Civilization Mafia [GAME OVER]

[beeboy]

Nebby think choosing nothing is a scumclaim, and I'm inclined to agree.

- Akane.

I am also inclined to agree and was coming to post this and think you are town.

[beeboy]

I am keeping this short and sweet and everyone not voting science can explain to me where I am going wrong.

None: We deny ourselves a power for the entire duration of a 3 month game because we want to enter day 1 faster, yay?
Art: Sure we get more powers to choose from but most voting powers favor scum more than town, Governer, Double Voter and Vote thief type effects.
Sciences: We literally just get more info.


None just seems lazy to me, Art seems pro scum and I don't see a con with science. I am open for more opinions but I don't know why anyone is voting something else.

[beeboy]

Its been explained about 17 times so far....

I disagree with the belief science helps scum strategize more than town.
Like we are all VTs anyway or so my understanding of this setup goes so I don't see what we lose.

[beeboy]

Like a scum sees a cop action coming up what can scum do about that, that we can't do.

[beeboy]

No wonder powers so far have been 1-shot actions either so I also don't feel like playing around that either. (Also if we see a blocked cop whoever takes a roleblocker power would obviously be conf scum.)

Also I am assuming whoever takes the treestump power is scum and will ignore them.

[beeboy]

(Also if we see a blocked cop whoever takes a roleblocker power would obviously be conf scum.)

But how will we know who took a roleblocker?

Whoever doesn't claim a power.

[beeboy]

Wouldn't you assume a mass claim in inevitable?

[beeboy]

(Also if we see a blocked cop whoever takes a roleblocker power would obviously be conf scum.)

But how will we know who took a roleblocker?

Whoever doesn't claim a power.

That could still leave us a pool of several people.

This is fair.

[beeboy]

No wonder powers so far have been 1-shot actions either so I also don't feel like playing around that either. (Also if we see a blocked cop whoever takes a roleblocker power would obviously be conf scum.)

Also I am assuming whoever takes the treestump power is scum and will ignore them.

That's why a townie should try to take it, to block scum from getting it.

I guess that is true.
I just think we will get more powers if our day 1 powers are an investigative, doctor and a redirecting BP

[beeboy]

I never implied anything about claiming tomorrow >.>
I am just saying assuming we don't win before what we assume is lylo/mylo we will mass claim.

pedit: Cause it is fun

[beeboy]

well I'll be back once we vote in something and can start voting players.

[beeboy]

But scum literally always have day chat in large themes unless site meta changed without me knowing.

[beeboy]

Is no one gonna point out that the {X, Y} thing is a terrible plan that still gives scum a 50% chance of hitting the PR they want to kill, and a chance to try again for 100% the next night?

Stop announcing PRs. And you also can't select two and say 'no one else take them'. That guarantees one won't get picked. And tells the scum you're either a doctor or a neighbourizer. They'll nightkill EITHER.
Just pick with your playstyle and if you miss out, try again the next day with higher priority for you.

Asking town to not claim for literally no reason?
What game do you even think you are playing?

[beeboy]

Drixx and Nebby head are town.
Yuri, Spiffeh and Vecna are lean town.

[beeboy]

I think the point is we just pick the role we like without actually talking about it.

[beeboy]

I am starting to lean towards voting None. Town probably won't keep quiet about saying they want a role that isn't even available yet.

[beeboy]

What is the vote count at I don't feel like hammering just yet given not everyone has appeared yet.

[beeboy]

VOTE: none

Actually I am just bored.

[beeboy]

The Deo what is your read progression on my slot?

[beeboy]

VOTE: Uzi

I'd vote Uzi.

[beeboy]

I'm null on Nero. I really liked his 453.

I did sr uzi but then I went to sleep and forgot what the sr was for....eh
VOTE: Max

Btw Vecna I don't really see that but then again you were around with him longer what are the dif's you're seeing?
~Maria

Fake read like I thought.

I don't think your scum though.

I didn't like these.

[beeboy]

I'm null on Nero. I really liked his 453.

I did sr uzi but then I went to sleep and forgot what the sr was for....eh
VOTE: Max

Btw Vecna I don't really see that but then again you were around with him longer what are the dif's you're seeing?
~Maria

Fake read like I thought.

I don't think your scum though.

I didn't like these.

Because?
-Nebby

453 was really far from anything alignment indicative even if he agreed with it. Fake read is a weird af accusation to make towards a town read.

[beeboy]

I have Nero as null?

Stop misrepresenting. That's not why I'm town reading the Maria head.

It's still a really shitty post to say you like but yeah I misread that.

I never said that was a bad reason to town read someone. I am saying that's a really weird question / thing to say to a town read.

[beeboy]

I have Nero as null?

Stop misrepresenting.

That's not why I'm town reading the Maria head.

I never said that was a bad reason to town read someone

. I am saying that's a really weird question / thing to say to a town read.

Never said you called it bad?

I mean you did say I was claiming that was your reason for town reading Maria.

[beeboy]

And that implies it's bad? Or did you know it was bad and thought you could push shit reasoning to scum read me?

wut.
I literally said that post wasn't the reason you town read the slot. It doesn't make a difference if it was a good, bad or null reason at that point.

[beeboy]

And that implies it's bad? Or did you know it was bad and thought you could push shit reasoning to scum read me?

wut.
I literally said that post wasn't the reason you town read the slot. It doesn't make a difference if it was a good, bad or null reason at that point.

The thing is I'm pretty sure I never said I was town reading Maria before that.

You said you thought they weren't scum reading the slot in the exact post I quoted.

[beeboy]

He says in 453 Nero is null though. "Don't think you're scum" doesn't mean he thinks they're town. Could be sorting them
VOTE: beeboy

Saying you like a post does mean you think a post would be more likely to come from town (I think).

I mean he did say that he was town reading the slot. Also if you were sorting a slot you wouldn't think they aren't scum that is something you would be unsure about that.


This is a stupid discussion and I am not going to waste more posts with it.

[beeboy]

And that implies it's bad? Or did you know it was bad and thought you could push shit reasoning to scum read me?

wut.
I literally said that post wasn't the reason you town read the slot. It doesn't make a difference if it was a good, bad or null reason at that point.

The thing is I'm pretty sure I never said I was town reading Maria before that.

You said you thought they weren't scum reading the slot in the exact post I quoted.

What? Dude I'm hung up on the fact that you were thinking that was the reason I was town reading the Maria head and then assuming I think it's a bad reason.

I am just going to go to point A) and reexplain everything using an incredibly small amount of words since I apparently suck at explaining things.


453 is a bad post to like.

640 and 646 isn't how town talk to town reads.

[beeboy]

No.

[beeboy]

Page 39

Yuri is town I guess, beeboy most likely scum that joined Uzi wagon.

I was literally the only person voting him but k

[beeboy]

Can someone explain to me what part of Creature's catch up was town?
I iz confused

[beeboy]

@Vecna and Leon btw

[beeboy]

Can someone explain to me what part of Creature's catch up was town?
I iz confused

Unless he learned to talk as scum, creature talking is a towntell.

Scum creature just luuuuurks.

Town-creature just goes on the blablablabla attack (no this is not me shading, just me trying to be witty about the fact he literally throws out everything thats on his mind while town).

This is the meta that everyone always uses to identify his allignment, and in the 4 or so games ive played with him it has not failed yet (lame sample size, I know).

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=68849 (many posts)
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=68495 (average posts)
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=69088 (no posts)

Idk I checked 3 games and he seems to be perfectly capable of not lurking as scum.

[beeboy]

A&N what is with your concern with literally everyone that is scum reading you?
Also PV is probs town.

[beeboy]

I'd vote A&N but I was waiting on Nero before I actually continued with that.

[beeboy]

????

I wanted you to vote A&N with me because I am pretty sure I can't achieve a lynch on my own right now.


Basically my problem with A&N right now is I didn't really like the notice push they made (like the notice push was meh af). But more imporantly my problem is that the way they are way too ok killing literally everyone one right now. It doesn't feel like they are solving the game and it is more like they are aggressively trying to find flaws in people's posts to push and nothing more. I don't recall them ever rethinking any of there scum reads this game which just seems weird af to me given how many they have had.

VOTE: A&N

[beeboy]

Beeboy, why aren't you obvtowning right now. You should be.

cause people like to complain when I do that.

[beeboy]

I could be wrong but who is A&N actually town reading right now?

[beeboy]

I could be wrong but who is A&N actually town reading right now?

You're not even reading.

I mean I did ask the question because I wasn't sure.

[beeboy]

I don't think his initial post and how he wanted to be the tree stump is an approach someone would take as scum.
That basically screams "investigate me"

[beeboy]

While I am here I am just going to say I don't think Nero is playing like his scum game at all (Dragon Age Mafia) and he is playing a lot like how he did in Street Fighter mafia so I think he is town.

Maxous is town because I liked his A&N and his spiffy reads (even though I didn't agree with his spiffy read it was still alright) and I don't think either of those pushes are ones he would have made as scum there.


We have way too many lurkers for me to comfortably have solid reads in this game tbh.

[beeboy]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=69868

I mean compared to my most recent game were I straight up refused to participate and got lynched idk I feel like my play isn't something new.
And it's not like I ever play like this as scum and am perfectly fine being literally like half the posts as scum.

[beeboy]

Like my most recent game I did the same shit I was doing in this game.

[beeboy]

Like A&N just feels disingenuous af this game, they are ok lynching all the major wagons, with a backup plan of lynching literally all the lurkers and there town reads are just all the near impossible people to Lynch like that isn't town.

[beeboy]

Taking meta into consideration out of my 40 town games or w/e only my most recent game resembles how I am playing right now which is why I am still pretty sure he is town despite wanting to ml me here.

But I really don't think I have ever shown that I am uncomfortable playing as scum except for games where I was so uninterested as scum I just replaced out.

[beeboy]

And like the whole shit about how I said I wasn't comfortable getting reads because not everyone posted = I am scum, is really bullshit because I have made a good chunk of reads so far this game.

[beeboy]

You

[beeboy]

I have trouble reconciling the fact that you have to wait on someone before pressuring a scum read with what I've known from town!beeboy. Could you elaborate on why you wanted to wait for Nero before voting A&N?

Cause every time I do that it either leads to me tunneling or me degrading the thread so I just decided it would be better for me to back off until I was either more confident in my reads or could actually get a Lynch through without derailing the game (like I did to day 1 in musical mafia)

[beeboy]

Everyone asking for my reads in various ways.

I've said Drixx, Maxous, Nero, Spiffeh, Vecna, PV and Fro99er are all likely to be town.
Vecna, and Fro99er just feel like they are genuinely solving the game.
Maxous' thoughts make sense and his pushes seem interesting to make if he was scum.
Nero is town cause meta
PV is also meta.
Drixx's entire play so far screams "investigate me no matter how I play" so he is obvious town.
Also I am pretty sure Uzi is town because his paranoia feels genuine and town and it doesn't really feel like scum who knows my lynch will go through regardless of how he defends me.
I also think the Aero+Pine hydra is town cause I feel like the push they made would be weird af to make as scum.

I am pretty sure my wagon has scum on it considering how long and hard I have been pushed by people, if Spiffeh and PV are town that leaves Creature (who I already think is disingenuous this game) and Kyouko (who I'd also still Lynch)
I am still really confident that A&N will flip scum so I give literally 0 shits about voting anyone else right now.

[beeboy]

I don't have a lot of reads but outside wanting to Lynch Kyouko and Creature I am confident in the ones I have so far.

[beeboy]

I am not compromising on Yuri cause I don't know why they are scum and I read the case on them but I kinda forget how I felt about it cause I am a scum fuck.

[beeboy]

I do still really want a Yuri lynch like they are so fucking disingenuous with there reads it isn't funny.
Like it is too convenient for them to switch to me after Spiffeh presented information he already shared, they are ok lynching all the leading wagons and the lurkers.
They are also just town reading all the people who I can't be lynched.

I feel like they are trying to make it seem like they are playing aggressively while making a point on stepping on as few people's toes as they can.

[beeboy]

Similar reads =/= Scum
Different reads =/= Town

I mean wanting to lynch all the lurkers in a game with a fuck ton of lurkers while also wanting to lynch all the leading wagons isn't a matter of having similar reads at all.
And doing all that and expressing like no paranoia about there own reads is just disingenuous af.

[beeboy]

I feel like they are trying to discredit me for like literally the entire game but I am not too sure cause some of the things the game solving they are doing feels kinda town.

[beeboy]

I feel like they are trying to discredit me for like literally the entire game but I am not too sure cause some of

the things

the game solving they are doing feels kinda town.

[beeboy]

I don't think they would be on a team with A&N but I'd hear out why you want me to vote there before I actually answer.

[beeboy]

I am not compromising on Yuri cause I don't know why they are scum and I read the case on them but I kinda forget how I felt about it cause I am a scum fuck.

I do still really want a Yuri lynch like they are so fucking disingenuous with there reads it isn't funny.

Like it is too convenient for them to switch to me after Spiffeh presented information he already shared, they are ok lynching all the leading wagons and the lurkers.
They are also just town reading all the people who I can't be lynched.

I feel like they are trying to make it seem like they are playing aggressively while making a point on stepping on as few people's toes as they can.

2 posts apart. WTF?

Did you mean someone else in that second post?

I meant A&N if you look at my other posts on A&N those are the same reasons I stated before sorry.

[beeboy]

Like A&N just feels disingenuous af this game, they are ok lynching all the major wagons, with a backup plan of lynching literally all the lurkers and there town reads are just all the near impossible people to Lynch like that isn't town.

Here is a post where I use the same reasoning I typod Yuri instead of A&N

@Fro99er and Creature

[beeboy]

Yes I think A&N is scum and I do not have a read on Yuri.

[beeboy]

Although Yuri is trying to lerk out her wagon now :<

[beeboy]

Or they just have a life it is hard to tell.

[beeboy]

Now that I think about it this Leon has a point on ABR this is really fucking odd coming from him, even in Gistou where he had a decent reason to not want to participate he was being more active then this by far and was still actively pushing reads.

Also @A&N I don't take issues with your reads on there own, I just feel as though a town player would find it odd that outside there own wagon the game is almost playing exactly the way they want it to. (the active people they think are scum are both being wagon and the rest of them are just lurking and Sodom who is globally scum read) Neither of your heads have really expressed any kind of paranoia which is really odd, like look at the recent posts from the DEO slot if you want an example of what I mean.

[beeboy]

The DEO slot is also probs town.

[beeboy]

The tree stump should claim so they can be investigated o3o

[beeboy]

idk I'd rather just have a claimed conf town tree stump then everything else.
If you guys don't want to investigate the tree stump and have them claim I am less comfortable both trusting them and giving it to drixx.

[beeboy]

No one else wants to vote A&N with me :<

[beeboy]

Unless they come and in and do something I'd take kyouko over Yuri right now cause I am not overly compelled by the Yuri case.

[beeboy]

Unless they come and in and do something I'd take kyouko over Yuri right now cause I am not overly compelled by the Yuri case.

What's wrong with the Yuri case?

I am just not really sold by it and would rather lynch A&N and Kyoko

[beeboy]

well I'd promised someone I'd do something before I went to bed so I can't explain anything right now.
But for tomorrow morning which one do you want an explanation on A&N or Kyoko?

[beeboy]

VOTE: Yuri

Fine the recent wall was weird and I'll vote with my town reads.

[beeboy]

I mean I would rather lynch A&N and Kyoko I am also just getting tired of this day phase and don't see either of those happening.

I mean outside an early gut read I don't think I have ever said that I thought Yuri was town so idk what is so odd about me deciding they could be scum. Also sheeping town reads is like one of the most common things that happens on this site >.>

[beeboy]

im looking for something to be confident about but id also settle on someone who wasnt me/a strong TR

I didn't like this part in particular.

[beeboy]

I am not compromising on Yuri cause I don't know why they are scum and I read the case on them but I kinda forget how I felt about it cause I am a scum fuck.

so why did you compromise now?

your town reads were on yuri then too

Because I am getting lazy and didn't like the part I quoted and I really do think that we need to move on with this game.
I mean at the time of that post I wasn't willing to vote anything outside my 3 scum reads but obviously there is more than 3 scum in this game and I just feel like sleeping my town reads because I don't really feel that confident in my reads this game.

[beeboy]

im looking for something to be confident about but id also settle on someone who wasnt me/a strong TR

I didn't like this part in particular.

why not say that you found this scummy instead of 'the wall was weird'

I just didn't say it because I was lazy.

Because I am getting lazy and didn't like the part I quoted and I really do think that we need to move on with this game.

WHAT don't you like about it

Because after expressing multiple scum reads and basically having the post amount to "fuck it I'll do anything" is just really weird to me. Like in the current state of the game I just don't understand why you would ever consider something like that unless you were scum seeking survivability especially when the A&N Lynch was actually really viable (and a scum read of Yuri's) starting some random af vanity wagon just seems so out of place for a town mind set.

im looking for something to be confident about but id also settle on someone who wasnt me/a strong TR

I didn't like this part in particular.

I mean, isn't that what you're doing yourself?

Settling on someone who isn't yourself/a strong TR?

I mean I am willing to vote 4 people right now and I am opposed to lynching the lurkers (I don't think I have ever said I'd vote them so far this game) and I do have reasons to want to vote Yuri beyond "things that my TRs read as scum" to want to vote Yuri and even if what I said was really shitty and poorly explained (although I went into on this post) I still did express more than just wanting to Lynch a non town read. I didn't even think your case was bad nor was bad I just liked my reasonings on my other reads more at the time you were asking me about it.

[beeboy]

Like Uzi went to being a strong scum read to being one of my top town reads.
Idk how the fuck my read trajectory on Yuri is remotely odd.

[beeboy]

Because after expressing multiple scum reads and basically having the post amount to "fuck it I'll do anything" is just really weird to me.

I mean I am willing to vote 4 people right now

So...still. Didn't you do the same thing you're accusing yuri of. You basically just went "fuck it I'll vote Yuri" despite having multiple scum reads.

I mean if you read my reasoning I feel as though my reason for voting Yuri goes beyond "fuck it I am bored" even if we pretend I was totally against your case (I just wanted to vote my top reads).
And y'know wanting to vote among multiple scum reads and wanting to vote outside your multiple scum reads as long as they aren't strong TRs is very different as well.

What part of what I am saying right now don't you understand?

[beeboy]

VOTE: Yuri

Fine the recent wall was weird and I'll vote with my town reads.

I mean, this is basically a fuck it I'll vote Yuri post.

I mean I have expanded on my reasoning since then

[beeboy]

Why do you expect town to go with wagon viability over who they think is scummiest at the time

And how does going for what u think is an unviable wagon make it look like im going for survivability. those two contradict each other

K those should have been separate points but "I'll vote anyone who isn't a strong TR" is just a really odd stance to have day 1 in a large theme and that is what I was referring to when I was talking about survivability.
And dropping your A&N push doesn't really make sense given you are still scum reading them and nothing in your read has really changed since then.

Like going for Vecna like that while also expressing how you just don't want to be lynched and would Lynch any non TR just don't make sense together coming from the same town mindset.

I mean if you read my reasoning I feel as though my reason for voting Yuri goes beyond "fuck it I am bored"

I mean I would rather lynch A&N and Kyoko I am also just getting tired of this day phase and don't see either of those happening.

Isn't this basically "fuck it I'm bored"...that's kind of how that read to me

Because after expressing multiple scum reads and basically having the post amount to "fuck it I'll do anything" is just really weird to me. Like in the current state of the game I just don't understand why you would ever consider something like that unless you were scum seeking survivability especially when the A&N Lynch was actually really viable (and a scum read of Yuri's) starting some random af vanity wagon just seems so out of place for a town mind set.

I mean this was my reasoning not that post but k.
And going "fuck it I won't go for my top scum read because Yuri is fine" and going "fuck it I'll Lynch any non town read" is a lot fucking different.

[beeboy]

And going "fuck it I won't go for my top scum read because Yuri is fine" and going "fuck it I'll Lynch any non town read" is a lot fucking different.

Like what part of this can't you grasp frogger I really would like to know?

[beeboy]

Because this is like the 3rd time I have reworded that.

[beeboy]

And going "fuck it I won't go for my top scum read because Yuri is fine" and going "fuck it I'll Lynch any non town read" is a lot fucking different.

Like what part of this can't you grasp frogger I really would like to know?

It's not a lot different. It's only a little different.

Both of you are saying "fuck it I'll vote for non-town reads" ... you're just narrowing yours down to a few specific scum (you have 4 scum reads you said)

What part of I have 4 scum reads and will vote for all 4 of those scum reads makes you think I am town read all 16 of the other players?

[beeboy]

Both of you are saying "fuck it I'll vote for non-town reads" ... you're just narrowing yours down to a few specific scum (

If I am narrowing it down to 4 people who I think are all scum.
I am not going fuck it I will just lynch non town reads.
I garuntee you a vast majority of living players are ok with lynching any of there scum reads right now but I don't take issue with literally any of them.

Unless Yuri is town reading like 16 different people right now she is being a lot more generous with who she will "fuck it" vote then I am and it is VERY different.

[beeboy]

AMONG THE GROUP OF YOUR NON-TOWN READS, YURI WILL VOTE ANYONE. YOU HAVE NARROWED IT TO 4 OF I DONT KNOW HOW MANY NON-TOWN READS YOU HAVE.

I am not town reading any of the lurkers and I won't vote them.
Nor am I town reading Elbrin or Leonshade or like a few other people on the top of my head that I also won't vote.
Idk it is very different.
Having a pool of 4 people and having a people of a fuck ton of people is very much not the same thing.

[beeboy]

Where the fuck did I say you have 16 town reads beeboy?

Show me.

I said you are not going to vote in your town reads. Nowhere did I say because you have 4 scum reads means you have 16 town reads. It means you have 4 people you'll vote, X people you don't necessarily town read but won't vote, and Y people you town read, where X+Y = 15 (since you scum read 4 people and also removing yourself)

I am not saying "fuck it I will vote my non-town reads" if I will in fact not vote my null reads.
I am taking issue with Yuri being ok lynching her null reads to stay alive.
I don't take issue with someone having a pool of people they want to vote.

[beeboy]

Having a pool of people you want to vote = fine
Lynching null reads for survivability despite having multiple scum reads = not fine.

[beeboy]

I can probably post before tomorrow at 2 but I am going to prod dodge anyway!

[beeboy]

VOTE: ABR

Yeah ABR is just scum.

[beeboy]

See I would consider compromising outside the people who want to see me killed. But the thing is think of this from my POV, I have had a shit ton of people try and get me lynched for pretty much the entire day phase and closest I have ever been to getting lynched was L-4. I just have a lot of trouble seeing that be the case without the dominant people pushing me be scum.

[beeboy]

Like I refuse to believe that there isn't at least 3 or 4 scum within the people actively pushing me.

[beeboy]

er I guess voting me* not pushing me

[beeboy]

Yo you were at L-1 last night

Yo I am a VT btw.

[beeboy]

Like I refuse to believe that there isn't at least 3 or 4 scum within the people actively pushing me.

So who are they?

ABR, Yuri, A&N and Spiffeh.
But if I am wrong I am sure there are scum hiding on my wagon, I am just as capable as looking at vote counts to see who has been voting me as you are.

[beeboy]

Cause Spiffeh is being too stubborn this game, it feels faked even for him.
ABR doesn't play this shit ever.
Yuri and A&N I already explained.