Mini 1524: Olympian Gods Mafia - Game Over

[Whiskers]

For instance,

here

, its common courtesty to unvote when you replace in, as you don't have reads on anybody, and you don't know if keeping your vote on a person might let their lynch go through before you're through catching up.

Of c, I wouldn't mind hearing how you actually

do

read my slot so far.

[Whiskers]

Comment on the thread.
If you're so set in "doing it your way" that you can't function, you'll likely end up toDay's lynch.

[Whiskers]

Let me rephrase that: Comment on the vast amount of bullshit, point out things that

have already been said

that you think are telling. You can't work from live reactions alone-- and you don't need to, because it's forum mafia.

[Whiskers]

whee, the slowness is upon us!

[Whiskers]

Whiskers, fitz, what's your flavor for neighborizing?

Oh, right.

I don't know, I haven't done it yet.

[Whiskers]

I guess I'm not sure what you're asking, Wisdom. I'm Apollo, and I can choose someone to neighbourize, and then we get a Quicktopic together.

Maybe see if someone else answers your question with a better answer.

[Whiskers]

Oh, is it because I rule over the day?
...I'm specifically not-quoting, but it says it in a much cooler way.

[Whiskers]

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Sun_Domain

[Whiskers]

I did.

.__.

I am apollo, the god of light and music and stuff,

I have power during the day.

That's pretty much it.

[Whiskers]

wrt flavour? Yeah.
There's also a picture of Apollo, if that counts for anything.

The rest is-- wait, let me show you.

Role Name & Role

I am apollo, the god of light and music and stuff,

[IMAGE]

I have power during the day.

Explanation of the ability.

Then my wincondition.

Then my role-confirm method.

[Whiskers]

What I asked is how it's explained that you can neighborize.

Probably because I'm the god of "the prophecy" (I

am

quoting there). But under the "Ability" section, it says merely, that, "carpe diem, you're a neighborizer."

[Whiskers]

"You love the sun, so you moved to florida where you're hailed as a god."

[preedit]
Wait, you said "it works other ways" but then said, "it's the same." What?

[Whiskers]

So Fitz, since we'd presumably already turn up guilty on Mala, and our QTs work in opposite game-phases,
What do you say we neighbourize each other, and become a bona-fide mason team?

Ok, that will do.

Whiskers is fakeclaiming.

Whoa, whoa, wait, what? What are you basing that on? We both have a single sentence for flavour.
Like-- I normally wouldn't mind you voting me, but I'm not sure how you're coming to your conclusion.

[Whiskers]

You said you have no flavor.

Quote that--

But under the "Ability" section, it says merely, that, "carpe diem, you're a neighborizer."

Oh. That's actually pretty funny.

No, that was a "day" pun.
Considering I had told you that I had flavour before, paraphrased it before, shown you an outline of my role PM, with flavour, before, I wasn't trying to suddenly retract the fact that I do.

It's just that I only have like, two sentences: one is in my Role name/summary, the other is the first sentence of my "Ability" section.

[Whiskers]

So anyone got any excuses for this one, or can we finally lynch scum?

So, again, please explain.

[Whiskers]

Everyone's abilities are explained in flavor. They go "As the god(dess) of x, you have y ability".
Whiskers failed to provide what it says for him. Like we were saying with Nacho, his claim is a fake. That explains why he suddenly switched from "day-neighborizer" to "i neighborize at night as well, but i make daytalk" too.

Dude, my ability is literally called "Day Neighborizer". Like, direct quote.

My flavour doesn't explain

why

I can neighborize people, it explains

when

.
Further, I don't have unlimited uses, like fitz.

What's the point of a QT cop if there's 3+ false positives, Elyse?

Hm..

Hence why I'm suspicious of that claim, and/or suspicious of it being a scum role.

[Whiskers]

That's weird when 4 people have said it does and mine also does.

What?
Who else is this? Fitz, and who else?

But anyway, let's say yours is different because of different role. How do you explain that for the two other neighborizers it's explained how they neighborize but for him it isn't?

Again, Fitz is the other neighborizer who claimed "flavor, flavor"- did Nacho claim this too? I remember him claiming to be crippled, and you say, 'Ah, hence the restriction', but did he ever claim his role PM said, "You are Hepatitis, and therefore have contact with a lot of gods", or flavour of that style?

Regardless, each role is written individually.

Ofc, that's answered with 2313 and 2315.
Which leads me to say, Desparado's attempts at white knighting me here are well-meaning and well-appreciated, but, imo, misled. I agree with wisdom, it does look like they say

why

they neighborize. Mine is just that I have power in the day. Apparently that power happens to be neighborizing.

I would ask Wisdom this, though (if it hasn't been asked already (except by iirc fitz, who did)):
I was the first one to claim I already had my quicktopic active as part of my role pm. How can this be? Lucky guess? Inside information? Ockham's Razor says that I know what's in the role PM because I

have

the role PM.

And hey, you like meta, right? Perhaps an other player I've played with can vouch for me here: My meta, as town and scum, is to, generally, tell the truth. Why would I lie about this?
If I have to come up with a lie, why would I have claimed right away at all? I was sitting at a pretty nice, fairly-solid townread from nearly everybody, why jeopardize that with a claim I have to make up? Why would I lie about this?
Being a neighborizer is a role that we've already discussed is likely to come as either a town-role, or a scum-role. Claiming isn't going to confirm me, it's not even going to help me a little. Not even a weak town-tell for me to claim neighborizer. If I were going to make up a claim that I had to lie about, why would I claim something useless? Why would I gambit for nothing? Why would I lie about this?

Am I just scum with an erection for danger? Do I merely want a brush with death? To play necksies with the business end of a noose? Am I lying just so I can have a chance to get caught? So you can have a chance to catch me? Am I just arrogant scum, Wisdom, dear?
Even if I

were

lying-- and let me tell you, hun, you're stretchin' a bit there-- why would I lie?

[Whiskers]

Consider a moment the transition to Desperado coming in to post he completely jives with Wisdom's reads and pushes:

Matt/Mala/Mirari seems like a fine scumteam to me.

To immediately, within one post, turning into a vulgar and hostile monster. The transition is so incredibly awkward it has to be fabricated

Seriously, god forbid I should have thoughts or ideas? And under no circumstances should I have answered a question posed to me by another player! What the hell is your problem? Your posts aren't even game related-- this should have been a refutation from you-- they're just you, being an annoying cunt. Go away.

How about you don't call people cunt's and shit?

Jesus christ

Can I pretend this is a fucking accident?
Tell me this is an accident, Matt.
WHOA, THE TRANSITION FROM ONE POST, TO A POST THAT CAME WAY BEFORE IT, WHOOOOOAAAAA!!!!!

So let's just skip on over that, shall we, sweetheart?

Yeah right.

Whiskers/Desp/nacho

the fuck is that supposed to mean

Is he hostile because he said "fuck"? If that's you're gripe, I should point out that he said "shit" two posts before this one (or one post before the first one you quoted).

I buy the stupidity from shos but not from you. There's absolutely zero doubt mala is town now yet you keep acting retarded about it and even replaced mollie instead of her.

Get real, asshole.

Whoa, so hostile!
Maybe he got fed up with Wisdom's bullshit.
But, ok, let's say this is hostile. Look at the post he's responding to?

Actually, wait.
wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

What the fucking hell are you arguing?

To immediately, within one post, turning into a vulgar and hostile monster. The transition is so incredibly awkward it has to be fabricated

Oh, so basically,
"He said a bad word!"

But seriously, like I said, he was cursing the post before the first one you quoted.
If your problem is, instead, when being baselessly (and weakly) accused, going, "the fuck is that supposed to mean?" was

too hostile

for your precious sensitivities, then you might have a problem...
You're stretching. And you're stretching something that's not even a scumtell.

[Whiskers]

So would you both of you just fucking go back to catching scum?

[Whiskers]

I don't care why you did it, you're fakeclaiming and it's the most solid evidence we have.

Which is to say, you have no evidence.

I guess we already knew that, it

is

Day 1. But by now you've built up this illusion that you actually had some kind of, I don't know, support behind your attacks...

Anyway,

vote: shos

Wisdom has hardly proven himself a pirate. Get off of his shoulder and speak for yourself.

@Grimgroove: Why nacho?

[Whiskers]

I don't care why you did it, you're fakeclaiming and it's the most solid evidence we have.

Which is to say, you have no evidence.

I guess we already knew that, it

is

Day 1. But by now you've built up this illusion that you actually had some kind of, I don't know, support behind your attacks...

Anyway,

vote: shos

Wisdom has hardly proven himself a pirate. Get off of his shoulder and speak for yourself.

first point was directed at wisdom but I'll address it too. Town don't

need

support to scumhunt.

Wrong.

they just do that. by covincing others, they will earn their support; not just have it from the beginning to start with.

...ok, I was looking for synonym for evidence, since I had already used that word.

we have evidence against you mate; our role PMs.

Incorrect. Even by your own reasoning-- which follows-- this is not good evidence.

in many peeps' PMs the ability has flavor explanation for it.

In

many

? So, I'm clearly not the only standout here. Why does that make me... actually, nobody is arguing that it makes me scum, the argument is that I'm lying.

you supposedly don't,

Incorrect.

and are the only one who doesn't..

Incorrect.

this means taht you don't actually have that ability that you say you do.

This is a big jump in the logic-- especially since the last two points were false.

we practically know that there's gotta be some scum in the pack of three neighbourizers.

No, you don't. You know nothing of the setup. The closest you can come is your own understanding of game setup & balance, (aka, "outguess the mod") and that doesn't really apply in a theme game.

regarding the second point, wisdom is not a pirate at all. he's literally attacked..everyone. his reads are up and down so often and so quickly it's llike, well, *censored*. I'm not following wisdom here. I'm just coincidentally(lol) agreeing with what he says about you. and I'm in tons of work this week so don't expect me to restart making my superwalls like I did with wisdom atthe time.

You agree about me, and nearly everyone else.

penguin is town. sorta active lurking in the tunnel, yes, but still town.

Case in fucking point.

Look for partners after you get a scumflip. Which you won't get from penguin.

[Whiskers]

Grim claimed Virgin to give Matt's neighborizer claim more strength. I doubt this would happen if they are both scum. Agree?

The other Virgins have not claimed despite Grim encouraging them to do so if they exist (1924). Would a scum Virgin claim or not seeing a Town Virgin claiming?

1) Yes. Grim-scum wouldn't link his fate to scumbuddy Matt so early. I can see Grim-scum linking to Matt-town.

2) That's surprising.

Point towards: (Speculation) Given that I'm suspicious of fitz as scum and fitz NEI claimed after the other two - I think scum virgin would have claimed.

Point Against: However, Quick ISO however reveals that fitz claimed way back in #1791. Maybe scum virgin figured out the one scum in three rule for NEIs and VIR and decided it's better not to claim?

Let's give it some time for others to read this again (maybe they missed 1924). But Grim looks much better if a second person claims but we do not get a third.

Whyyyy does scumGrim want to strengthen townMatt's claim!?
Why does wanting to help someone out make them both LESS likely to be scum together!?
Why does wanting to help someone out make the helper MORE likely to be scum than the one getting help!?

ESPECIALLY SINCE SCUM WOULD JUST

NOT CLAIM

AND LET MATT GET LYNCHED!

[Whiskers]

1/ Nachomamma still not scumhunting.
2/ MattP having dissapeared after having lost his town-leader position and his unquestioned universal townread.
3/ MattP's claim circumstances and motives still being as scummy as before.
4/ Both of the above's early strong defending of Malakittens with objectively stupid arguments.
5/ Ika not in any way turining around the bad impression mollie left on us.

I want to lynch one of those three. Soon.

I like this. I'm not totally sold on you being town, Grimgroove, but nothing says I can't be suspicious of you and vote with you, too. I'm fairly down for Matt, and for Ika. Although, I'd like to see how Ika answers the questio directed to him first.

[Whiskers]

Wis whis malmatmol ooba gg nacho me peng
Oh mirari

What the fuck even is this?
God. Your ability to spell words has, overall, decreased significantly, and sometimes you say shit that just makes absolutely no sense. I don't mean logically or anything, I mean that, for example, you make a list of names.

Without context, too. You start the post by giving your reads and who we should lynch and why-- and then you make this list, with all of those names out of order. Unless you'd really lynch Wisdom first, and unless you'd really lynch yourself before Penguin.

Seriously, what the hell, man?

[Whiskers]

I like Nacho, Desperado, and Penguin, on this page.
I'm not super happy with GG, who is kind of excitable, the Mirari that penguin quoted from (I think?) a page ago, and shos.

Based only on the posts since the last votecount, I'd lynch:
Mirari, Shos.

[Whiskers]

ika or Nacho. Maybe Desp.

What about them?

and, since I probably know that already, why?

[Whiskers]

Well, when Mollie was around, you seemed to think her slot was too dumb to scum, for a while-- until she was dumb and intereacted with you, when she became so dumb, she

was

scum.
Nacho, you haven't had a scumread on for a while, not since before Mala/Matt/Mollie, iirc.
Desp, Idk. I just like him. He's mah bro.

[Whiskers]

Also, I wouldn't not-lynch ika, he's like if you took all the AtE from mollie and replaced it with nothing. The posts coming from that slot aren't really any less stupid-- nor do they show any less stubbornness, with ika saying, "We do things differently around there!" and using that as a reason to keep the same style he has on a different site...

Yeah.

I just wondered why you, wisdom, put ika in that list of whatever it is.

Besides, if I'm not mistaken, if the mollie slot flips scum, we can go right up to lynching shos again.

[Whiskers]

Of course, all of that could merely be noobishness.
For example, this:

2/ MattP having dissapeared after having lost his town-leader position and his unquestioned universal townread.

Considering he has been on V/LA, this is bad.

Why?

Ika, it's bad because (if what everybody in the quote chain is saying is true), that means MattP didn't "dissapear" for scummy reasons (such as, he's no longer a town power, he wants to stay out of the spotlight, or he's lurking); it means he disappeared because he was on

V

acation, or

L

imited

A

ccess-- V/LA.

I guess the difference between this player in the mollie slot, and mollie herself, will be to see if this fellah actually engages you in conversation, where mollie was content to just smash her giant head into arguments.

[Whiskers]

You don't remember correctly

I do sometimes have false memories.
Which am I wrong on?

And, are you just calling up old scumreads because the newer scumreads are no longer scumreads? Or something? It seems like you're just keeping all of your options open-- and I don't mean it in a scummy way, in this instance. I mean that, you seem willing to turn your attack on any player, should they strike you as scum. You're not set against anybody.

Of course, when I say it, I now remember I think you've never gone after, say, penguin.

[Whiskers]

It means exactly what it says.

Ok Wis. And, I even remember the bit about Nacho-- you said something about how, if Mala somehow wasn't Scum, Nacho was instead.

Why Desp, then?
Also, what about me?
Also, why Mollie/ika? Really I remember the vote on her (and consequent scumread) being about how she was dodging your question, then kind-of answered your question, then said "I didn't say that!"-- that whole business. Is there something else about the slot you don't like? (Because, like I said, at first you were like, "Yo, this is all to mollie's townmeta."

I was going to ask what you thought about Malakittens all but disappearing now that you're townreading her, but I looked and saw she's VLA. So nvm.

What about, then, Penguin, who only has 59 posts, or ooba, who has been surprisingly sparse, or Mirari, who has been getting some heat recently.
Ok, ok, so I know I basically asked you for a reads list. But I wonder what you think of individual players that you're

not

focussed on. Essentially, I maybe just don't know where your reads lie. As the most vocal town-leader (no matter your own alignment), Your opinion is kind of important.

[Whiskers]

@ ika

What is your homesite, and what was your username there?

[Whiskers]

The site is

actually

going down repeatedly, and sporadically, right? It's not just something wrong with my computer?

[Whiskers]

Now this is a rather odd question. I don't mind giving it but i must ask. why?

Answer me first.

[Whiskers]

@whiskers2473:
Your ability to nitpick is incredible. That was me writing the names of ppl in the game, trying to say what i think about all of them. I dont remember all the names so i wrote it down. The "oh mirari" part shoild make it clear - the pne i cmissed was mirari.
Of allvthat post i made this is all you have to say eh? That my spelling capabilities whileposting from phone is not perfect?
You justify my vote on you repeatedly.

It's because 2247 really has nothing else I can comment on. I'm struggling to read your posts most of the time-- and even in tone, you've become the new pirate mollie, haven't you?
What am I supposed to say to "Lynch whiskers, whiskers is the lynch because she claimed neighbour without flavour (even though I didn't claim without flavour) and Day (even though you haven't pointed out why that would be a scum-trait)."

Also, if what you explain here is the case, you fucking forgot Desp, way to go.

[Whiskers]

@ Whiskers

wrt Post 2071...why at the Neighborizors all being viewed as anti-town roles? 

That's the theory, isn't it?
 

@ Whiskers

wrt Post 2197...that's wrong.  A town QT cop is more valuable than a scum QT cop because wtf would scum care who the neighbors were and who they might have neighbored?  Whereas a town QT cop (as has been mentioned several times already iirc) can catch people in a lie.  Unless every person on the scum team has claimed neighbor...then there are players out there who would come back to a town QT cop investigation has having a posivive result...and have some explaining to do.  I will probably neighbor but it will only be on other neighbors.  I think it is in our best interest to minimize the number of players who are claimed to be in QTs to maximize Mala's chance (if telling the truth) of finding someone with a QT who didn't fess up to it.  Your inability to see this is concerning.

I'm perfectly able to see it. Are

you

able to see that the chance of the thing functioning in the way you think it will, is minuscule? All

I

am doing, is questioning the assertion that the role

must be town

, "because it would be useless as scum." It's already very,

very

unlikely to work,

AND

we have to shoot ourselves in the foot-- effectively disabling three of our other power roles-- for it to even have a

shot

of helping.

In the end, it's fucking closed, theme game, and you don't fucking know what the roles are or what the setup is.
Ok?
I don't care that you disagree with me, but don't act all "Oh my god whiskers, how can't you see this!?" Instead, take your head far enough out your ass that you can question all of the matter-of-fact bullshit that you're coming in later to "catch up on".

And you know? I was going to call you a sheep. But yeah. Catchup posts. You can go ahead and be scum.

[Whiskers]

and I would like to hear your explanation about the 'change in tone - becomes new pirate mollie'. what tone is it that I'm using?

that is just such a useful answer oh my gawd!!

[Whiskers]

That mess around the claim is bad, and the latest posting of whis is freaking horrible,

dat nitpicking, ignoring and posting on irrelevant stuff.

whis does have some goot content here and there but I really dunno.

I'm thinking maybe to just let it go and call him wtfnull just like wisdom, and go back to voting matt -_-; lemme get some other games first, I'll need to refresh.

I swear to god I will fuckking lynch you for this shit.

I am

always

nit-picking. That's the fucking point of the game, idiot.
I am not ignoring fucking

anything

. If I'm ignoring something, bring it up to me, and I will go ahead and fucking pick it right the fuck

clean

of nits.
I am not "posting on irrelevant stuff." There

IS NO IRRELEVANT STUFF. IT'S A FUCKING MAFIA GAME. EVERYTHING IN THE THREAD, RELATED TO THE GAME OR IT'S PLAYERS, IS RELEVANT.

WANNA FUCKING TRY AGAIN, MOUSE?

But no, seriously. Bring up all the "irrelevant stuff" I'm posting. I think I mentioned my pokemon game like, a hundred years ago.

No more accusing people of "posting irrelevant stuff". Not from

anybody

.

[Whiskers]

I agree that fitz sounds sheepish in some of his posts. I'm not that sure about him being town anymore.

Let me see if I can wiggle that lever a little bit more, maybe free up that read of yours just a

little

bit further.

Not a fan of ika's posting.

Oh, cool, are you asking him questions like I'm doing, to see if he's scum? Want to investigate that shit

any

?
 

I agree that fitz sounds sheepish in some of his posts. I'm not that sure about him being town anymore.

VOTE: ika[/quote]
Ah, I see, that's a 'no'.

Guess you're scum!

[Whiskers]

ooba, you've been calling me scum for a while now. Time to put your arguments where your mouth is.

are you saying 'vote me if you dare'? O_o; what's the point of this?
GG: what is your opinion about the setup spec? would you say that there's a scum in the neighbourizers pool?

No, I'm telling him what is written down. Not "vote me if you dare". I don't ask for votes, I ask for arguments. The point of asking for that should be obvious. I remember him saying something along the line sof me being some kind of Mafia Godfather and my virgin status being proof of that. Obviously, this isn't an argument.

I gave my opinions about the set-up spec and my own stab at it around a week ago. Your question is proof of this game simply dragging to the deadline. Do the reasonable thing and jump on the obvtown train consisting op people who put time and energy in this game when it actually mattered and vote ika. Thank you.

It's called "Argument from repetition."

[Whiskers]

That's what shos meant by ignoring. You acting like grim never explained that or me never suspecting nacho etc.
Of course, you're not the only one doing that and it's not scummy in any way, but I figured you wanted to know.

Acting like Grim never explained what?

Unless you mean, "I didn't acknowledge GG's post" until just now.
Because if that's what you mean, and if that's what he means, if that's what's passing for "ignoring" these days,

[Whiskers]

Not only. Example wouldbe 2447, for which the only comment was OMFG YOU SUCK LEARN TO SPELL

Oh, my dear boy, that's because 2447 had literally nothing else in it!

Ph my gawd 28 pages :0

What a great way to start off a post. "I'm way behind and still have the time to act like a complete tool." First impressions!

Anyway if we were lynching someone for not obeying your plans immediately we would have all been dead by now. He *has* posted since so im just guessing that equals no. I dont agree to such a lynch reason lol.

I'm pretty sure this refers to the "is ika a Virgin, is ika claiming Virgin/Not" bit going on at the time.
If this is the case, then ika posting since then would not equal "no", it would equal "avoidance". Which, really, would be a better reason to lynch him than any claim he could have made.
Of course, the shit about Wisdom turning his gun on anybody is old-ass news. Why are you bringing it up?

If we go by claims, whiskers should be lynched, dat claim without flavor in ability andd that mess around day/night. He is one of the nei claims so thats OK cuz its a small lynch pool.

I'm not sure I can discuss this; I'm biased. Let me assert again and again that I don't have "No flavour in ability," and then clarify that the flavour explains why I Neighborizer power

in the Day,

not why I have a Neighborizer power. I could understand you pushing the angle that "Day-talk is really more useful for scum", but you're not. You're just saying, "WHOA, WEIRD!"
Of course, I'm talking to the guy who thought my bit about moving to florida was a direct quote from my role PM, so.

If we dont hunt by role setupspec and assumptions, then im OK with matt, mala, and probably thats it.

Oh, that's nice. No mention of the fact that Matt is

also

a Neighborizer, and Mala has been, apparently, cleared because of her role. But, no fair enough, your premise was that we're

not

taking the role claims and setup spec into account.
Because, for some reason, you think that it's black and white; you either lynch someone based

solely

on mechanics, or you lynch them

entirely

without use of that information.

But let me go ahead and point out, maybe this is telling of you, my darling shos!

This tells me you don't think I'm scum. You want to lynch me, based solely on my claim? Hunting

without

"role setupspec and assumptions," I'm perfectly town, and you'd lynch only Matt and Mala? Yet you're pushing my lynch- even had your vote on me.

I have a townread on peng although mirari gave me a point to think about regarding him. Townread on ooba is strong, very sttong. Null on ika and nacho, ika cuz mollie was meh and ika is meh to the other side, and i alwaus have real hard time reading nacho. Might iso him if i have time.

Then there's this big list of reads that are basically "Null, town, null, null, null, not sure." Don't give any reasons for any of that shit, of course, either.

Wisdom is omgwtfnull. His posting has very many omgus- he callspractically everyone scum if they dont agree with him/act as he wants, and hes a little dense in many cases and stubborn as hell. But all these are not alignment telling and by now i have no idea how to read him.

Oh, and hey, something new! Add a "null" to that list, past-Whiskers!
But in all honesty, shos has really turned up the brain-juice with this little snippet, in which he recounts that, Wisdom attacks lots of people, and-- er, nevermind, that's it. shos devoted an entire paragraph to saying, "I don't know how to read Wisdom, Wisdom omgus'es, Wisdom is stubborn, I don't know how to read Wisdom."
Sigh. We knew this already. In fact, most of us have been readily observing it.

But thanks for the update, you beautiful mouse.

Des needs to participate more. Honestly, i remember mollie more than him. Dont remember shit about him.

Oh, my bad. You didn't forget Desperado, you only forgot him later.
Btw, "Null".

GG has his sparks and im leaning town on him from gamestart behavior, but his claim puts him in a pool likely to contain scum and ooba is supertown so we'll see eventually.

"Null". Or, more accurately, "Town, but possibly scum."

Wis whis malmatmol ooba gg nacho me peng
Oh mirari
Well hmm. Mirari can be scum. Can. Im thinking town, but this is a very weak read.

Oh and fitz yes duh well. I think he is town. His catchup was good iirc.



Think this prettymuch sums up what i can remember.

And then this shit! I included it just for the sake of completeness. Wouldn't want to "ignore" anything!

<3

[Whiskers]

shos' reads list as of 2447

shos - himself

ooba

- "strong"

town

Malakittens

-

town

from setup,

scum

from scumhunting

Wisdom

- omgbbq (

null

)

Nachomamma8

-

null

havingfitz

-

Town

. "His catchup was good" (despite the fact that those are super easy to counterfeit.)

penguin_alien

-

null

Desperado

- "I don't remember him";

Null

.

ika

-

null

Whiskers

-

scum

from setup,

town

from scumhunting

MattP

-

town

from setup,

scum

from scumhuntinng

Grimgroove

- leaning

town

from "gamestart behaviour", but claim puts him in a likely-

scum

pool?

Null

.

Mirari

- "Can" be

scum

, but has a very weak

town

read on him. Fencesitting at worst, "

null

" at best.

Does this look about right, Doc?

[Whiskers]

the flavour explains why I Neighborizer power in the Day

-.-
Can you explain again what your flavor says?

It's something like, "The day is your domain, you have power during the day." And I'm paraphrasing because I'm not going back to look, but that's approximately what it says. Uses the word "domain" and all that shit. Why I made that post linking to the D&D "Sun Domain" cleric shit.

Whiskers you're still having that tendency to criticize playstyles. What's the point of what you're doing now?

I believe it's called "discrediting."

[Whiskers]

Go back and look. Does it say anything more other than the domain stuff? It doesn't make any sense that it's not said why you're a neighborizer.

No.
It does not say why power.
It does say why Day-power.

[Whiskers]

Please instead discuss shos having all null reads, except for two town reads, one read that relies on only using setup speculation and claims, and two more that intentionally exclude that information.

[Whiskers]

Fair enough. How about the fact that shos is attacking me for having "ignored" his post with all null reads?

[Whiskers]

I explained what he meant by ignoring.

Yeah, and then he corrected you.
He corrected you, wisdom. He said, "yeah, that,

AND

my shitty post with a bunch of null reads."

Looks like whiskers started reading. The forced conclusions are wrong inherently tho. Ill read the longwall and explain more from computer. Till then, im still strictly against a lynch based on setup spec with no flips.

Pedit these are not all null reads. My nulls arenacho, des, and nullwtf in wisdom. You trying to cut it black or white is wrong.instead you can divide it to 'will lynch *today*' and will nit.

Bullshit.
In fact, bullshit on both. You're voting me based solely on my claim shit, and you're "against a lynch based on setup spec"??
They are

nearly

all null reads. You have two town reads. Everything else is "null" or "They might be town, but they might be scum," or "Maybe they're scum, otherwise town."

Btw i find it funny that you said nothing can be said about my post and then you post a lifelong wall of china aboit it

I took the time to eat and digest your umbrella-full-of-dogshit post. Because you said I "ignored" it. Pick a fight with me, shos.

[Whiskers]

The moment you were voted - first time in the entire game - you freaked out like a madman and started spewing crap in wisdom's posting speed. That is not how town respond to fire. Liar, liar, your pants are on fire, mate.

What?!

I don't remember this at all, I'll have to look it up. It sounds hilarious though.

[Whiskers]

The moment you were voted - first time in the entire game - you freaked out like a madman and started spewing crap in wisdom's posting speed. That is not how town respond to fire. Liar, liar, your pants are on fire, mate.

What?!

I don't remember this at all, I'll have to look it up. It sounds hilarious though.

Wait, shos, do you mean when Wisdom voted me? On like, page 85?

Because Wisdom's vote was

off

of me again, by the next time I posted. The only other vote on me at that time was ika, a remnant from when pirate mollie was still in the slot.

(I also think I remember being voted a little bit earlier in the game, but whatever.)

You think I'm scum because... I argued with Wisdom, even after he unvoted me? I didn't argue to get the vote off, I argued

even though the vote was already off

.
I freaked out like a madman? The moment I was voted? Come on. Whose pants are on fire here?

[Whiskers]

Order of events:

Wisdom votes me.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: whiskers

shos I'd tell you to stop being braindead once again, but I'm apparently talking to a wall. Or to scum.

You, shos, make a post about how town I am and Wisdom should stop voting me.

Wisdom, if many people disagree with you, it means that there is, in fact, doubt that mala is town. I too still believe that matt and mala are scum together; you are at teh moment voting WHISKERS who is by far more townie than both of them, and even with the confusion with the claim, I see no way in which you'd vote whiskers over matt. I know matt's having ifnals lately but seriously, look at his latest posts.

For reasons unrelated to that^, Wisdom votes ika instead.

VOTE: ika

Then I make two posts, catching up on what I missed 2162, and 2163-- I've linked them instead of quoting them because one is sort of long. And I want everybody to read them in their entirety.

Wisdom makes some posts.
I make two more posts, and am caught up.

So, let me go over what I said in those four posts. You know, when I was "posting like a madman" and acting soooo scummy.
2162: I argued with Wisdom's 2111. In the end of the post, I pointed out that I was pretty much wrong on anything that could be factually proven.
2163: I said that Wisdom's scumteam containing me, Desperado, and Nacho, was plausible.

2168: I say Wisdom's ika vote (you know, the one OFF of me) showed that Wisdom was lacking direction. Just throwing his vote anywhere for fear of losing the momentum he'd built up.

2169: I put out the idea that Mala's role-- "QuickTopic Cop" might actually be a scum role.


Which of these is so scummy? And, four posts is "posting like a madman"?


[preedit]

No i speak of after *i* voted uou

You voted me??

[Whiskers]

Ah, ok, here.

What I asked is how it's explained that you can neighborize.

Probably because I'm the god of "the prophecy" (I

am

quoting there). But under the "Ability" section, it says merely, that, "carpe diem, you're a neighborizer."

VOTE: whiskers

I'm highly unconfident with my vote here but well, my role pm works other ways. I have flavor in the ability section too.

I posted once more on that page, then four times on the next page.
Compare with Wisdom, who posted 10 times on the next page.
Compare with havingfitz, who posted three times on the next page.
Compare with Mirari, who posted five times.
Also, you, malakittens, and desperado all posted once.

It's not that I freaked out or was posting like a madman, it's that I was having a conversation and defending myself?

godfucking damn it, Whiskers. Wtf don't you understand? shos convinced himself you are scum and only then he started being annoyed by your playstyle. Prior to that, you had been defending him, so he didn't mind it.

You are both fucking town and this thing is fucking distracting. Now stop voting each other and choose from ika or penguin.

Oh please. I'm not voting shos.

And I'm waiting on ika to answer my question, before I vote him.
Of course, I'll probably vote him anyway.
But the resistance to the ika lynch from shos is interesting, since shos was voting ika earlier, saying "all aboard the ika train" or something.

[Whiskers]

He explained that that was trying to get reactions from ika. <- another example of your "ignoring"

No, you're right. I scrolled past when you quoted that, and then havingfitz's quoting "shos: it's all a reaction test!" about a hundred times. I

still

can't retain the information, for some reason.

Although, I wonder why, if he didn't get what he wanted from the reaction test (which is what shos said), he would

stop

wanting to lynch ika...

Anyway,

Vote: ika

Votecount 1.24

penguin_alien

- 3 - ooba, Mirari, Nachomamma8 (L-4)

Mirari

- 1 - penguin_alien (L-6)

Whiskers

- 1 - shos (L-6)

ika

- 3 - Wisdom, Grimgroove, Desperado, havingfitz, Whiskers(L-2)

Not voting - MattP, Malakittens, ika

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline: (expired on 2013-12-22 12:00:00)

Deadline has been extended by one day due to the site being down.

Aaaah, according to this votecount, I

was

voting shos... wtf, I can't even rmeember my own votes anymore...

[Whiskers]

@ooba
I'd prefer Nacho, maybe even Desp, over penguin right now. What do you think about them?

I like Nacho - I'd like to think I can read Nacho after our recent scum game and he seems more honest here (as opposed to posturing).

Desp was like "I'm Hades - guess my power!" - but nothing apart from that that's made me think he's town so far. I can only read Desp after flips. He's town if ika flips scum for example.

Why do people have you as town, ooba?
Like, even if you

are

town, why are people reading you as it? You hardly ever post, for instance.

I ask 'cause the bolded here doesn't make sense to me. That's not something town(Desp) would do. It would be anti-town. But you're like, "Yeah! that shit right there! Super town! So great!" supporting it. I could see scum(ooba) doing that. But why would a townie do it?

[Whiskers]

I'm stupid, and didn't bold anything.
EBWOP:

@ooba
I'd prefer Nacho, maybe even Desp, over penguin right now. What do you think about them?

I like Nacho - I'd like to think I can read Nacho after our recent scum game and he seems more honest here (as opposed to posturing).

Desp was like "I'm Hades - guess my power!" - but nothing apart from that that's made me think he's town so far.

I can only read Desp after flips. He's town if ika flips scum for example.

Why do people have you as town, ooba?
Like, even if you

are

town, why are people reading you as it? You hardly ever post, for instance.

I ask 'cause the bolded here doesn't make sense to me. That's not something town(Desp) would do. It would be anti-town. But you're like, "Yeah! that shit right there! Super town! So great!" supporting it. I could see scum(ooba) doing that. But why would a townie do it?

[Whiskers]

- Similarly on Desp's "Guess my power": You say that's anti town because it leads us into a situation where everyone starts claiming and guessing powers. Most towns won't be led down that path by something so simple. We tend to overestimate scum fishing around for roles and they would never do it that obviously.

No, no, I mean, claiming like that is usually thought of as very anti-town, if not outright scummy. Not entirely sure why, myself. I guess it's because then scum can guess the setup better, and narrow down who probably has power roles... But then for some reason, partial claims like Desperado's are thought of as even scummier.

I can right away go, "Desp's claim was to [cause confusion]" and write it off as something scum would do. But whether or not it's a scumtell for him to have flavour-claimed with no pressure on him to do so, isn't it sort of scummy for you to say, "Ah yeah. That's town."?

Doesn't that encourage people to halfclaim out of the blue? Something that's usually thought of as scummy? Or worse, won't it lead more people to halfclaim out of the blue in a similar fashion, keeping in mind that it's a townie thing to do?
Just some thoughts, as the Day crawls to a close.

[Whiskers]

I'm feeling both penguin and ika are scum right now.

Then policy lynch.

[Whiskers]

Nope, I'll vote ika if it comes to that. Though I really really prefer penguin right now.

Dude, I don't get it.
I mean, I'm sitting here and literally every post penguin has ever made, you have quoted it and replied "WHOA YOU'RE SO SCUMMY."
And I'm just not fucking seeing it at all.

Even when you explain that shit-- like you did recently, last page in fact-- although, you never explain it often enough for people to share your reads, do you?-- I sit there and I'm like, "...yeeeaaaaaaaaaah.... I

guess

.... that

kiiiiind of

makes sense..." But it seems like you're just coming up with things to fit your predetermined read. Or, you're taking the actual reasoning for stuff, and twisting it to make it look scummy.
Idk, maybe it's just me. But there hasn't been a single post by Penguin that has made me go, "Ah. I want to lynch this individual." And granted, there haven't been a ton of posts from penguin. But seriously. I'd be more comfortable lynching havingfitz, for god's sake, than penguin.

btw, has anybody

defended

peng? I don't recall.

[Whiskers]

The only reason Mala isn't dead is her claim.

>:T

Not sure in 16 hours we can string up another person. UNVOTE:
I have such a hard time understanding the point of this game given all the claims.

Let me think about this. peng, I think Wisdom is town because

no way a scum person would ever post that much.

:U

...

Hey! Hey, I found the other guy we could lynch!

[Whiskers]

Got it. Whiskers is a day neighborizer. Odd.

Whiskers, how many shots do you have or are you an unlimited Dayshot neighborizer?

I'm fine with either Fitz or Whiskers getting lynched since I doubt all three neighborizers are town. Whisker's is different but it doesn't make sense to claim something so different to put a target on your back.

Not telling.

Also, where does that leave you? If you really want to lynch among the neighborizers, I'll gladly fight you to the last.

[Whiskers]

So hey, let's see if ika ever comes back, or if he's replaced by

another

noob player who flakes 'cause he doesn't know how to play scum.

Btw,

why

did we lynch Penguin?

Vote: Shos

[Whiskers]

I'm really,

really

disappointed that we ended up lynching Penguin, too. Just so everyone knows. Like, I know it's going to make me look bad to make a big fucking deal out of it, but I'm still aghast that anybody

let

that lynch go through, let alone that half of you voted her in the first place.

[Whiskers]

Also, a couple of things:
Ika is

not

just just a hastily thrown-together alt for Mollie (please understand my suspicion: mollie has about seven alt accounts, though she only signed up like, a month or two ago).

I believe Mollie and Titus and Ika all have a history together, and know each other, from their "previous site" that Ika mentioned. (They're all in another game together, ongoing.)

With this in mind, I am going to go ahead and assume that Titus's skill level and ability is going to be somewhere similar to those other two players. So forgive me, Titus, if I don't put a whole lot of stock in what you say.

[Whiskers]

Bite me.

Although, thanks for correcting me on that info! I'm still waiting on an answer from Ika, so it was all speculation on my part.

[Whiskers]

Malakittens, since you're

online

,

You hopped off the Penguin wagon, then made four whole more posts the rest of the day. Despite you being ill and having six games to play, you managed to weigh in

against

an ika lynch. Who would you rather have lynched?

[Whiskers]

I am not an alt of mollie. I am anohter being ientirely. i will admit though tit and i are somewhat similar though in level and abaility. i am still wanting to know what you want from knowing where i origonate. i can tell you post game but untill you give me good reasoning i have no intention of doing it for it is irrelivent. i will igve youthis, my home site username and this site usernames are the same.

Oh, so now you're outright refusing to answer questions? If you had done this, oh, when I'd asked the question, this would have saved us a lot of time.
That was pretty much it-- I was sneakingly suspicious that you were an alt of Mollie: Mollie replaced out, you replaced immediately in. You were a brand,

brand

new account. You seemed to have about the same skill level of Mollie. And while I'm not so egotistical to think that Mollie replaced out because of me, I

am

egotistical enough to think that, it might be her style to replace back in using an alternate account, if she wanted to play the game and was worried about me bullying her and "stalking" her, that would fix it. Right?

Anyway, like I said, seeing you all together in a game makes me more-sure that you aren't an alt of her (that'd break the rules).

Anyway, I'm not going to waste

my

precious time trawling the internet looking for your homesite. Since you don't (or, didn't) know why I wanted it, there was no way of knowing if it were "irrelevant".

But, since it was "irrelevant", why is it the

only

thing you comment on, coming back into the game? You've been gone for about 200 posts. Since you wanted to "see what you missed", that

one

thing is

THE

MOST-IMPORTANT thing, The MOST-

RELEVANT

Thing?


CAN SOMEBODY TELL ME, WHY WE DID

NOT

LYNCH THIS YESTERDAY??

[Whiskers]

i only commented what i needed to say.

I disagree.

i have my reasons for not saying much else but i will hold off on that.

I'm just assuming your reason is that you're scum. In which case I can't blame you for not telling it.

just about everyone here expects me to bend over and listen to this site meta and how they play.

No. No, I'm pretty sure I've seen none of that-- There was a little bit of it from me, early on. No, mostly the players here expect you to do, uh,

any

playing.

well heres some info, im not going to do that, im going to play how i play all the time and go with it.

I don't give a shit. Also, you've said this before. Add one more post to the "ika's filler posts" bucket.

So, while you're off playing all by yourself, could you at give some opinion on Penguin's flip, Wisdom's flip, why wisdom was chosen as a nightkill, whether or not you know Titus and if you'll be able to read him better (or have meta on him) for it, where you stand as far as reads go, now that we have more information than any time during the rest of the game--

anything

that anyone else can use? Please remember that this is a collaborative game, and even if you want to play like a useless piece of shit, the town could really benefit from you rubbing brain cells together, and discussing the game with everybody else.

[Whiskers]

Ok, I'll elaborate:
Commenting on the thing that you have already called "irrelevant", and not commenting on anything else, means that you are continuing a chain of thought that you think it irrelevant, and are not commenting on anything relevant. You are either lying, or a hypocrite. Which is it?

[Whiskers]

I wish Wisdom were here so I could rub in his face how wrong he was about the stupid fucking penguin lynch at the end. Only god damn player in this game actually

playing

the game. With him gone, it's going to be a slooow game, lots of active lurking, and there's going to come a point where I just don't give a damn anymore, and will replace out. Because I can't force any of you to play, and I can't convince any of you to lynch lurkers.
I'm calling it now, that's all.

[Whiskers]

I've generally bought into your shtick but this one sounds fake as balls. There is no reasonable justification for suggesting Wisdom was the

only one

playing, and dropping this kind of woe-is-us bullshit now is nothing more than you covering your tracks for your fade as the game goes on. Prove me wrong.

Failing that, stop whining about imaginary problems and get focused.

Vote: Ika

It's not "woe is up", it's "woe is me." Day 2 is going to be boring as shit. Let me tell you how it will go:

-We run up the ika wagon to L-2. He bitches and goes "whyar eyou lynching me!??!?!!?!"
-Someone will go "gee, I'm reallly no

feeling

this wagon." Everybody else on the wagon will hop off.
-There will be a bunch more bullshit setup speculation, which will ultimately come to nothing.
-We will lynch between neighbors.

Agreed Desperado.

You don't break the record for most posts by active lurking. You may not understand us or we may not understand you but be assured that a good portion is playing.

No.

I

didn't do it by active lurking. I posted. Wisdom posted. Shos posted too, I guess, but I'm not sure if that's a good thing or not. And nearly all of the other players had little chunks where they posted. But there were also big empty spots. Not just like, "Oh, nachomamma is sleeping now," but "Oh, where have all the players been for the last several days?"

[Whiskers]

-snip-

Matter of fact, this one is pretty fucking fake too. You made one attempt to stop the wagon, 11 hours before the deadline:

-snip-

And nothing else. So your sanctimony is falling on deaf ears.[/quote]
I said at least a couple of different times-- all throughout the Day!-- that I didn't want her lynched. I proposed several alternatives. And no, I didn't argue against her lynch. I'm not sure what her lynch was about.

But really, ISO me, and ctrl+f "penguin".
"one attempt to stop the wagon," sheesh.

[Whiskers]

Anyway the entire game seems to be designed on QT shenanigans so Mala being scum is out of the question. What I meant by my previous scum team fitting the setup theory is that I expect one scum to be in the Neighbourizers (fitz), one in the virgins (Grim) and one in the rest (Peng).

Backtracking on the above because you think Mala faked emotion is scummy as fuck.

I actually thought the post in question was tame, and if you don't expect Mala to protect her friend from someone dragging her name through the mud then you don't have the necessary experience to determine whether Mala's level of emotion is fake or not.

That's great, except the post she was responding to had no "dragging through the mud". Oh, I mentioned mollie had a bunch of alts? That's the extent of it. It is

odd

that that's the thing I say, that mala takes offense to.

Also, Desperado, Chainsaw Defense.

[Whiskers]

@Malakittens: Are you well, yet?

[Whiskers]

I did iso for penguin. Why don't you quote all of your efforts to stop the penguin lynch and make me look dumb?

Spoiler: ok

I don't think penguin is scum, but most of all, penguin is being more useful than most of you. I'd policy not-lynch her.

Also, does anybody want to remind me why penguino is scum?

And since there

weren't

another seven pages today, I suppose I'll ask this instead:
Wisdom, why now,

not

shos? I know there was a big block in there that I didn't really comprehend, but why is it a penguin lynch, instead of a shos lynch?

-snip-

Yeah see,
You're losing the Whiskers vote on this one because your case is, "meta, meta." If all you have are meta tells, it's not a case I'm interested in falling for, especially not on Day 1. From the look of what you said here, you

should

be able to just go, "She's lurking", simple as that, and then go "ergo, she's scum." Which isn't really a strong case either, but it's stronger than "Meta, lol," which is maybe not exactly what you're saying, but it's exactly what I'm reading in your posts.




In other words, this.

While I don't disagree with the meta itself; why are you not waiting for her to actually post, but instead are encouraging people to speedlynch her? Why do you rule out that she is just inactive for her own reasons and jump to the conclusion she is inactive because she is scum?

Also, I wouldn't not-lynch ika, he's like if you took all the AtE from mollie and replaced it with nothing. The posts coming from that slot aren't really any less stupid-- nor do they show any less stubbornness, with ika saying, "We do things differently around there!" and using that as a reason to keep the same style he has on a different site...

Yeah.

I just wondered why you, wisdom, put ika in that list of whatever it is.

Besides, if I'm not mistaken, if the mollie slot flips scum, we can go right up to lynching shos again.

I'm feeling both penguin and ika are scum right now.

Then policy lynch.

Nope, I'll vote ika if it comes to that. Though I really really prefer penguin right now.

Dude, I don't get it.
I mean, I'm sitting here and literally every post penguin has ever made, you have quoted it and replied "WHOA YOU'RE SO SCUMMY."
And I'm just not fucking seeing it at all.

Even when you explain that shit-- like you did recently, last page in fact-- although, you never explain it often enough for people to share your reads, do you?-- I sit there and I'm like, "...yeeeaaaaaaaaaah.... I

guess

.... that

kiiiiind of

makes sense..." But it seems like you're just coming up with things to fit your predetermined read. Or, you're taking the actual reasoning for stuff, and twisting it to make it look scummy.
Idk, maybe it's just me. But there hasn't been a single post by Penguin that has made me go, "Ah. I want to lynch this individual." And granted, there haven't been a ton of posts from penguin. But seriously. I'd be more comfortable lynching havingfitz, for god's sake, than penguin.

btw, has anybody

defended

peng? I don't recall.

[Whiskers]

Of course, it's not so much to make you look dumb. I just don't understand how Penguin, who had done nothing scummy all game-- at least, from my perspective. Really, did I miss something??-- get lynched with so little discussion, opposite the ika slot, which would have been a

great

policy lynch, at worst, and quite possibly scum.

[Whiskers]

Yes, yes you did drag Mollie through the mud. You did it fucking twice in the same post. You first soft-accused her of cheating and then you secondly decided that to put her down and try and discredit anything you said because the play of her, Ika and Titus don't match up to the level of playing mafia you expect them to play. Fuck you already did it to me once this game too when responding to Shos.

You have a huge ego and someone needs to fucking flaten it because it's annoying as hell.

I can't argue with all of your post, but I can certainly argue with this.
Here's my post that you flipped shit about:

Also, a couple of things:
Ika is

not

just just a hastily thrown-together alt for Mollie (please understand my suspicion: mollie has about seven alt accounts, though she only signed up like, a month or two ago).

I believe Mollie and Titus and Ika all have a history together, and know each other, from their "previous site" that Ika mentioned. (They're all in another game together, ongoing.)

With this in mind, I am going to go ahead and assume that Titus's skill level and ability is going to be somewhere similar to those other two players. So forgive me, Titus, if I don't put a whole lot of stock in what you say.

No accusations of cheating. I reference it in a different post, saying that "she is not doing that, because that would be cheating"-- saying she is

not

cheating, thanks so much for paying attention-- but none of it is in this post that you threw a fit over.
No discrediting

her

, although maybe you could say it was discrediting her, because I referenced her play in a way that was, er, not good? I was using her play-- which yeah, I don't have any qualms about saying it was bad-- as a landmark to judge something else by. I'm saying, "This fish is as blue as the sky," and you're getting defensive of the sky. This post was discrediting Titus, not Mollie.

Or, wait, wait, maybe you're referring to that other post? You know, the one I hadn't made yet, when you freaked out?

I am not an alt of mollie. I am anohter being ientirely. i will admit though tit and i are somewhat similar though in level and abaility. i am still wanting to know what you want from knowing where i origonate. i can tell you post game but untill you give me good reasoning i have no intention of doing it for it is irrelivent. i will igve youthis, my home site username and this site usernames are the same.

Oh, so now you're outright refusing to answer questions? If you had done this, oh, when I'd asked the question, this would have saved us a lot of time.
That was pretty much it-- I was sneakingly suspicious that you were an alt of Mollie: Mollie replaced out, you replaced immediately in. You were a brand,

brand

new account. You seemed to have about the same skill level of Mollie. And while I'm not so egotistical to think that Mollie replaced out because of me, I

am

egotistical enough to think that, it might be her style to replace back in using an alternate account, if she wanted to play the game and was worried about me bullying her and "stalking" her, that would fix it. Right?

Anyway, like I said, seeing you all together in a game makes me more-sure that you aren't an alt of her (that'd break the rules).

THIS is the other post, the post where I "soft-accused her" of breaking rules? In another game? No. I found evidence of them playing together in another game. It brings me to believe that they're different players. the "soft accusation" is something that you made up.
I do

not

attack her play. Again, I am using it as a reference to attack ika's bad play. I've done this before. They are both bad. However, it's not an attack on Mollie.
Even if it were, you can't have been talking about this in 2756, because

it hadn't been written yet.

Since the "dragging through the mud" Desperado is talking about in 2748 is the post you threw a fit over (2755), you're attributing things from my new post, to my old post. To justify your tantrum?

[Whiskers]

Actually, for the record, I

could

probably argue with the rest of Mala's post. I don't really see the point, it's mostly discussion. I'll probably be able to use it in an attack later, although I'm not sure why I'd bother, since everybody is all "Oooh, Mala's a conf-town role!"

[Whiskers]

Fuck you already did it to me once this game too when responding to Shos.

And yeah, I did. I did try to discredit you earlier (although, you were being attacked by "Burden of Proficiency" at the time, and I wad defending you from it by saying "she's not that proficient"). Mala, you tunnel people, and then are wrong. You don't get to keep that sort of playstyle, if you're wrong. If you do, people should at least make fun of you for it. I'm not going to give you, or anybody else, more credit than they deserve.

Now: You're voting me because I'm a big mean meany-poo?

[Whiskers]

Assuming all players are town (since we don't know which are and aren't; Schrodinger's cat), who should scum have killed last night?
This is a question that everybody feeling bold can feel free to answer.

[Whiskers]

Assuming all players are town (since we don't know which are and aren't; Schrodinger's cat), who should scum have killed last night?
This is a question that everybody feeling bold can feel free to answer.

this was the first post i quickly saw when i came back so before i answer this question, i want to ask you the very same question. i always find it that if someone ask a question in fm like this they should be the first to answer it.

If I answer it first, any subsequent answers become completely useless to me (the person who asked), since I've given away "the right answer."

But I'm not sure why I'm explaining this to you, who refuses to answer any question. It's not like, if I explain it, you'll adapt your playstyle in a pro-town way.

Vote: ika

I predict that, with my vote on this wagon, other players will begin hopping off.

[Whiskers]

Vote: ika

[Whiskers]

no i delibertly type like this becasue i have no cares about grammer excpet on home site when we play with annons. its my typical playstyle to be a sloppy writer

Yeah, and this is exactly why I thought you were an alt of Mala, originally. Mala did this, and it pissed me right the fuck off. Please die in a fire.

i want to hear an elaboration on that, just becasue you dislike someones playstyle or becasue they tend to be wrong with it does not mean that they should change it.

I already elaborated on it, in the rest of the post. Read the fucking post you fucking quoted, you absolute dunce.
Also, it's not "just becasue I dislike the playstyle". It's "because it fucking doesn't work". Hey, just like you! Your play is shit, so I'm encouraging you to change it. Mala is a little different: she's not playing poorly because she's an incredible douchebag who refuses to learn and adapt, in order to prevent other people from playing the game (you know, like you are). Her play changes as she grows and learns.

ya becasue i am town and just about everyone is using mollie as the reason to get a myslynch off me. that is itself is bad reasoing.

No, becasue I'm unpopular right now, and it's standard for players to go "I don't like who's on the wagon!" and jump right the fuck off. Unfortunately, it's really easy for scum to do, and doesn't look bad at all because town do it all the time too.

And no, that's not the reason everyone is trying to "get a myslynch off you." It's because you're not an improvement over Mollie. You're not better. There's a good chance that you're actually

worse

.
And guess what? It's that asinine playstyle of yours, that led you to the conclusion that

that

was why people were trying to lynch you. Instead of discussing and conferring with the other players in the game, you sat in a corner playing with yourself (so to speak). You don't know why we're voting you, because you're not involved in the game, you're not paying attention.

And you're so damn proud about it.

[Whiskers]

EBWOP:

no i delibertly type like this becasue i have no cares about grammer excpet on home site when we play with annons. its my typical playstyle to be a sloppy writer

Yeah, and this is exactly why I thought you were an alt of

Mollie

, originally.

Mollie

did this, and it pissed me right the fuck off. Please die in a fire.

[Whiskers]

The watcher flip makes the QT cop claim a bit strange, but I think that ignoring the sheer number of QTs in this game and the weird mechanic of them would be a mistake. I don't really see why else Elyse would make this the case (unless she was looking to center the game around a role such as QT cop), so I don't think watcher flip is enough to make that a scum claim quite yet. I mean, even if Mala knew about the neighborhoods beforehand, the claim would still be creative as hell and a pretty impressive thing to pull off, don't you think?

Yeah, unless

it's her actual role

, except scum.

Mala is a mostly town role with mostly town play so I see no reason to pursue her wagon right now, considering she's going to have to start producing results come tomorrow.

What, you don't expect an "oh, I was roleblocked!" and a couple of "oops, I investigated the player who is dead now!"
Not to mention the, "Aha! [Scum partner] has no QT, so is cleared and conf-town!"

Her "mostly town play" might just be debatable.

[Whiskers]

Assuming all players are town (since we don't know which are and aren't; Schrodinger's cat), who should scum have killed last night?
This is a question that everybody feeling bold can feel free to answer.

Wisdom.

Also, I'll go ahead and challenge this. Why? Wisdom was defeated by pretty much anybody who stood up to him, until he settled on a nice town lynch. Penguin got lynched by Wisdom because she wasn't interested in fighting back. Remember that business about Penguin not being willing to vote the opposite wagon, because she wasn't sure ika was scum?
Apart from that, you don't even ever have to worry about Wisdom attacking you, if you're willing to climb on and ride piggyback.

[Whiskers]

It is stupid to say that the QT cop is meaningfully more useful to town than it is to scum. If it is useless to scum, it is almost as useless to town. You say, "It's useful to the town!" and I say, "except for all of these ways that it's actually not." Since none of those things would be a hindrance to scum (not to mention having a role that's like, idk, "WHOA TOTALLY CONF-TOWN ROLE EVERYBODY!"), why is it more useful to town, again?
Town: can clear (certain) people as being innocent. Helps town.
Scum: can clear scumbuddies as being innocent. Helps scum.

Town: prevents town neighborizers from using their roles, based on their cooperation. Hurts town.
Scum: prevents town neighborizers from using their roles, based on their cooperation. Hurts town.

There are probably other things, but I don't remember them and am not smart enough to figure them out on my own.

[Whiskers]

these are NOT WHY YOU THINK HE IS TOWN. so this all looks like an attempt to get towncred from a mislynch.
and you actualyl say that ika would have been a GREAT policy lynch. why policy lynch after a 110 pages D1?? not enough scumreads by anyone?

I guess not! Since it came down to lynching ika, who is essentially a policy lynch ("ika's play is so bad"), or penguin, who didn't have any better case on her than meta (which turned out to be wrong).

I'll admit that I'm kind of flustered on this one; I can not remember an attack on penguin, aside from like, Mala's

"THIS IS NOT HER TOWN PLAAAAY"

early on in the Day-- meta. It got really aggressive at the end of the day. When I came in to read and catch up, I tried to make a couple of posts. Only the first one got submtted, the second one was cutoff by the end of the day (...what normally would have been a Twilight phase, but whatever...) I don't remember what it was, so I can't say "I was

going

to argue against the wagon, honest!" or anything like that.

But really, what were the points against Penguin that I was supposed to argue and fight? That's the problem I'm having. No, I did a terrible job at defending the obvious townie, but I also never understood anybody else was voting for her, anything to defend her from.

[Whiskers]

Whiskers are you goin to ignore my question for the third time in a row?

Did you use your ability n1? If so who?

Oh, you're finally going to ask it?

Or did you mean when you asked all of the neighborizers in 2730? Sorry, I wasn't ignoring you, per se: I figured that I didn't answer you would have been answer enough. To clarify, no, i submitted a No Action.

[Whiskers]

I'd kill wisdom too.

I particularly like shos answer so far.

Assuming all players are town (since we don't know which are and aren't; Schrodinger's cat), who should scum have killed last night?
This is a question that everybody feeling bold can feel free to answer.

this was the first post i quickly saw when i came back so before i answer this question, i want to ask you the very same question. i always find it that if someone ask a question in fm like this they should be the first to answer it.

why would you say that? I'd say exactly the opposite, asking such a question is probably in order to examine the answers. giving your own answer first might lead to sheeping of it, copying reasons, etc. post 2802 has a good point ika - you should start playing the game as we do. when in rome, act like roman; I don't give a fuck about your homesite, if you're not going to do shit here my gut will stop stopping me from voting you

your posts contain lots of shit about playstyle, people liking others and not caring and not changing etc and it might be all good and well but these are discussions not for the game and meanwhile you're doing shit here and I wanna vote you

I also kind of like this portion, but I see the same kind of stuff that he did with wisdom yesterDay. I don't know if you're just reading the thread and posting stream-of-consciousness, but it looks like you could just be repeating other people.

and the aestetic & commuter don't make it BETTER, they make it WORSE. because these are not only roles tat cannot be neighbourized - they are also roles that cannot be INVESTIGATED. as in, if mala targetted them, she would recieve 'no result', not 'no qt'. assuming three neighbourizers, three scum, possible overlap betweent he groups, then there are 5 people starting with a QT, possibility that more are added, 2 people who are immune to investigation, and all the rest- can be neighbourized, and probably will in a completely random game with no massclaim D1. ADD THE FACT that the claim is DELAYED qt cop, and that role is freaking bullshit. add to that the play which is scummy even regardless, and not protown almost at all, this is a very good D2 lynch imo, and when it flips scum, we will see what the role actually is and decide later what we do regarding the neighbourizers. should mala actually flip *town*, I'd be quite in shock, but that would mean that there's *gotta* be scum in the neighbourizers, and town should invest its powers in finding that thing.

Aaaand, this makes me doubt my mala distrust... If the role is truly useless, it'd be the most-fun thing ever, from a mod's point of view (or at least, from my point of view), to toss it in as a town role and watch the havoc it creates.

:O :O :O :O :O
holy momma whiskers has a good observation in 2816. that role could be scum! it makes even more sense!!

I said this yesterDay, too. Wisdom told me I was scum, and everything.
Idk you playstyle, but this looks heavy handed.

Shos, somebody earlier said you might have been playing "stupidly" on purpose. What do you think of that assertion?

[Whiskers]

everybody please be aware, I royally fucked up the quotes in that last post...

[Whiskers]

How is asking who Sosh is bad? I didn't know Titus misspelt your name. I thought something else. Good god I don't see how that post by it self makes you want to lynch me. In fact it's stupid. Had Titus went Sohs I would have realized but the spelling was beyond noticeable and thought maybe it was something else.

Someone attacked you because you asked who Sosh was? Little distracted at the moment, but what.

Yes

It was a joke. Nobody "attacked" you. Shos was like, "this makes me want to lynch you soooo muuuuch", and if you're playing it off like it was a serious attack, mala, then you're scum.
I will point out though, that maybe shos just has huge confirmation bias, since he quickly found a reason to vote mala anyway.

[Whiskers]

Whiskers are you goin to ignore my question for the third time in a row?

Did you use your ability n1? If so who?

Oh, you're finally going to ask it?

Or did you mean when you asked all of the neighborizers in 2730? Sorry, I wasn't ignoring you, per se: I figured that I didn't answer you would have been answer enough. To clarify,

no, i submitted a No Action.

Why not? Why not use it on one of the other neighborizors to confirm your role or Grimgrove to confirm his? Or Mala? Why none at all

Er, personal preference?
My QT being day-only kind of removes the great utility of having neighborizers talk to each other in it: we can just talk here instead. Since I don't know any of your alignments, it's not like I particularly trust any of you. Same thing with mala.
In the end, I went with the plan, not neighborizing anybody who wasn't Mala or another neighborizer. Because I just did not neighborize anybody at all.

[Whiskers]

I just wanted one because it would help me to COMMUNICATE to someone so I can actually have help to see what would be the best plan in play to use my ability on. I'm not a robot and I'm not perfect. Having two heads is better than one and it would probably be more accurate then me randomly using my ability.

But, you still wouldn't know if they were town or scum.
:\

Wouldn't that put you at risk of putting your head together with a scumplayer? Who would likely lead you more astray than onto the correct path?

[Whiskers]

I can sort them out?... I can talk to them so I can figure out if they are scum or town.

Think about it for a minute before asking me questions like this.

Er, but, you

can't

sort them out! And I really can't say that in any way that's not-insulting, but, No, you can't sort them out.

[Whiskers]

When she plays off site, she usually emulates her town meta as closely as possible and goes for "fake paranoia" angle, discredits those who can play with her, etc. What happened here was definitely 100% not that.

???

mollie made a pretty strong push on Whiskers for reasons that essentially equalled "the way Whiskers is treating me is for outside of the game reasons like she knows me and is cyberstalking me".

??!?!?!??

Make up your mind?? It was definitely 100% not "fake paranoia," except that the whole thing was "whiskers is cyberstalking me"!?!? Pick one, maybe?

[Whiskers]

For the record, the awkward way in which shos implements reaction tests, is more likely to cause them to receive unusual results, or outright fail.

Also Nacho, do you want me to absolutely destroy Mirari's case on Penguin?

I dislike that Mala is Confirmed town. Eagle replaced Grimgroove, right? I like Eagle a lot better already, but I wasn't too confident on GG-town. Could have just been good play, GG & Mala never really having any interaction together, but I'm sort of inclined to think that they're both town, or at least Mala is town.
((If both scum, this claim and result ties them together. Sloppy play, usually bad, if one flips, incriminates the other, unlikely.
If Eagle scum, still might confirm Mala in order to champion her and make her the unwitting face of the scum party.))

I don't remember who I'm voting, so I'll

Unvote

Vote: ika

[Whiskers]

What if Mala and Eagle target the same person? I'm not asking for a lengthy discussion on this (likely to reveal better plays to scum, please don't discuss at length), but this way, if one is killed, the other one can still give us a result. If they're BOTH killed, we catch a scum. On second thought, not such a great plan. Nevermind.

[Whiskers]

What if Mala and Eagle target the same person? I'm not asking for a lengthy discussion on this (likely to reveal better plays to scum, please don't discuss at length), but this way, if one is killed, the other one can still give us a result. If they're BOTH killed, we catch a scum. On second thought, not such a great plan. Nevermind.

What did Mala claim?

Malakittens is a QuickTopic-Cop. She investigates people and finds out whether or not they have a Quicktopic thread. That's the claim, iiuc.

[Whiskers]

What if Mala and Eagle target the same person? I'm not asking for a lengthy discussion on this (likely to reveal better plays to scum, please don't discuss at length), but this way, if one is killed, the other one can still give us a result. If they're BOTH killed, we catch a scum. On second thought, not such a great plan. Nevermind.

What did Mala claim?

Malakittens is a QuickTopic-Cop. She investigates people and finds out whether or not they have a Quicktopic thread. That's the claim, iiuc.

Did she get a report?

Oh! No, sorry. I forgot,

delayed

quicktopic cop. she doesn't begin functioning until Night 2-- which makes some kind of sense, considering that a bunch of the Neighborizers can't technically get QTs Night 1. Basically, having her be delayed makes it easier for her to get false-guilties, barring massclaim (which we (almost) did).

[Whiskers]

I request to be docced tonight.

...on what grounds??

[Whiskers]

What the heck is s-fm, etc?

[Whiskers]

So he's saying that 3/5 forum mafia games have flavour? And not only that they have it, but that it plays a significant factor in game design?
Well, we're playing a theme game, so I can't shoot him down entirely.
Instead I will point out that just because the modifier is called "Weak" is just a standard name for the role-modifier, used to ease communication.

[Whiskers]

Well it fits the ability tho haha

After recent claim i intend to focus on the neighbourizers pool. Whiskers yourein it, help me if youre town

Yes, "help you". To do what, exactly, lynch me?

But let me take a less-snarky shot at you instead. Do you need me to lead a charge into attacking players, so you can sit behind me and echo everything I say? Is that what you're asking me to do?

And, if so, where are you expecting me to look? My vote is on ika, the playerslot we should have lynched yesterDay. I wouldn't have felt too bad lynching Mala, until Titus claimed and it's likely, all things considered, that she's actually town. The other place I'd go for scum? You, mainly for your behaviour yesterDay of the game. Even before you started scumreading me.

What is it you're looking for, shos, that I would "help you"?

[Whiskers]

Oh of course, duh. You want me to look at the neighborizer pool.
I still hold that there's no reason for "ONE OF THE NEIGHBORIZERS IS SCUM!!!!!!" and that we could go right the fuck ahead and lynch all three of us and you'd get three nice fun townflips. In fact, I'd say that as far as neighborizers go, my role is the

only

one that makes any sense as scum.

Roles aside, Matt claiming like he did was incredibly odd, still don't get that. Havingfitz was kind of weird a bit earlier, although has he posted at all lately? I mentioned yesterDay that I was more willing to lynch hFitz than I was penguin.
But really? I'd lynch entirely outside of neighborizers. Ika or shos, for instance. Or Mirari, who only plays when his name is called. Or ooba, who doesn't fucking exists a majority of the time.

[Whiskers]

Because Mala is a QT cop, so she needs to stay alive. And scum can just nightkill me to frame someone anyways.

Uh, yeah, except Mala's role is about as useful as a cat in an apple tree.

[Whiskers]

Yes, this is all good, and Desperado's explanation makes sense. And Grimgroove seems like the sort to play in that fashion.

[Whiskers]

Not being able to lynch =/= townread.

No, no, it wasn't an

actual

townread. It was an "I am actually suspicios but nobody is listening to me. I'll Investigate her later, confirming my suspicions one way or another. Until then, I'll just say I have a townread on her so I won't have to talk about it," townread.

And then, he investigated her, and she turned up town. Then, she WAS an actual townread. Get it?

[Whiskers]

GG: "Hey wisdom, mala is scum, take a look at post BLA BLA, how can this shit not be scum I don't even get it wtfbbq"

wisdom: "Hey GG, mala confused lovers with the lovers role, ta ta biatch, ain't no gonna be no scumz here biAAAAtch" -->say this with some real punk accent lol I'm in a good mood

GG: "

ohai I don't agree with your OMGWTFBBQ on DIZSHIT and moths going in circles around equatorial guinea, and this piss is waaaay too yellow so you gotta learn not to eat the deodorant, rather, spew it out, it's like MAGIC, when POOF the tooth faerie comes and say uggachucka and all the bad guys disappear into thin air. in fact, they just go through quantum tunneling and end up completely vaporized somewhere else, yes I know this is odd and chances are slim. but you're wrong.

but hey, you convinced me on mala being town."

So yeah, all that shit? no. He didn't win over Wisdom, so if you buy into Desperado's theory, (which I do, he seems fairly competent and fairly town, whereas you, shos, are probably only one of those,) he said, "fuck it, I'll drop it for now, and MAKE SURE later on."

Regardless, whether or not you believe this, his crumbing the result as "his biggest townread" or whatever, should lend a bunch of credence to the claim.

[Whiskers]

Because Mala is a QT cop, so she needs to stay alive. And scum can just nightkill me to frame someone anyways.

Uh, yeah, except Mala's role is about as useful as a cat in an apple tree.

But, if I target someone else, scum can just nightkill me to frame whoever I target.

Yes, but you forget that they

can't

. Two scenarios for you to consider:

1: Night falls. Scum kill somebody not-you. You Investigate somebody, who IS scum. Day breaks. There are

two deaths.

2: Night falls. Scum kills you, in order to frame you. You investigate somebody, but that doesn't matter, because as Day breaks, there is

One death.

The only way mafia can manipulate this to their advantage is

3: Night falls. Scum submits no-kill. You investigate scum. Day breaks. There is

One death.

(and that scum appears to be cleared)

And that can be thwarted by you just

not

announcing who you're going to investigate during the Night.


So, to recap:
Do NOT tell us who you're targeting toNight. Tell us in the morning, if you're still alive. You won't get any Guilties (only Innocents), but Mafia won't be able to manipulate you.

[Whiskers]

Well, that and scum might just kill you anyway, since you're a stronger cop-type than Mala claims to be.

[Whiskers]

just gimmie a vote on fitzy
that's all i ask for
your vote on eagle is going to massive fucking waste because he's not getting close to lynched

Give me a vote on ika.

He's

not a neighborizer.

[Whiskers]

who cares about neighborizers

D:>

[Whiskers]

Haven't been able to get the site to work since my last post. Checking my PMs (I assume 24 prods) and reading up.

[Whiskers]

GG doesnt townhunt d1.

You have no evidence of this.
It also seems like GG had a few townreads by the end of the day, so...?

If nopony is going to help me lynch eaglescum then by all means pick your fav neighbourizer and lynch ahoy. Idek or care anymore.

Try fitz on for size.

Holy shit, didn't notice fitz was gone for so long .
I suppose that explains why he's been avoiding the thread lately!

who the fuck cares

Weak Doctor was used like a doctor. This does not make the Weak Doctor claimant scum. At all.

These posts here no content, pushing a player on vla. I just pings me. Beyond that, I cannot say why. I hate these feelings, bc it means either a) your town and/or b)I am missing something.

This post is reaaaally fucking bad. Nacho and Shos were having an argument. Back and forth. One-liners. TWO of your four quotes are fucking from that. "oh no, they have no content!"

You were manipulating me. Quit being artificially dense. I say I'm suspicious of Nacho, suddenly you vote Nacho. Ding! Ding! Ding!

The thing you keep missing,

you keep fucking missing

, is the "WHERE!?" that Shos keeps asking. Unfortunately, I don't think you're "

artificially

dense".

[Whiskers]

Titus recent posts: Baaaad.
Shos recent posts: Baaaad.
Ika's slot was Mollie, and all of ika's and mollie's posts were baaaad.

Vote: ika

Here's hoping I can get back to this fucking site again EVER. It has seriously not-loaded for me every time I've checked it up until now.

[Whiskers]

eagle push is bad, -ish. I get what you're saying but then Desp explained it, and it made more sense.

After that, you just are

stuck

on it.

About ika, you're going, "Whoa! Dude! This stuff is totally deep! You just have to like, read

between

the lines, man! It all comes into focus."
I disagree that there's anything there, and if I am wrong (which I totally could be, I didn't bother reading the iso for myself, and I ended up skimming your case a bit), then I can at least lynch him for all the posts that essentially just go, "Wah, wah, you just want me to play the same as you! But I won't, I'll play my

own

way!" and then ignores shit. When was the last time ika said anything game-related? And I wish I were asking retorically, but since the site has been down

(although, for some fucking reason, not for anybody else)

, I really don't remember any of this shit very well.

Also, Mala.

[Whiskers]

EBWOP

Also,

Mala

.

[Whiskers]

X_X

ebwop:
"Also, Mollie"

[Whiskers]

Im not getting what you say about mollie. Im trusting nacho on this one re:meta.

That's not my problem.
More importantly, fuck meta. The meta says, "Mollie plays like a piece of shit" and poof, here we are. That doesn't make her fucking town.

So its lije a stalemate of inactivity - us, nacho, eafle, titus, and slightly des are active, and we disagree,bwe cant get a lynch that way. Considering some may even be scum - i see no reason to let go of eagle.

How about this: a claimed weak-doc.
WOW!
SUCH BRAIN!
MUCH SMART!
GREAT REASON, WHISKERS!
YOU'RE THE BEST!
WHAT DID WE EVER DO BEFORE YOU CAME ALONG?

Or, since I'm

sure

you're not interested in some kind of

crazy

think like

not

lynching power roles-- how about because you apparently think that A, we should lynch among Neighborizer claims, and B, Nacho, who you randomly trust, wants to lynch a Neighborizer!
WOW!
SO THOUGHT!

If Eagle is actually a weak doc, then he'll blow himself up sooner or later, proving the role.

(Btw, a sidebar here: Eagle needs to keep investigating so that he either draws the nightkill, or blows himself up. Fuck mala and mala's weak-ass role. Or-- I take that back. Rather, fuck the idea that mala and mala's weak-ass role should do the investigating.)

If Eagle is not actually a weak doc, then we will give him the old string-tie later. Probably will eventually anyway.

_____________________

Now,
SOMEONE brought up the fact that there were two-out-of-three of a kind Investigative roles. When I read that, I thought, "whoa, gee! There are two-out-of-three similar Neighborizers, too!"

Shos, you say you are willing to lynch one of the neighborizers. What would make you want to lynch one over an other?

[Whiskers]

Re: eagle.
He wants to investigate mala again. His claimed actions and role dont fit ggs play. Thats why. He will not be of any use doing that.

Re:nei. I dont understand the 2/3 thing you said, probably language barrier, care to rephrase?

You arenot getting lynched.that will kill the game. So fitz or titus. Matt was much worse than the fitz slot. I just isoed that slot and uts nullscum at best, so my pref would be titus. The fact he is deathtunneling me for no visible reason, btw, helps.

No, he wants to

doc

Mala again. Just because it functions better as an investigative role, doesn't mean it can't be utilized as a doc.
Of course, when I think about it, that's not such a bad situation, either. Mafia can kill somebody else, giving us new info (in the form of flips) that we didn't have before. Or, they can kill GG/Eagle slot, and give us the flip on him.

Re: 2/3
There are 3 Investigative roles, right? Two of them are similar-- Ascetic and Virgin (neither can be Neighborized). Malakittens' claim is different, because it

can

be neighborized.
In the same way, there are three Neighborizers. Two of them are similar-- Standard, Night neighborhoods. My claim is different, as I can only use the QT during the Day.
I'd like to look into the similarities and differences. If 1/3 of both Investigators and Neighborizers are scum, it's probably not the odd one out (aka, it's not mala or myself). Instead, it's one of the similar roles (havingfitz or MattP, and GG/Eagle or Wisdom).
^So based on that, though I recognize it's super weak setup speculation, I might be willing to lynch Eagle. But why not wait, see if he baits an NK? Or bites a bullet himself.

[Whiskers]

@shos:
Yeah, the whole thing about my setup spec lynchpool and your actual lynchpool matching up, it kind of startled me and made me reconsider my "shos is super dumb" read.
I think maybe your logic isn't perfect all of the time, but you might have a better intuition than I gave you credit for-- which also means you could be scum. But you just got some of your credit back, in my eyes, for what that's worth.

What if he pritects mala and mala cops him? Or are we just wasting our powers?

Nah, if they

are

both town, and this happens, then Eagle will die. Not worth it, I think, may as well blow him on scum-investigations. Although, your plan for having them choose between two? That'll work.

My suggestion is lynch ika toDay. Mala checks [Eagle OR Shos], and Eagle [docs Mala] OR [Cops Nacho].

I had you get checked by Mala, and not by Eagle, because Mala is very limited in who she can investigate-- none of the Neighborizers, for instance. Eagle should therefore be Cop'ing Neighborizers, as he's the only one who can do it.

[Whiskers]

If Eagle wants to target shos, and Mala targets ika/nacho (nacho please) that I guess is understandable. I still think eagle should target mala to protect her and just go after the people that should not have QTs (nacho, ika, shos, Desp I believe).

The thing about this is they need to have two choices. Scum wanting to kill Mala will have to play outguess the Doc.

Also, I keep forgetting Nacho isn't a neighborizer. Who replaced MattP, again? Ah yes, Titus.

So err... Yeah, I guess it doesn't matter who does who, then. Just that one of Eagle's choices has to be "Doc Mala"

[Whiskers]

Can you guys please shut the fuck up about what the PRs should and shouldn't do, you are only helping scum. I have said that I will be investigating someone and I will not be saying who unless I'm still alive in the morning.

BUT YOU DO REALIZE THAT IF YOU ARE NOT ALIVE IN THE MORNING YOU CANNOT TELL US WHO YOU TARGETTED?!?!?!?!?!?

IF I SAY WHO I TARGET BEFORE THE NIGHT, THEN SCUM CAN MANIPULATE THAT. IT'S VERY SIMPLE. NOW SHUT UP ABOUT IT.

No man, look:
You need to make list of TWO (2) possible targets, and then randomly (or calculatedly, your choice) choose one. One of them needs to be Mala, who is already clear.
THIS WAY, if you die from Cop'ing Mafia, we know who it is. ALSO, if you die from the nightkill, we know that (there'd be a single kill, instead of 2). ALSO, since mala is one of your targets, Mafia will want to not-kill mala, because there's a 50% chance you'd just block that kill.

So basically, no, they can't really manipulate it all that much.

Ok? Trust me? Please? We've covered that already, if you think about it you'll see that it's not something that scum can manipulate.

I'm deciding to read this game from the beginning with the information I know now and going for straight up gut feels.

Oh good god.
We're all doomed.

[Whiskers]

Because shos and ika are struggling to manipulate the game and failing miserably.

Oy, you.
You forgot that it's me, not ika, struggling to manipulate the game.

Who do we lynch? Who is your second choice?

_____________

...Why do we want Nacho investigated, btw? Shouldn't we investigate one of the Neighborizers (Eagle doing that Inv, of course) so we can make a more-informed lynch out of the two?

[Whiskers]

okay enough with the name calling.

I don't really like coming into the thread and seeing one literally on every page.

Anything game-related you'd like to mention? You know, if you have the time? Once you're
done with all that other important stuff you need to post that's

not

related to the game?

[Whiskers]

Mala, if you feel that I'm being personal (beyond calling someone scummy), do call me out on that. We come to have a good time. That being said, moving back to substance.

VOTE: ika

ika is totally scum here. Town ika gets phased when I attack him. Scum ika is barely alert in this thread, despite posting elsewhere.

lol no, this game is dead for the most part. i dont get phased by your attacks, its more of the fact we will butt heads in disagreements. here its boring and got little to do elsewhere i got stuff

Dude ika I have no patience for your shit posting please selfvote.

[Whiskers]

It's more optimal to continue clearing non-claims, hence:

Lynch Ika
Eagle on Shos
Mala on me

Let's go.

the whole point though, is to give each one a choice. make it 50/50. Scum can't plan for it.

Aaargh, which is why, SHOS, we're not lynching Eagle! Eagle can't clear you if he's fucking dead. It doesn't actually matter that Ika is a policy lynch, because We're NOT lynching between power roles, etc. It's a nice, safe lynch, and maybe hits scum.

I really don't care which person is set up to investigate shos, Mala or Eagle. Mala would work, but shos wants to be doc'd, too. Seems sketchy, but I'm willing to put it aside until tomorrow.

[Whiskers]

Ok, here's the plan.

Mala is going to investigate whoever she feels like investigating.

My possible targets are Malakittens or havingfitz.

Whiskers's plan is in post 3140

In that case, we should have somebody on Shos. It sounds like Shos is claiming a MASSIVE power role, and if that's the case, he'll bring us results tomorrow, and then if he doesn't, we know our next lynch. Easy peasy.

Oh-- I mean, someone should be 50/50 on shos.
Actually, nevermind, because mala "investigating anyone" functionally results in her investigating anybody except Titus, Fitz, or me. So 7 players, with a preference toward some players over another.
Eh, do whatever. You're not leaving any question as to who you're choosing though, Eagle.

[Whiskers]

Someone pushing Mala was probably scum

That's interesting and I disagree. Why would someone push a player in-thread, if they were just going to nightkill them anyway? If it were me, I wouldn't do it like that.

Eagle - who did you flip a coin about? I thought it would be mala/me but it seems neither?

For all your attempts to draw the nightkill... or whatever the fuck you were doing-- you were never in any danger of a nightkill because you're such an easy lynch! <3
Well, ok, maybe not

easy

. But like, people disagree with you. A lot. Titus here thinks you should go down.

I'm gravely concerned about follow the cop here. This game could be broken by that, especially if the neighborizers never neighborized.

Ah, ah, but you forget! Follow the cop only works if the cop is town...
Although now that I think about it, tell me

any

way a Weak Doc can be "followed"? First time he nabs scum, he dies! Ok, so he only investigates Town roles, right? What's keeping him alive, huh? You know, like from night kills? A second Doctor protecting

him

every night?
Ok, so let's say he's mafia, fake-claiming, that's why he's staying alive. If he only investigates town each night, then eventually we're left with Process of Elimination, and start lynching "Scum", right? Yeah, and when they flip town, we've got one more. Great plan there, doccy.

[Whiskers]

1) I wouldn't be surprised that scum shoot someone they fail to get lynched. So you're taking the perspective this was more a framing option? Given the fact you disagree with me on this point, I'd like to hear more of your reasoning. You are more of a seasoned player and I can see seasoned scum possibly thinking along those lines. Also, given the fact that mala said her cop role didn't work until night 2 (oddly when Fitz and our neighborizations would be in effect), it makes sense killing mala from anyone being scum. I can't see where pushing Mala = likely town. However, I am a little tipsy.

Not "fail to get lynched". And like you say, yes, it makes sense to kill mala

anyway

since she's a cop.
I never said that makes them more-town.
But YOU said, pushing mala makes people more-scum. Which no, I don't really think it does. Keep in mind, that players like Wisdom pushed Mala. Maybe if you want to look at people involved, don't look at the ones who obviously-pushed Mala, but the ones who subtly added their support.

2) While it is obvious I highly scumread shos, please don't say what I think. I wanted him dead yesterday with ika in a close second. It feels kinda creepy and manipulative (but not necessarily scummy or townie) considering I hadn't actually posted who I wanted dead today yet. I always take a look at my reads after a flip. I still scumread shos but unless I'm dead set certain, I rarely open from death tunnel stance. It's not helpful. It also shuts off communication and scum tend to slip and be obvious more when they think there is a chance they can get away.

I don't trust you. Looks like you're willing to put a lynch anywhere, and your play is cautious-- not town-cautious, either, but like you want to keep your options open. Maybe it's just a gut feeling.

3) No. I meant follow the cop from an abstract sense. Mala claims, she could investigate a good chunk of the game before scum could have killed a hidden doctor. Mods don't like games that even hint at the remote possibility of follow the cop. We do have a ninja here that is a counter to the watcher. There should have a godfather present that's a counter to mala. That forces the last role to be a roleblocker because more scum wouldn't make sense in a small setup. Yet, a roleblocker is counterproductive in a setup where town neighborizers can essentially millerize themselves.

Titus point #3 is superb. Massclaim d2: watcher watches doc, doc protects cop, cop cops. Or justmala claims and bith watcher and doc target her again and agsin and again.

Not really. Mala doesn't need a godfather (false positive) to counteract her, because she already has so many Neighborizer/Millers (false negative?) to fuck her results up.
And SINCE she gets so many incorrect results simply from there being neighborizers in the game, there isn't a follow the cop. It'd be like, "Follow the cop and maybe lynch scum but also lynch a bunch of townies." It'd double the number of guilties, if Neighborizers target nobody. That six players. And that's only if Mala targets Guilties all the time (unplausible). And she's already delayed.
So yeah, that's Day 7, when all of the guilties are lynched. Except that, by that time, scum would have gotten to make 6 kills. And everybody in the town would be dead.
Best chance for follow the cop is "Mala gets a couple of clears" and then dies. Because even with random nightkills, scum has a 1/9 (13 players, 3 scum, minus 1 Mala) chance to kill the Doc, and that chance gets bigger every day. That's without the massclaim/cop-doc-watcher trick Shos suggests.
WITH D2 massclaim and the train (which is optimal play, which town doesn't know until

after

the massclaim, so is unlikely even to happen), mafia kills randomly night 1, kills the watcher night 2, kills the doctor Night 3, and kills Mala Night 4. In that time, Mala gets 2 results. Guilty or clear, doesn't matter, because

follow the cop is not possible here

.

AND, this is all assuming Eagle is actually his claim, a weak, virginal, doctor. If he's actually mafia, then they can just kill mala right away, can't they? Although with a watcher, that'd mean trading a scum for her, so maybe not...

[Whiskers]

Wait, wait, wait.

Have you had a QT this whole time, then?

Also, somebody remind me why Titus and not havingfitz. Don't trust either one of them but how did the PoE count out fitz? :\
[preedit]
shut the fuck up, I'm trying to post but you've made like, eighteen cockblock posts. Holy cats, man.

[Whiskers]

...ok, maybe that was a little harsh.

[preedit]
fair enough.

[Whiskers]

So, lynch Titus? He's not paying attention ("I vote shos find out if scum has a neighborizer"), He's not making sense (at least to me) (Whiskers' claim sticks out like a sore thumb), He's making posts saying "Kise is scumhunting" when the first MAJOR spike in activity from that slot is like, four posts all in the same week. Or, if you don't like that, and you think Kise IS scumhunting, go ahead to "Half of the Kise Hydra reads me like I'm cool town that does my own thing 'cause that's how I roll."

..at least, that's how I interpreted it.

Regardless, we have one Neighborizer pseudo-cleared (assuming Eagle is truthful), and I'm the other Neighborizer. Titus seems a good lynch anyway-- although I don't know how much I 100% believe Mirari/Kise as masons. If Eagle is still up and alive next-night, he should scope one of them. For now, it'd be nice to get another bribe from shos, so I'd prefer a shos-doc'ing.

[Whiskers]

Works.

Vote: Titus

[Whiskers]

I was pushing Ika's slot since before you were BORN.

[Whiskers]

Bomb would be such a lame fake claim that I refuse to believe Nacho made it up.

I disagree.

Worse still is that he claimed it, instead of claiming something ridiculous and strong, like Magical Bulletproof VigCop. Now we can guarantee that Nacho will NOT be nightkilled.

I'm not scum, so I'm fine with Eagle on me tonight. If he isn't killed, maybe he can go to Nacho tomorrow Night, to check 'im?
Alternatively, You can put him wherever you want in the unconfirmed-pool. I know Shos feels nervous sending Eagle after me.

[Whiskers]

Eagle does not do the masons. The masons get killed tonight. If not, we can eventually lynch them, but in the meantime scum has to kill unconfirmed townies, to try to frame the masons.

Better is to get more confirmed townies from Eagle. Also, if Eagle dies, then we AT LEAST know his role & alignment. AND, we know if any of the players he's cleared are actually clear. ALSO, if he dies and there's a separate nightkill, we've caught another mafia.

So yeah. Mafia is going to KILL one of the masons.
Oooh, is that why you're saying Eagle should be on them?
Nah.

[Whiskers]

Whiskers, the masons are not confirmed town. Confirming them is prudent. If two deaths, then we know the masons are scum. Confirming two town or putting town into autowin status is the best play.

If Eagle hits scum, y'all are in mylo possibly if not lylo.

If we do not do the wise thing and protect/check the masons, then Nacho is the best bet after that.

will you seriously shut the fuck up and think for a minute?

Scum can either:
Shoot a mason, confirming both of them as town.
Shoot Eagle, confirming Him and Fitz as town.
Shoot shos, desp, Nacho, or Whiskers, confirming that player as town and leaving four players (Kise, Mirari, Eagle, and fitz) who we can

assume

are town until we clear the rest of the players.
Shoot fitz, which narrows down the neighborizers (to me.)
^This is

every possible scenario

. None of them are good for scum. They ALL are highly beneficial to town, except for the one about killing fitz. That won't happen, though, because you're flipping scum.

Or, actually, maybe it will happen, because you're flipping scum, and scum will know we won't need to lynch another neighborizer?

Eagle needs to have one, ONE selected, announced target. He needs to check that target. He needs to blow himself up on a scum. Because that will make the game auto-win.

[Whiskers]

@shos: you shouldn't have explained that. Should have let scum kill a mason, then we'd have had the flip.
@fitz: Can't attack him for that. He very much wanted to Doc mala again. It was forcefully beat into him that he had to pick two other targets and choose randomly between 'em. He did what we wanted him to do.
Also, Mala's role was fucking useless, ok? Seriously, THAT is not something to get worked up about.

[Whiskers]

@ Whiskers.....so if Eagle had come back with a "Nacho has a QT" result...that wouldn't have helped?

I thought Mala's only options to investigate were Nacho and Desperado... but had Kise and Mirari claimed yet? If so...Mala would have had four options. Eitherway...her role was useful enough to warrant being killed over a more useful (if legit) PR in Eagle.

I'll assume asking about eagle in the first line is a typo...


Didn't somebody say that there's a total of like, three roles that mala could get potentially get a "non-QT" result on? I don't remember if that's counting the virgin/ascetics or not. But yeah, not really fucking useful.
At that time, masons hadn't claimed, so maybe they thought it was possible for her to get more clears? More likely, they were afraid of being guiltied, which Eagle can, arguably, only get one of. Eagle's role is way more useful.
Of course, you're right; the fact that they killed mala over Eagle calls Eagle's claim into question.... well, except for the fact that that would be a fucking stupid kill (because it sort of incriminates Eagle).

In the end, I have no fucking clue why they killed mala.

[Whiskers]

I agree with Nacho ^, Eagle should pick ONE person, and tell us who it is. Please. Game is almost over, so don't feel bad if you don't-survive.

[Whiskers]

The mod has confirmed we do not die with each other like the lovers role.

I really wish you guys would stop saying this, and take a bullet.
...you know, in the game.

[Whiskers]

One shot. Unused.

[Whiskers]

I've said at least once already that I haven't neighborized anybody. Also said I was limited, not the mention the fact that someone (I thought it was you?) deducted that I was limited shot on the very beginning of day 2, by virtue of the fact that I hadn't neighborized.

In the end, does that matter? I didn't realize we were still calling into question the claim itself, since being a neighborizer doesn't sway my role to either alignment, town or scum. In otherwords, even as scum, why would I lie and claim Neighborizer? It doesn't clear me, it's provable, so could

condemn

me, when I suddenly can't prove it-- it would be a really, really

stupid

fake claim to make.

But here, I'll do this, just for you! Whoever Eagle is going to Doc? I'll Neighborize them, too. That way, if they're town, they won't get killed and ('cause i'll be protected) and they can confirm my role, though not my alignment. If they're scum, then we'll lynch them, and eh, you can worry about what my alignment is another day.

[Whiskers]

And if Eagle dies bc Nacho is scum, you claim to have neighborized Nacho well shit...like we are taking the word of scum.

This is a fake claim.

How about this. If eagle dies because Nacho is scum, then you can lynch me, right after we auto lynch nacho. OK? Because by that time, we'll be so far ahead, that there'll be one more scum, and I understand I'm an unknown. Alright? Ok? Sound good, sister?
Then, according to your plan, you'll have all three scum caught (ika, nacho, and myself), and you'll win. Hurray!

[Whiskers]

I did Neighborize Nacho, like I said I would.
Sounds like Eagle is alive, too, so Nacho is town.


Kise is confirmed town from Masonflip.
If Eagle is town, then Nacho is confirmed Town.
If Eagle is town, then havingFitz is confirmed Town.

Players to lynch:
Eagle
Desperado
Whiskers
Shos.

Ok so here's what we do.
Lynch Whiskers today.
If scum kill Eagle, then three players (Nacho, fitz, and Kise) are confirmed town, and two players (Desperado and Shos) aren't-- and must be scum. Automatic town win.

If scum

don't

kill eagle, then Eagle instead has the chance to investigate another player-- for the sake of argument, let's say Shos.
Let's say scum kills Kise, obviously the best kill for scum this Night. So to recap:
Lynch Whiskers
Nightkill Kise
Investigate/Doc Shos.
This leaves Eagle, Desperado, and Shos in the morning.
If Eagle is town, then Eagle will die, flipping and clearing Nacho and fitz, and confirming Shos as scum. Lynch Shos, lynch Desperado, town wins.*
If Eagle is not town, then eagle will still be alive-- meaning that her previous clears are actually

not

cleared-- but then, you've caught one scum, Eagle.

*Actually, this endgames us, doesn't it? townNacho and townFitz vs scumShos and scumDesp? So maybe that dosen't work after all.

[Whiskers]

In that case, it puts us back where we were, doesn't it? Scumhunting. Where are your reads (Eagle and Kise, as you've both posted recently-ish) for scum?

[Whiskers]

I don't understand why scum-me is being considered here.

Did you forget about my claim? It was town as balls.

Only for the sake of example.

Actually, no, I don't remember your claim.

[Whiskers]

I'll wait for your explanation, but the theory sounds about right.

[Whiskers]

Can I take a step back and say I haven't read any of Shos's plans mostly, because it occurred to me that my plan works great, is we lynch Desperado instead of me toDay.

He flips, if he's town, Eagle goes scum-hunting (Me or shos, I guess?), and if he's alive, he's scum, but if he's dead, we know whomever he investigated (me or shos) is scum, not to mention that fitz and Nacho are confirmed town. Then we lynch whoever to protection was, and we have enough votes to do so (because Desp).


Although, as I type it out, it seems that either Eagle is scum, and we should just go right there, and then start looking for scum in his clears, or else Shos and I (possibly substitute one out for Desp) are scum.

But yeah. Desp's claim won't be proven, and his power won't be usable, until he's killed. So that seems like a reasonable way to go.

[Whiskers]

mod do you inform people if their action failed, including by not limited to, via roleblocks?

No.

Conversely, My action, neighbourizing Nacho,

was

confirmed to go through.

Which means he should have access to my Day QT, not that that has any thing on my alignment.

How convenient. all of a sudden you say fitz is not conftown.

mmm. can you smell it? *sniff* I smell whiskers-eagle scumteam?

See, that's interesting.

What if we actually lynch Eagle tonight? I mean, this isn't going to be a popular suggestion, but I want to talk it out at least.
If we lynch eagle (fips town), we get fitz and Nacho confirmed. Kise is confirmed. Whiskers, Shos, and Desperado are unconfirmed. A conf-town is nightkilled (assume Kise for example). Assuming three-scum team, two of Whiskers, Shos, and Desp are scum, the other is town, along with Fitz and Nacho. LyLo.
If we lynch eagle (flips scum), we get a scum lynch. Kise is confirmed. fitz, Nacho, Whiskers, Shos, and Desperado are unconfirmed. A conf-town is nightkilled (Kise is the only one). Assuming a three-scum team, one of Whiskers, Shos, Desp, fitz, and Nacho, are scum. One last day until Lylo.


Is this any better than the other plans suggested?

[Whiskers]

Worst case scenario there, is if eagle is scum-- and even then it's not so bad because we've got a scumlynch.

[Whiskers]

eagle is alive

Except, he's not, if he investgates scum, which was one of the parameters of that scenario.

whiskers-eagle
whiskers-fitz?
whiskers-nacho?
fitz-eagle
fitz-nacho

that's it

Why didn't you include yourself, here?

[Whiskers]

Nacho that sounfs like you are preparing a shosmislynch right afyet your buddy the RB flips

Why does this look like flailing?

Also, if we correct-lynch fitz, what does Eagle do? Anything?
What about if we mislynch?

Where does that put us? Who are possible scumteams? etc, etc.

[Whiskers]

Has fitz even neighbourized anyone yet? If not it all just fits(no pun intended) - eagletown targets mala or fitz; so fitz blocks eagle, have no fear in shooting mala. If eagle protects mala then people will lynch eagle for not being doc. If he targets fitz then fitz gets conftown.

It all makes sense, and that means we are looking at nacho-fitz scumteam or des-fitz scumteam.

For the record, Fitz neighborized both Titus, and myself.


Also, did it occur to anyone that perhaps Shos

enables

Eagle-doc to function, and until then it just visits without being Weak, or Doctoring? Rather than a straight-up roleblocker.

[Whiskers]

@Eagle, no. THAT'S NOT WHAT I SAID PAY SOME FUCKING ATTENTION.

Actually, that goes for Kise, too. I'm not saying, "derp, maybe they are still conftown without having been confirmed!"
I'm

saying

, maybe instead of a scum roleblocker, Eagle's role needs to first be

enabled

by shos.

I assume I'll be voting shos tomorrow.

vote: fitz

That's probably L-1.

Actually, you know what?

Unvote.

Does

any

body else, fucking remember how badly shos wanted Eagle to hop on him, and "confirm" him? Now with the super-powerful role that reveals mod-confirmed setup info, saying that "no, scum don't have a roleblocker!"

It looks totally suspicious, alright?

[Whiskers]

Holy shit that was a bad fake hammer

Mod just showed fits was l-2

If that somehow didn't work

unvote
Vote whiskers

What the fuck are you talking about?
The votecount clearly said fitz was at L-2.
I voted and said, "this is L-1."
Then unvoted in the same post, putting him back at L-2.

Are you fucking stupid?
It wasn't a fake hammer-- I even

said

it was L-1.
And I don't know why you're saying, "WHOA, I HOPE HE'S NOT HAMMERED BY WHISKERS' L-1 VOTE!"

Holy shit, man.

[Whiskers]

@Whiskers, no. YOU CANNOT NOT ASSUME THAT FITZ AND NACHO ARE CONFIRMED TOWN AFTER I FLIP BECAUSE I STILL COULD HAVE BEEN BLOCKED.

VOTE: fitz

Shos's 3429 is pretty good.

Seriously? Why are you quoting this, it's eagle shouying at me for something I didn't even say.

Would anybody care to talk about the thing I actually

did

say??

[Whiskers]

And eagle voting fitz. After vote count showed fitz at L-2.

oh.


yeah, that makes sense then.

crap.

[Whiskers]

Yeah, that was me not paying attention-- I may have fucked town over here.

So I guess I'll go ahead and hope fitz flips scum, but probably the scumteam is like, Nacho and Desp. idk.

[Whiskers]

Actually, if fitz flipped town, I'd be lynched next regardless of the quickhammer, just for being the last neighborizer.
So if we're right (in that there is a scum neighborizer), fitz flips scum. If fitz flips town, I'll be voting shos (faulty information), not that that'll really sway any of you ponies.

[Whiskers]

I'd be willing to buy Shos/Nacho, maybe, but again, why do you remove yourself from the lynchpool, desp?

@Eagle: Because that's how I do things. Generally I write

forward

, if that makes any sense. I was willing to vote fitz at that point, and then I decided, no, I wanted to unvote him and explain why. I changed my mind mid-post. And there wasn't any problem in doing it, because I was just putting him at L-1 at most, anyway. I'll admit that I was careless, and hadn't read Eagle's vote on fitz. I simply wasn't paying attention, and it was my downfall.

Sort of surprised I haven't been lynched already, I thought we had agreed that I'd be the next to go, assuming fitz flipped town.

Actually, Desp, why do you pair shos with Nacho? What's your reasoning for that?

[Whiskers]

I'd be willing to buy Shos/Nacho, maybe, but again, why do you remove yourself from the lynchpool, desp?

@Eagle: Because that's how I do things. Generally I write

forward

, if that makes any sense. I was willing to vote fitz at that point, and then I decided, no, I wanted to unvote him and explain why. I changed my mind mid-post. And there wasn't any problem in doing it, because I was just putting him at L-1 at most, anyway. I'll admit that I was careless, and hadn't read Eagle's vote on fitz. I simply wasn't paying attention, and it was my downfall.

Sort of surprised I haven't been lynched already, I thought we had agreed that I'd be the next to go, assuming fitz flipped town.

Actually, Desp, why do you pair shos with Nacho? What's your reasoning for that?

Did you not get a pedit message? There was a VC AND A VOTE immediately before you. Thats lies.

No, eagle had already posted-- I skipped past it to make my own post. Again, it was careless.
Shos, I'm not sure if you're familiar with my play or my personality, but here's why I'm good as scum: I don't lie. Whether I'm town or scum, I'm not going to lie about something I could tell the truth as.
Also, I'll point out, that if I wanted to quickhammer, I wouldn't feel guilty about it, even as town. I'm willing to do scummy things as town, and I also am willing to own up to my mistakes.

As a third point, let me ask you: Why would scum-Whiskers quickhammer town, resulting in her own autolynch the next day? It's not worth it to scum to trade one-for-one, and we are so close to the end of the game. Especially with the townread on me from pretty much everybody-- maybe not Kise, but scum has a roleblocker and kills Kise, as we've seen (because it actually happened in the game)-- why would I do something that would make everybody look at me and go, "WOW, SCUM!" Especially when it could have been avoided?

Look: I'm not saying that you should read me as town after what I did. What I'm saying, is you should believe me when I say, I fucked up, and that vote and unvote was not supposed to be a hammer on Fitz.

Why are people avoiding the thread? Come on, vote either me or wisdom. We arent lynching anyone else.

Other things to do. Sounds like you're actually going to be lynched, but with all the support for your lynch (nacho, at least, and maybe desp), I'm kind of worried you're gonna be town.

Which brings me to,

Im surprised whiskers didnt countervote me. Why is that?

Maybe because that would be scummy as fuck and has the potential to end the game immediately if you're town? And because, despite the fact that you've decided to declare a 1v1, nobody listens to you.

Btw, can I please point out that all it takes to quickhammer someone in Lylo is for both scumteammates to realize and confirm the other one is online, and then to vote? It'd be pretty cool if you unvote me. Of course, if you already

are

one of the scum, I guess a quickhammer isn't possible. But that's sloppy play, if you're scum.

[Whiskers]

Actually, why would Nacho, in a Nacho-shos scumteam, confirm that I neighborized him? Instead, just claim Whiskers is lying, and mislynch whiskers. Nacho-Whiskers makes more sense, doesn't it?

Anyway, a couple of things occurred to me. First thing was, Oh, I forgot Shos guaranteed a Neighborizer; since I'm the last neighborizer, and town, he must by lying (and so I should vote him).
Second thing though, was that, we're assuming all of the claims are true. I

still

don't like that damn bomb claim. What if, say, Desp, were a scum neighborizer? Mala died before she could get any results, the use of a roleblocker has made Eagle useless (or Eagle is lying scum, and is therefore useless regardless).

[Whiskers]

well it can't be des because that wouldn't make any difference balance wise; it can be the bomb nacho, or the cop eagle.

this is problem.

Oh, nacho is the bomb? That's huge, actually.

Ok, there are loads of reasons for scum to claim bomb. Or, ok, not loads of them, more like one very big reason: it explains not being nightkill.

the only team that doesn't make sense for me is Des-whiskers. this leaves way too many options right now. I'm officially waiting on you guys now.

Remind me of Des's claim? He's Hades or something, isn't he? For some reason, I thought

he

was the bomb.


Shos, have you been in LyLo as scum before? Can you link me to such a scenario?

[Whiskers]

Usually I'd put a bomb claim in a position to help one explain how they don't get NKed. but in this game, with Eagle's claim, and the masons, nacho didn't

need

that to explain why he is alive. so that claim makes no sense as a fakeclaim.. bomb dies AND kills its killer, right?

No, it makes great sense as a fakeclaim. He doesn't get killed by mafia. He's necessarily pro-town (excepting a vig; we haven't had one). It's unconfirmable, as you say, so Nacho doesn't have a reason to try to prove it, doesn't need to make up any night-action results, because he's passive.

Instead, he sits around and roleblocks eagle.

[Whiskers]

Desperado doesn't really make sense as scum, especially as far as interactions with mollie went.

Desp had good interaction with Mollie?

In that case, does my constant hounding of Mollie, and then ika, count for anything?

You can't be scum with Whiskers because you've been building to this specific situation for like three days now and it just wouldn't make any sense.
You can't be scum with bald because if you're scum then that means you've been lying about the scum PRs, which means there probably IS a roleblocker, which means bald is town (or else he'd be dead). If you were scum with Bald you would have just said that there is a roleblocker.

I don't get this.
First: "there probably is a roleblocker, which means bald is town (or else he'd be dead)." No, he'd be dead if there were NO roleblocker, Bald is town, and Bald is what he says he is. Instead, there: 1. Could be a roleblocker, but bald is lying scum. 2. could be no roleblocker, and bald is lying scum.
Also, why would scum say, "oh, there's a roleblocker," outting their powerrole? :\

Anyway, scum is Shos and Desp:
Shos for faulty information that comes from his (really weird) role, specifically that there is a neighborizer in the scum. (I am the last claimed neighborizer, and am not scum (though read me however you want). A scum neighborizer would have claimed when the others did, early on.) Other info to support my suspicions that he's lying (or that this is a bastard mod game), include Nacho's assertion that there's been shown to be a roleblocker (through Eagle) and one player flipped Mafia Ninja, while Shos's information tells him of a neighborizer and encryptor.
Desp for his soft bussing (Whiskers/Eagle or Shos/Nacho, but probably Whiskers/Eagle, so let's lynch them first, in this LyLo situation), and his repeated avoidance: removing himself from the possible lynchpool. Heh, he also gets bonus points for having a scumread on every other player in the game: Whiskers, Eagle, Nacho, and Shos.

So, here's the part where I cast my vote and walk away for two days. Go town.

Vote: Shos

[Whiskers]

If Bald and Shos were scum together, it would have been in their best interest for Shos to claim that a roleblocker exists in the game. It's the best explanation for why Bald is still alive. Shos says scum have no roleblocker. Ergo Shos and Bald are not scum together.

I don't get it. Why does

shos

need to claim that there's a roleblocker? Since Baldeagle just did that anyway, and then they don't incriminate each other.

I notice you didn't argue with my point that you and Shos can't be scum together either, which means you must agree that from my point of view the choices are pretty clear?

Sorry, I didn't touch on every possible scumteam.
You're suggesting that shos and I can't be scum, because he's "been building to this point for the last three Days," right? That seems a little extreme; I saw it yesterday, but I wouldn't say it's been

three

days.
A better argument for why Shos and I aren't scum, is something like, "Why would shos confirm, 'There's a scum neighborizer,' when he's trying to lynch neighborizers already, and his partner is one?" Because by process of elimination, (specifically, eliminating Titus and havingfitz, which we did,) Whiskers, his partner, would be the only neighborizer left, and therefore the only scum. Right? He'd have caught his own partner.

I s'pose it could be a towncred thing. But no, I'd say that a Whiskers/Shos scumteam is less likely-- but of course, I'm biased.

Desp for his soft bussing (Whiskers/Eagle or Shos/Nacho, but probably Whiskers/Eagle, so let's lynch them first, in this LyLo situation), and his repeated avoidance: removing himself from the possible lynchpool. Heh, he also gets bonus points for having a scumread on every other player in the game: Whiskers, Eagle, Nacho, and Shos.

This makes 0 sense. Especially the "being scummy for not removing myself from the lynchpool" bit. What are you, 12?[/quote]Er, no, I'm not. And I'm under the impression that you're not either. That's why taking yourself off the suspect list is odd to me, that's something that less-skilled, less-experienced players do. Rather than helping town analyze the situation, and try to find the best lynch, you're looking out for yourself, trying merely to survive.

I also like the way you get bent out of shape, every time I point it out. Not sure if you're "overdefensive" or just "frightened," but when I say it and you make personal attacks and try to change the subject, it doesn't make me think you're scum less. If you're

not

scum, you'd do better showing why "Desp/[player]" can't be a scumteam. You should know this.

As for the other things that "make 0 sense":
--You're pushing Eagle/Whiskers, which means that you wouldn't be willing to lynch Shos/Nacho. However, you're still declaring a scumteamread on Shos/Nacho. If I assume Shos is your scumbuddy, (which I do,) that's called

bussing

. You should know this.

--You're scumreading every player in the game (except for yourself, which is to be expected); this makes you a useless piece of shit. We have

one lynch

. Possibly two, if we lynch scum today. You can speculate on teams and associations

tomorrow

, if there IS a tomorrow, when it actually matters at all. You know you won't be killed, because you've claimed Bomb-- a very safe, lazy claim, by the way. You'd be less useless, and less shitty, if you tried to find a lynch for

today

, since if we're fucking wrong (and by "we," I mean shos and I, and maybe I can even add nacho in there since I've used his argument now), there won't

be

another lynch tomorrow, and all of your bullshit scumteam speculation may as well be flushed~~

_
Hey, I've got a new one, too: Shos defending the Bomb claim. This is actually really weak as evidence, but I thought of it, so I put it up here for you all to laugh at, like Shos.

[Whiskers]

Shos, you can probably go ahead and revote me. I thought about it, and a scum neighborizer would have claimed with Titus, fitz, and I. Otherwise, he'd never get to use his role! Plus, if he was found out, it'd be instant scum.

Other people: You can probably go ahead and vote shos. If you believe Eagle, then Nacho's argument makes a lot of sense: scum likely wouldn't have a Roleblocker (evidence from Kise dying), a Ninja (ika flipped it), an Encryptor, and a Neighborizer (things shos both told us scum have).
Eh, I'm rethinking it now. What's the chance that there's, say, a Roleblocker-Encryptor and a Neighborizer, a Roleblocker-Neighborizer and Encryptor, or a Neighborizer-Encryptor and a Roleblocker? Does any of that make sense?

[Whiskers]

Hey, I know we're kind of 1v1 but I'm still interested in hearing your stuff.

Because I can thinkof a handful of ways you could actually be telling the truth, AND have false information.

[Whiskers]

Good post. It actually helped me get a townread on Nacho.

Shos, when you're done with everything else, what do you think about the possibility of Desp/Nacho, Desp/Whiskers, or even Desp/Eagle?

btw, I'm thinking more and more that, if you're both telling the truth, Shos' Enabler role affects Eagle's Weak-Doc role. Shos has to turn Eagle on each night, but Shos has been Bribing instead. It's just a hunch, but what do you (and, I guess, everyone else) think?

[Whiskers]

Well, tell me the fucking claims so I can actually make some analysis out of them.

Anyways, I'm inclined to vote for Whiskers, because he was indeed lying about he didn't see my post.

You can't know whether or not I was lying.
I still don't understand, what motivation I would have, to lie about realized you voted, one way or another. If I'm scum, then it would be a stupid thing for me to do. If I'm town, it would be a stupid thing for me to do.

Regardless of alignment, it would be stupid for me to lie about it.
I accidentally hammered fitz because I fucked up and didn't pay enough attention. Not alignment-telling.
Even if you don't believe me, and I quickhammered fitz intentionally, WHY would I lie about this??

FITZ WAS THE LYNCH, ANYWAY. I COULD HAVE QUICKHAMMERED HIM AS TOWN AND IT WOULDN'T HAVE MATTERED, BECAUSE WE WERE GOING TO LYNCH FITZ REGARDLESS.

It's not right. We never had a flipped ninja.

You're fucking kidding me.

[Whiskers]

Shos, you keep saying "all of the other town roles are so strong! That's why Desp is town."

Ever considered that the "weak" Restless Spirit claim is an easy scumclaim? considered that Desp is the Encryptor?

Actually, I dont know why I'm arguing that with you. Here, let me argue this instead:

Anyway, scum is Shos and Desp:
Shos for faulty information that comes from his (really weird) role, specifically that there is a neighborizer in the scum. (I am the last claimed neighborizer, and am not scum (though read me however you want). A scum neighborizer would have claimed when the others did, early on.)

Other info to support my suspicions that he's lying (or that this is a bastard mod game), include Nacho's assertion that there's been shown to be a roleblocker (through Eagle) and one player flipped Mafia Ninja, while Shos's information tells him of a neighborizer and encryptor.

Desp for his soft bussing (Whiskers/Eagle or Shos/Nacho, but probably Whiskers/Eagle, so let's lynch them first, in this LyLo situation), and his repeated avoidance: removing himself from the possible lynchpool. Heh, he also gets bonus points for having a scumread on every other player in the game: Whiskers, Eagle, Nacho, and Shos.

So, here's the part where I cast my vote and walk away for two days. Go town.

Vote: Shos

faulty info - is not faulty, lol, but I guess here comes the inevitable 1v1. there's the option that there's ANOTHER neighbourizer, but really, I don't think anyone really believes that. why would a scum neighbourizer claim when the others did? why tie yourself to a fakeclaim unprovoked? that makes no sense.

This is you not fucking understanding anything I've said.
First: There's the option that there's another neighborizer. Correct, nobody believes that. Why? Because if there were, then they

would

have claimed with the other neighborizers.

SO IT WOULDN'T BE A FAKECLAIM

Since only three claimed, there isn't another. Another

actual neighborizer, not a fakeclaim

, would have claimed then, to fit in, to avoid investigation, to cast even more doubt on the other neighborizers. That's

WHY

there's not another neighborizer. Nobody is "tying themselves to a fakeclaim," where the fuck did you even come up with that idea?

.....I don't understand the underlined sentences. *Nacho* asserted that there is a blocker through eagle(how? when? what?..*eagle* said that after Kise died tonight)...and ika flipped ninja, when my role told me about the other roles.....I'm not getting it.

Eagle says, "there's a roleblocker!" after Kise dies. then

Nacho

says, "Shos must be scum! There can't be ALL of Ninja, Roleblocker, Encryptor, and Neighborizer on the scumteam!"

You say that *DES* is scum for his "bussing"?..what game are you reading? and calling someone scum for not considering himself as scum is incredibly stupid. bonus points...not evn going to respond to that, lol. You're flailing heavily, man.

You do know what bussing is, right? And, a good townplayer leaves himself in the lynch pool, so town can more-easily analyze the situation.

Worse

, is that when I suggest this, or ask him why he doesn't do it, he uses insults rather than answering me or figuring out a way to tell me I'm wrong.
Because I'm not wrong.

______-


Finally, let me go ahead and point out this bit:
If I were scum with Nacho, we'd have hammered Eagle by now.

Nacho and I have Daytalk (I neighborized him. He confirmed this).
Shos already has his vote on Eagle.
Nacho and I could easily confer in the QT, then whap-whap quickhammer, mislynch, game over, scum wins.

So let's go ahead and cross THAT one off all of our lists.

[Whiskers]

Players Whiskers could be scum with:
-Eagle
-Shos
-Desp

Players Nacho could be scum with:
-Eagle
-Shos
-Desp

I'm not sure you could rule out a Whiskers/Shos lynch due to the animosity between us, or not. Desperado is trying to do that, but then again, he's mafia.

[Whiskers]

Whiskers is at l-1, no hammer, im town

Saying "no hammer" and then hammering?

:\


But yeah, I'm pretty sure it's not town's job to go, "whoa, I'm so town! I'm town, everybody. Don't consider me at all in anything, because I'm town." It's town's job to like, try to find scum. Or, hey, to try to show that they're not scum, so they don't get lynched. But, whatever.

Shos, Desp, were you scum?

[Whiskers]

EBWOP:

Newsflash: NOT INCLUDING YOURSELF IN POTENTIAL LYLO SCUM TEAMS ISN'T SCUMMY YOU FUCKING IDIOT. THERE IS NO REASON FOR ME TO SPECULATE ABOUT SCUM TEAMS THAT INCLUDE MYSELF, AND REPEATEDLY CONTENDING THAT IT'S SCUMMY FOR ME TO DO SO AND THEN CALLING ME OUT FOR BEING "DEFENSIVE" ABOUT IT IS ABOUT THE DUMBEST FUCKING SHIT I'VE EVER HEARD AND MUST BE COMING FROM SCUM.

But yeah, I'm pretty sure it's not town's job to go, "whoa, I'm so town! I'm town, everybody. Don't consider me at all in anything, because I'm town." It's town's job to like, try to find scum. Or, hey, to try to show that they're not scum, so they don't get lynched.

So yeah, you're basically scum for being an inactive piece of trash, who treats himself as universally confirmed-town and rudely dismisses anybody who calls him out (although in this case, "anybody" was only me, so maybe that says something).

The fact that you don't have to consider yourself in potential scumteams, doesn't meant other people don't have to consider you in potential scumteams. It's far less confusing for everybody to just include them and save the other players the trouble (and the possibility of fucking up) of going and adding your potential pairings to the list.

[Whiskers]

Whiskers, i actually think des is right. You need to first be convinced, youraelf, who scum us, and THEN you convince the others, by showing why scum are scum and you are town.

Desp didn't do any of this. He didn't say why scum were scum, or why he was town. He said that "two of these four players are scum" and that "I, Desp, am town." Not who, not why.

Now, somebody want to tell me why "shos would have just announced there was s roleblocker ,if he were scum"?

I guess I'm already over losing. I figured I'd be quickly executed, right after the day started. Kind of pisses me off that we had to wait around and get into a stupid fight before we could get around to lynching me.

[Whiskers]

for that to even be a possibility...either shos or baldeagle had to be lying.

*cough, cough,* one of them

was

.

[Whiskers]

Yeah.

I take the blame for that-- after people explained to me that I had just cast the hammering vote (not the L-1ing vote), I kept kicking myself for losing the game for town.