NY 169: The EPIC XD Mafia Game of Greatness (Game Over)

[DOMO]

bert is a lot more convincing than casso

[Bert]

I'm sorry I haven't been here. I'll be up late till 5 AM and I'll make a post or two every few hours as I've been absen - better that way so I don't spam 5 posts full of walls. Caught the past 5 pages, and still have like 27 to go. I'll just forget about the past 160 until I actually get a hang of stuff going on.

[Bert]

But out of the three bert is the one that gives us least information... so it has to be casso or SSK to gain the most value from the flip.

Thank you, Generic. I think you're town because of the pure emotion from that raging stallion-like argument you indulged in with DOMO early on.

otoh, a bert townflip gives us little and wouldn't surprise me all that much if I'm honest, he did seem town through d1 and it's his voting around the time of the SSK lunge that has me thinking he's scum. Town can make dodgy votes too.

SAD and KoreanBBQ, et al., don't seem to support what you're saying. My play has been lazy on D2. Good news is I'm not run up to lynch -1 (yet).

Why aren't scum seizing on a fistpump mislynch? Because they're scared to? Or because it's not a mislynch?

All I can say is I'm puzzled by the swings of this type of game. That's a really hard question to have answered. Falcon asked himself the same thing in our last cult mentor game. Both the wagon on my hydra and Falcon went absolutely nowhere. It killed the game. KILLED the momentum, the smooth arguing. The game just stopped. What I'm trying to say is there's no way to tell why the SC wagon was so hard to build up early D1, but then suddenly found flashlynch momentum at the end.

I thought SC might be scum based on how hard it was to get any friction on the wagon.

C. He thinks my action has to make sense. I'm now on my fourth prod in this game, meaning I only have one more left, and that just goes to show how apathetic I am towards this game. I haven't given a shit. I didn't see any stinking mason claim or whatever. I knew that geists looked town, so I protected them. Simple as that.

Dude, the knock on me has always been sometimes I mail it in or don't try hard enough. PRods don't mean a thing, dude. Scum and town both can be apathetic, so it shows us nothing other than you're lazy. I've been that way as both alignments before. It's not as simple as that. How can you not see that? There were two masons out there that had claimed. Why wouldn't you protect even a universally town Tammy over geists??? It does not add up. You must see this from our point of view.

[DOMO]

Ok I'm readjusting somewhat...

SAD BBQ and casso.

This assumes bert is town and casso is scum. I'm gonna look at SAD and BBQ in more depth in a few hours.

[DOMO]

SSK is still a given. I can't see him flipping town.

[Empire]

Day 2, Votecount 29

Casso the King of Seals (5)

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goodmorning, DOMO, Norlkaz, BROseidon, Generic

MafiaSSK (3)

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geists, Desperado, Sakura Hana

Ser Arthur Dayne (2)

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pieguyn, Cephrir

Desperado (2)

-

MC Maraca, Casso the King of Seals

Bert (2)

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KoreanBBQ, Ser Arthur Dayne

Cephrir (1)

-

F-16_Fighting_Falcon

Not Voting (3)

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MafiaSSK, zMuffinMan, Bert

With 18 alive, it takes 10 to lynch! Deadline is on January 11th at 10:10 AM EST (expired on 2014-01-11 11:10:12)

Mod Notes

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fferyllt head of geists is V/LA until the 8th. goodmorning is V/LA until Tuesday. GuyInFreezer head of KoreanBBQ is V/LA until Friday.

[MC Maraca]

Oh, and koreanBBQ as strong town?

Curveballs are one thing, I can't understand the mindfuck you are pulling with that one though.

What's your issue with KBBQ?

I also have them as strong town, always have, regardless of how annoying Nero is.

[MC Maraca]

Mara I miss when you are really tunnely on someone. You're kinda giving Cabd the steering wheel

Kinda, yeah but if you like tunnel mara so much, why don't you bring her back to life by helping her lynch the one she wants for today?

[MC Maraca]

why not Desp?

He's pretty much ignored everything I've stated post-mason claim and his chances of being scum is much higher than it is for anyone else. he isn't as engaged as I would think he would be, and he still didn't explain why he thought the things I've done this game isn't indicative of town-mara

[MC Maraca]

He's pretty much ignored everything I've stated post-mason claim and his chances of being scum is much higher than it is for anyone else. he isn't as engaged as I would think he would be, and he still didn't explain why he thought the things I've done this game isn't indicative of town-mara

isn't that what you wanted? enough with this "but dat daytalk!!!!" bullshit--you took the easy way out and now i get to call you town and ignore you

why the fuck would i waste my already limited time justifying my scumread on you from before you claimed mason?

ps your stickiness here isn't helping my nightmares at all

and this is his response to that post.

[DOMO]

But falcon, lynching a lurker/useless one gives us little to no info to work off

The only information lynching strong town gives us is that we're a bunch of idiots, which is not something I'm prepared to learn so early in the game.

Pedit: why don't you all lynch F-16

Unvote: Stuffed Crust
Vote: F-16

Done.
I don't even have a case on him. I don't care.

Right, so have you played f16 before?

5. F-16_Fighting_Falcon Townish.

Looking at some things that I am not allowed to admit exist, I would just like to clarify that I really like the idea of Pie getting lynched.

What the fuck is this?

Are you sure as heck that Falcon and Ffery are town

I am.
I'm also sure as heck that Stuffed Crust is town and the two top wagons suck quite a bit. Do you want to move your vote Sakura with us so the Day 1 lynch doesn't suck?

note - vote is still on f16

Why are you spending time now just tunneling Sakura?

Why now, why not earlier on during my stay here

P-edit: ok...

So do I have your vote yet?

note - yes, still

I was hoping that I would be able to attract more votes than Tammy's, but with ffery and Bert liable to join soon we can make this at least as big as the F-16 wagon.

Mac, please don't stop posting.

VOTE: Sakura Hana

And finally he shifts, and showing an awareness that he's been on f16 for so long.

What the fuck is this?

DOMO if Nati says no on SSK.

Oh yeah he tried to talk town into panic lynching me while I was on V/LA. No case, just higher chance of scum in a group containing me and SAD. And this was after I said lynching him on d1 was a huge mistake because it's nachothor. This is the same hydra that said earlier he hates lynching strong town players early. And they're happy to pick me off without me being able to claim or defend myself, because of a random unsubstanciated read.

I'm convinced he's scum.

[DOMO]

Gonna focus on BBQ after some food. I've seen enough of casso. Solid scum read. This is nothing like town nacho or town thor, except in glimpses, ie when they realise they need to town the fuck up. Less scumhunting and more reactionary posts, asking qeustions rather than pointing fingers, trying to get votes on someone he's reading town. I mean wtf is this? How is it so difficult to lynch this slot?

BECAUSE THEY ARE SCUM.

[Bert]

SSK is almost certainly scum bc setup. there's a gunsmith and a vigilante so it makes sense to put a scumdoc to counter both of them

this is a good point

Though scum-nacho does like quicklynches. And town-nacho sometimes is in a rush, too. This game is an example of town-Nacho wanting to get the lynches done and dusted:

Yes, town-nacho can also take his time if he feels scared or tentative about his reads. I don't see pace as an indicator of alignment for him.

I'm fucking playing this for me again, why I bothered to entertain stupid people with stupid reasons I don't know

Aww this is a Gen-attitude. I like it

Right. So your paranoia is based that one game where I didn't even stay long enough to be evaluated and other ppl saying "dude this guy good as scum".
You had that paranoia since day 1 and that paranoia is based on that one not-even-completed scumgame of mine. I call BS on that. You had plenty of time to look over at least few more games that I actually completed. Added with the effort value I've seen from you in this game, it looks half-assed.

Oh GIF, Oh darling, how I wish you were playing as a solo player. My paranoia on you is very real too, you know. So I can see where Falcon is coming from!!! And have I been in a game with you as scum? Don't think so

I think SSK is scum.

I do not think we should lynch him today.

I agree right now. SSK is red herring if town because scum left him alive knowing he might become lynchbait.

I prefer the casso wagon right now as I haven't been convinced by nachos play compared to past town games of his I've been in, and Thor seems to just contradict everything nacho posts to cover all the inconsistencies.

But Generic, didn't you join me in wagoning Nacho at one point in Wingate on D2????? You didn't seem so "convinced" then, nor did you at the end of our second game together...with the "we need to make sure your tammy/nacho hydra is town."

[DOMO]

I can't believe that I'm actually keeping up with this thread despite of all this walls and shit.

What I see is an attempt to stay up to date and involved in town discussion, what I don't see is an effort to analyse people's posts and challenge people who you feel are scummy.

Well, there you go. The former explains the latter!

These posts contradict each other. He brushed off my comment with bullshit.

Korean's ISO is a massive ball of fluff. So many posts with so little content.

There's likely scum cluttering things up. (geists?)

Ok if korean flips scum I would suggest people have a good look at who geists was scumreading just before this comment was made, because I would suspect bbq would be trying to discredit geists, which in turn suggests her reads at this point were solid.

At this point, I just want someone lynched.

Comment like this I believe at least increases the probability of the author being scum.

I dunno, I've started skimming which is a strong indication I'm losing interest, so I'll stop for now. The first half of his ISO seems really fluffy, but the second half was looking better, a little more town motivated. I'm really not so sure about BBQ and will have a look again at the 2nd half tomorrow when I'm feeling more motivated.

casso most ceratinly reamins a scumread.

[DOMO]

There was a quote fail there somewhere. Pfft.

I wrote this -

Ok if korean flips scum I would suggest people have a good look at who geists was scumreading just before this comment was made, because I would suspect bbq would be trying to discredit geists, which in turn suggests her reads at this point were solid.

[/quote]

[DOMO]

And this.

These posts contradict each other. He brushed off my comment with bullshit.

It makes sense if you try hard.

I'm getting tired, as you can see.

[Bert]

I thought that BBQ's self-vote in the heat of the deadline pressure was a pretty solid town move, even if you discount his play before that point.

Also Bert I want your reads on

Bro
Pie
Cephir
norl

Marking this so I can answer once I finish reviewing this stuff 5 pages at a time at hourly spurts.

*shrug* i was planning to be a bigger part of this game, but the site being down at awkward times for me and some stuff IRL leading up to christmas meant i couldn't really follow the game at the pace it was going

Bert is scum 'cause he was pushing on the SSK wagon but didn't join it.

How very annoying lol

pie, generic, bro, bert are town

A townread coming from you? =O What happened to "I have no idea what you were doing in Castle, and I have no idea what you're doing when you play"

[geists]

Pie, that's not a ringing endorsement from you.

I don't trust you altogether, much like you KBBQ will post something very town and then go the other way. His current defence on casso now he is lead wagon is a concern.

In fact, several of you have now come out in defence of casso, I have thrown it out there but give me the best alternative. I don't want a town casso lynched but this feels like a scum hydra. But that is not a certainty read because it relies on others being scum...

Fuck this game, I will wait got responses from casso/KBBQ/pie/anyone else defending casso right now.

In fact, f16, I want you to talk to me here, give me what you are seeing from the game state at this moment in time, I want guidance and you have yet to have input with me.

I am not seeing any progression of gamestate and feel somewhat tuned out at the moment. I have a strong scumread on SSK and am fairly certain he is scum. I have concerns about Casso as well that I put forth. Nacho has been addressing the suspicion on him but I don't see Nacho doing what Nacho does as town: wreck scumteams. He is just not as engaged in scumhunting. I don't find his posts to be similar to the Perpetual Mylo game that Geists linked earlier. But it is not as obvious to me that they are scum as it is SSK. Plus, I'll spend several sleepless nights if I help lynch a Nacho hydra and he flips town after he spent a ton of effort getting MC and I to stop tunneling and get the game back on track. So, what if he is scum? He'll still be here tomorrow as will all of us other than DOMO. We can persue it then. I see no reason to let SSK live another day based off of speculation that he may be protecting a buddy. I get DOMO's point that Casso could be a more important PR for scum but it is speculation and I am not convinced.

I am just waiting for DOMO to post all of the analysis he can before we move onto lynch.

Talk about the reasons for not leashing SSK if he's scum, and tying scum into suboptimal kills for a night.

Also, talk about your other scum reads.

[geists]

Bro, this is I'm not sure what - a warning I guess. I'm teetering on the precipice of massive paranoia about you.

Muffin, Desp, I've already fallen into the abyss. I would totally lynch either of you today.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Leaving him alive doesn't make the cop less likely to die. There's always the element of roleblockers. The action is so unbelievable (to protect Ffery), that I think SSK is smarter than that as scum. In my last game, he was a scum tracker and tracked Geists N1, yes, as scum. Would he do the exact same thing as a fake doctor this time??? THAT is the 1 million dollary question. He could easily be a scum doctor. I just talked myself into being unsure, but I feel like it's a coin-toss with him. He's also easy to lynch because of his lurker tendencies. Gut-wise, I'm not feeling this lynch now that I have time to be looking over this game.

Are you implying SSK is not smart as town? Because I don't buy arguments that someone is "smarter than that" as scum. If they are smart players, they are smart as town as well and will make optimal moves. On the other hand, they could make sub-optimal moves when they are scum (if those moves are optimal for the scum).

[Bert]

Protecting Geists can be smart/dumb depending on each person's perspective.

I'm saying that as scum, the most believable/accepted protection is that of protecting a mason (or anyone else you can argue).

Taking a risk and letting one mason become confirmed by the other's dying isn't unheard of? Either way, I'm not sure I buy SSK's explanation of "Geist was town so I protected them." Also, I need to check if DOMO's claimed copping of Geists came before or after SSK's announcement of action target.

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Talk about the reasons for not leashing SSK if he's scum, and tying scum into suboptimal kills for a night.

Also, talk about your other scum reads.

Weren't you the one who wanted SSK lynched today? Have you changed your mind? I mentioned it in 4545 although Cabd beat me to it a post earlier.

Not sure about other scumreads right now. Cephrir is going to throw a fit upon seeing this but... I was waiting to hear back from you about your read on him?
SSK and Casso are other scumreads.

[geists]

Talk about the reasons for not leashing SSK if he's scum, and tying scum into suboptimal kills for a night.

Also, talk about your other scum reads.

Weren't you the one who wanted SSK lynched today? Have you changed your mind? I mentioned it in 4545 although Cabd beat me to it a post earlier.

Hydra dissonance up in here.

Not sure about other scumreads right now. Cephrir is going to throw a fit upon seeing this but... I was waiting to hear back from you about your read on him?

I wrote an autobiography about my game with ceph before I went on v/la. I also posted a bunch of links to parts of Sakura games you asked about.

SSK and Casso are other scumreads.

So two scum reads?

[F-16_Fighting_Falcon]

Oh, wow. I completely missed 4627 and 4629. No idea how that hapenned. My apologies. I'll get back to you on that.

[pieguyn]

this is a good point

ftr I'm not the first one who said this