Mini 1524: Olympian Gods Mafia - Game Over

[MattP]

VOTE: Shos

[pirate mollie]

Because you just said you want to lynch her and penguin?

I never said that

fuck this wis are you scum

[Wisdom]

So, you heard it here first, folks.

Mala/Matt/mollie is the scumteam.
Replace Mala with nacho if I'm somehow wrong there.

Everyone else is town.

[helium-3]

so not scum just dumb

[Elyse]

Votecount 1.13

Nachomamma8 - 1 - havingfitz (L-6)
penguin_alien - 2 - Malakittens, ooba (L-5)
Mirari - 1 - penguin_alien (L-6)
shos - 5 - Mirari, Nachomamma8, Whiskers, pirate mollie, MattP (L-2)
Malakittens - 4 - Desperado, shos, Wisdom, Grimgroove (L-3)

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline: (expired on 2013-12-21 12:00:00)
MattP is V/LA until Wednesday.

Interesting Fact #14: Hera is the protector of heroes, such as Hercules and Jason.

VOTE: leap of faith

This vote has not been counted.

[havingfitz]

havingfitz replaces ArcAngel9.
Welcome!

Hi.

UNVOTE:

55 pages...fcuk! I'll try to get caught up before I'm prodded.

[Mirari]

I hate myself slightly for letting my read of this game become so large.

[Malakittens]

Seriously, she is pushing penguin, right? She is like 100% sure penguin is scum. penguin posts a wall after days of inactivity, and

Mala completely ignores it and responds to completely irrelevant things (that might hurt her image if she didn't)

. Then after I prod her and ask her why she is not responding to it, she decided to do so.

Why are you ignoring this? Why the hell would she not respond to it the first chance she got?

I do have to ask though, why is [other parts of the game], including [the wagon/attack on her] "completely irrelevant? Mala is only allowed to talk about the scumread she's tunneling? Er...

I didn't expect a town reaction because her doing nothing was already something not town.

Ah, I see.
Confirmation bias.

Gotcha!

So why call out this part of the post for confirmation bias when clearly 979 of wisdom's had it all written over it?

[penguin_alien]

Someone asked me if I liked my vote on Mirari. Given that we have time before deadline, yes. I still haven't heard why Mirari came out of nowhere claiming that the wagon on me was better because Mala was on it having completely ignored Mala up to that point, and claiming that ooba and Mirari knowing each other offline means their mutual townreads make them surefire parts of a town block (ugh, town blocks: scum central) is less than rigorous.

I'll second (or third or whatever) that I've seen Mala replace out of a game as town. It was after a fairly lengthy conflict though, and I don't remember if she threatened to do so first or just got fed up and left. If mollie or Nacho remember, I'd take their words on it.

Nacho, do you disagree with my re-explained Mala and MattP reads or still not see where I'm coming from?

shos says: "you're a girl. that's like AtE automatically for me" Not cool, man.

Starting my catchup. I'm not going to be compiling a list of things to comment on like shos. If you want my opinion on something, ask me (after I've read).

Looking at the last few pages I don't get the Mala scum read. She seems pretty protown oriented in her discussion and suspects. Did you all suffer a collective stroke?

What's protown? She's 'scum-reading' the person who's voting you? Why the weird phrasing about you liking the wagon on me because she was on it, given that that was an understated characterization seeing as she's pushed it the entire game so far?

However, he said he was changing his playstyle for this game. Hm, Wis-scum playing like Wis-town? That'd be a change, eh?

He was also trying to change his play style in Newbie 1448. From a mod perspective, I found him much different--less inclined to tunnel, keeping his options open more, being accommodating. Here even if he says he wants to change his play style, this is default town-Wisdom leaking through. He was trying to maintain a facade in Newbie 1448, one that worked well for scum-Wisdom, but I'm not seeing that reproduced here.

What? Why wouldn't they? That's incredibly fun (see also: trolling, griefing), and when you're a pretty-much-unanimous townread (whiskers seems to be) what would stop you?

...OK, major difference of opinion. Yelling at people for me is never fun; if I lose my temper I feel badly for days afterwards, and yes, that applies to gratuitously antagonizing people as well.

You're kidding, right? I'm pretty sure Mala uses AtE consistently and without remorse.

I haven't played with scum-Mala. I know town-Mala doesn't fake AtE and follows through on genuinely expressed emotions. Much to my chagrin in NY 164.

...and you apparently care about none of this.

(AA9, I hope your cousin ends up all right.)

[Mirari]

533 actually makes me reconsider my read on Shos. The amount of planning that went into the post looks to be too much for a sinking scum to think is wortwhile. The post that is a reaction test in general looked really scummy but in context it is better.

543 Matt's analysis of 542 matches my opinion of said post.

Matt is playing a next level game that is beyond me. I think he is town for it.

I don't know if I can be bothered to read a Whiskers post. Too much talking to hold my interest. Matt is succinctly cryptic and robust, quite entertaining.

604 I think this makes Nacho town.

If what Mala says is true about mollie's chair that's good. Less brain power to devote to reading a prolific player like Whiskers.

I know this may seem biased but 657 I feel is more likely to come from scum, emptily commenting on current happenings to have their opinion recorded for later.

I think I said this before but 686 probably town.

Also the same reason penguin is scum. I just realized Mala is on her wagon. That increases the credibility of the wagon and the likelihood of penguin being scum if you ask me. Decisions, decisions...

Someone asked me about this but I don't remember who. I was under the impression that Mala could read peng well and vice versa. I had just noticed Mala was on peng and so that made me feel peng is more likely to be scum. I still think peng is scum but the potential of being more likely than shos to be scum at a time when I was growing weaker on shos was tempting.

723 sounds like me right about now actually. I laughed reading this.

This is decent info. How sure are you of oobatown? What do you think of him not townreading you yet?

I'm quoting this for future reference because it shows nacho not reading.

876 I think that makes Matt town to be honest

This is a good game, btw. Scum are playing well, really every player sans Penguin is doing a damn good job of appearing town. Simultaneously, town are for the most part remaining calm and letting things take as much time as they need rather than falling apart. I like this.

Nice first game back

.

THAT'S A LIE!!
You were in Normalville! The SunnyDays!

Why are you lying about this?

Dude he took a break.

I enjoyed reading this exchange.

902[/url] I don't really like this? A way for grim to disregard Nacho. And I think there is danger in labelling grim's posts as nonsensical because he is high? allows him to get away with more I think.

Suspicious of Grim for this post.

[post]952 Meh... not sure on Grim

can you back up any credibility of being able to read Ooba in the past due to this.

I saw your comment to ooba. I thought you were talking about forum games? I'm confused and was busy when I answered. If you want stuff I don't know how I can show you since its all in person mafia.

In face to face games he plays town games more erratically than his scum games. One day he played as town 3 times in a row and each game featured a "different" ooba. He shouted and was super aggressive one time, literally said nothing but pointed another time, and then reversed his supicions on purpose. Like his scum suspects were actually his town reads and vice versa. That's why his image stuff is so town.

Don't have time but I saw Mala ask me a question. I don't have any games with Ooba. I just think since we know each other well we'd be able to read each other well. This is really only my second game ever.

I guess that is a better explanation of this ^

992 yawn. Peng continues the tunnel on me. Nothing new there.. She takes my comment about mala out of context. I wasn't saying mala being there is something new. I was saying it was my first notice of the wagon composition.

Like she's making sure she can always justify leaving her vote on me from all the way in the first few pages

Kinda just want to lynch shos so he will stop posting so much. ....

However, anything before this becomes flimsy again and makes the results bad. I'm not going to discount data just because this data looks pretty

I'm suspicious of this
While yes you don't follow the data to this conclusion, just saying the most recent and prettiest data carries its own conclusion. Could be highly manipulative... If you only followed data that proved your point shame on you as a scientist.

The misogyny in this game is astounding.

So yea.. I'm just posting this anyway. Tired from reading this game. Drained me so much.

Town
Ooba
Wisdom
mollie

Weaker Town
Matt
Mala
Whiskers

Null
Nacho
Grim
Desp
Arcangel

Weaker Scum
Shos

Scum
penguin

I think penguin is our best bet for hitting scum, shos being second best
VOTE: Penguin

[Mirari]

What's protown? She's 'scum-reading' the person who's voting you? Why the weird phrasing about you liking the wagon on me because she was on it, given that that was an understated characterization seeing as she's pushed it the entire game so far?

I think she's town for opinions during the game. Everything seems off the cuff and the like. The only one that is going to end up with egg on their face for pushing a lynch is you that's for damn sure. Only warning.

No, that's a nice projection of your own opinions though. She's attacking you strongly when she could be appeasing you. You two play with each other a lot, it would be better strategy to kill you silently rather than go for a lynch against you.

I'll give you an analogy... people claiming global warming exists citing their own personal observations of ecology isn't going to hold much weight. When a PhD person in ecology and the like comes in and says global warming exists citing observations, the legitimacy of the claim goes up. Do you disagree?
I know you and mala are in a hydra right now from looking into you that's why I think she can read you accurately. that was around when I noticed mala was on your wagon and I thought "this is more credible". it is also why I think your approach to her is more generally "safe scum". You scumreading her right now looks like the least confrontational path to that conclusion you could have taken after many days of delay.

[Mirari]

I'm exhausted... bed

[penguin_alien]

992 yawn. Peng continues the tunnel on me. Nothing new there.. She takes my comment about mala out of context. I wasn't saying mala being there is something new. I was saying it was my first notice of the wagon composition.

It took you that long to notice Mala was scum reading me?

And why assume she can read me better than I can read her?

[Mirari]

Her conviction

There is a clear difference in the presentation of the reads of one another between you two

[Whiskers]

Her conviction

There is a clear difference in the presentation of the reads of one another between you two

It's a playstyle thing, mate. Conviction=/=accuracy.
for instance, mollie has conviction in her reads.

Of course, I see what you're saying: Mala's conviction comes from having more-current, more-intimate experience with Penguin's playstyle and thought process. Right? That makes some sense. I'm not sure how right it is, but I at least comprehend it and agree that it's reasonable.

How refreshing!

[Whiskers]

Because you just said you want to lynch her and penguin?

I never said that

fuck this wis are you scum

You did.
Here, let me quote it.

How is he retarded? He's right, you dodged my question about who you want to lynch.

no I didn't. I answered you.

So the answer is peng and mala, and among them you prefer peng?

yes

If you do

not

want to lynch mala and penguin, then

answer the question,

okay I don't want to lynch whiskers anymore

who do you want to lynch

I still want to lynch whiskers for being a creepy stalker but gun to my head I would say penny over mala

So... right. You prefer Penguin over Mala,

why?

And, clearly, you prefer neither, since your vote is on... um.

VOTE: leap of faith

Uh... what the fuck?

But more importantly, there's

not

a gun to your head, and we've still got quite a bit of time until deadline. Why don't you answer the question:

Who do you want to lynch?

I have not said this in a long time on this site but you are fucking retarded and I will vote you for being an ass

Oh wait, I forgot. I'm fucking retarded and being an ass.

Is anybody else seeing this?

Mollie, do you like chunky peanut butter?

I like jelly but if there was a gun to my head I would each chunky peanut butter.

That's stupid, you've shown no interest in chunky peanut butter before. And even now, you're licking the jelly spoon! Do you

really

like chunky peanut butter?

J33z wh1skerz u r a retarded @ss!!1!

So you

do

like chunky peanut butter. Right?

yes.

Come on mollie, have some chunky peanut butter with me!

EW WHY WULD I DO THAT I DON'T LIKE CHUNKY PEANUT BUTTER!!

But, but... you just

said

you liked it!

WOW I NEVER SAID THAT. WISDOM R U SCUM??!

[Whiskers]

Ah, I see.
Confirmation bias.

So why call out this part of the post for confirmation bias when clearly 979 of wisdom's had it all written over it?

Ok.
To me, it's a little bit different.
In 979, there's an oppourtunity for you to redeem yourself. (although reading it a fourth time, maybe I was giving Wisdom too much credit).

Here, he's just saying, "IT'S TOO LATE. SHE'S SCUM. NOTHING SHE CAN DO WILL MAKE HER SEEM MORE TOWNIE BECAUSE I'VE ALREADY MADE UP MY MIND!!!"

There, he was at least asking you for reads. *shrug*

[Malakittens]

Glad Penguin ignored all of my posts I had written for her.

._.

[penguin_alien]

Glad Penguin ignored all of my posts I had written for her.

._.

Nothing you've said recently has changed my opinion of you. Anything in particular you feel I'm willfully ignoring?

[Malakittens]

OK, staying awake long enough to figure out what's going on here.

I will say that I don't remember Mala storming out after me at the start of a game before. Can't find an example in my completed games. So for her to say that I'm acting differently that I have in the past when she's done this is perplexing.

I also don't see the tradeoff for scum-Mala to be investing so heavily in this scum read on me, since my town flip would leave her with egg on her face

.

Promised catch-up/coherent thoughts incoming.

That's not actually true. I did go after you at the start of a game before, but it was over another reason. Then I let it go because I realized that your comments rang genuine and that you weren't scum based soloely off that reason.

Remember when I went after you for not confirming right away in Mind Reader Mafia?

I went after you towards the end and your reactions to me felt different from what they are right now.

Note the bold:

Why are you so hesitant in this read. Sounds like part of you doesn't want to call me scum because you don't see why scum-Mala would go so hard after a mislynch, but you don't even want to call me town for it either. (Not that I was thinking you would call me town, but this just feels off to me.)

I'm not getting 'scum' from the shos ISO. Reading through his posts, I find myself nodding along.

Wisdom looks town, mostly because it seems like he can't help himself as town from tunneling, being fixated on his reads, and generally not changing his game overmuch. Not what I saw from scum-Wisdom in Newbie 1448.

GG is paranoid and suspicious. Not looking for the easy buddy with shos, and he's not afraid to tangle with Nacho. His refutation of the 'Mala goes and looks up Actor to see if that could be MattP's role' supposed town tell is in line with my opinion as well.

Whiskers is town. Sorry, but scum don't see someone with an emotional playstyle and say, 'gee, let's push that person's buttons for funsies.'

AA9 is saying all the town-AA9 things, but in a game like this where she knows a decent number of people, I'd expect the interactive part of her style to be more front-and-center. Heaven knows I get being behind, but it's a drastic falloff. On the other hand, her defensiveness about it is townish, so I'd let it slide pending further info.

Desperado's willing to engage with mollie over the weak Whiskers scum read and tells Wisdom off. I disagree about shos, but I think he has a point with mollie.

Mala thinking that MattP would indicate his role so early on looks like hopeful scum. I don't think that Mala would pull any fake emotional stuff, so I think her frustration with Wisdom is genuine.

This:

@ Wisdom: Arc (early townread w/ mollie) and someone weird...Mirari?

Mala, I'm seeing the same things you are. I don't think it's her towngame either.

With that said, humans are...human, and she might just be off her towngame.

This doesn't chive w/ your last post before this.

You are now thinking Peng is a ML and I'm scum.

Get your feelings straight.

isn't town interacting with other people's reads. This is 'how dare you change your mind even a little bit.'

MattP, still don't see him laying out anything that convinces me shos is even scummy, let alone scum. (and to clarify, by 'following the game' I mean 'comprehending the arguments that mirror popular opinion' rather than 'reading the thread') But I'm willing to buy that he has a strong mutual town read on/with Wisdom, and Wisdom-town makes me think MattP-town.

Mirari, I don't like posts like this:

Not that I know. I have only played two games here and I don't think you were a player in those games. I'm just asking you too vote because ooba votes are bad.

where it takes more than one post for Mirari to explain why ooba votes are bad. It's not helpful and reads as artificial to me.

Calling shos' posts filler is also a gross mischaracterization. You can disagree with the content, but there's no way they're fluff.

Also the same reason penguin is scum. I just realized Mala is on her wagon. That increases the credibility of the wagon and the likelihood of penguin being scum if you ask me. Decisions, decisions...

This is odd. You don't mention Mala that I can find anywhere else before this in your postings, yet suddenly her being on my wagon makes it so much better. And to say that she's 'on my wagon' is a mild way of putting it; she's been on my wagon forever pushing my lynch. This isn't some surprising new development that represents someone changing her mind about me.

Nacho, don't agree with all his stances, but I'm getting a gut-town vibe off him. Anything further I'd like to think I can sort out a bit further down the line.

ooba, here:

Penguin scum flip would mean Mala town. Plus I never liked the fact that Nacho was on the shos wagon. Lets see where this leads..

Vote: Penguin

seems like town being frank. And considering their wagons in light of other reads, instead of trying to push lynches through irrespective of inconsistencies in their stances. I'd like it better without the slight implication of it being an exploratory vote. Also seems flexible in a non-scummy way.

mollie, still don't comprehend the inflexibility on Whiskers earlier. I get being annoyed with someone, but at a certain point it's only reasonable to step back and see if there's a non-'people are attacking me!' explanation. The Whiskers conflict read as a good way for mollie to kill time. The chair discussion also seems null. Yes, I've seen town-mollie pull it out, but I certainly wouldn't draw conclusions from it, given that the goal of the game as scum is to play a town game in any aspects that don't damage your team's chances. The chair pic falls under that category.



Overall reads:

Town:
shos
GG
Whiskers
Wisdom

Town enough I would disagree with their lynch:
AA9
Desperado
MattP
Nacho
ooba

Scum enough that I wouldn't condemn their lynch:
Mirari
Mala
mollie

Scum:
I'm too out of sync with a lot of people's reads to feel like I have anyone whose lynch I'd feel super-confident on.

That's all I have tonight.

I have to say there's some reads in this whole post that feels off to me.

First your ArcAngel9 read. I'm not disagreeing with you about the read itself, but the reasons feels like it's mimicing other's voices in regards to her. Yet the last part 'I'll let it slide pending further information' gives you a perfect opportunity to swing this read on her in any way. I don't like it.

How does Desperado's actions make him more town in your eyes. Doesn't his interactions be null really because wouldn't you think Scum-Desperado would try to act similar to how a town-Desperado would?

Your read on me. Let me get this straight: why exactly are you leaning scum on me? Is it because you think my early townreading of MattP looks like hopeful scum or is it because I'm going after you hardcore?

No, I just didn't like Desperado's posts at all. Just felt like he was going after you, but then randomly changed to scum reading me because of information, but not because he really feels like I'm scum. That post of his felt really off to me.

I have to agree that I disagree with how easily Mirari is writing off the Ooba votes because they live with each other so he can read Ooba well. Why I questioned in it a later post of mine.

As for the Mollie read you give her a null read which I would think you would do the same for Desperado. I don't think you believe in that Desperado read, but leaning scum on me is part of the reason why you are calling Desperado town.[/quote]

[penguin_alien]

First off, if you think you going after me here is like going after me in Mini 1413 where the mod sent me my role PM two full days after everyone else and didn't tell me about the issue, you're really reaching. You thought I was lying about something; that's entirely different from claiming to pressure me to obtain a read on me.

Yes, my read on AA9 is flimsy. So's her content thus far; we'll see what HF turns up. Some people might be able to read her off her postings thus far; I'm not that confident. Sue me.

Saying someone would try to imitate their town game as scum and so we should never town read people because they could be faking is a useless argument WRT Desperado.

I don't read you as town right now. Mirari isn't helping that, but I'm also skeptical of you asking about an Actor role. I also don't see you scum-hunting much outside of me, and given how many of these people you've played with, I don't see it as coming from town-you.

mollie and Desperado are not playing the same game here. Why would I have the same read on them? And why would Desperado changing his mind based on information be scummy?

[Malakittens]

Just seems like you're hedging on some of your reads leaving a LOT LOT LOT of opportunity to change it.

I'm hunting a lot besides you, but I have a lot of town reads due to it rather than scum reads.

Your FoS on me just seems OMGUS-like.

I'm just shocked on how you haven't moved your vote onto me since it's pretty obvious your vote on Mirari is just idle-like of a vote. (Then you can say the same for mine, but I have a glimpse of support.) I kinda get the feeling you're trying to keep your distance or you really feel 'confident' in your Mirari vote.

Blech league game, byeee

[pirate mollie]

What's protown? She's 'scum-reading' the person who's voting you? Why the weird phrasing about you liking the wagon on me because she was on it, given that that was an understated characterization seeing as she's pushed it the entire game so far?

I think she's town for opinions during the game. Everything seems off the cuff and the like. The only one that is going to end up with egg on their face for pushing a lynch is you that's for damn sure. Only warning.

No, that's a nice projection of your own opinions though. She's attacking you strongly when she could be appeasing you. You two play with each other a lot, it would be better strategy to kill you silently rather than go for a lynch against you.

I'll give you an analogy... people claiming global warming exists citing their own personal observations of ecology isn't going to hold much weight. When a PhD person in ecology and the like comes in and says global warming exists citing observations, the legitimacy of the claim goes up. Do you disagree?
I know you and mala are in a hydra right now from looking into you that's why I think she can read you accurately. that was around when I noticed mala was on your wagon and I thought "this is more credible". it is also why I think your approach to her is more generally "safe scum". You scumreading her right now looks like the least confrontational path to that conclusion you could have taken after many days of delay.

I love this post

[pirate mollie]

hey guyz so what do you think about chicken fucking? I personally like it. the feathers feel so good against my skin. I also have the intellectual capacity of a turnip. I am in love with pirate mollie that is why I feel compelled to mention her in every single post. I wonder what mollie thinks of chicken fucking.

tmi dude tmi

[Nachomamma8]

okay I don't want to lynch whiskers anymore

who do you want to lynch

I still want to lynch whiskers for being a creepy stalker but gun to my head I would say penny over mala

This is reassuring.

@ nacho

what is up cos you usually defend me and you are not

I don't understand what is going on between you and Whiskers so I am generally ignoring it. It doesn't feel like your normal thought process as scum, but it is not something I want to get involved in.