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Post #88 (isolation #1) » Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:02 pm
Postby chamber »
You can(for now).
Shards of Alara (until October 5, 2012)
Conflux (until October 5, 2012)
Alara Reborn (until October 5, 2012)
Magic 2010 (until October 5, 2012)
Zendikar
Worldwake
Rise of the Eldrazi
Magic 2011
Scars of Mirrodin
Mirrodin Besieged
New Phyrexia
Magic 2012
Innistrad
Dark Ascension
Last edited by chamber on Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #263 (isolation #3) » Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:22 pm
Postby chamber »
Wingsplicer seems really mediocre in a limited context untill you consider other soulbound guys you could pair with it (like the 2/1 ophidian pairer). If there are other good abiltiies that increase the relevance of the 1/1 body it could be a sweet role player type card in the limited format.
Like, personally, I will NEVER run a 6 in an aggro deck without an alternative casting cost. At 23 land, you're just not seeing a 6 drop before turn 8, and you want the game to have ended by then.
Draft, if you get a sweet 6, ya run it. Or even 2. In moderately to very aggressive decks.
Meanwhile, ironically, a lot of strong constructed cards drop in value. Watchwolf, for instance, is infinitely better than Selesnya Guildmage... in constructed. In limited, I'd probably take the 2 drop wayyyyy sooner than the Watchwolf, because 3/3s are replaceable, and a 2 drop that matters for the entire game isn't.
So I think he's making a good point, just in a bad way.
But yeah, if you've got 5 3 drop creatures and there's a 4 drop creature that's marginally better than some 3 drop, you take it, because you have something to do on turn 3 anyway.
The strength of a 3 drop is that it can be played with 3 lands or 4 lands. And that at 5 mana you can reasonably play it and a 2 drop. In the case that you are already heavy on three drops and you have the choice between a 3 drop and a 4 drop thats only marginally better without considering cost, in nearly every format ever its going to be better to still take the three drop.
edit: for instance in the current format, if I were drafting a gw aggro deck, already had 5 3 drops and 0 4 drops and I was given the choice between an abby griffen and an orchard spirit, I'm fairly confident its nearly always right to still take the orchard spirit.
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Post #383 (isolation #6) » Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:55 pm
Postby chamber »
In post 379, GreyICE wrote:They're very nearly the same card, vigilance isn't really worth 1 on a 2/2.
If it was a choice between spirit and a Moon Heron in a GU deck, I'd think your choice would probably be influenced by how many 3s and 4s you have.
First I'd wonder why I wanted either of those card in a ug deck in DII, and likely cry at having to take 1. Then I would consider my existing curve yes, I didn't say it was irrelevant. Perhaps the issue here is different understandings of the word marginal in terms of magic. I don't think an extra point of power is marginal. I do think the addition of vigilance and the ability to block fliers does fit the bill.
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Post #431 (isolation #10) » Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:49 pm
Postby chamber »
Just got back from a midnight release. Either my pool was bad or I don't get this format at all. Still not sure which, I'll come back to it in a month and find out.
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Post #468 (isolation #12) » Sun May 06, 2012 7:55 am
Postby chamber »
Im in my league too. You should be playing with the special rules, which will let you abuse your deck for the first week. The first weeks special rule is starting with a basic land in play. To abuse this, you can go 3 color, make sure one of your colors is all spells that only cost 1 of it, and only put the 1 land for it in your deck, always searching it out. It will let you run a 3 color deck but effectviely having a 2 color manabase. Hopefuly this makes things easier on your pool because of its even spread. You will need to change for week 2, but you'll have another pack then.
Last edited by chamber on Sun May 06, 2012 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #1269 (isolation #16) » Thu Oct 18, 2012 8:36 am
Postby chamber »
It is common only. But the card just needs to have been printed as a common at some point, most recent printing doesn't matter (Assuming you are talking about rancor).
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Post #1275 (isolation #17) » Fri Oct 26, 2012 12:12 pm
Postby chamber »
In that deck as it is you can probably get away with as few as 20 lands. Mono white aggro has historically had reach problems (recovering after a wrath or once your opponent just plays bigger dudes) I don't think it can really be fixed without branching into a 2nd color.
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Post #1450 (isolation #18) » Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:26 pm
Postby chamber »
In post 1439, Fate wrote:ok because I can't afford to waste money on pride (not revealing my deck till I make it) because it might suck:
I was thinking Curse of Stalked Prey for a Gruul deck
idea is:
Skaarg Guild leaders give boardwide trample+Curse of stalked prey=snowballthreat fast. Pit fight rapes flyers and Skullcrack laughs at druid's deliverance and shit like that
its not AS fast or aggro as Rakdos, but it provides more stability against bullshit wipes with hexproof (GAMMA GIVE ME YOUR RANGER GUILE)
Also Nightshade Peddler+Ash Zealot=for teh cheap deathtouchfirsttrike LULZ?
NO ONE STEAL MY IDEAZ
its k cause no one will play gruul except me and gamma
Buttons is right here. Curse of Stalked Prey is a very bad card. It only does anything when you are already ahead on the board, has no synergy with other copies of itself, does nothing on its own. And for those disadvantages, it doesn't contribute to your ability to kill your opponent the turn it comes down or significantly increase the difficulty of answering the threats you do have on the board.
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Post #1467 (isolation #19) » Wed Jan 16, 2013 3:58 am
Postby chamber »
In post 1466, Fate wrote:Did my post insulting Reck get deleted? Really?
Still want to know what sTuffy doll its all about
If Reck actually has a stuffy doll list, it probably involves Blasphemous Act. But I mean I'm pretty sure no even close to tier 1 stuffy doll deck exists.
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Post #1500 (isolation #20) » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:01 pm
Postby chamber »
In post 1499, Gammagooey wrote:also a 1G enchantment for delayed get a counter on all your dudes every turn would be super broken, people play cathar's crusade and something that similar for 2 mana would have the shit played out of it with stuff like champion of lambholt or regenerating creatures plus rancor
Might barely be playable. Would not be super broken.
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Post #1512 (isolation #21) » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:07 pm
Postby chamber »
You might want to try goblin rally as another token producer, but given that you are only running 3 increasing devotion, perhaps mass token production isn't a hole in your deck. lingering souls is really good if you dip into black, but would require a better built manabase. Alternatively green gives you gavony township as another way to abuse the number of tokens you generate. Guttersnipe seems like it should be really bad in that deck, and is probably the card that should be replaced first, but having never played with or against a deck like that (and it being in a more casual grounding than I'm used to) some of this advice may be bad, so make sure to test it all yourself.
edit: On more thought entreat the angels also seems really weird in the deck to me. It produces very large tokens that win on their own, which is different from the rest of the decks synergistic approach to abusing mass produced creatures.
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Post #1534 (isolation #22) » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:33 pm
Postby chamber »
In post 1533, GreyICE wrote:Gradual advantages are almost always fair. I have a tough time thinking of a comes-into-play mechanic that was inherently broken except Palinchron (even Worldeater dragon wasn't about what happened when it came into play). Chunking out the game with expensive incremental advantages is usually fun.
Now on-cast mechanics can be absurd. Bloodbraid elf?
Primeval titan, in the context of valakut, had a pretty unfair citp ability, it was really close to just being 'I win the game'.
Edit: I think Planeswalkers kind of ruined that subset of creature that was very powerful, kind of expensive, but did nothing right away. Planeswalkers tend to be comparably difficult to answer, but can all do something the turn they come down. Thats why most creatures these days either cost 1-2 mana, or have some immediate effect on the board in the 3+ spot (be that through haste or a citp ability).
In post 1533, GreyICE wrote:Gradual advantages are almost always fair. I have a tough time thinking of a comes-into-play mechanic that was inherently broken except Palinchron (even Worldeater dragon wasn't about what happened when it came into play). Chunking out the game with expensive incremental advantages is usually fun.
Now on-cast mechanics can be absurd. Bloodbraid elf?
Primeval titan, in the context of valakut, had a pretty unfair citp ability, it was really close to just being 'I win the game'.
Edit: I think Planeswalkers kind of ruined that subset of creature that was very powerful, kind of expensive, but did nothing right away. Planeswalkers tend to be comparably difficult to answer, but can all do something the turn they come down. Thats why most creatures these days either cost 1-2 mana, or have some immediate effect on the board in the 3+ spot (be that through haste or a citp ability).
Fair enough, but 6 mana cards follow different rules, thanks to the 5/6 dichotomy.
Anyway, I don't think the category of 'expensive creatures that take a while to work' was never one that was truly tournament viable. The closest I remember was Akroma, and she was mostly just to seal the game up (and did something when she came down anyway). Other than that, most expensive things have always needed to do things immediately at the tournament level.
It's one of the reasons planeswalkers were made, beyond the marketing/theme. The design space for incremental advantages were artifacts/enchantments, and those really lacked counterplay (playing W/G or W/G/R? No? Have a counter? No? Sucks to be you).
Expensive is a relative term, there always was a point that was too expensive, I think that point has come down considerably over the time I've been playing.
In post 1540, Sudo_Nym wrote:Well, how expensive a card should be to be balanced always depends on the surrounding environment. My main issue with the game is the speed of it- it feels very much like games either end quickly, or stretch to eternity, with little in the way of middle ground.
Well it's also balanced around the math of the game (7 card starting hand, 1 card per turn (yes p/d). With this math, at 24 cards, you can expect to reach ~5 mana on turn 5 without acceleration.
6 mana cards have a higher threshold because 6 mana basically requires acceleration or card draw (resources invested) to come out before around turn 8, and because turn 6-8 is way late. Due to this you'll notice a HUGE threshold between what makes a playable 5 and what makes a playable 6.
I haven't done the math right now (and don't care to) But based in my memory of an article I read on this, 5 drops don't typically hit until turn 6 with 24 mana sources out of a 60 card deck, with 1 draw a turn. (math that's too simplistic has needing 5/24ths your decks mana, which should work out to 12.5 cards proportionally, which is turn 5.5 on the draw, and turn 6.5 on the play
more as I think of them (or remember because there were some I had combos in that I didnt want to ask my opponent)
Here's two for mostly clarification:
1. You can cast instanst between first strike and normal combat damage, Im p. sure? Aka First strike 3/1+Searing Spear to rape a x/6
2. This one needs more in depth explaining: Wild Beastmaster. I read something about "announcing the trigger" what the hell is this about?
Aka:
I want t giant growth my Wild Beast Master. I read that downsize can shit on wild beast master pretyt hard, but in a response post someone else said that "they don't have a lot of window time to downsize wild beast master"
I think this meant that I should be:
1. Casting Giant growth BEFORE I declare that I'm attacking
2. Now my WBM is 4/4, and I say "I'm attacking"
3. Now they can downsize THEN, or not, and if they DO I don't swing with WBM because she'll get blocked and raped.
4. They say "Ok you are attacking, I do nothing"
5. I THEN tap the creatures I Want to attack with, if I tap WBM all my other creatrures get 4/4 and they CANT downsize before that effect takes place (they can do it before combat obv but they can't prevent the +4/+4 counters going out)
Do I have any of that wrong?
The -2-2 wont kill an indestructible hussar patrol with 2 damage on it, its toughness would need to be reduced to 0 or less (-4-4), damage doesn't reduce toughness.
Triggers go on the stack just like spells do. When you announce who you are attacking with (the WBM) there is a window for them to downsize while the WBM trigger is still on the stack. The end result being that your team gets +0+0 because the WBM is a 0/4 when the WBM trigger resolves.
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Post #1579 (isolation #26) » Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:08 pm
Postby chamber »
In post 1576, Nuwen wrote:So Shea, I picked up a door to nothingness from a prize pack tonight.
TELL ME ABOUT THIS OMNIDOOR YOU SPEAK OF
Door is by far the worst card in that deck before considering context. It is straight unplayable in nearly every other format including casual, the deck is named after it because of the absurdity that its playable in the deck. What I'm getting at is that having one shouldn't be a draw to make the deck.
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Post #1639 (isolation #28) » Sat Jan 26, 2013 8:13 am
Postby chamber »
In post 1637, Fate wrote:ALSO they told me I could Pit Fight+Pay 1 red to activate first strike on my creature and when they "fought" my creature had first strike I didnt die
I think I was cheating because it specifically says "deals damage equal to its power to one another" and nothing about actual fighting
They were wrong about this interaction. They would both deal damage to each other. Fighting doesn't consider keywords, just power. With that said, reminder text (the text in italics and brackets) is not rules text. Although its intended to be intuitive and right in most situations, it does at times cut things out in the name of brevity, so using it as anything but a guide is a bad idea.
I predict, without playing it, that its less OP than it seems. I think the way their mechanic plays is just sufficiently different enough from normal magic to catch people off guard. When people learn how to play against it properly it should seem less OP.
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Post #1718 (isolation #32) » Fri Feb 01, 2013 3:46 am
Postby chamber »
Rubblebelt Raiders is probably the worst card in your deck, a couple silvers isn't a bad thing. They don't need to come down on turn 5 to impact the board. RUbblebelt doesn't actually do anything unless you have a lightning mauler basically.
Raiders with hellraisers is a huge threat turn 4 and synergies with my lots of early creatures theme
I don't know how to make the kind of semi-competitive deck you are looking to make. My suggestions would probably involve adding cards like hellrider and Thundermaw Hellkite if you are just looking to make it better. And probably 2 more 1 drops of some nature
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Post #1724 (isolation #34) » Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:40 am
Postby chamber »
In post 1723, Fate wrote:Hellkite's are 5 mana and too high for the curve I want
Hellriders will probably make it in, but I want to use Raiders more and I can't fit two 4 drops. Also Hellrider RR opens up potential to be color screwed (I dont own any stomping grounds yet)
I just want advice for cards that are good with the strategy I proposed. No "well youre in G/R you have to get Huntmaster trololol and Rancor's and XXX"
Huntmaster is more for midgame he isnt a game winner.
Anyway yeah I need more 1 drops thats what I dont have a great knowledge base of. Throw in wasteland vipers? Stromkirk Nobles? What? Vexing Devils?
What spells should I throw in now that I wont have Domri?
Also I like Domri still because I can't think of any decent 3 drops (Beastmaster is pretty niche and Hellraiser seems good, but thats all besides going something else), but if he's not aggro enough I'll take your word. I just like the "draw more into my creature pool that I need to win+Removal fighting"
I also have zero way to get rid of indestructible stuff, any g/r cards that do that, or is that just going to be my weakness?
I'm thinking Gruul Charms and Ground assaults on the SB to deal with heavy flyers, but other than that the only weakness I can see is Predator Ooze and even that I might be able to ignore for two turns or so?
The 3 mana 2/2 that makes all your dudes attack and gives them haste is probably fine, so is that undying has to be blocked by at least 2 creatures guy. There are a plethora of good red 1 drops right now. crackler and stromkirk are the 2 I'd look at first. Beastmaster isn't good at all but it+ pump seemed like the kind of gimickyness a semi-competative deck was looking for.
5 mana spells aren't too slow when they have haste or immediately effect the board in some other way(silver heart), and also help get past stuff like thragtusk (hellrikite flying over top at that point is important, the fact that it still can win the game when your early game gets murdered for w/e reason is also helpful)
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Post #1728 (isolation #35) » Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:14 am
Postby chamber »
Its not actually a weakness. Indestructible creatures aren't exactly common, indestructible blockers even less so. You just trample over the ones that do exist.
Thats not really an alternate win con, at least not in an effective sense. They both require you to augment a creature and attack with it, which means they are both largely disrupted by the same things, but they don't work towards the same goal. Thats basically the opposite of what you are looking for.
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Post #1779 (isolation #38) » Sun Feb 03, 2013 7:55 am
Postby chamber »
In post 1775, Fate wrote:ALSO I told someone at the pre-release something that is apparently wrong. The Gatecrash FAQ SPECIFICALLY said each time you pay to activate the keyrune's ability of turning it into a creature, it is a NEW creature with NO memory of its past self. aka if they enchant agoraphobia (i think the example was) on your shit, you let it resolve, then pay the activation cost to make it a NEW creature that ISNT agoraphobiad
FOLLOWING this logic, I told someone that they couldn't cipher encode onto a keyrune, well they could but it would be LOST once it turned back into an artifact because its encoded on the CREATURE keyrune, and once it turns back into a artifact all knowledge of that creature is gone forever, and no cipher.
But then the Magic site said you CAN encode onto a keyrune and it will stick...??? not following the rules logic here
Just so new players don't get confused. The card used in the example was diminish not agrophobia. Agrophobia's effect would continue to apply on top of any power/toughness setting effects, no matter how many times they were used. It is however a creature aura which means that if its ever not enchanting a creature it goes to the graveyard as a state based effect. So at the end of the turn after it was put on the keyrune it would go to the yard.
The reason the diminish example works is because power toughness setting effects all apply in the same layer, below power toughness modifying effects and power toughness switching effects. Both diminish and the keyrunes activated ability set the the power toughness, meaning they are applied in time stamp order, so keyrune > dimish > keyrune would leave you with the keyrunes power/toughness at the end because its the most recent. Because this happens below modifying effects though, agrophobia/giant growth/etc are all applied after the base power/toughness is determined.
Short answer is yes. Long answer is to make sure whatever card you are using can redirect abilities, not just spells, because bloodrushing is an ability, and to make sure you have a legal target to redirect to, because bloodrush can only target attacking creatures.
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Post #1784 (isolation #40) » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:57 am
Postby chamber »
In post 1783, Thestatusquo wrote:I assume its because red just has way better options available at the three drop slot.
reds 3 drops are actually kind of shit right now. (which is the only reason the card fate mentioned is even close to being maybe playable outside of combo)
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Post #1801 (isolation #44) » Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:56 am
Postby chamber »
As a vanilla? 3/3 really, MAYBE a 3/2. 2/2s and 2/1s and 3/1s with the right abilities are fine. Evasion<Haste<Utility, generally. Utility obviously has less value in hard aggro decks.
In post 1813, Thestatusquo wrote:Nope. That is in fact exactly what they just changed away. A trigger only becomes missed at the point a player is forced to make a decision. That means if you attack with exalted triggers and they block forgetting about the triggers, they still happen.
Well, then I've been completely misplaying it. We've been playing that a trigger becomes missed when you pass priority after the trigger should have happened.
That was the proper way to play it until this update. Of course it was also only for professional/competative REL not FNM/prereleases/casual.
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Post #1832 (isolation #46) » Thu Feb 07, 2013 3:19 am
Postby chamber »
Shea's criticism isn't laughing at your lack of knowledge about magic, fate. Myko is right that shea isn't being as constructive as he could be, but the questions you are asking aren't very clear, which makes answering them frustrating. In your head you have some limitation other than making the best deck possible, but you've never communicated that limitation effectively. If its a matter of the budget, give us a budget to work within, if its a matter of card availability, describe what kinds of cards you have access to. If its a matter of casualness, define how games you enjoy tend to play out, and the turn that games normally end on. If its a matter of innovation, well you have to do that yourself not ask us for help. But more than that, you are putting false restraints on yourself if innovation is all you are worried about. You can still innovate on top of existing decks. You don't need to carve out an entirely new space yourself and build from scratch. The nature of information in all fields these days is that the crowd knows more than you, yet we still learn new things. You can still use net decks as a foundation, or as a way to understand what needs to be beat, and still end up with progress.
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Post #1836 (isolation #47) » Thu Feb 07, 2013 4:17 am
Postby chamber »
Its not that those are the only 2, its that those 2 extremes are well defines goals, and 'somewhere in the middle' is much less well defined. Your desired strategy is also super straightforward, which makes it harder to innovate/be interesting in. I don't know what cards you know, if you want to learn all the r/g cards in standard, read through gatherer here: http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Searc ... 29&format=[%22Standard%22]
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Post #1883 (isolation #50) » Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:19 am
Postby chamber »
Random MYOS has 2 advantages going for it, the first is that the format we end up with should be unexplored, allowing people that want to test their deck building skills a way to do so, the 2nd is that the card pool will be constrained enough that people like fate or nuwen or myko still have a reasonable chance of understanding what will be good or bad in the format without days of research time.
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Post #1952 (isolation #54) » Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:46 pm
Postby chamber »
I'd go three domri 2 pit fight over the reverse. domri is a lot better without the combo.
You should hit 5 on turn 6-7 with that many lands and 4 arbor elves.
Cubes are sweet. I hope you get as much use out of yours as I got out of mine.
what is this past tense
Too many magic friends moved out of town. Hard to get 6+ magic playing friends together these days. It still gets pulled out on some holidays, but not being used multiple times a week.
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Post #2025 (isolation #58) » Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:37 pm
Postby chamber »
In post 2024, xRECKONERx wrote:I think it would break the randomization of the packs if they had to include a code with each one that accurately marked each pack for what cards were inside. I suppose there's a way to do it via computer, but I feel like that'd be easily game-able.
And yeah, financially, they'd lose a ton of money if they did that.
I don't think it would directly hurt them financially that much. The vast majority of the online product that gets opened is in sealed events, and presumably you couldn't use coded packs for that because that just wouldn't work. It would completely crash the online card market though, which would likely mean indirect losses through people being less willing to draft because they would be getting no value out of what was opened.