The real folk blues [Canceled]

[DiamondSentinel]

Also, if you're saying that I'm scum just because I happen to disagree with you on a read, that's also scummy.

You're actually scum because you're playing shady as shit. The thing you originally disagreed with me on is you being scum? So I don't understand your comment.

I don't care if you vote your "town read" I'll still give you town cred for trying to lynch him with me.

That's shitty logic and you know it.

Also, I am playing Shady because there are scum in global chat, so I never reveal what I'm thinking until I get in a neighborhood.

[DiamondSentinel]

PV should never be a mod, but he should always be on a list for a vigilante shot. If you go with the "he's lurking like usual so just keep him at null until endgame", then you'll end up with a repeat of Metal Gear Solid 5, which I've mentioned numerous times.

I resent this, I'm a damn good mod. If you have a complaint about any of my games, the time to bring them up was right after they finished.

Wait, what? I think I was drunk when I posted that.

Actually, it was likely autocorrect.

Anyways, I meant you should never be a lynch.

[DiamondSentinel]

I'm never drunk. I don't drink. So blame it on autocorrect.

[DiamondSentinel]

Then replace svp

[DiamondSentinel]

noone asked me shit. all i got was math saying im scum like a broken record
u can stop inventing shit now

pedit: @pisskop

Probably just a little salty that

1. You killed a town PR.
2. Having done so, you will not kill any scum.
3. Being almost certainly town due to your role, you're not providing more for us to sound board off of.

This assumes Kraska is telling the truth. Scum have this great PR called lying. They use it every game.

I ReALLY DOUBT KRASKA is a PGO

There's also this neat theory (I call it "DS's Theory on Lying") that states that "When given the opportunity, scum will lie as little as possible, as each lie is a liability and a point of weakness."

So, regardless of whether or not Kraska is scum, I wouldn't necessarily doubt that she is a PGO. She could be a scum PGO.

[DiamondSentinel]

noone asked me shit. all i got was math saying im scum like a broken record
u can stop inventing shit now

pedit: @pisskop

Probably just a little salty that

1. You killed a town PR.
2. Having done so, you will not kill any scum.
3. Being almost certainly town due to your role, you're not providing more for us to sound board off of.

This assumes Kraska is telling the truth. Scum have this great PR called lying. They use it every game.

I ReALLY DOUBT KRASKA is a PGO

There's also this neat theory (I call it "DS's Theory on Lying") that states that "When given the opportunity, scum will lie as little as possible, as each lie is a liability and a point of weakness."

So, regardless of whether or not Kraska is scum, I wouldn't necessarily doubt that she is a PGO. She could be a scum PGO.

If you were the mod of a game with 2 scum teams, which one do you give the PGO to? And what do you give to the other team to Balance the 2 extra possible kills you are giving one side?

An interesting assumption. I wouldn't have expected someone who hasn't read much to make such an assumption, but it's also what I've assumed from the start.

Anyways, I doubt there would be any distinction between the two, besides flavor. One, undoubtably, is "headed" by Vicious. I don't think that he would have the PGO, but admittedly I'm only 12 episodes in right now (watching it as I type this. I like the Space/Spaghetti Western vibes, and while I think the Crime Noire intro sequence doesn't exactly fit well, I do like it. A good shot).

I have no guesses whatsoever for the other scum team. I'm thinking that, perhaps one has Faye as a traitor in the Bebop group, as she's the closest to a villain there, but she is, more or less, a protagonist. So, flavorwise, I assume that, if there is a traitor (not strictly that role. Just a scum in Bebop), it will have a fakeclaim that leads to being in Bebop. Another thing that dashes on Faye as the "traitor" is that she doesn't really have anyone besides those Casino jerks who would be connected.

Of course, this is all flavor guesswork. I'm mostly just shooting out headcannons.

Back to the PGO. More than likely, if there are 2 scum teams, one will have a strongman, and the other might have the PGO. Both could have a strongman, (that happened in Dramonic's Soccer Spirits), but that ended up terribly, as one scum team's other abilities made it significantly more OP than the other (one team had a redirector and a full-rolecard cop, so that was so sickeningly stupid)

Also, from Frozen's modding history, I expect that she gave some less OP abilities than most other mods do (like you, Varsoon, which I do like, btw). This game is, more than likely, not rocket tag, but instead a 360 no-scope battle with snipers that take 4 shots to the body but one to the head to kill. That is to say, I would assume that, given the right strategy and situation, any role (or more likely a combination of roles) can produce some OP results, but it's incredibly unlikely to happen.

As for any other powers scum could have to balance the potential PGO, I have no idea. This is a theme game, so anything goes. I certainly like making very non-normal roles.

Whew, I like lectures like that. Please ask me more questions.

[DiamondSentinel]

@PV - I can't say I believe it either. But I recognize it as a distinct possibility. Especially after Cyberpunk, I consider every possible alternative. Never again will my oversight cause the loss of a game.

[DiamondSentinel]

VOTE: Diamond Sentinel

Based on what I've read from Kamelot's ISO, you hard scumread us when we voted for Skrub, called us obvtown after deciding he was probably Town, then had another hard scumread for voting Vedith.

This is both inconsistent with your own self-meta, and smells like you defending your buddies.

I'm gonna go back to bed for now, but you'll be ISOed in a few hours.

The obvtown was a Freudian slip, as I said immediately after that. You have never been obvtown. You are, and have always been, a scummy McScumfuck.

[DiamondSentinel]

VOTE: Diamond Sentinel

Based on what I've read from Kamelot's ISO, you hard scumread us when we voted for Skrub, called us obvtown after deciding he was probably Town, then had another hard scumread for voting Vedith.

This is both inconsistent with your own self-meta, and smells like you defending your buddies.

I'm gonna go back to bed for now, but you'll be ISOed in a few hours.

Happy scumday, FA!

[DiamondSentinel]

I subscribe to theory that we've had enuff talk about me today and ppl should mayve start looking for a scumzer

Oh, and also the poisoner.

So a Serial killing Paranoid gun owning Poisoner.

I really hope that you're not serious.

[DiamondSentinel]

I really hope that you're not serious.

I'm sorry to say that I'm actually a little bit serious about that.

So wait.

Let's get this straight.

You think there is a serial killer (by definition a person aligned with themselves) in a 32 person game. So you're saying someone has to face 1v31 odds?

This might be true for some mods (Varsoon likes to do this, but with closer to 1v19 odds), FA is not a bad mod. (No, Varsoon. You aren't a bad mod either. You just like to give people ridiculous odds). I will eat my shoe if there is an SK in this game.

[DiamondSentinel]

I am not discarding the fact that Kraska could be scum. But there is practically no chance whatsoever that kraska, or ANYONE, for that matter, is a serial killer.

[DiamondSentinel]

I really hope that you're not serious.

I'm sorry to say that I'm actually a little bit serious about that.

So wait.

Let's get this straight.

You think there is a serial killer (by definition a person aligned with themselves) in a 32 person game. So you're saying someone has to face 1v31 odds?

This might be true for some mods (Varsoon likes to do this, but with closer to 1v19 odds), FA is not a bad mod. (No, Varsoon. You aren't a bad mod either. You just like to give people ridiculous odds). I will eat my shoe if there is an SK in this game.

Isn't there a claimed poison doc already? Aren't poisoner all Self-aligned?

No. Poisoner is a role, and no roles are explicitly third-party/self-aligned.

The only reason SK is explicitly self-aligned is because it's an alignment, not a role. It just happens that SKs are a type of self-aligned that have a "factional kill" of sorts.

I am not discarding the fact that Kraska could be scum. But there is practically no chance whatsoever that kraska, or ANYONE, for that matter, is a serial killer.

I'm curious
Y is that

I literally just explained why I can say almost 100% certainty that there isn't an SK in this game.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ed: 1,0,1,1, good-bye!

Hey, I just watched that episode

[DiamondSentinel]

I am not discarding the fact that Kraska could be scum. But there is practically no chance whatsoever that kraska, or ANYONE, for that matter, is a serial killer.

Wake's Role Madness had an SK @ 42 players and the SK won.

Ok, good for it. I'm still going to assume that there's no SK.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ok, just looking at the roles in it, he was way more powerful than any of the other roles in there. He was ascetic bulletproof, which is a very good combination (only marginally less powerful than ascetic lynchproof, imo). The closest were the 2 JOATs. Mechanically, there was hardly any reason he shouldn't have won, unless he played poorly and got himself caught easily. (I don't care if the SK was a dude or a chick or any other gender. Don't you dare think of correcting my pronoun use)

PEdit: Because there are a couple things that are reliant upon the supposition that there is no SK. I'll let you know about them later.

[DiamondSentinel]

Although in that game, bulletproof was probably better than lynchproof, as scum didn't have a strongman.



Yeah, that setup was built for the SK to win. There was literally no way to kill him outside of a lynch, which, if that's all you have to avoid, is a really really easy thing to avoid.

[DiamondSentinel]

VOTE: MathBlade

I'm bookmarking this for later. If I die tonight, I want you to make sure to check this ISO. Something is making me uneasy about his play.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ooh! I want to do this! I like a TAM lynch. But I want more people on there first. If we can't get that lynch going, then ima stay on Math.

[DiamondSentinel]

smh guys.

I'm not voting MathBlade because I want him to die today. I'm voting him because I think that I will likely die tonight, so I want to leave behind something that people might see more than my posts. Modposts tend to be remembered more than player posts.


Also, as I've said before, if the TAM wagon needs my vote, then I will give it freely. If it doesn't, then there's no harm in my non-participation.

[DiamondSentinel]

Oh, sorry about the pronoun usage, Math.

[DiamondSentinel]

I can buy a DS lynch but I think TAM would have to be a buddy dontca think?

Nah he's been scumming it up all game and consistently trying to derail every popular wagon, he's a bad bad man. We can get TAM tomorrow cause he's just lurker scum if he is scum.

I don't derail wagons. I just play devil's advocate.

[DiamondSentinel]

TAM is obviously scumfuck.

I mean, look at his profile pic. It's Vicious. Obv!scum

/s

[DiamondSentinel]

Because I'm bored. I want the TAM wagon to be a thing. I just like mocking things.

[DiamondSentinel]

TAM is obviously scumfuck.

I mean, look at his profile pic. It's Vicious. Obv!scum

/s

Vicious would be an SK, if the flavor fit the bill.

Vicious might have a team with Lin and a couple other folks. But yes. If there was an SK, it would likely be him.

I still don't understand your resistance to vote it but I'm willing to see where things go.

It's difficult for me to explain my reasoning for anything.

[DiamondSentinel]

Who the fuck thought we were anywhere close to a hammer?

[DiamondSentinel]

Ooh pagetop

[DiamondSentinel]

Frozen is asleep. It's 5 in the morning in Paris right now.

[DiamondSentinel]

I do not watch Japanese porn cartoons.

Anime isn't necessarily porn.

Cowboy Bebop isn't porn.

Cowboy Bebop is definitely not porn. It's like Firefly but better.

[DiamondSentinel]

I literally just explained why I can say almost 100% certainty that there isn't an SK in this game.

Oh, I forgot.

There can't be an SK because 1:31 odds aren't fair.

I'm not buying.

It's not that it's impossible. It's just that it's not a beach I'm worth dying on, and lynching someone because they *might* be SK constitutes dying on that beach.

[DiamondSentinel]

I am not discarding the fact that Kraska could be scum. But there is practically no chance whatsoever that kraska, or ANYONE, for that matter, is a serial killer.

Oh dear.

I was hoping you were Town this game.

I posted some info on a site where FA and I played some large themes. Over there you could have up to 3 Scum factions and possibly up to 3 3rd Parties. Or maybe you'd just have one big Scum faction.

So FA's familiar with those setups and able to play them. She's able to run games like that, too.

But you insist that an SK isn't possible.

Well if it's impossible due to FA's experience, then there must be another reason.

The only one I can think of would be "doing the math" - that you're on a Scum team of either 4 or 8 players.

KC, I really really thought you would have known my playstyle.

I try to mathematically break down games. I did it in Machina Mafia, I did it in Cyberpunk, it's just my MO.

The fact that you're just disregarding my well-known playstyle is discouraging to me. It makes me question your towniness.

[DiamondSentinel]

I dunno. It's fairly diverse. You've got your "obey the rules all the time" character in Jet, the "I'm just in it for the money" character in Faye, and then Spike is your typical "I'm just doing stuff because that's cool" protagonist.

And then there's Ed. She's a roller coaster. At first, she was introduced as a fairly important character, and then she become comic relief for a good half of the series, and then she's finally starting to get some decent screen-time. I hope. I'm just at episode 19.

[DiamondSentinel]

I will say that's my biggest problem with it.

Ed had massive potential to be an amazing character and then they just made her a comic relief character with very little point for a while.

[DiamondSentinel]

I'm Vax, I replaced Dripping goofball

Hi there. I had a slight scumread on your slot.

You should do some work to rectify that.

Those last posts didn't help.

[DiamondSentinel]

I'm Vax, I replaced Dripping goofball

Hi there. I had a slight scumread on your slot.

You should do some work to rectify that.

You were believable until this part:

Those last posts didn't help.

A little overdone, don't you think? I have 2 posts.

It was meant to be light-hearted. I do realize, in hindsight, that seemed pretty bitchy of me.

[DiamondSentinel]

Yes. RadiantCowbells to be precise.

But that's a "regardless of alignment" type of deal, that's just who he is.
What I wanted was not unilateral control of the lynch (as evidenced by me being willing to go along with the wagons I went with yesterday). What I wanted was to lynch in a reasonable amount of time, and we did. It wasn't the best lynch in the world but it wasn't the worst and we didn't have to pull all of our fingernails out and kill our first born children to get it. It was lovely.

Fair enough.
I do feel much better about you now that you're here and engaging. May not have joined that wagon at all had I been here the whole time, but ah well. Glad you weren't lynched.

I still need to properly check out Kraska and Skrub, but from what I've heard so far, Kraska needs rope.

Nope. You've heard wrong.

I should probably engage with the game and develop some other opinions.

kts, who should I lynch?

kraska or randommidget.

also, this is like the unofficial list of the murder brigade!

me,
u if u want cerb,
nacho,
spyrex,
pk

i dont care if any of u are scum but i really really want to POWER LYNCH THE OTHER SCUM

I'd join the murder brigade, but I'm not sure about the towniness of some of them.

[DiamondSentinel]

I dunno. It's fairly diverse. You've got your "obey the rules all the time" character in Jet, the "I'm just in it for the money" character in Faye, and then Spike is your typical "I'm just doing stuff because that's cool" protagonist.

And then there's Ed. She's a roller coaster. At first, she was introduced as a fairly important character, and then she become comic relief for a good half of the series, and then she's finally starting to get some decent screen-time. I hope. I'm just at episode 19.

I will say that's my biggest problem with it.

Ed had massive potential to be an amazing character and then they just made her a comic relief character with very little point for a while.

The point is you have about 3 or 4 superb main characters in the crew, whereas Firefly had like 8, which didn't feel like too much.

That's also true.

[DiamondSentinel]

Hey, we is back. Umm, yeah.

Just watched Episode 22. Most wtf episode ever...

[DiamondSentinel]

No, it's very good. That episode just felt quite out of place.

[DiamondSentinel]

It was a very weird comic relief episode, although, with the last 3 episodes, I understand why they would lighten the mood a bit. The series ends on a slightly heavy-handed note.

[DiamondSentinel]

It's definitely one of my top 5. Probably around #4. I just wish it felt a bit more connected.

[DiamondSentinel]

It's definitely one of my top 5. Probably around #4. I just wish it felt a bit more connected.

That's exactly why it's not very good, but I don't like shows written in that style in general. I really enjoyed bebop movie, but guaranteed cowboy bebop proper isn't even in the top 100 imo.

I am perfectly fine with non sequitur shows. It's what I grew up watching, so I guess that's why I'm fine with it.

[DiamondSentinel]

It was a very weird comic relief episode, although, with the last 3 episodes, I understand why they would lighten the mood a bit. The series ends on a slightly heavy-handed note.

I get what you mean with the ending, but it was still superb. "Bang" is one of the most iconic moments in anime and fitted the show so well.

No no no. I really liked the ending of it. I just said it was heavy-handed. I don't dislike that sort of stuff.

[DiamondSentinel]

My stance on Nos is they will lurk and be useless regardless of alignment so they are a stupid lynch. Now if we wanted to lynch a scummy lurker we could lynch RM. Random more than Rach at this point.

Well, I agree that they don't do much anyways. And I suppose that does make them vig worthy instead.

[DiamondSentinel]

Eh, fuck it.

VOTE: TAM

[DiamondSentinel]

My stance on Nos is they will lurk and be useless regardless of alignment so they are a stupid lynch. Now if we wanted to lynch a scummy lurker we could lynch RM. Random more than Rach at this point.

Well, I agree that they don't do much anyways. And I suppose that does make them vig worthy instead.

If they need to die, why is it important that they die by vig over by lynch?

Because a lynch ends the day. A vig does not. Lurksacks should always be vigged over lynched.

[DiamondSentinel]

My stance on Nos is they will lurk and be useless regardless of alignment so they are a stupid lynch. Now if we wanted to lynch a scummy lurker we could lynch RM. Random more than Rach at this point.

Well, I agree that they don't do much anyways. And I suppose that does make them vig worthy instead.

If they need to die, why is it important that they die by vig over by lynch?

Because a lynch ends the day. A vig does not. Lurksacks should always be vigged over lynched.

Why is ending the day on an active player lynch better than ending the day on a lurker lynch?

Because that gives us information going into the night. Additionally, lurkers should be nightvigged, not dayvigged. Dayvigs should be treated as a second lynch.

If you want to know why lurkers shouldn't be lynched, and should be vigged, see Metal Gear Solid V Mafia. 3 days were wasted by trying to lynch a lurker (who admitedly was lynchproof). If they had tried to vig PV instead of lynching him, then they might have had a chance of winning that game.

[DiamondSentinel]

Because that gives us information going into the night. Additionally, lurkers should be nightvigged, not dayvigged. Dayvigs should be treated as a second lynch.

If you want to know why lurkers shouldn't be lynched, and should be vigged, see Metal Gear Solid V Mafia. 3 days were wasted by trying to lynch a lurker (who admitedly was lynchproof). If they had tried to vig PV instead of lynching him, then they might have had a chance of winning that game.

Using a town trying to lynch someone who is lynchproof three days in a row as an example of why lurkers shouldn't be lynched is sort of silly, don't you think? Town got punished for lynching PV because he was lynchproof, not because he was a lurker.

You get information when you lynch scum. You don't get the same level of information when you lynch town.

That's 100% false. You get just as much information for lynching town as you do for lynching scum.

First of all, when a town is strongarmed early in the game, more than likely, the biggest people pushing for that lynch are town. Yadda yadda yadda long story short town lynches give information if you know what to look for.

[DiamondSentinel]

The simple fact it is so hard to swing a lurker lynch here is information and our poor vig doesnt have a tactical nuke to deal with the lurkaderp zombie hoards.

Pedit id also lynch random

your scum buddy first. Then you, Random and DS.

Can you not? I mean, honestly, how can you read what I'm posting and say "You know, I bet this guy is

totally

scum. Like, everything he says is just scummy, and deserves a lynch." Are you even reading? Or are you scum. I doubt you're scum, because this push is nonsensical, and when I flip town, it

should

lead to your lynch (although with the current level of play, who can tell). I don't think that you're that bad of a player as to just be completely be suicidal on your scum game, but who can say.

Seriously, please start trying, Nero.

PEdit: Thanks for asking that, smith. You get a townread for actually trying this game.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ed: Ed will introduce Ed. Full name - Edward Wong Hau Pepelu Tivrusky the 4th.
Spike : That's a long name.
Faye : Who the hell's this?
Ed: Ed made up that name for Ed, isn't it cool?
Spike : If you made it up, how can you be the 4th?

Vote Count 1.13

Maker_of_Zanos (7): RachMarie , The Ascended Masters , SpyreX , Expedience , Vifam , Maker_of_Zanos , DiamondSentinel
Skrub (7): grapes , SirCakez , Road Kamelot , Drixx , Vedith , Cerberus v666 , pisskop
Drixx (3): Nero Cain , Skrub , Yume
RachMarie (3): Klingoncelt , mhsmith0 , Killthestory
Expedience (2): Nosferatu , DrippingGoofball
DiamondSentinel (1): Albert B. Rampage
Albert B. Rampage (1): Panzerjager
Nosferatu (1): Giovanni il Pellegrino
Vifam (1): kraska77

Not Voting (6): randomidget , Space Dandy , Mirhawk , PeregrineV , davesaz , rb

With 32 players alive it takes 17 votes to lynch.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2016-10-29 06:10:00)

Note: Skrub is V/LA.
Searching replacement for Yume.

Here's the first votecount when MoZ became a reasonable wagon.

I won't say that the first slot on the wagon is town, but I will say that at least 50% of the next few slots are. If I remember correctly, Expedience wasn't pushing terribly hard (they haven't really pushed anything hard), and I really really can't see TAM as town, so I'm going to say that Spyre is town (since Vifam flipped town). Next VC analysis coming soon.

PEdit: Hey dumbass, I'm doing that now.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ed: Ed will introduce Ed. Full name - Edward Wong Hau Pepelu Tivrusky the 4th.
Spike : That's a long name.
Faye : Who the hell's this?
Ed: Ed made up that name for Ed, isn't it cool?
Spike : If you made it up, how can you be the 4th?

Vote Count 1.13

Maker_of_Zanos (7): RachMarie , The Ascended Masters , SpyreX , Expedience , Vifam , Maker_of_Zanos , DiamondSentinel
Skrub (7): grapes , SirCakez , Road Kamelot , Drixx , Vedith , Cerberus v666 , pisskop
Drixx (3): Nero Cain , Skrub , Yume
RachMarie (3): Klingoncelt , mhsmith0 , Killthestory
Expedience (2): Nosferatu , DrippingGoofball
DiamondSentinel (1): Albert B. Rampage
Albert B. Rampage (1): Panzerjager
Nosferatu (1): Giovanni il Pellegrino
Vifam (1): kraska77

Not Voting (6): randomidget , Space Dandy , Mirhawk , PeregrineV , davesaz , rb

With 32 players alive it takes 17 votes to lynch.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2016-10-29 06:10:00)

Note: Skrub is V/LA.
Searching replacement for Yume.

Katerina Solensan : Ha ha. I can't tell when you're joking and when you're not!
Spike : Yeah, I get that a lot.

Vote Count 1.21

Maker_of_Zanos (17): RachMarie , The Ascended Masters , SpyreX , Expedience , rb , Skrub , Killthestory , DiamondSentinel , SirCakez , Road Kamelot , Panzerjager , Vifam , pisskop , Cerberus v666 , kraska77 , DrippingGoofball , grapes

[Lynch!]

DiamondSentinel (3): Albert B. Rampage , Vedith , davesaz
Skrub (1): Drixx
Drixx (1): Nero Cain
Expedience (1): Nosferatu
RachMarie (1): mhsmith0
Nosferatu (1): Aristophanes
Vifam (1): MathBlade

Not Voting (6): randomidget , Space Dandy , Mirhawk , PeregrineV , Maker_of_Zanos , Klingoncelt

With 32 players alive it takes 17 votes to lynch.

Day 1 ends in (expired on 2016-10-29 06:10:00)

The final one has quite a large increase in votes. Let's use this one for our last VC, and then I'll start quoting actual posts.

grapes, DGB, kraska, and Cerb all hopped on since the last VC. So we disregard them. The last slots are really really NAI. I've seen lurker town and scum go for the final votes. Not going to bother dealing with those for now.

SirCakez, Road, and PJ look to be in pretty townie slots.

That's all I care to do with wagon analysis.

PEdit: Nero, I can't explain why I do what I do. I just do things .

And TAM, it's just an overall feeling. I've played with you, Nacho, as town and scum (I believe it's the same Nacho). I have gotten good at getting feelings about your alignment. Like it or not, you're quite obvious scum right now.

PPEdit: Dammit smith, don't point out discrepancies. Yes, there's a discrepancy. When there is a discrepancy between theory and my "hunches" or feelings, I revise my theories. Just how I play. Give me a sec to explain more.

[DiamondSentinel]

Huh. So, I stand corrected. It actually seems Expedience was pushing that lynch pretty hard. Granted, I'm just looking at the 3 or so pages before that first VC right now, but still, there's some serious pushing. I revise what I said about Expedience.

[DiamondSentinel]

Oh ho ho! I'm not seeing much with TAM even addressing him.

FoS: TAM and Nero

[DiamondSentinel]

Actually, TAM spent most of yesterday pressuring rb.

[DiamondSentinel]

so I don't see where you get so many reads from unless you are scum.

Can we talk about this?

I don't like master at all this page. At alllll.

Its it time to start favors 4 votes. Lets get this wagon movin

see here i thought you were saying "maker" and i was going to agree with you but suddenly i feel a pang in my heart

Like dude that logic can be applied to nearly any reaction scum or town have to anything

Not really.

@Killthestory - What I meant was the role modifier suicidal.

Thats quite the leap of faith, and while are you phishing KTS?
~Zanos

This is a joke, right?

I think Nacho is town here

What do you think of Maker?

Pedit: Not really.... Why do you ask? Maybe the fishing part was exaggerated but assuming a suicidal modifier was a pretty big leap of faith.

I asked because I was having difficulty believing that anyone thought DS was fishing by the "suicidal modifier" comment.
It was a big "leap of faith" I guess if he actually believes that KTS has the suicidal modifier. I don't actually think this is the case. Why do you?

Yeeea nacho im your sword bro but id be double happy to stick in makers neck

I'm ready.

Vote: Maker_of_Zanos

I think Nacho is town here

What do you think of Maker?

Couldbscum, dont really care for em

let's go

2. 903 --> Complains about my reactionary analysis of KTS in 889 --> And what exactly is wrong with the post? It wasn't even a strong conclusion; just more of an aside/comment on how KTS was behaving this game & why. At worst its null at best its null. - Neutral (-1)

You tried to imply that KTS was scum because he wasn't acting like a troll. You didn't analyze any of his "serious posting", you just took a difference and you used that as an attempt to push him. You are docking points from SpyreX because he disagreed with you; isn't this the definition of bias?

Obviously, people are yelling because it isn't super obvious at a glance. Just cuz something looks obvious to you doesn't mean it does to everyone else. And quite frankly, I don't like how you are basically shouting from the sidelines despite not having giving your reasons to do so; it feels you dont want to be held accountable should this slot flip as town.

The Skrub wagon wasn't obvious at a glance, but it still popped up anyways. The House wagon wasn't obvious at a glance, but it still popped up anyways. SpyreX was pointing out that these wagons didn't get questioned, but yours did. Why? I don't understand how SpyreX is avoiding being held accountable for your town flip; his response blows this particular criticism out of the water, but just because he didn't give reasons for lynching you doesn't mean that people aren't going to turn to him if you flip town. I find that making a well-reasoned case on a wagon lets you get off with lynching someone more than just lynching someone does. Again, you're criticizing him for how he approached your wagon which again seems biased.

Yeah, the confirmation bias coming from this slot is quite obviously, and it really doesnt feel like town deathtunneling each other either. Show that Scrub is obvtown; if that were the case, then why is Scrub the competing top wagon? Also --> Look at the double-standard when it comes to people voting your townreads. I understand that the Scrub vote was somewhat bad, but how can you argue that Scrub's vote was much better in comparison --> You had no problem with it as far as I can tell. This is scum targeting the weakest link, not town that likes to deathtunnel players. Your attitude this game tells me so.

First, addressing the "if Skrub is obvtown, why is he the top competing wagon?". The majority opinion does not always align with an individual's opinion. The majority opinion (much like an individual opinion) is not always correct. I can elaborate on this if you'd like, but I'd hope that you can acknowledge that this is a bad line of thought if you spend some more time thinking about it.

As far as a double standard goes, SpyreX never argued that Skrub's vote was better than yours (although I'd argue that it was); he said that your vote was bad and that Skrub was obvtown (he argued absolutely nothing about your vote).

You seem to be arguing that old-timers (which feels directed at me and SpyreX in particular, please correct me if I'm wrong) are currently approaching your case with a closed mind and are producing terrible logic to push a lynch through. If you are town, I'd argue that this case is a case that you're making because you're frustrated by the push against you; you seem like a person who can approach a situation objectively but I'd be very surprised if you look at this case after the game is done and tell me that this is your objective approach to SpyreX's push on you.

And then you mislynch people who dont play by your "One-Size-Fits-All" rule; this is great advice.

A majority of people aren't playing by my rules. I am not pushing or attempting to lynch all of them. This has absolutely nothing to do with the point that I am currently making.

That's the thing that I don't understand. Why can SpyreX do whatever & no one even casts a shadow of a doubt there?

Show me something that I should kill him for.
So far, what you've shown me is that you're biased against his playstyle and pushing him for it, which is a neat little coincidence because it's what you were criticizing him for doing to you earlier, which is an even neater coincidence because it's as hypocritical as your partner accused Skrub of being earlier.

But no, not really. I'd go back if the collective demanded it, of course, but I'm pretty interested in Maker at the moment.

These are all the posts that TAM even ADDRESSES maker.

And actually, I want to point out a post that was one of his later ones.

I'm pretty excited to see Maker push his shiny new SpyreX suspicion.
In the meantime, short catch up.

In this one, he actually seems to be happy with his play.

Thanks for actually having my iso TAM. I am 100% confident that TAM is scum, with Nero a very very likely TAM buddy.

So yes, Nero. That's exactly what I'm saying.

[DiamondSentinel]

Sorry I didn't spoiler anything.


But if you actually read any of the posts, there are very few where he actually expresses any sort of suspicion on MoZ. He just jumps on with "let's go", and never gives any reason for this lynch.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ok, so you're up to something like 4 posts where you actually tried to push him.

You are not the strongarm in this lynch.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ok, if anyone has a dayvig, I humbly request you use it on TAM. If he's scum, go ahead and lynch me. I'm 100% confident that TAM is scum after that ISO.

[DiamondSentinel]

I did a ctrl+f and typed in maker and MoZ. those were all the posts that weren't shitposts about him.

[DiamondSentinel]

Or ones that you quoted someone else talking about him, but didn't address the points on MoZ.

[DiamondSentinel]

with Nero a very very likely TAM buddy.

So to recap. I push TAM as a lynch, DS says that he'd be ok with a TAM lynch but it hesitant to vote them. I then accuse DS-TAM of scum theater and now he's trying to push me as a buddy.

That was just coincidence.

It was actually the fact that you tried to push something that wasn't the case, which would make them be town-read. I couldn't care less about scum theater, because I never take such accusations seriously. They are kinda funny to laugh at, though.

[DiamondSentinel]

ok, if I was pushing TAM for "something they could get town read for" why exactly are you voting TAM?

I mean sure you are not claiming that you think TAM is 100% scum but I don't really understand why you were voting them over "something they could be town read for"

You didn't push them.

I was saying "whoever strongarmed MoZ was likely town" and then you said "TAM strongarmed them" which upon ISO 100% wasn't true. This makes it look like you are trying to get them townread even though the basis of this townread is obviously untrue.

[DiamondSentinel]

Your previous statement is kinda the exact opposite of what happened, actually. You didn't push TAM for that, and I wasn't voting them over something they'd be townread for.

PEdit: Well, he's wrong, then. Because you didn't strongarm MoZ at all.

[DiamondSentinel]

Let me just spell this out for Nero and Cakez (mostly for Cakez, as I actually townread him at this point).

A D1 strongarm should not be proof of scuminess, especially if it's a "less strong" player like MoZ (what I mean is if you strongarmed someone like Varsoon, Drixx, or Ranger, who seem to be strong players, that'd be scummy. I'm not saying MoZ is a weak player). Therefore, your case on TAM is not valid. It makes no sense to potentially suffer many scumreads on such a fruitless lynch.

Au contraire, this should be for a townread. However, this is moot, as TAM

did not

strongarm MoZ.

PEdit: Thank you, TAM. I'm not good at typing.

[DiamondSentinel]

Well, at least we have sportsmanship between town and scum here. ^_^

[DiamondSentinel]

yeah I don't think I've ever tried to get them townread. I think your "town are the one's that strongarm lynches" is more of an attempt to get a town read on them then anything that I've ever said.

Absolutely not. I want a TAM lynch, or better yet, a TAM dayvig.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ok, if anyone has a dayvig, I humbly request you use it on TAM. If he's scum, go ahead and lynch me. I'm 100% confident that TAM is scum after that ISO.

So you're asking to be lynched then, since you're 100% sure TAM would flip scum, and you are offering yourself as a lynch if you're correct?

yayaya I said it was a typo. I meant if TAM flipped town lynch me.

[DiamondSentinel]

Ok, if anyone has a dayvig, I humbly request you use it on TAM. If he's scum, go ahead and lynch me. I'm 100% confident that TAM is scum after that ISO.

So you're asking to be lynched then, since you're 100% sure TAM would flip scum, and you are offering yourself as a lynch if you're correct?

Missed the fix DS. My bad!

Yeah. Contrary to what you might believe, I am not suicidal this game.

[DiamondSentinel]

Bah, stupid quotes.

[DiamondSentinel]

@Mod: When are prods going to resume?

[DiamondSentinel]

Ah, neat-o!

[DiamondSentinel]

Sure downtime has me a bit wonked up, but I'm pretty sure my choice lynches today are DS or Kraska.

Might also be able to go with Cakez, but idk. He's always been a tough one for me to read.

My no lynch list is TAM and Spyrex right now.

So your no-lynch list is down to the 2 largest wagons today. OH THANK YOU WISE ONE FOR YOUR WONDERFUL INSIGHT THAT GETS NOTHING DONE.

[DiamondSentinel]

The shift onto Nosferatu isn't town-driven. TAM's vote there is hypocritical and self-serving, just look at it compared to his previous reluctance to vote his rival wagon. We're starting to connect the dots, boys and girls.

There's the ABR that killed me in SaGa! Get to work, ABR. There are people to lynch.

[DiamondSentinel]

Site downtime has me a bit wonked up, but I'm pretty sure my choice lynches today are DS or Kraska.

Might also be able to go with Cakez, but idk. He's always been a tough one for me to read.

My no lynch list is TAM and Spyrex right now.

So your no-lynch list is down to the 2 largest wagons today. OH THANK YOU WISE ONE FOR YOUR WONDERFUL INSIGHT THAT GETS NOTHING DONE.

Pretty sure Spyrex isn't one of the two largest wagons today. TAM is, but being able to interact with and watch him is giving me incredibly Town vibes, despite my issues with strongarming.

Besides, I wasn't expecting anything huge to come out of that post. I didn't frame it as some brilliant insight. It was just an update on my reads, and frankly I find the hostility a bit unnecessary there.

Absolutely nothing TAM has done has been townie at all.

[DiamondSentinel]

randomidget - kill
MathBlade - town
kraska77 - townlean
Varsoon - kill
Vaxkiller - kill
Albert B. Rampage - townlean
Radical Rat - kill
DiamondSentinel - town
Mirhawk - kill
Nero Cain - town
SpyreX - town
Klingoncelt - kill
Vedith - kill
Expedience - townlean
RachMarie - town
SirCakez - kill
Skrub - town
PeregrineV - townlean
davesaz - town
pisskop - town
Panzerjager - town
mhsmith0 - kill
Drixx - town
Nosferatu - kill
Killthestory - town
Cerberus v666 - town
Aristophanes - town

Ok, the fact that you have over a third of the playerlist as kill is not a good sign, TAM...

[DiamondSentinel]

Ok, the fact that you have over a third of the playerlist as kill is not a good sign, TAM...

How many scum are you suspecting?

This is just looking at the list of living players, so take that as you will, but right now, I've got about 7 or 8 who I deem scum to null!scum.

[DiamondSentinel]

But if you want how many I suspect, I can go into a lot of setup spec. But nobody likes it when I do that.

[DiamondSentinel]

So I'm scumreading or nullreading around 2 more people than you are.
Can you explain to me why that's a bad thing? Should I have townreads that I don't have?

Well, I have more null reads than you. I tend to keep null reads almost until LyLo. That's another worrisome thing. You're already separating people off who aren't really doing much into a town or kill category. That's the biggest thing: Your strong opinions on people I find it nigh impossible to have opinions on.

[DiamondSentinel]

I don't like that SirCakez read, but I suppose it's understandable. Definitely don't like that smith scumread and that KTS townread.

Those are the biggest 3 issues.

[DiamondSentinel]

Please... PLEASE CAN WE JUST LYNCH KTS. THIS IS SO BLATANTLY SCUM

[DiamondSentinel]

DS, are you familiar with kts?

Expedience, I'd lynch you too. Should I fight you?

Thankfully, no.

[DiamondSentinel]

How do you come up with that number Nero?

Still waiting on a response from Nacho on my other questions. He is a lot better at math than I am and I am trying to figure out how many scum we are likely to have in this game, it helps me sort out reads. Also if this game is multiball or not, helps me sort things out. And by that I mean two mafia teams instead of one, Nero I know you think an SK is enough to make it multiball instead of a single maf team and a 3rd party.

Spy feel free to add in here as well, you are my top town read, and I know you have played in a ton more games than I have. And most likely are also better at math than I am. I suck at statistics ended up dropping out of the class 3 times.

Welcome to scum claim this is.

You are still trying to sort me yet you didn't even bother to ask me a mathematically based setup question.

Look at my name.

MathBlade.

Math.

One might think I'd be good at it. But you aren't interested in hunting me only silencing me.

Nobody cares how good you are at mathematically solving games. Trust me. It's my MO, and nobody really seems to care about it, and actually like to scumread me for it. I'd suggest you stop while you're even in the same dimension, as it's too late to stop while you're ahead.

its like you just keep posting things but don't know what they mean.

Its a 32 player and I believe in all my heart that KTS slipped that it was MB. 10 scum would make this a 10/22 (or 10/1/21 if we have SK) setup which seems more than reasonable. Assuming that yes this is MB then 5/5 makes sense as scum numbers. Also Math seems fixated on there being 5 scum and it looks like hunting the other team. And Nacho's kill list is exactly 10 players long.

While I like this line of thinking, all of this is based off the the assumption that there are indeed 5 scum per team.

But all the more reason to lynch from this pool. It seems like nobody is up for lynching Math, and KTS I guess has kinda slipped off for now, but we could definitely go with a TAM lynch.

All aboard the lynch train!

[DiamondSentinel]

Methblade do something before we mislynch Nos instead of trolling lol

Trolling implies I am doing something for the lols.

Notice how my scumreads poke me as to why instead of using the common senses.

@DiamondSentinel

Reads wise I struggle sometimes.
However I am pretty good at setup spec. I called a town vig in Wake's and everyone called me nuts. Had wrong player read for it but still.

And that was a specific critique of Rach Marie who knows I am damn good at setup spec.
Call me an idiot on reads fine.
But with setup spec I am damn fine thank you very much.

@ABR nah Serves me so far. Don't see a reason why I would join a wagon pushed by a scumread when I am asked by a scumread.

I think I've been wrong with setup spec once, and that was more flavor spec than anything else. But it didn't change the outcome of the game. (town lying was responsible for that loss)

[DiamondSentinel]

:/

That avi is far too bright for my eyes, but whatever.

[DiamondSentinel]

Also, Drixx is still in the game. He should be getting a prod.

[DiamondSentinel]

If poison was delayed Vifam would be alive.

Therefore Vifam was not killed by poison or poison is not delayed*

I go for the former. As far as I can tell, Drixx said that it was a poison, not an explosive. Now, this is dangerously close to the same setup spec I got into trouble with in Cyberpunk, but still, I'm willing to bet that the poison is delayed, and Vifam wasn't killed by it.

[DiamondSentinel]

If poison was delayed Vifam would be alive.

Therefore Vifam was not killed by poison or poison is not delayed*

I go for the former. As far as I can tell, Drixx said that it was a poison, not an explosive. Now, this is dangerously close to the same setup spec I got into trouble with in Cyberpunk, but still, I'm willing to bet that the poison is delayed, and Vifam wasn't killed by it.

Then the proper play is Vifam was killed for saying they'd investigate Kraska.
It is simple.
If Vifam's kill wasn't delayed and they know they'd show up as guilty they claimed PGO in response to the first hint of a tunnel. Town PGOs claim immediately. Read the Wiki.

I have one serious problem with this.

This makes the MASSIVE assumption that scum are in the PT. I can't think of any characters this would fit flavor for. I don't scumread Kraska for anything that they've done, so until we find proof scum is in the PT, I say we don't lynch Kraska. Simple as that.

Now, if you scumread kraska for other reasons, then please tell me, but I haven't seen anything more worthy of a lynch than many many other people.

[DiamondSentinel]

Mathblade, I'd really like you to explain how it makes sense that vifam, the gunsmith, was killed due to his investigation choice, by someone who doesn't use a gun? For bonus points, explain that connection without assuming a single scum faction has access to multiple kill flavors.

Mafia flag as having guns regardless of powers.

Nope. Mod confirmed that Jet would not detect the explosives/bio warefare and katanas kill flavors.

[DiamondSentinel]

I'm sorry MathBlade, but your theory on Kraska has too many holes in it. I can't support it at all.

[DiamondSentinel]

I'm sorry MathBlade, but your theory on Kraska has too many holes in it. I can't support it at all.

No it does not.

PGOs based on their role have guns.
Kraska as a claimed PGO would have shown up as a guilty on it.
Kraska killed Vifam because he would be discovered.
Kraska is very likely not a PGO.

If a game does not follow the wiki then it is not normal.

Did FA say this game was normal?

@FA: is that kill flavor on vifam indicative of one sort of kill, or two?

Also, would vifams gunsmith have worked on the individual with the katana/explosives/biological warfare?

It indicates one kill

and no. It would only detect gun's

She said it would only detect guns.
All Mafia have guns regardless of powers.

The Gunsmith is an information role that can target a player at Night to learn if they have a gun in flavor. Members of the Mafia (that are not Doctors), Cops, FBI Agents, Vigilantes, other Gunsmiths, Paranoid Gun Owners, etc. all have guns in traditional flavor. Notably, Serial Killers and Doctors do not have guns.

That's only for normal games.

[DiamondSentinel]

...

You're working at cross purposes here.

The mod already said the kill flavor that killed vifam would not have been detected by him.

Thus, there is no connection between his choice to investigate kraska and his death, without scum having multiple kill flavors, OR scum being really really really stupid and not asking if a gunsmith would catch them, once rhey learned one existed.

No they answered a different question.

They said explosives are not guns.

A PGO has a gun regardless of kill style.
If Kraska is a two shot scum PGO she turned it on to avoid detection.

I do not believe Kraska's claim.

THAT IS 100% WRONG AND I'M TYPING IN ALL CAPITAL LETTERS BECAUSE YOU ARE BEING DELIBERATELY OBTUSE!

THE MOD HAS CONFIRMED THAT THE GUNSMITH ONLY DETECTS PEOPLE WILL KILL FLAVOR "WAS SHOT"! THIS WAS 100% CONFIRMED, WITHOUT A FRACTION OF A DOUBT, BY THE MODERATOR WHEN JET DIED. STOP BEING FUCKING OBTUSE. SERIOUSLY. I'VE DEALT WITH YOUR SHIT FOR 3 GAMES NOW AND I'M DONE.

[DiamondSentinel]

@Mod-
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with a Katana" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with biological warfare" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed with explosives" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "killed by biological warfare and explosives" if he investigated them?
Would Jet Black be able to detect a gun on the player with the killing ability "shot" if he investigated them?

The answer to first 4 questions are : no, not by defualt
the answer to fifth question is yes.

Jet Black could detect whoever has a gun.

FUCK YOU MATH HERE IS THE MOD'S SPECIFIC POST.

[DiamondSentinel]

[sigh] I'm calm. I'm calm.

No need to warn me mod. I know I overstepped my boundaries there. I'll try to keep it from happening again.

[DiamondSentinel]

lol are you figuratively yelling at a computer screen?

just close your eyes

Well, I wasn't kidding on the MS fallout shelter about how mafia raises my blood pressure.

[DiamondSentinel]

I CLOSED MY EYES AND A SLIPPED AWAY!


MORE THAN A FEELING!

WHEN I READ MATH'S POSTS SAY IT'S BAD

Ok, I'm done.

[DiamondSentinel]

Math, until you can prove with almost absolute certainty that there is scum in the hood, I will not entertain this thought.

[DiamondSentinel]

Oh yeah, who's in the PT again?

[DiamondSentinel]

The "other than shot" kill flavors

could

be SK, or even vigs. In which case they are not mafia and don't have guns.

If conclusion jumping were an Olympic sport we'd have some gold medalists here.

But the odds are 2 to 1 in favor mafia not using guns.

[DiamondSentinel]

vifam claimed in a private chat, allegedly. Not that I disbelieve it. It's just what some folks are sayin.

[DiamondSentinel]

Private chat Kraska had access to?

Nope

I started to glaze over and so I started skimming, so I probably missed things, w/e
Math your Kraska theory might hold water but it's not a battle for today

Please... PLEASE CAN WE JUST LYNCH KTS. THIS IS SO BLATANTLY SCUM

Have you ever read a KTS game before? go do that

SirCakez I'm not really reading as town because he hasn't done shit but tunnel me and every time he does come in and tunnel me he just makes some weak shit well and fucks off again. His reasons for voting me aren't strong and the way that he's pushing me lost all of its conviction; I liked him more earlier when he was complaining about me ignoring pushes but that's gone down steadily.

They are incredibly strong, and I can add on now with your awful Nos push
You would come up with something way better then a lurker lynch as town

[insert generic meta is trash]

[DiamondSentinel]

General scuminess, a lack of towniness, terrible play, the general stuff.

The real question is why wouldn't I scumread them?

[DiamondSentinel]

meh I think KTS is town. He often plays a tad unusually, and I know tended to scum read him a lot at first.

I did in a recent game even because he was really lethargic in that game, and not quite so out there, and I was wrong then. So I am willing to put him in the town pile at this point.

There's a massive difference between "tad unusually" and just scum.

For my first few months on-site, I played "a tad unusually". This isn't "a tad unusual". This is downright scum.

[DiamondSentinel]

Also, I'm 100% done giving anyone a pass for shit play. I did that twice for Dwlee and he was scum both times. No more.

Anyone who wants to give them a pass should read Cyberpunk mafia and GTA2 mafia.

PEdit: MathBlade, I think I missed the part where I was supposed to give a shit.

You give me games to read, I give you games to read. Until you read the 2 games I just gave you, I will not read any games that you put out here.

[DiamondSentinel]

I really hope I'm right about what I suspect is about to happen.

[DiamondSentinel]

Please, KTS. Claim your "absolutely without a doubt role that proves your towniness". I really really need something new to shoot down besides Math.

[DiamondSentinel]

Also, Drixx is still in the game. He should be getting a prod.

He announced 48 hours VLA before site going down. I decided to count that as well.

Will recheck activity stuff after catching up.

Sorry. That wasn't directed at you. That was more just to the others in the game. As in, "I expect that he'll be getting a prod soon"

[DiamondSentinel]

God damn it why don't roles follow the fucking wiki?!?!?!

Is this a question from me or not? Please bold if you want to ask a question from me. thanks.

@Frozen angel That was more frustration than an actual question. You may answer it if you wish but that honestly would be hunting the mod about why you designed something the way you did. I think I would want to talk about this post game though as the bastard elements question should be yes if roles don't follow the wiki. Anything not normal is bastard. However that doesn't seem to be an opinion shared so I will stew and talk privately post game.

Holy crap. This is the theme queue. Assume everything is non-normal. That is the point of this queue. It isn't to play games that have a fancy shamncy themes. It's to play games that don't fit in the normal queue and don't work in open. You ought to know that, since Shadowrun was VERY non-normal.

In fact, I'm convinced you're BSing at this point.

[DiamondSentinel]

That was because of the randomness of the missions, Math. Not any of the roles.

If you actually read the definition of bastard, it is any undisclosed randomness, mod interaction in the game, lies that can not be logically predicted, etc.

Non-normal roles fall under NONE of those categories.

[DiamondSentinel]

MathBlade, you've been on the forums for 3 years! How could you not have learned that theme games are not normal 90% of the time! Non-normal roles, again, fall under absolutely none of those categories. I'll even go down the list.

1. Cults-Nope
2. Moderator Lies-Absolutely not
3. Secret Win Conditions-Not even close
4. Non-Randomness-How does that even apply?
5. Direct mod influence-Nope

You're 0 for 5, kiddo.

[DiamondSentinel]

Roles are not supposed to follow the wiki, especially in Theme Games. That's why people come to the Theme Queue.

Also, why the fuck would it matter if a gunsmith gets a result from a PGO? They die anyways.

PEdit: GOD FUCKING DAMN IT MATHBLADE SHUT UP AND STOP BEING LIKE THAT! ITS NOT A MODERATOR LIE! IT IS FULLY TO BE EXPECTED WHEN IT SAYS "DOES THAT PERSON HAVE A GUN". WELL, IF SOMEONE IS BLOWN UP OR KILLED WITH A KATANA OR KILLED WITH BIOLOGICAL WARFARE THAT IS NOT A GUN! THIS IS A THEME GAME! BY DEFINITION OF THE NAME, THE THEME HAS SOMETHING TO DO WITH THE GAME. THIS IS REASONABLY ANTICIPATED.

[DiamondSentinel]

Maybe I'm not understanding or something but I don't think making a PGO that doesn't have a gun is bastard or anything.

Merci beaucoup.

[DiamondSentinel]

pagetop

[DiamondSentinel]

I can't say I'm going to argue with that.

[DiamondSentinel]

No wait, that's now what you wanted.

Enter Scene: MathBlade has just revealed that he plans on leaving MafiaScum due to some issues with mods and their choices to DiamondSentinel.

"But baby. I thought we had something special." he says.

"Maybe once upon a time, but not anymore. I just can't take it anymore. All of this... non-conformity!" Mathblade retorts.

"But... But I love you!"

"I don't love you. You are too attached to the chaos inherent in this system."

"But the chaos is what makes this life fun. Who ever had fun with boring ol' order all the time!"

"I did. And that's why this just isn't going to work" Mathblade says, as they leave for the door.

DiamondSentinel dives towards his feet. "But please! I can't live without you MathBlade!"

"You'll have to find a way."

"You're tearing me apart, MathBlade!"


Close Scene

[DiamondSentinel]

That's not what you wanted*

[DiamondSentinel]

Because TAM is scum and I feel that if we lynch Nos here that the town will be in an irreparable hole.

irreperable hole? on a day 2 lynch?

I dunno about lynches, but N1 NK on Wisdom in Machina Mafia left an irrepairable hole.

[DiamondSentinel]

Oh good, 4 pages of mostly useless stuff.

[DiamondSentinel]

Pagetop

[DiamondSentinel]

I am a JOAT with several powers but no killing role. I do have an invention that I can give and anyone, regardless of alignment, will get it as long as the kill KTS.

I will kill KTS with pleasure, if this invention kills him. Otherwise, I can't really do much about it.

[DiamondSentinel]

So why would the mod give out roles: If person a dies then person b gets ability x to scum and town... It's too one sided.

That's a fairly common design feature. I've used it before (in off-site games, but that's minor details).

[DiamondSentinel]

It's easy for players who are written off as VI's when they're town to written off just the same as when they're scum. However, DS actually seems somewhat intelligent, but he doesn't show it here. Maybe this is literally his towngame, but I don't feel it. I haven't played with him before, but I've been fooled by this ploy before.

It's almost like he's acting against town's interests. (gasp)

Wait. So you're saying I have my own agenda? Rather than the shitfest that "town" has?

Gasp!

But seriously, I don't trust anyone for the first 3 days at least. Just my MO.

I am a JOAT with several powers but no killing role. I do have an invention that I can give and anyone, regardless of alignment, will get it as long as the kill KTS.

I will kill KTS with pleasure, if this invention kills him. Otherwise, I can't really do much about it.

seems

f o r c e d

actually looking at it my reasoning puts him only at null since hes only on my watchlist. hes NOTICEABLY NULL yes

And you're one to talk, obviously... (Obvious sarcasm is obvious)

[DiamondSentinel]

WAIT A SECOND!

YOURE PULLING ONE OVER ON US! I WATCHED ALL OF COWBOY BEBOP! I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO!

[DiamondSentinel]

who are you talking to DS?

Keep in mind, some of us are not that familiar with the theme the game is based on.

I was talking to Nero, halfway joking.

In Cowboy Bebop, almost every episode that resolved around a bounty would resolve with the bountying party not paying them off a technicality. e.g. The bounty was for a human so computers don't count.

[DiamondSentinel]

nos way too many bad votes on it.

nos potential third party, though. would make sense to me.

First logical statement you've made all game.

[DiamondSentinel]

I'd assume so. But they are never active enough for me to really get a good diagnosis.

[DiamondSentinel]

i swear i've played tons of active games with nos and everyone called him he ?

The patriarchy in action yo.

I hope to God you weren't serious about that...

[DiamondSentinel]

most people do that, I even have been called a he a few times, and not only is my gender indicated, but my user name is clearly feminine. I have never met a male Rachael, or even the more commonly known name Rachel.

Well, I can't say I've never met one, but there is a far larger weight towards female than male. Of course, I don't exactly have that good of a basis to go off of, as my sister has a mostly male name.

[DiamondSentinel]

I agree. But let's deal with that later. For now, either TAM or Nos needs to die. We don't have time for vanity wagons.

[DiamondSentinel]

ABR, you get back on Nos, and Cerb, you either get on or you are the next death after we lynch Nos.

Like that ultimatum?

[DiamondSentinel]

Holy shit Cerb is scum.

VOTE: Cerb

Holy shit I doubt you're town even more.

This...

Coming from the guy...

Who wasted an entire day bitching about how a theme game is non-normal.

[DiamondSentinel]

Holy shit Cerb is scum.

VOTE: Cerb

Holy shit I doubt you're town even more.

This...

Coming from the guy...

Who wasted an entire day bitching about how a theme game is non-normal.

1) Person
2) Not a waste

I didn't say guy as a gender-indicative noun. Get the fuck off of your soap box.

Also, it was 100% a waste considering THE MOD HAD SAID VERBATUM WHAT YOU WERE ARGUING AGAINST FROM THE VERY START!

[DiamondSentinel]

Presumably yes
Or to protect Skrub/Kraska

Cakez... Cakez... We've already established that the main reason all y'all were voting Kraska was fundamentally flawed.

I can't really say much about Skrub, though.

[DiamondSentinel]

ABR is town
TAM is town.

RachMarie move is the weird one here, not ABRs. ABR had an established history of voting TAM, a reason for the move to Nos, AND a reason for the move away.

1 for 2, Cerb.

[DiamondSentinel]

Agreed. ABR is scum. TAM is town.

0 for 2, Mathblade.

[DiamondSentinel]

realtalk tho this wagon only exists because one person picked one lurker in particular; if that isn't enough for you to realize its a shitty wagon, there's no hope for you at this point.

That doesn't make it a shitty wagon. The fact that it's a shitty wagon on a lurker is what makes it a shitty wagon.


You should be vigged instead.

[DiamondSentinel]

Agreed. ABR is scum. TAM is town.

Eh, I don't know about ABR. I'm leaning Town based on seeing him in Dragon Age. I have not seen his scumgame though.

Read Cyberpunk Mafia.

He is super obvious as scum.

[DiamondSentinel]

Agreed. ABR is scum. TAM is town.

Eh, I don't know about ABR. I'm leaning Town based on seeing him in Dragon Age. I have not seen his scumgame though.

Read Cyberpunk Mafia.

He is super obvious as scum.

That too.

Also, ABR didn't explain away his actions. They simply made sense.

Indeed.

This is very clearly ABR's town game, so it would be great if you'd not lynch him. plz & ty

[DiamondSentinel]

realtalk tho this wagon only exists because one person picked one lurker in particular; if that isn't enough for you to realize its a shitty wagon, there's no hope for you at this point.

That doesn't make it a shitty wagon. The fact that it's a shitty wagon on a lurker is what makes it a shitty wagon.


You should be vigged instead.

you'd need some mass vigging with this game.

That's true. Sometime we will definitely need to lynch some lurkers, but I wouldn't say now is the time to do it. For now, we let them live, and then play Russian Roulette with them with vigilantes.

[DiamondSentinel]

It's better than lynching them.

[DiamondSentinel]

So, that's a really old post, but the mod confirmed that the Explosives and Biological(?) Weapons was one kill.

[DiamondSentinel]

You are super super behind.

[DiamondSentinel]

I assume Mirhawk wouldn't have made that comment without some kind of evidence, which puts you at a priority over a scumteam to me, because I know who you are. Don't try to frame lynching 3P as defending the Mafia. Both of 'em have to die before we can win, what difference does the order make?

I should clarify that I have a theory, not evidence.

I can lay it out though, basically it goes like this.

First of all a town player who defends themselves by blowing people up with biological weapons sounds super friggin sketchy in the first place. I haven't seen far enough into the show to confirm if this is something that the character she claimed to be would do, but using biological weapons for self defense sounds like horseshit.

Secondly, bulletproof serial killers aren't that uncommon so I don't see a SK with some sort of protective ability as being too unlikely. In fact if Vifam hadn't said who he was targeting we never would have know it was her at all, which does kinda make it a defensive ability.

Lastly, there was no kill last night that I would attribute to either a second scumteam or a SK so it's likely that Drixx's poison doc claim isn't fake. I mean if Kraska wasn't targeted there would have only been two kills last night, which isn't much for a game this size. Also since poison is kinda related to biological weapons so there's a tie in there (though kinda tenuous).

We're probably missing a kill from the poisoner yet, so I'm guessing that the poisoner is both Kraska and that shes a SK.

If she were a serial killer, that would imply that she killed them out of self-defense, which meant that she was parley to the neighborhood. Which she doesn't seem to be.

[DiamondSentinel]

If she were a serial killer, that would imply that she killed them out of self-defense, which meant that she was parley to the neighborhood. Which she doesn't seem to be.

Nah I was thinking a PGO and a SK at the same time, which wouldn't require access to the neighborhood.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that, unless her only kill was a PGO, then that would throw off balance.

Also, from a flavor standpoint, that doesn't really seem to make much sense. I can't think of an evil/non bounty-hunter, who kills reflexively. Of course, I can't think of anyone who used bio weapons and explosives, so that's already a bit bust. But whatever.

[DiamondSentinel]

@Mirhawk - Indeed. She is a necessary lynch, just about, unless we can find some other way to prove her or whatever.
@Radical Rat - With this many people, it's a safe assumption that there is a vig. Also, we had 3 kills last night. Let's hope there aren't 3 scum factions.

[DiamondSentinel]

0 because this game has stupid roles.

Then don't play.

[DiamondSentinel]

And I warned you about it in your scum pt when you asked

though it really didn't matter as noone cought it I guess

I definitely caught it. I rely on flavor a lot(maybe too much), so I notice when things don't make sense.

[DiamondSentinel]

And I warned you about it in your scum pt when you asked

though it really didn't matter as noone cought it I guess

I need to never read post-game threads ever again... All of y'all are really really negative.

Sorry the game didn't work out, FA. I'll definitely try to join one of your games again.

[DiamondSentinel]

@Nero - Question. How did I "scum claim" D2?

[DiamondSentinel]

DS I'm not sure if this has anything to do with your perception of me but my "no I'M THE TOWN LEADER" in cyberpunk was joking; don't know if you remember or not, but you discredited my reads on entry and that was my way of pushing back. I wanted to make the point that leaders aren't made because they declare themselves leaders, they are made when people start to follow. If that is not what your perception is based on then whoops.

Yeah, I took a really long break since that game. I don't really remember anything that was said aside from Dwlee's cockiness because he won.

[DiamondSentinel]

/pre-in for bastardness. I love bastard.