Oh that's a good idea.
I think AJ is right about no lynching day one, but not for the reasons he suggested. I don't think any of that is really all that important for solving the game and can easily be done without the day one lynch. BUT roles would be going into tonight blind and probably have a better chance of overlapping, which we do want to avoid.
I'm going to stop thinking about this and try to find something else to occupy my mind. We just really need town to act like town this game if we want half a chance to win this.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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I was thinking about that too. My only hesitation is that mafia has a two-shot role blocker. Granted they could only block one person a night, but we would definitely be losing a role and information.
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Tammy Survivor
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My thought was if we mass claimed we could ensure that the roles did not overlap tonight, but then there's the role blocker.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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VOTE: medea the alien
I think it's pretty obvious if you've read the posts that they suggestions were made by people thinking out loud about the fact that we have an extra scum member this game which has a good chance of resulting in a scum win night two and people were thinking out loud/offering suggestions to try to give town a better chance. Yes, the suggestions aren't perfect, but it's a hell of a lot better to try to figure something out and see if there's a way we can increase our chances of winning.
I do not think that you read the posts in the game and refer to me passively suggesting a no lynch (then deciding against it) and not tell me that yes, I am being silly. I don't think that you don't engage with me on that at all.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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And I don't want my point and suspicion on Medea to be misunderstood as so many interaction reads are.
I am the most active player in this game right now. (Blame me being home alone and bored ). I have been the most active in discussing the setup and suggested the no lynch. Gamma suggested the mass claim. Penguin asked Gamma to clarify his thought process on the mass claim but not my suggestion of the no lynch.
Why ignore mine to ask Gamma why he suggested the mass claim, but not me on the no lynch? That makes no sense. She didn't mention me as being town, so that can't be it. But didn't she find it suspicious at all if she's going to ask why people suggested it? And how do you miss the why?
What sucks is if there was a way to use this setup to our advantage in any way, that's one of the hydras I expected to use it or discuss it. I expected that if they were town they'd engage me on it - either to tell me to settle the fuck down there's nothing I can do or to have an idea if there's something to do. (The other is the nacho hydra, but I don't expect him to post in this game before tomorrow at the earliest so I'll wait with bated breath there.)
I don't understand the town points to AJ for pointing out why some suggestions aren't good. (Also, notice the ignoring my points against the mass claim there.) By saying that AJ gets town points for not buying in, which would suggest she has issues with the suggestions, but again why ignore that I suggested the no lynch. And what would be the scum motivation anyway?
I thought that LUV had the best idea for the vig not to shoot night one if we mislynched; how come that didn't get town points?
I just think that Penguin posted something to post and look like she was engaged with the game, but actually ignored the real crux of the conversations going on which I think she would have addressed if she were town.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Your interaction with me is still not sitting right. Why are you being antagonistic and kinda putting me down. You're reminding me of the last time I suspected someone and they wrote a whole thing about how I wasn't playing well enough in an attempt to make me feel shitty and ignore they were being scummy as shit like you are.
I didn't read the set up until today when I looked at the player list. I saw godfather out of the corner of my eye and thought that it was cruel to be paired with a one-shot cop. Then I noticed up above that it said 4 scum.
How in the seven hells do you not have any idea what my alignment is?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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In post 48, Medea the Alien wrote:
Gamma Emerald, why would you want to throw in RQS at this point? Are you dissatisfied with the discourse in progress?What was your thought process that mass claiming would be useful?
--PA (I sign, nyeh)I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Can you explain what "I'd read more into it, but I know you do tend to write things out a bit so whatever." means?In post 56, Medea the Alien wrote:
So yes, read your posts, end result wasn't anything I felt like picking further at. I'd read more into it, but I know you do tend to write things out a bit so whatever. It doesn't tell me anything about your alignment.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Okay that's the answer I was hoping for. I had a thought you were trying to play it cool with sadly, but then I thought you might be referring to the 4 scum thing, which yeah it would be cool to be scum in this setup, and then I thought if that were the answer then it wasn't the alignment indicative thing I thought it might be.In post 64, BBmolla wrote:I'd like it in a mini with 4 scum ya
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Tammy Survivor
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I also thought about that. We could maybe put a pool of two to three for the two to investigate out of so that we can avoid the investigating oneself thing. The only drawback to directing in a sense is that scum are involved in the direction process and we might have investigatives who just have a good sense of who to investigate?In post 67, Empking wrote:I'm not sure if anyone is still taking it seriously, but I'm strongly against mass claim. Nothing on our side really suggests it's a good idea, while the fact that there are four scum ought not influence it; aside for putting us into lynch or lose earlier.
However, mightn't there be a virtue in our deciding who the gunsmith and cop should investigate - obviously with the caveat that one wouldn't investigate oneself. Or is that giving scum more info than we'd want to?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Bleh I wish I were a normal person who had all the questions right when I read a post and not act like those kernels that pop minutes after the poppers been turned off.In post 56, Medea the Alien wrote:Ignoring RQS.
What suggestions have you made that you think are worth discussing, Tammy? I read you tossing out a lot of frankly not so great ideas and eventually rejecting them, rightly so. Given that this was advertised as the open setup it is, I find it weird that anyone wouldn't have done some cursory thinking about the perils of the town:scum ratio, so why go weird about it now that the game has started?
So yes, read your posts, end result wasn't anything I felt like picking further at. I'd read more into it, but I know you do tend to write things out a bit so whatever. It doesn't tell me anything about your alignment.
Okay, so on the playing side of that, you said you have high expectations of this player list. How's that working out from your perspective so far?In post 41, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:I think our best bet is to just play and convince the vigilante to stay put if we mislynch D1.
--PA
Pedit: I would assume the vig wouldn't shoot night one if it was likely to put us in near-certain LyLo the next day. That...is kind of obvious? Waiting to see more interactions from you, as you going a bit down a rabbit hole isn't alignment indicative to me. And I asked Gamma why RQS, not why mass claim.
If you thought it was weird that I got weird about it when the game started, wouldn't that have been enough of something for you to poke at? Why didn't you ask that before I pointed out that you hadn't interacted with me directly? Even if all I was doing was posting nonsense and nothing to poke at further, wouldn't that be the thing? Because if you thought it was weird that should have been pointed out. (On the off chance you are town and this really does read weird to you, ask your other head how often I read the setup or rules before a game starts.)
Also if you thought about the perils of the ratio, and since I was going on about it, why didn't you offer up any of your thoughts? Why did you act like you didn't know the impetus of why we were throwing out such bad ideas.
Also squared why did you ask that question of LUV in this post instead of your first one. Did you reread the game and that stuck out to you the second time?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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The only thing I didn't like about LUV was when he asked me why I seemed so concerned about four scum. Both because the answer speaks for itself and because of the "seem" there. I wondered if he put the seem there to seem like town who didn't know my alignment. Okay it sounds even sillier now that I wrote it out actually. From the question I was expecting an accusation of me trying to fake not knowing there were four scum, but it didn't come, so.
IDK what do you think about Medea?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Is that the most interesting thing?In post 87, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:
Echoing this. Surprised he went through with it.In post 54, Aj The Epic wrote:We're not doing RQS at this point.
Did you miss the question posed to you?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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I look at playerlists, not setups, when I sign up for games. The only times I read the setup is when it's made clear that it's a mechanical game or to expect something different. Had I read the setup I would not have signed up for the game. I looked at the player list.In post 95, Persivul wrote:
Maybe when it's an open game you should read the setup before signing up. Not liking this opening.In post 23, Tammy wrote:That means nacho's chances of being scum just went up even more
So, this is basically an evil mod game, right? Like hey, games aren't hard enough. Scum don't win enough games around here, let's add an extra member. Oh and as if that's not enough, let's make one of them a godfather too. And limit the cop. Yep that sounds just right.
What would lead me to think it's an open game anyway? Here's the post I looked at. What looks special about it that I should have noticed. Does it say "OPEN GAME EVERYONE THERE'S FOUR SCUM MAKE SURE YOU NOTICE THAT" anywhere?
Also, what don't you like about my reaction? What is my scum motivation?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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The investigatives are one shot. And there's a godfather and a role blocker.In post 92, Persivul wrote:That was known going into the game. Presumably the offset is the two investigatives. That probably balances, but increases swing.
The game isn't even pretending to be balanced.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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OH color me stupid.In post 101, Aj The Epic wrote:@tammy
Investigative roles aren't gated AFAIK. There's 1 of them, not one shot. Mafia RB, Town Doctor, Town Vig have x shots.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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In post 102, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:All bashing of the setup should be saved for post game. Its disrespectful to the mod to bash it now in my opinion.
I'm not bashing it; I'm pointing out that it's unbalanced. And now that it looks like I was completely wrong about the investigatives being one-shot, it might not be as dire as it looks, so.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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A theme game is a theme game. I'm ready for shenanigans, sk, two teams, etc. Wasn't ready for four scum in a 13 player game, wouldn't expect that to happen here. I don't worry about setups. I don't care about setups; I care about playerlists.In post 115, Persivul wrote:
I did, and I believe some other people did.In post 111, Tammy wrote:Who does that?
In my experience, scum, who know the alignments, are less likely to have thoroughly read the setup than town. Further, while setup spec can be beneficial, it can also be used as a way to appear busy without really scum hunting.[/quote]And why are you acting like I'm supposed to?
Where was my scum motivation for reacting to the setup the way I did though?
That's not even close to my experience. Scum tend to have a better handle on the setup than town, but really it's player dependent. I did, accidentally, read the setup or I wouldn't have been reacting to it.
But you were getting after me for not knowing the setup before hand. I couldn't know my alignment beforehand.
Have I not been scum hunting?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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I believe his answer.In post 117, Persivul wrote:
I give you town points for questioning molla on wanting to be scum. Like you, I figured he would answer as he did, but it was a good question.In post 113, Tammy wrote:Anyway Persivul do you have anything useful to say or reads on people that don't involve you should have read the setup or doing rqs means you're scum?
Do you believe his answer? Do you think it could all be wifom?
The answer is not alignment indicative, unfortunately, because it's just true for him as a player. The answer gets rid of the queasy feeling the original response gives me, but it puts him at neutral.
I've been pretty decent at reading BB in the past, so I'm hoping that he'll be a read I'll feel confident about. We haven't played together in a while, but iirc I've never mis-scum read him though I have mis-town read him once or twice - though I think only once knowing he was BB. The other times I thought he was town we were playing alted games and I didn't know who he was.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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What does it change?In post 125, Medea the Alien wrote:Not penguin so I'm skipping all the Tammy questions, unless some of them were directed at me. I imagine it does change things that Tammy's posts were made form the point of view of all investigative roles being one-shots. That WOULD be desperate times.
The only thing it changes in my mind is that if we make it to day three we might not be in terrible shape, but that was also before it was pointed out that gunsmith's actually can give false positives. So, yay we have a cop we can't trust and a gunsmith we could use results to mislynch with. Woo.
Whether or not they're one-shot, we can still lose the game on day two.
(And yeah, I had that melt down privately about the day vig was just gonna shut up about the sky is falling bit.)I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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In post 128, BBmolla wrote:more LUV votes? why are we interrogating Tammy who's probably town
What didn't you like about BB's defense?In post 129, Reflektor wrote:My reason for scumreading Tammy was wrong.
VOTE: BBMolla
Don't like BBmolla's defense of Tammy in #128. Next vote would probably be Medea or someone with only one post. I haven't slept in nearly 48 hours so I'll tackle page 5 in the morning.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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I haven't felt this town right off the bat in a really long time. It's because I'm home alone with nothing pressing to doIn post 128, BBmolla wrote:more LUV votes? why are we interrogating Tammy who's probably town
I don't have any town reads I feel good about right now, though there's a little part of me that thinks that nacho would have told prism not to attack me for something little like that and this would be stronger if it weren't for the fact that we got our roles last night and he might not have had a chance to interact with him about it so it's probably nothing, but I do have a couple I'm watching you reads besides my actual scum read. I'm gonna hold off on those though because it's super early in the game and I might just be extra jumpy due to setup paranoia and the fact that I got extra invested earlier than usual because I've been home all day thinking about this and other people probably just aren't.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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In post 136, Medea the Alien wrote:
There's things in this setup I'd speak more about; but on the off chance scum don't see what I see, I'll leave it until it's relevant or needed. I will say that Penguin and I ran through various scenarios and breaking methods in the shower earlier. None of them play positively when there's so few opportunities for safe error.In post 133, Tammy wrote:
What does it change?In post 125, Medea the Alien wrote:Not penguin so I'm skipping all the Tammy questions, unless some of them were directed at me. I imagine it does change things that Tammy's posts were made form the point of view of all investigative roles being one-shots. That WOULD be desperate times.
The only thing it changes in my mind is that if we make it to day three we might not be in terrible shape, but that was also before it was pointed out that gunsmith's actually can give false positives. So, yay we have a cop we can't trust and a gunsmith we could use results to mislynch with. Woo.
Whether or not they're one-shot, we can still lose the game on day two.
(And yeah, I had that melt down privately about the day vig was just gonna shut up about the sky is falling bit.)
Right and I would expect no less from you guys, but that doesn't explain Penguin's entrance and reaction or lack of direct interaction with me. If you guys had been discussing it, I'd expect some comment along that way, not why are you guys suggesting this nonsense. Sot then Penguin's entrance just looks like posturing and if you'd discussed it well then it should have been different.
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I am now sufficiently buzzed that I should be able to fall asleep soon. I promise I won't be overposting like this all game. I really do wish that Fate had commented on something more than AJ and his tone, but I believe he's doing the Canada meet thing so I await him to arrive in all his glory as well.
Nacho if you read this, please post in this game and if you're town please make it obvious. I don't have the luxury of himming and hawing about you until day three because we might not have that long, so if you could do jazz hands, cartwheels, or pole dancing i for one would be super duper grateful
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Tammy Survivor
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HUH?In post 142, Persivul wrote:
Assuming you're referring to 52, I disagree. They said, "WTF is with no lynching and mass claiming being bandied about as good ideas this early?" I agree with that. Those were bad ideas. Your vote is OMGUSsy.In post 119, Tammy wrote:What did you think about my point on Medea
I've definitely said more words about my read than 52. Did you just stop reading at that point?
I can't tell if this is a case of you completely misunderstanding, me being unclear, or you willfully mischaracterizing my point and then making a weird accusation based on the mischaracterization. Right now, I kinda want to lean towards door number three because I can't for the life of me understand where you got that idea or that it could possibly even come close to omgussy.
I mean it's definitely based on a reaction and his posts in the game; it's not just made up feelings or a tone read. Do you disagree with what BB and Empking see?Persivul wrote:
It was feelings based on very little information. That's fine for him personally this early in the game, but it does nothing to swayand what did you think about BB's vote on LUV?me.
What do you think about LUV in general?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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In post 150, Fate wrote:The low effort gold posting will commence for Tammys sake
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Tammy Survivor
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I meant exactly what I said. Even if all you read was the post I voted in them, I still don't see how you got that. The last two sentences should have clued you into the fact that your interpretation isn't even close to correct. It was born of a lack of interaction, not whatever interpretation you came up with.In post 151, Persivul wrote:
Let's be reasonable. When you say "my point on" someone, it's not reasonable to expect me to ISO you, identify everything you've said about the person, and address all of it. I went to the post in which you voted them. If you meant something else, say so, but don't act like it's fault.In post 148, Tammy wrote: I've definitely said more words about my read than 52. Did you just stop reading at that point?
And yes, I do think that in a game of mafia, when there are only five pages, that it's reasonable to expect you to read and even iso to respond. Why I asked you in the first place was because the manner in which you went, and didn't, go through the thread pinged me. You seemed like you were reading the thread. You were interacting and responding to posts as if you were trucking along, but all you really did was respond to setup spec stuff. The only sort of scum hunting response you had was responding to Gamma's RQS post. (What is it with people caring that he did rqs even after someone said not to anyway?) But you stopped commenting on anything going on in the game thread after that except to discuss with me about people being aware of the setup.
I find it odd that you literally stopped responding once actual game relevant stuff started happening. Since you were shooting down setup suggestions, I expected to see you responding to actual scum hunting that was going on, but you merrily ignored it.
Did you actually read my problem with them? Go ahead and read that page to see me explain my read two whole posts later after I voted them.Persivul wrote:
IIRC you talked about some strategies...Madea said those were bad ideas...you voted them. IMO that at least comes close to omgussy. Note that omgussy is an observation, not a charge, as you see omgussy town all the time.I can't tell if this is a case of you completely misunderstanding, me being unclear, or you willfully mischaracterizing my point and then making a weird accusation based on the mischaracterization. Right now, I kinda want to lean towards door number three because I can't for the life of me understand where you got that idea or that it could possibly even come close to omgussy.
What do they see? BB voted LUV in 73. LUV had made 5 posts at that point, no more than 2 sentences each. Tell me what this substantive case is they have on her, because I'm not seeing it.[/quote]Persivul wrote:I mean it's definitely based on a reaction and his posts in the game; it's not just made up feelings or a tone read. Do you disagree with what BB and Empking see?
Do you or don't you agree with their reasoning?I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Hi Nacho!
I've read all your posts, but I probably won't respond to much until tomorrow. Brain is heading off into lalaville.
Your point on LUV about being around and posting just neutral things is one of the things I was referring to with my I've got a couple of I got my eye on you reads that I wanted to watch. Your response to LUV's original reaction to my concern about the setup looked like you were leaning on it being a townie reaction. Did I misunderstand that or did you change your mind based on the lack of posting and substance.
Not only does Cabd's post imply that they did in fact read the setup and think about it. Well imply is a bad word, he said they discussed it in the shower, so. But Penguin's second post implies that as well. She said this:
"Given that this was advertised as the open setup it is, I find it weird that anyone wouldn't have done some cursory thinking about the perils of the town:scum ratio, so why go weird about it now that the game has started?"
So yeah.
Also I was kinda expecting Cabd to tell me to get my head out of my ass if they were town and I was jumping on something I shouldn't. But I could be wrong about that I guess.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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Tammy Survivor
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- Posts: 15361
- Joined: January 13, 2012
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Tammy Survivor
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- Posts: 15361
- Joined: January 13, 2012
No, I can imagine her trusting a cabd interpretation. I just still think that if Penguin!town had thought about or discussed the setup with cabd, her reaction to the suggestions would be different. The post looks like the setup was not thought about or talked about at all, at the very least from a town perspective.In post 180, Reflektor wrote:Or do you disagree with the Cabd influence possibility I brought up?
What do you think about her second post to me wherein she says that she doesn't have a read on me and that going down a rabbit hole isn't alignment indicative, and basically implies that my opening was suspicious, which then really makes her lack of interaction an even bigger problem? I was kinda expecting you to respond to that post, but you didn't.I am in the top 90% of scumhunters onsite!-
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Tammy Survivor
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