Mini 388: DOOMsville II {Game Over!}

[ShadowLurker]

/confirm

[ShadowLurker]

Vote Ozy

Vote hops too much.

[ShadowLurker]

So Turbovolver was the first to change their random vote, and immediately got voted by two others.

Ozymandius was the next one to change his random vote, and got voted for it by ShadowLurker.

Very interesting. I'll keep my SL-vote for the moment.

Why is this interesting?

What I actually meant with the comment was that it seemed strange that there seemed to be three people who thought an early vote change was vote-worthy (Rosso, Mert, SL). The two votes for Turbo could be coincidence, since they didn't came with reasons, but I doubt it.

SL's vote for Ozy definitely was a little suspicious, since the reason behind it ("votehops too much") is BS, while SL apparently intended it as at least a semi-serious vote, hence my vote for SL.

Patrick makes a valid point though, SL didn't mention Turbo who did the exact same thing SL accused Ozy of. However, Turbo is actually right that one shouldn't answer someone's questions for them.

Rosso, please explain why you think Sotty should be lynched.

plz stop trying to make masterpieces out of shit

unvote vote falcone

[ShadowLurker]

Rosso, please explain why you think Sotty should be lynched.

because sotty is scum

Oh, I get it, you're trying to be BJ.

SL, I don't quite get your vote for me. Is it because I used the first thing that was remotely interesting to try and start a discussion, or just because I voted you?

Both possibilities seem like not-so-great reasons for a vote.

nice false dilemna

[ShadowLurker]

ok, without much to go on in the first few pages. The person I find most scummy at this point is Shadow Lurker. She seems much to defensive with just one vote on her. So for right now I will

Vote: ShadowLurker.

Still watching this game, along with my others.

good defense kilmenator, i'll leave u alone for now

Unvote Vote Ozy

he's been lurking

[ShadowLurker]

Hmmm, I'm concerned by Rosso at the moment. He voted Turbo just after I did with very little reason and has since jumped onto the other guy with two votes (Sotty). I'm keeping my eye on him for the time being.

mert, ill be honest. i want to be on the biggest wagon possible.

that makes reactions.

thats how mafia works.

youve played games, you know that this is how mafia works.

bad coin:mert

mert, ill be honest. i want to be on the biggest wagon possible.

that makes reactions.

thats how mafia works.

youve played games, you know that this is how mafia works.

bad coin:mert

Well yes and no. I understand the value of wagons, of votes that spark them etc and I do think there's a good chance of finding scum (especially inexperienced scum) on a pattern of wagons, but just as your argument is that you're town using wagons to try to catch scum, there's an equal case for you being the scum that is on those wagons, non?

well when it gets to lynch-1 quickly and i get off and bear down hard on the -1 voter, youll know im town.

It's just how Rosso plays.

The thing is, I think it is made too easy for players to hide behind their playstyle sometimes. I take each game as it comes, to be honest. I've been in a game with Rosso before and he played a similar style to this, but not exactly. But yeah, I have my eyes peeled but I'm not saying he's definitely scum at this point or anything.

my point is tht you freaked out over a couple votes.

no one is in danger

my point is tht you freaked out over a couple votes.

If you say so mate. You call it freaking out, I call it mentioning my concerns. I'm sure we can move past it all, especially since my post was basically nothing more than an IGMEOY...

w.t.f.

I'm here. Do you have a problem with me ShadowLurker?

I'm still trying to sort out what the situation is, and right now, I don't have much time, I'll be back later.

w.t.f.w.t.fx4

confirm vote kilmenator

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote Vote Friday

That post you just gave gave me the vibe of complete BS, and trying too hard to seem town and it shows like either you are trying to throw things out and see what sticks, or that you've been skimming the game.

[ShadowLurker]

Shadow, I don't quite follow. I wasn't really clear as to what I was saying, I realize that, so here is what I want to know. Why do you seem to jump at me so much. First I vote hop, when someone else has done so before, and now you jump at me for lurking, when I am not the biggest lurker. Sorry, it almost seems as if you're singleing me out.

I'm new, so if 'Bad Coin' is a mafia (or a Rosso Carne) term, then I don't know what it means. I'm asking you Patrick, since you know, and have not threatened to shoot me for asking.

I merely jumped on you because it was the random vote stage and I was looking for reactions. A reaction has now come by so I don't need to puruse this anymore. Most people here so far in this game seem to be looking too far into things when my posts were solely to generate discussion.

A "bad coin" is merely Rosso's way of saying FoS.

[ShadowLurker]

sorry guys, that post was in regards to SL's long post on page four where she confirm voted me with no purpose and on the very next page she jumped off...

(i tried to post before i finished reading, i usually type my ideas into the box at the bottom while i am reading and then work from there as to if my ideas change or not, but that time i hadnt finished reading the next page before i posted my idea. so to clarify that post above has everything to do with SL's long post on page 4)

I was never voting you

[ShadowLurker]

Vote Ozy

unvote vote falcone

Unvote Vote Ozy

confirm vote kilmenator

Unvote Vote Friday

Damn sure that's the only instances of me voting. A confirm vote is for when you're already voting someone, also the fact that the post was completely unrelated to kilmenator should've gaven away the fact that it was not serous at all. You say I "voted" you on the previous page but my vote was on Falcone and that was a "confirm vote" and there was no unvote preceding it.

Can we stop the silliness now? On that note, we're also well past the random voting and half-assed stage. Plus, friday still has a lot of explaining to do.

[ShadowLurker]

how was me voting for SL scummy in any sense? The logic of the lying vote or whatever is WIFOM... so why would it matter if that was why I was voting her? So far the only person I really get any sort of scum vibes from is SL so that is where my vote is.

That made as much sense as Max does on drugs. When does this sentence ever make sense: " The logic of the lying vote or whatever is WIFOM..." ?? Even if it did, WIFOM and "lying vote" don't seem to be good reasons for voting someone.

[ShadowLurker]

would-ya stop acting like a fag turbo....for god sakes it was A joke!the fact every one was randoming,i thought i would just do it!and are you retarted or some thing?why do you want me to adress you?is that a confession that your scum?FFS grow up yah damn kid...
being so that turbo has just partly pissed me of with his immaturety...i will e posting in a few...

[ShadowLurker]

Umm, ShadowLurker lies as town. In Leper mafia he claimed Kamikaze when he was vanilla.

just because someone does something in another game does not mean that they are any less scummy if they do it in this game. to me, it doesnt matter if SL lies in other games, if she does in this game it is scummy. therefore i find her scummy no matter how she plays in other games.

and to SL's...

kilmenator wrote:
how was me voting for SL scummy in any sense? The logic of the lying vote or whatever is WIFOM... so why would it matter if that was why I was voting her? So far the only person I really get any sort of scum vibes from is SL so that is where my vote is.


That made as much sense as Max does on drugs. When does this sentence ever make sense: " The logic of the lying vote or whatever is WIFOM..." ?? Even if it did, WIFOM and "lying vote" don't seem to be good reasons for voting someone.

my sentence was a reply to whoever said that why would you lie about something that could so easily be disproved. my point was no matter what your reply was it could be taken as WIFOM logic, which means it could go either way... for scum or for town... and, lying would be a good enough reason for me to vote for someone.

SL's play is not pro-town therefore that is where my vote will stay.

No that is bullshit, learn the meaning of WIFOM. If it is WIFOM, it is neither a scum or a town tell so you just invalidated your own argument.

And I still have NOT LIED about my vote, confirm vote is for when you are already voting someone and you are showing that you still think them scummy, not for people you haven't been voting for.

[ShadowLurker]

SL is acting all over the place,

Please define "all over the place" as it's general and I don't see at all what you mean.

he hasn't made a vote yet that I could agree with,

Would you like me to vote myself? As that seems to be what you would agree with.

he's evasive when questioned and all in all,

What questions have I evaded?

he's playing a lot differently than he did at the start of our previous game (where he was town).

Complete metagaming, and yet others have already said I've been showing similarities to Leper Mafia. Obviously there is dissent over this point and Leper Mafia was the first game I have ever signed up for. I've completed a couple of other games as well y'know.

[ShadowLurker]

SL, what I meant is that you seem to poke here and there, attacking here and there and changing your vote a lot, to the extent of losing track of it (e.g. the "confirm vote kilmenator" thing).

This could mean nothing, but I get the impression of scum who's trying to seem active, but hesitant to push in a certain direction too much.

And you were being evasive regarding my questions to you - about your (1st) Ozy vote and about you vote on me.

To Turbo: Remember Leper mafia... You thought STD's "passion" was a sign of townieness there too...

To friday: It would be a lot easier to read your posts and understand your points if you'd increase the amount of punctuation in your posts and decrease the amount of insults.

Umm.. no, I was simply doing random things to get discussion going. Apparently, people have been skimming as no one noticed the discrepency between my votes until I pointed it out myself. And you pointing out a mistake in Turbo's scumdar is just sounding desperate in my opinion because it's obvious that Turbo can make a mistake in what he thinks and there's no need for you to poison the well.

In fact, your constant little snipes to demerit people are enough to warrant a

FoS: Falcone

[ShadowLurker]

Umm.. no, I was simply doing random things to get discussion going. Apparently, people have been skimming as no one noticed the discrepency between my votes until I pointed it out myself.

What, so now you're saying you were deliberately acting strange/random just to get ppl talking? After you've spent most of your recent posts trying to defend your actions and saying there was nothing strange?

Can we stop the silliness now? On that note, we're also well past the random voting and half-assed stage. Plus, friday still has a lot of explaining to do.

Sounds like you actually wanted attention away from what you'd done. Now you say it was done in the name of conversation. I have to say I don't like that.
Anyway why do you say nobody noticed the discrepancy in your votes until you pointed it out? Didn't Ozy point it out?

Well his post said 'can we stop the silliness now?' That implies that he thinks the whole thing against him is BS. And earlier he voted Falcone for 'creating masterpieces out of shit'. Now he's saying he was deliberately provoking the attention by doing silly/weird things. Why was he trying to push ppl away from him if that was the case?

It seems like he's changing his defence from 'I'm not doing anything strange' to 'I was deliberately acting strange to start discussion'.

Please explain how I am changing my defense. The things earlier before I said "stop the silliness" were to generate discussion. The things afterwards were not and my real thoughts about what was going on. I've said there is nothing "strange" (clarify what you mean by this) about what I did as it was to generate discussion and especially not the confirm vote, which is true, but the point is, it still was to generate discussion.

[ShadowLurker]

Also, on your metagaming vs. Leper Mafia. On Leper Mafia, there was something to go off immediately, the random vote stage was basically non existent, if you notice, I started it off with something silly too "Vote Rathyr because my dice told me too" so really, there isn't any discrepency between what happened. It was just in Leper, the PBPAs and seriousness started immediately, and here, I felt we just had people who were trying to nitpick what I was doing for no reason so basically, your metagame arguments don't apply, and I urge you to look at other games if you want to look down that path.

[ShadowLurker]

If the stuff you did earlier was to generate discussion, then I don't know why you were accusing ppl of nitpicking you. Your first vote on Ozy for vote hopping was questioned by Falcone, and you voted him for apparently making masterpieces out of shit. You strangely accused Falcone of setting up a false dilemna, you made that weird post which contained only quotes and w.t.f. and you confirmed a vote on kilmenator when you weren't voting her. All this you say to create discussion. But when it did create discussion, you told ppl to back off, stop nitpicking etc. I don't really get it.

The metagaming argument I assume you're targetting at Falcone since I don't think your play in Leper Mafia makes you look bad here.

Maybe my above post fleshes it out a bit more. I don't think I'm misrepresenting the situation at all. I find it interesting that you seem to be keenly defending Shadowlurker, although to some extent I can see how his kind of behaviour could make him a ridiculously easy target for scum votes if he's pro town.

He never said that though. He hasn't said anything about the 'level of weirdness' of his play, and he hasn't really done much defense other than ask snide questions and/or request that people clarify their attacks on him.

Well ok, he hasn't said anything about his weirdness of his play so I suppose it's grammatically wrong to put it in ' '. Nevertheless I'm trying to find out the reasons for what he's done so far, because it wouldn't be the first time I've seen ppl tring to hide under the I was just generating discussion defence.

The point of the matter, it generated discussion. Nitpicking will lead to this which it already in a sense: THAT WAS STUPID IF YOU'RE PROTOWN, NO IT WASN'T IT GENERATED DISCUSSION IT WASN'T SCUMMY, YES IT WAS, NO IT WASN'T, etc. The point of the matter is, we now have people's reactions to each other and more interactions and are beyond the random vote stage now.

I don't know what you mean that I'm hiding under the cover of "generating discussion defense" because my actions pre-taking the game seriously weren't intended to be anything, they were just for discussion and I can't really argue on the principle of whether it was smart or not or whether protown or antitown players would be likely to do that but I don't see the point in voting me for it because obviously, I'm NOT doing it anymore and I don't see how generating discussion puts you in a scum context.

[ShadowLurker]

I dont think it was the generating discussion part that got targetted. I think it was the way in which you generated the discussion. Why not throw out a No Lynch or something like that to generate discussion instead of how you were acting? And honestly I dont like how turbo seems to always be coming to the defense of SL. Maybe it is nothing, but I think that SL should defend herself because she is the one who put herself in this situation.

So, on to new topics. I would like to hear more from other people, and would like to hear their takes on what is going on.

1) I'm a boy.

2) I am defending myself.

[ShadowLurker]

yo

[ShadowLurker]

..so i throw 1 word at turbo...big deal...its jsut that the fact he keeps pointing out at random times about all this...it just annoys me...not only that,but as you can see.he continues...
and my vote is still on rosso?i never knew...

and why must you always mention me turbo...i really havtn said anything scummy yet...hardly at all with all these set backs...

Friday 13th's only vote is on Rosso, who she voted because he was trying to "speed lynch". Friday, Rosso appears to have just been generating discussion, and I don't think he's done anything wrong. What do you say to this?

well you know,technicly,you kinda answered your own question...

Yet your vote is still on Rosso.

[ShadowLurker]

Friday, is English your first language?

[ShadowLurker]

The Friday thing is nothing? Well in her latest post, she tells me I should drop accusations for no good reason, then goes on to say she is unvoting just so she won't look like scum.

O.O

That's what I thought I read, but I thought it was a communication barrier or something as that seems way too ridicolous to be true.

[ShadowLurker]

Still happy with my vote on friday 13th.

[ShadowLurker]

Damnit. I don't think I've ever had such a fruitless reread as that. I did notice friday going rather hard at Rosso, with alot of his posts just reminding us that Rosso had been inactive or lurking. I can't swear to it but I don't think friday ever mentioned any of the other non posters, such as bird or Mert. Why only Rosso?

FoS: Patrick

[ShadowLurker]

SL, why do you always seem to be sticking up for Friday?

WTF?

[ShadowLurker]

SL, why do you always seem to be sticking up for Turbo?

WTF?

[ShadowLurker]

To elaborate more on what Turbo said, you're accusations of vote hopping are also false. I have made one serious vote in this game which was my 6th post and I'm still on the same person so I don't see how what I did could be considered "vote hopping"

[ShadowLurker]

give me a break... first of all, this game is so messed up because in another game i am in there are like 2 or three players who are here too... so i keep getting names messed up... i you will read the thread you will see why i would be voting patrick and chess because my reasons are listed in another post. i didnt put them at three because i find the discussion of a third vote useless and didnt want to spark it yet again. if i didnt want to take the heat for a third vote then i never would have mentioned it. i think that you and SL are scum buddies or one of you is buddying up to the other because at least one of you are scum and you will take the other down with you. and, to answer the question as to why i think SL is defending you it is because it seems that when you two post you post very similar ideas or you kind of attack the people who are attacking you guys. and example would be if attack SL then you (turbo) attack me. or visa versa. anyway, just my thoughts.

First of all, turbo wasn't attacking you, he was attacking your attacks which were all untrue. Second of all, you just proved that you're putting motives of not looking scummy over motives of hunting scum.

[ShadowLurker]

no i wasnt avoiding looking scummy at all! i didnt want to deal with another bunch of pages of stu[id arguments that go no where! let me reread. i think i might have some apologies coming to people because i have them confused! give me a bit please!

No one will ever quick lynch you, in fact, I'm not even voting you, feel free to reread especially if it helps you straighten out your thoughts. However, I doubt there would've been discussion about third on a bandwagon because it really is an unfounded scumtell and if you thought them scummy, you should've put the third vote on. Any discussion helps town.

[ShadowLurker]

Well that was very beneficial. Now can we wagon friday-13th? Thanks.

[ShadowLurker]

Shadow - considering you haven't mentioned Friday in a post since the 11th, seems odd to try and get a quick band wagon going now.

What are you talking about? I've been pushing on Friday this whole game and she still hasn't answered questions. How am I trying to get a quick bandwagon going on her

now

?

[ShadowLurker]

Shadow - when i wrote that i think what i had done was look at all your posts and noticed that you hadn't mentioned Friday for a long time, ten days or so. so then you suddenly brought up Friday again i found it odd was all.

In the first place, I hadn't posted in 6 days, and there weren't many posts at all in that 6 days anyway. And second of all, it was 8 days.

[ShadowLurker]

Mod:

I believe we need a deadline extension because of the fact that several people have been inactive and need prodding and possibly replacement:
friday-13th: Last post December 12th
Rosso Carne: Last post December 15th
MrBuddyLee: Last post December 19th




Ozymandius, who do you think is scummy and why?

[ShadowLurker]

kilmenator, I believe you're mixing up games again? No one has claimed as of yet.

[ShadowLurker]

I don't like how the votes so far are:

Ozymandius, who I'm not ready to vote just yet
kilmenator, who I believe for her actions is protown
Rosso, who for meteagame reasons I believe is protown
friday-13th, who I'm the only one voting.

[ShadowLurker]

Ozymandius, who do you think is scummy and why?

Please answer this after you reread. Thanks.

[ShadowLurker]

SL what do you think about MBL? I would like to know your thought there... since you outlined the other votes and what you thought.

Both he and his predecessor haven't said enough to let me get a good read on them which is why I requested a prod on him. He's usually good at generating discussion regardless of alignment as well and he isn't the worst of the lurkers so I'm opposed to a lurker wagon on him.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote Vote Ozymandius

Your wide net of suspicions seem contrived at best and I find this too similar to that scumchat game if lyncher when you leapt on everybody else's cases and tried to pursue them no matter how weak they were.

[ShadowLurker]

Patrick:

What are your thoughts on IH?

[ShadowLurker]

Sorry, that was posted in the wrong thread.

[ShadowLurker]

Mod:

May we have a deadline extension as to have a bit more discussion before deadline such as a claim?

[ShadowLurker]

First of all, what is voting on Rosso helping? It is obvious he is NOT lurking, but rather hasn't been at the site judging by him being replaced in all his other games and his mini being abandoned. Voting him is not helpful, especially when we're under a deadline.

[ShadowLurker]

I have stated my opinion that you should claim already.

The longer you delay about claiming, the less time we have to make a decision (we only have a little over 3 days left)

[ShadowLurker]

kilmenator: Have you been paying attention to the game? Ozy is most certaintly not vanilla, as he's an unlynchable townie. He's also pretty much confirmed innocent. Also, you have already ruined any chance you have of getting information about MBL and frankly, I don't believe MBL claiming to confirm your role information is worth it considering you already said if MBL is a power role you will leave him alone.

[ShadowLurker]

Although I beleive MBL claiming solely to confirm kilmenator is pointless, I'm not objected to him claiming for being scummy.

Vote: MBL

[ShadowLurker]

I support a mass claim today. I'll go first.

[ShadowLurker]

w.t.f. x4

This is not constructive.

Please see:

i dont like your unsubstantial posts that come with just quotes of other and WTF...

[ShadowLurker]

I can confirm two people right now (MBL and kil not included). That leaves us with 7, if we believe MBL and kil, we have 5. And out of those 5, we should believe some of them as well over others meaning I don't see how we can lose right now.

[ShadowLurker]

So shall I go?

[ShadowLurker]

Not really up to me is it. Your choice if you think it's best.

I'd like consensus first before I claim, and then everybody else backs away.

[ShadowLurker]

Me in post 107:

I

merely jumped on you because it was the random vote stage and I was looking for reactions.

A

reaction has now come by so I don't need to puruse this anymore.

M

ost people here so far in this game seem to be looking too far into things when my posts were solely to generate discussion.

A

"bad coin" is merely Rosso's way of saying FoS.

Bold mine, spells out IAMA

Me in post 123

D

amn sure that's the only instances of me voting.

A

confirm vote is for when you're already voting someone, also the fact that the post was completely unrelated to kilmenator should've gaven away the fact that it was not serous at all.

Y

ou say I "voted" you on the previous page but my vote was on Falcone and that was a "confirm vote" and there was no unvote preceding it.

C

an we stop the silliness now?

O

n that note, we're also well past the random voting and half-assed stage.

P

lus, friday still has a lot of explaining to do.

Bold mine, spells out DAYCOP.


I AM A DAYCOP.

If you look in my posts after that, I started spelling out TWELVE but it got too hard so I scrapped it.

My investigations:
Rosso Carne, now Norinel, 12th player in the list innocent on D1
Adele, previously Falcone, innocent today

geraintm should claim next

[ShadowLurker]

Makes sense. Does your pm give any indication of sanity though? Always have to look out for that in minis.

I doubt we'll have sanity issues in a Mini and even if we did, I doubt my PM would tell me anything about it. My PM says I'll get innocent or guilty results but I don't really think that means anything.

[ShadowLurker]

The first mini run by MM contained both a sane and insane cop, with a load of millers to boot. I don't think we can discount sanity issues. If you are a sane day cop then we're obv in a very strong position, especially with the GF gone.

I just checked it, there was only a Sane Day Cop.

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 184#453184

There were also no Millers from what I could see, only an investigation immune SK and a Mafia Godfather. I don't think we have a SK due to the lack of kills last night unless we got really lucky.

[ShadowLurker]

So my thoughts:

Town
ShadowLurker
Adele (replaces Falcone on Day 1)
Ozymandius
Norinel (replaces Rosso Carne on Night 1)

Probable Town
MrBuddyLee (replaces Sotty7 on Day 1)
kilmenator

leaving:

Turbovolver
Patrick
klebian (replaces friday-13th on Night 1)
geraintm

Klebian needs to post in this thread as I don't believe he has. geraintm has been silent lately. Patrick and Turbo I'm fine with right now.

[ShadowLurker]

I'm talking about mini 333 Street Racing Mafia.

Ok that setup was a bit crazy looking at it. We've had tightened rules on what defines a Regular though and that would probably mean Norinel and Adele were both Millers and I was Insane if I wasn't sane.

Also, I should still be guranteed at least 1 more investigation tommorow if I get protected tonight.

[ShadowLurker]

"My second attempt for confusion was to add the sane and insane cops to the game, which I tend to have in all the games I make up. I figured there may be a point in the game where one cop claims, the other cop counters, and the town eventually lynches both of them because of the assumption that one is lying."

Ugh...

Well, I still believe that a Mass Claim is the correct way to proceed.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote

I believe a mass claim order should have geraintm first, klebian second, and how about we dice roll for the next?

ORDER
1. geraintm
2. klebian

PEOPLE REMAINING
1. MrBuddyLee
2. kilmenator
3. Turbovolver
4. Patrick

Original Roll String: 1d4

1 4-Sided Dice: (2) = 2

Original Roll String: 1d3

1 3-Sided Dice: (2) = 2

Original Roll String: 1d2

1 2-Sided Dice: (2) = 2

[ShadowLurker]

So

ORDER
1. geraintm
2. klebian
3. Patrick

PEOPLE REMAINING
1. MrBuddyLee
2. kilmenator
3. Turbovolver

ORDER
1. geraintm
2. klebian
3. Patrick
4. MrBuddyLee

PEOPLE REMAINING
1. kilmenator
2. Turbovolver

ORDER
1. geraintm
2. klebian
3. Patrick
4. MrBuddyLee
5. Turbovolver
6. kilmenator

Is everybody fine with that?

[ShadowLurker]

The order is fine, but I don't see a consensus on massclaiming at all. It seems like you're trying to make it seem as if we agreed on a massclaim without anyone else saying they wanted to.

Well Patrick and kilmenator did not raise any objects, we've gotten a partial claim from MBL and kilmeantor already. Do you object to one? If you don't, the only objecting people might be Turbovolver who's 2nd to last and geraintm, who hasn't been making any contribution at all.

[ShadowLurker]

Ok, I may be a bit overenthusiastic as I think we have the game won =/ Perhaps it might be better to take it slow and let me get a few more investigations?


MBL and kilmenator: Do any of you have information that can be used to basically break the game?

[ShadowLurker]

If ShadowLurker realizes his last remaining scumpartner got caught making a kill, this could be his best move. Establish trust with the townies he confirms and "believe" the claims of the others. Lynch the unclaimed/unconfirmed. The final scum will probably need to get us to make three mislynches in order to win. I'd bet on SL being town, but it's not a certainty.

Except if we massclaimed like I originally suggested, that trust would probably be blown right out of the water if I was lying

---

We should not be lynching Ozy unless we have decided on a No Lynch. I do not believe a No Lynch is the best way to proceed. Right now I am content with a

Unvote Vote geraintm

to see where that leads us

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote Vote klebian

[ShadowLurker]

ShadowLurker, is a vote on Klebian where the Geraintm vote led to?

A single vote = No pressure and does not help


I'd like everybody to start saying who they think is scummy and why as I'm reasonably sure we can get this game over tommorow if we make informed decisions.

[ShadowLurker]

Tommorow, wow, you seem pretty confident. The pressure thing is true, but why the pressure on Klebian?

Please suggest an alternative and I'll gladly look into it.

[ShadowLurker]

Tommorow, wow, you seem pretty confident. The pressure thing is true, but why the pressure on Klebian?

Please suggest an alternative and I'll gladly look into it.

I'm not saying that it's a good or bad move. I'm wondering what your reasoning on the putting pressure on Klebian. Turbo's reasoning was lacking, but as you said, a single vote means no pressure, but you decided to put a little more pressure on Klebian. I want to know why and whether or not you have a different reasoning besides Turbo's word.

Well as I said earlier, my top two canindates were geraintm and Klebian mostly because of process of elimination. I said I'll be good with pressure on either of them.

[ShadowLurker]

Sorry for that double post, the forum said that it failed, so I tried again, but didn't realize that it actually worked.

Would you like me to answer any more questions?

[ShadowLurker]

I'm a little surprised nobody's going after me for not posting thoughts on specific people, since klebian and I replaced in to the exact same situation. I'm working on a read right now, will have stuff to say about Day 1 over the weekend, if not sooner.

Please do, CT Mafia was lost even though they got it down to 1 mafia out of 11 because the confirmed innocents did not feel like doing anything.

[ShadowLurker]

I don't believe too much speculation on the kill/killer until it comes out is a good idea as it will distract us from finding scum.

For the moment though, I'm leaning toward the killer being protown.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote Vote geraintm

[ShadowLurker]

I don't believe it's a good idea for them to step forward.

[ShadowLurker]

Can we have some votes placed by the way?

[ShadowLurker]

I have an inkling of who the daykiller was and I believe that person to be protown at the moment.

[ShadowLurker]

[ShadowLurker]

I have to say, i don't really trust anyone in this game. I feel like everyone else is playing with a ton more info than me about what is going on.

Did you miss a cop claim?

[ShadowLurker]

I believe klebian is referring to the discrepancy of her saying she found it scummy earlier and now saying she did not consider it because he has not finished it.

[ShadowLurker]

Either way, it'd be nice to get some input from our other players as right now I think this day needs a deadline.

[ShadowLurker]

I have to say, i don't really trust anyone in this game. I feel like everyone else is playing with a ton more info than me about what is going on.

Did you miss a cop claim?

? nope. but that would account for merely one person...yourself.
MBL and kilm i could never work out what the two of them were on about either, but it was more a comment on how i felt out of my depth in this my first trip outside the newbie room.

That would account for three.

And kilm and MBF have both claimed power roles.

[ShadowLurker]

I'm sorry; as I've posted a few other places, thing have been ridiculous. It doesn't help that I'm not really seeing a decent case against anyone with a vote at the moment.

Then make a case against someone else please, you're contribution this game has been or rather the lack of, noteworthiness.

[ShadowLurker]

He was another one who said I picked the two easiest targets by playstyle. Have you encountered them before, Norinel? Or are you just assuming they play this way as town?

kilmenator I've played with before in Newbies. I replaced friday-13th in (the now-finished) Jungle Republic, where she was town.

People's grammar, writing style, and strategic approach don't get significantly worse when they're scum. If they did, it'd be way too easy.

Do you have some thoughts than who you think are scum then? If you're not happy where everyone is going, an alternative is always nice.

[ShadowLurker]

You are the Watchman. Every night you may choose to watch someone to see who is targeting that player.

[ShadowLurker]

May I ask what everyone else thinks of ozy's alignment? And to respond to klebian on the point that I would want to lynch townies isnt accurate, I would definetly not want to lynch a power role such as a cop, doc, or such. To me, a townie would not be what I wanted to lynch, but if he claimed townie and I thought he was scummy, I wouldnt feel so bad about lynching him. If he claimed power role, I would be much more likely to lay off for a little while and watch to see what happens.

Protown, there's no way we would have an unlynchable scum as that would require us to vig him and once the vig is dead we're screwed.

[ShadowLurker]

We can test it again if we have to but we shouldn't be worrying about him at the moment.

[ShadowLurker]

I have submitted my check of geraintm.

[ShadowLurker]

I got geraintm as town, I really hope I'm not naive, but that leaves Patrick/Turbo unless we think by some logic that MBL and kilmenator are scum.

I g2g now, barely had time.

[ShadowLurker]

kilmenator can you give us your results? Thanks.

[ShadowLurker]

Well, I could see MBL being a...scum who...successfully recruited) Ozy.

The more and more I think about it the more and more I'm leaning towards this explanation

[ShadowLurker]

Vote MBL

A 1 shot mafia recruiter is common.
I don't like him asking us who the daykiller is.

[ShadowLurker]

Ha. It's only a bad thing if they're pro-town. I suspect they're bad guy, why don't you, SL?

I feel like I have a good guess who the daykiller is and I feel like I feel like they're town.

[ShadowLurker]

unvote vote kilmenator

This game seems sealed IMO.

[ShadowLurker]

What does everyone think about a scum group not being able to nightkill at all, but only daykill. I've sent in my investigation of MBL as I'm almost positive he's the last scum.

Vote MBL

[ShadowLurker]

MBL is guilty.

MBL can daykill me, then we can lynch him.

[ShadowLurker]

The odd thing was that I originally thought Norinel was the daykiller based on my read at the time I made that post.

Although I now doubt that there's a "daykilling SK" as that would mean scum would have to kill at night and that we've had 3 successful kill preventions which doesn't seem likely at all.

[ShadowLurker]

Let's change it to this:

Norinel, if you kill before we lynch MBL, we WILL lynch you today instead of MBL.

We should hurry and lynch MBL before Norinel shows up. Turbo, any chance of double voting?


I'll investigate geraintm tommorow just to make sure.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote

for discussion sake.

O_O.

[ShadowLurker]

Let's get a full claim out of Norinel at the very least.

This game is honestly very convoluted even if the roles aren't that much individually and I'm trying to decipher what the hell is going on half the time

[ShadowLurker]

I've already stated this:

Let's get a full claim out of Norinel at the very least.

Although MBL, less bullying tactics please.

[ShadowLurker]

Honestly, I'm just confused right now, I'm reading over MBL's posts trying to find something, and I'm playing out possible scenarios of roles in my head.

I think it's safe to say that we only have 1 SK left which everyone should be able to agree about considering 1 recruited Mafia is a lot stronger than one who started out one and I doubt the mafia would have 4 members.

I'm also thinking about the idea of everybody claiming and giving their roles and actions so that we can analyze them and see what happened each night.

[ShadowLurker]

MBL: If you are sure Norinel is the daykilling SK, why is your vote on Adele other than what you perceive to be intentional stupidity?

[ShadowLurker]

Let's get a full claim out of Norinel at the very least.

This game is honestly very convoluted even if the roles aren't that much individually and I'm trying to decipher what the hell is going on half the time

I've already stated this:

Let's get a full claim out of Norinel at the very least.

Although MBL, less bullying tactics please.

[ShadowLurker]

If Norinel is a SK, MBL must be guilty as well, therefore Norinel is clear.

If I am a SK, Adele must be as well, therefore, I am clear.

So now we have narrowed our list to MBL, geraintm, and Adele.


Ok now, the SK should honestly claim right now, why? If the SK claims, we no lynch, and MBL converts you to town and everybody but the three mafiates win. There is NO reason not to claim unless you're a dick and don't want people to win. This plan assumes that MBL is not the SK, but you have a MUCH better chance of winning by trusting us to convert you (as converting you gives another winner, lynching you provides no benefits) than trusting us to not lynch you today (2/3 chance of surviving as 2 people are clear) and then tommorow (1/2 chance of surviving) which means you have a 1/3 chance to win. 1/3 vs. 1, which is the better choice?

[ShadowLurker]

(SK also encompasses the chance of there being a mafia that could only daykill and only the mafia recruiter left which is the possbility I am leaning towards)

[ShadowLurker]

By the way, geraintm, can you announce your targets?

[ShadowLurker]

Sorry for quadruple posting, Adele: Does your PM mention anything about becoming a Day Cop or Night Cop? Just covering all the bases here and laying your claims all fully out on the table.

[ShadowLurker]

geraintm: Please read posts 916-918 and then claim SK or Not SK, please remember that if you are the SK and claim SK, you will win. If you are not SK and you claim not SK, you will win. The only way you could lose is if you lied.

[ShadowLurker]

The SK is lying about not being SK. If we don't get them converted, they can still win by dodging two lynches. So the right play, I believe, is to lynch the most likely SK target until/unless they fess up.

Why would the SK choose to try and dodge two lynches over a guranteed win?

[ShadowLurker]

I will vote once I get geraintm's resposne.

[ShadowLurker]

Vote: MBL

In my opinion, there's just no way that he's not guilty and everything from post 916 on was just to cover the bases.

For him not to the guilty would require Adele to be a daykilling SK who chose to lie about her role who's still trying to get MBL lynched knowing full well that she'll have lost her chance to win with the town and has the biggest probability of being lynched tommorow. That versus the scenario of MBL being guilty which seems much more likely to me.

[ShadowLurker]

I've investigated all 3 of you already and got all innocent so it's unlikely for me to get anything else.

As for today, Norinel is DEFINITELY the lynch as we should use his ability to lynch two people rather one, now, we must decide whether Adele or geraintm is more scummy since I am cleared as if I was scum, Adele would have to be as well and 6 scum in a game would just be unbalanced. Norinel's being "cleared" does not apply today MBL and Norinel being both scum is a plausible possibility now.

This means that I should definitely be the first vote on Norinel and that Adele should unvote.

I have a question though.

Mod: If there is a daykill of a player who is not voting while two person are already on a third person, will the daykill lower the amount to lynch and cause that person to be lynched? Or will a daykill reset the votes?

[ShadowLurker]

Well, this game is high-chaos, right? Could the exact wording of your PM be interpreted in such a way that there could be no cop?

Now you're really trying to stretch it What would be the point of a back up cop with no cop?




As for today, I think the right plan is to have Adele hammer Norinel. If me and geraintm put our votes on Norinel..
Case 1: Norinel is scum
If Norinel daykills Adele, he will be lynched and lose. If Norinel daykills geraintm, it will be 2 to lynch with one vote on him and Adele can still hammer.
Case 2: Adele is scum
If Adele daykills Norinel, then the votes on him no longer apply. If Adele daykills either geraintm or I, then there will only be 1 vote on Norinel.

As far as I see it, daykilling can't mess up our strategy. I'm much more inclined to believe a Doctor role over a Deputy role although a SK Doctor does not seem entirely out of the question.

[ShadowLurker]

Go town!


And this happened right in the middle of a nice long post >_< wasted effort