Blitz 1: C9++ (GAME OVER!)

[Kop]

Titus it may pay for you to rethink everything. Mass claiming day one is a big no no.

[Kop]

Finishing work soon, once I'm at a computer I will go through all of this. Hate doing this on a phone.

[Kop]

Also one flaw is the set up may have an sk

Not a flaw. An additional kpn makes it harder on scum to fake claim.

Looks like scum will know there is an sk and just relay on them for kills

They won't know for sure until night one is finished. And a SK is just as dangerous to them, as a cop and vigilante is, so they won't be necessarily be relying on them for the kills.

[Kop]

Titus was saying I "lurked" And was voting me because I want offline for 3 hours to watch football games. He called me out for lurking after 15 minutes.
Also the massclaim seemed like scum trying to find power roles.

PEDIT FLUBBER: Im at L-1, and I would like someone else to vote Ranger before I vote him.

If I vote Ranger, what does that alter? Seriously?

Blocky shouldn't be at L-1. Agreeing with the current wagons can be opportunistic. It can also mean that the people on those wagons are making good arguments and persuading people, which is what town is supposed to do. I rather think someone is opportunistic when they make abrupt changes from one wagon to another.

On the positive side, he noted that Ranger is buddying, which is something I thought too after Ranger proposed a town block.

Four people - Kraeg, Ocean, Kop, ETL - have post counts in the single digits. I'll bet there's 1-2 scum there. From the rest I'm suspicious of Marge and Ranger.

I hate Titus' breaking idea, but I butt heads with Titus on breaking almost every time we play together so that's not giving me a read.

I don't like town blocks, especially when there is no confirmed townies to be within a block. I understand and back it up, if it is made up with players who have been confirmed as town, in one way or another. But not when they are unconfirmed, regardless of how townie they look. A scum member could easily be town read for there actions within the game, and slip into the block which will make it harder for the rest of us to convince that they are scum if the people within the block don't believe that is the case.

You could be right that there could be 1 or 2 scum within the players who have single digits, but however I wouldn't use that as alignment indicative. ETL has only one post in the game, and I believe that was a vote on Titus, in RVS.

That slot needs prodding if it hasn't already been done so

. Ocean has pretty much focused on Titus for the whole 4 posts made, promised us a more substancial post tomorrow. If he fails to follow up on that, I think that would require pressure on Ocean. Kraeg I am not sure about, yeah your in a different zone but you can still interact, you can make the post then read back the next time your on? Yeah it won't be like a chat room, where you make a post the person responds pretty much straight away, but you can still interact. It is difficult when you sign off and come back on and there's 10 pages to read through, but you can overcome that.

[Kop]

Titus it may pay for you to rethink everything. Mass claiming day one is a big no no.

Usually you're right. Open setup. Fast deadlines. Hard to fake claim. Hard to kill BC choice must be made in 24 hours. Mass claim good in this situation.

It is not good, whilst yes I have thought about it, I still think the negatives overrule the positives. We roleclaim further down the line when numbers tell us so, but not day one. Scum won't have a hard choice if they see what roles are out there. Are you proposing scum kill the PR's whilst we lynch the VT's?

[Kop]

Does anybody not find it strange that Blocky has been at L-1 for a while now, and nobody has posted intent or even hammered him. Does this spell an indication that scum are on his wagon?

[Kop]

Already on his wagon that should say.

[Kop]

Pretending to be participating by feeding into this pointless massclaim discussion?

Take it either way you like.

[Kop]

Do you think it does?

Yes I think it does.

What is your vote on Block based on?

[Kop]

ETL, how is Kraegs #178 a townslip?

[Kop]

ETL, how is Kraegs #178 a townslip?

We don't use QTs on this site anymore.

Fair enough. I'm presuming QT's are Quicktopics?

[Kop]

Kop trying to get the town slip in while it's fresh!

@especiallythelies. Abbreviated ETL, have you participated on mafia on footballforums?

[Kop]

Kop trying to get the town slip in while it's fresh!

@especiallythelies. Abbreviated ETL, have you participated on mafia on footballforums?

yeah but I don't think I was in any games with you there. I just know you're from there.

Yes, you participated there with me. Name rang a bell and I had to ask..

The Hitman is my name over there.

[Kop]

Anyway. Here is the wagon posts on Blocky.

#8 Marge votes. Reason - Stealing vote.
#29 Titus votes. Reason - Flash Wagon blitz.
#30 Vedith votes. Reason - Lets go lets go.
#40 Marge unvotes. Mistakenly votes for him?
#60 Firebringer votes. Reason - ??
#65 Firebringer Unvotes. Reason - Sleeping
#79 Marge revotes. Reason - Thought setup was different.
#82 Ythan votes. Reason - Kill This.
#119 Ranger votes. Reason - Agrees
#184 Firebringer revotes - For town credit
#237 Marge Unvotes. Reason - Not sure.

[Kop]

I don't particularly care for the Blocky wagon as I have a hard on for Persivul at the moment.

Kinky.

[Kop]

I don't particularly care for the Blocky wagon as I have a hard on for Persivul at the moment.

Kinky.

Join me?

As long as you keep the whips and chains in the cupboard.

VOTE: Persivul

[Kop]

It could be a case of if he is hammered, flips town, you can claim you said it was a bad wagon and gain town credit?

[Kop]

Does it show that you were right?

Who you referring too?

[Kop]

Does it show that you were right?

Ignore my last post, seen it and asked, looked a bit up, I see what it's refering too.

[Kop]

Persivul. You say what you said about my post towards Blocks wagon, blocks wagon was formed on probably the littlest thing and it ran up. You soft defending it, could be a case you know he is town, and you know he's going to flip that, you get town credit because you were the one who defended it, if Block is hammered.

[Kop]

Flipity flop.

You got a vote on marge but you haven't really interacted with her or pressed hard on that matter. If you want to lynch marge, you are going to have to press it harder.

I can place a vote and say the same as you. I have a vote in said person, doesn't mean zilch if your not going to press it further than that.

[Kop]

Why do people use Hyrdras? I never have quite grasped the whole of it, or it's whole purpose.

[Kop]

Why do people use Hyrdras? I never have quite grasped the whole of it, or it's whole purpose.

Hydras - two or ore people in a single account - are used to spread the workload or to bounce ideas with someone I suppose. I've never seen the point either, and I hate them. If a game has more than one I generally won't join.

Alts - two or more accounts for one person - are used to avoid meta reads. Again, I don't see the point. Too easy to slip up (we've had two slips in this game already), and then the alt isn't worth much. Plus it would IMO be too much work to try to change your writing style.

Thanks, makes sense to me now. Too much caffuffle for me personally. I'd rather try and alter my meta on my one account if I want to avoid meta reads.

[Kop]

Vonflare replaces Vedith.

Kop has been prodded.

I'm here. Just reading back now.

[Kop]

@Kop

This is an interesting progression:

263 - You respond to the post in which I said Blocky's wagon was bad, commented on Ranger's proposed town block, and commented on lurkers. You completely ignored the part about Blocky, only commenting on town blocks and lurkers. So, you didn't think my position on the Blocky wagon was an issue.

307 - You list the votes on Blocky and note that they lack substance. So, you seem to agree with me.

313 - You vote me without explanation, at ETL's request.

316 - You make a weak wifom argument which you could have made back in 263 if you thought it had merit.

Other than sheeping ETL, you've mostly talked about the breaking issue or just made small talk. There's very little original scum hunting coming from you.

I'll admit about post 263, I didn't fully read the whole of your post in great detail. I quickly glanced over it and saw your comments on Ranger, then saw you mention my name.

Post 307, I quoted all of the votes, to which I think need a look at, because there is one at least who is scum on that wagon. You kind of have a point to what you were making, but that still doesn't rule out that you could be the other scum who doesn't join the wagon, and actually try to convince town there wrong in this lynch. It might not be the case, but I'm sure, you would have seen it over the time of playing mafia, so I can't rule it out.

313, I think the whole point of what she made against you, is viable, and I somewhat agree with it. I'm not ruling things out.

316, that is a case of I didn't think about it at the time I made post 263, when I was joining the whole case, that's when it came to mind, and I put it out there.

[Kop]

Wrong.

CCs are both very mathmatically unlikely to both be town.

There's a 10 percent chance of a V in any particular spot. To get three Vs would require a lot of sheer coincidence but I'd say it's less than 5% of both telling the truth. So we'd just shoot each other. If one lived, they were confscum.

If one lived they were confscum, I'm assuming you mean the one that survived is the SK, and has chosen BP over the immunity for one night from the cop. That's a strong claim to make, if you are already assuming that the SK has chosen BP (if the SK is actually in the game) over immunity for one night.

I can't tell you how much I actually hate these trades, because there is negatives, and pros, but the negatives actually overcome the Pros of it all.

[Kop]

It could be a crumb, or it could be the fact that he loves dougnuts, and as no relevance to the game?

[Kop]

Because it was obvious.

I missed it at first.

At first I wanted to make sure

we

didn't target the same person.

Did you just admit that you were helping scum find a target?

When FB said he wasn't crumbing, there was zero harm in stating it.

He only needed to say it because you had already stated that he made an obvious crumb. The damage had already been done. People crumb PRs. Scum want to kill PRs, so they would have looked back and found it.

I had to look back to see it. When Titus mentioned it, have I missed something.

Titus, who are you proposing to shoot, if you are decided to be kept alive?

[Kop]

Your point?

Just havin fun, getting some perspective on other players, getting to know yall.

I'm from England, and I am 29. Would you like to go on a date, so you can get to know me better

Spoiler:

[Kop]

UNVOTE: Persivul

VOTE: Titus

[Kop]

Ocean

etl

and Marge for scum

If this is a thing that has traction, I'd rather it go through today rather than later on. I don't have the time or energy to argue with people who have already convinced themselves without bothering to ask me anything or try to figure me out. I'm too busy with school and work.

So hop to it. There's already one vote there, Flubber. Add yours.

A replacement would be more likely to have the time/energy to defend themselves

Or at least the time/energy to continue to scumhunt past a reads list

I don't see this as optimal town play and the sarcastic undertones in the way you challenge people to wagon you seems to have an ulterior motive. Like when a parent says "do whatever the hell you want" and then throws something at you for doing it

I can't disagree with any of this to be honest.

Part of me is telling me she is trying to appear a frustrated townie so that we think 'hang on scum wouldn't put themselves up for a lynch this easily'. It's similar to self voting that kinda gives that impression too.

I don't know what to make from the whole lynch me scenario she is playing. What do we gain from her lynch? Apart from her flip?

..... do you not... realize that Ocean was my first vote and my current vote?

Yeah that's where your vote is, but don't you think if you flipped scum, it could be trying to break a connection off into making us think he isn't scum.


I'm not fully sure where I'm going to put my vote, I haven't read the thread in great detail as I am quite heavily tied up until tomorrow morning, so I will get back to this tomorrow lunch time, and give some thoughts.

[Kop]

If it's a regular vig claim sure you can keep watching them but 1 shot vig is like the easiest/laziest sk fakeclaim in this setup.

This seems absolutely backwards. If you're a serial killer and you claim vig, then you can shoot every night. If you claim one-shot vig and you continue to shoot, then you're outing yourself as a liar.

In theory, I can see where Ythan is coming from, because claiming a regular vig, it couldn't hold strong credit than a 1 shot because if you think further into it, she could shoot the first night, then stop killing after that and just help people towards a lynch, and if she isn't nightkilled or lynched, she rides that claim to the bank.

Claiming a regular vig, people might start to think, and they might just figure it out that she isn't exactly the vig we are thinking of.

And the other thing you have to think about, is by claiming regular vig, mafia will want that out of the game because they are a threat, so a SK claiming vig just basically kills them off, but by claiming one shot, she takes that shot then doesn't do anymore after that, so in theory mafia, don't see her as a threat anymore because in effect, they see the SK as a VT.

But obviously she flipped town, and I was on that wagon. My vote was naked but I was pretty much convinced that she was the SK from reading the posts in this thread. I don't like the idea of trading, I have seen it many a time where they offer themselves up to the town in order to be kept alive, and it just didn't benefit the town whatsoever. If I believe your genuinely scum, we don't trade, I'd rather the rope around your neck, simply because we let you live one night, you do what we tell you, but then muddy the water to break connections with partners.

ETL, I'm not sure what game you are playing, but if your town, you don't offer yourself up for a lynch, regardless of what suspicion you have. Come on, defend yourself, prove you are town, get the suspicion of you, and play to your win con and find scum. If you feel you can't bypass your suspicion and want to be lynched, I suggest you replace out, because by lynching you, you flip town, you are helping scum, more than helping your win con in winning as town.

[Kop]

Fucking yikes how do you claim vig un cc'd and still get wagoned that fucking hard

Easy: by having scum on the wagon. Lots of scum. Maybe even three.

I'm dead serious, I'd vote to lynch any of the members of that Titus wagon.

In related posting: my scumread on Firebringer has vanished. With the defense of Titus, I don't see scum defending her in that manner.

How do you not see scum defending her in that manner?

[Kop]

I am intrigued at the argument of Titus SK but I don't really want to lynch her oddly enough.

VOTE: kop

Can we lynch this instead?

During the wagon of Titus, you tried to get a wagon formed on me, with no basis or arguement to show for that vote. And ever since the flip, you haven't followed it through. Obviously for you to wanting to lynch me, you obviously have a scum read on me, you have YET to engage myself, asked any questions, or even followed it through.

What was the whole basis of your vote being on me during that wagon on Titus?

[Kop]

With regards to ETL, I don't like the "lynch me" mentality. It doesn't make sense. If you're really pro-town, why would you even get yourself lynched on purpose, and give another mislynch for the town. That's definitely a bad thing to do.

People don't think that way.
It's really null because you either have players who really do get fed up or scum that fake the emotion.

I am intrigued at the argument of Titus SK but I don't really want to lynch her oddly enough.

VOTE: kop

Can we lynch this instead?

During the wagon of Titus, you tried to get a wagon formed on me, with no basis or arguement to show for that vote. And ever since the flip, you haven't followed it through. Obviously for you to wanting to lynch me, you obviously have a scum read on me, you have YET to engage myself, asked any questions, or even followed it through.

What was the whole basis of your vote being on me during that wagon on Titus?

I made points why your vote was scummy.

You made your points, Prohawk didn't. That's what I am trying to work out, I understand people making points for there votes, but when they don't when trying to start a wagon, I find it baffling.

I didn't put any of my points forward when I voted for Titus, but the points had already been put forward by others, and I did put my opinion forward, before I placed my vote.

[Kop]

With regards to ETL, I don't like the "lynch me" mentality. It doesn't make sense. If you're really pro-town, why would you even get yourself lynched on purpose, and give another mislynch for the town. That's definitely a bad thing to do.

People don't think that way.
It's really null because you either have players who really do get fed up or scum that fake the emotion.

I am intrigued at the argument of Titus SK but I don't really want to lynch her oddly enough.

VOTE: kop

Can we lynch this instead?

During the wagon of Titus, you tried to get a wagon formed on me, with no basis or arguement to show for that vote. And ever since the flip, you haven't followed it through. Obviously for you to wanting to lynch me, you obviously have a scum read on me, you have YET to engage myself, asked any questions, or even followed it through.

What was the whole basis of your vote being on me during that wagon on Titus?

I made points why your vote was scummy.

You made your points, Prohawk didn't. That's what I am trying to work out, I understand people making points for there votes, but when they don't when trying to start a wagon, I find it baffling.

I didn't put any of my points forward when I voted for Titus, but the points had already been put forward by others, and I did put my opinion forward, before I placed my vote.

Actually looking back at my posts, it wasn't a strong opinion, but it was just the basis of the trade that Titus proposed, I don't like trades, I think the whole situation would still be there on day two, and wouldn't have been resolved. That element of suspicion would still be there, and would distract us.

[Kop]

this is terrible.

What's your objection? Put out your points anyone can say this is terrible.

[Kop]

this is terrible.

What's your objection? Put out your points, anyone can say this is terrible.

Missed out the comma in between points and anyone.

I'd rather someone put out points about why it's terrible other than saying it's terrible. It doesn't really convince me that it is indeed that, it's lazy way of objecting to a wagon than having to prove to why it is that.

@persuvial what is your facts of your vote on Firebringer?

[Kop]

Vote Count #2.4:

Not Voting:

Kop

17 hours left and no vote. Seems like scum that doesn't want VCA used against him in late game.

That is an excellent observation on quoting my no vote.

But you said the answer yourself, there is 17 hours left.

[Kop]

I woudn't mind a lynch between either Ythan or Firebringer.

I have read through some of there ISO's, and can't disagree with others.

I don't like the Ocean wagon, simply because reading through a few of his posts, I'd put Ythan or Fire ahead of him in the lynch pool.

We aren't lynching ETL.

[Kop]

VOTE: Ythan

L-1 I believe.

[Kop]

I have theory so I'm going to do something else with my vote.

Vote: Kop

What theory would that be?

[Kop]

VOTE: Ranger

[Kop]

Jesus fucking christ marge... read my goddamn ISO.

I've played with him before. He felt and looked town. There's really nothing more to it than that. I said that on D2.

Everything he's posted has come across incredibly straight-forward, off the cuff, and honest.

All she's done is lurk and hop onto wagons.

I don't want to lynch Ocean. Kop still needs to go. I wish I had the time to be a leader, but alas....

I like my vote. Pushing a vote on a claimed Mason.
Not waiting for it to be verified.
You want to call that town I'll look at you like:

I'm not a she.

I am not going to put a case forward, but there is no other way to confirm that the mason claim is telling the truth. I can however see where ETL is going with this, it's not crazy, it's been open with it. For all we know, they could be two scum claiming together and riding it to the bank.

If we lynch ETL, and she flips town, where do we go from there?

[Kop]

In fact, reading some of her posts, it does make for uneasy reading.

VOTE: EspeciallyTheLies

If she flips town, we do have some information from her that can be used.

L-1

[Kop]

I am The Town Doctor.

I protected Firebringer night one. Simply for that crumb, obviously now it wasn't a crumb, but at the time, I couldn't take a chance to doubt it's integrity.
I protected Flubbernugget night two.
I protected Ranger night three.

Those weren't necessarily my reads at the time, I was trying to second guess scum, as it looked like they were hitting randomly and not hitting players who are in general active a lot in the thread.

[Kop]

Marge, you had a theory on me. Did you ever indulge into sharing that theory?

[Kop]

I'm holding back the urge to vote Kop right now because this is lylo.

But I don't buy that claim. I'd be the last person Kop would protect, and it reeks of BS.

I actually forgot I voted for you when I sent in the protection. I signed up one hour before deadline looked at the players left in the game on page one and sent my protection in. I didn't choose to protect ocean in simply because I believe scum would think he is lynch bait. And with that bait being there scum would hope that a wagon drives onto him, and they ride it to the deadline.

[Kop]

I'm thinking a no lynch here might be an option.

[Kop]

I am The Town Doctor.

I protected Firebringer night one. Simply for that crumb, obviously now it wasn't a crumb, but at the time, I couldn't take a chance to doubt it's integrity.
I protected Flubbernugget night two.
I protected Ranger night three.

Those weren't necessarily my reads at the time, I was trying to second guess scum, as it looked like they were hitting randomly and not hitting players who are in general active a lot in the thread.

I've explained it here. After night one they shot Kraeg, I asked myself Kraeg wasn't exactly active in the thread why would they shoot him, night two Flubbernugget was a person I thought they may have shot as the others who were active were either shooting at wrong targets or looked like things could have been swayed from scum onto them. Ranger was a quick glance, had very little attention day three, no wagon could have formed, I presumed that may have took the shot, obviously not. They were not reads to why I protected them, I tried to second guess scum a gambit I got wrong. I mean look at Firebringer had quite a lot of attention but yet he was shot. That alone tells you one thing.

[Kop]

VOTE: Marge

I'm fairly happy with my vote there. I just am not convinced at her arguements towards the two masons.

[Kop]

Lesson learnt.

[Kop]

I'll admit this is probably one of my worst games that I played. Got a lot wrong this game, and just never recovered. Sorry peeps.

[Kop]

I don't know why I thought no lynch was a good idea, somehow I thought it was mylo when I posted that, not lylo.

[Kop]

And it turned out he wasn't even a cop, so it wasn't even a crumb.

[Kop]

Count me in, Rob.