Mini 729 - WaTR Mafia - Game Over!
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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I think its the easiest place for a wolf to go looking for some sheep if you ask me. I mean they could come up from above and maybe jump too far and end up going down the cliff themselves if we went that way. Though I certainly dont much care for the forest myself, meh.
I will be the first to preemtively say.. ITS A TRAP!-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Points A and B that are made here are WIFOM? I am still on the newer side of things, so I am not entirely sure how I should interpret this all.Occam wrote:A. It wasn't even intended as role speculation. It was off the cuff. Additionally, why would that be a role if all it takes is one person - any person - to vote in order to choose the path? You really think I'd try to get someone's role out of them when it says right above that it doesn't matter who posts the vote - which quite clearly contradicts the likelihood of that being a role? No, CLEARLY the only thing that makes sense is that was not aware of that rule at the time that I posted (whether it was because I forgot about it or simply missed it).
B. Your point about missing a rule being scummy is invalid as it's just as likely something town would do inadvertently (which is the case here) as it is something scum would do intentionally - in fact I would argue strongly that it would be a mistake someone of either alignment could make rather that something someone would do on purpose.
C. I voted you because you continued (and indeed to continue) to push a weak point past reason.-
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freeko Goon
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I think it would be an obvious point to be bringing up the next day were the parked vote to stay on someone an entire day.
Though I disagree with this whole random voting thing being over with. I could very well make another vote with the sole intention of gaining information. This vote me not be who I think is who I want to be lynched, but it would be more along the line of a random vote that is used to start the game rolling. Then again, thats just my opinion.-
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freeko Goon
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There is an old japanese saying that goes something like this.
Even the greatest of Tsunamis all startt as just a simple ripple.
I really dont know or care what the exact wording is, for all I know it could be all your base are belongs to us. The long and short of it is this, that no matter the decision every one that is made will have a consequence tied into it. Maybe not an immediate one, but one down the road. It could be no different than looking at interactions on day one when it is day three. Seeing as how you know how some people are aligned at this point, you know how true or false some of these statements are. Maybe in the end it is a completely inconsequential decision. Only one way to find out. That is to play the game out. and see what happens.-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Isnt the whole point of the first day to build up an information base to use in future days? A 4? person bandwagon is nothing when it requires 7 of us to lynch someone. Maybe it is a play to get some information from the player that is bandwagoned? I may switch my vote over there if nothing comes of it to force the issue. I dont get why you have your panites all in a bunch over someone getting bandwagoned, occam? Unless of course he is your scumbuddy and you are trying to defend him to the end of time?
Enlighten me here, as you seem to be the one that sticks out the most.
And since I am on old japanese proverbs, here is another one.
The nail that sticks out gets hammered.
Occam, you are the one that sticks out most to me. Though I am not sure what to make of it. So maybe you could do some explaining?-
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freeko Goon
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@occam: you didnt convince me. I still think this bandwagon is providing information. Unfortunately for you, I think it is telling me that you are trying to defend your scumbuddy? Which for you would obviously be a mis-lynch. Because the next thing the town does is string you up for defending a scum player so ardently.
Maybe this should be the time and place where you give us a reason for your zealous defense of another player?
I am truly considring moving my vote either onto you or onto the bandwagon for LT, as it seems to have gotten a reaction out of you. I cant help but think that LT is playing the silent lurker scum while you are playing the more vocal of the group trying to convince everyone else that others within the group are worth more attnetion than your scummate?-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Korts, I am no more or less scummy for looking at Occam and having the same reaction to it as you do. I just have not gone so far as to vote for him yet. Though you seem to have missed his last response where he made the clarification to his using mislynch instead of bad lynch. Maybe you did not see this. Or are you just trying to make everyone else look bad so you somehow avoid suscpicion?-
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freeko Goon
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Rhinox, where do you get the idea that I had them pegged as scum-mates? For all I know they could be lovers. I love how you make this attempt at turning my questioning completely sideways here.
First you say..
"there is scum on LT's wagon" .. i suck at quoting, so meh.
Then you say I am the one thats fishing?
Which one is it? Is there scum on LT's wagon? Or am I scum now, because I was exploring the possibility of a link between LT and Occam? If you missed a MINOR little detail, I do not have my vote on Occam. Nor did my vote ever get placed on Occam at any point.-
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freeko Goon
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So by your logic, If I were to have moved my vote over to him first( or at any time?), I would have been perfectly justified in exploring the defense of LT by someone who is not LT?
The only reason I can see why someone is defending someone else this early in the game is because they are linked. Masons? Maybe. Lovers? More than likely this is what I think (and why I did not move my vote). Scum? You cannot tell me that it is not worth exploring this possibility.
Though I will say this, my vote is where I believe it is most likely to stay. I have not been convinced by Rouge that his choice of path was not either pre-meditated or some manner of an act of sabotage that will come into play later in the game. I cannot help but think that he has knowledge of the path and knows what will come from going certain ways good or bad.-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Raider, my mason partner gave ME away actually. We are actually what looks to be 3rd party masons. Our victory condition (at least mine) is simply to get to the town alive on day 6. I also have the town win condition of winning when all scum are found. It is unknown to me what PK's alignment is.
Personally, I dont see how my role is a "power" role. The only thing I have is the ability to talk with someone else during the night phase.-
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freeko Goon
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I cannot directly quote my role pm, so I cannot really answer it better. He knows my alignment (town), but I do not know his it seems. The last line of my pm says something to that effect. That I am not sure of his alignment.
Due to the forum crash right before the game started, it did not give me any time in the pregame to actually discuss anything wtih him. Though if I were to guess either way, I would lean towards town. Would it be unreasonable to ask for someone who has an investigative ability to look into him?-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Just so you know korts, the caravan reaches the destination town on day 6. It is the last rule in the Other category. PK and I win by either siomply making it to the town or by finding all scum. (Would be hard to get killed if there are no scum left I think)
I think a FoS on the other 2 that have their vote on me seems to be in order as well.-
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freeko
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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yeah, I dont get it. You couldunvotejust like that.
but then you coudnt do thisvote: monkey man
I dont get it how you could POSSIBLY keep your vote on a claimed mason. I certainly dont see anyone trying to counter my claims or disputing my alignment. As much as I dont horribly care for Occam, you gotta go.-
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freeko Goon
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meh, minor little details right?
Mod-Edit Votecount 1-8
MonkeyMan - 5 (BSG, Rhinox, freeko, Occam, Raider)
Lunar Tick - 2 (Rogue Shenanigans, Kiro)
Occam - 2 (Prom King, Korts)
freeko - 1 (Sipylus)
Not Voting - Lunar_Tick, MonkeyMan
With 12 left, 7 to lynch.
Deadline is in 15 real-life days. Just a heads up.-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Lets see, I was on L-2, and claimed. Then everyone realized that lynching a mason is not a smart thing to do. Will I get NK'd, I most certainly think so. Its just a matter of time as to when.
Here you lie, then lie again, and hide every thing you can. Which shows every town player thats here that you are not with the town. If you are not anti-town then give a a reason to think thats the case. It might just get a few votes removed from you, but what do I know... It only happened to me in this game already.-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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@siphylus: no, I dont have anything that makes me consider myself for being the watchman other than everyone knows im town right now. though it would not suprise me if someone simply had an ability that would be relevant to this sequence. If that is the case then I would defer to them.
@occam: good question...-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Its more of a check than anything else. and to that extent i think its real simple (and pretty much wifom as well). Either korts is telling the truth and he flips town, or he is not and he is a scum. I am very heavily leaning twoards teh scum side right now. Problem is there is only one way to truly find out.-
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freeko Goon
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The reason you vote for PK is that I cannot confirm PK while PK can confirm me. I also got NOTHING from PK in the night discussion, which worries me slightly. Either he is going to be replaced, or he is hiding something from me.
So my scumdar goes something like this. I will gain information by the lynching of RS,Korts, or PK. Obviously maybe the replacement for RS could offer up something, but until then... Maybe I am way off but those are the ones that stick out to me as doing something that I do not particularly see as being a town player.-
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freeko Goon
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Now I will make this clear, I dont care much for common logic. Its my logic, and with 7 people still left in the game, I think it would be best to get more information. As I said before, the only way I can get information is to lynch one of them so we know what thier role is and if they were lying or not.
For example; (completely theoretical)
IF player X is scum, then I assume that those who are associated with them are most likely scum as well. THEN I go after them next.
or
IF player X is town aligned, then I am obviously wrong. THEN I admit my mistake and move along with the game.
Right now that player X is korts for me.-
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freeko Goon
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Korts, if you read the flavor of his lynching, It only required 6 of us (or one less than normal) to lynch him. At least that is what it looked like to me. It just seems that you are doing nothing but making decisions in this game that are totally one sided. You are thinking about yourself and not the good of the "town" as a whole, I think.-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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Did you even pay attention to day 1 at all? Or did you just jump in and not bother to ready any of it?
Anyways. My speculation is that PK is trying to hide something from me. He did not participate in the discussion at all. All he really did was force me into tipping my hand and making me need to claim my role all the more relevant to my survival. The problem always has been that I cannot confirm him, but he can confurm me. Then I recall saying that Occam can clear us with an ability he has, and shockingly he is the one who goes bye-bye during the night phase (presumably NK'd?) though its not official yet it seems as his role has not been revealed. So I am now quite pissed off because 2 of the people who would be able to "help" me are gone from the game in one way or another and the other has not bothered to do anything for about 10 days, though PK is still supposedly in the game.-
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freeko
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freeko Goon
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@raider: I pretty much laid everything out on the table except my exact role pm. There is nothing more I can do with this. Rhinox has it right on the money when he said that PK knows my alignment and I do not know his. I will say that since this is a unconventional game, I am equating what the actual given role I have to the closest thing that I know exists within the mainstream mafia roles. I function exactly like a mason would in a "standard" game. The doctor was called a Pagan Cleric and seemingly required 1 less player to lynch him. So not everything is completely standard, and I presume that many people have little twists like this in their role pms as well. Though I have the basic town win condition of "find the scum", I think I am likely to be an indifferent 3rd party. As I only care about getting to the next town alive. Most of this is all stuff I have said before, a little reading would have shown you this. I know and PK knows that I am town aligned. I do not know his alignment though.-
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freeko Goon
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Which is exactly why I think Korts is hiding something.
Probable WIFOM alert.
If Occam is dead, we would/should know about that minor detail. If he is alive, then wtf happened to the NK?
With these wild mishmashing of roles, it would not suprise me to see a Commuter/X asa possibility fir Occam. That is speculating on the small chance that he may still be alive in the game.-
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freeko Goon
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Who is that directed towards? I assume me since you had quoted me earlier. If so, then here is my answer. I want him replaced. hopefully his replace metn could do.. SOMETHING in the game where PK did nothing in our discussion thread in the last game night. Along with obviously being absent for this game day as well. As an extension of this, I would not entirely mind him getting lynched, as I cannot cofirm his alignment. The way the pm I have is worded is so that I am to be suspicious of his alignment right from the start. Though I think it best that we waited for a replacement to shed some light on the situation. I know its a slight contradiction, I really woudl like more information, and I get it either way.raider8169 wrote: What are your feelings towards PK?-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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My thinking is this. I am not sure either way if PK is scum or not. Not to the point where I would feel that I would vote for the lynch. If he is not scum, then we have wasted a lynch. If you need PK to be lynched to trust me, then I think something is wrong. I would still rather scumhunt as this whole episode is a mere distraction from that. If you all decide to lynch PK, then so be it. I dont agree with this lynch, but I understand why it would happen.
I still think that patience is the proper play. I hope the moderator will do something about this to keep the game moving. With 3 players due to be replaced that is just too many, I would almost call for an abandoned game if nothing comes of this soon.-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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I said that my win condition is that I make it to the next town alive, this happens on day 6 (as the rules state). I have made the assumption on my own that surviving until day 6 would be the alternate win condition. It also says that I win when all threats to the caravan are removed.Freeko says his role PM has an alternate win condition of making it to the next town
This is what I have said from the start. The only lies are the ones you are choosing to fabricate out of twisting things away from what they really are.
Last side note, go look up Neighbor from the role wiki, it redirects to Mason. I presume that since we are not sure of each olthers alignments it is more correct to call us neighbors than masons.-
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freeko Goon
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WHOA.. hoooold up. To say I missed this from rhinox in post #363 would be an understatement. I sorta skimmed over it and went right to the next post where I adressed that. hell I will even go right from a page of Rhinox's own book and make the quote further into or out of context and make it more damning.unvote, vote: freeko for insisting he was confirmed when he's not. Lynch All Liars. If freeko is scum, I'm comfortable letting Vi live a while, but not as confirmed town
Now get this right , right from the start. I do not even remotely care about the vorte. Look at the last part.If freeko is scum, I'm comfortable letting Vi live a while, but not as confirmed town.
vote rhinox
Cry OMGUS all you want, but its not about you voting for me. Its about you not wanting people to live when they are confirmed town. Only reason for that is obvious.-
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freeko Goon
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You should start a machine shop. Your fabrication skills are amazing. Your acting skills need a little work though. You really need to learn how to turn tail and retreat better than this over your obvious screw up.
As for this.
I would not entirely be happy with lynching someone who I was not sure was scum, but I would have done it to move the game forward. In reality I would have been expecting the NK there so I would have been able to get away from this game pretty cleanly and not really care that half the people in the game then are inactive.So why is it that when we were actually considering lynching PK, you said you didn't agree with it?
Now that your skills at taking things out of context are complete. I now grank you the rank of context knight. You still have a ways to go before you are one with the context of things.
Mod-Edit Votecount 2-5
Rhinox - 3 (Vi, Freeko, Korts)
Vi - 1 (BSG)
Freeko - 1 (Rhinox)
Not Voting - 5 (Megaflareon, Lunar_Tick, Sipylus, Raider, Juls)
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Currently seeking a replacement for Lunar Tick and Sipylus, in that order. Megaflareon has one day to respond to his/her prod.
Deadline is in 17 Days, in case you happen to be wondering.-
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freeko Goon
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freeko Goon
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BSG is the one that is rolefishing. Therefore I will not answer him unless he gives me reaon to. The only reason I would EVER answer a question like this is if he pays the price I want him to. Even you could realize the implications if he is willing to pay my price for information. As I think the only person who would ask that and they sayC'MON! this isn't pinging anyone elses Radar as rolefishing, now, on top of everything else?
is that he himself has something to hide.Noted that you don't want to give information to the town.
The only thing I am doing is taking a blatantly loaded question and turning it on the one who is asking it.-
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freeko Goon
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Somehow I think its you who are unsure, and need to ask a question that has an obvious and already stated answer.Rolefishing when the role is already known? That's new to me...
So it would be more name fishing...And what's bad about that?
Actually I think about this more and something popped out. You cant NK me can you? It would be too obvious who did it. The only way you could possibly be able to deal with me, and hide youeslf, is to somehow get me lynched. The problem you now face is that even this will backfire on you. you try and try and try with rhinox to manufacture anything and everything you can , but in the end you end up exposing yourself dont you?
Not anytime soon, I am perfectly fine with rhinox atm. I might OMGUS the smiley though.. so annoying. Though if you are willing to pay the price, I will answer your question as to the name of my role. Hell, I might even throw in a bonus gift too.Can you also warn me when your next OMGUS vote is coming?
Offer expires while you wait.
When i go, I want to make damn sure that you take out some scum after me.Freeko why the sudden change in the way you are posting? I got the impression you were laid back before the replacement and now you are teaming up with VI and being very aggressive. Is anyone else noticeing this?-
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freeko
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freeko Goon
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I do this grudgingly, but since you asked so nicely.Denied.
You will nameclaim - for yourself AND me - and you will do so with no further stipulation.
Nobody else has reason to claim right now, except you and me. And you can do it for both of us.
Me = merchant
Vi = my companion
Now to go back to why I referenced making it to the town so often. It is my objective to make it to the town to sell my goods, with my companion. We travel in this caravan for the "safety in numbers" if you will. (I couldnt find a better way to paraphrase this without directly quoting the pm I have)
End of line.
Btw.. lol @ right said fred.. classic!-
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freeko Goon
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FFS.. I will say this one last time. Its a flavor of my role , that I have coem to realize is misinterpreted (by me) to be an alternate win condition. It says that I am only interested in getting to the town in the flavor, and the rules state that I get to the town at the beginning of day 6.
As for my partnber BEFORE Vi came in.. I think Vi put it about right that he was retarded... and inactive. Also the game started right when the site crashed and was moved to a new host, so that kinda hindered things slightly.
I have already said EVERYTHING in my role pm now without directly quoting it. And I made it clear already that it is said that I am to be wary of him. Again not helped by the brainless retard outburst from PK that caused this whole thing to start.
If you want even more, too bad. I cant give it to you because that would mean a verbatim quote of my role pm, I cannot do that.-
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freeko Goon
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Skimming much Juls?
Oh wait, I know its all about still trying to get me lynched since thats what your scum discussion was about in the night time wasnt it? How could you so blatantly miss EVERYTHING thats happened lately? Or did you not get the memo? Appears another read-thru is in order for you I think.-
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freeko Goon
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Oh wow. I think I get it.. A (were)wolf in sheep's clothing. What an excellent flavor for this game.
Oh, I guess since you made it multiple choice. The closest answers are B for both of them. Though for the first one I would add that PK is/was a (fill in the blank how you wish)ing idiot. The second one is spot on though.-
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freeko Goon
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