In the Court of the Gods (Game Over)

[Jack]

DGB are you seriously trying to call 2 posts "very busy site wide"?

[themanhimself]

So maybe that was hyperbolic, but I can't see how we can have two people, one of whom *must* be lying and not do something about that today.

P-edit: Jack claims that NS claimed scum to him via PM and NS says that he didn't. One of them is lying. If Jack is scum he probably didn't realize that the town knew that the scum knew who the evil god is, so he figured he could make this insane gambit and have everything NS says discredited. If NS is scum and Jack is telling the truth, why on earth would NS have told Jack that? If NS was scum he would know that Jack wasn't so he would never confess. NS's story makes some sense and Jack's makes none. Jack is the only one of them with motive to do that.

[Jack]

NS also told me that you were one of his scumbuddies tmh. Are you? Because when I flip town, that means that ns is obv the scum god, and then either you or him is lying.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

NS also told me that you were one of his scumbuddies tmh. Are you? Because when I flip town, that means that ns is obv the scum god, and then either you or him is lying.

Wait what?

What's with this retro-active modification of your story?

[themanhimself]

Oh my god, now I

know

that Jack is lying. This is such a clear OMGUS accusation. And why the hell would the scum god tell you his scumbuddies so you can go lynch them? I'm worried Jack is a jester, but I've played with Jackscum before and he was absolutely terrible, so maybe it's just that again.

[Benmage]

Hey team. I'll be checking in here eventually...little behind on the site...been doing some reading on my phone. I imagine I'll be voting Jack when I do read.

[DrippingGoofball]

scum:

Jack
brokenscraps
Feysal
Benmage

[zoraster]

Day 1 Vote Count

Andrius ( 1 ) Jack,
Brokenscraps ( 0 )
hitogoroshi ( 0 )
me=weird ( 4 ) SpyreX,

Fishythefish,

Zang, farside22,
SpyreX ( 0 )
Equinox ( 0 )
farside22 ( 1 ) Mina,
Feysal ( 0 )
Mina ( 0 )
themanhimself ( 0 )
Benmage ( 0 )
DeathRowKitty ( 0 )
Jack ( 5 ) Equinox, Lady Lambdadelta, hitogoroshi, Andrius, themanhimself,
Lady Lambdadelta ( 0 )
Zang ( 0 )
Not Voting ( 7 ) Brokenscraps, me=weird, Feysal, Benmage, DeathRowKitty,

DrippingGoofball,

Nobody Special,

Total Votes ( 18 )

Deadline: February 14th at 23:00 EDT
With 18 able to vote, 10 needed to lynch.

[Feysal]

Hello all. Some of you know me, the rest are about to get to know me. I was too busy yesterday to participate in the pregame, but after reading it I don't feel like I missed much by not being there. The important part of Jack making a sensational claim I certainly did not miss.

@Mina: Yes, LL really is scummy. Don't remember why.

If you can't even remember why, then it can't have been enough to justify a scumread.

fos:farside

vote:LL

Is still scum however.

Oh, andrius's ISO is filled with obvscumness.

unvote, vote:andrius

To loosely quote someone from another game... "What I personally enjoy about these reads is the strength of the arguments. It really assists me in evaluating Jack's motivations."

Ok guys, why would knowing who the scumgod is NOT be worth it?!?

You know I'm town thus you are scum.

It was SpyreX who said you would flip town. Andrius simply followed up on that. Are you even paying attention?

THANK YOU

ONE PERSON IS NOT BRAIN DEAD

Which probably means you're the scum god

Did I get this right? You said that Nobody Special claimed scum to you, and you are accusing DrippingGoofball of being scum?

You talk to the scum god and her scum minion like they are town, I'm not surprised you don't understand

"Her?" I got it right all right. You are accusing DrippingGoofball and her priest Andrius of being scum, in blatant contradiction to your claim.

Amazing isn't it, anyway I really think you ought to be lynching NS tmh.

Er, Nobody Special is a god. He is immortal.

So. I've been told Jack is a smart player, and that he has a reputation for town gambits. I really have no clue what he thinks he's doing here though, he looks like he's completely lost his marbles. The scum motivation of him acting like this eludes me, but he makes no sense as town either.

If you're town, Jack, you need to stop this, whatever the hell it is. And if you're scum, do continue, having you self-destruct makes the town job much easier.

PS. Hold your horses there DGB with your lurker scumreads, I'm posting. I can't be present simultaneously in all my games you know.

[DrippingGoofball]

K, Feysal is town.

[DrippingGoofball]

Zang is scum.

[Equinox]

What the fuck is this shit.

Unvote, Vote: themanhimself

I'll go back and reread this whole Jack-NS situation thing again in a few minutes when I'm done munching, but my thought right now is that Jack-NS was a bunch of hot air that you lot took a lit match to, so now we're sitting in an exploding airship.

While I'm in favor of finding the scum god (as long as we're not blowing time on it), a Jack vs. Nobody Special lynch dichotomy is not the way to do this, and so I strongly disagree with lynching Jack to "learn" about Nobody Special.

[themanhimself]

I strongly disagree with lynching Jack to "learn" about Nobody Special.

Don't get me wrong, I want to lynch Jack because he's obviously lying and obviously scum and for no other reason. It's a bonus that even on the off-chance we're wrong, we still get to know which god is scum.

[Benmage]

Is it just me or is DGBs skill decreasing?

[DrippingGoofball]

Is it just me or is DGBs skill decreasing?

If anything, my power of making lurkers ooze out of the woodwork seems to be increasing exponentially.

[Equinox]

All right, reread Jack and Nobody Special. I'll tackle the rest of you later this evening.

The situation as I understand it:

1. Nobody Special sends out PMs requesting ability claims. (Source: Lady Lambdadelta's 19, Jack's 36, Nobody Special's 37, DeathRowKitty's 40)
2. Jack claims to be scum in a return PM, and Nobody Special responds in kind. (Source: Jack's 7)
3. Nobody Special refutes Jack's claim; Nobody Special states he received a two-word response from Jack and did not respond with a scum claim. Apparently, the communication had ceased with Jack's response PM. (Source: Nobody Special's 108)
4. Jack claims that it was a three-word response, not a two-word response, and asserts that Nobody Special is still lying. (Source: Jack's 127)
5. Jack claims that Nobody Special included the name of the scum followers in his response to Jack. (Source: Jack's 152)

Conclusion: Nobody Special appears to be telling the truth. However, there is no scum motivation behind Jack's dishonesty; I believe all this was a gambit, and so far it's worked quite well.

I will not lynch Jack. I like my vote on themanhimself.

---

What's with this retro-active modification of your story?

What makes you think that?

It's a bonus that even on the off-chance we're wrong, we still get to know which god is scum.

How would Jack's flip reveal the scum god? I don't see enough interactions to draw that strong of an associative tell.

[Equinox]

If Jack continues to deny lying, and sticks to his story about NS claiming scum, I want him lynched. Worst case scenario, he turns up town, and we know which of the 3 gods is scum.

Oh, hey, I'll ask you the same question I asked themanhimself.

Pretty much the only thing we can do today is lynch Jack

. I don't see anyway to move forward without resolving this glaring inconsistency and since we can't lynch NS we pretty much have to lynch Jack. Besides that, the way I'm seeing the situation, it's a lot more likely that Jack is the one lying, I can see motivation and a means for that at least where I can't with NS.

No.

FoS: TMH

I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this. You seem to be of the same thought that Jack is a lying bastard and we all will learn which god is which once Jack dies, and yet you FoS themanhimself for expressing a similar sentiment. Why?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

If Jack continues to deny lying, and sticks to his story about NS claiming scum, I want him lynched. Worst case scenario, he turns up town, and we know which of the 3 gods is scum.

Oh, hey, I'll ask you the same question I asked themanhimself.

Pretty much the only thing we can do today is lynch Jack

. I don't see anyway to move forward without resolving this glaring inconsistency and since we can't lynch NS we pretty much have to lynch Jack. Besides that, the way I'm seeing the situation, it's a lot more likely that Jack is the one lying, I can see motivation and a means for that at least where I can't with NS.

No.

FoS: TMH

I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this. You seem to be of the same thought that Jack is a lying bastard and we all will learn which god is which once Jack dies, and yet you FoS themanhimself for expressing a similar sentiment. Why?

1) Specify the question. I'm having a hard time finding it @_@

2) I wasn't FoSing him for sharing the sentiment about Jack. I was FoSing him for his closed minded thinking. He was trying to limit our options today to ONLY Jack, and while I certainly endorse a Jack lynch ATM, there is always room for other leads to come up. That is what I disliked with the post (as you may see, I bolded the part I didn't like)

[Lady Lambdadelta]

EBWOP: Equinox, Jack added a statement about "NS claiming TMH as Scum aswell" retroactively to his original claim.

I'll find the post if you'd like?

[Equinox]

The question:

It's a bonus that even on the off-chance we're wrong, we still get to know which god is scum.

How would Jack's flip reveal the scum god? I don't see enough interactions to draw that strong of an associative tell.

---

2) I wasn't FoSing him for sharing the sentiment about Jack. I was FoSing him for his closed minded thinking. He was trying to limit our options today to ONLY Jack, and while I certainly endorse a Jack lynch ATM, there is always room for other leads to come up. That is what I disliked with the post (as you may see, I bolded the part I didn't like)

Okay, fair enough.

Preview edit:

EBWOP: Equinox, Jack added a statement about "NS claiming TMH as Scum aswell" retroactively to his original claim.

I'll find the post if you'd like?

I saw it. I don't see a problem with it.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

NS also told me that you were one of his scumbuddies tmh.

Are you? Because when I flip town, that means that ns is obv the scum god, and then either you or him is lying.

This is retro active, and in response to pressure from TMH.

P-Edit: In response to the earlier question, the main association is that

one of them must be lying.

I personally see very little town benefit from either if them lying. Hence, it is my belief that the liar is scum. You may not share this belief, (the idea of a gambit) but that is where we shall agree to disagree.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

EBWOP: The problem with the retro active change is that it detracts from the validity of the story. If I claim something, and then when it becomes convenient, I am allowed to change that claim, it should raise questions about how valid the claim truly is.

[Equinox]

P-Edit: In response to the earlier question, the main association is that

one of them must be lying.

I personally see very little town benefit from either if them lying. Hence, it is my belief that the liar is scum. You may not share this belief, (the idea of a gambit) but that is where we shall agree to disagree.

Well, yeah. Jack's the liar; that much is pretty obvious. What I don't get is how that tells Nobody Special's alignment (or DrippingGoofball's or Fishythefish's), and since you mentioned that we could pick out the scum god from our 3 gods by looking at Jack, I was confused.

EBWOP: The problem with the retro active change is that it detracts from the validity of the story. If I claim something, and then when it becomes convenient, I am allowed to change that claim, it should raise questions about how valid the claim truly is.

Your line of thinking here in general is correct, but I don't think it applies here. I'm going to agree to disagree with you about Jack for the moment, since I'm now more interested in hearing from themanhimself.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

EBWOP: The problem with the retro active change is that it detracts from the validity of the story. If I claim something, and then when it becomes convenient, I am allowed to change that claim, it should raise questions about how valid the claim truly is.

Your line of thinking here in general is correct, but

I don't think it applies here.

I'm going to agree to disagree with you about Jack for the moment, since I'm now more interested in hearing from themanhimself.

Then it's my turn to ask you something.

Can you explain to my why you do not think it applies?

[themanhimself]

So equinox, your whole case is that Jack's play is gambit for the town? What's the purpose of it? You said it worked so what did it do? If he is town then accusing a random player of being scummy and pushing it for seven pages all the while acting like he's lying is incredibly anti-town. If he's town then all we've gained is seven pages of speculation over a false dilemma. I'm going to have to agree to disagree with you here as well, the liar in this situation is going to be scum.