Large Normal 199: L'Hôtel Pleuvoir (Fin)

[mozamis]

The only real answer is buckshot.

When are we planning on really getting back to wagoning people again?

When are you planning on posting analysis as opposed to vacuous guff?

[mozamis]

VOTE AJ

Nero still doesnt look great. But at least he has posted his opinions, as oppsed to AJ who HAS DONE DOTHING all game apart from posting eff all.

[mozamis]

ok then VOTE: Alisae.

why would scum fake clim vig and then have to deal with the bullshit the next day? IT's a nightmare fake claim.

[mozamis]

but it's also classic scum to fake fatalism.

Indeed, but to that extent? It was hardcore "I'm about to kill myself" frustration.

[Nero Cain]

. I'll reply to other stuff during halftime and/or after the game.

I lied.

Kinda.

vote:SSBM

I'm buying into reasoning that Cloud saying she could be playing a good scum game could have been the crumb

He may be scum that saw that Lapsa reached a 5-person wagon comprised entirely of town and decided that would be an easy excuse to FoS town all day and not have to look at his partners

maybe a scum slip? Like why can't I just you know, actually be good at this game?
She's also not voting her top scum read

there was something else but I can't think of it right now. Anyways I'll try to stop being lazy and reply to the other stuff I want to.

Moz lets chat later

[mozamis]

See, this exchange is making me think Alisae is SK instead of Vig. SK is worried about other shooters, Vig is just part of Town.

Jury's still out though.

Think SK would be more concerned about blending in, i.e prob just not posting as much.
Her stream of consciousness stuff sounds town to me.

so did Cloud though...DOH!

[xSoniaNevermindx]

These are the notable posts I found while rereading that area. Basically these posts lead me to believe that Gamma is town for his resistance to the rest of the players calling Tywin town. In order, those players were Cloud, Cabd, Lapsa, Sonia, Me, I think. Cloud was the main force before the Tywin claim, but soon after the claim Cabd started reasoning with Tywin, then Lapsa said he would not participate in Tywin or Aj lynches today, then Sonia used a "^" symbol to say she also would not participate in those lynches. I later hesitantly said that Tywin was starting to behave townie but I'd be keeping an eye on him. Knowing Lapsa is town I'm looking at Sonia/Cabd, but the problem with that is that Titus doesn't want either of them lynched. I need to know which one you won't lynch because the other is scum, unless you've been misleading me in your answers to my questions Titus. You know which ones I'm referring to. Also looking towards Syryana for the Cloud comment about betting his macaroni that Transcend would agree with him on Tywin. Lapsa provides a genuine reason to not lynch Aj/Tywin, and I feel like sonia hops onto the town!Tywin train of thought rather quickly when the wind shifts, because she seemed pretty emotionally invested in the push on Tywin but the feeling in her posts evaporated unnaturally.

Spoiler:

btw im calling a tvst tywin titus

Really CK? T v T?

Alisea is milking it too

i also hard tr tywin

I think both of you are just too invested and should back off a bit, its easier to see interactions when youre outside tunnels and whatnot, alisea 2nd to last post was explicitiy scumtelling imo

I dont buy twin scum being this obstinated and going after you so hard d1

yo if im wrong on tywin im wrong, i want trans read on that tho, i bet my macaroni he will agree with me

VOTE: Tywin

So 1 of 2 things happened

Either
A) Tywin saw my wall post thought it was towny and ignored giving me an answer when I asked him not once but twice
or
B) I somehow towntold after he made a giant case on me from being number 2 scum with Titus to "Pro Town"

What am I at? L1 or close to it? I'm a straight up vanilla townie. To be exact, there isn't even a vanilla in there. It's just 'townie.'

To answer Sonia: there are 50+ pages on D1. You say I missed your post? Well no shit? I can't reply to 50 pages worth of garbage and hope to find one diamond in the rough. It will literally take HOURS of reading. You can forget that. I'm not gonna do it after seeing very few of you truly evaluating the game if you think I'm scum. I say it over and over again, and I will keep saying it until I'm lynched and flip town. Titus is scum. Remember that after I'm

50 pages is too much to have any say here. It's a shit show right now full of fluff and bad posts. Nobody knows a damn thing with all this useless posting. It shows that nobody is even attempting to sit and think about what's what. 50 pages means D1 is a wash. Way to go town. You'll get a mislynch on D1 and no info out of it. Titus will use that to her advantage to get anyone else who claims she is scum as the next few day's mislynches, because a lot of you seem to be sheep here. It's ridiculous, but I don't see anything changing with 50 pages of useless posting going on. It's really bad and completely demoralizing. I had almost all weekend off, and I can't keep up with this thread. Do none of you have responsibilities or jobs? There are multiple players complaining on this thread about the length and the insane amount of posts. It's not a good thing for town. Scum can and do hide in shit show threads like this.

Anyway, again, I am town. Titus is scum. Take from that what you will after I'm lynched.

I'm asking you to answer my post as you made a giant case on me and I went from sr number 2 to pro town
that's the annoying part
UNVOTE:

FWIW I'm not voting for Tywin today. He's very obviously frustrated railroaded town.

Shame on those of you that are taking him as scum. He can be town who found scum-titus or town that mistook town-titus for scum titus but the frustration and emotion is genuine town with a capital T.

Tywin, let's chat real quick. A large part of your Titus case is that the logic Titus is using is so ~wrong~ it has to come from scum, right?

FWIW I'm not voting for Tywin today. He's very obviously frustrated railroaded town.

Shame on those of you that are taking him as scum. He can be town who found scum-titus or town that mistook town-titus for scum titus but the frustration and emotion is genuine town with a capital T.

Tywin, let's chat real quick. A large part of your Titus case is that the logic Titus is using is so ~wrong~ it has to come from scum, right?

Look at how he talks about a scumread like they are town.

I won't participate in Tywin and Aj lynches today.

^

Gamma, you're scummy

for ignoring Titus and focusing your entire attention on townies.

I do have to admit, the gladiate, if real, neuters my vca too...

This is horrible. VCA still works with gladiation.

No. It really doesn't. I have been reading through here and every post here is theory and a good chunk is wrong. VCA centers on the choices made. Gladiation artificially removes choices from the game, limiting data points.

Since I am making a post educating you, here's what you need for a good VCA

1) Every vote count colored, without bias of town by play
2) A scum flip not caused by a guilty/gladiator
3) 3 days of data to work with
4) A good understanding of optimal town and scum play
5) The ability to filter a VI.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I will get back to reading. If I only see more bad theory spec that makes me rip my hair out, I will be annoyed.

Jesus Christ, pot meet kettle.

Titus is the player that called 4 players the scum team and conf biases everything over her bad theory in hopes of proving it right somehow. It's the definition of a bad theory,

yet she has the nerve to call out Gamma

? Wow. Misplaced fucking ego that is.

Does this look logical to anyone? It looks fake as shit to me. It feels like he knows I'm town in the second post.

Cabs acknowledge my point.

btw i told yall tywin was town

Why does the later have to be the only possibility? You can't call somebody out for doing something illogical unless you ALSO think they're town?

And it's also just as possible he thinks it's a binary state that has: one of {gamma, titus} is scum? As in "both could be scum but they are most likely not scum together"

By no means am I ruling out your line of questioning as a possibility. I just don't see it as the cardinal sin you seem to think it is.

There's also his blatantly false accusation of Titus not asking him questions.

mm, that said

UNVOTE:

Jesus christ this thread did not need 15 more pages overnight, what were you people doing at 3am? I for one sleep.

it annoys me to no end that I have posted, multiple times, why I think Titus is scum and both Ali and Elbrin are acting like it never happened.

Nero your case on titus is that she was the 3rd person to vote on a wagon. You were about to vote gamma instead until you realized it was titus. Which is just....I can't fuck with that. There's no sense there.

"But she also ignored me!"

Yes, yes she did.

I also don't like that there doesn't seem to be any signs of scum hunting or attempts to do so in his ISO.

Ah, that old "he hasn't done anything disregard everything he's said" line. Classic meme bro

The "this guy is doing nothing" logic pisses me off.

Is this directed towards me or uzi?
Because in my view, it's a pretty scum move to, instead of doing any substantial analysis of a player, throw your hands up and say "they haven't done anything. I am throwing shit on their play as a whole. It's literally all bad."

Uzi/Elibirn: I dont like the gladiator claim, but apparently fake claims in mafiascum meta is okay. Elibirn doubled down on it when others took it as a joke, but it's largely null. I do think fake claims are scummy and idk why it's okay in mafiascum, but it is what it is. Uzi/Elibirn could be TvT, but I think one of them are scum. Idk which one, but Titus has weak associations with either one. Her entire scum claim on me was my 'it's only fair' post asking for Uzi to give his reasoning on voting Elibirn. Then again, Elibirn could be scum and Uzi town. Neither are a good lynch today, so this whole point is moot.

Your position here is really bleh. It's flipfloppy as you don't commit to a stance on either of us, saying "it could be TvT, but I think one could be scum, but gee it could be either". It's a lot of words that don't add up to any meaningful analysis and set you up to lynch either of us later. It's weak sauce and it makes me sadface.

It's even more bleh because I think you're town and my original point in talking about this was thus made void when 10 pages of reading later I decided you were town. But this is scummy, m8, don't do this.

I think only Elbin and Alisae and Titus herself think she's the town leader

Me thinking titus is town =/= me thinking titus is town leader

Clearly I am the town president and all other town and all other town are members of my administration

Really? Why are you constantly asking asinine questions?

Okay, here's an example for you:

Titus is scum buddies with Alisae. Without day talk, Alisae is extreme newbscum and doesn't know to not buddy her scum team in-thread. She thinks that's how to play, but obviously Titus can't go and say 'hey Alisae, calm down there buddy, you'll get us both caught!' Without day talk, newbscum Alisae does what she does.

With day talk, the experienced scum would calm her the fuck down and try to minimize her mistakes.

Now that you have the knowledge that day talk is in this game, don't you think that alisae would be more cautious to buddy titus if they were both scum? That titus would use the day talk to say "hey don't do that"

Yet Titus' case on me is good? She said my post asking for Uzi to answer Elibrin's question and saying 'it's only fair' was the scum tell of the century. Really? Now that is fucking terrible, but a lot of you latched onto that as if it was legitimate. Do you even know what my case is? Why defend Titus without looking at what she's done? You're ISOing me a lot apparently, but ignoring others. Why?

*raises hand* hi yes me again tywin, I never bought into that as a scum tell and idk if anyone else did pls calm down

btw im calling a tvst tywin titus

T v S?

t vs t*

Cloud gets things, good for cloud

So, what is your read on me Alisae?

If Tywin flips scum, town. If Tywin flips town, scum.

And Tywin just said he would self-hammer himself. I KNOW Tywin is the kind of person to claim at L-1 instead of self-hammer if he was town. Becuase he knows that is a townie thing to do. He's not trying to prove to us that he's town, he's trying to prove that Titus is scum. And I'm fucking taking his bluff.

Dichotomies are scummy as fuck

About tywin wagon, some of his line looks like genuine frustrated town, even the self comment didnt comme off as forced to me, i once said and did that as town not so long ago with great success, i also was correct about my deathtunnel

More cloud being right

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Alisae

Choo Choo everyone!

Unofficial VC

Titus 3 (Nero Cain, Tywin Lannister, mozamis)
Alisae 2 (Aj The Epic, Elbirn)
Aj The Epic 1 (Transcend)
Lapsa 1 (Pine)
Tywin 4 (Titus, Gamma, Alisae, ssbm_Kyouko)
CloudKicker 1 (Nosferatus)

Not Voting 5 (Lapsa, Cabd, xSoniaNevermindx, Lil Uzi Vert, CloudKicker)

With 17 alive, it takes 9 to lynch.

Did this on my phone but I think it's accurate

Lapsa, you want to talk about anyone but Tywin (not Tywin out of respect for Cabd)?

Townread Tywin around spaghetti.

What else assumptions have you made?

Sub out.

Sorry to do this, but the game exploded with lots of long posts and I'm kinda busy with life. Apologies.

Alisae and Kyouko need to be revisited. That should be the next course of action. So far, I've been happy with how this day is progressing, so I think bouncing onward for now is worth while. Both Kyouko and Alisae have been suspect in the last few pages for various reasons and out of the list of people available to be looked into, these two make the most sense for scum.

So far, I've been happy with how this day is progressing

?

On day 1, being able to quickly cycle through not only the baseline of suspicious people, but the people who have made votes that were suspicious, is a great plus. My general theory of the game is that town can never be more powerful than D2/N3/D3 so getting this much positive information day 1 to have actually formed a town core that we can be reasonably confident in is a win in and of itself.

Okay: Titus; assuming for a second tywin is town; does your pick for the "other" parts of the scumteam change? Who is your top suspect going into day two if tywin is lynched flips VT and I get shot overnight?

Tywin; who is your highest non-titus pick for scum right now?

Lapsa is probably still scum.

Alisae I have a desperate to survive read on and I would compromise there, but I would be gambling.

Move towards investigating/voting there then. I will personally burn all of my townie brownies to derail a lynch on tywin today if you try. We can revisit tomorrow (or later today if those paths prove not that great) if things change but as of right now I see nothing but a death tunnel and your arguments so far have not convinced me. You can either grind up against me and maybe get it pushed through or work with me and make this thread less toxic. Your call.

Ok, Captain Planet is here to clean up this toxic thread. I will shut up about Titus, and do my best to ignore further... Whatever. Cabd gets my TLeader nomination for even trying to mediate it. Scum would be more than happy to let this fester, especially if it's TvT (which neither Titus or I think it is).

Still at work, but will give updated reads when I get a chance to really catch up again. I have about 15 pages to read it looks like, and I skimmed most of the previous 30 as well. Even if Titus is scum, she's not the only one, so it's a pointless venture to keep it going until one of us (probably me) gets lynched. Town will be no closer to finding the other scum, and so I think even keeping this 1v1 with Titus up would be anti-town on my part. I'll drop it.

Cabd, there's a wagon on Twyin for a reason. If I was alone in scumreading Tywin, I would do as you ask. You do not need to babysit me. You need to realize that may I am right. You need to realize that players like Tywin, that if town, need to read the game. We cannot have players like Tywin who ask twice, after mod confirmation, if scum have daychat. That type of player is not engaged in intelligent thought but posts garbage that makes the game impossible, regardless of his alignment. All Tywin has done is attack obvious town. If no one agreed with me, your call would have more use. It doesn't.

If the group decides to spare Tywin, I will unvote him. Not before. We have a pretty solid fucking townblock, so we can remove players like Tywin.

We still don't NEED to go for his removal. The thing is, we also aren't required to listen to him until her decides to post something that isn't him calling out non-existent attacks.

There ARE, as I said, other things to get done. Aka Kyouko and Alisae.

VOTE: Titus
There's being stubborn and then there's being unreasonable
this is the ladder

VOTE: Titus
There's being stubborn and then there's being unreasonable
this is the ladder

I'm still willing to lynch this fyi

VOTE: Titus
There's being stubborn and then there's being unreasonable
this is the ladder

I'm still willing to lynch this fyi

Why? Just because someone doesn't like me is not grounds for lynching.

Gamma annoys me and I want to bias lynch him. Can get behind that wagon
I don't see it as omgus more just as dislike that he thinks I'd slip as scum and he hasn't done anything.

Tldr of gamma's iso: Shade throwing with shallow comments.

AHAHA YOU'RE SCUM.
Read my catchup.

Well that's because I'M NOT CAUGHT UP, MEANING I CAN'T ANALYZE JACK SHIT!

My catchup starts after this post and goes on until my bracketed reads

*sing song voice* all I hear is excusessss

Can we lynch obvscum Sonia?

also, can you be a dear SSMB and walk me through your reasoning for dropping your scum read on Titus and then town reading her?

We've already had this conversation and like I said if you missed it I can't point it out for you, not yet at least. Also want to say if you're caught up like you say you are you should have seen that I didn't SR Titus for being on the lapsa wagon, I had a heightened suspicion of her and the rest of those players. Being on that wagon shifted them into my null scum pile. I treat null scum, scumleans, and scumreads as different things. Not sure if you do though so maybe that's why you're saying I was SRing her

I am caught up save for whats been posted today

I'm cheering because you're a hypocrite. And I have a TR on both Titus and AJ fyi
I do love all these idiots shouting "town v town!" though.

Nvm, maybe you didn't TR me. I saw this originally and didn't see the AJ part. I thought you said 'I have a town read on both of you.' Guess you caught me in another lie /s

You TR Titus and AJ I guess. Looks odd to me. I SR them both. You included. Funny. Who are the idiots you mentioned claiming TvT?

And I'll repeat my question: if I get lynched and flip town, will your reads change?

This is a townie way to handle being caught misunderstanding a post, you admit to it and look back to clarify what really happened and go from there.

Also the links in that post work from desktop, I think it's your phone having a problem

Also woops i forgot i did quote, im sad transcend boi is subbing out, i really wanted to play with him and sonia, one of the reason why i joined the game, lapsa also said he wouldnt be part of tywin lynch but eventally did vote them, also aj you are right its not AI per se, but you have to read in to nd tywin's imo was genuine, much more than titus's iso she has posted as proof

VOTE: lapsa

VOTE: Sonia
Could do Syryana today considering Cloud's intro to the game and the macaroni comment. Imo people tend to crumb in their very early posts if they're going to crumb because they think that's where it will blend in the best, with the rest of the "unusual" posts of RVS.

Hello sonia transcend <3

What part of CLOUD ME AND TRANSCEND KNOW EACH OTHER OFF SITE DO YOU NOT GET
DO I NEED TO LINK YOU OFF SITE GAMES TO PROVE THIS?

[Titus]

I retract my request to shoot Elbrin in the face.

Mozamis, why are you TRing Tywin so hard. A tywin lynch/shot also tells us a lot scumhunting wise right?

[mozamis]

SSBM FOR THE LOVE OF GOD.
PLEASE.
PRESS ENTER.
TO SPACE OUT.
YOUR THOUGHTS.
LIKE.
THIS.
YOU ARE UNREADABLE AT PRESENT.
WITH LOVE,
MOZZA.

[mozamis]

Mozamis, why are you TRing Tywin so hard

Well, why are you scum reading me? Oh yeah, dleayed OMGUs, i forgot. Well done for that.
I have been clear on this. He is so frustrated town.

[mozamis]

A tywin lynch/shot also tells us a lot scumhunting wise right?

Maybe. But really. lynching for info is always dodgy, beacuse so often the onfo gets wifomed for shit.
e.g he flips town.
Do i get town read cos i town read him.
Or am i scum that was trying to get towncred?

Need to lynch who you think is scum, not some dodgy compromise.

[Elbirn]

idk, if you can't see town!Nosferatus from her ISO alone I don't know how to explain it. She screams town to me though.

I'm ignoring the parts of this post that have to do with Moz. I think he should have to defend himself, rather than me getting riled up over you lumping us together. But I wanna touch on this.

I've just read Nos' iso for a refresher. There is nearly zero content. There's not just "little content", or "things I don't agree with". There is quite literally no content. I squinted really really hard and I couldn't find jack shit that would give me any little hint as to why he's remotely town, let alone "screams town".

Like, let me go pull it up again and let's see.. okay his posts are as follows:

Spoiler:

An rvs vote on alisae (with no comment)
Fluff (x4)
A Lapsa townread with a bit of reasoning..k this might be fine
Scumreads pine for wanting to get out of rvs (lmao?)
Fluff (x3)
Votes cloud for a page 1 interaction (this is post 1275 and he couldn't find anything better to do?)
Fluff
Boring scumread on Transcend (syr slot) 1000 posts late
Fluff (x5)
Wants alisae lynched
Fluff (x2)
Really wants alisae lynched, votes her, agrees with Tywin

So what do we have from him as far as actual content, stances made, etc. Well he's got about 1 post (Lapsa townread) that I can look at and say "hey that doesn't suck", out of a whopping 22 total posts. The alisae stance is...okay. I don't agree with lynching her but it's at least a stance. Over 50% is absolutely nothing.

I fail to see how this is obvtown.

*grabs Kyouko by the face, stares into eyes* tell me what you seeeee *shakes head*

[Elbirn]

I retract my request to shoot Elbrin in the face.

You should shoot Elbrin in the face.

Can we lynch lynch Mozamis Elbrin Tywin SSM nero

Yeah that great to Tipsy Titus

Pick one

So is that a no on telling me why I should vote for moz?

No help, just suddenly elbirn is a shitter?

Titus you're talking about me but not to me and it makes my heart super unhappy

I love and value you gum drop goblin so help me Obi-Wan kenobi you're my only hope

[mozamis]

I mean, Christ, I barely undersant SSBM, but vague guess is town. At least he appears to be thinking about the game for himself.
So null- town.

[mozamis]

*understand

[mozamis]

Not lynching Titus, Alisae, Nosferatu, or Cabd today.

Why not Nos?
I admit, I dont have much to go on apart from his general lurkiness, but unlynchable? Dont get ya.

[mozamis]

Damn it, was just gonna say I'm not gonna read SSBM anymore, and i see he votes me.
Ah well, maybe I'll get to his posts later. But they are an effing nightmare of incoherence.

[mozamis]

Last ditch effort for scum to derail the wagon on the player they think is their traitor?

I thought the wagon was based on... not a lot.
What you are saying is wrong.

[mozamis]

Pretty much fully caught up, though i skimmed SSBM.
Not much has changed.
Sense a vague drift against me.
Which UTTER BALLS.
But yeah, still think AJ, nero are good bets.

[Titus]

A tywin lynch/shot also tells us a lot scumhunting wise right?

Maybe. But really. lynching for info is always dodgy, beacuse so often the onfo gets wifomed for shit.
e.g he flips town.
Do i get town read cos i town read him.
Or am i scum that was trying to get towncred?

Need to lynch who you think is scum, not some dodgy compromise.

Are you townreading Tywin? If so, why?

Why are you supposing I am townreading Tywin. I am not.

[Titus]

I retract my request to shoot Elbrin in the face.

You should shoot Elbrin in the face.

Can we lynch lynch Mozamis Elbrin Tywin SSM nero

Yeah that great to Tipsy Titus

Pick one

So is that a no on telling me why I should vote for moz?

No help, just suddenly elbirn is a shitter?

Titus you're talking about me but not to me and it makes my heart super unhappy

I love and value you gum drop goblin so help me Obi-Wan kenobi you're my only hope

I am hungover. Later.

[Gamma Emerald]

Lil Uzi Vert has been killed Night 1. He was a...

Spoiler:

Town Vanilla Cop

.

CloudKicker has been killed Night 1. He was a...

Spoiler:

Mafia Loved Traitor

.

It is now Day 2. Dead thread additions and first post will be updated later.

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Reads are fucking REKT

[Aj The Epic]

Mozamis if your reads were any worse, I'd wonder if you were reading the wrong thread.

The fun thing of your read on me is you refuse to explain it and now go after a 'lack of content' when Cabd was asking us to hold off on speed wagoning this obvious scumslot in SSBM_Kyouko

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Mozamis if your reads were any worse, I'd wonder if you were reading the wrong thread.

The fun thing of your read on me is you refuse to explain it and now go after a 'lack of content' when Cabd was asking us to hold off on speed wagoning this obvious scumslot in SSBM_Kyouko

Just so we're clear Cabd never called me obvious scum (at least not on D2, and I don't think he did D1), that's Aj. Cabd told people not to speed wagon me, but Aj is the one calling me scum

[Aj The Epic]

Is there a point here? Other than pretending me calling you scum makes you any less of it?