Mini 733- Congratulations! You are... Mafia (Game Over)

[Kmd4390]

Ek, what is the whole alpaca thing? That's not the first time I've seen it on MS.

Vote ZazieR

not as a bandwagon but because I like jokevoting her.

I'm gonna be a little less random with this line and ask if anyone knows what's up with the lawn gnome thing.

[Kmd4390]

Vote ZazieR

not as a bandwagon but because I like jokevoting her.

don't like this

I vote her in any game we play together.

Votecount

Zazie - 2609 - [Plum, caf, kmd]
Coheed - 57 - [imaginality, sly]
Plum - 4.5 - [dahill]
Glork - 4.49999999 - [elvis]
Caf - 4.4999999999999999 - [Isacc]
Sly - 4.4999999999999999999 - [Coheed]

Not Voting - -7 - [Zazie, Glork, Darox]

Wondering if these numbers mean something.

Vood joo loik som vodka?

I'll take some.

votecuntquote

Awesome typo.

Anyway, something is up with the vote counts whether it means anything or not. To be safe,

Unvote

[Kmd4390]

Lügen! Sie haben mich nie vorher gewählt, KMD! (denke ich…)

Vote KMD

<3 dich

(Ich bin so slecht auf Deutsch )

Gibt es keine Lügen gibt. Ich war gespannt auf Abstimmung, bevor Sie das Spiel einmal begonnen.

(Du bist besser Deutsch als ich.)

[Kmd4390]

Lügen! Sie haben mich nie vorher gewählt, KMD! (denke ich…)

Vote KMD

<3 dich

(Ich bin so slecht auf Deutsch )

Gibt es keine Lügen gibt. Ich war gespannt auf Abstimmung, bevor Sie das Spiel einmal begonnen.

(Du bist besser Deutsch als ich.)

Я не понимаю .

[Kmd4390]

Чтобы эту должность в соответствии с этим.

К сожалению, я посасывать русском языке.

[Kmd4390]

Или один раз в четыре года, если Ваш день рождения 29 февраля. У меня есть друг, который родился в день скачок. Если мы не будет размещение мафии, связанные вещи, хотя?

Votecount

Zazie - 2609 - [Plum, caf]
Plum - 4.5 - [dahill]
Glork - 4.49999999 - [elvis]
Caf - 98.5000000000000000000000000001 - [Isacc]
Sly - 4.4999999999999999999 - [Coheed]
Isacc - 67 - [imaginality]
Elvis - 9 - [Sly]
Kmd - 450 - [Zazie]
MeMe - 0.7 - [Glork]
Ross Perot - 2.9 - [Glork]

Not Voting - -9 - [Darox, Kmd]

Btw, Cyrillic is evil.

[Kmd4390]

Shouldn't we be playing a mafia game here?

Let me bring us back to my question. This IS game related. What does anyone know about lawn gnomes?

[Kmd4390]

Screw it, I'll wait.

I'll be back when the game "starts".

[Kmd4390]

i kid i kid
i have no knowledge of lawn gnomes besides them being aliens

Ok, thanks for the answer. This will help the town. You'll find out why eventually.

[Kmd4390]

I think the more important question is

Who would win in a fight, a Lawn Gnome or a Porcelain Doll?

If I answer your question, will you answer mine?

[Kmd4390]

Ok, so dahill and Plum know nothing about lawn gnomes.

dahill, I can't elaborate on this. Sorry.

[Kmd4390]

Darox, do you have any information about lawn gnomes?

[Kmd4390]

Darox, do you have any information about lawn gnomes?

I can't talk to heathens like you who think Superman is better than Aquaman.

Did I say that?

[Kmd4390]

You sure haven't said that Aquaman is better than Superman, heathen.

I bet you don't even know who would win if Bruce Campbell and Michael Caine fought.

Answer my question and I'll answer every question you have poste.

[Kmd4390]

Two questions, both serious (srsbsns):

Darox, why are you avoiding Kmd's question?

Caf, what happens if I decide I want to buy lemonade from you?

I'm interested in both of these as well.

[Kmd4390]

Hulk, Green Lantern, Aquaman, Wolverine.

Will you answer my question now?

[Kmd4390]

Thank you both.

Still awaiting answers from:
CoheedCambria09
elvis_knits
imaginality
Isacc
SlySly
ZazieR

[Kmd4390]

I recently played a game offsite where a player asked everyone to type a bolded "install ice rink" claiming that it was the only way for his role to work. At night, he could kill or role block anyone who had installed. He said if everyone did it, he could act as a normal power role. He was actually telling the truth. I'm curious if we are dealing with something similar as far as the lemonade.

(FTR, I didn't install in that game. Saw no reason to allow myself to be blocked/killed. I was a town vig.)

[Kmd4390]

I'm with Glork on the lemondade.

I know there are lawn gnomes, and anyone who knows anything about them, it's in your best interest to say so.

Waiting on:
CoheedCambria09
elvis_knits
Isacc
SlySly
ZazieR

[Kmd4390]

Waiting on:
Isacc
SlySly
ZazieR

And Coheed, I don't think there is anything important in the other languages. I know I said nothing important.

[Kmd4390]

Waiting on me? I answered.

My bad.

Waiting on:
SlySly
ZazieR

[Kmd4390]

Ok, so Zazie is the only one who hasn't said anything about gnomes. I guess people don't know the information I need unless it's her. That makes things harder unless Zazie has answers.

And yeah, there's no content in a language other than english.

Now, we didn't have much of a joke phase. It was more lemonade, gnomes, aliens, superheros etc.

The only thing we can really go off of is reactions to that, and I see that Plum wanted answers and Darox didn't answer, but it looks like that was because he couldn't until we answered his questions first. Basically, I don't really see anyone as scummy except maybe Sly for rushing into the lemonade purchase. And even that is probably more overeager town play than scummy because I'd probably be even more afraid of it as scum than as town. Unless Caf is scum with Sly in which case he'd be more likely to trust him.

So basically all I have is that Plum looks town and Sly only looks like scum if Caf is.

[Kmd4390]

Ok, so no one knows about the lawn gnomes. Guess I have to figure it out on my own then. Some people have them on their front lawns and I have to find out who. Maybe it's people with post restrictions and taking their gnome removes their restriction? I don't know. I'll probably check Zazie tonight to test that because hers is the worst one.

Also, let's try not to let these things distract us from scumhunting.

Vote Coheed

What do you have to add to the game at this point?

[Kmd4390]

Ok, so no one knows about the lawn gnomes. Guess I have to figure it out on my own then. Some people have them on their front lawns and I have to find out who. Maybe it's people with post restrictions and taking their gnome removes their restriction? I don't know. I'll probably check Zazie tonight to test that because hers is the worst one.

Also, let's try not to let these things distract us from scumhunting.

Vote Coheed

What do you have to add to the game at this point?

And I just posted this without reading anything on page 7.

I'll do that now.

[Kmd4390]

Ok, I caught up.

Current thoughts:
Kittens mean nothing. Vote counts being screwed up means nothing. Lemonade probably activates a role for Caf. Still thinking the same about gnomes.

[Kmd4390]

So that's who Ross Perot is. Ok. I'd be careful of voting non-players though. I once played in a game where the Mod was random lynched on Day 1. The game actually went to night, so it was basically a no lynch.

[Kmd4390]

Bad habit of mine. Especially when I come in to games knowing they are bastard games. Or when I play a Farside-modded game.

[Kmd4390]

Paranoid is better than careless though.

[Kmd4390]

Yeah, I agree there.

Like in the random phase, when people call a 3rd vote on a bandwagon scummy in a mini, that's not even close to a lynch, but it always seems to make people vote over it.

[Kmd4390]

No. It was a normal jokevote. I always vote her.

[Kmd4390]

I could care less if I get voted in the random phase to start things off.

[Kmd4390]

I don't know. Just did.

Two people voted her right away, so that was the popular wagon. Not saying it's scummy to bandwagon, just that it wasn't my reason for voting her.

[Kmd4390]

No reason really.

I was going to vote her anyway and then saw a couple votes already on her. I wasn't going to not vote her just because of 2 votes though, so I said what I said. There really isn't any other motive to it or anything.

[Kmd4390]

I could care less if I get voted in the random phase to start things off.

[Kmd4390]

Sly, thanks for the info, but it doesn't exactly help.

Caf, if I don't jokevote her, it's because one of us is replacing into the game and the jokevote stage is over. Other than that, she's probably my top choice on MS for a jokevote.

[Kmd4390]

It wasn't supposed to be any kind of explanation at all. It was just a statement attached to a jokevote.

Why would I care about being voted on Page 1?

[Kmd4390]

Why would you make a disclaimer about a vote page one?

Because my reasoning for the vote wasn't the bandwagon. It was just because I wanted to vote her.

[Kmd4390]

If I was just bandwagoning, I'd have said so. I wasn't, so I said I wasn't.

[Kmd4390]

I've given the most explanation I possibly could. I was going to vote Zazie, saw some votes already there, and voted anyway. There is nothing behind the Zazie vote.

I do like the fact that we are actually discussing who could be scum now, and not just being random.

[Kmd4390]

The random phase starts off pretty much random. The thing that turns it serious is when someone takes a small tell and starts pursuing a real point off of it. That's what is happening here.

[Kmd4390]

Responding to letters without quotes out of laziness.

A. My reasoning WAS that I always vote her. I see his point, but it's weak. I've said several times that if people vote me to get out of the random phase, that's fine. If I got called out for bandwagoning Zazie just to start discussion, fine.

B. Honestly not sure what you mean. Please clarify.

C. I didn't sit there and think, "Hmm, maybe I shouldn't say that because it will look scummy." My bad I guess?

D. Not sure what the point is here.

[Kmd4390]

dahill, I've said this I don't even know how many times.

I don't know why. I just did. I saw the other votes and knew that in most situations, my vote would just be a random bandwagon vote. I wanted to point out that I was voting Zazie just because I like to vote her. That's all there is to it. Nothing more.

[Kmd4390]

CC is V/LA. Saw this in another thread.

He did not post it in *this* thread or PM me, as it says in my rules, which he obviously did not read. The prod stands.

[Kmd4390]

I don't mind being called out for bandwagoning if that's what I'm doing. If I was, I'd say so. But I wasn't, so I said I wasn't.

This is starting to turn into arguing in circles...

[Kmd4390]

The case against kmd seems fairly weak to me but at the same time, kmd's responses to the questions seem a little too defensive as if he does have something to cover up.

I naturally try to answer everything directed at me in any game regardless of alignment.

[Kmd4390]

You appear to be being called out for the disclaimer that your random vote wasn't a bandwagon-related vote. Some seem to think you may have been attempting to preempt suspicion, etc. It doesn't appear to be about bandwagoning or not itself.

I see that. And as I've said, I meant nothing by it.

[Kmd4390]

Mexican rap is great.

I actually loathe rap. But Peter Fox is pretty good.

Heard it on the radio in California.

[Kmd4390]

I don't buy this at all. Who's going to openly point out their own scuminess while they are committing it?

When it's my first post of the RVS, I will. I'll gladly jump up and say, "Oh, bandwagon!!! I'm on it!!!"

I see the foreign language posts, by all the players doing it, as anti-town. I am now assuming that any post that is not in english is scummy.

If it's a post restriction, they have no choice. I assume Glork and Imaginality's accents are restrictions as well as Zazie's German.

[Kmd4390]

I see all these guys talk about how they are German or something. You need foam, amirite?

So who has the lemonade? I am interested in buying some, if you tell me why I want it.

Translated for simplification.

[Kmd4390]

hascow, I didn't want to elaborate because I wanted everyone's answers first. Nobody knows anything though, so I guess I don't get any help.

Early votes don't bother me because they get the game started. Something we were in desperate need of.

[Kmd4390]

It has now.

I was talking about early votes as in the RVS and just after.

[Kmd4390]

Glork's just mad that I didn't post more Hello Kitty pics.

You can post in English?!?!?

And I think the only way scum would be more willing to buy lemonade is if Caf is scum with them and they talked about his role. I think if Caf is town, the scum would be just as cautious as us, if not more cautious.

[Kmd4390]

Unvote

because hascow seems to be trying to get us going.

So what have I missed... a Sly wagon...EK trying to build "total posts" or "posts per day"...still no answer from destructor (but no posts at all either, so I expect he hasn't seen the question from myself and hascow yet)...Darox putting in basically nothing serious (what else is new? I've seen this from him in every game I've played with him)... and dahill still looking pretty townie.

So a couple of things need to be done:

Vote destructor

unless he can explain the English posts

and

Buy box of condoms

I hear they are cheaper here.

[Kmd4390]

@Dahill: Pushing a lynch on bad logic = scum.

I've seen plenty of townies push bad cases.

[Kmd4390]

Wow, Isacc. I didn't call you scum. I said I disagree with you on a theory point. Quick to defend yourself much?

[Kmd4390]

@Dahill: Pushing a lynch on bad logic = scum.

I've seen plenty of townies push bad cases.

@Kmd and Dahill: I attack bad logic. It's what I do. I blow up over

really

bad logic. See all my other games (WoT, mini 772). You don't like it, sorry, but if you think it's a scumtell, you don't know me.

Wow, Isacc. I didn't call you scum. I said I disagree with you on a theory point. Quick to defend yourself much?

Kmd: Am I not allowed to respond to your comments? Don't overreact, I was just responding.

Doesn't look like "just responding" to me. Looks like:

Isacc:Bad logic is scummy.
Kmd:No it's not.
Isacc: I say that all the time! It's not a scumtell!

[Kmd4390]

Kmd: did you see Dahill's comment on me in 335? I was answering him too you know.

Hmm. I see...

[Kmd4390]

EK and Sly, you guys know I'm the shit, right?

[Kmd4390]

That's your "claim"? Not that claiming right now is even a good idea... Just...anyone can say, "I am X. I am not vanilla. Lynch someone else." I mean, that's like destructor could say "I am German. I am not vanilla. Lynch someone else." Or dahill, "I am an alien hunter. I am not vanilla. Lynch someone else."

Point is, either fullclaim or don't claim at all. I prefer not claiming at all right now.

[Kmd4390]

(so I should be applauding Kmd here, I guess).

Eh, Mod won't let me buy them. Gotta go without.

Serious test here:

Buy Coat Rack

[Kmd4390]

(so I should be applauding Kmd here, I guess).

Eh, Mod won't let me buy them. Gotta go without.

Much the pity, eh?

It's fine.

actually, and he can correct me if I'm wrong, but I see him saying that he wished you hadn't claimed at all, and now that you've gone partway, you should fullclaim.

Exactly this. I typed pretty much the same after reading Sly's post and then saw that Cow had pretty much summed it up.

Moving on, hasd seems a lot less suspicious than Coheed. I'm curious about the repeated mentioning of having an awesome role, though - Coheed did it too.

I think Cow mostly did it as a joke because of what Coheed had said.

[Kmd4390]

Zazie made ALL of her posts in German if I'm not mistaken. I believe you came in and made your first few posts in German too. You should see why the English posts come as a shock to me.

The explanation seems truthful though.

Unvote

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, please work on your quote tags so you won't be misquoting people in the future like you did me in 367.

My bad.

[Kmd4390]

Wow, such a strong case. You have convinced me that, contrary to my role pm, I must be scum. After this game will you sit with me and train me so I can become a supreme scum detector such as yourself in my future games?

And an even better defense.

[Kmd4390]

Ok, so we can buy non-beverages. Pretty sure nothing outside of lemonade means anything though.

If lynching Sly wouldn't end the day, I'd see no reason not to do it. If it does, we should treat it like normal. If people think he's scummy, go ahead and vote him like you normally would.

Sly, you don't have any definite information about what happens if you are lynched?

[Kmd4390]

That's interesting...

[Kmd4390]

Plum, I said "that's interesting" after I asked Sly about his role and I found his answer interesting. In context, I see nothing wrong with that post. If I'd lurked for 8 pages and came in with that, you'd have a point. But I find it interesting that he seems to know next to nothing about what happens if we lynch him.

Who would I vote now? Well I'd almost want to vote Sly, but as weak as his claim looks, my gut tells me he is telling the truth. I'd have been fine voting Coheed, but Cow seems more protown than he did. The only votes I could come up with wouldn't have much backing them (Glork, Darox, Imaginality). I do get a strong town read from dahill, you (Plum), and EK. I keep changing my mind on Isacc. Leaning town right now. Destructor seems like a decent vote, but only because of the English posts which he explained. I'll try and get a better look at this game tomorrow if I end up being able to leave my house tomorrow (snow storm). If not, I'll get to it Thursday.

[Kmd4390]

You're COMPLETELY neglecting the value to the scum-hunt in me contributing instead of posting nothing if I were to only read.

How much can the uninformed really contribute?

About this. I think I've contributed a fair amount since I replaced in. That alone pretty much completely kills your argument that pro-town players can't be useful until they've read everything.

It definitely helps to read everything though...

[Kmd4390]

If Zazie/Des's role says something like, "Post in German or die", it can be interperated a couple of ways. It can be seen as, "All German, no English" which Zazie did. It could also be seen as, "Make sure there is some German in some of your posts" which is what Des is doing. Basically, there is no guarantee that one or the other lied. It may just be different interpretations which is what I'm starting to think.

[Kmd4390]

Amazing, I do a crude translation of 3 posts and seemingly have ran across Zazie and Kmd discussing telling lies, thinking self, and some sort of pre-game knowledge about something.

That sure seems scummy to me. I feel just fine about my vote.

FoS:Kmd

I think more translation is at hand. Can someone tell me what languages Imaginality and (Plum, Glork and Kmd) are/were posting in?

Wow. "lies" refers to my urge to vote her in the RVS. "thinking self" I have no idea what that even means/ "pre-game knowledge" is past games we've played.

Plum and I were speaking Russian.

Anyway, class in 30 Min and more games to catch up on, so if I stay where I am (depends on weather), I'll get to that reread and analysis.

[Kmd4390]

I see no reason not to believe he is "sasquatch". His claim seems like an unlynchable claim. If he is unlynchable, I'd expect that either he is town, or there is another killing role in this game, likely SK because unlynchable scum is a broken role for the most part. So basically it comes down to whether or not we believe his claim which seems to be that he is unlynchable. Personally, I believe it. Not that he isn't scummy, but something is just telling me he is town.

[Kmd4390]

Destructor:

You must not post in German ever again in the thread. Period. If you make another post in German, you will be lynched. Got it?

@Darox: He claims he will die if he doesn't make any posts in German. This will tell us if he is lying.

So if he speaks German, you want to lynch him. If he doesn't, and he lives, you'll want to lynch him. If he doesn't and dies, then well...he's dead. What the hell is this Isacc?

Why should you risk being modkilled? Because otherwise, I don't buy that you ever had to speak in German at all. Prove yourself, or be scummy. Your choice.

Prove himself by being modkilled? How is that protown. "Hey guys, if Des stops posting in German and gets modkilled, it means he was telling the truth! Let's see if it happens!"

Vote Isacc

unless you can tell me how any of your plan regarding Des makes sense.

I do not have any immunities. What I do have is abilities. Other than what I have already said, that is about as clear as I can make it without tempting the Wrath of Mirth, which I have already unintentionally treaded far too close to, as it is.

No immunities? Likely NOT unlynchable then. And I assume you aren't allowed to fullclaim judging by this post in combination with your actions so far.

[Kmd4390]

Isacc's plan had no hope of working. This is the second game I've seen him do this (make bad hopeless plans). I don't know if it means anything about his allignment though. I still think we should lynch Sly.

Is that game finished? If so, what was Isacc's alignment? And do you have a link and post number where the bad plan occured?

[Kmd4390]

Ridiculous? Your predecessor said she couldn't post in english. She must have been lying since you are now posting in english.

Do you think it's at all possible that they simply interperated the Role PM differently?

@Kmd: it was Wheel of Time mafia, where I flipped town. Plus, I never suggested we did the plan in that game, it was just...idk I made a weird post that I don't remember why I did. Lol...

What similiarites do you think EK is seeing that can be applied here?

[Kmd4390]

Isacc, if there is no likely link to the meta EK is providing, I will not use it either against you or in your favor.

Also, yes, the German-English shift by Des is still interesting. But your plan would have left him to die either way. That's what is scummy about it.

Sly, you are at L-1. Please claim as closely to fullclaim as you are allowed. Also wondering what happened after you drank the lemonade just now.

[Kmd4390]

Sly, you are at L-1. Please claim as closely to fullclaim as you are allowed. Also wondering what happened after you drank the lemonade just now.

I have said all I can say about my role.

Summarize what you have said please.

[Kmd4390]

Sly, you are not making sense. You don't think you are unlynchable, but you don't think the lynch would be successful? How is this possible?

EK, I seriously don't think that's a slip by Sly. Maybe he is scum, but even if he is, I don't see that as a slip.

[Kmd4390]

Sly, your claim is very vague.

Can you tell us what the lemonade has done for you?

[Kmd4390]

Cow, you have said your role is awesome. What more can you tell us about it?

This is blatant fishing...

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, what are your thoughts on Isacc now that he's explained his attempted gambit? Still scummy? Elaborate? What about Sly?

Yes, I still think Isacc is scummy. I've seen scum say stupid things and try to pass it as a Gambit before. His plan was scummy as hell, Gambit or not.

Sly, every time I want to think he is town does something scummy. I was almost willing to believe his claim, as vague as it was, but then he fishes for Cow's role. I'd be ok with a Sly lynch.

[Kmd4390]

I think Sly being a Super Saint makes sense.

I think the comment regarding the fishing was scummy as hell.

I think myself going down if he is a Super Saint is better than Plum going down because it would eliminate the distraction of suspicion on me and Plum has been relatively protown.

Vote SlySly

Let's see what happens.

If I die from this, my final suspicions are Isacc, Imaginality, and Cow.

[Kmd4390]

@Kmd: How was my plan scummy? He wouldn't have had to test it to the point of being modkilled. I wanted his reaction, not his death.

If you do not believe I am telling the truth, then you must already be suspicious of me: can you provide reasons for your distrust of me, plan obviously not being one of them?

If you do believe I am telling the truth...well then you shouldn't find my plan scummy, so I'll discredit that possibility.

The only reasonable reaction to what you suggested is, "Hell no. Why would I agree to being modkilled or lynched. Your plan is retarded." That's what I would have said in Des's position regardless of alignment. I think you were trying to get Des killed, and when we attacked you for it, you came back with, "Wait! It was a Gambit!"

As for Sly's non-lynch... we are definitely in mod-Wifom-ville here. It appears that Sly's claim of being a sasquatch has been given weight, but whether he is a town sasquatch or a scum sasquatch is unclear. The prospect of having an anti-town player who resists the lynch is somewhat overpowered and unlikely (anyone here seen one in a game before?), but especially in a game such as this one we can't rule it out. Still, time to explore some other avenues.
/quote]

I seriously doubt Sly is scum after the non-lynch.

The poor fools gathered around one of their own, SlySly

Does this statement mean anything to anyone besides myself?

I know what you are saying, but I doubt the Mod is telling us you are town with this. If you look at the game of mafia as a whole, the town is uninformed. That means we don't know who the scum are. (Yes, I'm stating the obvious, but just follow me for a second). So if we don't know the scum, everyone has an equal chance of being "one of our own". Also, flavor doesn't usually give game related information.

[Kmd4390]

@Kmd: How was my plan scummy? He wouldn't have had to test it to the point of being modkilled. I wanted his reaction, not his death.

If you do not believe I am telling the truth, then you must already be suspicious of me: can you provide reasons for your distrust of me, plan obviously not being one of them?

If you do believe I am telling the truth...well then you shouldn't find my plan scummy, so I'll discredit that possibility.

The only reasonable reaction to what you suggested is, "Hell no. Why would I agree to being modkilled or lynched. Your plan is retarded." That's what I would have said in Des's position regardless of alignment. I think you were trying to get Des killed, and when we attacked you for it, you came back with, "Wait! It was a Gambit!"

As for Sly's non-lynch... we are definitely in mod-Wifom-ville here. It appears that Sly's claim of being a sasquatch has been given weight, but whether he is a town sasquatch or a scum sasquatch is unclear. The prospect of having an anti-town player who resists the lynch is somewhat overpowered and unlikely (anyone here seen one in a game before?), but especially in a game such as this one we can't rule it out. Still, time to explore some other avenues.

I seriously doubt Sly is scum after the non-lynch.

The poor fools gathered around one of their own, SlySly

Does this statement mean anything to anyone besides myself?

I know what you are saying, but I doubt the Mod is telling us you are town with this. If you look at the game of mafia as a whole, the town is uninformed. That means we don't know who the scum are. (Yes, I'm stating the obvious, but just follow me for a second). So if we don't know the scum, everyone has an equal chance of being "one of our own". Also, flavor doesn't usually give game related information.

Tags fixed.

[Kmd4390]

Unvote

[Kmd4390]

I seriously doubt Sly is scum after the non-lynch.

Why?

Isn't unlynchable scum kind of loaded? Thought so.

@Kmd: You completely ignored my question. Mind ACTUALLY ANSWERING ME. If you think I was trying to get Des killed, that would mean you are suspicious of me

outside of my gambit

. You cannot use my plan as reason that you were suspicious of me prior to my plan: it doesn't work. Now, please, don't avoid the question any longer.

You attempt a scummy plan and call it a Gambit. I call you out for it. Now you are telling me your scummy plan "CANNOT" be used against you? Why? I'm not avoiding anything. Your plan is my main reason for suspecting you.

Oh, and I moved my vote to lynch Sly.

Vote Isacc

I will continue to role fish if I want to. I know what my PM says and you don't. I know what I need to find out and if that requires me to role fish, I will.

Do you have a lawn gnome for me? Actually, if you do, that lemonade is sounding pretty tempting.

Wait, why didn't I think of this?

Buy: Lawn Gnome

This should actually do something for me...

@Sly/Caf, look closely at your role PMs. Does anything indicate that we can help each other out?

[Kmd4390]

I may be on to something.

Caf, do you know where you are selling lemonade from? Is it by any chance Florida?

[Kmd4390]

I seriously doubt Sly is scum after the non-lynch.

Why?

Isn't unlynchable scum kind of loaded? Thought so.

is sly actually completely unlynchable?
even if so, is this not a bastard mafia game?

Seems unlynchable to me. We brought him all the way to hammer and got flavor. The votes never reset. I don't see any way he can be lynched. Unless maybe it requires a unanimous lynch? I really don't think he can be lynched. And bastard game or not, if scum can't be lynched, how do you beat them? Unless there is an equally powerful Vig who can't die or something like that. But I think the role is too powerful to exist as scum.

[Kmd4390]

by the way kmd you still haven't changed your avatar

do it

I'm on my crappy home computer. I'll try though.

[Kmd4390]

Isacc, the plan was scummy. It was scummy before your explanation.

I don't buy your explanation.

That's why your plan and explanation are scummy together. Not because of circular logic. Your plan isn't scummy BECAUSE of the explanation. It was scummy because it would result in Des's death. If I believed your explanation, your plan wouldn't look scummy. But I don't buy it, so the scumminess of the plan is still there.

[Kmd4390]

I don't buy the explanation because I think you are scum mainly based on your plan. It's not circular logic because I would have to think your plan was scummy BECAUSE of the explanation, which I don't. If you think I do, you are putting words in my mouth to make it into circular logic.

[Kmd4390]

Mod: Can Kmd be reported for that avatar? I find it offensive.

I find it offensive too. Lost a bet.

[Kmd4390]

Mod: Can Kmd be reported for that avatar? I find it offensive.

I find it offensive too. Lost a bet.

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 82#1455582

[Kmd4390]

Based on my explanation,

there wouldn't have been any deaths

. I wanted a

reaction

out of Destructor, not a modkill. Thus, based on my explanation, my plan shouldn't be scummy.

Your explanation IS that there wouldn't be any deaths and the whole thing was a Gambit for his reaction. I don't buy that explanation.

Also, Kmd you contradicted yourself. Post 586, the last two sentences you say that if you believed my explanation, the plan wouldn't look scummy, but since you don't believe me, it does. Therefore you ARE saying that my plan is scummy because you don't believe my explanation, and that you don't believe my explanation because my plan is scummy. You ARE using circular logic. I am NOT putting words in your mouth. But, you ARE contradicting yourself.

Ok, let me try to follow this.

"you say that if you believed my explanation, the plan wouldn't look scummy, but since you don't believe me, it does"
Right.

"Therefore you ARE saying that my plan is scummy because you don't believe my explanation"
No. It was scummy. Even if your explanation had NEVER come, it would still be scummy.

[Kmd4390]

@Kmd: How was my plan scummy?

The plan of having Des die was scummy because Des would die either by modkill or lynch. That's scummy because there is no way out and it's basically a "die because I said so" plan. Well, I guess with that logic, it's like a vigkill . But seriously, you are asking him to agree to die which doesn't seem productive to me.

Yeah, I fail at explaining, but that should make sense. I hope.

[Kmd4390]

Oh, and the avatar was removed by Mith. New one will go up when I hear from Dahill and it is approved by Mith.

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, but my plan wouldn't have Des die. It would only have him provide a reaction.

Do I have to say it again? This is the last time.

THIS IS THE EXPLANATION THAT I DON'T BELIEVE

See, a death resulting from my plan only follows if you are assuming I am a liar. However, the only reason you have been giving to suspect my lying, is that a death would have resulted from my plan. You can deny it all you want, but your logic

is

circular.

NO. YOU ASKED DES TO BE MODKILLED OR LYNCHED. THAT WAS SCUMMY. I DON'T BELIEVE YOU WHEN YOU SAY THAT YOU WERE ONLY AFTER HIS REACTION

Do you get it now?

[Kmd4390]

Because I think you made a plan to try and get a player killed and then tried to pass it off as a Gambit when it didn't work.

[Kmd4390]

General feel I guess.

[Kmd4390]

@Sly/Caf, look closely at your role PMs. Does anything indicate that we can help each other out?

Not sure what you mean. I don't have anything about gnomes, you or Sly. Perhaps if you could clarify what sort of help you're looking for, I might be able to say.

Well I have to collect gnomes and my role PM subtly hints at the possibility of help. I was curious if you or anyone else had noticed the subtle hint in your PM.

Caf, do you know where you are selling lemonade from? Is it by any chance Florida?

No specific place is mentioned, and place in general doesn't seem important to my role. There are references to generically American things/products/concepts though. It's possible I could be in Florida, I guess.

If it's Florida, that's helpful. I'm already pretty sure Des, Glork, and Imaginality can't help me.

And yes,

I see that it's possible my gambit was actually to try and get him killed, and that my explanation is a lie.

However, if someone believes I was lying, I want an actual reason they are suspicious with me outside of the plan (due to the fact that, as I explained, that would be circular logic). I have no problem with people attacking me for my plan, as long as they provide good backing. Kmd has not done so. His argument is "I feel like you are scummy." That is weak.

My argument is NOT "I feel like you are scummy." My argument is bolded above in your post.

Why don't you consider this an "actual reason"? I've explained more than enough why it isn't circular logic at all, so I'm not about to do that again.

No player with half a brain's worth of mafia theory knowledge would accept a plan that will inevitably result in their death REGARDLESS of their alignment, which is EXACTLY what the plan you proposed was.

There are exceptions to this, but very few. (For example, a scummy vig being asked to shoot themself.)

I never thought you wouldn't get that it was a gambit. However, you knowing it was a gambit wouldn't have stopped it from working. You couldn't have known what reactions I was looking for.

So if Des knew you were after reactions, and the reaction would probably be crafted, what good would the crafted reaction do? Even when town, human nature is to try and go for the reaction that seems best.

I have no lawn gnome and for the record, I think Issac's plan was stupid too.

I don't expect that you have a gnome. I think Caf probably has my gnome. I do expect that you have a hint in your role PM towards someone being able to help you, or you being able to help someone else.

@Plum and Darox: He wouldn't have accepted IF PEOPLE WEREN'T PUTTING PRESSURE. You keep forgetting that part. If people had agreed, and threatened the lynch, he would have had to accept, which is why I was hoping I could get a reaction involving acceptance.

So you expect to come up with a plan that basically says "Be Modkilled or Be Lynched", not take any heat for it, and have that plan agreed to? All for reactions? Not likely.

Sorry, all out of lawn gnomes, sold the last five to an old couple.[/color]

Hmm.

Buy Lawn Gnome from caf19

Fixed quote tags

[Kmd4390]

@Kmd: Your argument IS that you feel I am scummy. You have NOT explained that it isn't circular logic (because it IS), in fact I have shown quotes of you where you word for word made a circular argument.

You have no case because you have not given any reason to suspect me of lying. That means, you have no case.

About your "If Des knew you wanted a reaction," If you read the quote you JUST quoted, I said that Destructor couldn't have known what reactions I was looking for, so they

wouldn't

be crafted. Christ, you have no clue what you are even saying. It's like arguing with Empking. No wonder Dahill found you scummy earlier.

Yes, I feel that you are scummy. No, it's not for no reason. It's because of your plan to get Des Modkilled/lynched. No, I don't feel your explanation that you were after reactions was truthful. BUT, I'm not trying to say that your plan was scummy BECAUSE your explanation is untruthful. I'm saying it was scummy because it would result in Des's death regardless of what happened. If you don't get it now, I'm done explaining. It should make sense by now that there is no circular logic because your scumminess doesn't depend on your explanation that you were after reactions and it's more the plan itself.

I think if Des knew you wanted reactions, the reactions would be crafted based on a WIFOM guess at what you were after. There's no way you could get an accurate read from that.


@Des, I've seen the argument you are presenting about Glork before. You are saying that the game is in LYLO early because he can't vote (or at least not for real players). This is true. What is also true is that by lynching him, we put ourselves in basically the same situation. If he is town, it's a mislynch and likely a scum kill. That's 2 dead townies and another step toward LYLO. Basically, lynching him is counterproductive unless you think he is scum.

Actually, in Weasles Mafia, undo had a role that required L+2 votes to lynch. Anyone up for trying to put more votes on Sly to see what happens?

I was thinking maybe it would take a unanimous vote. I'd be willing to try it. If he survives with everyone, including himself, voting for him, I think it basically confirms him as unlynchable which I don't think could be a scum role.

Also, there seem to be two "plans" that get referred to. The first is the one he proposed - that I stop posting German and get lynched if I do. That was a bad plan. The second plan is his gambit - that he would use the manner in which I agreed to it to gauge my alignment. This wasn't a great plan either, but doesn't come across as scummy either.

I think kmd and co. are arguing that plan 2 never existed and that plan 1 was scummy.

"Plan 2" was his explanation for "Plan 1" after we found "Plan 1" scummy. It looks like you see the argument though.

Fraud: half-joke/half role-related

Is there a reason you are softclaiming like this?

[Kmd4390]

You said your role was awesome and that "fraud" was role-related. Assumptions about your role can be made based on these statements. That's a softclaim. Now, why are you doing it?

[Kmd4390]

You said your role was awesome and that "fraud" was role-related. Assumptions about your role can be made based on these statements. That's a softclaim. Now, why are you doing it?

Why do you think I'm doing it? Do you think I would be saying my role is awesome normally?

Are you asking me to answer my own question for you? I'd like an answer before I speculate on this.

[Kmd4390]

@Kmd: You are an idiot, and I am done explaining this. You have no clue what you are saying, because you can't understand basic common sense. Luckily, I think the rest of the players in this game are smarter than that.

Way to actually listen to what I am saying.

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, what you are saying is nonsense. You simply do not see it.

I see what you are saying. I disagree. You don't even see what I am saying.

let's just say that it was "suggested" that I talk about how awesome my role is, which wasn't hard.

Suggested by who?

Kmd, although it isn't impossible, I don't think it's likely I have any gnomes. Don't suppose anything happened when you tried to buy one off me?

How unlikely? And why? Remember that every single player told me they had no gnome. So either they don't know they have it, they lied, or there are no gnomes (in order of likeliness).

And no, nothing happened. I didn't expect it to. I was reaching severely with what I'm supposed to do. But I figured it was worth a try. I do find it interesting that the Mod didn't even acknowledge it though...

Yeah, but I haven't seen anything that compels me to believe he isn't scum. Unless something changes, I think he's a policy lynch for the day before LYLO, at the latest.

I'll only vote him if I think he is scum.

I have a specific reason to believe caf is good people and I'd rather he stayed alive.

Buy: Lemonade

Can you tell us why you think the lemonade is ok?

To test the idea,

Unvote, Vote Slysly

[Kmd4390]

kmd, do you honestly have no clue? I can't believe that.

Ok. You mean the Mod. Didn't think that would do anything to you. But do you mean similar to what Des is saying about posting German? If so, it explains a lot.

[Kmd4390]

Like it or not, a vote on me is a waste of time today. Remove your votes on me lest ye be scum.

I want to see Caf and Glork vote you and a self-vote first. After that, we can confirm that you are unlynchable.

[Kmd4390]

Oh, forgot about Glork not being able to vote when I said that.

And I want to make sure there is really no way to lynch you. What does it hurt to try?

[Kmd4390]

How unlikely? And why? Remember that every single player told me they had no gnome. So either they don't know they have it, they lied, or there are no gnomes (in order of likeliness).

My role doesn't seem like the kind that would possess a gnome. I guess I could be wrong, though - am I to take it that you have a specific reason to believe I have a gnome?

Does your role give you an age or profession?

[Kmd4390]

Unvote, Vote Isacc

Couldn't you have done this before I posted the votecount?

[Kmd4390]

Couldn't you have done this before I posted the votecount?

Oops.

[Kmd4390]

Does your role give you an age or profession?

Yes, I have an age. I have no profession other than selling lemonade.

Looks like we're getting somewhere.

What IS the age?

[Kmd4390]

Is that all you can say? Not even an estimate?

I have an idea, but I want to be as sure as possible.

[Kmd4390]

Can I suggest Isacc?

[Kmd4390]

Deadline is coming up. It's Darox or EK.

Vote Darox

He hasn't really done much of anything this game.

[Kmd4390]

Oops. Forgot to

Unvote, Vote Darox

.

Although Mirth doesn't technically require unvotes. (I found that out the hard way in Mayo.)

[Kmd4390]

I'd agree with an extension. Darox is actually starting to be helpful.

[Kmd4390]

Des, do you not realize that policy lynching Glork effectively does the same as keeping him alive if he is town?

[Kmd4390]

Because if we keep him alive, the game ends a day earlier. If we lynch him, we lose that day anyway.

And I'm not calling Darox town yet. But I'll admit I'm starting to second guess myself after that last post. Reminds me of one Pads made in Mini 677 as town. Pads was at L-1 in that game and gave us a post like Darox's. He escaped the lynch and actually ended up NK'd that night.

[Kmd4390]

I was mostly voting him for being lurky and unhelpful, so yes.

[Kmd4390]

Glork pretty much summed up what I am saying about voteless.

Also:

why are you typing in normal english all of a sudden?

This.

What happened to the accent?

[Kmd4390]

Unvote, Vote Isacc

because of the extension.

[Kmd4390]

In the meantime, kmd, what do you think about Glork?

I think that if he is town, there's no reason to policy lynch him. He hasn't really done anything scummy so far, so I don't plan on lynching him any time soon.

[Kmd4390]

Des, just ran a hypothetical situation through my head, and you are right about Glork. Lynching Glork before LYLO brings a normal LYLO. Keeping him alive in the same hypothetical game ends the game.

EK has a good point though. Glork may not be voteless for the whole game. Glork, do you know if you can get a vote later on?

Plum, would you mind presenting your case on Des in bulleted points so it's easier to read? Des, could you post a defense to the bulleted points when Plum posts them for the same reason?

Isacc, were you still planning on doing that PBPA on Darox?

[Kmd4390]

Kmd: What's your opinion on Destructor v Glork?

I'll get to it tomorrow. Haven't actively read anything posted today in this game.

[Kmd4390]

I was asked about Glork vs. Des.

As far as policy lynching Glork, I actually do see Des's point. I was against the idea until I thought up a hypothetical scenario. Glork being alive at LYLO hurts us more than lynching Glork hurts us. And that's if he's town. If he's scum, that's even more reason to lynch him.

As far as Des, he seems pretty protown IMO.

I honestly think both are town and Glork is a policy lynch at most.

[Kmd4390]

Nah, it's fine. I'm okay with people disappearing as long as I'm warned

I'm disappearing for a week, but it's still almost a month away.

[Kmd4390]

I was asked about Glork vs. Des.

As far as policy lynching Glork, I actually do see Des's point. I was against the idea until I thought up a hypothetical scenario. Glork being alive at LYLO hurts us more than lynching Glork hurts us. And that's if he's town. If he's scum, that's even more reason to lynch him.

As far as Des, he seems pretty protown IMO.

I honestly think both are town and Glork is a policy lynch at most.

What about Des asking for a claim from Glork earlier today? Still protown?

I can see the thought process behind it. It could tell us if Glork can actually get a vote or be useful in some other way. That said, I disagree with Glork claiming now. No need for it yet.

[Kmd4390]

Caf, can you tell us anything new about the lemonade now that 3 cups have been bought?

Darox, I'd like to see the rest of your analysis as well.

[Kmd4390]

Unvote, Vote Darox

We need the rest of that analysis and a claim.

Now.

[Kmd4390]

Darox, please post what you have of the analysis.

My vote isn't moving after the "Haha, I can't claim" thing. The analysis would still be nice though.

[Kmd4390]

As for the analysis, unfortunately in the pile of things I have to do, this game isn't currently high enough that I have the time to do the rest of my analysis.

Scum caught not wanting to give the town more info.

Town Darox would consider this game high priority right now.

[Kmd4390]

As for the analysis, unfortunately in the pile of things I have to do, this game isn't currently high enough that I have the time to do the rest of my analysis.

Scum caught not wanting to give the town more info.

Town Darox would consider this game high priority right now.

God that is terrible logic.

That's like the assumption that only scum fight hard to avoid their own lynch.
News flash buddy - I'm not a jester, so dying hurts everyone who shares my alignment. Period.

Then what can it hurt to help the town before being lynched? If you are town, that analysis should definitely go up. You do realize we have a deadline, right?

[Kmd4390]

So where to start.

Caf, I think the lemonade thing MAY be a wild goose chase...

Hascow being silenced... Did somebody do that or did he break a PR or what?

And I'm pretty sure Caf is right about me being the lynchee. Flavor doesn't match as far as aliens, but dahill's actions say otherwise.

Vote Isacc

for the same reasons as Day 1.

[Kmd4390]

imaginality, I've played 2 games with a lyncher. One had a town target. The other had a scum target in a game that was otherwise scum-heavy.

[Kmd4390]

Kmd: Seriously? You're voting me?

Do you honestly think I would bus a scumbuddy day 1? You think I am scummy for trying to get Destructor killed: if so then, why did I try to push a Darox lynch in favor of a Dest lynch? You are suggesting that I am scum who had a good town target, but

decided to convince everyone to lynch scum instead.

Isn't that the purpose of bussing?

I won't clear you just for being on a scum lynch. Not after Mini 628 (Llama bussed me Day 1 and our other scumbuddy Day 2 to get a free ride to endgame for the win).

[Kmd4390]

Isacc, thesame logoic works on you tioo. Im leavin my vrote.

[Kmd4390]

Kmd: Whatever, you had no case yesterday, and you have none today. You've also ignored every action I had D1 except the one tiny one you're still voting me over. You're an idiot.

K.

Isacc Case

Point One

-

Stays in random phase as long as possible

-

Yes, I know the game didn't get truly serious for quite a while. But read Isacc's first 8 posts. Not a serious point to be found. There's a jokevote on Caf, some superhero arguing with Daroxscum, and calling Imaginality's vote unfair.

First post with content starts, "Ummm lot's to respond to I guess...". Yeah, well, when you lock a dog in a room with 3 year old steaks, the shit is gonna pile up.

Bottom line, there was a lot of useless stuff going on which is great for scum. They can post without adding anything and no one questions them for it. Well, consider yourself questioned, scum.

Point Two

-

"Admitting" points

Same post, "Yes Caf, you are well to point out I haven't done much yet. I admit, I was a little lost by the randomness of it all for awhile, and hadn't quite caught up."- Admitting it doesn't make it any less true. This is an excellent way for scum to try and lessen points brought up on them. They can say, "Yes, I lurked", "Yes, I lied", "Yes, I fucked up", but the truth is admitting it doesn't mean it never happened. It just means you are defending it differently. This point can still be used even if you admit it's true.

Point Three

Bad Excuse

Also, "I was waiting for Imaginality's explanation of his vote, but I think i just figured it out."- This was your excuse for staying random. You were waiting for him to explain. What? Do you get random and joke around when a game is in LYLO and everyone is waiting for a player to respond? I don't. You could have done more while you waited.

Points Four and Five

Non-Committal statements to create wiggle room/contradiction

a.)"As for the lemonade, I don't find it scummy yet, but I am still a little put-off by it."
First, you don't find it scummy "yet". So your opinion can change when everyone else's does? Sure, Caf may do something scummy later, but you are addressing lemonade specifically. There is no specific lean on it. Second, define "put-off" on something you admit you "don't find scummy". Seems like a contradiction to me.

(If Charter was in this game, he'd call you out on a scum slip because the only way to be "put-off" by something you "don't find scummy" is if you are scum worried about a power role. I rarely believe in slips though, so I see this more as trying to be able to take either side later.)

edit: I think you meant you didn't find it scummy (yet) that Sly bought the lemonade, not that Caf was selling it. Point still stands, but I think I misread who you were talking about.

b/c)You were also non-committal in calling Darox "odd" and calling dahill "ridiculous". I elaborate on those later.

d)"In other news, Sly your comments about foreign languages seems kinda anti-town." anti-town? Not scummy? Looking through that post (15 under your posts in isolation), I see nothing that shows whether you think Sly is scum for this or not.

e)"Alright, while the whole SlySly issue is very interesting, I would rather address a matter I feel I can get a definite read on for now, so as to whether or not his claim seems legit, I am holding off on deciding." translates to "We had a roleclaim, but I'm not gonna look at it yet."

Point Six

Making your voice heard without really saying anything

"I agree that we should wait til day 2 to see what happens to the lemonade drinker."- Well...yeah. Unless you get inside info from the Mod, that's what is going to happen. Or we could have lynched him, but specifically over buying lemonade? No. That would have been a terrible move. So you basically said nothing except the obvious with this line.

Point Seven

Distancing from Darox

a) "Darox is odd to me. While it seems his "who would win" scenarios are probably a role related thing, that doesn't explain why he voted Glork for it. Seems a bit strange to still be random voting at this point. small FoS until we get an explanation on that."

Your first suspicion of the game. Well, first real suspicion. (You joke voted Caf.) And you don't even specifically call him scummy. This is as small a suspicion as you can get. You call him "odd" and you even FoS. But wait. Not just FoS, but a "small FoS". Was there really a purpose in this? If you are town, I don't see one. If you are scum with Darox, I call distancing. (Note that the FoS was "removed" just 2 posts later)

b)Another FoS after Darox doesn't justify his vote.

c) "@Sly: As to who I find scummy, let's see...
Darox continues to frustrate me. He rarely posts anything original, and his content is more often the "Who would win" than anything else at all. The only time I think I see him making an actual argument is against SlySly."- Still haven't voted Darox AT ALL, but you HAVE FoS'd twice.

d)"I think, in light of Darox, I am going to do a PBPA to see if my memory is correct. I'll post it later."- You avoided this until I asked about it.

e) You finally vote Darox when it's clear he's our most likely lynch. Sets you up to say you look more townie for voting him. After that, you finally bring forward that PBPA and push hard for the lynch. And this late push makes you look pretty obsessed with getting Darox lynched. After just a few FoS's and small jabs before. Smells like classic bussing to me.

Point Eight

Lack of Solid stance on early Dahill vs. Kmd

First, you only comment because you feel you have to, shown here: "the length of this tiny squabble has made me realize I am going to be obligated to take some position or side, or at least provide commentary."

Next, you say dahill is over reacting to it. Ok, you take a side. But you fail to correlate it to an alignment of either player. You FoS dahill and leave it at that. And the FoS isn't even for being scummy. It's for being, " for being, frankly, ridiculous."

"Why is it weird to you that a person explains their actions as they do them? How in the world does that make it scummy? I'm reading it totally right, and I maintain you have no case, your argument holds no water, and you're voting for nothing."
You are quite clearly disagreeing with dahill here and "taking my side", but again, nothing about an alignment on either player. No suspicions or even bad vibes yet.

"Dahill, I will start by saying you have defended yourself well, and my worries towards you have lessened significantly. That said, there are still some parts of your argument I disagree with."
Now you are acting like you had previously been calling dahill scum. You weren't. And still no suspicions at this point in the game. On anyone.

"I think a scum and town are both likely to want to explain their actions the way Kmd did."
Good to know. But no mention of which is MORE likely in THIS situation.

"it's not the vote themselves that make it helpful. It's the responses that are important, like your and Kmd's little debate."
Ok, but it's only important if you take something from it. You really didn't.

Point Nine

Fear of voting?

a)Well, you jokevoted and unvoted with no vote attached.

b)You commented on lemonade with no vote.

c)There's the Darox issue where you FoS, you never voted.

d)You FoS'd dahill.

e)"I might vote you, except I have not decided who exactly seems the most suspicious yet." to Hascow.

f)You are asked for suspicions while you are not voting anyone. You mention Darox first. You mention EK and actually bring good points. And you say Sly bothers you, but not enough for a lynch. I'd have expected a vote on EK. But again, no vote.

And later, "Fos: Elvis_Knits with a vote possibly coming after I do my PBPA on Darox"

g) While voting Sly "to test a theory", "Glork, EK, and Kmd are scum."

Why the fear of voting? (Your Post number 26 where you vote Des if your first serious vote of the game)

Point Ten

"I'm not scummy. Someone else did it too!"

a) Hascow calls you out and you literally say, "Plum did the same thing as me five posts above the one you're voting me over..... So why are you voting for me, but made no such comment to Plum? Scummy." (The dot dot dot is to note that I removed some of the post because it's not relevant.) So. You can't be scum because Plum did the same thing. Not only that, but Hascow is scummy for thinking you are scummy. Textbook OMGUS. And your first actual suspicion of the game, so congrats on that. Want a milk bone? (Damn image tags. I can't get it to work.) "Unvote because I had only voted Destructor for pressure." I take back that milk bone. =/

b) You also throw in the little gem, "Hey look, I also see a bunch more people agreeing that Kmd isn't scummy for his vote...again...how come you haven't attacked them?"

Point Eleven

Extreme over defensiveness

a)We see this when Hascow votes you. You call his accusation "bull crap" and say it "pinged your scumdar like mad". You also toss out a "major FoS Has for a totally bull accusation and tunneling." which is hilarious because Hascow was far from tunneling.

b) Your post 19 is filled with caps, bold, profanity, and bad points. (Not that I have a problem with profanity. Just the way you used it looked over defensive.)

c)Not even gonna go into your response to my original suspicions again. Note that it's there though.

Point Twelve

Ordering Des to die

"You must not post in German ever again in the thread. Period. If you make another post in German, you will be lynched. Got it?" =/

I think I've said enough on why this is scummy. (earlier in the game)

"He claims he will die if he doesn't make any posts in German. This will tell us if he is lying."- Awesome. If he's modkilled, we know he's town. That's helpf....wait a second.

Point Thirteen

Explanation for Point Twelve

"Alright, well, my gambit failed...I didn't expect to push it till he was modkilled."

I've already said I don't buy it. You tried to get a free kill on a town aligned player, and when it wasn't going to happen, you passed it off as a Gambit.

[Kmd4390]

Hazkow:

I have a homevork assinment for joo. Even zo joo kant post today, I am not goink to let joo off ze hook. Using ze notes fonktion on zis site (or notepad, or votever joo vont, really), I vont joo to take notes on ze ENTIRE day as it happens. Every time joo see an interesting post/point, argument, or anything zat stiks out to joo, I vont joo to note ze post nomber, and write a sentence (or more) on it. Vonce joo are able to talk again, I vont joo to post ze ENTIRE set of notes in full. If joo are protownzh, a largely objective, stream-of-konsciosness, comprehensive analysis kan be a huge blessink in disgize. If joo DON'T post this tomorrow, I am goink to throttle joo. Joo have no excuse not to do zis, konsiderink joo shood be followink ze game anyvay. Thanks in advance.

I agree with this. No reason not to do it.

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, you has no brain. Let me counter your bad logic point by point.

Calling it bad logic doesn't make you right and me wrong.

1: I stayed in the random phase as long as possible? WTF? That could be said about EVERYONE in game, seeing as it lasted til nearly page 8!

You did nothing to even TRY to get us out of the RVS.

2: Yes, admitting points doesn't mean they didn't happen. However, admitting points is also NOT a scumtell. Actually, what would have been scummier is if I had lied about it. However, you are saying something I did was actually a scum move done in order to look town? Wifom much?

No. I'm saying admitting it doesn't make it any less true.

3: That wasn't an "excuse" for anything. You clearly have no idea what I was referring to. When I said I had been waiting for Imaginality's explanation, it was because he voted me after quoting someone else. Then I realized he was testing the "let's put a vote on everyone" theory so I said "Oh nvm Imaginality, I understand now." That wasn't an excuse for anything.

You did nothing while you waited for the explanation. You said you were waiting for it.

4a: Or, you know, it means I was wary to trust buying lemonade, but I didn't think it was automatically a scumtell, which was what people were calling it at that time.

Why were you wary if it wasn't a scumtell? You avoided the point on this one.

4d: There is a difference between acting anti-town and acting scummy. Being a retard is anti-town. However, it doesn't make you scum. If you don't realize the difference between anti-town and scummy, you need to go back to newbie games.

That's exactly my point. You called him anti-town, but why? You said nothing to relate to alignment. And I'll take up your offer on that Newbie game. I'll IC and teach you the game.

4e: No, it doesn't translate to that. It translates to, "I want to see Sly's interactions still, so I'm going to pursue a different case which was interesting to me."

Something like a roleclaim is an important thing that you should give opinions on. You decided not to. Still scummy.

6: Not a scumtell. Not really any tell. Not really...anything...

Yes it is. (See? I responded the same way you did.)

7: Ok, you are trying to manipulate the meaning of my words. "Odd" meant it is bothering me, sorry that I didn't use a word you felt more in tune with "scummy." So I small FoSed him, gave him a chance to explain his vote, because maybe he had a good case.

So you thought he was scummy, but decided not to attack? If you think you have scum, you just "small FoS", call it odd, wait for a response, and walk away? Dodgeball quote= "Looks like Average Joe's is about to forfeit." "Great strategy here Cot, let's see if it works out for them."

Then, I FoSed because he never made a case. Seems pretty damn reasonable.

No, no, no. I see what you are doing and I'm not going to let you do it. This was a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ISSUE. You "removed" your "small" FoS. It's in the case. Right between the part of 7a that you DID respond to and 7b.

You complain that I didn't vote Darox? BFD. I don't think I am obligated to vote for every scumtell ever.

But when you find someone suspicious, you should vote. That's kind of...well...how you play mafia. Townies vote for who they think is scum and string 'em up. You seemed to be finding Darox suspicious, but hadn't voted him. Do you know what distancing is? I can explain it to you in that Newbie game if you'd like.

No, I didn't avoid the PBPA. I was freaking V/LA.

You were posting.

And NO I definitely did NOT vote Darox when he was our most likely lynch. In fact, I'm pretty damn certain I voted Darox about the time everyone was switching away from him in favor of Destructor.

"Everyone" was switching to Des? Did I miss this?

8: To your "first," so?

Keep reading...

Ok, the rest of this point is a boldfaced lie. I am noticing a pattern. You keep claiming that I am NOT suspicious of people I FoS. Do you know what the S stands for in FoS? I WAS suspicious of Dahill, don't try and claim I wasn't.

THEN WHY NO VOTE? Or at least call him scummy. It's not hard to do. Watch, I'll show you: Hey everyone, I think Isacc is scummy. I'd vote, but I already did that. It's not hard to do. Why the hell do you treat voting like this big scary thing? Vote for scummy players. That's the ONLY way the town can win is if we actually VOTE for who we think is scum.

"Now you are acting like you had previously been calling dahill scum. You weren't. And still no suspicions at this point in the game. On anyone."
-Lie

You called people "ridiculous" or "odd". You didn't vote. You never called anyone scummy. FoS when you aren't voting is useless IMO. I very rarely use it, and if I do, it's because someone else is so blatantly scummy that my vote isn't moving unless something huge happens. Btw, I'm at that point. Oh, and you're doing it again. You say I am lying. Lying is scummy. But I see no expression of suspicion on me from you. Are you gonna FoS me?

"Ok, but it's only important if you take something from it. You really didn't."
-Yep, I did. I took from it that I find Dahill town, and you an idiot.

That's nice. Who did you find scummy at the time? Why weren't you voting them?

9: A vote is used for two purposes in my mind. Number 1, I am comfortable lynching the person. Number 2, I am demanding they address an issue. In all the situations you are referencing, neither of these held true. Therefore, I had no reason for a vote.

It also shows a strong stance on your suspicions. If the person isn't in danger of being lynched, you have no reason to be scared to vote. Well, unless you think six more people are going to jump on and quicklynch before you have a chance to unvote.

10: I wasn't saying that because others did it, it wasn't scummy. You are totally misrepping. I was saying that it was weird that Hascow singled me out. I did not at all say anything like what you are claiming. I do admit the OMGUS was my bad, and it was a common trend in all my games. However, you may note I have (since Hascow and I discussed it) stop assuming anyone voting me is scum.

Hascow called out you specifically. Instead of addressing his point, you pointed to Plum doing the same thing.

Also, a misrep is scummy. You think I'm misrepping you. Are you suspicious of me?

11: That is how I roll. Or how I rolled. Either way, not really a tell unless you fail at meta.

I've never played with you before.

12: I wasn't gonna make him die. But I won't get into why your logic is circular again.

13: Lulz.

It's been discussed enough.

So, your whole case fails.

Your defense to my case fails.

Here's a question. Earlier you "voted me for same reasons as yesterday." Yesterday, your reasons were only my gambit, and today you have a "case." Why wasn't that there yesterday?

Yesterday, my reasons were your gambit and your reaction to my accusations. When I voted today, it was still because of that. The case is there today, and not yesterday, well... because frankly, I had a lot of free time yesterday and I didn't feel I'd shown enough about my suspicions on you.

tags fixed

[Kmd4390]

Well, points stand then. You've been scummy as hell and your defense was retarded. (See? I can do that too.)

[Kmd4390]

(but I think some people have inferred it)

Where?

[Kmd4390]

Maybe it's the meds talking, but I think I'll Buy: Lemonade. I've had town reads from you so far, so I think

letting you live another day

is a good plan. Hopefully I won't regret this once I'm off my meds.

This? Do you die if you don't sell 3 cups of lemonade?

[Kmd4390]

I'm assuming the lemonade keeps Caf alive or he would have just told us it doesn't.

Just to be sure, I'm going to ask this.

Caf, does lemonade give you and extra vote?

(Note that I highly expect the answer to be no. Caf has hinted that he can't tell us specifically what it does, but if he can answer no to this, it confirms that lemonade keeps him alive. If Caf can answer no to this, I will gladly buy lemonade. Also, if at any time we want to lynch Caf, we can just refuse to buy lemonade instead.)

[Kmd4390]

Buy lemonade

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, what is your opinion of EK in this game?

TBH, I don't see what others seem to see. She seems pretty townie to me. I'd much rather lynch Isacc.

What do you think of my case?

Kmd, nevermind. Plum's stupid buying of the lemonade just screwed up where I was going.

Plum, why the fuck did you just buy lemonade when EK, whom you just voted for and for whom you obviously think is scum, is trying to help caf stay alive without some proof that caf is town? Has caf done anything, especially today, that has been protown in any way?

Not buying lemonade is basically a vote to lynch caf.

[Kmd4390]

I've got to catch up this afternoon. Spent all my time in Marathon Day games.

[Kmd4390]

I'm Sorry I didn't get to this game. I'll get to it tonight or tomorrow.

[Kmd4390]

Plum's V/LA noted. Mod is back. And you're getting a deadline.

Deadline: Tuesday, March 24, 12:00 PM EST

If we don't lynch while I'm away, this game will be one of my top priorities when I return.

Ok, so I just read up. And as far as Plum vs. EK, I see Plum as more likely scum, but Isacc above her. So if needed for deadline, I'd switch to Plum over EK.

Also, I find it interesting that not many people have commented on my Isacc case.

[Kmd4390]

EK, post 933 on page 38.

I don't see how you could have missed that though...

[Kmd4390]

Sly, Gambits can be protown.

I had one in Marathon Day that was pretty risky, but pretty awesome. It was 3 player LYLO, and when you play real time, you get a lot of cross posting. So I voted a player in one post and immediately unvoted in the next post. The scum voted thinking it was for the win. Scum caught.

Another one. After a massclaim. A player is replaced. Ask the player who replaces for a claim. If their claim is different than what their predecessor claimed, they are scum.

There are several protown Gambits. The issue I had with Isacc's is that I didn't see it as a Gambit. I saw it as a scum move that didn't work, so he tried to call it a Gambit.

[Kmd4390]

See my sig.

Will catch up next week.

Also see my Isacc case if you haven't already. It's a good read.

[Kmd4390]

I see a deadline in a few days. This will be one of the first games I look at. See my sig.

Unvote

, I remember being very convinced about Isacc, but I see a weak doc claim when skimming. I'd like results if they aren't up already. Be back with content ASAP. Tonight at the earliest.

[Kmd4390]

Ok I'm gonna use the same catch up style I use to replace into games.

Page 42:
Noting Caf said he'd comment on my Isacc case. Wondering if that happened at all.

Page 43:
Sly distracts the town with the discussion about protown Gambits. (I can give a link if you still want it, but I don't see why you need it.)

Ok this is screwed up. Sly asks the town for a link. Plum gives it. That means Plum is defending Isacc?

Imaginality, I have never seen a silencer, but it shouldn't be a town role. I wouldn't rule anything out though.

Isacc seems really sure that his claim will save him. It's possible that he likes a fakeclaim he has prepared.

Des, please explain post 1073 where you say you are "left with" Imaginality, Sly, and Cow. Are you saying one has to be scum? Why? Did you take Darox's flip (he is also in the list) into consideration?

Des shows a good point on Isacc's "Gambit" with the quote where Isacc tells Caf to think more. I guess I can see that. And yes I posted other points. See my case...

Caf, I don't remember any chainsaw defense from Isacc, no. The biggest thing I saw apart from his "Gambit" was the strong connection to Darox.

Caf, when you make your scum list, why do you have Cow in a "mystery position" that you don't know? Can't you take something from Day 1?

Page 44:
Isacc, for Day 1 bussing to a lynch being "terrible" play, see a game I have referenced many times as amazing scum play: Mini 628. LlamaFluff bussed me hard Day 1. Had me as his number 2 suspect all day. Forced a mason claim from his number one suspect. After the claim, he told everyone they should be voting me. I was lynched. Now even better yet, Day 2 he comes out of nowhere with a case no one saw at all Day 2. He gets that lynch. It was our other scumbuddy. We won that game. I never rule out bussing after that game. "I voted for scum" is not a defense IMO. (Not just here. Any time.)

Caf, my Darox vote before the deadline extension was because Isacc wasn't going to be lynched and the other choice, EK, looked townie. When we got the extension, I was back where I started. Voting Isacc. Darox looked better when he posted his thoughts on half the game. But then he flat out refused to give the rest, so that was the nail in his coffin IMO.

Sly, why shouldn't Cow be reading? A silenced player should be keeping up at the very least. At most, they should be writing out posts and stamping times to post it tomorrow.

Isacc, "bussing is not a scumtell"? Who busses? Town? Also, where you say I was "falling off" the wagon, I revoted you because I thought you were scummier and we had a deadline extension. I'll admit that around the time you mention though, I was thinking Darox looked a little better. I still saw you as a better lynch than him and EK a worse lynch though.

"Would Darox's scumbuddy really need to post an entire PBPA on him, rather than just joining the wagon and voicing basic opinions?"-Isacc. Ok, let's play some WIFOM then. What would scum do? Well. If you are going to bus, bus well. Make it look as townie as possible. FoS early. Don't commit. But when the lynch looks almost unavoidable or the partner is too scummy to even bother keeping around, full out attack. Gain townie points and come back the next day saying "I caught scum." Least that's what I would do.

My argument on you included the early mentions of Darox. You called him scummy and FoS'd him but never really pushed or even voted until it was happening anyway. I still see the connection.

And calling it "elaborate" is taking too much credit. It's not that hard to think, "Yeah I need to look like I'm suspicious of my partner so people think we aren't scum together" and "He's gonna be lynched. I should probably jump on."

Isacc, random question. Are you in college? And if you are, are you a psycology major?

Sly, Caf doesn't have a free pass if we decide to lynch him (which I see no reason to do). He just won't be killed for lack of lemonade sale.

Page 45:
Isacc, how can claiming at L-1 hurt the town if you are a weak doc? Anyway. If your claim is true, Plum is basically cleared.

Sly, what is the case on Caf?

Isacc, confirmed innocents are NOT bad for the town.

Sly, why does Isacc's claim clear anyone right now? The claim itself isn't confirmed. Plum isn't confirmed unless Isacc is. And EK? I don't know how EK could even be confirmed by the claim.

-------------------------------------------------------

So.

I'm torn on whether or not to believe Isacc's claim. But regardless, we are NOT lynching an uncountered claimed doc. Also, we are NOT lynching Plum. EK looks town.

I'd like to look closer at Imaginality. As Caf pointed out, I got bad vibes from him earlier, but didn't really have a case.

Now Caf. The thing with him is he needs 3 people to buy lemonade. Now asscume him town just for a second. If he doesn't get that, he dies. As long as the game continues, we know we have at least one scum who won't help him stay alive. So if our night matches last night, we are down a lynch, 2 NKs, and a silenced player. That means 6 alive and if someone is silenced, only 5 who can post. Caf needs 3 of the 4 other players to keep him alive. If that doesn't happen, the lynch puts us at 3 people going into night. The scum get their kill and the vig or SK gets a kill. If it's SK, we are screwed.

Now all of that is if he is town. If he is scum, he's obviously a good choice. But I don't think he should be kept alive today either way.

Vote caf

[Kmd4390]

Caf, I don't remember any chainsaw defense from Isacc, no. The biggest thing I saw apart from his "Gambit" was the strong connection to Darox.

K, well that just means I still don't see the case on him as ever being that strong.

Well we aren't lynching him today anyway so it doesn't matter much right now.

Caf, when you make your scum list, why do you have Cow in a "mystery position" that you don't know? Can't you take something from Day 1?

yes, I can, but it didn't seem fair to put him on the same list as the other players when I have a day's worth more material on other people. He didn't really seem to fit on the same scale as everyone else. If I had to put him on the scale-of-everyone it would be fairly low (maybe level with you, Kmd). At this point with so many people out of the picture, I might have considered possibly lynching him if he wasn't silenced, but lynching someone who can't defend themselves and/or claim is a crappy idea, imo.

Fair enough. I just wanted to know what you thought about him. He shouldn't be forgotten, but probably shouldn't be lynched today either.

Caf, my Darox vote before the deadline extension was because Isacc wasn't going to be lynched and the other choice, EK, looked townie. When we got the extension, I was back where I started. Voting Isacc. Darox looked better when he posted his thoughts on half the game. But then he flat out refused to give the rest, so that was the nail in his coffin IMO.

That makes a reasonable amount of sense, but it doesn't change the fact that you didn't seem very eager to lynch Darox and were quite happy to get back on someone else's wagon. hmm... What was it about Darox's long post that made him look more town to you? Others found it to be quite a questionable post.

Well I thought Isacc was scummier than Darox. So I had no reason to vote Darox over Isacc outside of the deadline.

The point against Darox was that he wasn't contributing. When I saw him "contribute" with that post, it looked better. After that, he went straight downhill though.

Sly, Caf doesn't have a free pass if we decide to lynch him (which I see no reason to do). He just won't be killed for lack of lemonade sale.

What post is this referring to? It's just that it appears to be saying that there is no reason to lynch me, when later on you vote for me, which is something of a contradiction. Feel free to clarify if this isn't what you were saying.

Sly said we were giving you a free pass. I thought there was no reason to lynch you when I wrote that because there was no case on you and I didn't see anything. But then I later think about your role specifically and it probably hurts the town to keep you alive in a position where you die. So it's not a contradiction. It's a change of stance after further evaluation.

Sly, what is the case on Caf?

Again, what's the point of this if you're just going to vote for me without hearing it?

He voted without a case. I was curious why. I hadn't seen his case yet and I hadn't thought more about your role until I read a post (by Imaginality?) about you being doomed to die and realized it would suck losing because we left you alive.

Now Caf. The thing with him is he needs 3 people to buy lemonade. Now asscume him town just for a second. If he doesn't get that, he dies. As long as the game continues, we know we have at least one scum who won't help him stay alive. So if our night matches last night, we are down a lynch, 2 NKs, and a silenced player. That means 6 alive and if someone is silenced, only 5 who can post. Caf needs 3 of the 4 other players to keep him alive. If that doesn't happen, the lynch puts us at 3 people going into night. The scum get their kill and the vig or SK gets a kill. If it's SK, we are screwed.

Now all of that is if he is town. If he is scum, he's obviously a good choice. But I don't think he should be kept alive today either way.

this reasoning just seems insufficient and reminiscent of the 'policy lynch' on Glork that was bring suggested yesterday. Have I actually been scummy or are you just voting me because of this potential liability in situations with fewer players? As I said at one point before, I think that in the case of not enough people being around to buy lemonade, the mod will 'move the goalposts'

so my death isn't inevitable

. Since I've got the most votes, I may as well add that the mod put something in my role to make me believe that - something along the lines of 'if X happens... who knows'. Heavy paraphrasing obv. The gist of it is that Mirth has clearly considered outcomes such as that one.

Yes, it is similar to Glork's situation in a few ways.

I'm voting you mostly because of your role, but partially because my top choice for most of the game isn't a good choice anymore and we have a deadline coming up.

To the bolded: What happened to not being able to tell us that?

I think I'm still fine with this vote. I don't like the other popular options and I don't have a case on Imaginality.

[Kmd4390]

Well at least you could confirm it for us. That pretty much backs my thoughts for why we shouldn't leave you alive.

[Kmd4390]

Imaginality wants to post.

[Kmd4390]

EK, honestly no idea if I'm your lover or not. =/

[Kmd4390]

It is very important to me zat imaginality, Sly and Kmd tell os who zey tink is caf's schombuddy. I beeleeve it vil give us moch informashon regardless of vich vay he flips.

Imaginality and Hascow are the most likely partners IMO.

Korrently, off top of my head, am finkingk Plom in parrticular and Glork-now-you perrhaps could fit as scumbuddiez for caf19, yes?

Plum is town unless Isacc is lying. If Plum is scum, so is Isacc. Unless Isacc is running another Gambit.

Caf, IF you are town, you hurt us TOMORROW just by being alive. If you are scum, you are an even better lynch.

[Kmd4390]

I would like to know what everyone thinks about the following things...

1. How many scum do you think are left?
2. Which is more likely amongst us, a serial killer or a protown vig that had unfortunate aim on night 1?
3. Is a mass claim a good idea at this point in the game?

0-1 mafia, 1 possible SK. We've had 3 anti-town roles flip. More than likely only one left.

Could be either. If I had to guess, I'd say SK.

No.

[Kmd4390]

We've had 3 anti-town roles flip.

All but 2 names that have flipped are blue. What are you referring to?

Caf was a survivor.

[Kmd4390]

I am certain that Plom, haz and kmd are all postink around ze site. Vy are joo not postink here?

This is one of my games I've fallen behind on. I had no access for a week while I was in 13 games and still haven't completely been able to keep up with everything. I'll get to it eventually.

[Kmd4390]

Why would you guess SK over protown vig?

The EK kill could have come from either side. A vig who suspected EK or an SK thinking who knows what or even an SK planning to claim vig. Night 1 could go either way too. So like I said, just a guess and I honestly don't think it matters yet. We are most likely only looking for one more scum whether it be mafia or SK anyway (considering the 2 mafia, 1 survivor, 1 lyncher already dead).

Though, I wouldn't call a Survivor role antitown, just proSurvivor.

But still not town. Neutral role.

I vud like ze claims to happen in an order somzink like this:
imaginality
Kmd
Hazcow
Sly
me
Plom

If we are claiming, I'd prefer to see you claim before Sly.

So, vun scum or vun SK (most likely). Vun scum

and

vun SK zeems like too much (I am azzumink eifen bastard mod games are balanced, yes?).

I agree with this. One or the other, not both.

Historically, I have been a terrible mafia player. My role in this game allowed me to play my usual game on day 1 because I knew Sasquatch was highly unlikely to be taken down

so soon

. Being my usual self lead to me to being able to prove I was telling the truth about the nature of my role, twice.

Bolding is mine. Does this mean you aren't invincible?

Zere is von thing I am interezted in knowink

from everyvon:

Vud joo be willink to allow Plom to decide vezzer she shood claim at her own dizcreshon?

Considering Isacc confirmed her, she should only claim if she has info for us. Keep the scum guessing in case of a mislynch.

I do not believe that anyone should be exempt from claiming without a good reason, and you saying that she shouldn't claim isn't a good reason.

Interesting stance. Plum is 98% confirmed.

[Kmd4390]

Sorry, I still need to catch up a little. I see it's my turn to claim though. I'm a cop. I know this is weird because we already had a cop flip. But anyway, I had a guilty on Isacc N1 and another guilty on Imaginality N2. Isacc's flip shows that I'm either insane or paranoid, so I didn't push Imaginality anywhere near as hard as I pushed Isacc. I didn't claim the guilty, because, well it's just not how I roll. See Farside's Family Guy mini (I can find the link if anyone wants it). I had a guilty on Rock and instead of claiming it, I pushed his lynch as I would normally.

I believe Hascow is up next.

[Kmd4390]

Oh, and I also need to find out who has lawn gnomes. You guys probably figured that by now though. Each night, I can check someone for a gnome. Checked EK N1 and Plum N2. Neither had a gnome. I assume it's a wild goose chase.

[Kmd4390]

Cop and member of the Gnome Liberation Front.

[Kmd4390]

Plum, I never even considered that about gnomes, but you may be right. I'm going to treat it as a RB from now on.

Des's rejecting the system thing sounds more anti-town than protown. It's very possible that he's SK making kills a vig would make to set up the vig claim.

Imaginality, how did you find the information on this Alexander Pichushkin guy.

imaginality, vy on earth vud

anyvon

bredcrom SK?

I can see him doing it and not expecting anyone will find the information.

The way I see it, we have one of two scenarios:
A) Imaginality somehow found all of this information and his findings along with the chess board are incriminating evidence that Des fakeclaimed a character.
B) Imaginality is lying about the chess board.

So basically, Des or Imaginality is probably scum, if not both. I'd like to hear why Imaginality knows about this chess guy before I make a decision.

[Kmd4390]

Ze way I am seeink things:
imaginiality is town - he is havink sanity issues or ze items he receives are misleedink or random (bastard mod)

Night 1's results didn't seem misleading.

I haf been ponderink about ze posibilities. I am actually takink imaginality's presentashon of ze results as slight town tells at ze momont.

If Imaginality is town, he is telling the truth about the chess board. If that's the case, explain your connection to chess.

Plum, EK was scum. Unless one of us RB's without knowing it, we can be pretty sure she was lying about it.

Or I roleblock when I look for gnomes...

Honestly leaning Des as scum over Imaginality.

Vote Destructor

[Kmd4390]

Do you think that it's still possible no member of the Mafia remains?

I think we are looking for

either

mafia or SK. One or the other. Not both. So yes, it's possible there is no mafia left.

That being said, I agree with you about imaginality being mafia or Des being SK. Either imaginality is mafia who made up the whole chess thing OR des is SK who imaginality caught.

I find it unlikely that imaginality, as scum, would make up something so elaborate like that. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my opinion. That's why my vote is on Des. I think he is SK and the last anti-town role left in the game.

[Kmd4390]

I haf not been scum in any of my games on zis site so far - about 10

ozzer

games I zink, all games completed

azide from zis one

. (Only 5% chanz of me not havink been scum yet in 10 games. Vhat haf mods got against me? lol)

10 games or 10

other

games?

And what do you mean by "aside from this one"?

Did you just scum claim?

----------------------------------------------

Sly, look closer at your role PM for a minute. Does it say how you became a sasquatch? Were you born as one or what?

[Kmd4390]

Sly, look closer at your role PM for a minute. Does it say how you became a sasquatch? Were you born as one or what?

My role PM does not have any reference to a metamorphosis of any kind taking place for me to become a sasquatch. My pm has shades of discussion about aging but not of creation. I assume that since I am a Sasquatch, I was born a Sasquatch.

When it mentions aging, does it hint at any possibility of other Sasquatches or anything like that?

(Sorry if I'm confusing you. I'm probably more confused than you are right now.)

[Kmd4390]

My bad. I misread. Thought you said you'd been scum in 10 games, not played 10 games.

Sly, last question. Did you target me with anything during the day today?

[Kmd4390]

Sly, last question. Did you target me with anything during the day today?

No. I have not targeted you with anything during this game.

Interesting..

Well. I've said this much. I should claim this.

I will be alive at endgame. Guaranteed. I'm just, you know, powerful. Like, if anyone ever wants me dead, let's just say good luck to you.

I was informed of this during the day, not night. Not sure why it happened, but it did. Maybe as Sly ages, his powers go to me for some reason? Not sure why me though. I have no connetion to Sly other than this. And this morning, I was only human.

Anyway, we should be lynching Des now. I think that will win the game for us.

[Kmd4390]

Kmd, a question. Why did you choose to search EK for gnomes Night 1 and search me Night 2?

No specific reason. I thought I was just looking for gnomes. I didn't have any clue where to look other than not caf because I questioned him about his role.

[Kmd4390]

I was informed of this during the day, not night.

Did this information you received specify that this was the result of an action made by another player that had targeted you?

No. I was just informed that I had gained the power. I have no idea where it came from. I assume it came from you somehow though.

[Kmd4390]

April 13th at about 2 PM.

Going to bed. Will respond where necessary tomorrow.

[Kmd4390]

No. I was just informed that I had gained the power.

Did you receive this news at the beginning of the day today?

No.

Kveschons:
1. Vy didn't you claim it then?
2. Can anyvon conceev this as beink ze result of anythink other than a day actshon?
3. Who tinks Kmd is fake-claimink schomz? *puts hand up*

1. Didn't see a reason to.
2. No idea.
3. Wanna test it? I won't die. Ever.

Whatever. Let's prove my invincibility and then lynch Des, k?

Unvote Des, Vote Kmd

Let's get this over with and then get back to the game.

[Kmd4390]

Was that a hammer?

Do I get a cool 'not lynched' scene like Sly did?

That doesn't end the day by the way.

[Kmd4390]

Do I get a cool 'not lynched' scene like Sly did?

It would be very unlike Mirth if you didn't.

Wonder what kind of flavor I'll get.

I hope I get to be bored in the noose or something.

Maybe I'll fall asleep and you'll all think I'm dead and I'll walk in somewhere later. That would be fun.

[Kmd4390]

Hmm. So I CAN bleed. Can't die though. Thanks for the scene Mirth.

Vote Destructor

[Kmd4390]

Des is SK or Imaginality is scum. It's as simple as that.

[Kmd4390]

Alo,
salut,
sunt eu,
un haiduc

si te rog,
iubirea mea,
primeste fericirea.

Alo, alo,
sunt eu,
Picasso

ti-am
dat beep
si sunt
voinic
Dar sa stii,
nu-ti cer
nimic

Hi.

[Kmd4390]

Des, if I was scum, I'd be guaranteed a win. That's unfair.

I can not die. At all. I will be here to decide on our last lynch. I will be here for the remainder of this game. All of it.

Ok.

Picture Chuck Norris. Picture him losing in a fight. I'm the guy who beat him.

Really. I can't be lynched. I can't be NK'd. I can't be daykilled. Hell, I even wonder if I could be modkilled. Ok, I could probably be modkilled, but that's about it.

Now stop fishing to see if you can kill your biggest threat if you make it to tonight.

[Kmd4390]

Des, if I was scum, I'd be guaranteed a win. That's unfair.

Vich is vhy we need to consider joo as unlynchobel bot possibly nightkillobel schomz. Soch a schomz is entirely conceevobel in a bastard mod game.

Vhat vos the flavor that came along vith joo invulnerability?

Even with the chance of the other killing role being dead and scum guaranteeing a win? Not possible.

Flavor was basically that I started getting a lot of hair and then suddenly became a beast. I thought I was an alpaca, but I was still shaped like a human, but bigger. And my feet were massive. Was told that I was insanely powerful and wouldn't be able to die anymore. Wasn't told why.

I was just wondering if your role was an evolving role like kmd's apparently is.

Wait, you think it's part of MY role?

I am trying to get a grip on a few things right now but everything I grab for seems to be covered with grease.

That's what SHE said.

If you can't die ever, doesn't that guarantee you a win no matter what your alignment is?

Not jester.

I assume I can be endgamed.

kmd, are you a Sasquatch?

Sort of a weresasquatch or something. I don't know. Something cool and powerful. Basically, yes.

[Kmd4390]

kmd, are you a Sasquatch?

Sort of a weresasquatch or something. I don't know. Something cool and powerful. Basically, yes.

Let me clear this cloud of vague out of the way that I just ran into and rephrase my question much more specifically. kmd, is your role title "Sasquatch"?

No.

My role title is Member of the lawn gnome liberation group or something.

[Kmd4390]

Sly, if you made me a sasquatch, ignore this post. If you didn't, say you didn't.

Trying to confirm this like I did with Caf earlier.

[Kmd4390]

If we leave Des alive (and NOW with this possibility my brain is frying again) attempting to NK him is an idea with merits.

Exactly what he wants if he is SK.

He kills me.

4 left.

Sly possibly dies from aging.

3 left.

Now it's you, him, and Imaginality in LYLO. All he needs is for you to vote Imaginality and he wins.

[Kmd4390]

Not that the kill would work though. XD

[Kmd4390]

But still.

If we leave both Des and Imaginality alive for LYLO, that's disastrous for the town.

[Kmd4390]

Hi imaginality.

[Kmd4390]

imaginality, I think if there is scum and SK left, it would be more important to lynch mafia today. Your opposite reasoning concerns me.

Actually, there is no difference. 1 anti-town role who can kill. That's what both are if both exist.

imaginality, do joo not tink that Kmd could be schomz?
If he is schomz and unlynchobel, how can ze town vin?

I'm town and invincible, not just unlynchable. I can't die. Period.

Imaginality wants to post I think.

Why is Des still alive?

[Kmd4390]

Sly, explain how Imaginality and Des can both me town? I don't see it. Either Imaginality lied about the chess board (why would he as town?) or Des lied about something role-related (why would he as town?).

[Kmd4390]

Hi.

[Kmd4390]

Yes, Imaginality. I blocked you.

And I believe I can be lynched now if needed. Maybe because of Sly's death somehow? I was told I lost my abilities though.

And I got a guilty on Cow last night. Surprise, surprise...

Plum is confirmed town, so Imaginality pretty much has to be scum. Des was SK though, so it seems that he was telling the truth about the chess board. He could be a scum theif. Scum want SKs dead just as much as town.

Speculation aside, Imaginality has to be scum becuase Plum is confirmed.

Vote Imaginality

Looks like it's gonna be Plum's decision that wins or loses this game.

[Kmd4390]

Smurf.

Unvote

[Kmd4390]

Why were you able to post immediately after your singing post?

[Kmd4390]

How can Plum possibly be scum? She was protected by a weak doc.

[Kmd4390]

I'm starting to hate bastard games now.

Either a weak doc protected scum and lived or scum was roleblocked and performed the kill.

Maybe biting is a RB and Imaginality bit me allowing the kill to happen? Or maybe Isacc was blocked by one of you when he protected Plum?

Is it possible for Imaginality to have a role where he is untargetable at night?

This sucks....

[Kmd4390]

Imaginality, you are right on all of that.

This really is a bastard game, isn't it...

My result:

And I got a guilty on Cow last night. Surprise, surprise...

Assumed Plum would be killed as confirmed. Already checked Imaginality, so that left cow.

[Kmd4390]

Oh. Cow flipped cop:

hasdgfas[/b]

CoheedCambria09

- SlySly, Cop,

Friendmaker

Choked on Molly Ringwald, Night 3

so, it is my turn to claim, I believe.

I am SlySly, Mirth's Best Friend.
Each night I get to investigate someone. Night 1 I got that Isaac kills kittens and Night 2 I found out that kittens love imaginality.

Opposite results on Isacc and Imaginality. Could that be a

real

guilty on Imaginality?

[Kmd4390]

We need Plum's input ASAP btw.