Open 150 - Crossfire - Game mod abandoned

[Zachrulez]

I'm basing this completely on my profile setup. (Which is aligned with central time.)

GMT - 5 = Central Time Zone.

Vote : Zazier

[Zachrulez]

Vote: kmd4390

How dare you stand at the forefront of a Zaz wagon..

FoS dvdkid13

Motherphucker!

What's this all about?

[Zachrulez]

Vote: kmd4390

How dare you stand at the forefront of a Zaz wagon..

FoS dvdkid13

Motherphucker!

ITT We learn that there are different ways how players show their love
Both Zach and Kevin show it by voting, while Kise acts like the prince on the white horse (do you say it like this in English It's probably Prince charming...)

I think the proper term is a knight in shining armor.

[Zachrulez]

So, if your FOS is serious, does that mean your vote is too?

[Zachrulez]

Gut feelings, Huntress? you are saying that out of 12 people, your gut feelings are telling he is scum? Well, gut feelings are indeed valid in a ly-lo situation, but in early game they won't help much, eh? We've got to get reasons to vote on someone at this stage.

Unvote, Vote: Huntress

I entirely agree with Fern's opinion on this. However, I don't believe Huntress's actions have been scummy enough at this point to award him a vote.
But I would like to point out lurkers: Scott Brosius and Darkstrike_11.
Anyone have any thoughts on lurker treatment?

Mod, please prod Scott Brosius and Darkstrike_11

(Done.)

With this type of lurking, I'm more of a fan of letting the mod go through the prodding process, and then simply allowing these kind of players to be replaced in order to hopefully get us a more active player in their slots.

[Zachrulez]

o hai

Just like to say, I'm not inactive and I was actually lurking in the true sense of the word. I've been watching the game, but not participating because I haven't really seen anything scummy yet, and I dislike the random vote stage immensely. I am an active sort of player (at least I will be once my exams are over ) and so please don't prod me!

Now we are starting to get out of random votes and into discussion, my activity will rise.

Until then, why don't we try question time!

what are everyone's favourite alignments? I should think I would prefer a mafia role, as it would be fun to manipulate the unknowing townies.

Did anyone else get excited at being told that they were a policeman as their role before finding out that its actually a vanilla town role?

and finally, has anyone played in a game with more than one mafia group, and if so are there any different scum tells?

This is active lurking. Inactivity based lurking is one thing, active lurking is another.

Disliking RVS is one thing, but why wait till you're called out on not posting to... well start posting?!

Unvote, Vote: Darkstrike

Here is an example of a game with two scumgroups.

Just for everyone that's curious about what to expect. I would say it's likely this game will turn out a bit differently than that one because unlike that game, we are aware of the fact that there are two scum teams from the start of the game.

[Zachrulez]

My eyebrow raises at dvdkid's concern of a Fernando lynch happening while he has a mere 2 votes.

[Zachrulez]

My eyebrow raises at dvdkid's concern of a Fernando lynch happening while he has a mere 2 votes.

I'm not only concerned with a fern lynch. i'm concerned of a lynch too early which may result in a mislynch

I heard you the first time.

There's a way you can reduce the threat of this mislynching you are worried about though. It's called scumhunting, and you can start by telling us who you think is scummy.

[Zachrulez]

Mod please prod Zazier, her last post was on the 9th.

I'm happy with my vote on Darkstrike. He's said he would be more active, but all I see is more inactivity thus far. I particularly don't like this in the face of him saying that he was following along with the game when he was called out on this the first time.

[Zachrulez]

Both have exhibited strange/scummy behavior. If I think Laz is more scummy than Fern, then let me think. In fact, if you're trying to get me to go against my own personal decision and vote for someone (Fern) I have not FoS'd, then

you are

starting to reek of George Bush-scumminess.

Because they're suspicious.

Unvote; Vote: Fernando

I wasn't lying. Thanks for the payment!

*Eyebrow.*

Not liking this. So you find it scummy for people to try to persuade you to vote for who they think is scummy, yet you change your vote under the pressure?

[Zachrulez]

So he says Lazarus is not scummy and then votes him?

Yeah...

Unvote Vote: Kise

[Zachrulez]

Hey Ash! Where you been?

What do you think about everyone else in the game?

[Zachrulez]

Ad for the random vote stage, yeah its there (

shock

, thanks for pointing it out) and so you say that to move it on I should post something. Seeing as the RVS is only usually moved out of when someone posts something scummy, you would assume that the best play in the RVS is to make a scummy post. Nice. Also I had a go at asking some questions to see if I could have a go at scumhunting, but everyone then made fun of them and all started voting for me. Whenever I post people suspect me, regardless of what I say. And people wonder why I don’t post that often.

I take this as "I'd post more but I don't want to look scummy."

As for hoping for a scum role being a scumtell, would “damn I was hoping for a town role but unfortunately im a member of x group” be less of one?

That whole statement is scummy.

[Zachrulez]

;]As for hoping for a scum role being a scumtell, would “damn I was hoping for a town role but unfortunately im a member of x group” be less of one?

That whole statement is scummy.

Again, a statement with no backing up. I don’t mind it, but it means I can’t refute your claim. What do you find scummy about it? I can tell you that I meant it in a genuine attempt to respond to the attack made that hoping for a scum role is a scumtell. Please try and do more than just paint me as scum then leave.

You're trying to justify an earlier statement by putting a worse one out there to compare to, in order to make your original statement not sound as bad.

Premise here is that you didn't say the worse sounding thing, so what you actually said isn't as bad.

Not a big fan of that kind of defense.

Anyway, you don't seem to be actively lurking anymore, so that's good.

[Zachrulez]

Zach:
-Started by asking a few questions, but didn't take any hard stances.

So?

-Took the easy Darkstrike vote and blew it up as his first real stance

Well for one you seem to think darkstrike is scum. Also maybe you wanna qualify what an easy vote is, cause in my mind voting someone is as simple as bolding the words vote: so and so.

-Most of his attacks are small jabs

So?

-Put Kise at L-2 for weak reasons without even mentioning him previously

Lies. I didn't put Kise at lynch -2, and I have mentioned him previously. As for the strength of my reasoning for voting for him, that's your opinion.

-More concerned with lurker hunting than scum hunting

What's your stance on lurking? I see half the people in this game not really bothering to post or participate in this game, and it's actually making it quite difficult for me to get into this game myself. I suppose I should check who is due for a prod.

Note:

If you're using your 2nd point to argue that I'm scummy you can't use the 1st, because by definition, you're using a hard stance taken by me to make a case, and it outright invalidates your first point.

More later.

[Zachrulez]

Vote Zachrulez

. Case was posted yesterday.

Modified the quote for easier access to your "case."

Dunno why you couldn't have provided that to make it easier for everyone to see...

Anyway, more later.

[Zachrulez]

Vote Zachrulez

. Case was posted yesterday.

Modified the quote for easier access to your "case."

Dunno why you couldn't have provided that to make it easier for everyone to see...

Anyway, more later.

Does it matter? It's not hard to find.

What probably matters more is that once again the 4th point in your case was and is a lie.

On the Darkstrike case:

1. Is a non point

2. The active lurking concerns me the most.

3. OMGUS being a scumtell? It's certainly not an example of good play.

4. Is WIFOM.

[Zachrulez]

So who's standing out to you right now Darkstrike?

[Zachrulez]

This game is moving at a crawl's pace.

Vote: Darkstrike

Reasons:

- Active lurking
- OMGUS attacks (Which we've now seen a pattern of in the way he responded to Lazarus.)
- Failure to scumhunt (See post 261 posted two days ago.)
- Every post he's made has been a response to attacks. Even his first post was a response and assertion that he was not lurking in the face of being accused as such. (A subpoint of failure to scumhunt)

I will be perfectly happy with Darkstrike being the lynch today if he continues failing to address these four points.

[Zachrulez]

Zach, I find it interesting that you don't point out the night kills, isn't that the central point of the case?

No, it's not. The night kill point is WIFOM as I already pointed out.

Anyone could have killed VP or Ash, for any reason. Speculating on it or using that specific point against Darkstrike is not scumhunting, it's just being silly.

[Zachrulez]

Wow, I just looked across the street and could see tumbleweeds making their way through town.

[Zachrulez]

Isn't it at least part of the case?

What's stopping you from giving your thoughts on the case?

Your posts since the start of day 2.

I like the looks of the Darkstrike_11 case but we have to remember that the scum are possibly smart and without knowing it, both teams intended to make him look worse.

What about the case do you like?

Zach, I find it interesting that you don't point out the night kills, isn't that the central point of the case?

Do YOU think it's a central part of the case? You've been pretty vague about your thoughts on the case so far.

Isn't it at least part of the case?

See above.

[Zachrulez]

Are you really so sure it has to be one of those 2 possibilities?

[Zachrulez]

Are you kidding? She hasn't posted in two weeks.

[Zachrulez]

And what of Fernando and Dvdkid?

What makes Zazier so much different than those two?

[Zachrulez]

At this point, I'd be happy to see a post from Darkstrike that isn't simply a response to a case against him. (Maybe mentioning his name will make him magically appear.)

[Zachrulez]

This game is a poster child for lurking.

[Zachrulez]

Well, the last 20 posts have just been useless fluff.

Where's the GD?

[Zachrulez]

Hey Darkstrike.

This game is moving at a crawl's pace.

Vote: Darkstrike

Reasons:

- Active lurking
- OMGUS attacks (Which we've now seen a pattern of in the way he responded to Lazarus.)
- Failure to scumhunt (See post 261 posted two days ago.)
- Every post he's made has been a response to attacks. Even his first post was a response and assertion that he was not lurking in the face of being accused as such. (A subpoint of failure to scumhunt)

I will be perfectly happy with Darkstrike being the lynch today if he continues failing to address these four points.

Some scumhunting from you could really go a long way toward getting this game going.

Hell some scumhunting from anyone that's inactive could really go far in putting an end to the standstill that this game has reached.

Some simple questions for people who haven't posted in a while.

Do you agree that Darkstrike is suspicious? If so, what actions from him stand out the most to you?

Do you find someone else suspicious? If so, who? And why?

[Zachrulez]

Hai guyz

Just what this game needed! K7!

Do i know you?

Well we've been in 3-4 games together. You lurked through them all though. Off the top of my head, Mini 628, Past Ages, and Mafia 91.

I apologize kind sir, i will do my best to stay active in this game to apease you.

You can get started by responding to 315.

[Zachrulez]

Just saying now that I'm ready to post again and will do so asap.

But you aren't even on AIM, so I don't know when "asap" is...

One of these days. I have to catch up with some other games as well.
And I had music lesson yesterday. Didn''t Erica tell you?

Nope, haven't talked to her much. But some new opinions might be exactly what this game needs. Well, that and some Zach votes.

Yeah, and I see you... lurking, with no effort to expand on your case against me, taking a convenient hedging position with token suspicion on Darkstrike.

Perhaps you want to explain why you find my scummier than darkstrike? Or not? Cause you've had plenty of time to do so and haven't even bothered.

[Zachrulez]

And again, let me stress that the only things you've really done on day 2 are vote me pointing back to your day 1 case as your sole basis, saying darkstrike is scummy with no further expansion on why, resist specifically a Zazier replacement, (A lurker who has yet to post ANY content.) and complained about Killa seven replacing into the game.

[Zachrulez]

There are two other games I've played with Zazier in.

Newbie 707, and Newbie 749. She lurked, and was replaced in both games.

Her lurking here is very comparable to the lurking she did in newbie 749.

But the point I'm getting at here is that the more I think about it, the more KMD bothers me.

I'm trying to connect why he would have so much contempt for Killa Seven, who is apparently a notorious lurker, and none for Zazier, hell even going as far as to openly state in game that she doesn't need to be replaced after lurking for 2 weeks.

A few theories pop into mind about why KMD is behaving this way, all of which involve him being scum.

So why is it that you're putting so much effort into preventing lurker Zazier from being replaced while lurking yourself? Why is it that you have such a problem with Killa Seven, given that you seem to be just fine with Zazier being allowed to remain in the game despite not actually playing it?

Unvote: Vote: KMD

[Zachrulez]

Such a difference has yet to be established in this game.

Zazier has done nothing but active lurk since RVS.

[Zachrulez]

How well you know Zazier is irrelevant.

At the point you openly stated that she didn't need to be replaced, she had not posted content for

2 weeks.

As of this writing, all she has posted is that she will read the game and get a content post up soon, more than once.

As of this writing, she has failed to post any game relevant content.

In this situation, I wouldn't give a damn even if it was my own wife playing in the game. (Who incidentally is a player on this site.) I would be voting to lynch her, or demanding she be replaced.

Your resistance to her being replaced doesn't really make any sense from an in game standpoint.

[Zachrulez]

How well you know Zazier is irrelevant.

No, it really isn't. It's why I wanted Zazie to stay in the game.

In this situation, I wouldn't give a damn even if it was my own wife playing in the game. (Who incidentally is a player on this site.) I would be voting to lynch her, or demanding she be replaced.

Well that's a difference between the two of us then. [offtopic]Who is your wife?[/offtopic]

Your resistance to her being replaced doesn't really make any sense from an in game standpoint.

I don't expect it to. Only from a personal standpoint.

I knew that would be your defense, but I don't necessarily have to buy it.

Offtopic: My wife is Sotty7. (We don't play together in any of the mafiascum games due to possible conflicts of interest.)

[Zachrulez]

If you don't buy it, see EVERY SINGLE GAME I have ever played with Zazie. Someone accuses us of being scum because they sense a connection. We explain that it is a person connection, not a game-related one. We (usually) flip opposite alignments. We actually have been scum together twice, but usually one of us is scum and the other is town. Regardless of that though, the connection you are seeing is not game-related at all.

And I've seen Scotty's name around. I don't think I've actually played with her though. I think she replaced into a game after I died or something.

Nowhere did I say you both had to be scum on the same team, scum on seperate teams, or one town, and one scum. What I'm saying is that I find the way you are reacting to her lurking interesting.

And it's SOTTY7 by the way. No c in the name whatsoever.

[Zachrulez]

Consequently though, you and me may be the only 2 people left who actually care about this game... *sigh*

How ironic that we also happen to be going at it.

[Zachrulez]

I don't mind friends playing together in a mafia game. (Absent when you stick up for said friend who is clearly active lurking.)

The issue with playing with my wife is the fact that we live in the same house, and it kinda makes things complicated at times if one of us happens to have a night action and the other doesn't.

[Zachrulez]

Do we still even have a mod for this game?

[Zachrulez]

Wow, I just glanced at the top of the page and saw that KMD changed his vote.

In response to Huntress, the theory I most believe in regarding KMD is that he's content with Zazier's contributions to the game and is using his real life friendship with her as a crutch to have a decent excuse to keep an active lurker in the game.

Regardless of his excuses, there's absolutely NO pro-town motivation for this kind of play except to continue to contribute to the current game state (and then blame others for it after lurking himself.)

At this point, I'd like to see a lynch of either KMD or Zazier (Them being scum together is another one of my theories, though I'm less sure about that) with Darkstrike being the 3rd choice.

[Zachrulez]

Wow, I just glanced at the top of the page and saw that KMD changed his vote.

What is your opinion of that?

Also, I'm saying I'd like Zazie to stay in the game. I haven't said Zazie is town. I just think there's content coming in the near future.

It's weak.

Weaker then you claim my vote on Kise was. (Which is wasn't, consequently, your bandwagon vote on Kise was pretty damn weak too.)

[Zachrulez]

Kise was scummy as hell. I voted as such.

What do you think specifically of my weak vote on Darkstrike? What do you think my motivation for it is?

To see how people react to you blindly bandwagoning?

[Zachrulez]

Ok, maybe we'll actually get some discussion going now.

[Zachrulez]

You remember Grim Mafia Has?

I do...

The tone of your attacks on me are actually quite similar to that game...

[Zachrulez]

Oh, here are some more observations on KMD.

You see Kmd, picking at little things can sometimes unravel the whole package.

Unvote, Vote:Fernando

Guess I had it right the first time. There are valid reasons to be voting Huntress right now, but yours are certainly not it. Nice attempt to join a wagon, though.

You're right. Fernando is scummier. So is dvd.

Unvote, Vote Fernando

Follows VP's vote on Fernando, that's about as far as he goes with explanation here.

I completely missed that where kise said Laz isn't scummy and then votes him in his next post. Obv scum who can't keep his story straight because he's FoS'ed almost everyone in the game.

this guy needs to die quick

Unvote, Vote: Kise

Unvote, Vote Kise

Let's do this.

(There's something familiar about Furry for some reason. Not sure why...)

Follows VP's vote on Darkstrike, absolutely no reasoning given except for "Let's do this."

It's quite interesting the big deal KMD makes about my Kise vote while little has really been mentioned about his.

In fact with my recollection of events, his reaction to VP as a whole was actually quite interesting. Seems like all his actions and reactions to him on day 1 were suited specifically to satisfy him.

[Zachrulez]

Battousai:

battousai, post 381: Could you please elaborate on why they are scummy on this wagon? It's all well and good saying "they reacted scummish" but you can't leave it at that.

Sorry, missed it.

I already said why Furry and KMD are scum, now on to Zach.

Zach misrep what Kise said. "So he says Lazarus is not scummy and then votes him?

Yeah... " Is not the same as "Laz isn't really scummy." And he neglected the fact that Kise had a FOS on Laz before the vote. Kise obvioiusly found Laz scummy, but he wasn't really (as in a measurement) scummy.

Eh, that was the way I interpreted his position.

In the end it's the difference between voting someone you don't find scummy at all, and voting for someone you don't find "really scummy."

I guess I really don't see much of a distinction between the two positions at all. Kise was wishy washy at best there.

[Zachrulez]

Which is quite interesting because he calls my suspicion of Darkstrike scummy, yet weakly suspects him by calling him scummy. (With no reasoning to back it up.)

[Zachrulez]

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by the "easiest thing there."

Just because you don't think his active lurking was scummy doesn't mean I have to think the same way you do.

[Zachrulez]

Maybe he has an alt you don't know about.

[Zachrulez]

Which kinda takes me off topic here, but I think in that which scummer has the most posts thread you claimed a while back that you had played with me prior to this game, but I don't ever remember playing you before this game.

Something I've actually wanted to say for a while.

[Zachrulez]

Why not? You were supposed to post content yesterday, remember?

[Zachrulez]

If you hadn't noticed Haylen, this game isn't exactly bursting out with activity.

So I will push at anything I can to get any kind of game content rolling here.

[Zachrulez]

I'm sorry, are we actually arguing about alts now?

Batt claimed that I'm scum because he's never been wrong about a read on me. The only way he has played with me before is if it was as an alt. If he doesn't have an alt, he is claiming to be able to read me really well and has never played a game with me.

Interestingly he has not addressed this issue.

[Zachrulez]

Ah. Since you have both played your share of games, I didn't realize it was a joke.

[Zachrulez]

Ok, you dont need to summerise the current cases, just link me to the post number.

I don't like this at all. This seems to indicate an unwillingness to actually go through and read this game.

As I recall, Lazarusmoth never really added much to the game either, and actually did a pretty good job of staying under the radar for the most part.

[Zachrulez]

Can we get a vote count.

The deadline's in less than 5 hours...

[Zachrulez]

Well the deadline has passed.

We are waiting for the mod I believe.

[Zachrulez]

I can't seem to get into this game.

I've been pretty much going through the motions and have stayed in out of an obligation not to add to the replacement problem this game has.

[Zachrulez]

I'd love to see this game continue and the activity level turn around.

But the cynic in me says this game is going to die a slow painful death.

[Zachrulez]

You can take that as a yes vote BTW.

[Zachrulez]

I was a sorcerer, better known as Mafia B

My scum partner was Lazarusmoth, and later Haylen.

Must confess that I don't really have a good idea who was on the other scumteam. I thought for sure Kise, and KMD would flip mafia A.

We killed VP Baltar on night one. (Sorry about that VP.)

Didn't realize that it would put the game on life support at the time as well.

[Zachrulez]

Damn, who was Scum A?

[Zachrulez]

Oh lame, I wanted to lynch Zazier for active lurking too...

I blame KMD