Mini 687 - Time Abuse Mafia (Game Over in Epic Fashion)

[Vi]

random vote:Vi

If it weren't for the fact that one person here habitually votes the mod and another one votes himself, I'd expect a ton more of these to come my way (pseudorandomly, of course...) Perhaps I still should

Anyway,

Vote: JDodge

for reasons that should be manifest by now.

[Vi]

You need to be lynched for many many reasons.

Vote: Scattered

You feel lucky, I take it

I see no reason to deny Scattered's claim due to its timing, minus the physical implications of blowing yourself up in a small laboratory room and only expecting one other person to be killed.

I would be remiss if I didn't link to this right now.

[Vi]

I would agree with Komrade Zakari, but then I would have to be Komrade Wi after applying the akksent, and that would be rather Wi-erd.

----

I now see a problem with Scattered's claim, and it's Post 23. To my understanding, the Night Actions basically don't happen until a Time Dilation Device is used. Therefore, blowing up someone who hasn't actually done anything to you yet seems strange.

And something else.

Reasons I am claiming:

2) So Scum don't NK me, unless they believe I am bluffing

Uhh... what? 'Splain that one.

----

Hey, melikefood. 'Mind contributing something that doesn't require me to believe in occult divination?

[Vi]

Guys, read all my damn posts, I've explained perfectly logically why having a time dilation device would make no sense for my role. There isn't much more I can say on the matter.

'Hope that's not in response to me; I don't see where you'd need one with your role as claimed.

Are you really asking why scum won't NK someone who blows up anyone who targets them at night?

No, I'm asking why you don't want to be NKd by them when

getting NKd kills a scum

.

@Netlava and melikefood: Okay, voting by dice is seriously retarded.

[Vi]

Are you really asking why scum won't NK someone who blows up anyone who targets them at night?

No, I'm asking why you don't want to be NKd by them when

getting NKd kills a scum

.

Ah ok. The reason was that scum aren't the only ones who have abilities, and it would put the town in a bad situation if I got targeted by a town aligned player.

Nonono. I'm not talking about adverse side effects of getting targeted by a Town player. I'm talking about how you specifically said you do not want to be hit by scum. massive difference.

'Twould be nice if some more people commented here.

[Vi]

That... was somewhat unnecessary. But enlightening nonetheless; I like having confirmed Townies/Roles that could possibly come back to life later~

I don't think there would be much harm in giving an analysis of all the possibilities for the future at this point, just for practice and an idea of how this game could play out.

Timeline A (present): Scattered and Zakeri are dead.
Alternative 1:

If

someone targeted Scattered N0, then Zakeri would be alive (and confirmed Loyal!) in exchange for someone else's death; either a role or a scum.
Alternative 2:

If

Zakeri was the N0 kill, then Scattered would be alive (and confirmed Loyal, plus the rest of his role!).

@Netlava and

tacobell

RossWilliam: Hellooooooo... anyone there?

[Vi]

Hmm... I didn't think of that, and I'm sure there are one or two other possibilities still unaccounted for. I thought it would be simple with just one action early on, but I can only see it getting more icky and complicated from here (especially when we get into multiple unconfirmed actions later), so the serious analysis stuff should wait until we learn more about the setup.

forbiddanlight, do you understand why Scattered chose to asplode with Zakeri? Do you think that was the best option under the circumstances?

[Vi]

The KGB was the USSR's secret police and intelligence agency. That points to a Cop role, although I'm pretty sure information roles weren't liked in the Time Abuse setup.

Ultimately, it doesn't matter unless Zakeri comes back. :v

----

@forbiddanlight: I messed up the question, not to mention who I should have asked.

Take two, and directed at everyone this time: If Scattered had to blow someone up right then, was Zakeri the best option at the time?

[Vi]

Are we

really

still in the random voting stage? <_<;

[Vi]

Are we

really

still in the random voting stage? <_<;

No, only him.

Oh, okay~

Unvote: JDodge
nonRandom Rigged-Dice Logical Vote: Netlava

I believe RossWilliam; he makes sense after thinking about it

[Vi]

Wait, when did this turn into Toadstool Traitor?

Anyway, I'm more for four people taking the plunge. But I'll volunteer to go for it, and if it really does come down to one person I'll fight forbiddanlight for it ^.^

NumberVote: 4, ObjectVote: 6

...er...

NumberVote: A, ObjectVote: Vi

[Vi]

I'm actually wagering that the one person touching it will get something similar to the Lain treatment forbiddanlight knows all about~

Four would be more interesting IMO; many more possibilities. (Parallel timeline, party of four, for example.)

[Vi]

Then with the relative lack of information you've put out as of now, you'd be a great addition if we're going to use those kinds of criteria~

[Vi]

Nyeh, I still wanna be a glory hog by my logic.

I want to be a glory hog by your logic too, which is why I'm not letting you ^.^

[Vi]

I have this nasty feeling that we need to ObjektVote people

other

than ourselves for this to go anywhere...

[Vi]

Oh wow, Doomsday hasn't posted ITT.

@Mod Korporation: Prods, ets.

If I'm reading between the lines correctly in assuming that the people you're choosing were picked because they're the most useless, why Cruciare over Netlava?

[Vi]

What opinions do you have so far?
And you did notice that SSK is out until Friday, right?

[Vi]

Netlava, do you have a meta or role that requires you to make cheesy dice roll comments as your justification for everything, or are you basically here to annoy me?

I'm also assuming you are in agreement with the "useless people touch the objekt" argument. To an extent, I can buy it.

ObjektVote: Netlava

[/catty]

[Vi]

Wow, there are so many possibilities to people putting hands on the objekt.
I hope we're able to do something with it.

Are you posting so you can see your avatar on this page?
If you're going to post, contribute.

[Vi]

I say that since our chances of winning are lower now, standard protocol dictates that we adopt the high risk/reward route.

I would think being more careful would be standard protocol. Two Townies down doesn't make for a five-alarm fire.

[Vi]

How would you say that is scummy?

Active lurking.
Lower content:posts ratio.

[Vi]

@forbiddanlight:

[Vi]

Has it been a week since I got my Ether avi? Because I totally want that shrunk and avi'd for me .

It'll be a week tomorrow
I don't have the original picture, though.

[Vi]

@mod: Must the objekt necessarily be touched at deadline, or can it happen sooner if an option on how many people go for it is chosen ahead of time?

[Vi]

I'm following my gut. The discussion about your avatar while the deadline approaches is suspicious.

I'll point out that the discussion about the avatar is there mostly as filler since there's nothing else of note going on (at least IMO). You're more than welcome to derail us with any more relevant conversation of your own.

As far as voting goes, it will be tough to do today because there's not much that has happened so far to polarize discussions or opinions. I'm pretty sure in the original topic this game was already specified to be vanillaless, so any Town-side loss will be a bigger deal than usual. Scum can stack kills regardless *unless* we hit the person who made the N0 kill, which I think is unlikely. I think/hope this Objekt thing, regardless of what occurs, will make for enough of a division between us that we can get better opinions on who to lynch, because I feel that at this point a lynch would be somewhat arbitrary.

In short, I'm seriously considering No Lynch.

[Vi]

In short, I'm seriously considering No Lynch.

Any thoughts on this, again? Quite honestly, I feel that the lynch today will be based on petty reasons, and the reward of lynching someone will be rather poor versus the risk.

----

His response, though reasonable, loses cred points for what constitutes a "delayed reaction."

Explain this.

I think a lynch is important in our current situation, or at least some sort of pressure for the scum

or else they can do whatever they want at their leisure.

That depends on this objekt, doesn't it?

----

f-light's metaguess about the deadline being pushed back is not cool, especially since the Objekt deadline and the Day deadline are concurrent. Although the convenient way to dodge this speculation would be for us to agree on an Option so the Objekt event can get out of the way and we'd know if the deadline extends or not... If two people jumped on the Option C wagon, either Netlava or qwints would get it as of right now.

----

@melikefood: You

are

playing, right? Toss an accusation around; get someone upset. Prod:

Unvote: Netlava
Vote: melikefood

Also this--

Objekt vote: Vi and forbiddan

knight

[Vi]

Agree with most of this. Except the fact that you call it a meta guess. I'm not using meta, I'm using the fact that EVERY EVENT SO FAR HAS PUSHED THE DEADLINE BACK!

So it's a reasonably grounded metaguess
It's not a guarantee nonetheless, thus I'd like confirmation either way before relying on it.

[Vi]

All right, I'm bored and the deadline isn't exactly going anyplace. I don't support the idea, but I'm considering placing the last vote on Option C, which would result in Netlava and Netlava alone touching the object.

'Any objections?

[Vi]

Mostly from me since

I

want to touch is and have no idea why netlava gets the privelege.

Netlava gets the privilege for "being more useless than you", at least at the time of the initial voting.

But sure, I'm in favor of seeing if this can spur discussion. I'm not going to be here for a bit of a while to see what havoc I've wreaked, but oh well--

ObjektUnvote: Option A
ObjektVote: Option C

[Vi]

Touch:Netlava

o.0
Innuendo aside, the lack of a stated reason to go with it is noted. (Yes, I can infer that you just wanted to get things going, but...)

Depending on an objekt is like depending on an unknown.

It IS depending on an unknown. But discussion is awesome, regardless of what sparks it. And we're about to find out what that discussion will entail, since you're going on a one-way trip to the bold unknown as soon as the mod gets in.

[Vi]

Discussing who touches an objekt when it's pretty much random is pretty useless imo.

Is it random?

[Vi]

Um, I don't know. Results = unknown. I'm assuming scum don't know what happens either.

So reactions will be pretty useless since town and scum would react the same way.

Not necessarily...

----

...aaaaaaaaaaaand it appears I was wrong about the touching happening before the deadline, unless Grandfather Time is getting lethargic in his old age.
Which brings me to the same point I've been harping on for a while now: No Lynch. Yes or no?

[Vi]

Sorry, *ATTEMPTING* to rush us to a lynch. Mine. For weak reasons at that.

You aren't anywhere near a lynch.

With all due respect, neither is anyone else.

If we're going to lynch today, some bandwagoning needs to start happening, soon. I'm not unhappy with my vote, although SSK could use a prod <_<
So if you want us to lynch, 'might as well make clear who you want to have strung up. Are you comfortable with your vote, Netlava?

I'm an attention whore

I'll vouch for this *shot repeatedly*

[Vi]

'Anyone else you want to look at other than the current bandwagon?

[Vi]

This hasn't popped up on my watched games list until now. Sorry.

Yes, but do you have anything to say about what is/n't going on?

Is there something wrong with the current wagon?

No, but you said you would apply Lynch *All* Lurkers and targeted the person who happened to be the current bandwagon.

[Vi]

He could have gotten hammered in the that fifteen minutes....did you want that or no?

Let me ask YOU that same question. I notice your vote's not on anyone.

[Vi]

This hasn't popped up on my watched games list until now. Sorry.

Yes, but do you have anything to say about what is/n't going on?

About LAL?

About whatever the heck it takes to put your views out there.
For instance, why did you pick Netlava to touch the Objekt?

Do you wish me to continue as to why

?

"Yes" is usually a good answer to questions like those. Elaborate.

[Vi]

Posting before pr... oh jeez.
I'll be back after I take some Tylenol.

[Vi]

Hey, don't quicklynch without me.

Anyways, claim: descendant from the tsars. No powers.

I'm not sure I buy it. The previous topic said that this game was vanillaless. In addition, I'd like to ask if you were PMd the other effects of touching the objekt.

Town gets another day to lynch before Night Actions start going online.

Problem.
Tomorrow would be literally do-or-die massclaim time.

D1: 10 alive (9 actually so, perhaps) vs. 3 scum, maybe.
D2: 10 alive (8 actually) vs. 3.
D3, if going through with Netlava lynch: 9 alive (6 actually) vs. 3.
D3 vortex; scum jumps in -> 6 alive vs. 2. LyLo.

That said...

D2: 10 alive (8 actually) vs. 3.
D3, if going through with a mislynch on someone else: 9 alive (6 actually) vs. 3.
D3 vortex, scum jumps in -> 6 alive vs. 2. If Netlava is scum, the game is over.

I'm going to need to reread and see if I want to hammer Netlava. Until then, I'm not sure I like this wagon.

[Vi]

Nyaaaaaaaaaaaaaa--
Apologies for the wait, but I'm having a hard time liking this game. It was a good idea and I'm glad I got to try it out, but it's like living in D1 until LyLo.

----~----

All right, people I'm suspicious of.

pickemgenius - Hasn't contributed much all game. Literally, coasting. But I agree with what he has said.
melikefood - Failure to random vote, totally useless.
RossWilliam - Noncommittal throughout the game until it comes to a Netlava lynch, which he's all for. Reasonably useless.
SSK - Always useless, so it's kind of a crapshoot as to whether he's actually scum or not. But this game, he's certainly playing the part of Mafia.
Natirasha - Call it intuition if you want, but I think you're scum. Your jump onto the Netlava wagon yesterday was without justification, and you don't seem like you have anything at stake here.
forbiddanlight - Clearly waffled on melikefood, but was/is willing to push a Netlava lynch. Hmm.

Netlava - Failure to random vote, continued random voting after everyone else, reasonably useless for a while. Gets better later of his own volition, and starts to look intuitively more Town.
No read on Doomsday/qwints, leaning anti-Town.
Positive read on Cruciare.

--

Natirasha. How was Scattered's role easy to see as a scum-aligned?
In Post 107 you say you'd prefer two people to touch the Objekt, but then in 112 you vote for Doomsday only to touch it. What was your motivation there?

Let's keep that dead person scumhunting and active

and using their role

as long as possible, right?

Um... what?

Netlava. Why the hell are you not voting for anyone?

~~~~~~

Bottom line: I'm not going to hammer Netlava.

Vote: Natirasha

I'm pretty sure every scum is on the Netlava wagon, as rereading they happen to coincide with the people I'm suspicious of. In addition, this would be a terribly easy hammer to make - especially with PEG's entrance - but it hasn't happened. Why not?
RossWilliam is most likely the hitman because he wants the day to drag out for lame reasons. More like you want to jump in and kill two people if things start to go poorly, amirite?

@mod: Prod/replace melikefood and Cruciare.

[Vi]

However, then we all came to the wavelength that "We should vote for scum to touch" and so we did.

?

[Vi]

Do we lynch people for being USELESS, or do we lynch them for being scum? Because right now this looks like a "list of useless people with a couple suspicious peeps thrown in". I don't like it.

The only two legitimately useless people are the first two. The rest are

selectively

useless (that is, generally useless until the Netlava wagon started), which raises eyebrows immediately.

Because Netlava is scum.

Why, in 100 words or fewer?

[Vi]

I'm in too many games and behind in half of them; I'm not intentionally stalling. Will try to get a post in tonight.

[Vi]

I still don't believe Netlava is scum, nor do I believe that the people on his wagon are all or even mostly Town.

However, considering that four of the ten players in this game are inactive, I sense that whether I hammer Netlava or not, the end result will be the same; Town doesn't have a chance until some replacements come in. Until then, I will stay true to what I believe.

[Vi]

I also

know

that Netlava's claim that he can't self-destruct b/c he's town is false.

orly

And the WIFOM begins.

And:
*the tunnel vision continues.
*the scum pushing the obv-doublevoter continues.
Pick one!

[Vi]

*the tunnel vision continues.

By the way, IGMEOY for guarding your scumbuddy.

Doesn't he have to flip scum first?
And why, exactly, do I have a good reason to guard someone who's in optimum bussing position right now?

orly

Um yeah. Everyone should know this, if I'm reading the rules correctly

I suppose I'd have to ask what it was qwints "knew", that he had no time dilation device or that he was scum.
However, Netlava has already claimed vanilla + Objekt (objekt is still undefined). So I highly doubt that qwints "knows" anything.

Last, if Netlava were scum and had an out... wouldn't he have, y'know,

already used it

instead of leaving us here to squabble over whether we should lynch him, given that a lynch would ruin everything he's done scumside?

[Vi]

Doesn't he have to flip scum first?
And why, exactly, do I have a good reason to guard someone who's in optimum bussing position right now?

Because you said that

Oh come now, you know I'm not an evil mastermind until someone hands me the mod hat

Last, if Netlava were scum and had an out... wouldn't he have, y'know, already used it instead of leaving us here to squabble over whether we should lynch him, given that a lynch would ruin everything he's done scumside?

Depends on how things work. There are any number of reasons why he might not want to suicide. And also, you do realize that we are less likely to lynch him if he doesn't do anything since people will think just like you are now.

Mmm, enjoy your backpedaling~

I'd like to wait until Netlava and the two replacements show up before doing anything major, but I'm not sure if we'll have that luxury.

[Vi]

Mmm, enjoy your backpedaling~

Backpedalling? Where? I certainly don't see any. And since you apparently don't believe in examples...

Exmples are not the Soviet way! You listen to authority on pain of death!

*serious modo*

That was a response to the people laying on the heavy pressure OMG LYNCH NETLAVA ASAP NOW NOW NOWASLK;DFK;ADF;CAPSLOCKASDFKJASE... but then I notice that you're the singular person who also added the option of not doing so. So to that end, I misdirected that barb somewhat. I still think you have a good chance of being teh skumzorz.

[Vi]

Speaking of forbiddan, what are your thoughts on forbiddan and rosswilliams.

I noticed that no one has commented on my ultra strong cases. Everyone's thoughts?

Your ultra weak scum cases?

I'm interested in the answer to this question. (Yes, what is your opinion on yourself? Sub qwints in for your own name.)

Ok.

Anyway, you are wrong.

Perhaps about you. But the others on the Netlava wagon?

[Vi]

And now I remember why lynching melikefood was once a popular idea.
f-light, your reluctance to hammer him D1 is duly noted.

[Vi]

Good morning everyone.

I'm not gonna point any fingers because I'm among the offenders, but I think we all need to not let ourself get rushed by the whole vortex thing and think things through. I know that at least I would not be so quick to have voted Netlava in slower circumstances and our hastiness resulted in a mislynch. Let's not be hasty about this and really be methodical with our voting strategies.

Gonna wait for melikefood to explain himself, but I'm leaning towards voting him.

Thanks for making yourself the third member in my fantasy scum dream team.

The part rationalizing that you wouldn't have speedlynched Netlava? Quite the lie. I still dislike your hop onto Netlava D1 (250), and then you hopped on D2

without the pressure of a vortex to push you on

. (292)

Vote: melikefood

As of now, ViLogic suggests a new, new, NEW plan: Quicklynch like hell. Assuming no vorteces appear, Town wins

provided

enough mislynches do not occur such that scum equals Town. As far as I know, Town is

past LyLo

(10 players - 3 nights - 1 lynch = 6 players, hypothetically 3 scum vs. 3 Town) so the next vortex is the end of the game.

Current Players: 9
Scum: 3 maybe
Assuming that number's correct, scum win if we hit population 6. Three shots isn't bad.

This is quite consistent with RossWilliam 318 and SSK 319, btw.

[Vi]

@mod: Please update the second post.

Nine alive, five to lynch - two more remaining! Go, go, go!

[Vi]

I disagree with this proposal for two reasons:

1) Natirasha ALWAYS fakeclaims.
2) If he's lying and we let him Time Dilate, oops and oh well.

If cult has a majority - and they would if Natirasha is telling the truth and offs himself - then they should win instantly if he's telling the truth. It's a WIFOM I'm not willing to take, at least as of the moment.

The fact that you've claimed 4 recruits is suspicious given the fact that you only had 3 nights to do it in.

Go through this thread and count carefully. <_<

I think we have a more vested interest in a...

Vote: MafiaSSK

, because I can only see a roleblocker as a harmful role in a setup like this.

@Natirasha: Why did you cult the people you did?

[Vi]

Vi,
If you're not going to lynch Nat, why not vote for Cruciare? I see no benefit for you in lynching another purported cult recruit.

I don't think Cruciare is scum. I'm aiming for scum. Isn't that what you wanted us to do?~

I see your reasons, Nati, and they're not bad at all. I still have to wonder why I should believe a (however entertaining) claim from a habitual liar.

[Vi]

I see your reasons, Nati, and they're not bad at all. I still have to wonder why I should believe a (however entertaining) claim from a habitual liar.

What do I need to do to convince you of my truth?

Be someone else

Aside from that, tell me who the Mafia are.

[Vi]

I disagree with this proposal for two reasons:

1) Natirasha ALWAYS fakeclaims.

When? I've only seen Nati claim his truthful role.

If you'll forgive me for saying so,

in your own game

.
Read also his wiki entry.

[Vi]

I swear, the next time forbiddanlight looks scummy, I'm making a beeline for her.
This is, what, the third time now; and I have no idea why I didn't try to wagon her this time.

On the plus side, watching communism fall to capitalists and sci-fi dudes is basically epic. We need a TV serial about that, or at least a fanfic.

Winning for a change is also basically epic. Unfortunately, my No Lynch thought turned out to be a Bad Idea in hindsight. I don't even know if letting melikefood quicklynch instead of doing it myself actually meant anything. >.>

[Vi]

I adore this flavor text, btw.

Also to be fair my role was basically worthless the way I played it; I knew fully well none of my protects were worth anything - but protecting more scum than Town is embarrassing

[Vi]

Lord gurgi, I am /pre-inning for all of your games where you will use this epic flavor. Man can I not wait for Parralel universes.

I second this. (pre-in included)

I remember you (or someone) saying that this could become a Large Theme? This concept will work out much more smoothly when there are more than

12

10 players around; with the possibility of a scum m-m-multikill looming and no information being given out until it was basically too late to stop it I could definitely feel the pressure to sort out the group but didn't have much to work with (initially).

Also, apologies/thanks to Natirasha.

[Vi]

Anyway Vi, this would be the second time I've been super scummy and not been lynched as scum. Not the third.

You should have been lynched as Town in that first game anyway (...wait, you were)

Once again I have to wish I had a less-than-upstanding meta so I could do stuff like PEG did to basically own the game. I guess it's not too late to start building it...

I mean, what would have happened if the mafia had nk'd Nat?

Four-person LyLo, I think.