Because devices can be bad.
Mini 1568: Another Awesome Alliteration Adventure (over)
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Riptide Goon
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I'm bad at this.In post 45, 3dicerolling wrote:So you see them as unlynchable, but not as concrete town?-
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Have you read any of Cho's post? Pretty sure she's dead serious.In post 66, Burning_Earth wrote:@ post 59: It seemed more like a joke to me. I don't think cho was seriously suggesting they were unlynchable
@ post 60: "I don't want to say too scummy to be scum, but cho is too scummy to be scum"
@post 61: thanks
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What would you have rather me asked? Your favorite color?In post 63, Elyse wrote:
Riptide asked a dumb question that looked planted to feign scumhunting.In post 29, MTD wrote:Ah, yes, it is true we were probably already a bit further than that, nothing intentional, just wanted to come in on the game and I hadn't really put any thought into it at that point. I am ok with Elyse's vote on me for that reason, maybe with Dunhamganger's, too, cause wooo, wagons, but I am p sure I want more than "yay these people are sooo town based on RVS votes" from Cho. Staying with my vote.
Also
@Elyse: Any reason you think mnemonics Vote was good? From my POV it just looks like a pretty dull RVS-OMGUS.
I don't even... I know MTD already said something, but nowhere was the expresion "them OMGUSs are incredible" said vaguely. It's right in the middle of his first post. It can't be much clearer than it is. And why would someone cast suspicion on someone this early, especially with their RVS post?
No, you vaguely said, "them OMGUSs are incredible" which literally means nothing and places no suspicion on anyone. The fact the you call it "commenting on something" shows that.In post 29, MTD wrote: Also, The only other vote that I would maybe have found to be worth commenting on was burnings' for wagon-jumping much but Riptide already did that. Other than that I often don't find much to comment on in RVS.
And this is nearly textbook buddying. You ask what scum would automatically eliminate players from the lynch pool- newbscum would.Everyone who is voting Cho needs to stop. He's obviously newbtown. Come on. What scum (with a joindate last week) would automatically eliminate two players from the lynch pool? I agree that it's unreasonable to call people unlynchable for RVS only, but I don't see how it makes him scum at all. TSO looks to be jumping on newbtown and I think he's smarter than that, so I'm scumreading him too atm.
What does thinking TSO is smarter than jumping on a "newbtown" have anything to do with scum reading him? If he was smarter than that, why would he do it?
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Oh, and B_E, what's the case on us again?
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1In post 143, Burning_Earth wrote:1Yes but you seemed too cautious, like three votes were bad (especially when my vote was serious)
2If you were trying to ascertain the meaning of my vote you would have asked about the reasons for the vote, not the position.
3Also, I note that you (both heads) are reacting a reasonable amount to two votes.
2 I was trying to ascertain the meaning of your vote and putting emphasis on where it was.
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1) Yeah, HS said he was a little paranoid about the vote in the hydra chat, but I think it was more about the reasoning and the fact that on the site we come from, that would usually be a scum tell.In post 143, Burning_Earth wrote:Yes but you seemed too cautious, like three votes were bad (especially when my vote was serious)
If you were trying to ascertain the meaning of my vote you would have asked about the reasons for the vote, not the position.
Also, I note that you (both heads) are reacting a reasonable amount to two votes.
3) Not really. We were just curious about the angle you were working at.
Why are you scum reading Egg?
P-edit: I don't think my partner and I are posting in sync right now. I'll work on communicating better.-
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Cho - So basically, you're town reading him for his aggression, then you're scum reading him for his aggression, then you're placing him as null? Weeeeeeak.
I can understand keeping your vote on someone if you're still trying to figure someone out, but you're just leaving it there because he's mean? Mean =/= scum.
Hah I love how you try to make lurking look town.
BE - Yeah, I didn't think about how different a playstyle we might have. (It's almost like we stuck a Republican with a Democrat, lol). I guess that's the fun part about hydraing.-
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Does it not bother you that she basically contradicted herself on her TSO read? Also, doesn't it bother you that she tried to pass lurking off as town?In post 208, MTD wrote:
Her reaction to being pushed seemed genuine to me, but yeah, much of it is gut and the absence of a reason why IIn post 207, Riptide wrote:MTD - Is there something specific about Cho that doesn't make you want to lynch her? Or is it just gut?wouldwant to lynch her.-
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@MTDIn post 144, Cho wrote:a)I really want to bring myself to scumread him
i)but I reluctantly think he is town for the blind aggression
1)and yet I am also leaning toward scumreading him because I know he can be hyperaggressive to form a façade of towniness when he is scum.
a)T S O is anullleaningI-hope-you-are-scumread for me.
b)My vote is still on him because I don't like unnecessarily mean people.
4)I was lurking out the pressure like a true townfuck.-
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She said that he was town for blind aggression. She also said he leans scum because of his aggression. Either this is a contradiction or fence sitting disguised in wording.In post 219, MTD wrote:
->null read, as it was laterIn post 214, Riptide wrote:
@MTDIn post 144, Cho wrote:a)I really want to bring myself to scumread him
i)but I reluctantly think he is town for the blind aggression
1)and yet I am also leaning toward scumreading him because I know he can be hyperaggressive to form a façade of towniness when he is scum.
a)T S O is anullleaningI-hope-you-are-scumread for me.
b)My vote is still on him because I don't like unnecessarily mean people.
4)I was lurking out the pressure like a true townfuck.
->context! Direct reply to
So T S O said: "Scum motivation!", she said "Town motivation!"In post 120, T S O wrote:she's lurking out the pressure like a true scumfuck.
Still. Lurking is not town. Ever. (Unless you get in PRs, which is different, and I'm not getting in to)-
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Yes, I do. The difference is someone saying "Player A is town because of his aggression, but scum because of post whatever" and saying "Player A is town because of his aggression, but scum because of his aggression"In post 222, MTD wrote:
What? don't you ever have arguments for scum and for town on a person?In post 220, Riptide wrote:She said that he was town for blind aggression. She also said he leans scum because of his aggression. Either this is a contradiction or fence sitting disguised in wording.
Already said that, lurking is null.Still. Lurking is not town. Ever. (Unless you get in PRs, which is different, and I'm not getting in to)
Arguably lurking under pressure, as TSO said, may in general be more probably scum, not sure about that though.
I agree lurking is most often null, but trying to pass it off as town is ridiculous.-
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Okay, using NK WIFOM to justify a vote on someone is bad. It is the baddest of bads.
By the by, most of our play so far is just dice being dice. And I don't even see how he was that defensive.
Also, I just convinced dice Elyse was scum over night, so now we both have to go back and fix our reads.
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10 RVS means nothing right now.
25 MTD makes an RVS vote. Big deal. Woop-dee-doo he says people OMGUS'd. Is that really enough to deserve a serious vote? Or is it scum trying to look like they're doing something?(Yes, I'm using your own argument against you. Tit for tat.)
63 I've already commented on this one, here's the link- 78
80 Buuut I like being productive and trying to get out of RVS. So I'm going to ask a question to get us out of RVS.
Bad excuse is bad. Nowhere had you mentioned thinking that "them OMGUS's were incredible" was trying to justify anything. You just said he was trying to avoid commentary.
82 This is just WIFOM. There is no other word to describe it.
112 It's. Not. A. Dumb. Question.
114 No, you just said it was dumb. No explanation for it.
156 This post is boring for me. It felt as if it should've happened sooner, honestly.
162 Well, this is the post we're responding to above, so...(and here be it-
The RVS question (While not me, nor my specialty in RVS) actually was not as dumb as you think. It draws reactions, like yours, which was pretty scummy by the way. Considering this is a hydra, and we have to work out our thoughts together, no we did not have much content at the time, but that is changing as the game progresses.
Nowhere were the words "textbook" and "newbscum" used together. I said you were "nearly textbook buddying." To me it looked like that IF Cho flipped town, then you as scum was trying to get credit for calling her a town read. Also, you were defending her, possibly making her think you were town for doing so, simply because of the fact that you "helped" her.
Also, you criticize us for making a question, but the you also criticize us for only attacking certain people. That makes no sense. Also, at the time, the only person we really attacked was you. Everyone else we mentioned was someone we were starting to engage.
188 Yeah, um, I never knew you stopped either.
231 Yeah we are. Look at our interactions with you. Also, I watch and get reads from others' interactions with each other early D1, which is one reason I haven't been very active.
235 This is a weird post. Confirmation bias goes either way. Everybody does it. It's human nature.
237 And just a question that really IS pointless because Elyse isn't being patient.
Sorry, for the formatting of course. You'll definitely want another window open.
B_E is a ninja-
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Bad dice. Bad.In post 344, 3dicerolling wrote:Before I start working on my thoughts, I would like to respond to tool first.
@Tool - Cho's lurking was different because she was lurking under pressure.-
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Oh, and-HS
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I'm gonna use myself as an example- you read my case/ISO on Elyse? You saw how I explained what I was thinking as I was looking through the posts? Please do.In post 370, Burning_Earth wrote:In post 22, Riptide wrote:Burning_Earth- Why the third vote on Egg on pg1?In post 43, Riptide wrote:@Cho - So let me get this straight. You made those three unlynchables because of their RVS votes?
- DiceIn post 46, Riptide wrote:
I'm bad at this.In post 45, 3dicerolling wrote:So you see them as unlynchable, but not as concrete town?In post 50, Riptide wrote:What about there RVS votes make you think they should not be lynched today?
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My case on riptide.In post 347, Riptide wrote:I'm not really good with hydras yet. :p
I'm getting too many townreads. Need to talk it over with HS.
Riptide attacked cho without voting her until other people had.
Another masterpiece from B_E cases TM-
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B_E the links work fine for me. Oh, and message from dice-
To: B_E when you said that we waited for others to vote Cho before I voted
From: Dice
I was trying to figure out exactly what Cho was stating, and when I felt like I had a clear understanding I voted. It's not like I waited, not saying anything until someone voted, then jumped in and voted.
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Do I need to think he's scummy to vote him?In post 407, BipolarChemist wrote:
This is such an out of left field vote. Other than not being impressed do you think he's scummy?In post 405, Riptide wrote:Vote: Rubicon
I haven't been particularly impressed with anything you've produced so far.
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After re-reading a little, your entrance on Cho isn't bad, just not what I was expecting compared to how you entered Binding of Isaac.In post 406, Rubicon wrote:Orly
What are you reads atm? Also, why the vote on dun?-
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My gameplan as hydra is usually a little funky due to being new with hydras and having to listen to a second voice in my head (not always a bad thing though). I will admit, my play this game isn't what I hoped it would be, but I'm trying to change that now. As for my vote on Cho, I didn't really have much to say because TSO pretty much summed everything up before I could get to it. I did work on interacting with Cho in the beginning and found her reasoning and contradicting very odd.In post 412, Rubicon wrote:
That's pretty much how I feel about you (compared to Binding of Isaac & Fire and Ice) although I think your jump on the Cho wagon WAS bad. The Elyse thing is the only thing going for you frankly.In post 409, Riptide wrote:
After re-reading a little, your entrance on Cho isn't bad, just not what I was expecting compared to how you entered Binding of Isaac.In post 406, Rubicon wrote:Orly
What are you reads atm? Also, why the vote on dun?
I don't obv-town in every game though. Binding of Isaac was an unusual situation since I replaced in at L-1.
I wanted to see where the dun vote would go, answer seems to be nowhere. If dunham is town there is probably scum parked on this wagon, possibly scum distancing from it (in the players talking about how it's such a bad wagon without saying why).
toolendo town read.
Would really like for TSO to do something town with the interactions from his push on Cho yesterday.
I understand what you're saying. I think I obv town more when I replace in then when I start the game because reads are very different when you come in as a replacement.
I think Dun said he's been having computer problems, so I understand why he's been busy. I just don't understand the motive behind the Dun wagon.
I'm somewhat in agreement. He's more of leans town than straight up town, but I haven't ISO'd him, so the read might change.
@TSO and BE - Obviously I havesomereasons for voting Rubicon, like meta difference, gut, my partner saying you feel a little off and #397 feeling off, but the vote didn't have rock solid reasoning behind it. Mainly it was to draw reactions, like BPC's, which I find kind of town for calling us out.
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@BE - The fact you called out my vote on Cho and not this one really bugs me.In post 134, toolenduso wrote:OK I'm ready to vote Cho. This looks much more like the townTSO I'm familiar with than the scumTSO. Also, people's defenses of Cho against TSO's case haven't convinced me as much as what I've seen from her slot (or from most of TSO's case). Also:
This is a very good point. This is something that I have deliberately done as scum before, and it worked like a charm.In post 120, T S O wrote:It's natural that your suspicion of Cho is fading; she's lurking out the pressure like a true scumfuck.
VOTE: Cho
@Dunham: would you mind giving a serious response to my question, or was #89 as serious a response as I'm going to get?-
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I can actually answer this one. I was had a slight scum read on Elyse, but not as strong as HS, so he was trying to convince me, then BE hammered. I asked him to outline his case, so we could present it the next game day.
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Sorry, I didn't know you really cared. HS told me he's going not going to be posting all too much due to having other games.In post 442, SleepyKrew wrote:I addressed it to HS for a reason...
But w/e
Señores Riptide:
What was dice's read on Elyse before the case? How strong?
What was doce's read on Elyse after the case? How strong?
Apologies if you've answered these already. If you have, please still respond with new words instead of just quoting old stuff. Thanks
My read on Elyse was scum. It was only slightly leaning scum.
As for my read after the case, I think the best label for it is undefined. HS posted his case in the chat, but I didn't have time to read any of it before the flip came.
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Well herro to you as well, Sleepy dude. My brain isn't screwed in quite right at the moment. Dud so e turbo studying and now I can get a bunch of random facts about Model T's out of my head(did you know Ford didn't invent the car OR the assembly line?) for Acreus' sake...
But just what dice said.
-HS
Will probably do more in the morning. Working stuff over with dice.-
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Okay, so BE originally called me out because he said we waited for other people to vote Cho before voting for her, which in fact is absolute bull crap. If you look at the timing of our posts of our interactions with Cho, there were no votes added to her until from the moment we engaged her to the moment we voted her. The reason we say he should've said something about that post is because the way you worded it, it sounded like you could have been waiting to see how the wagon was going before actually voting (at the very least, you were waiting on Cho to defend herself). If you read the wording of our post, it was not "Look at Tool! He did it too!" it was more like, "By your logic, shouldn't you have called Tool out as well?". One benefit from posting this was the reactions that came from it. We gave BE some town points for calling you out on your post and not just straight up tunneling, but lost town points when he tried to call us out on a deflection that wasn't there.In post 422, toolenduso wrote:
1. Yes, either partner pairing is possible. I don't understand what the issue is here.In post 403, Jargonaut wrote: Also, I thought your working theory was that BE was my partner. Now I'm with Riptide?
And with the way multiple people on the Cho wagon voted (I.E. almost naked-ly), you don't think I could have come up with a short reason in order to join on if I'd wanted to?
2. Of course you could have come up with a short reason. But maybe you wanted a more convincing reason so people wouldn't find it scummy.
Sorry, I misread the question.In post 403, Jargonaut wrote:
I'm looking, but I don't see an answer. You gave possible motivation for me not voting someone else, but not for me keeping my vote on TSO when I was supposedly waiting to take it off anyway. What was I waiting for?In post 402, toolenduso wrote:
See above.In post 360, Jargonaut wrote:You also haven't explained to me why it makes sense for meas scumto wait to unvote if I had some better wagon to be on anyway.
The answer is, again, that there could be several scum-motivated reasons. One could be that you were waiting for somebody to give you a reason. Another could be that you were trying to stay out of the spotlight so you didn't want to vote or unvote and draw attention to yourself. Another could be that you weren't waiting at all, and rather that you just didn't believe in your case very much and so the second a townie attacked it you felt like you had to distance yourself from it.
OK. Then what I'm saying is that it looks bad to me.In post 403, Jargonaut wrote:In post 402, toolenduso wrote:
Uh...I looked through your ISO just now and found a post where you responded to Cho challenging your read on TSO. That was the post where you unvoted TSO. But I didn't see anything where you responded to Cho talking about your unvote. I'm not even sure Cho did talk about your unvote.In post 360, Jargonaut wrote:I already responded to Cho when she said that exact same thing. You've read the post, I'm sure, seeing as you already quoted it.
Can you point to the post you're referring to?
That is what I responded to. Note that you didn't say anything about my unvote here. You had a list of 3 items which had to do with myIn post 352, toolenduso wrote:
You're getting bogged down in the fringes of what I said. The core of my argument is this. These behaviors:
-Retracting the biggest part of your argument for scumreading someone
-Declaring that they are still your biggest suspect
-Keeping your vote on them anyway
Seem scummy to me because they contradict each other and therefore suggest that your motives aren't genuine.keepingmy vote on TSO despite dropping the meta-related part of my argument, which is something I already responded about when Cho brought it up.
Lol this should be fun. Let's quote all the times I've listed the possible scum motivations:In post 403, Jargonaut wrote:
This is a very odd thing to say. Up until this post, you hadn't noted any scum motivation, so you responding to me with this makes it seem like you're trying to make my arguments look redundant when they aren't.In post 402, toolenduso wrote:
I've noted the scum motivation several times now.In post 360, Jargonaut wrote:The reason I said your scenario is convoluted is because there doesn't seem to be scum motivation for me to do the things you are saying I did.
Spoiler: All the times I've given possible scum motivations for Jargonaut's actions
Please elaborate on why he should have called me out for my vote instead of/along with yours, because from where I'm sitting this looks like a very sneaky way of pushing suspicion on to somebody else.In post 417, Riptide wrote:
@BE - The fact you called out my vote on Cho and not this one really bugs me.In post 134, toolenduso wrote:OK I'm ready to vote Cho. This looks much more like the townTSO I'm familiar with than the scumTSO. Also, people's defenses of Cho against TSO's case haven't convinced me as much as what I've seen from her slot (or from most of TSO's case). Also:
This is a very good point. This is something that I have deliberately done as scum before, and it worked like a charm.In post 120, T S O wrote:It's natural that your suspicion of Cho is fading; she's lurking out the pressure like a true scumfuck.
VOTE: Cho
@Dunham: would you mind giving a serious response to my question, or was #89 as serious a response as I'm going to get?
@TSO and Jargonaut: If you were to vote for anybody right now, who would it be?
@Rubicon and The Betting Pool: I'd like to hear some more explanation for your votes.
At this point, BE is just trying to fabricate reasoning on us that's not even there.-
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Vote: TheBettingPool
This is mainly gut and that I feel that this slot has been coasting through this game. HS isn't exactly sure yet.
SK - I for one, have never been a big fan of mass claiming, but I have had very little experience in situations where mass claiming is helpful, so I would love to discuss your thoughts on why it would be a good time now.
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I can see how you can take that perspective, but I'd think scum would jump on a fellow scum's wagon later rather than sooner. It's more of a bandwagon than a bus IMO, but obviously that's my perspective because I know I'm town.In post 594, T S O wrote:Dice, thoughts on the above?
Makes sense to me. Honestly, I'm no expert in this category.In post 595, SleepyKrew wrote:TSO, how do you differentiate a bad bus from scum not knowing which townie to vote because they're not sure how to fake genuine scumhunting?
PEDIT:
Dice, I'm assuming worst-case-but-still-in-the-game, which would be 3v2 LYLO tomorrow. The earlier you claim, the harder it is to make stuff up later. Massclaims in general are a good idea because they give information to town and force scum to think on their feet. Early massclaims are bad because then they give too much info to the scum, but I think it's late-enough in the game that benefits outweigh risks at this point. I think.
I'll take a look at it. HS and I are both reading Tool as town at this point.In post 596, SleepyKrew wrote:
... one game?In post 590, T S O wrote:idk about tool. you're right that his push was weak, bad, whatever, but I've played scum with tool before and when he interacts with you, he puts in effort. if him and Jargo were scumbuddies, meta tells me his reaction would be a lot more concerted. I don't really know his town meta, I guess.
Open 545, btw.
he clearlywasputting in effort with Jargonaut
but I think he eased off the gas when he realized no one was paying attention to them because of B_E
also hightideofdice, thoughts on my tool case?-
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Riptide Goon
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 183
- Joined: April 13, 2014
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Riptide Goon
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 183
- Joined: April 13, 2014
A lot of this stuff is stuff that's already been said. Vote is the 5th vote on the most popular wagon.In post 164, The Betting Pool wrote:VOTE: Cho
Frankly there is nothing going for this girl. Her absence while she waited for the pressure to leave didn't work, and she admits that is what she was trying to do. How is that town in anyway? Town know that sometimes they will die and they should accept that and give as much info before their death by arguing their case so when they get mislynched it can be analyzed later by surviving town.
Cho are you sure you're a veteran of this site? There are mean people here who's play style is basically just to be a jerk. So your point's 2b and 2bi shouldn't be said, and I think you just posted that to try and explain some of your scummy activity away.
Why are you backing off on the unlynchable thing? I would of liked you more for town if you stuck to it... Don't try to appease us by backing off it please.
Oh come on! You've been skimming the thread for instances of your name? Are you just compulsively admitting to your own scum behavior? Are you a jester or something?
Why are you asking for us to ask you questions when you think you are going to be mislynched today? Scum fear the hunt of a town person about to be mislynched because after the flip all the information they gather is confirmed to be from a town source. How about you start asking some questions instead? There wasn't one "?" in that whole post and that is why you are scum.
-Lucky
Sheeps BPC and is the 4th vote on most popular wagon.In post 379, The Betting Pool wrote:
be nice...In post 376, BipolarChemist wrote:Your posts suck shit, B_E.
I agree with your vote on Dunham and until P_A forces me to change it, let me join you
VOTE: dunham
Question though, you have B_E and Dunham as scum reads. If one flips town does it hurt your read of the other? In other words, are you reading them as a team or separate?
Reasoning for BE vote isn't very good. This is the 4th vote on the most popular wagon.In post 458, The Betting Pool wrote:So Lucky and I got to chat a bit last night, and I'm good moving our vote in light of that.
VOTE: Burning_Earth
Lucky is the half of the hydra that has experience quickhammering people in non-is-scum-in-LyLo situations, and he agrees with me that Burning_Earth really isn't playing like town who messed up and wants to make amends.
tool, explanation for the vote, Lucky thought Dunhamganger looked like scum. I disagreed, but since I didn't have a strong scum read of my own I was all right leaving our vote there. Now I do, and I even got us synched up on it for now.
Incidentally, I'm currently comfortable calling tool town based on differences between this and Micro 318. Lucky's only willing to go as far as 'not scum' but I'm leaning on him. Other recently completed experience with MTD-wise, I have a weaker sense that this is town-MTD. Not as strong as tool, but I was always better at the contrasting parts than the comparing ones.
--PA
All of TBP's votes (excluding RVS) have been votes with reasoning that has already been expressed or something not very good smack dab in the middle of the most popular wagons. If this isn't coasting and bandwagoning all game, I don't know what is.-
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Riptide Goon
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 183
- Joined: April 13, 2014
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Riptide Goon
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 183
- Joined: April 13, 2014
@SK - I know this is a little weak, but I wanted to discuss it with my second head without going out on my own because we were both town reading Tool.In post 607, Riptide wrote:Must've thought I already read it when I was on my phone. My mistake.
I see what you're saying. I do agree that it seems really odd how quick it was dropped without any notice. I like my vote where it is for now though.
P-EDIT: Yeah, it wasn't as much on inactivity as it was on coasting.
Yeah so, HS and I are basically split on reads. We do agree Egg is town, and somewhat on our BPC read, but otherwise we're split. I'm going to try to talk things out with him, so we can have a clearer understanding on our reads.
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