Open 514: Monks and Masons in Serona - GAME OVER

[Bert]

I'm telling you to actually not just look at how I play in ONE game if you're goin to use that as a measuring stick.

notscience if you cannot handle it, replace out and blacklist me like the others. Capiche? Otherwise, stop fluffing because I'm that close to starting doubting my townread on you.

Really? Who else don't you doubt your townread on? Or are you not going to answer that either because "I don't give away townreads"

[Wisdom]

1) I thought both of them were scum. And I stand by that. It's not like I went from having a strong townread on Mala and in less than a page of posting or less (in real or virtual time) went from that strong townread to a strong scumread on her.???

You keep saying that my Mala wagon is bad and goes nowhere and stuff. That assumes you think Mala is town. So yes you went from a strong scumread on her to calling the wagon on her bad. Which is another mother of contradictions.

2) self-defeatist?? Of course I don't want people to end up giving away the emotions I give when I'm self-defeatist. Because I've seen myself get lynched many times from eing that way, and the people I told that to, I wanted them to go down with a fight, not just give way like I do sometimes.

How the hell can you advise people not to be self-defeatist and then be one yourself in the fucking same game?

[notscience]

Everyone here needs to step back and take a fucking chill pill. Fighting this hard isn't getting us anywhere.

[50 Shades of Purple]

@mollie
Please don't be stubborn.
Bert is scum. goodmorning is town.
But even if I am wrong about that, it's not wise to lynch from the masons. Relax for a while and think it through and you'll see it's right.

we are lynching gm and that is all I have to say

We are not lynching gm, mollie.

want to make a bet

[Bert]

1) I thought both of them were scum. And I stand by that. It's not like I went from having a strong townread on Mala and in less than a page of posting or less (in real or virtual time) went from that strong townread to a strong scumread on her.???

You keep saying that my Mala wagon is bad and goes nowhere and stuff. That assumes you think Mala is town. So yes you went from a strong scumread on her to calling the wagon on her bad. Which is another mother of contradictions.

2) self-defeatist?? Of course I don't want people to end up giving away the emotions I give when I'm self-defeatist. Because I've seen myself get lynched many times from eing that way, and the people I told that to, I wanted them to go down with a fight, not just give way like I do sometimes.

How the hell can you advise people not to be self-defeatist and then be one yourself in the fucking same game?

1) Where did I say the Mala wagon is bad?? Where did you get this mother of an impression? LOL
2) Because I can. Got a problem with that? And to add onto that, I did not self-vote OR threaten to replace-out. Big difference.

[Wisdom]

Then start it with a blank slate nd play this game like you've never played with me before. You're acting so biased, but you're basing everything on my town play which isn't even fairly recent.

Why the hell would I do that? Meta exists to be used, not to be ignored.

you were bragging about your history with me that someone else who was reading me as town doesn't, when the fact is that person (Marquis or GM) has JUST as much history as you do with me, and more recent in fact.

My read is affected by MY history with you, not GM's or anyone else's. goodmorning is not supposed to know what you know of my townplay.

[Bert]

OK then so you're going to disregard 503 Polygamist as a whole. You just said Meta exists to be used?

[Wisdom]

I'm telling you to actually not just look at how I play in ONE game if you're goin to use that as a measuring stick.

Where the fuck did I say anything about how you played in ANY game?
I said that you know my townplay and you're a hypocrite if you're acting like you don't.

[Wisdom]

Everyone here needs to step back and take a fucking chill pill. Fighting this hard isn't getting us anywhere.

Unless you choose to ignore Bert's blatant contradictions, it is getting us to see how Bert is obvscum.

[Bert]

And that stuff about how GM would not antagonize Nacho or voice such confusion...I may have voiced doubt, but GM voiced doubt much later in the game than I did. I voiced doubt when RVS had just gotten out.

Hey, not everyone is gonna go "I'm just gonna be really logical, and therefore Wisdom can't tunnel the hell out of me" Because you know that's exactly how you think scum can get away with being scum - by just being REALLY REALLY logical

Oh hey, I'm not the most logical, and I'm not purposefully trying to make my play 100% logical so that you never scum-read me, am I? On that same token, not all experienced players are gonna buddy Nacho as such.

And no, you did mention 500 popcorn in this game. I'll go find it now, thanks.

[Wisdom]

1) Where did I say the Mala wagon is bad?? Where did you get this mother of an impression? LOL

dont'expect everyone to share your reads on Mala either. See where your wagon on her has gotten? Yeah, that's what I thought.

[Wisdom]

OK then so you're going to disregard 503 Polygamist as a whole. You just said Meta exists to be used?

So you're saying I should expect you to post nothing in all your scumgames because you did so in Polygamy?

[notscience]

Wisdom, when you hardtunnel the fuck out of someone they make slipups REGARDLESS of alignment. You're confbiasing it.

[Bert]

1) Where did I say the Mala wagon is bad?? Where did you get this mother of an impression? LOL

dont'expect everyone to share your reads on Mala either. See where your wagon on her has gotten? Yeah, that's what I thought.

Just because I said the latter doesn't mean Mala's wagon is bad. It just means you shouldn't expect everyone to share your read on me.

[Bert]

OK then so you're going to disregard 503 Polygamist as a whole. You just said Meta exists to be used?

So you're saying I should expect you to post nothing in all your scumgames because you did so in Polygamy?

No, I'm saying if you don't use Polygamist to go off, then you have nothing to compare my town play to. Therefore, you can't use the past to dictate "this isn't his scum playstyle." People adapt, change, improve, get worse, all that...as town.

[Wisdom]

And that stuff about how GM would not antagonize Nacho or voice such confusion...I may have voiced doubt, but GM voiced doubt much later in the game than I did. I voiced doubt when RVS had just gotten out.

GM was

a replacement

. She did not experience the Nacho posts as they happened. And it is something you should be fully aware of since she's your masonbuddy. Yet you scumread her for not being sure on what the hydra is. Like people are not allowed to ever be unsure about their reads. And replacements more so.

Hey, not everyone is gonna go "I'm just gonna be really logical, and therefore Wisdom can't tunnel the hell out of me" Because you know that's exactly how you think scum can get away with being scum - by just being REALLY REALLY logical


Oh hey, I'm not the most logical, and I'm not purposefully trying to make my play 100% logical so that you never scum-read me, am I? On that same token, not all experienced players are gonna buddy Nacho as such.

What do you want to say here? That you would be logical if you were scum? You know, scum can't just decide "I'll be logical" and expect it to happen. When they have to deal with someone who posts and questions them all the time like me, they'll break in the end no matter how much they wanted to be logical. So save it.

[notscience]

Town do that too wisdom.

[notscience]

VOTE: 50

[Wisdom]

It just means you shouldn't expect everyone to share your read on me.

So you think I'm scum yet you're giving me advice?

[Bert]

if you're so sure that I'm scum, Wisdom, it shouldn't matter whether I'm a mason or not.

Scum is still scum.

It just means you shouldn't expect everyone to share your read on me.

So you think I'm scum yet you're giving me advice?

No. Not advice. It's a rebuttal to what you were saying earlier, which I can't even remember because I'm really confused now from all of this banter. be back after a quick snackie

[Wisdom]

No, I'm saying if you don't use Polygamist to go off, then you have nothing to compare my town play to. Therefore, you can't use the past to dictate "this isn't his scum playstyle." People adapt, change, improve, get worse, all that...as town.

Where the fuck did I compare your play to

anything

?

[50 Shades of Purple]

Wisdom:

There is a very dramatic difference between someone antagonizing me and someone being inconsistent with their read on me. When people are antagonizing me, paranoid of me, ATTACKING ME, that is fantastic that is wonderful I love it. When a GOOD player like goodmorning pulls a weak scumread on me and cannot properly describe it (most of the time, even "I don't trust you" satisfies me. that's not what happened here), it's usually scum trying to capitalize on the "scum wouldn't attack me" cred. And you can trust me on this because I am Nacho and I am used to how scum deals with me, believe it or not.

Here's the original:

50 shades - Where is Nacho I WANT NACHO SO I CAN JUST READ HIM AND GET IT OVER WITH
Oh, there's Nacho. I don't know that I like 242

Which isn't even antagonizing me in the first place. "I don't know that I like 242" is nothing close to an actual scumread on me (or a read, really) which is why I prodded it in the first place.

For a start, and because it doesn't sound like Town-Nacho.

goodmorning's response to "why didn't you like 242"? Important because she's only read me as town once correctly in a game where she was SK and I was town and still she wasn't sure at all. What's important is that goodmorning here doesn't have a good baseline for Nacho-town, she has a good baseline for Nacho-scum. So, this is inconsistent with my experiences with her.

I would assume because you aren't Town.

(not interested in explaining her read on me at all is ALWAYS a bad bad sign)

In Duck Duck Goose I was quite sure you were Scum the entire game and made that quite clear in the dead thread. In BotE I was insanely paranoid.
I've already said I have a hard time reading you in hydra.

Duck Duck Goose bit was a lie!

At that point you were. That read was mostly based on your Hiraki push, because he was obvTown and you would have known it.
In this case I don't see you pushing on anyone you should know better, other than me, but I still get the same feeling.

And it's funny she says she's getting the same feeling of Nacho-scum here. Because originally, I just didn't feel like the Nacho-town she was used to, but she lost that too. And she says that she thought I was scum because I was pushing on obvtown and apparently there was a feeling that went along with that and although I'm not making the same strange pushes I still have that same scum feeling.

At that point, yes. That was several hours ago. At this point I've read rather more of the game (read: your entire ISO).

And this doesn't really make any sense either. It wasn't three hours ago, it was two days ago when she pulled the town-Nacho card and apparently she hasn't read our ISO since then and hasn't gotten any more caught up or felt any differently about the read since then despite the line of questioning on it.

so her read is inconsistent and bullshit and fabricated and no i don't think goodmorning is town.

[fferyllt]

Ms Marangal kindly replaces Honeybee! Please welcome her!

[Ms Marangal]

VOTE: Wisdom

Noct is scum and I'm only on page two

Wisdom replaced Noct so...

Vote goes there for now as I catch up

[Wisdom]

hi mara. youre in a scumslot.

pedit: lol