Mini 671 - Dwarf Fortress - Game Over!
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Tuberkulos
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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@ iLord: Ok, so if I got this strait; According to you, I just wants a random lynch, even though I stated that I thought roffman's "eagerness" was a bit suspicious. As I see it, atleast I had a more reasonable basis (a hunch if you like) for my vote than both Ramus and Roffman.
Besides, if I wanted to lynch someone quick, I would stay with Roffman since he already has two votes and you none.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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@ andersonw:
I voted iLord because his argument made no sence to me.
First he said that roffman's vote was a joke. I can't see where roffman have stated such a thing.
2. He changes his mind and says that "joke" was the wrong word, claiming that he meaned that roffman (and ramus) was just eager to start the day.
Joking and "eagerness" are (to me) two different things... I did not vote iLord for him voting me, but for his reasons for voting me.
@ reborn537:
Yes, I'm a newb on this forum. But I've played several mafia games on other forums.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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If I wanted a fast lynch, I would let my vote stand on roffman since he was closer of being lynched than iLord...
I want a discussion, and apparently my vote on both roffman and iLord started a discussion which I belive is a good thing.
iLord wrote:We wait until scum screws up and then jump on himWhat I mean is that Roffman and Ramus were just eager to start the day.
So tell me why you voted roffman? Another joke?The day will start naturally - no need to force it. But when a player crosses the line from overeagerness to oppertunism, that's the time to jump.
@Mariyta; votes like that is always a little supicious to me. Care to explain?-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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My thoughts on voting the first day;CoheedCambria09 wrote: Tuber- From experience you should get discussion going by your words, not by throwing around your vote.... it just leads to bad things happening.
At the very beginning of a game, there isn't much else to do but to vote and watch how others vote and react. People will vote eachother for none, random, legitimate and/or stupid resons etc.
These votes serve as a basis for analysises and questions. "Why did you vote him? Why so eager to vote as him?" etc. When some people have thrown out their first votes, people will start to discuss and analyze these actions. How people respond and so on. When the discussion is going on, people will start to change their votes since there will more to go on, hopefully.
Sometimes a lynch is reached just by random votes. This isnota good thing, butsometimesnecessary. If no lynch is reached, we are still on sqaure one, with one town dead by day two. If a lynched is reached however, we are one or two men short, but atleast we are on sqaure two, with much more to analyze and discuss.
I would much rather see a lynch with legitimate reasons behind our votes, that's why I withdrew my first vote and also my current one.
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Tuberkulos Goon
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At the time, yes and no. Right now, no.andersonw wrote:Tuberkulos: Just wondering, do you still go by what you said in post 42? Because in that post, you said "let's just hope for a lucky hit", but then in post 78 you said "I want a discussion".
Let me elaborate. At the time, I was quite eager to get a lynch, since ahugediscussion generally gets going after the first lynch (no matter the outcome). But as I've said; I prefer a lynch with reasons behind it. Since iLord, for some reason, found my vote extremely scummy, a discussion (and disagreement) envoke. Therefore, no need for lynching roffman without any proof/clues of him being scummy (even though his eagernessmightbe interpreted as scummy). Right now, I consider roffman as neutral.
I believe that those two things, go hand in hand...iLord wrote:Plus, you didn't neccessarily want a fast lynch - rather you wanted a random townie lynch.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Claiming this early in the game is always a bit supicious to me, and not a good move in my opinion. At L-2 I would've fully understood your claim, but this early I would rather have seen you wait, until one more vote, with that claim.Timeater wrote:I'm Minkot Custinthrith, a cook. I'm a good guy who recently came to "Osvalanthez". I'm town and I'm not apart of the danger
If your claim really is true and sincere, at this moment it provides us nothing but a higher risk of losing a town-power role the first night.
Who are theseTimeater wrote: I realize I'm L-3 so I'll save the town time and trouble by claiming now, giving us a chance to focus on Bob andother likely candidates.other likely candidates?-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Less than 30 gamesiLord wrote:Tuber, how much experience have you had?
I guess most of the games I've played have just been really slow and poor on analysises the first day. In this game however, this has not been the case.iLord wrote:You should know that games start up on their own - there's no need for a random lynch to start discussion.
A weak wagon maybe, but not striving for a "lucky hit."
People really hung up on my "lucky hit"-phrase. Fully understandable though, I could've chosen some better words for it.
Fair enough. I see, and understand, your point.iLord wrote:Tuberkulos wrote: I believe that those two things, go hand in hand...
Usually, if there's need for a random lynch due to set-up, it tends to be for speed, but in a undisclosed and discovered set-up such as this, random lynches only happen slowly, after discussion has failed.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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I would like to discuss other players before we should even think of claiming.roffman wrote:I'm not blatantly fishing. I believe in game as flavor based as this that scum would need to have been given safe claims. However, if timeater's role matches my description of a cook, then i'd claim as well. That way, we'll have two cleared townies, making the game significantly harder than scum as they either have to waste night kills going through us and protective roles, or keep our votes active in a smaller pool of suspects.
Alternatively, he could claim differently to me, in which case one of us should be lynched, and you get yourselves a scum for the cost of a townie. Fair trade i think.
At the time of your vote, Pesco's poor reasons for voting Timeater was enough for you. Tell me. What made you change your mind? I would also like to hear your reasons (Pesco's reasons) with your own words for why you voted Timeater.Coheed wrote:I'm not jumping out of the spotlight, or deflection. The sentence was true, I was pointing it out, hardly a deflection. And I'm not jumping out the spotlight either. I unvoted because the vote in hindsight was bad and didnt have a solid enough case around it.
My view on current players:
-iLord.Is probably my personal favorite right now. Reasonable and not easily persuaded. I consider him town, but I wouldn't be too suprised if he flipped scum.
-Timeater.He seems townish to me, even though his early claim could be discussed. I wished he had waited with the claim, but from his point of view, I understand why he chose not to.
-Cyberbob.Hard to tell. Said that we should discuss why Timeater was the new target, instead of me. But did nothing but bringing it up.
-Roffman.I don't really get his logic all the time. I don't consider him pro-town.
-Mariyta.Haven't contributed a bit. Oppertunistic, and a very silly reason for unvoting me. Could be a scared townie. Neither town or scum, so far.
-Ramus.Haven't really got a good look of him yet. He definitely can't count.
-Coheed.Oppertunistic when he voted Timeater and when he realised that it could look a little suspicious, he withdrew his vote because that would give everyone what they want, making him look even more suspicious to me. Scummy looking.
-andersonw.This guy haven't really cought my eye. Haven't withdrew his first vote on Timeater which puzzles me a bit.
-Pesco47.I would like to hear some reasonable reasons behind his vote on Timeater. Town or scum, could flip either way.
-Verbal.Is this guy playing?
@ Andersnw: What's your reasons for having your vote on Timeater? If I haven't missed something, you haven't unvoted a single time, right?
@ Pesco47: You admit that you gave no clear reasons. So, what are your reasons for voting on Timeater?
@ Cyberbob:Cyberbob wrote: - Ooh, Tuberkulos' post 42 is scumcumcum....
- Nicely rounded off with a dose of OMGUS in post 44. Good Show
Is this still where you stand?Cyberbob wrote:Tuberkulos- about as solidly scum in my eyes as you can get at this early stage of the game. Which isn't huge, mind, but it's definitely there.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Missed that, my misstake. His jumpiness indeed seems a bit suspicious. Cyber's FoS even led to personal assaults (from both of them). But I do not consider his posts as "fluffy cotton candy". So far neutral to me. If Timeater is about to get lynched though, I might reconsider and be willing to hear Roffman's claim.Pesco47 wrote:My reasons for voting given here.
Coheed is the most scummy looking player right now.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Just saying that you could be scared of getting lycnhed, so you vote some one who is close of being lynched. You have no reason to be scared, but people have been more illogical.Mariyta wrote:
Where do you get scared from? Anyway, I haven't had time to play, so I've asked for a replacement. *waves*Tuberkulos wrote: -Mariyta.Haven't contributed a bit. Oppertunistic, and a very silly reason for unvoting me. Could be a scared townie. Neither town or scum, so far.
I don't think you are scared, just saying that youcould be. As for now, I don't know what to think of you.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Just saying that you could be scared of getting lycnhed, so you vote some one who is close of being lynched. You have no reason to be scared, but people have been more illogical.Mariyta wrote:
Where do you get scared from? Anyway, I haven't had time to play, so I've asked for a replacement. *waves*Tuberkulos wrote: -Mariyta.Haven't contributed a bit. Oppertunistic, and a very silly reason for unvoting me. Could be a scared townie. Neither town or scum, so far.
I don't think you are scared, just saying that youcould be. As for now, I don't know what to think of you.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Are you blaming us for thinking you look suspicious? Sure, we might misread and misinterpret you, but don't forget you have the outmost responsibility of how others read you.CoheedCambria09 wrote:quote from ilord
This is completely false. In a previous game(one of my first) I got into a bit of trouble and drew suspicion. I was town and since I was drawing bad attention I exploded. I completely lost it and all I did was make it worse. So I decide in this game that I'm gonna back off and let things cool down and all that happens is the exact same thing, people still suspect me. holy moley.Coheed doesn't read like scared, panicking townie - he reads like scared, panicking scum.
Townies under pressure either ignore it, explode, or break down. Scum under pressure could do the same things (especially if they are skilled players), but they also have a tendency to back away and to attack others, which is exactly what Coheed did. Townies who are afraid of being lynched tend away from deflection and more at emotional outbursts.
For example, Town or Scum Coheed under pressure could start screaming at the town, but only Scum Coheed would attempt to deflect and back away.
Try to convince us that we are wrong with something else than refering to another game, where you obvoiusly failed to do so. And don't forget that to some people, one behaviour might seem scummy and to others it migth seem like something else. Just becauseblackequals 1 the first time, doesn't mean thatwhiteequals -1 the other.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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@ Sekinj: I think you are going a little bit too far with this iLord vs. Tub - thing. Sure, I disagree with iLord's arguments (and he with mine), but I think that both me and him have come to some sort of understanding for each other's arguments. He understand why I acted the way I did, and I understand why he thought it was scummy. I've explained all that now, so I think it belongs to the past.
Still, wouldn't be suprised if he turned out to be scum. But if I ever will accuse iLord for being scum, it wouldn't be for the him vs. me-thing solely. To much to go on for that right now.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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[quote"sekinj"]as a replacement I may have mis-read the mood of the game as often happens[/quote]
Fully understandable. You got a few points though, that might be of value later if something "suspicious" about iLord turns up.
@ Timeater: You got on the defensive before you even encountered an offensive. Why didn't you wait for anyone to comment on it before you start explaining yourself?-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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One thing that speaks for Timeater's favor is this "too-scummy-to-be-scum"-thing, which I don't like at all. But it is indeed a valid point. Why would he NK Cyberbob, if he knew that he would have to explain himself directly after? Sure, it could be thought as a cover but it would be a very bold move. If Timeater hadn't got on defensive the first thing he did, I would have an easier time to accept him as town. But at the moment, I just don't know what to think about this situation.
Now this is what I'd like to know also.Ramus wrote:@Roff - How does your death prove Tim innocent? More so, how do you truly know he's innocent?-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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It is a possebility, but I find it unlikely. Just a feeling though, you never know.iLord wrote:If the scum get Chef as a safeclaim/role despite Chef being an actual town role, then they could be of different alignment
I do have to agree with iLord's thesis about Timeater and roffman having the same alignment. It seems like the most logical at the moment. If they are town or not is another question to be answered.
I guess that you consider both Sekinj and KoC as scum, but why would you rather vote Sekinj over KoC?Timeater wrote:Will consider a KoC if he gets some votes and a momentum towards a lynch, but I'm quite happy going after Sekinj atm-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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[quote="iLord"]iLord seems to agree with me about Sekinj, which is convient. Like I said, I'm fine with going after either one. I'm flexible and I'll do what the town wants[/b]
Of course it's convenient to have such a townish-looking guy on your side. And I don't find your "flexibility" as a contribution to town. A contribution to a lycnh, yes.
I do agree with you about KoC and Sekinj though. They are in a unconvenient situation, where one of them is most likely to be lynched as it looks right now. But they haven't convinced me yet of being scum(s).-
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Of course it's convenient to have such a townish-looking guy on your side. And I don't find your "flexibility" as a contribution to town. A contribution to a lycnh, yes.Timeater wrote:iLord seems to agree with me about Sekinj, which is convient. Like I said, I'm fine with going after either one. I'm flexible and I'll do what the town wants
I do agree with you about KoC and Sekinj though. They are in a unconvenient situation, where one of them is most likely to be lynched as it looks right now. But they haven't convinced me yet of being scum(s).-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Just wanted to tell my standing on proof and accusations etc. We don't have proof. We have clues. Acting scummy isn't a proof IMO, I rather see it as a clue. By "collecting clues" (reading people, analyzing possible slips etc.) we make accusations.
Proof = factual evidence
Clue = indication
I know this is just semantic, but I wanted to get that out since Pesco and Tim had an argue about proof earlier.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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The fact roffman claims that here are two cooks in this game is indeed a little strange. Claus probably has more imagination than putting two cooks in a relatively small game as this.
The fact that Timeater is the first one to bring up the cook as a role, and that roffman is the one spinning on it is indeed a little suspicious. But on the other hand, he must have knewn that if he would manage to get Timeater lynched, he would get lynched the next day. Either one of them could flip scum as I see it right now.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Excuse me for the terrible grammar, should have previewed.
The fact thet roffman claims that there are two cooks in this game is indeed a little strange. Claus probably has more imagination than putting two cooks in a relatively small game as this.
The fact that Timeater is the first one to bring up the cook as a role, and that roffman is the one spinning on it is indeed a little suspicious. But on the other hand, he must have knewn that if he would manage to get Timeater lynched, he would get lynched the next day. Either one of them could flip scum as I see it right now.
Just came up with this when I corrected the grammar. Maybe roffman confirmed Timeater just because he realized that if he would get him lynched, he would be dead the next day?-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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So we have aMiner, aKobold Thief, anAnimal trainer, acookand ahammerer.
I really hope that we haven't lost three power roles...
I would say that Green and Blue seems like two quite townish-looking colors, in my opinion. The hammerer seem like an anti-town role to me, hence it colors. And I believe that Claus wrote "Not a threat" about the Kobold Thief-role since it could sound like an anti town role.
@ Timeater: You still haven't answered my question. Do you still claim to be cook?-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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@Timater; stop acting like it's obvious that you are town. And that "I'm not a part of the danger"-argument is ridicoulus. Anyone could come up and say that, scum or town, so I don't really see that as a legit proof of you being town. I'm not too fond of this "didn't you read what I said"-attitude at all. Especially when what you said early in the game doesn't prove anything...-
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Tuberkulos
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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I read through the thread a little and found this. So you are indeedTimeater wrote:I'm town and I'm notapartof the dangera partof the danger?
Anyway, I don't know what to think of this mass claim. Reborn got a point though, it's indeed time to try everything, but I don't know if a mass claim is the way to go yet. We have to think about what could be the negative/positive consequences, and which one are we most likely to get at this point.-
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Well, if there are more town power-roles I think it's a bad idea to give those away right now. Or do you suggest that we just tell our names and professions, but not possible powers?Reborn wrote:How exactly do we lose anything from it?
I just saw that Claus confirmed the colors. Blue = town power role, green = vanilla townie, which means that the hammerer is indeed anti-town.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Knight of Cydonia wrote:I'm good with a mass-claim.
Popcorn it, Tim should pick first.
Care to explain your sudden change of heart?Knight of Cydonia wrote:Only scum benefit from a mass-claim in lylo or mylo situations, since it lets them call people's claims scummy or it lets them counter-claim and push a lynch.
I'm against the massclaim for now.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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And yet you mentioned mass-claimingKnight of Cydonia wrote:Tuber: I had a think about it, and realised that though there may be some benefits for town, they pale into insignificance given the benefit to scum.
I'll claim if asked, but I'm not going to start a mass-claim.twice, showing no signs of being sceptic to the idea. What made you reassess?
[quote="Knight of Cydonia]Shall we popcorn the mass claim, if we're going to have one?[/quote]Knight of Cydonia wrote:I'm good with a mass-claim.
Popcorn it, Tim should pick first.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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And yet you mentioned mass-claimingKnight of Cydonia wrote:Tuber: I had a think about it, and realised that though there may be some benefits for town, they pale into insignificance given the benefit to scum.
I'll claim if asked, but I'm not going to start a mass-claim.twice, showing no signs of being sceptic to the idea. What made you reassess?Knight of Cydonia wrote:I'm good with a mass-claim.
Popcorn it, Tim should pick first.
I would also like to add that sekinj really got some valid points about Pesco. His ambivalent style is quite scummy.Knight of Cydonia wrote:Shall we popcorn the mass claim, if we're going to have one?-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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I haven't.reborn537 wrote:Has everyone claimed?
I had to look up what this inhibitor-thingy meant and I found this:
Yet you claimed Pesco... I actually do find it hard to believe that you would get a role like this and still be allowed to claim, since that would automatically draw attention to anyone voting on you since it is the only way to kill you.MafiaWiki wrote:The Inhibitor - An un-nightkillable player. As long as he is alive, the game cannot end.He also can't tell his power to anyone.This might go well if you had some survivors in the game too.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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I can't see how that would happen?Pesco wrote:Now does anyone want a draw?
MafiaWiki wrote:The Inhibitor - An un-nightkillable player. As long as he is alive, the game cannot end. He also can't tell his power to anyone. This might go well if you had some survivors in the game too.Pesco wrote:Inhibitor survivor. Game ends when town wins, or scum outnumber town sufficiently. The best deal scum can now take is 'Happily Ever After'.Pesco wrote:Inhibitor keeps the game going until a win condition has been fulfilled and I decide to end the game.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Well, he have already admitted that he's not town. But what we need to know is wether he is scum or not. I don't buy his claim.
KoC's change of heart with the mass claim idea is a little weird.
I get the feeling that he is trying too hard for his own good to look townish with this post. It's like he's trying to say: "Town wants to claim. I'm town, I'll claim with you guys." Smells fishy to me.KoC wrote:I changed my mind over the claim because it seems to be the will of the town.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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I had a little too much time on my hands today at work. I searched around a little on MafiaWiki and found this and this.Pesco47 wrote:Tuber: I have no problem with what you want to present. I believe you're town and asking for my permission first means you want to make a deal? I'm willing to negotiate with you.
As mentioned this is far fetched, and since you had no problem with me presenting my theory, I guess I'm terribly wrong. Anyway, here it goes:
You said you were a Weaponsmith, and I thought that it could be the same as a Gunsmith. Read about Flavor Cops and apparently they are common in theme games. Therefore I thought that maybe you claimed Inhibitor so that scum wouldn't try to NK you. Giving you atleast one more night to investigate. Why you chose to also claim Survivor was still unanswered with this theory, but then I thought that maybe you thought that the mafia would focus on the town rather than on a third party when trying to lynch someone. The fact that it said that Inhibitor's wasn't allowed to claim strenghten this theory.
As I said, too much time on my hands
I thought we were supposed to be asked before we claim.Reborn wrote:That means Tuber and Anderson.
I'm Minkot Kibzuden, Traveler, Hated Townie.[/quote]-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Where have I stated that I was willing to make a deal? I asked him what kind of deal he was talking about, and told him that I find you and him scummy. At the moment you are the most scummy looking person IMO.Knight of Cydonia wrote:So you find Pesco scummy, but you're still willing to make a deal?
Hmm, are you soft-claiming something here?Pesco wrote:Interesting but also not wrong.
vote KoC-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Ramus, KoC has already claimed.
Andersonw, everyone has already claimed but you.
Pesco, you want to get rid of the scums, yes? So we could actually count you as kinf of a pro-town player? In that case, why would it matter who we lynch (assuming that we wont hit scum)? I get the feeling that all you are trying to do is to save your ass from this lynch...-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Tuberkulos Goon
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Could you also respond to this, please?I wrote:Pesco, you want to get rid of the scums, yes? So we could actually count you as kinf of a pro-town player? In that case, why would it matter who we lynch (assuming that we wont hit scum)? I get the feeling that all you are trying to do is to save your ass from this lynch...-
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Tuberkulos Goon
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 648
- Joined: August 24, 2008
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Tuberkulos Goon
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 648
- Joined: August 24, 2008
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Tuberkulos Goon
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 648
- Joined: August 24, 2008
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Tuberkulos Goon
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1. You claimed to be Inhibitor Survivor. An excuse of why you won't be NK'd. You even say that you want to make a deal, trying to tell us that "With my power we can win".
2. You change your claim to SK. Which seems wierd since there have been only one NK every night. You have of course thought about this, and says that you have obviously been roleblocked or the person you tried to kill had doc protection.
3. You ask for a second mass roleclaim. Trying to make us believe that if we fully claim, we will be able tell friend from foe and you will save us all by killing scum during the night.-
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Tuberkulos Goon
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- Joined: August 24, 2008
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