I suggest you folx look for the people who are posting what looks like content but is really just avoiding wagons at all costs. I usually find scum there. I’ll do a proper catchup asasp
okay but what are your teammates saying about this game
In post 517, HighPrincessErinys wrote:
This one believes it has an understanding of how Porkens and Fate play now, and that's "silly". Neither seems to be a very high-content poster or much of ones to elaborate on why they do the things they do, but this one was still figuring that out. Fate was ESPECIALLY doing nothing, so it threw a vote onto them that went nowhere of use as they didn't really stir from it. It went back to you as it realized that Fate and Porkens just Play Like That and that trying to strongly scumread them for it is just... eh. Which is why this one asks: Do you often try to elim people based on their playstyle? Because your choices of vote on me/Porkens/Fate really gives the impression you do, unless you don't? Because if you don't then it's low-hanging fruit to try and get the low-contents who are always low-content.
fate is very much doing things and imo it's uncharitable to describe him as not - you might not like it or find it hard to read into but he's said stuff (towny stuff imo)
i think you shouldn't make assumptions about people play just based on the game you're in - porkens can often be low-effort, but he's more than capable of producing substance as town (note: his early posts in that game had him using chatGPT as a gimmick, he drops it at iso #13 so skip there), and the fact that he hasn't done so here and seemingly hasn't read the game despite having multiple teammates who could help him, is legitimately scummy
i also think if you're going to chalk things up to a clash of playstyles, why can't you assume it would be town vs town and they're misreading you due to not understanding how you play? not every push
has
to have malicious intent. i think wgeurts legitimately believes their whole iso-dive case trying to bury you, the way they talk about it feels like genuine belief over
Cat Scratch Fever is a townie. This is a meta read, and meta reads tend to be annoying if you don't know the person, but it is what it is. she's much moe low-effort/low investment as scum
wgeurts is town because there's legitimate conviction in their highprincesserinys push, annoyance at porkens doing nothing, even starting to get irritated with me for not doing anything with my vote. they're someone who is very clearly trying to solve the game.
Fate is town because i don't think he fakes derping on the setup like that as scum and cuz i think he believes thstuff he's pushing on
Adorable also probably town for earnestness but i have a weak spot for players who sound earnest. there's a little more uncertainty here because she's been playing a bit reserved but i think her recent posts come across as fairly plausible explanations for her reads
radical rat mostly looks the part of a townie with how they've been going about things, their vote on me is silly but i don't think it's scum-motivated
cerb idfk he hasn't done anything but is kind of yolo town. him accusing hpe of beetlejuicing felt a lil opportunistic maybe but it might be one of those cases where i'd expect a player to try to project towniness a little more as scum. i'm content to give him a pass for today and let him cook i guess
i want to ponder hpe here but my gut is kind of telling me they're town still and jingle's defense of it just looks like it's coming from an informed to my eyes
jingle i just think is kind of scum because his case on me stinks, his perspective has been frozen in amber since page 4, it doesn't feel like he's truly attempting to evaluate or analyze anything people say, he just has a perspective he wants to push which is me/wgeurts being scum, regardless of how much sense it makes
porkens is prolly just scum cuz he's frozen and not playing the game
In post 547, petapan wrote:
open chatgpt: viewtopic.php?t=90462 (again he's gimmicking for 13 posts or so, keep scrolling down and you'll see where he stops using chatgpt to write responses)
weird dreams mafia: viewtopic.php?t=90611 (it's a replace in, but, like, that game had a similarish number of posts to where this one is at now)
like he can be lazy and low effort at times but all available evidence from what i've seen is that as town he is capable of actually trying but as scum he barely cares
Got around to double checking some of his meta. He's capable of doing more as both alignments than he has shown here, but he does strike me as someone who needs more time to fake analysis / reads as scum:
In post 614, RadiantCowbells wrote:
The major thing I was basing Porkens off of was oh gamma is voting there and vice versa so probably town right
then I remembered gamma bussed everyone on his scumteam in my game and that porkens iso is still pretty awful
so maybe that's just the third and this game is really easy and we can all go home and drink wine
i promise I will start actually playing this game tomorrow.
please don't lynch me in the next 24 hours. I will read and post actual things
***
As scum, there's a general pattern of saying "I haven't been reading the game seriously yet" as an excuse for not having more serious thoughts or for having underdeveloped reads early in the game.
***
I don't doubt that he's busy when he wrote these posts, but playing scum requires more time to think about the game & that seems to be true for Porkens.
The same kind of posting is present this game too:
Spoiler:
In post 152, Porkens wrote:
Jeeze Louise of course just gut I haven’t read the game
The game was only on page 7 at this point lol - how long does it take to read the game?
In post 286, Porkens wrote:
Cause I gut your town and I haven’t read enough to c
Can you for once actually comment on the game, actually give thoughts on what's happening, instead of being obnoxious?
Soon. How am I being obnoxious?
In post 159, wgeurts wrote:
Gonna sleep now as my first wall of text in years has drained me. I do want to note, not providing any insight as to where you stand and not committing to anything is not a playstyle difference.
Tell me who you like most, tell me who you lije least. I don't care about questions posed if you never follow up.
I didn't want to include this in the spoiler, because I think it's a good example of what I'm trying to express here. This interaction seemed like a bad dodge when asked a basic question of "who do you like / dislike" - that's the kind of question that really should not take that much time or consideration to answer.
---
He doesn't do this as town because all he has to do is post his genuine thoughts. It's hard to quote the absence of something, but here are some town games I looked at:
As a bonus, Porkens' vote in 163 also looks worse if HPE and wgeurts are indeed both town, which is kinda where I'm at.
VOTE: Porkens
So about half of the reason I didn't want to weigh in on this is that these two cases are like... the same case. CSF put more effort in and it's an overall sexier case, but the fact that no one has made this connection is just weird af to me.
Also I haven't wanted to actually metadive porken's activity to check for reasons he might be more busy than normal, counterexamples to preclude cherry picking, teammates and their likely impact, etc. But that's cause that's like the most tedious part of mafia, even moreso than exhaustive buddy analysis.
This is a true statement that answered the question of what peta and CSF are doing and why for me, they both find the same meta tell on Porkens compelling.
Okay so. I disagree with your assertion that wgeurts case is entirely because HPE is wrong on wgeurts. The case is about the progressions more so than the end results. I do agree that some of the content wgeurts presents is a stretch and certainly an overattribution of scum manipulation that is likely present if HPE is scum - as you said, it doesn't strike me as a mastermind.
All that said, overall I place the most weight on trajectory and timing, and that's the crux of the peta situation, which is actually more the center of the case than wgeurts themselves is. Again, this is without reading context and skimming, and the noted misunderstanding due to pronoun usage makes me concerned some of that misunderstanding is being reflected here - but if not, this is what makes the case plauible to me - HPE swapped it's read on Peta at a time that allowed for a momentum shift to occur against Peta, without giving a compelling reason for doing so.
Now, I need to actually go back and look at the timings to see if that was actually what wgeurts was saying, but it seemed like it was being implied? Overall, that's what I got out of the whole thing as the reasonable argument for HPE scum that remains.
Which is to say, for anyone who has been paying attention, HPE is still not part of the 1.5 slots I would object to limming today.
In post 677, Cerberus v666 wrote:
HPE swapped it's read on Peta at a time that allowed for a momentum shift to occur against Peta, without giving a compelling reason for doing so.
For context, HPE swapped to peta after I posted a case about peta. I am more interested in your take on the reactions to the case than the case itself though. Specifically, peta's response to wgeurts' case. wgeurts thinks that the reaction is natural because they were previously mindmeldy but I wanted to know if you agreed with that takeaway.
In post 677, Cerberus v666 wrote:
Which is to say, for anyone who has been paying attention, HPE is still not part of the 1.5 slots I would object to limming today.
I feel like I've been paying attention but I still am not sure who the 1.5 is referencing. Yourself presumably and wgeurts based on 369?
I guess Coachella got the better of Cerb once again, and we'll find out tomorrow
I did get towny feelings from his posting just now. His thoughts felt unfiltered, as if he was posting his real reaction to posts as he read them & I think he was trying to understand my read on Porkens and the thinking behind it
Eh fair, I assume it's technically 2.5 if you include myself. Jingle is the .5, wgeurts is the 1(as the only person who I explicitly said I was not interested in limming today). Perhaps it will help you all recognize this when I state that on D1, nothing is going to have more than a lean in either direction - so generally saying something is any amount more town than scum or vice versa is the equivalent of voting for someone or declaring them conftown, as far as interpreting strength of reads is concerned.
Wgeurts, you should know that, so I am a little curious why you are keeping up the pretext that I haven't expressed strong stances on anyone, when I've expressed enough that you, at least, should be able to pick.up what I've been putting down...which is that everyone else is not town enough to for me to fight for at this moment.
Also this post comes to you from a set by the band "Los Bitchos", they're pretty cool.
Jingle, remember how I said that the way to judge wgeurts is on the consistency and progression of the cases they make? Taken in that light, what impact does the wgeurts push on HPE have on your read of wgeurts?
In post 649, Radical Rat wrote:
It's mostly because of the early wgeurts defense still. Since then you've looked plausibly town, but so far that's the only moment in this game I can point to as someone actively doing something scummy, whereas everyone else in my lim pool just hasn't been doing Townie things.
As for my team, honestly we haven't been discussing as thoroughly or frequently as we probably should be, but early on Klick said you were pinging him as well, and then Bella's recently said you look Town to her.
Did you catch my thoughts wrt CSF's push on cerb being probtown?
No, I didn't see that one, point me to it?
Maybe the real Mafia was the friends we made along the way
In post 606, Cat Scratch Fever wrote:
Agree that post was kinda weak but the feeling didn't improve after this even though he was mostly talking at me
Yeah, I completely get where you're coming from. cerbs has just kinda been around fmpov, which isn't particularly surprising. There are bits I've liked, and bits I haven't, but nothing to really push my read far in either direction. tbh, I haven't put a lot of time or effort into solving him today. Koba still hasn't seen the discord message about wanting to know what was liked, but I'll let you know when that changes.
I am vaguely interested in the fact that this wagon only showed up while cerbs was V/LA and I think that says you and Adorable probably aren't cerb partners. Scum don't tend to bus their buddy when they can't defend themselves if they'll presumably be better able to defend themselves later. It also makes me feel a bit better about both of you that you don't give a shit about the optics of voting someone right after they dip like that too in a general sense.
Ehhh, if anything I'd expect scum to be more likely to bus a missing partner than an active one. I've had to do it before, though I might be more inclined to wait on a proper V/LA...
Maybe the real Mafia was the friends we made along the way
In post 683, Cerberus v666 wrote:
Jingle, remember how I said that the way to judge wgeurts is on the consistency and progression of the cases they make? Taken in that light, what impact does the wgeurts push on HPE have on your read of wgeurts?
Mobile so snip quoting is too much effort, but I’m assuming 233 is what you’re referring to here.
Very little. First, because wgeurts doesn’t really seem to have a progression there. It appears to be HPE is scum -> event -> HPE is scum. There hasn’t been significant change and a death tunnel isn’t the towny sort of consistency. It’s the NAI sort of consistency. Second because I think the metric I’ve been using to read wgeurts (whether they would actually think the things they say they think) is a fine metric by which to read wgeurts. I haven’t been attempting to read their slot by their belief in the push on HPE but rather on their reactions to other people. I’ve spent a lot more time on whether wgeurts believes peta believes the case than my actual argument against the case, because to me the case itself is like a tertiary concern at best.
In post 689, Jingle wrote:
Sorry, I was mostly talking about the very end of the post, RR.
The optics thing? I don't know. I see people push absentee slots often enough that I don't think it would actually be a problem for scum, though I can see it being something scum worries about regardless.
I don't think I know CSF well enough to try to get in her head about it.
Maybe the real Mafia was the friends we made along the way
In post 682, Cerberus v666 wrote:
Eh fair, I assume it's technically 2.5 if you include myself. Jingle is the .5, wgeurts is the 1(as the only person who I explicitly said I was not interested in limming today). Perhaps it will help you all recognize this when I state that on D1, nothing is going to have more than a lean in either direction - so generally saying something is any amount more town than scum or vice versa is the equivalent of voting for someone or declaring them conftown, as far as interpreting strength of reads is concerned.
Wgeurts, you should know that, so I am a little curious why you are keeping up the pretext that I haven't expressed strong stances on anyone, when I've expressed enough that you, at least, should be able to pick.up what I've been putting down...which is that everyone else is not town enough to for me to fight for at this moment.
Also this post comes to you from a set by the band "Los Bitchos", they're pretty cool.
Are you ranking players by numbers from town to not town? I was having a hard time following on what you were saying on this post.
In post 682, Cerberus v666 wrote:
Eh fair, I assume it's technically 2.5 if you include myself. Jingle is the .5, wgeurts is the 1(as the only person who I explicitly said I was not interested in limming today). Perhaps it will help you all recognize this when I state that on D1, nothing is going to have more than a lean in either direction - so generally saying something is any amount more town than scum or vice versa is the equivalent of voting for someone or declaring them conftown, as far as interpreting strength of reads is concerned.
Wgeurts, you should know that, so I am a little curious why you are keeping up the pretext that I haven't expressed strong stances on anyone, when I've expressed enough that you, at least, should be able to pick.up what I've been putting down...which is that everyone else is not town enough to for me to fight for at this moment.
Also this post comes to you from a set by the band "Los Bitchos", they're pretty cool.
Are you ranking players by numbers from town to not town? I was having a hard time following on what you were saying on this post.
What did Staeg say?