Mafia Behind the Maiden (Game over!)

[dramonic]

Been busy IRL, will catch-up on Sunday.

[Vi]

Vote Count VII:

Nailah
ToastyToast (L-6) ~ Haze, UberNinja, SpyreX, Debonair Danny DiPietro, Quilford, Gammagooey, Wyrd, implosion, Teleporting Speed Hippos
GreyICE (L-11) ~ Oman, Nikanor,

Gammagooey,

Katsuki, Zdenek
MaguaofIllusion (L-11) ~ Tammy, Glork, singersigner, Tierce
Magister Ludi (L-12) ~

Wyrd,

Duplicity, MaguaofIllusion, Alchemist
UberNinja (L-14) ~ Lady Lambdadelta,

Teleporting Speed Hippos

dramonic (L-14) ~ Hinduragi,

implosion, Alchemist

Alchemist (L-14) ~ Nexus
Katsuki (L-14) ~ GreyICE
Oversoul (L-14) ~ dramonic
Teleporting Speed Hippos (L-14) ~ Magister Ludi
singersigner (L-14) ~ Shmugen
Debonair Danny DiPietro (L-14) ~ ToastyToast

Not Voting:

Oversoul

--With 29 alive, it takes 15 to lynch.

9

[Alchemist]

Gamma

You're now officially a triplevoter due to transitive property.

Let me know if that means you actually want it on GI (I'm still not seeing it). But fahhh this game needs blood

What happened to this

[SpyreX]

He IS.

I'm voting with him and DDD is voting with me.

Thus, transitively, he's got 3 votes.

[Alchemist]

Stop saying transitively.

I dont know what it means ;-;

[implosion]

hi alchemist.

Vote for toasty.

[SpyreX]

http://www.mathwords.com/t/transitive_property.htm

[Alchemist]

But I get it now. Sort of weird though.

hi alchemist.

Vote for toasty.

I'll hammer him

Ludi is a better lynch.

[Shmugen]

23. SpyreX - His answers to the pressure put on him by various sources (UN, MaguaoI) have been satisfactory, but only just. I want to call it clear town, but it's not there enough. Remember when I was talking about LLD and I said I hate vote trade deals? I dislike proxy votes too. Giving up your vote is like putting down your pistol in an Old West duel. Spy is correct that this game needs blood. It's pretty bloated already, I can't imagine how bad it would be if the lurkfolk actually tried.

24. Tammy - The personality irks me when someone flips the raeg switch, but the concepts presented seem solid. The town parts of the ISO that stand out are recent, the analysis of the LLD vote deal with Spy and the acceptance that meta is a thing around here and the effort to go to her old home, dig up all kinds of games and do analysis on them. The earlier parts of the ISO kind of blur together, but I think I understand where the idea of voting Tammy early came from.

25. Tierce - Like you needed an excuse to go drinking, that's most likely the biggest lie you've told this game. (Note. If you are actually an alcoholic, I beg your pardon.) That said, the reaction to the fake dayvig seems natural enough to me, had the rage stopped early I might have thought scum. Town up and down, but I'll agree with Tammy here, meta is useful but the whole 'What would Katsuki do' argument makes me slightly ill. It isn't everything. I want to hear more on why you think MaguaoI is scum.

26. ToastyToast - Much has been said to merit the below vote already. Not only does Toast come in and suspect the 3 wagons at the time with no other reads, he continually goes back and asks how he could possibly have reads on others by page 8. A few of these other reads come through around page 40 turning his initial 3 reads into 9 reads out of 28, 5 of these being null and no mention of previous suspect Tammy. Of these reads, only one is scum and that's DDDP of all people. Really? You're reading this game, the same words I'm reading, and you come back with DDDP.

Unvote

, VOTE: ToastyToast

27. UberNinja - *sigh* Crappy attitude, small townlean. I don't think Toasty's initial post was bad enough for scumninja to rev up the bus so soon, mostly. Disinterest level is dildos, cases instead of reflexive outbursts would be nice. Do you still think Tierce is scum after the whole Oversoul thing?

28. Wyrd - It took this hydra 1000 posts to get the ball rolling, but there begins to be content, hallelujah. Fate, do try to do more than just mock Tierce. The Ludi point by Nuwen early makes some sense to me, as does the Ludi defense of Toasty point. Similar amounts of town as UberNinja but with much more promise.

29. Zdenek - I'm sorry to hear about the family emergency. Your early content was inquisitive and decent, hopefully when you return it will continue. I'm going to go with the nullside of town for stubbornness. Going after Glork's Katsuki thing in the midst of the Oversoul fakevig and Glork's pondering of replacement doesn't feel like scum looking for blood in the water.


Whew! Those last six had a lot to them.
In rough summation:
Scum (S-W) Toasty, Ludi? Singer? *Insert Lurkers here*
Null (Scum to Town): *Insert more Lurkers*, DDDP, Alchemist, Nikanor, Haze, LLD, Dramonic, Zdenek, Grey, Wyrd
Town (S-W): Tierce, Glork, Duplicity, Tammy, Gamma, Spy

[Shmugen]

They struck me as MaguaoI putting himself in the thick of things and pushing points that others might shy away from. I would expect scum to shy away from anything that draws that much unnecessary attention to themselves, especially as point 1 vs Glork was very antagonistic towards a power player who I felt was townish at the time of the post. Reminiscent of a dog barking like crazy at another dog. What's it going to do but get people to throw shoes and tell them to shut up? Yet it happened anyway.

Does either head of the hydra seem to you to be people who act shy when scum so much so that speaking their opinion on something that is a stance taken in the past an indicator of alignment?

Also, I noticed in your reads that you said Duplicity made a lot of sense in his reads post. What is your read on them? You don't say.

Magna, no. Magua I couldn't speak for, I am not a meta scholar. Your point is taken. Giving MaguaoI a quick rereread, I also appreciate the wanting to vig Dramonic due to content lack. I am for the potential vig pool subsisting of those below the mod in activity level, say from Nikanor down? Excepting Wyrd and myself, of course.

As for Duplicity, yes I do have a townread.

I forgot to throw Magna into my summary thing.

In rough summation:
Scum (S-W) Toasty, Ludi? Singer? *Insert Lurkers here*
Null (Scum to Town): *Insert more Lurkers*, DDDP, Alchemist, Nikanor, Haze, LLD, Dramonic, Zdenek, Grey, Wyrd, Spy
Town (S-W): Tierce, Glork, Duplicity, Tammy, Gamma, MaguaoI

[singersigner]

V/LAish through Monday for quadz's brother's graduation. Will be around but probably not paying anymore attention than I am now. >_>

[Magister Ludi]

Its another reason I like toasty, he's willing to poke at DDD and go *here's somebody*, because he honestly believes there might be scum slipping along in that slot.

You really think it takes any courage to put my name down?

Yes, actually. Considering Toasty is the largest wagon, if he was scum I would easily believe he would hop ship to another large wagon or a more popular lynch wagon. You have no pressure on you, no one really thinks your scum, and its not the most popular wagon to vote. The fact that he is willing to actually poke around and try and find out scum (in this case you), seems pretty pro-town. He isn't just sheeping along.

[ToastyToast]

Finished. You guys seriously need to learn how to back the fuck off. Every time I check the game its some new illogical vote on me that ignores what I say completely. Implosion, UN--learn how to play. Thats not an Ate. Its called being pissed off at all the stupidity in this game. Starting to remind me about why I stopped playing. Also, if you honestly think I can write a long ass opinion piece on all 29 players in the game, know how I solidly feel about their alignments, and respond to every little thing in a reasonable amount of time....ugh. I may not complain about my other commitments as much as Quaoroath or Singer, but if you can give them some time, then you can give me time, too. I posted those 9 reads because they were what I had done, and I didn't know if I would get a chance to finish every read. And honestly, you would probably be voting me if I waited, and would probably had already decided to vote me before I even had my list done.

In order from scummiest to town.

DDD

Implosion: He’s gotten worse with each post, basically. I still don’t know why he’s voting dramonic. No explanation. Why does he explain the vote on me but not the switch to dram? No sense made. Don’t like his long posts suck attitude; I think town are more likely to prefer posts with content over implosion’s posts. I also don’t recall this attitude from him before. The “don’t see Magua votes” comes out of nowhere. May just be a phrasing confusion. Mentions too many people without explaining why, and does not allow anyone to get a grasp on his reads above “I’m voting for this guy.” Last post just threw me over the edge. Of course I’m working on the list. I’m not going to be able to throw it all down in the same time span as a “are you fucking kidding me?” post.

20. Quilford: Stopped doing anything as soon as he didn’t have to defend himself. His “vague, negative feelings” list has no explanations attached, blames lurking on school. Sorry, but that's not going to cut it. Votes me without explaining why his “vague, negative feelings” turned into a vote;
Also, did no one catch the “I don’t know who to vote!” thing? When I started on mafia, that meant the person was probably scum who can’t figure out how to fake a case.

15. MathGirl277/Shmugen: ugh. Really? You are going to harp and focus on things that happened so early? Make something new up, rather than just being a sheep. If I’m going to get crap for my wagon reads early game, then there is no way in hell you should get away with it. Your 3 reads are me, singer, and Ludi. That's just as bad and its like 40 pages in. Who? Hopefully replacement posts soon.

21. GreyICE: Never know what flavor of GreyIce I’m going to get in a game. He seems to be like VOTE KATSUKI every fucking post. Guess what? Saying that is ineffective, and I believe I already attacked others as to why it's a scummy thing to do. I’d say he comes up on the lower end with his banter with katsuki.

LLD

Tierce

singer

14. MaguaofIllusion (MagnaofIllusion + Magua hydra): Don’t understand some of his reads. GreyICE read is odd, since it basically reads like “well, he’s done some scummy things but he’s funny!”; a lot more to say about Tammy than “she’s playing differently” (i.e. Tammy has a ton of content); However, I don’t think he’s spewing BS like some people suggested, and the wagon on him worries me.
(Lurkyland!!)

UN

16. Nexus: Who?

17. Nikanor: Meow?

18. Oman: What?

2. Teleporting Speed Hippos (AurorusVox + PeregrineV hydra): Another super lurky mc lurkerston.

11. Katsuki: Nothing I can say about this slot that hasn’t been said already. I have more problems with the other lurkers, but that doesn’t make his play right.

4. dramonic: seems to have a strong concern over the lore of the game, talked about little else early

Wyrd

Ludi

9. Hinduragi: Explained a little on his earlier, but he’s grown more town on me. I was sketched out after the OS vote, but he explained it well in terms of why he had a problem with the gambit, and why he was unvoting OS later on.

23. SpyreX: Response to MoI convinced me of town status

24. Tammy: My only read that has changed completely. I thought the meta thing was awful, but her more recent posts show much more actual content, and she is putting a clear effort into scum hunting.

6. Gammagooey: singer, kat focus is good; actually gave me a chance to respond.

5. Duplicity (Regfan + Shift hydra): Re-read slot and ended up with more good things to say than bad. They’ve been vocal, have decent reads; good town voice.

1. Alchemist (as an alt of Timeater): leaning town. I disagree with his Glork assessment, but that doesn’t mean scum would write it. I actually disagree with his OS, ludi reads too, but the fact that he put effort into finding out if OS was lying about the virus means he’s probably town.

7. Glork: Also gave me a chance to respond; has been pushing a lot. I of course did not like his reaction to the OS gambit and thought it was hasty, but now scummy per-say. See Tierce.

8. Haze: definitely town. Questions of me were valid, not sheeping; good gut, too.

19. Oversoul: I thought he was town before the gambit, and, regardless of whether said gambit was a good one, it came off as a very protown action.

Zdeneck

short version (for the long-post challenged

Scum (scummiest-->w): DDD, implosion, quilford, schmugen, GreyIce, LLD, (Tierce--special)
Middletown (nulliest-->leaning town) singer, MoI, UN, (Nexus, Oman, Nikanor, TSH--same grp), dramonic, Wyrd, Ludi,
Town(townies-->Sheepable) Hindu, SpyreX, Tammy, Duplicity, Alchemist, Glork, Haze, Oversoul, Zdeneck

I was going to respond to more people in detail, but just reading a page makes me want to throw things and I already wrote this.

[implosion]

I'm not voting dramonic anymore. And I explained the vote in 890.

I think town are more likely to prefer posts with content over implosion’s posts.

Look me in the eyes and tell me that you read the entirety of every one of Magna's/tammy's/other wall posters' posts.

I moved my vote back to you because I want a lynch, the dramonic wagon isn't moving, and I still like your wagon. I've explained my votes on all two of the people who i've voted. And why do I have to justify who i'm giving reads on? I'm giving reads as I get them.

[ToastyToast]

Also, a list of people lurking:

DDD, quil, LLD, singer(v/la tho), UN, dram, Wyrd, nexus, oman, nikanor, tsh, GI, implosion (unless he wants to piss me off a little more); this is too much. thats thirteen out of 29.

PEDIT: what you have explained you've explained poorly. You justify reads because its the town thing to do. Yes, but I wrote your section before your vote on me (a fish could've figured that out) and your vote on me just makes you scummier. And the fact that you changed your vote from dram to me does not change my beliefs about you slot, and doesn't in any way change what the dram vote shows. I ISO'd your slot and found sub-par after sub-par statement, and, honestly, thought your posts were more tedious and awful than anything MoI or Tammy have posted. I will at the least skim any long post I see.

[ToastyToast]

hi alchemist.

Vote for toasty.

Like this shitty gem right here. Short, yet I don't want to put effort into something with now effort.

[implosion]

what you have explained you've explained poorly. You justify reads because its the town thing to do. Yes, but I wrote your section before your vote on me (a fish could've figured that out) and your vote on me just makes you scummier. And the fact that you changed your vote from dram to me does not change my beliefs about you slot, and doesn't in any way change what the dram vote shows. I ISO'd your slot and found sub-par after sub-par statement, and, honestly, thought your posts were more tedious and awful than anything MoI or Tammy have posted. I will at the least skim any long post I see.

I haven't justified most of my reads. I can justify them if you really want me to, but I don't generally spend time justifying townreads unless they're under pressure. I've justified my votes for the sake of justifying my votes, so that others know why I'm voting. So really, your statement that i'm justifying votes because it's the town thing to do isn't inaccurate. That's why votes are supposed to be justified. So that others know why you're voting, and so that others can interpret those justifications and decide if they're valid.

It's your fault if you're going to make it sound like you think my vote is still on dramonic. Don't get pissed off over me interpreting your post that way. It's a game :\.

And If you're going to call me scummy for asking people to join the wagon that i'm on... yeah. you can die.

[Magister Ludi]

Don't see maguavotes.

One scumteam makes a lot more sense than two. If there's an SK, they probably have a nonstandard win condition too.

You talked about getting short and to the point in one of your posts, could you do that in explaining what about MoI-scum I, and a few others, are misinterpreting

dddp could be scum too.

And given that you think DDD could be scum, do you think it is likely that hypo toasty-scum decided to go out of his way to bus DDD-scum out of the blue

[implosion]

You talked about getting short and to the point in one of your posts, could you do that in explaining what about MoI-scum I, and a few others, are misinterpreting

There really isn't anything specific... I just don't see them as scummy. They're playing about how I'd expect a MoI-Magua hydra to play. I think when I said I didn't see the votes on them, it was in response to their response to Oversoul at the beginning of 1058.

And given that you think DDD could be scum, do you think it is likely that hypo toasty-scum decided to go out of his way to bus DDD-scum out of the blue

Maybe. Probably not. Frankly, this is just a bad question :S. I don't focus on connections on day one. And even if I did, having two scumreads that I don't think are scum together (i mean, it's obvious that the expected answer to your question is 'no') in no way prevents me from voting one of them. And I see toasty as scummier than dddp.

[Magister Ludi]

meh, I didn't expect any answer one way or the other, (sorry If you didn't like the question, but I wanted an answer) I just wanted to get where your thinking is at. I don't think it is unreasonable on day one to have a few scum reads, but then if all of them gang vote the same guy maybe you reevaluate your read on that particular player. Things change, etc.

[implosion]

The toasty wagon is filled largely with nullreads, with some townreads and one scumread. My scumreads aren't ganging up and voting anyone.

[Magister Ludi]

I wasn't implying that was the case, I was using a hypothetical to illustrate a point. (which in my mind is the low likelyhood of toasty scum voting dddp scum) Which was that sometimes you don't need a flip to change to base interactions off of.

I think the long and short of what I was trying to do here was say that if you think DDDP is scum, maybe toasty voting him is a town-tell and you could come away slowly from your toasty scum read and vote someone else! I really don't think toasty is scum here, and don't want to see him lynched.

[ToastyToast]

Maybe. Probably not. Frankly, this is just a bad question :S. I don't focus on connections on day one. And even if I did, having two scumreads that I don't think are scum together (i mean, it's obvious that the expected answer to your question is 'no') in no way prevents me from voting one of them. And I see toasty as scummier than dddp.

I know you said connection-reads D1 are bad, but do you think they are inherently scummY?

The toasty wagon is filled largely with nullreads, with some townreads and one scumread. My scumreads aren't ganging up and voting anyone.

I find it hard to believe that in my being L-6 you only have one scumread on my wagon.

ToastyToast (L-6) ~ Haze, UberNinja, SpyreX, Debonair Danny DiPietro, Quilford, Gammagooey, Wyrd, implosion, Teleporting Speed Hippos

five people on my wagon are lurkers, 2 of them are following Gammagooey, 1 is you, and then there's spyreX and Haze.
So, basically, I'm getting voted primarily by the people putting the least effort into the game, and only 3 who I think have actually done something.

[Magister Ludi]

To be honest, I don't have a large bunch of scum reads on your wagon either. I'd say TSH, and then maaaaaaybe DDD and Haze (and uberninja is just derpy).

[implosion]

I know you said connection-reads D1 are bad, but do you think they are inherently scummY?

No. I just think they're a stupid thing to do.

ToastyToast (L-6) ~

Haze

,

UberNinja

,

SpyreX

,

Debonair Danny DiPietro

,

Quilford

,

Gammagooey, Wyrd, implosion

,

Teleporting Speed Hippos

Colorized for you. DDDP is my only scumread on the wagon. I've mentioned all of the townreads except for gamma. Haven't gotten real opinions on anyone else here.

I think the long and short of what I was trying to do here was say that if you think DDDP is scum, maybe toasty voting him is a town-tell and you could come away slowly from your toasty scum read and vote someone else! I really don't think toasty is scum here, and don't want to see him lynched.

Like i said, i think toasty is scum more strongly than dddp, so etc.