How about you vote Gamma with me?In post 168, gerryoat wrote:I like how that's all it takes for you to change your read on me. But, I actually agree with him. I was actually going to ask you why you TR me, cause I haven't done anything so far that would warrant a townread so far.In post 164, Gamma Emerald wrote:Okay.
Null - Gerry (seems reasonable, but hasn't really added much yet.)
I mainly said that because he diffused everyone's getting up in arms about your reads.
Mini 1830 - Game Over
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Grendel Mafia Scum
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RhazhBash Goon
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Gamma Emerald AnySurvivorAny
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CCC Goon
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Yeek.Day one is something like 40 pages.In post 155, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
It happens:In post 151, CCC wrote:I guess I am pessimistic about day one. Later days, when there's some decent info to work with, I consider far more useful.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=60961
Oh, quite. Don't get me wrong - day one provides a lot of useful and important information for future days, and I really shouldn't minimise that. I don't think much of the day oneIn post 155, VictorDeAngelo wrote:I'm sure there's more. That said games aren't won on day 1. What's important on day 1 is getting that everyone contributes to that all important first lynch. It doesn't have to be well informed (as town's don't have a lot of info) but it in itself provides info in later days.lynch, but day oneinfocan make the game. So, yes, discussion on day one is important.
It's a bit unpleasant for the broken egg, though.In post 155, VictorDeAngelo wrote:If we get a scumflip today that's great. But if we get a townflip, oh well. You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs.-
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CCC Goon
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What you did was suggest that there were either three mafia, or three mafia and a serial killer. This carries the weak implication that you knew there were three mafia, but weren't sure about the SK. It's a terribly weak case, but I have no even halfway decent cases.In post 159, Gamma Emerald wrote:CCC- I mentioned the part about him being consistent on scumteam size as well, but here’s the interesting part: he attacked me for my comments about it. Got anything to say for yourself, bud?
What I did was suggest there might be three scum. I didn't suggest any other scenarios. I don't think this carries the same implications.-
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Gamma Emerald AnySurvivorAny
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I think your post was worse because you ONLY stated that there was likely 3 mafia, without branching out into other bits of speculation. And I never said it HAD to be a Serial Killer. A Lyncher or Survivor would be perfectly fine.<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”-
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CCC Goon
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...let me rephrase that then. I wasn't trying to say "Well I do that all the time so its not AI". I was trying to say "Well, that's how I play as Town".In post 161, Grendel wrote:In the post right after 121 you referenced how you math in other games. And I think you did it a couple other times this game to. By "it" I mean you have said, "Well I do that all the time so its not AI" in response to accusations. I don't like that because it doesn't refute the argument so much as it lampshades it. Lamp shading a problem doesn't make it go away. Saying you do something as either alignment doesn't make you town.
I don't have a good idea of how I play as scum yet. All of the completed games I've been in, I've been Town.-
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Gamma Emerald AnySurvivorAny
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Well in my last game with Grendel, it was the same for him. I don't think Grendel is scum this time, but I DEFINITELY think you are.In post 181, CCC wrote:
...let me rephrase that then. I wasn't trying to say "Well I do that all the time so its not AI". I was trying to say "Well, that's how I play as Town".In post 161, Grendel wrote:In the post right after 121 you referenced how you math in other games. And I think you did it a couple other times this game to. By "it" I mean you have said, "Well I do that all the time so its not AI" in response to accusations. I don't like that because it doesn't refute the argument so much as it lampshades it. Lamp shading a problem doesn't make it go away. Saying you do something as either alignment doesn't make you town.
I don't have a good idea of how I play as scum yet. All of the completed games I've been in, I've been Town.<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”-
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CCC Goon
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No, I said threeIn post 180, Gamma Emerald wrote:I think your post was worse because you ONLY stated that there was likely 3 mafia, without branching out into other bits of speculation. And I never said it HAD to be a Serial Killer. A Lyncher or Survivor would be perfectly fine.scum. That could be three mafia (and likely is), or it could be two mafia and a serial killer.
Your original post (and now this post supports that) look like you know there's three mafia, and are speculating about what else there might be.-
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CCC Goon
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Believe it or not, this fits my Town meta too. Every game I've ever been Town in, I got lynched day one.In post 182, Gamma Emerald wrote:Well in my last game with Grendel, it was the same for him. I don't think Grendel is scum this time, but I DEFINITELY think you are.
(This may be why I think so little of day one lynches).-
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Gamma Emerald AnySurvivorAny
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Say what now? You don't think much of Day 1 lynches? Well I do. You can't throw simply rule out the Day 1 lynch, that's crazy.In post 184, CCC wrote:
Believe it or not, this fits my Town meta too. Every game I've ever been Town in, I got lynched day one.In post 182, Gamma Emerald wrote:Well in my last game with Grendel, it was the same for him. I don't think Grendel is scum this time, but I DEFINITELY think you are.
(This may be why I think so little of day one lynches).<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”-
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Gamma Emerald AnySurvivorAny
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Well I'm sorry for misinterpreting your post. And I pretty much know there are 3 mafia, because it's a 11 person game. Having a Serial Killer is like having an Independent Vigilante who has to eliminate everyone, not just the mafia. I also assume that because I don't want to have to worry about thinking we're safe to mislynch and then whoops, one extra mafia then I thought, we lose! I chose the logical maximum to account for that.In post 183, CCC wrote:
No, I said threeIn post 180, Gamma Emerald wrote:I think your post was worse because you ONLY stated that there was likely 3 mafia, without branching out into other bits of speculation. And I never said it HAD to be a Serial Killer. A Lyncher or Survivor would be perfectly fine.scum. That could be three mafia (and likely is), or it could be two mafia and a serial killer.
Your original post (and now this post supports that) look like you know there's three mafia, and are speculating about what else there might be.<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”-
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gerryoat Survivor
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VictorDeAngelo Mafia Scum
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What do reads list have to do with conflict?In post 169, gerryoat wrote:I kinda like Grendel trying to get "conflict" in the game, which in a sense is how you get reads more. So I do slightly tr that from him. But his actions and his words are a bit off right now. He says this game needs more conflict, but he already laid out a list of reads. Why does he keep saying this game needs more conflict when he already has a list of reads 3 pages in.
I actually read this as Rhazh defending snake from me.In post 174, Gamma Emerald wrote:
Grendel, this is what I was talking about. It's a strange way to distance, to be sure, but it kinda looks like distancing. And I do acknowledge that he mentioned me too, but that could have been an attack on me, or an attempt to group me in with Eager.In post 87, RhazhBash wrote:The page 3 stuff between Snake and Gamma is 100% fluff. I don't see how Victor can be scumreading snake for it either. Regardless I don't see it as alignment indicative.
Also a huge pet peeve of mine is when people waste too much time on setup spec. Setup spec won't win Town the game, so quit it and start posting some real content.
Yeah, well I've had longer day 1s. Personally I prefer more shorter/more direct day ones.In post 178, CCC wrote:
Yeek.Day one is something like 40 pages.In post 155, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
It happens:In post 151, CCC wrote:I guess I am pessimistic about day one. Later days, when there's some decent info to work with, I consider far more useful.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=60961
Yeah, I've never liked being lynched early either, but that's part the game and you get a cool dead chat where you can complain about the people who lynched while waiting for a new game.
It's a bit unpleasant for the broken egg, though.In post 155, VictorDeAngelo wrote:If we get a scumflip today that's great. But if we get a townflip, oh well. You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs.
So if we don't lynch you today, that means your scum right?In post 184, CCC wrote:
Believe it or not, this fits my Town meta too. Every game I've ever been Town in, I got lynched day one.In post 182, Gamma Emerald wrote:Well in my last game with Grendel, it was the same for him. I don't think Grendel is scum this time, but I DEFINITELY think you are.
(This may be why I think so little of day one lynches).-
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Manuel87 Goon
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I generally dont like when ppl say "there are 1-2 scum in this group of people" when the group they are talking about is exactly 50% of the players (self not included)In post 160, Grendel wrote: Do you like/dislike anything else in 102?
Which in return means he also thinks there are 1-2 scum in the other group.
@RhazhBashu: would you mind answering my question in 92-
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CCC Goon
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Day oneIn post 185, Gamma Emerald wrote:
Say what now? You don't think much of Day 1 lynches? Well I do. You can't throw simply rule out the Day 1 lynch, that's crazy.In post 184, CCC wrote:Believe it or not, this fits my Town meta too. Every game I've ever been Town in, I got lynched day one.
(This may be why I think so little of day one lynches).interactionsare important, because that sets the stage for scumhunting on later days. And I can see a good argument tohavethe day one lynch, just for the small chance of it actually hitting scum. I just think that is asmallchance.-
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CCC Goon
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Others have suggested things like two teams of two mafia, or two mafia and a SK. You seem suspiciously certain of the threeIn post 186, Gamma Emerald wrote:
Well I'm sorry for misinterpreting your post. And I pretty much know there are 3 mafia, because it's a 11 person game. Having a Serial Killer is like having an Independent Vigilante who has to eliminate everyone, not just the mafia. I also assume that because I don't want to have to worry about thinking we're safe to mislynch and then whoops, one extra mafia then I thought, we lose! I chose the logical maximum to account for that.In post 183, CCC wrote:
No, I said threeIn post 180, Gamma Emerald wrote:I think your post was worse because you ONLY stated that there was likely 3 mafia, without branching out into other bits of speculation. And I never said it HAD to be a Serial Killer. A Lyncher or Survivor would be perfectly fine.scum. That could be three mafia (and likely is), or it could be two mafia and a serial killer.
Your original post (and now this post supports that) look like you know there's three mafia, and are speculating about what else there might be.mafia, especially considering that you're a good deal less certain of the total number of scum over all factions.-
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CCC Goon
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Conflict causes people to talk and interact. From these interactions, reads can be formed, and refined.In post 188, VictorDeAngelo wrote:What do reads list have to do with conflict?
Longer ones will give you more to work with, and give scum more chance of somehow slipping up...In post 188, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
Yeah, well I've had longer day 1s. Personally I prefer more shorter/more direct day ones.In post 178, CCC wrote:Yeek.Day one is something like 40 pages.
Yeah, it's part of the game. Personally, I'd rather like to explore one of theIn post 188, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
Yeah, I've never liked being lynched early either, but that's part the game and you get a cool dead chat where you can complain about the people who lynched while waiting for a new game.It's a bit unpleasant for the broken egg, though.otherparts of the game this time round.
You would certainly be able to make an excellent statistical argument to that effect.In post 188, VictorDeAngelo wrote:
So if we don't lynch you today, that means your scum right?In post 184, CCC wrote:Believe it or not, this fits my Town meta too. Every game I've ever been Town in, I got lynched day one.
(This may be why I think so little of day one lynches).-
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CCC Goon
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In this game, assuming the existence of three scum, the odds of a randomly selected group of five people (if a single known Town player is removed from consideration) containing zero scum is 16.807%. This is the same as the odds of the randomly selected group containing three scum.In post 189, Manuel87 wrote:
I generally dont like when ppl say "there are 1-2 scum in this group of people" when the group they are talking about is exactly 50% of the players (self not included)In post 160, Grendel wrote: Do you like/dislike anything else in 102?
Which in return means he also thinks there are 1-2 scum in the other group.
@RhazhBashu: would you mind answering my question in 92
Thus, the odds of five randomly selected players (after putting aside one known Town player) containing either exactly one or exactly two scum is 66.386%.
If there are two or four scum, these numbers change somewhat.
But Grendel didn't just say that in 102. He took his five players, and heranked usin order of perceived scumminess. He didn't just say "one or two of these five people are scum". He said "of these five people, this is how scummy I think they are, and this is why."-
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eagerSnake Mafia Scum
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eagerSnake Mafia Scum
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eagerSnake Mafia Scum
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The_Jester Mafia Scum
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eagerSnake Mafia Scum
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If he says that it would probably hold up against any random post, then he is insinuating it probably holds up against his post, too.In post 141, Gamma Emerald wrote:I really don't understand that bit about the random post holding up. Could you explain a little more, Eager?
Why not?In post 142, VictorDeAngelo wrote:If I have an ulterior motive I'm not going to admit to it. If I'm lazy I'm not going to admit that either.
I think there are better lynches for today than Gamma, I still tr him more from earlier than others.In post 149, Grendel wrote:@Snakebuddy, Do you still think Gamma is town?
Readlists are boring. We'll try not to be too noisy. We'll only do like 4-5 people.The_Jester wrote:Can't you both just post readlists? It would create much less noise pollution.-
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VictorDeAngelo Mafia Scum
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Do you really want me to explain it. Because if you do, it's probably going to sound quite patronising and not actually lead us anywhere towards catching scum.
Why not?In post 142, VictorDeAngelo wrote:If I have an ulterior motive I'm not going to admit to it. If I'm lazy I'm not going to admit that either.
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